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委員報告 我想我們再來檢討 因為我們其實地方 有時候是這個火水下水的整體系統性 有的需要怕通 有的需要點檢討的部分 這點我們會加速來看地方政府看討論 看我們還有對一塊的部分 有時候不是清掃的關係 有時候是系統性"},{"start":247.528,"end":255.97,"text":"主要做一個調整有可能要建工廠要訂做的這個部分我先來探討,之後再來探討這個部分麻煩市長再多多複審是,請問...上天...上個月這個...當這個行政院結束的時候有去講到這個國土法,剛才也聽到委員有去關心到這個"},{"start":274.52,"end":296.016,"text":"二、審查委員王鴻薇等20人擬具《都市更新條例第六十五條條文修正草案》案。第三、審查委員王鴻薇等20人擬具《都市更新條例第六十五條條文修正草案》案。四、審查委員王鴻薇等20人擬具《都市更新條例第六十五條條文修正草案》案。五、審查委員王鴻薇等20人擬具《都市更新條例第六十五條條文修正草案》案。六、審查委員王鴻薇等20人擬具《都市更新條例第六十五條條條文修正草案》案。七、審查委員王鴻薇"},{"start":303.966,"end":322.452,"text":"此資訊要有清澈如何靠國外去承受農民的管理。此就各分。市長。我跟委員報告,第一就是說,我們的路徑跟大家溝通,因為那個溝通界的法律,如同大家幾個委員、大家的機構,很多人都沒什麼了解,當然我們就請大家隨便清澈,這是第一點。"},{"start":326.693,"end":340.781,"text":"第二,我們的執法在年底前一定會完成在完成過程中會向大家報告說這個執法對大家的關於的保護其實比較重要的其實是委員所觀察的農地問題包括農地的補助這部分農地上面可以去做什麼可以做什麼我剛才有報告過以前是要用省省的未來是用農學就是說我們上面跟你說說你可以做什麼你就按照那個規範去處理就可以了"},{"start":355.669,"end":363.251,"text":"二、審查委員王鴻薇等20人擬具《都市更新條例第六十五條條文修正草案》案。三、審查委員王鴻薇等20人擬具《都市更新條例第六十五條條文修正草案》案。四、審查委員王鴻薇等20人擬具《都市更新條例第六十五條條文修正草案》案。五、審查委員王鴻薇等20人擬具"},{"start":383.556,"end":387.037,"text":"請就是各位這樣通過後實施後,那如果比如我們這個農業的土地這樣會相對,它的計劃性會怎樣計劃?我跟委員報告,其實農地的計劃應該是在農地本身的農業生產的規定裡面,它的那個計劃。委員說說的農業計劃可能就是說農地如果有人想要變更做白的輸用的時候來處理,好來我請主席。"},{"start":413.111,"end":422.655,"text":"委員報告,其實我們兩年前就大概有跟全國的公家署,因為現在土地本都是公家署,還有土地代書一部分來做,所以我們其實兩年前就"},{"start":429.69,"end":433.034,"text":"二、審查委員王鴻薇等20人擬具《都市更新條例第六十五條條文修正草案》案。三、審查委員王鴻薇等20人擬具"},{"start":447.699,"end":452.282,"text":"二、審查委員王鴻薇等20人擬具第六十五條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員王鴻薇等20人擬具"},{"start":478.206,"end":478.388,"text":"二條案未開會"}]},"會議時間":"2024-09-30T09:00:00+08:00","委員發言時間":"09:49:12 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09:57:11","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第2會期內政委員會第2次全體委員會議（事由：一、審查行政院函請審議「都市更新條例第六十五條條文修正草案」案。二、審查委員王鴻薇等20人擬具「都市更新條例第六十五條條文修正草案」案。三、審查委員李彥秀等17人擬具「都市更新條例第六十五條條文修正草案」案。【第一案如未經各黨團簽署不復議同意書則不予審查。】\n\n【9月30日、10月2日及3日三天一次會】）","gazette":{"lineno":240,"blocks":[["丁委員學忠：（9時49分）感謝主席，我請董次長。"],["主席：好，請次長。"],["丁委員學忠：次長好。"],["董次長建宏：委員好。"],["丁委員學忠：颱風又要來了。"],["董次長建宏：是。"],["丁委員學忠：大家比較辛苦。"],["董次長建宏：不會，大家一起努力打拚。"],["丁委員學忠：上次凱米颱風來，雨水量在那兩、三天就下了一整年的量。很多區域不管是農田也好、村子也好、在市內也好，都造成很多地方淹水，下水道的清淤工程是國土署的業務吧？"],["董次長建宏：是。"],["吳署長欣修：我們有補助地方政府，有一些是地方政府要自編的。"],["丁委員學忠：對。這樣做起來，署長在這裡，你覺得那個效益怎樣？"],["吳署長欣修：跟委員報告，其實事前的清淤絕對是最好的一個做法，可以減少很多我們想不到的問題。"],["丁委員學忠：我們有確實依照各縣市所報出來的需求給予幫助嗎？"],["吳署長欣修：跟委員報告，我們大概每一年年初的時候都會邀集地方政府，現在在地比較大的問題，因為國土署這邊是負責都市內的，但是我們也知道整個系統出去到外面，有可能是屬於地方自己管的大排，或是中央管的河川，這就是整體的系統性，我是覺得可以再繼續加強啦，它主要差別在這裡，否則都市計畫內的部分，這十多年執行下來其實效果不錯。"],["丁委員學忠：是，除非說排水系統需要整體工程改善。"],["吳署長欣修：是。"],["丁委員學忠：否則清淤是非常重要的。"],["吳署長欣修：是。"],["丁委員學忠：從市區內到出水口的整體性清淤，我過去擔任鎮長，我們虎尾鎮是整個雲林縣人口數第二高的鄉鎮市，我們一年的下水道清淤工程經費只有30萬而已，署長，你知道30萬能夠清多長？"],["吳署長欣修：了解，因為這可以清的路段很少。"],["丁委員學忠：我是希望可以照地方需求做合理的補助，讓他們有辦法落實、達到工程的效果，不要提供一些經費應付你一下，再提供一些經費，再應付你一下，如果清頭清尾，中間不清，這樣也沒用，只是做給人家看的話，這樣也沒用。"],["吳署長欣修：是，感謝委員，我想這個部分今年結束之後我們再來檢討一下。"],["丁委員學忠：我知道之前中央有抑注嘉義縣、嘉義市比較多經費，上一次凱米颱風來的時候，根據整體報告受災的範圍就真的縮小了。"],["吳署長欣修：是，主要是系統性有做起來。"],["丁委員學忠：這就代表我們整理排水系統是真的有效果的，希望國土署、內政部可以針對各縣市的需求做合理補助，當然地方也要提出配合款，能夠確實來防範水災。"],["吳署長欣修：跟委員報告，我們會再來檢討，確實地方雨水下水道整體系統有的需要打通，有的需要重新檢討，這點我會加速來跟地方政府討論，看還有哪一些部分需要改進，有時候不是清淤的原因，有時候是系統性需要做一個調整。"],["丁委員學忠：有可能是工程要重做。"],["吳署長欣修：對，這部分我會跟地方政府再來檢討。"],["丁委員學忠：這個部分再麻煩署長多多費心。"],["吳署長欣修：是，這我們會努力。"],["丁委員學忠：上禮拜五質詢行政院的時候，有講到國土法，剛才也有很多委員關心這個議題，昨天又看到政府發新聞稿，強調國土法要如期上路，雖然沒有影響到農民的權利，但是配套措施只完成了14項，總共還有9項沒公告完成，預定要到年底才有辦法完成，這個資訊還不清楚，要怎麼確保不會犧牲農民的權利？次長。"],["董次長建宏：我跟委員報告，第一、我們會努力跟大家溝通，因為國土計畫法如同幾位委員所指教的，很多人還不太了解，當然我們會儘量跟大家說明清楚，這是第一點。第二、子法一定會在年底以前完成，在完成過程中會跟大家報告，這些子法對大家權益的保護。其實更重要的是委員所關切的農地問題，包括農地的補助，農地上面可以蓋什麼、可以做什麼，我剛才有報告過，以前是要用申請的，未來是用容許的，就是我們會規定農地上可以做什麼，農民就按照那個規範去處理就可以了，讓大家更便利。再來就是農地上的補助，農業部現在也很積極在處理，已經把法案送到行政院了，所以行政院那邊會趕快處理、審查，原則上就是一定會保護農民的權益，因為農民對我們臺灣社會來說是最重要的，我們的吃穿都是靠農民辛辛苦苦種植，所以我們一定要保護。"],["丁委員學忠：那一天我有請教農業部部長，都市計畫實施之後，農一土地相對的價值會降低嗎？"],["董次長建宏：跟委員報告，其實農地的價值應該是農地本身在農業生產過程中的價值，委員所說的農業價值可能是指，如果有人想要把農地變更做別的使用的時候。這部分我請署長來說明。"],["吳署長欣修：跟委員報告，因為現在土地部分都是透過估價師還有一部分的土地代書來做，所以我們其實兩年多前就有透過地政司邀集公會一起來討論，包括過程中有跟他們多次座談，也有訓練，其實他們大概也都理解，如果現在正式由這個估價公會來執行，他們會了解這個土地其實跟過去相比沒什麼改變。第二、有一些使用還有稍微放寬，這部分就放在整體估價的系統裡面，估價其實沒有包含所謂的變更這部分。"],["董次長建宏：不過，目前看起來除了農地價格有一點……"],["丁委員學忠：沒關係，這個會期才剛開始，我們可以慢慢來討論，不要影響到其他委員的時間。"],["吳署長欣修：感謝委員。"],["丁委員學忠：感謝次長跟署長。"],["董次長建宏：謝謝。"],["主席：請王美惠委員。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":276,"meet_id":"委員會-11-2-15-2","speakers":["張宏陸","李彥秀","王鴻薇","蘇巧慧","麥玉珍","許宇甄","黃建賓","丁學忠","王美惠","黃捷","徐欣瑩","李柏毅","吳琪銘","牛煦庭","張智倫","李坤城","黃健豪","徐巧芯","羅智強","張啓楷","邱志偉","洪孟楷","張嘉郡"],"page_start":213,"meetingDate":["2024-09-30"],"gazette_id":"1137801","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1137801_00009"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第2會期內政委員會第2次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、審查行政院函請審議「都市更新條例第六十五條條文修正草案」案；二、審查委員王鴻薇等\n20人擬具「都市更新條例第六十五條條文修正草案」案；三、審查委員李彥秀等17人擬具「都市\n更新條例第六十五條條文修正草案」案","agenda_id":"1137801_00010"}}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}