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請蘇人事長 薛次長 還有陳副主委"},{"start":16.901,"end":37.339,"text":"大家早安今天周圍安排了這一個AI為主題的專案報告然後呢部會來列席的好多部會等等這樣一卦所以代表我們要打造確實是一個AI的國家對在公務體系裡頭no one is outsider"},{"start":38.936,"end":45.39,"text":"沒有人是局外人各個部會都有承擔責任不管是培育或是參與"},{"start":48.973,"end":69.814,"text":"那AI列入我們五大信賴產業當中跟AI相關的就是我們的國家雄心壯志是打造台灣為全球AI影響力中心推動目標裡頭呢當然希望有產值但是在人才的部分"},{"start":70.555,"end":94.765,"text":"全國公司協力4年內培育20萬名AI數位人才然後提升數位經濟產業導入AI的應用普及率是50%對於製造業來導入AI的普及率要到3成今天的主題是我們公務部門其實也是順著剛剛我們趙薇所問的"},{"start":97.486,"end":126.395,"text":"到底這麼多部會是國家隊每一個部會的職﹑你的職長都跟AI的應用相關到底誰管好我現在要問這個問題啦我們對於數位經濟導入要4年5成對於製造業導入AI技術要4年3成那我問這個問題我們的公務體系導入AI的應用4年內的目標是多少"},{"start":127.935,"end":149.789,"text":"誰可以回答這個問題?如果以剛剛鍾釗緯所問的、垂詢的誰在整合、誰在管考,你們沒有辦法回答所以我的問題你當然也沒有辦法回答這就是一個key point"},{"start":150.925,"end":165.925,"text":"國家隊 大家都有責任在自己的專善執掌裡頭想方設法去應用但是我們對於民間的產業有清楚的戰略目標對於公務體系我覺得不能夠"},{"start":167.286,"end":192.083,"text":"這樣子毫無清晰的目標值這個問題好好帶回去這就是我們要面對的問題在公務體系今天人事長處理的是公務體系的培訓嘛來下一頁總統說了我們AI時代來臨希望我們公務體系每一位首長每一位公務同仁都要有相關的AI知能"},{"start":193.581,"end":216.4,"text":"但是今天的主題我看到的如果是以因為法制委員會監督的是人事長我們可能會把他放在公務人力的人才培育但是我要說我們不只是培育公務體系的同仁有AI的知能更重要的是在國家的AI政策跟相關的應用上"},{"start":216.94,"end":245.633,"text":"其實是各部會是參與的角色包括我對人事長你的期待我們不是只辦訓練營讓大家知道AI是什麼剛剛鍾釗緯講得非常好啊對於山岸的協助對於矯正署法制委員會我們的法務部AI的應用何其之廣啊所以不是只有末端的人才培訓來告訴大家現在技術有哪些大家要懂重點是公務體系的應用"},{"start":248.017,"end":266.633,"text":"這個是前後非常重要的一個思維的翻轉,我在這裡一定要提出來喔,下一頁這個big data,新時代喔,資訊就是新的石油,因為我過去在教育文化委員會喔,我長期跟國科會來做這方面的討論,下一頁"},{"start":268.587,"end":288.557,"text":"所以在CHAP GPT引爆了AI的這個資訊資料庫的浪潮之後我過去質詢了國科會那時候的吳政中他是主委也兼政委所以提出了要在2024年是今年的預算已經在執行有40億國家投入AI的發展這是今年度的預算但是呢我們還是落後了"},{"start":298.183,"end":299.745,"text":"我今天就就這個資料庫來就教於三位"},{"start":320.439,"end":337.012,"text":"這個TED我們要推動可信任生成式的AI發展就在中研院去年發生了台灣的資訊資料庫不夠以至於我們中研院的研究員去引用了"},{"start":338.072,"end":363.994,"text":"中國建制的資料庫鬧出了笑話大家記得這件事所以在這個事件之後國科會述發部跟中研院就投入了3億要進行臺版的CHAP GPT也就是臺灣自治大型語言模型目前這個進度應當是進行來是要陳副主委回答還是要我們學次長"},{"start":365.3,"end":388.108,"text":"報告委員這應該是目前是國科會負責的那目前呢建制我們要創造台灣的資料數據建構台灣繁中系統的語言資料庫掌握data就是掌握了石油目前建制如何報告委員目前我們應該已經release了應該在今年的4月份有release一個版本出來"},{"start":391.049,"end":418.208,"text":"我看您今天沒有辦法回答細節你可以提供相關資料給本席我要提這個是我們的預算當初要建這個台版的CHAP GDP是3億左右的預算那我剛剛講的即便3億之外要40億投入國家隊的AI發展我們還是落後先進國家非常多沒有預算就沒有辦法做事啦下一頁"},{"start":419.489,"end":423.272,"text":"我掌握到的國科會針對這個TED資料庫的新年度就是明年2025年的國家預算至少是1.37億這是新增預算新增計畫如果總預算繼續被擋下去的話這一個台灣的繁中語言資料庫的建制就成了受災戶我們就沒有辦法打我們的"},{"start":446.567,"end":475.186,"text":"這個AI跟世界各國一起比拼的這個資訊大戰你們有去跟在野黨委員爭取預算說明預算了嗎?這裡面有國客會預算大概1.37億速發部應該也有吧?速發部的預算是那個評測中心的預算一年8千億一年8千億所以總預算八檔就不一定不可以嘛我們今天在這裡爭取我們AI向前大步走預算沒過怎麼推啊?"},{"start":476.067,"end":496.078,"text":"我相信很多在野黨的委員也會在這裡要求你們我們要做多好做多多做多快預算沒過怎麼做呢我用的還只是這個TED資料庫繁中語言資料庫台版CHAP GDP的一個案例而已下一頁那另外就是"},{"start":500.074,"end":520.951,"text":"是為了AI基本法嗎?你們現在公告完成了10月底要送行政院其實面對資安、面對假訊息、面對侵權行為的頻傳台灣能不能夠快速地來去制定出台灣的AI基本法我去年在教育文化委員會我是質疑的"},{"start":522.622,"end":542.607,"text":"在世界各國還沒有他也許是指引歐美國家還沒有完成立法的台灣有信心做得到做得好嗎你們現在完成公告了收集社會的意見如何跟你們原始的法案的草擬的想像是如何來副主委"},{"start":543.808,"end":563.104,"text":"報告委員我們已經完成了公告那其實也收集了蠻多的建議的那我們也在這個收集完之後有納入方向跟原本的設定方向跟原本設定大同小異我們還是會這個鼓勵創新跟兼顧人權這兩個方向會同時"},{"start":563.464,"end":582.422,"text":"我沒有反對制定但是我是以國際經驗國外的AI每年投入這麼多預算的先進大國他們還是用指引的方式台灣能夠這麼快速的用一個立法的方式嗎我今天在這裡我還是質疑不需要為快而快"},{"start":583.447,"end":603.983,"text":"我們要做就要做對方向繼續對話好AI基本法涉及7大基本原則4大推動重點都是跨部會的所以我們成立了行政院數位法制協調專案會議下一頁人事長我們人事總處是outside"},{"start":605.247,"end":628.592,"text":"這樣對嗎?"},{"start":630.23,"end":653.855,"text":"這就回到我剛說的你只是負責培訓喔而不是參與喔你只是培育而不是參與喔我是假如他們有邀請我我一定去參加你覺得你需不需要在裡面啊你覺得你需不需要在裡面我是樂於積極參與對國家發展有幫助的我認為AI新時代公務體系的"},{"start":654.255,"end":683.057,"text":"瞭解AI的知能進一步的能夠更去應用它我們人事總處應當是insider否則你會留於後端一個知識性傳授的角色而已下一頁你看看這是我們開過三次會的會議結錄都提到各機關的座談會工作坊論壇去培育公務人員的AI知能"},{"start":684.403,"end":692.21,"text":"我認為這個你們在場三位來這個國科會跟速發部應該速發部這個應當把人事總處納進去吧這麼簡單的問題因為這個是"},{"start":704.093,"end":729.623,"text":"人事長公他願意勇於認識嗎 對不對一起參與嘛 我不說你主導嘛 你要加入嘛幕僚應該是國發會啦好 那請國發會 那請今天與會的國發會的代表把這個訊息帶回去好嗎 下一頁因為我們現在都是做培訓課程 我說他是很末端的 人事長下一頁"},{"start":732.54,"end":757.17,"text":"就以國科會定定的使用生成式AI的指引．裡頭每一項從國安資安人權隱私倫理保密各自保護著作權．完全都跟公務體系的user使用端有關．所以我們人事總處當然要盡可能多參與．而不是只顧政策訂出來我來培育就好下一頁"},{"start":758.308,"end":783.108,"text":"好 說到你自己的這個提供我時間到了AI基礎的訓練課程120小時不管是高考或普考在整個 對不起所有公務體系的120小時的訓練裡頭AI甚至是資安不是只有AI都只有加起來都各只有8小時比例只有6.66這個部分就是我們培訓端就完全是人事總處"},{"start":784.648,"end":812.535,"text":"這個人事長您的我各位這是保訓會的我們在跟保訓會溝通這不是AI課程喔這是資安plus裡面一小部分的AI如果我剛剛說的培訓你只做培訓不做前端政策應用的參與的話那培訓也要做得充足目前高考跟普考要新進公務體系的人員他的這方面的課程是非常的少的也不夠啦"},{"start":813.157,"end":836.076,"text":"我來蔡主委拜託所以我覺得我們今天拋出來的議題從嘉賓召委到思瑤我們連成一氣的觀點就是公務體系對於AI相關的發展他是要多參與而不是只有培育而參與的部分no one is outsider我認為人事長人才是重中之重"},{"start":837.057,"end":852.601,"text":"我也很期待對於立法院也能夠有相關的課程包括立委或是立委的助理幕僚們我們都要共同來理解AI的新時代好嗎?今天的問題很高興這張委說未來還會有專案報告對於我們的幾個核心命題我們的AI運用在公務體系有沒有什麼樣的目標誰來觀考好好思考這個問題好嗎?好一起加油謝謝"}]},"會議時間":"2024-10-14T09:00:00+08:00","委員發言時間":"10:49:01 - 11:03:28","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第2會期司法及法制委員會第4次全體委員會議（事由：邀請行政院人事行政總處人事長暨相關部會列席就「政府機關導入AI提升效能」進行專題報告，並備質詢。）"},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}