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12:36:14","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第2會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第4次全體委員會議（事由：邀請勞動部部長列席報告業務概況，並備質詢。\n【10月16日及17日二天一次會】）","gazette":{"lineno":1197,"blocks":[["邱委員若華：（12時30分）謝謝主席，有請勞動部部長。"],["主席：請部長。"],["何部長佩珊：委員好。"],["邱委員若華：部長好。先請教部長一個問題，請問我國何時會邁入超高齡社會？"],["何部長佩珊：明年。"],["邱委員若華：在2025年，我國會邁入超高齡社會。"],["何部長佩珊：對。"],["邱委員若華：本席在上個會期有提到80歲以上的長者免巴氏量表，請問後續你們對這個議題討論到什麼地方？目前進度為何？"],["何部長佩珊：80歲以上免巴氏量表是在野黨委員的修法案，我們比較不贊成用80歲這樣的線來劃分免巴氏量表，我們現在用擴大多元免評的措施來處理。所謂擴大多元免評已經有包括第一個使用長照服務6個月以上，就是長照服務2.0半年以上就可以免評了。"],["邱委員若華：針對2.0長照，有提到放寬看護申請只要連續使用長照2.0半年以上，或是有輕度失智診斷或是特定中重度身心障礙就可以免巴氏量表，可是使用長照2.0半年以上就表示他有照護需求，這半年的空窗期，請問家屬要怎麼處理？"],["何部長佩珊：委員是說6個月的空窗期嗎？"],["邱委員若華：他已經使用半年以上，也就是表示他有照護需求，那家屬要如何處理？"],["何部長佩珊：他本來就有啊！"],["邱委員若華：我是指他就是有這個需求，他們就是需要巴氏量表。事實上，這些當事人都要去醫院定期回診，那眼前的空窗期，如果家屬發現他們有異狀而自己又需要上班，那要怎麼辦？"],["何部長佩珊：是，所以我們也推了擴大喘息，包括我們現在要推多元陪伴服務方案，就是希望能夠cover這種有短期照顧需求的，就是我們跟NGO合作，讓NGO眾體跟仲介合作，讓他們聘移工。"],["邱委員若華：移工是適用勞基法？"],["何部長佩珊：他可以進入家庭裡面，比如手術後或者是臨時有陪伴的服務需求，就是短期的。"],["邱委員若華：因為我國在明年就要邁入超高齡社會，衛福部在因應對策指出兩點，其中一個是長照資源的資金應仰賴明確的財源，第二是高齡者超過90%都跟子女同住，所以子女最知道高齡者的狀況情形，當高齡者出現退化問題的時候，子女在申請政府資源之前，他們優先想到的就是申請看護，子女才能夠順利出門上班。可是我請問部長一個問題，臺籍看護跟外籍看護的薪水差距是多大？"],["何部長佩珊：當然差距是相當大。"],["邱委員若華：多大？部長了解嗎？"],["何部長佩珊：以現在可能應該有到一半的差距。"],["邱委員若華：就本席的了解，外籍的看護是兩萬多塊一個月，臺籍的看護一個月可能要五、六萬塊，所以這差距非常大。部長，臺籍看護一天的薪水行情是臺幣兩千八百多元，那是很多上班族都負擔不起的金額。或是孩子要去上班，長者在家的時候可能會有一些狀況，比如他們忘記服藥或是跌倒，還是煮飯忘記關火，或是出門的時候因為認知的問題，還是他們記憶力退化，導致出車禍或是在路上跌倒旁邊沒有人照顧，部長有看到這些家庭的問題嗎？"],["何部長佩珊：是，所以我才要推多元陪伴服務方案。"],["邱委員若華：是不是修法放寬巴氏量表會比較快一點？"],["何部長佩珊：我們也會擴大多元免評。委員，我們比較擔心用年齡線來劃分，會變成有需要跟沒需要的全部都會申請，會造成現在看護工缺工的狀態會更嚴峻，主要是有這個顧慮，也會造成他們可能會挑工作，那麼會更難照顧，就是說照顧會更緊繃，所以恐怕沒有辦法真的解決照顧的問題。"],["邱委員若華：部長，正本清源來說，就是因為看護的市場勞動力不足，除了勞動力不足之外，人口高齡化對看護的需求是增加的，所以我們必須要對症下藥，解決人力的問題。"],["何部長佩珊：對，所以我說要推多元陪伴服務方案也就是這樣子，希望讓移工也進入照顧領域的部分，用國家的力量把它建置起來。"],["邱委員若華：部長，本席還是希望您可以和勞動部再討論巴氏量表的政策，根據本席今天向您提出目前很多家庭的需求。"],["何部長佩珊：是，當然，謝謝委員。"],["邱委員若華：謝謝部長，謝謝主席。"],["主席：謝謝邱若華委員。","接下來請牛煦庭委員發言。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":362,"meet_id":"委員會-11-2-26-4","speakers":["黃秀芳","陳昭姿","林月琴","陳菁徽","王育敏","邱鎮軍","廖偉翔","蘇清泉","涂權吉","王正旭","林淑芬","王鴻薇","羅廷瑋","陳瑩","楊瓊瓔","洪孟楷","吳宗憲","林國成","羅智強","吳春城","邱若華","牛煦庭","蔡易餘","葉元之","楊曜","劉建國","麥玉珍"],"page_start":265,"meetingDate":["2024-10-16"],"gazette_id":"1138601","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1138601_00006"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第2會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第4次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請勞動部部長列席報告業務概況，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1138601_00005"}}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}