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書長,也請鄭部長。好,部長、秘書長。"},{"start":12.696,"end":39.77,"text":"兩位早安大家辛苦了我想尊重憲法法庭的判決快速的啟動修法的配套不只是司法院或是法務部更是立法院我們共同的責任我也要在這裡非常清楚的再一次藉由我質詢的時間來做非常完整的一個說明並沒有廢死而是慎死"},{"start":40.666,"end":62.436,"text":"也就是憲法法庭的宣判並沒有廢除死刑而是未來在判決審議死刑的過程更要嚴謹更要審慎所以沒有廢死是要慎死這個立場我們要非常清楚的向社會說明下一頁"},{"start":64.077,"end":90.583,"text":"我非常不樂見操作憲法判決的結果作為阻擋我們憲法法庭大法官人事同意權的一個工具其實當我們看到在野黨的委員在死刑何限與否的憲判還沒有出爐前就已經進行政治的操作"},{"start":91.363,"end":112.143,"text":"甚至藍營的委員一開始就表達如果死刑違憲就要封殺大法官的人事同意權我想這是非常不宜的但是在920當天憲判的結果出爐死刑合憲"},{"start":113.824,"end":132.851,"text":"國民黨團第一時間的記者會的回應是正面的感謝大法官聽見人民的聲音但是隨後國民黨黨中央改口了改變立場了藍白立場每天不一樣黨與黨團不同調"},{"start":137.358,"end":153.006,"text":"所以說我們都不樂見憲法的判決法律的專業不要淪為政治操作的工具更不要因此來阻卻大法官立法院依憲法依應行使同意權我們的憲法忠誠義務下頁"},{"start":154.967,"end":169.554,"text":"我想問一下代理秘書長過去到現在自從2003年大法官同意權改由立法院來行使之後有沒有發生過嚴當拒審大法官人事同意權的案例有沒有發生過拒審或嚴當沒有"},{"start":176.57,"end":189.97,"text":"唯一一次還不是據審也沒有延宕喔是2007年阿扁執政的末期提名的大法官裡頭有4位被提名人被國民黨多數否決"},{"start":191.445,"end":209.724,"text":"被否決也只能尊重所以在新任接任的馬英九總統任內重新補題國會重新審查行使同意權大法官憲法法庭可以如常運作沒有癱瘓"},{"start":211.005,"end":229.612,"text":"所以從過去到現在沒有任何一次大法官人事同意權發生過國會聚審然後延宕然後沒有辦法履行大法官的職責癱瘓了憲法法庭Never Never Never我們希望不要發生"},{"start":230.95,"end":235.673,"text":"我看到民眾黨委員發函要求大法官要填他們所謂的回填這些意見徵詢表但是呢"},{"start":259.715,"end":283.804,"text":"這當中的意見徵詢如果是正向的溝通對話理解彼此的理念這沒有問題但是如果涉及提問的內容攸關現在事件中的違憲審查條文我想這就大大不妥了所以我看到我們幾位大法官被提名的人有提出一個共同的說明也就是"},{"start":285.645,"end":303.921,"text":"為方便也為利於立法院行使統一權相關的簡歷自傳著作財務狀況各項資料依法皆已提交立法院來說明被提名人的個人學是專長從事法律相關的歷練參與釋憲以及憲法訴訟的相關經驗"},{"start":309.486,"end":322.9,"text":"當然包括對於憲法秩序人權保障的價值理念都已經完備的提供國會也已經公開上網了所以我個人是支持我們大法官的人事同意權一"},{"start":324.545,"end":324.565,"text":"吳思瑤議員"},{"start":341.476,"end":341.636,"text":"好那下一頁"},{"start":365.714,"end":375.456,"text":"回到今天主題死刑何限但是要限縮使用就是我說的沒有廢死但是要慎死所以說"},{"start":377.059,"end":396.559,"text":"我們接軌了國際的公約兩公約是馬英九前總統簽署的我們也落實了憲法保障人民生命權的重要精神大法官做出這樣一個憲判的結果我們予以尊重但是下一頁國會的工作是什麼"},{"start":397.62,"end":426.33,"text":"法務部的工作是什麼?司法院的挑戰是什麼?刑法、刑訴法、法院組織法、監獄刑刑法的配套都要趕快提出是不是我們已經組成了一個應變小組來進行所有修法的工作?部長跟委員報告我們有成立一個應變的一個小組那我們也根據這些憲判例子我們就刑法跟監獄刑刑法我們已經研擬那個草案條文了"},{"start":427.32,"end":443.931,"text":"剛剛有委員說他打賭了你們一定搶在最後兩年壓線才提出意思是能拖就拖能言就言會這樣嗎你們應當即刻的現在法務部相關的法律條文有應變小組也應當準備的差不多吧"},{"start":449.059,"end":472.927,"text":"所以法務部的條文基本上大致ready了動作很快但是後續送行政院之後有政委行政院院會還要會嫌司法院如果我在這裡預測時程加快加速的話這個會期或是下個會期應當立法院就可以來行使相關修法配套的工作吧"},{"start":474.281,"end":475.982,"text":"我個人對於尊重憲判的結果我的三大主張"},{"start":501.681,"end":525.334,"text":"第一個,我們依舊要避免冤獄的產生。第二,我們要全面的建制完備制度來防堵犯罪人逃避刑責。第三,我們要即刻來推動無期徒刑假釋制度層級化。我在你們的報告當中看到這是你們已經在進行研議的工作。下一頁。"},{"start":526.414,"end":543.761,"text":"我還是要提一提喔37名的死刑就案啊社會有一種風氣或一種以而傳而的擔心這個憲判之後後續的處置他們可能重新審議非常上述或者如何如何可能被放了有可能嗎部長"},{"start":547.453,"end":574.271,"text":"我們非常關注這個問題齁那這個死刑犯會不會放出去因為這牽扯到還是一些的法律上的一個一個的我們在我們認為現在在收容中就是不能夠折抵刑期据或保安處分另外其實我沒反對是進入假釋的門檻那個期間所以我們這部分我們是是有修法在監獄期間我們要修法來來做這樣的一個一個一個"},{"start":576.593,"end":580.977,"text":"所以絕對不會有現在就在擔心或者是謠傳37名死刑救案有兩案可以提非常上訴有三案也因為他審判期間的精神障礙心智缺陷也可以非常上訴其他32案一併都要審酌提起非常上訴但是無論如何都不會有現在就被釋放的這種狀況發生嗎"},{"start":606.192,"end":633.561,"text":"在那個有提起回廠上訴在確定判決還沒有撤銷以前都是屬於縮容的狀態是的所以大家不用擔心因為我時間到了我後面有一些修法的部分沒有辦法來論述但無論如何立法院同樣有責任我們要向社會清楚的來說明沒有廢死而是在法律的程序要更為嚴謹所有的修法配套"},{"start":634.701,"end":646.367,"text":"請司法院請法務部包括我們自我要求立法院越快越好希望這個會期可以來審查或是下個會期來全力推進完備配套謝謝"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:41:44.684000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:41:44.845000+08:00","text":"謝謝主席。","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:41:45.647000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:41:47.953000+08:00","text":"有請黃代理秘書長，也請鄭部長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-10-07T10:41:47.953000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:41:48.214000+08:00","text":"好，部長、秘書長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃代理秘書長麟倫","start":"2024-10-07T10:41:48.214000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:41:53.696000+08:00","text":"委員好。","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:41:53.696000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:41:54.877000+08:00","text":"兩位早安，大家辛苦了。","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:41:55.837000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:42:07.383000+08:00","text":"我想尊重憲法法庭的判決，快速地啟動修法的配套，不只是司法院或是法務部，更是立法院我們共同的責任。","quality":0.977},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:42:08.103000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:42:42.876000+08:00","text":"我也要在這裡藉由我的質詢時間再一次清楚地做非常完整的說明，並沒有廢死，而是慎死，也就是憲法法庭的宣判並沒有廢除死刑，而是未來在判決審議死刑的過程更要嚴謹、更要審慎，所以沒有廢死，是要慎死，這個立場我們要非常清楚地向社會說明。","quality":0.893},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:42:45.077000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:43:24.995000+08:00","text":"我非常不樂見操作憲法判決的結果作為阻擋憲法法庭大法官人事同意權的工具，其實當我們看到在野黨的委員在死刑合憲與否的憲判還沒有出爐前，就已經進行政治的操作，甚至藍營的委員一開始就表達，如果死刑違憲，就要封殺大法官的人事同意權，我想這是非常不宜的。","quality":0.982},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:43:25.976000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:43:53.851000+08:00","text":"但是在920當天憲判的結果出爐，死刑合憲，國民黨團第一時間的記者會的回應是正面的，感謝大法官聽見人民的聲音，但是隨後國民黨黨中央改口了、改變立場了，藍、白立場每天不一樣，黨與黨團不同調。","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:43:58.358000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:44:13.986000+08:00","text":"所以我們都不樂見，憲法的判決、法律的專業不要淪為政治操作的工具，更不要因此來阻卻立法院依憲法應行使大法官同意權的憲法忠誠義務。","quality":0.949},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:44:15.967000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:44:29.834000+08:00","text":"我想問一下代理秘書長，過去到現在，自從2003年大法官同意權改由立法院來行使之後，有沒有發生過延宕、拒審大法官人事同意權的案例？","quality":0.964},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:44:29.994000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:44:30.174000+08:00","text":"有沒有發生過拒審或延宕？","quality":0.818},{"speaker":"黃代理秘書長麟倫","start":"2024-10-07T10:44:30.174000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:44:37.570000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，應該沒有。沒有！","quality":0.182},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:44:37.570000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:44:41.035000+08:00","text":"唯一一次還不是拒審，也沒有延宕喔！","quality":0.933},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:44:41.536000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:45:10.724000+08:00","text":"是2007年阿扁執政的末期，提名的大法官裡頭有4位被提名人被國民黨多數否決，被否決也只能尊重，所以在新接任的馬英九總統任內重新補提，國會重新審查行使同意權，大法官、憲法法庭可以如常運作，沒有癱瘓。","quality":0.988},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:45:12.005000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:45:28.611000+08:00","text":"所以從過去到現在，沒有任何一次大法官人事同意權發生過國會拒審、延宕，然後沒有辦法履行大法官的職責，癱瘓了憲法法庭，never、never、never！","quality":0.94},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:45:28.611000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:45:32.190000+08:00","text":"我們希望不要發生，更不應當因為一些政治事件或者是對於某一個憲判不接受、不同意，然後就來杯葛人事同意權，我想這是我們共同的立場。","quality":0.155},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:45:32.190000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:46:18.882000+08:00","text":"我有看到民眾黨委員發函要求大法官要回填他們所謂的意見徵詢表，但是這當中的意見徵詢，如果是正向的溝通、對話、理解彼此的理念，這沒有問題，但是如果涉及提問的內容攸關現在釋憲中的違憲審查條文，我想這就大大不妥了。","quality":0.947},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:46:19.662000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:46:44.921000+08:00","text":"所以我看到幾位大法官被提名人有提出一個共同的說明，也就是為方便也為利於立法院行使同意權，相關的簡歷、自傳、著作、財務狀況，各項資料依法皆已提交立法院，來說明被提名人的個人學識、專長、從事法律相關的歷練、參與釋憲以及憲法訴訟的相關經驗。","quality":0.972},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:46:50.486000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:46:59.375000+08:00","text":"當然包括對於憲法秩序、人權保障的價值理念，都已經完備的提供國會，也已經公開上網了。","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:46:59.375000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:47:03.995200+08:00","text":"所以我個人是支持大法官的人事同意權依現有法律的授權、依程序來行使，如果個別政黨去行使所謂的意見徵詢，但是提問的內容已經僭越了憲判審議中的案件，我是支持我們不應當來同意這樣一個問題的回答。","quality":0.205},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:47:03.995200+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:47:08.615400+08:00","text":"是不是基於這樣的理由，幾位被提名人做出一個共同的決定？","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:47:08.615400+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:47:13.235600+08:00","text":"代理秘書長可以回應嗎？","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:47:13.235600+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:47:17.855800+08:00","text":"你也只能尊重？","quality":0},{"speaker":"黃代理秘書長麟倫","start":"2024-10-07T10:47:17.855800+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:47:22.476000+08:00","text":"對，因為我只能尊重，因為大法官的提名是總統府這邊的……","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:47:22.476000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:47:55.354000+08:00","text":"好，回到今天的主題，死刑合憲，但是要限縮使用，就是我說的，沒有廢死，但是要慎死。","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:47:56.276000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:48:17.559000+08:00","text":"所以我們接軌了國際的公約，兩公約是馬英九前總統簽署的，我們也落實了憲法保障人民生命權的重要精神，大法官做出這樣一個憲判的結果，我們予以尊重，但是國會的工作是什麼？","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:48:18.620000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:48:20.341000+08:00","text":"法務部的工作是什麼？","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:48:20.341000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:48:22.301000+08:00","text":"司法院的挑戰是什麼？","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:48:22.301000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:48:34.165000+08:00","text":"刑法、刑訴法、法院組織法、監獄行刑法的配套都要趕快提出，部長，是不是我們已經組成了一個應變小組來進行所有修法的工作？","quality":0.942},{"speaker":"鄭部長銘謙","start":"2024-10-07T10:48:36.466000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:48:47.310000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，我們有成立一個應變小組，我們也根據這些憲判例子，就刑法跟監獄行刑法，我們已經研擬草案條文了。","quality":0.979},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:48:48.320000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:48:58.827000+08:00","text":"剛剛有委員說，他打賭你們一定會搶在最後兩年才壓線提出，意思是能拖就拖，能延就延，會這樣嗎？","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:48:58.827000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:49:04.911000+08:00","text":"你們應當即刻的……現在法務部相關的法律條文有應變小組，也應當準備得差不多吧？","quality":0.971},{"speaker":"鄭部長銘謙","start":"2024-10-07T10:49:04.911000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:49:10.059000+08:00","text":"我們近日內會再陳報行政院來做……","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:49:10.059000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:49:33.907000+08:00","text":"所以法務部的條文基本上大致ready了，動作很快，但是後續送行政院之後有政委、行政院院會，還要會銜司法院，如果我在這裡預測時程加快、加速的話，這個會期或是下個會期應當立法院就可以行使相關修法配套的工作吧？是。","quality":0.979},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:49:33.907000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:49:34.907000+08:00","text":"應當OK嘛。","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:49:34.907000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:49:35.907000+08:00","text":"我也希望朝野的立委一起來進行所有的配套修法，我非常期待最快這個會期送進來，或者因為有院際之間的會銜，下個會期來進行審議，我想這是我們應當有的高度共識，我們一起來努力。","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:49:35.281000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:50:25.873000+08:00","text":"我個人對於尊重憲判的結果有三大主張：第一個，我們依舊要避免冤獄的產生；第二，我們要全面地建置完備制度，來防堵犯罪人逃避刑責；第三，我們要即刻推動無期徒刑假釋制度層級化，我在你們的報告當中看到這是你們已經在進行研議的工作。","quality":0.97},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:50:27.414000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:50:44.741000+08:00","text":"我還是要提一提，對於37名的死刑舊案，社會有一種風氣或一種以訛傳訛，擔心這個憲判之後後續的處置，他們可能重新審議非常上訴或者如何、如何，可能被放了，部長，有可能嗎？","quality":0.887},{"speaker":"鄭部長銘謙","start":"2024-10-07T10:50:48.453000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:51:03.924000+08:00","text":"我們非常關注這個問題，死刑犯會不會放出去因為牽扯到一些法律上的……我們認為現在在收容中，不能夠折抵刑期，要法律處分……是。","quality":0.925},{"speaker":"鄭部長銘謙","start":"2024-10-07T10:51:04.304000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:51:14.871000+08:00","text":"另外，其實我們也反對計入假釋門檻的期間，所以這部分我們有建議修法做這樣的法制作業來解決這個問題。","quality":0.644},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:51:17.593000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:51:21.957000+08:00","text":"所以絕對不會有現在就在擔心或者謠傳37名死刑舊案有2案可以提非常上訴，有3案因為審判期間的精神障礙、心智缺陷也可以提非常上訴，其他32案一併都要審酌提起非常上訴，但是無論如何，都不會有現在就被釋放的這種狀況發生嘛。","quality":0.968},{"speaker":"鄭部長銘謙","start":"2024-10-07T10:51:47.192000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:51:54.674000+08:00","text":"對，在提起非常上訴、確定判決還沒有撤銷以前都是屬於收容的狀態。","quality":0.857},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:51:54.674000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:51:56.615000+08:00","text":"是的，所以大家不用擔心。","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:51:57.375000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:52:13.921000+08:00","text":"我的時間到了，我後面有一些修法的部分沒有辦法論述，但無論如何，立法院同樣有責任，我們要向社會清楚地說明沒有廢死，而是法律的程序要更為嚴謹。","quality":0.968},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:52:13.921000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-07T10:52:27.367000+08:00","text":"所有的修法配套請司法院、法務部、包括我們立法院自我要求要越快越好，希望這個會期可以審查或是下個會期全力推進來完備配套，謝謝。","quality":0.912},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-10-07T10:52:27.867000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:52:29.295571+08:00","text":"謝謝吳委員。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-10-07T10:52:29.595571+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:52:33.309857+08:00","text":"部長，剛剛吳委員問東，你答西耶！","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:52:33.609857+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:52:35.609857+08:00","text":"我都沒有意見啊。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-10-07T10:52:35.909857+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:52:37.624143+08:00","text":"他問東，你答西。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-10-07T10:52:37.924143+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:52:45.638429+08:00","text":"他問說會不會放出來，你跟他扯說收容不計入，你們到底在講什麼！","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-10-07T10:52:45.938429+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:52:48.224143+08:00","text":"你不能問東答西啊！","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-10-07T10:52:48.524143+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:52:49.952714+08:00","text":"你這是怎樣？","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:52:50.252714+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:52:53.109857+08:00","text":"我沒有覺得他問東答西。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-10-07T10:52:53.409857+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:52:56.838429+08:00","text":"沒有，他沒有回答你的問題啊！","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-10-07T10:52:57.138429+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:53:04.281286+08:00","text":"你問說會不會放出來，他跟你回答說收容可不可以計入刑期……","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:53:04.581286+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:53:10.295571+08:00","text":"這是我的質詢時間，主席，您可以在您的質詢時間……","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-10-07T10:53:10.595571+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:53:16.309857+08:00","text":"這是問東答西，我跟你講，這是專業，就是問東答西！","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-10-07T10:53:16.609857+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:53:18.895571+08:00","text":"部長，你不能這樣子！","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-10-07T10:53:19.195571+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:53:20.909857+08:00","text":"你不能這樣子！","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:53:21.209857+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:53:25.495571+08:00","text":"您可以在您的質詢時間來處理，好嗎？","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-10-07T10:53:25.795571+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:53:30.081286+08:00","text":"我現在是為我們的委員覺得不值得……","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:53:30.381286+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:53:32.952714+08:00","text":"主席主持議事，請尊重……","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-10-07T10:53:33.252714+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:53:36.967000+08:00","text":"因為委員的問題問東，部長答西！","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:53:37.267000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:53:40.409857+08:00","text":"好啦，主席，不用關注了，好嗎？","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-10-07T10:53:40.709857+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:53:44.424143+08:00","text":"委員，我在為你維護你的權利耶！","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-10-07T10:53:44.724143+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:53:47.867000+08:00","text":"部長沒有回答你的問題耶！","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:53:48.167000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:53:50.452714+08:00","text":"那我再跟您說謝謝。","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:53:50.752714+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:53:55.324143+08:00","text":"好，我跟您說謝謝，我來跟您說謝謝，好嗎？","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-10-07T10:53:55.624143+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:54:04.195571+08:00","text":"他可能答出你要的答案，但是他沒有回答你的問題，我是在維護你的權利……","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:54:04.495571+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:54:07.352714+08:00","text":"您不用來延伸我的質詢。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-10-07T10:54:07.652714+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:54:12.795571+08:00","text":"部長，你不能這樣藐視我們的吳大委員！好啦！","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:54:13.095571+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:54:16.524143+08:00","text":"小強委員在等了啦，謝謝主席。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-10-07T10:54:16.824143+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:54:21.109857+08:00","text":"部長，不能藐視我們立法委員，好不好？","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-10-07T10:54:21.409857+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:54:24.267000+08:00","text":"麻煩你要對問題去回答。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-10-07T10:54:24.567000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:54:34.567000+08:00","text":"他剛剛問你是不是37個有被放出來的可能，然後你剛剛在答說收容計不計入刑期，這個……","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:54:34.867000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:54:37.438429+08:00","text":"我們雖然都姓吳，但是……","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-10-07T10:54:37.738429+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:54:46.024143+08:00","text":"好，沒關係，我跟你講，不然等一下我就問你這個，你就認真地答嘛，好不好？","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳委員思瑤","start":"2024-10-07T10:54:46.324143+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:54:50.895571+08:00","text":"對啦，您等一下可以繼續問嘛，謝謝主席。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-10-07T10:54:51.195571+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-07T10:54:53.195571+08:00","text":"接下來請羅委員。","quality":0}]},"會議時間":"2024-10-07T09:00:00+08:00","委員發言時間":"10:41:41 - 10:52:30","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第2會期司法及法制委員會第3次全體委員會議（事由：邀請司法院秘書長、法務部部長、內政部警政署、衛生福利部率所屬相關單位列席就「憲法法庭113年度憲判字第8號判決宣示相關法令之檢討與修正」進行專題報告，並備質詢。）","gazette":{"lineno":533,"blocks":[["吳委員思瑤：（10時41分）謝謝主席。有請黃代理秘書長，也請鄭部長。"],["主席：好，部長、秘書長。"],["黃代理秘書長麟倫：委員好。"],["吳委員思瑤：兩位早安，大家辛苦了。我想尊重憲法法庭的判決，快速地啟動修法的配套，不只是司法院或是法務部，更是立法院我們共同的責任。我也要在這裡藉由我的質詢時間再一次清楚地做非常完整的說明，並沒有廢死，而是慎死，也就是憲法法庭的宣判並沒有廢除死刑，而是未來在判決審議死刑的過程更要嚴謹、更要審慎，所以沒有廢死，是要慎死，這個立場我們要非常清楚地向社會說明。","我非常不樂見操作憲法判決的結果作為阻擋憲法法庭大法官人事同意權的工具，其實當我們看到在野黨的委員在死刑合憲與否的憲判還沒有出爐前，就已經進行政治的操作，甚至藍營的委員一開始就表達，如果死刑違憲，就要封殺大法官的人事同意權，我想這是非常不宜的。但是在920當天憲判的結果出爐，死刑合憲，國民黨團第一時間的記者會的回應是正面的，感謝大法官聽見人民的聲音，但是隨後國民黨黨中央改口了、改變立場了，藍、白立場每天不一樣，黨與黨團不同調。所以我們都不樂見，憲法的判決、法律的專業不要淪為政治操作的工具，更不要因此來阻卻立法院依憲法應行使大法官同意權的憲法忠誠義務。","我想問一下代理秘書長，過去到現在，自從2003年大法官同意權改由立法院來行使之後，有沒有發生過延宕、拒審大法官人事同意權的案例？有沒有發生過拒審或延宕？"],["黃代理秘書長麟倫：跟委員報告，應該沒有。"],["吳委員思瑤：沒有！唯一一次還不是拒審，也沒有延宕喔！是2007年阿扁執政的末期，提名的大法官裡頭有4位被提名人被國民黨多數否決，被否決也只能尊重，所以在新接任的馬英九總統任內重新補提，國會重新審查行使同意權，大法官、憲法法庭可以如常運作，沒有癱瘓。所以從過去到現在，沒有任何一次大法官人事同意權發生過國會拒審、延宕，然後沒有辦法履行大法官的職責，癱瘓了憲法法庭，never、never、never！我們希望不要發生，更不應當因為一些政治事件或者是對於某一個憲判不接受、不同意，然後就來杯葛人事同意權，我想這是我們共同的立場。","我有看到民眾黨委員發函要求大法官要回填他們所謂的意見徵詢表，但是這當中的意見徵詢，如果是正向的溝通、對話、理解彼此的理念，這沒有問題，但是如果涉及提問的內容攸關現在釋憲中的違憲審查條文，我想這就大大不妥了。所以我看到幾位大法官被提名人有提出一個共同的說明，也就是為方便也為利於立法院行使同意權，相關的簡歷、自傳、著作、財務狀況，各項資料依法皆已提交立法院，來說明被提名人的個人學識、專長、從事法律相關的歷練、參與釋憲以及憲法訴訟的相關經驗。當然包括對於憲法秩序、人權保障的價值理念，都已經完備的提供國會，也已經公開上網了。所以我個人是支持大法官的人事同意權依現有法律的授權、依程序來行使，如果個別政黨去行使所謂的意見徵詢，但是提問的內容已經僭越了憲判審議中的案件，我是支持我們不應當來同意這樣一個問題的回答。是不是基於這樣的理由，幾位被提名人做出一個共同的決定？代理秘書長可以回應嗎？你也只能尊重？"],["黃代理秘書長麟倫：對，因為我只能尊重，因為大法官的提名是總統府這邊的……"],["吳委員思瑤：好，回到今天的主題，死刑合憲，但是要限縮使用，就是我說的，沒有廢死，但是要慎死。所以我們接軌了國際的公約，兩公約是馬英九前總統簽署的，我們也落實了憲法保障人民生命權的重要精神，大法官做出這樣一個憲判的結果，我們予以尊重，但是國會的工作是什麼？法務部的工作是什麼？司法院的挑戰是什麼？刑法、刑訴法、法院組織法、監獄行刑法的配套都要趕快提出，部長，是不是我們已經組成了一個應變小組來進行所有修法的工作？"],["鄭部長銘謙：跟委員報告，我們有成立一個應變小組，我們也根據這些憲判例子，就刑法跟監獄行刑法，我們已經研擬草案條文了。"],["吳委員思瑤：剛剛有委員說，他打賭你們一定會搶在最後兩年才壓線提出，意思是能拖就拖，能延就延，會這樣嗎？你們應當即刻的……現在法務部相關的法律條文有應變小組，也應當準備得差不多吧？"],["鄭部長銘謙：我們近日內會再陳報行政院來做……"],["吳委員思瑤：所以法務部的條文基本上大致ready了，動作很快，但是後續送行政院之後有政委、行政院院會，還要會銜司法院，如果我在這裡預測時程加快、加速的話，這個會期或是下個會期應當立法院就可以行使相關修法配套的工作吧？"],["鄭部長銘謙：是。"],["吳委員思瑤：應當OK嘛。我也希望朝野的立委一起來進行所有的配套修法，我非常期待最快這個會期送進來，或者因為有院際之間的會銜，下個會期來進行審議，我想這是我們應當有的高度共識，我們一起來努力。","我個人對於尊重憲判的結果有三大主張：第一個，我們依舊要避免冤獄的產生；第二，我們要全面地建置完備制度，來防堵犯罪人逃避刑責；第三，我們要即刻推動無期徒刑假釋制度層級化，我在你們的報告當中看到這是你們已經在進行研議的工作。","我還是要提一提，對於37名的死刑舊案，社會有一種風氣或一種以訛傳訛，擔心這個憲判之後後續的處置，他們可能重新審議非常上訴或者如何、如何，可能被放了，部長，有可能嗎？"],["鄭部長銘謙：我們非常關注這個問題，死刑犯會不會放出去因為牽扯到一些法律上的……我們認為現在在收容中，不能夠折抵刑期，要法律處分……"],["吳委員思瑤：是。"],["鄭部長銘謙：另外，其實我們也反對計入假釋門檻的期間，所以這部分我們有建議修法做這樣的法制作業來解決這個問題。"],["吳委員思瑤：所以絕對不會有現在就在擔心或者謠傳37名死刑舊案有2案可以提非常上訴，有3案因為審判期間的精神障礙、心智缺陷也可以提非常上訴，其他32案一併都要審酌提起非常上訴，但是無論如何，都不會有現在就被釋放的這種狀況發生嘛。"],["鄭部長銘謙：對，在提起非常上訴、確定判決還沒有撤銷以前都是屬於收容的狀態。"],["吳委員思瑤：是的，所以大家不用擔心。我的時間到了，我後面有一些修法的部分沒有辦法論述，但無論如何，立法院同樣有責任，我們要向社會清楚地說明沒有廢死，而是法律的程序要更為嚴謹。所有的修法配套請司法院、法務部、包括我們立法院自我要求要越快越好，希望這個會期可以審查或是下個會期全力推進來完備配套，謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝吳委員。","部長，剛剛吳委員問東，你答西耶！"],["吳委員思瑤：我都沒有意見啊。"],["主席：他問東，你答西。他問說會不會放出來，你跟他扯說收容不計入，你們到底在講什麼！你不能問東答西啊！你這是怎樣？"],["吳委員思瑤：我沒有覺得他問東答西。"],["主席：沒有，他沒有回答你的問題啊！你問說會不會放出來，他跟你回答說收容可不可以計入刑期……"],["吳委員思瑤：這是我的質詢時間，主席，您可以在您的質詢時間……"],["主席：這是問東答西，我跟你講，這是專業，就是問東答西！部長，你不能這樣子！你不能這樣子！"],["吳委員思瑤：您可以在您的質詢時間來處理，好嗎？"],["主席：我現在是為我們的委員覺得不值得……"],["吳委員思瑤：主席主持議事，請尊重……"],["主席：因為委員的問題問東，部長答西！"],["吳委員思瑤：好啦，主席，不用關注了，好嗎？"],["主席：委員，我在為你維護你的權利耶！部長沒有回答你的問題耶！"],["吳委員思瑤：那我再跟您說謝謝。好，我跟您說謝謝，我來跟您說謝謝，好嗎？"],["主席：他可能答出你要的答案，但是他沒有回答你的問題，我是在維護你的權利……"],["吳委員思瑤：您不用來延伸我的質詢。"],["主席：部長，你不能這樣藐視我們的吳大委員！"],["吳委員思瑤：好啦！小強委員在等了啦，謝謝主席。"],["主席：部長，不能藐視我們立法委員，好不好？麻煩你要對問題去回答。他剛剛問你是不是37個有被放出來的可能，然後你剛剛在答說收容計不計入刑期，這個……"],["吳委員思瑤：我們雖然都姓吳，但是……"],["主席：好，沒關係，我跟你講，不然等一下我就問你這個，你就認真地答嘛，好不好？"],["吳委員思瑤：對啦，您等一下可以繼續問嘛，謝謝主席。"],["主席：接下來請羅委員。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":156,"meet_id":"委員會-11-2-36-3","speakers":["吳宗憲","黃國昌","沈發惠","莊瑞雄","鍾佳濱","謝龍介","吳思瑤","羅智強","翁曉玲","陳俊宇","王鴻薇","林淑芬","傅崐萁","楊瓊瓔","廖偉翔","牛煦庭","洪孟楷","林思銘"],"page_start":89,"meetingDate":["2024-10-07"],"gazette_id":"1138001","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1138001_00003"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第2會期司法及法制委員會第3次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請司法院秘書長、法務部部長、內政部警政署、衛生福利部率所屬相關單位列席就「憲法法庭\n113年度憲判字第8號判決宣示相關法令之檢討與修正」進行專題報告，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1138001_00002"}}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}