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在接下來,我們請登記第7位李彥秀委員質詢。謝謝韓院長,我是不是可以請卓院長。 麻煩再請卓院長備詢。"},{"start":25.049,"end":25.209,"text":"劉慧卿議員"},{"start":43.864,"end":61.684,"text":"議員長你從民意代表出身你非常知道工會對於我們業務的推動在職災在各方面其實都協助我們很多但是歷經了很多年其實包括我們的基本工資跟電價的調整還有包括消費者物價指數每一年都在調整增加所以我在這邊我要跟"},{"start":62.865,"end":76.241,"text":"院長再次爭取,就是說有關於我們行政補助費對於各項工會的補助,未來是不是有機會再調整,甚至有機會我們聯動物價的有機會我們重新每一次視我們財務狀況進行檢討。"},{"start":78.868,"end":99.585,"text":"我了解勞動部有在做這樣的研議﹖那可能在往後的年度﹖我知道是後年﹖因為我推動了好多年﹖我知道部長有承諾各工會說是後年﹖但是如果今年財政狀況許可﹖我們在省預算或多或少追加減預備金﹖多多少補助一些﹖我們可不可以放在討論研議的範圍之內﹖"},{"start":103.776,"end":107.138,"text":"每一個孩子都是寶,我們不僅要鼓勵父母多生,生出來的部分持育和照顧得更好,是重點。"},{"start":128.553,"end":145.779,"text":"院長我有幾個數據我們現在嬰兒的死亡率創14年新高然後包括新生兒的死亡率今年是15年的新高我們就要去探究問題是為什麼這當然有不同的問題包括我們現在女性的平均生育年齡是32.44歲就大家早晚結婚還是生的晚"},{"start":150.7,"end":166.811,"text":"三個婦女裡面生小孩第一胎生小孩三個裡面有一個是超過35歲也就是高齡產婦每一位高齡產婦其實就增加早產的風險所以我要再一次爭取院長我不知道你是不是知道這個數據就是說"},{"start":168.072,"end":186.886,"text":"早產兒新生兒6個月所需的平均花費高達11.4萬元, 遠高於逐月的每一個胎兒, 逐月生產38週生產,前6個月大概只需要2.8萬元, 所以很多早產兒的婦女還有早產兒基金會,"},{"start":187.927,"end":216.193,"text":"前一陣子不斷的到立法院來做跟各黨派做溝通所以我希望在少子女化我們整個項目就是說不只我們怎麼建幼兒園啦或者是其他的層面我希望對於非要務的早產兒的營養品用品我們是不是可以討論放在少子女化的那個整個政策基金裡面去思考這一塊去照顧早產兒的這個相關的一些營養品跟用品部長"},{"start":217.452,"end":237.102,"text":"委員的考量出發點絕對是正確的那實務上現在怎麼來做包括他的花費啦以及現在我們這一塊到底可以說過去從來沒有納入過但是這一塊我們可不可以放在討論的政策裡面研議包括去補助他們家庭的早產兒家庭的定額照貨津貼"},{"start":239.622,"end":240.323,"text":"有關這一塊我們還特別來研議"},{"start":269.666,"end":294.36,"text":"足月額跟不足月額前6個月照顧金費差至少5倍以上。我最後一個問題,包括現在早產兒的鐵的添加物現在全球是缺貨,這個問題什麼時候可以解決?部長,院長可能不知道,你要知道啊,現在早產兒的母乳添加劑現在全球缺貨,那現在缺貨的問題什麼時候可以給答案?"},{"start":295.899,"end":303.926,"text":"早產而需要魔乳添加劑,現在這個部分缺貨。 國際因素缺貨,怎麼樣去調度這些?"},{"start":303.926,"end":314.195,"text":"因為現在是缺貨的狀況,我提醒你。我再來了解國內的狀況。 其實我們在缺藥相關的一個平台是功能非常的好。"},{"start":315.936,"end":341.617,"text":"現在還是沒有,所以我現在告訴你現在沒有趕快去調度處理,三天之後告訴我調度的狀況怎麼去處理。好,最後一個問題,院長我長期在關注你周遭朋友一定很多人得過撇爪,帶狀性皰疹,上會期我已經問過了,但是沒有給我具體的答案。我覺得這件事情,我知道財政的狀況有限,但是這個是很多高風險族群,三高也好,我們是財務經費"},{"start":343.098,"end":343.138,"text":"李彥秀"},{"start":373.458,"end":375.019,"text":"謝謝委員 現在在很多公費疫苗的施打方面是還沒有把"},{"start":394.429,"end":394.569,"text":"李彥秀"},{"start":414.343,"end":415.323,"text":"接下來我要問幾個問題這是今天中午出來熱騰騰的民調我要請教院長"},{"start":441.168,"end":450.652,"text":"在TVBS今天下午有一份民調出來討論到總統就這個國慶的演說之後的民調有49%的民眾滿意賴總統的演說但是也有41%的民眾不支持國慶的演說賴總統是強調要團結臺灣但是從民調看起來是兩極化院長你認為問題點在哪裡部長你可以請回"},{"start":469.209,"end":482.714,"text":"如果看這樣的民調我現在我最有興趣的需要去看看那21%跟20%到底不滿意的重點在哪裡希望能夠找出來為什麼大家不滿意"},{"start":483.592,"end":486.474,"text":"兩岸關係上的表現只有39%滿意有47%對於賴總統的兩岸關係是不滿意的比在就職演說那天的演說其實又掉了2個百分點"},{"start":513.872,"end":514.032,"text":"二、六共識"},{"start":526.767,"end":545.327,"text":"請問院長,二六共識,你的二六共識,你心目中的二六共識是什麼?二六是馬祖的一個地點。對,我知道,但是你的二六共識內容是什麼?不要九二共識,二六共識尊重…形式上是剛剛那樣講的,那我覺得他講這話的意思是認為說,"},{"start":546.528,"end":553.249,"text":"九二共識,那個我們認為不存在的共識。 那沒關係,那二二共識內容是什麼?沒關係你覺得不存在的,那你的二二共識是什麼?"},{"start":553.249,"end":575.794,"text":"九二共識那個不存在的,即使他認為有共識的人,那也是二三十年之前的問題。 現在兩岸國際有新的局勢跟新的發展,應該要有新的機會,讓新的領導人跟新的兩岸事務的關係能夠來討論。 現在已經是新的領導人跟新的領導人,但是大家對於賴總統兩岸關係是越來越不滿意,所以院長你覺得根本的問題在哪裡?"},{"start":576.892,"end":591.16,"text":"兩岸關係,我想總統一直堅持臺灣的主權跟國家的安全,這一點應該沒有人反對,但是他認為中華民國跟中華人民共和國互不隸屬,這個是有人反對啊?反對的理由倒可能奇怪一點。"},{"start":596.303,"end":613.296,"text":"因為不滿意的人越來越多,從這個數據上,從TVBS,不是我李彥秀的數據,是TVBS數據出來,越來越多人不滿意。就是說,我想要知道就是說,院長你覺得根本的問題在哪裡,那如何解決?羅文嘉提出來的二六共識,你覺得有沒有能力解決這個問題?"},{"start":614.557,"end":625.191,"text":"雖然我手上現在沒有數據,但是我很有把握的請委員多看幾家的民調數據,再來綜合,光看一家難免偏失。好,我尊重。最後一個問題就是賴總統在國慶提到的祖國論,賴總統強調說"},{"start":632.921,"end":659.193,"text":"那天他談的祖國論有57%的民眾支持但是你們非常熟悉的顧寬敏的夫人王美秀女士說她要請問賴總統這個國家的歷史是從什麼時候開始也就是深綠獨派的很多人還是對於賴總統對於國家的歷史是從什麼時候開始是有意見的所以我要請問院長就是說你們如何去處理這個深綠獨派的反彈"},{"start":659.833,"end":684.866,"text":"身為中華民國臺灣的總統,取得就是國家跟人民的最大公約數。難免會有人對他的當時的講話,會有不同的意見。所以不需要去理他?不是不需要去理他,如果能夠取得最大公約數,我們繼續做這樣的論述,那麼去跟其他不同意見或是還沒有接受的國人能夠做更多的說明。比方你剛剛第一題,我就希望我能找出"},{"start":685.964,"end":691.488,"text":"希望接下來無論是你們的二六共識希望下一次在做民調的時候反彈的人可以越來越少,期待有更好的目標、更好的結果。"},{"start":708.24,"end":728.188,"text":"好,院長我接下來還是要回到我的胃環,因為前幾組其實問到很多我們的健保的問題,其實在這段時間各個部會為了裁員的問題其實大家都會有很多的討論,那裁員確實是在這一次預算審查當中的重中之重,這一次我們看到勞保基金在114年編了1400"},{"start":731.189,"end":731.509,"text":"對於老闆基金的撥補﹚"},{"start":757.483,"end":770.738,"text":"其實金額都不算小對不對算多嘛部長點頭嘛對不對這個事情呢聽到在邱部長的耳朵裡面我們的健保今年只撥336億哇"},{"start":774.755,"end":790.022,"text":"一千四百也很多。一千億也很多。 財務健全的那一部分,健保我們還有很多,還有整個加起來是五百多億,甚至再加上公務預算一路等於一百一十幾億。 你讓我講,我會說給你聽。今年你編列336億的預算,要去撥補健保,但是實質的健保的內容,院長你看我後面的表就知道了。"},{"start":802.068,"end":826.506,"text":"三百三十六億當中有一部分一百一十億本來就是政府依法要補足編列百分之三十六政府應該負擔百分之三十六比例的健保經費三百三十六億是這樣子然後有一百一十億是吃健保豆腐然後另外一百三十四億是原來欠健保另外十億是菸捐所以你們現在只是把錢再撥還給菸捐所以我覺得我為什麼是這樣講"},{"start":830.109,"end":830.269,"text":"﹚李彥秀﹚李彥秀﹚"},{"start":846.713,"end":875.908,"text":"我要提到賴總統在今年成立的三大委員會當中他說他要替國家發展擬定戰略和民間的一些對話跟目標這三大委員會也會成為我們世界的解方替國家擬定戰略政策這三大目標當中有一個就是健康台灣所以在我看來健康台灣一手覺得健康台灣在另一隻手就是踐踏我們的健保對很多醫界來說臺電不能倒"},{"start":876.408,"end":878.65,"text":"委員今年的健保費用已經高達九千兩百多億了。九千兩百多億。"},{"start":899.577,"end":899.597,"text":"請問院長,"},{"start":920.111,"end":941.391,"text":"謝謝﹖"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:03:47.277000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:03:48.938000+08:00","text":"謝謝韓院長，我是不是可以請卓院長？","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-10-22T15:03:48.938000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:03:51.019000+08:00","text":"麻煩再請卓院長備詢。","quality":1},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:03:51.019000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:03:56.480250+08:00","text":"順便請邱部長、何部長。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-10-22T15:03:56.480250+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:04:01.941500+08:00","text":"麻煩請衛福部部長備詢。","quality":0},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2024-10-22T15:04:01.941500+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:04:07.402750+08:00","text":"李委員好。","quality":0},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:04:07.402750+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:04:12.864000+08:00","text":"院長，我的問題很多，我先問幾個四大族群關心的議題，就是關於勞健保行政補助費的部分。","quality":0.027},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:04:12.864000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:04:45.241000+08:00","text":"院長，你從民意代表出身，非常知道工會對於我們業務的推動，在職災、在各方面其實都協助我們很多，但是歷經了很多年，包括基本工資跟電價的調整，還有消費者物價指數每一年都在調整、增加，所以我在這邊要跟院長再次爭取，關於行政補助費對於各項工會的補助，未來是不是有機會再調整，甚至連動物價，有機會重新視財務狀況進行檢討？","quality":0.964},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2024-10-22T15:04:47.868000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:04:51.971000+08:00","text":"就我的了解，勞動部有在做這樣的研議，可能在往後的年度……","quality":0.917},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:04:52.732000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:05:08.585000+08:00","text":"我知道是後年，因為我推動了好多年，我知道部長有承諾各工會說是後年，但如果今年財政狀況許可，我們在審預算，或多或少有追加減預算、有預備金，多多少少補助一些，我們可不可以將其放在討論、研議的範圍之內？","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2024-10-22T15:05:08.585000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:05:09.585000+08:00","text":"這又回到……","quality":0},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:05:09.585000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:05:10.585000+08:00","text":"視我們的財務狀況，好不好？院長。","quality":0},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2024-10-22T15:05:10.585000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:05:11.585000+08:00","text":"不只是財務狀況，這要回到審查預算的程序。","quality":0},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:05:11.585000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:05:12.585000+08:00","text":"我們再來討論，好不好？","quality":0},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:05:12.585000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:05:13.585000+08:00","text":"這是我第一個問題。","quality":0},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:05:13.585000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:05:14.585000+08:00","text":"第二個是少子女化的問題，何部長你可以請回了。","quality":0},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:05:12.776000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:05:16.138000+08:00","text":"關於少子女化的問題，每一個孩子都是寶，我們不僅要鼓勵父母多生，生出來的部分、質的部分如何照顧得更好也是重點。","quality":0.673},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:05:37.553000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:05:50.777000+08:00","text":"院長，在此有幾個數據，我們現在嬰兒死亡率創14年來新高，包括新生兒死亡率，今年是15年來的新高，我們就要去探究問題為什麼會如此。","quality":0.87},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:05:50.777000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:06:07.766000+08:00","text":"這當然有不同的問題，包括我們現在女性平均生育年齡是32.44歲，大家晚結婚、孩子生得晚，每3位婦女裡面就有一個第一胎生小孩是超過35歲，也就是高齡產婦。","quality":0.857},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:06:07.766000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:06:40.188000+08:00","text":"每一位高齡產婦其實就會增加早產的風險，所以我要再一次爭取，院長，我不知道你知不知道這個數據，就是早產新生兒前6個月所需的平均花費高達11.4萬，遠高於足月生產（36週至38週）的胎兒，足月生產前6個月的花費大概只需要2.8萬，所以很多有早產兒的婦女，還有早產兒基金會，前一陣子不斷地到立法院來跟各黨派做溝通。","quality":0.878},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:06:40.648000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:07:05.193000+08:00","text":"所以我希望在少子女化整個項目裡面，不只是建幼兒園或者是其他的層面，我希望對於非藥物的早產兒營養品、用品，我們是不是可以討論，將其放在少子女化那整個政策基金裡面，去思考這一塊，去照顧早產兒相關的一些營養品跟用品？院長。","quality":0.919},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2024-10-22T15:07:06.452000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:07:13.236000+08:00","text":"委員的考量、出發點絕對是正確的，實務上現在怎麼來做，包括他的花費以及現在怎麼樣……","quality":0.917},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:07:14.216000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:07:15.277000+08:00","text":"我們這塊到底可不可以做？","quality":0.727},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:07:15.637000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:07:26.102000+08:00","text":"過去這塊從來沒有納入過，但是這一塊我們可不可以放在討論的政策裡面來研議，包括去補助早產兒家庭的定額照護津貼？","quality":0.922},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2024-10-22T15:07:26.102000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:07:27.102000+08:00","text":"我請部長說明。","quality":0},{"speaker":"邱部長泰源","start":"2024-10-22T15:07:27.102000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:07:28.102000+08:00","text":"報告委員，謝謝委員關心早產兒花費等相關的經費，早產兒的照護，的確從醫療上以及他後續的照護，需要很多的資源……","quality":0},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:07:28.102000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:07:29.102000+08:00","text":"對，所以這一塊放進少子女化的整個政策裡面、基金裡面，看看怎麼樣去處理，所以請研議、討論定額的照護津貼，以照顧這些早產兒，好不好？","quality":0},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:07:29.102000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:07:30.102000+08:00","text":"因為很多年輕或高齡的，這些費用真的讓他們吃不消。","quality":0},{"speaker":"邱部長泰源","start":"2024-10-22T15:07:28.622000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:07:29.323000+08:00","text":"有關這一塊，我們會特別來研議。","quality":0.923},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:07:58.666000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:08:03.649000+08:00","text":"那是5倍的差距，即足月兒跟不足月兒前6個月照護經費差了至少5倍以上。","quality":0.586},{"speaker":"邱部長泰源","start":"2024-10-22T15:08:03.649000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:08:07.131000+08:00","text":"是的，好。","quality":0},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:08:07.131000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:08:14.495000+08:00","text":"接下來，早產兒照護中鐵的添加劑，現在全球是缺貨的，這個問題什麼時候可以解決？","quality":0.765},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:08:15.435000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:08:23.340000+08:00","text":"院長可能不知道，但部長你要知道，早產兒的母乳添加劑現在是全球缺貨，所以現在缺貨的問題，什麼時候可以給答案？","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:08:24.899000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:08:32.085000+08:00","text":"早產兒需要母乳添加劑，但現在這個部分基於國際因素缺貨，所以怎麼樣去調度呢？","quality":0.765},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:08:32.926000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:08:34.908000+08:00","text":"因為現在是缺貨的狀況，所以我提醒你，請帶回去，因為……","quality":0.636},{"speaker":"邱部長泰源","start":"2024-10-22T15:08:35.408000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:08:43.175000+08:00","text":"我們馬上來了解國內的狀況，其實我們在缺藥相關的平臺上，它的功能非常的好，如果有任何的反映……","quality":0.659},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:08:44.936000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:08:45.516000+08:00","text":"現在還是沒有！","quality":1},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:08:45.797000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:08:52.022000+08:00","text":"所以我先告訴你，現在是沒有的，請趕快去調度處理，3天之後告訴我調度的狀況，包括怎麼去處理。好。","quality":0.85},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:08:52.402000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:08:58.927000+08:00","text":"最後一個問題，院長，我長期都有在關注，院長，你周遭朋友中，一定很多人得過皮蛇（帶狀疱疹）。","quality":0.784},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:08:58.927000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:09:10.617000+08:00","text":"上會期我已經問過了，但是沒有給我具體的答案，就這件事情，我知道財政的狀況有限，但是這涉及很多高風險族群，包括三高族群，因此，我們視財務經費狀況來做補助，這部分我一直在爭取。","quality":0.675},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:09:10.617000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:09:26.537500+08:00","text":"現在有一些縣市對於有可能得帶狀疱疹的高危險群有一些補助，有一些縣市因為財務狀況不好並沒有做，所以我一直希望中央帶頭來補助、來做這件事情，至於是不是包括三高或者是低收入戶，或者是三高又是低收入戶，我們再來做考量，而且我們可以分階段來做，但是如果政府在第一時間釋出一些善意，至少照顧到經濟上有困難但是又是高危險群，換言之，如果經費許可，我們可以來試試看，但是如果連到底什麼樣的狀況、需要多少經費，你們連那個表都沒有做出來，我們怎麼去做進一步的討論、評估？","quality":0},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:09:26.537500+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:09:42.458000+08:00","text":"所以院長，我們可不可以趕快做這件事情？","quality":0},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2024-10-22T15:09:42.458000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:09:43.999000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝委員，現在在很多公費疫苗的施打方面，是還沒有把帶狀疱疹納入公費疫苗……","quality":0.676},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:09:43.999000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:09:48.370556+08:00","text":"是，這個我已經問第二次了，你很清楚。","quality":0},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2024-10-22T15:09:48.370556+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:09:52.742111+08:00","text":"因為它的每一劑費用確實是高，但是一般隨著年齡的增加……","quality":0},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:09:52.742111+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:09:57.113667+08:00","text":"我沒有說要補助所有的人，所以我才說低收入戶跟三高，我們來評估看看需要多少錢，再來看怎麼做，但如果你們連評估都沒有評估過，我怎麼跟你討論。","quality":0},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2024-10-22T15:09:57.113667+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:10:01.485222+08:00","text":"好，請衛福部來……","quality":0},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:10:01.485222+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:10:05.856778+08:00","text":"謝謝，部長你請回。","quality":0},{"speaker":"邱部長泰源","start":"2024-10-22T15:10:05.856778+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:10:10.228333+08:00","text":"報告委員，我們會視疫苗的基金財源跟逐年疾病的負擔，國內是不是……","quality":0},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:10:10.228333+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:10:14.599889+08:00","text":"那你要評估出來，你那個表都沒送給我！","quality":0},{"speaker":"邱部長泰源","start":"2024-10-22T15:10:14.599889+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:10:18.971444+08:00","text":"好，我們會再提報ACIP來……","quality":0},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:10:18.971444+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:10:23.343000+08:00","text":"好，我今天時間有限，請把表送給我，我會在預算審查的主決議提案中寫得很清楚，不然我就會做處理喔，我先提醒部長。好的。","quality":0},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:10:23.343000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:10:24.323000+08:00","text":"接下來我要問幾個問題，這是今天中午出來熱騰騰的民調，我要請教院長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:10:50.288000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:10:59.332000+08:00","text":"TVBS今天下午有一份民調出來，是總統國慶演說之後的民調，有將近49%的民眾滿意賴總統的演說，但是也有41%的民眾不支持，國慶演說中賴總統強調要團結臺灣，但是從民調看起來是兩極化，院長，你認為問題點在哪裡？","quality":0.956},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:10:59.332000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:10:59.632000+08:00","text":"部長，你可以請回。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-10-22T15:10:59.632000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:11:18.209000+08:00","text":"邱部長請回。","quality":0},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2024-10-22T15:11:18.209000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:11:31.694000+08:00","text":"如果看這樣的民調，我現在最有興趣的是想要去看看那21%跟20%到底不滿意的重點在哪裡，希望能夠找出來為什麼大家不滿意。","quality":0.962},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:11:31.694000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:11:32.694000+08:00","text":"那如何去團結臺灣？","quality":0},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:11:32.694000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:11:33.694000+08:00","text":"因為這個照理說是要團結臺灣，但看起來是兩極化。","quality":0},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2024-10-22T15:11:33.694000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:11:34.694000+08:00","text":"找出原因之後，想辦法，就有辦法來團結臺灣啊。","quality":0},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:11:34.694000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:11:35.694000+08:00","text":"好，希望院長可以找得到辦法，因為我今天問題很多，就不著重在這邊。","quality":0},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:11:32.592000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:11:35.474000+08:00","text":"另外，在兩岸關係上的表現，只有39%滿意，有47%對於賴總統的兩岸關係是不滿意的，比照就職演說那天的民調又掉了2個百分點，也就是說，有越來越多的群眾對於賴總統處理兩岸關係是不滿意的，這是第一個問題。","quality":0.523},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:12:02.872000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:12:21.533000+08:00","text":"第二個問題，我聽到羅文嘉副董事長說要跟對岸談26共識，請問院長，你心目中的26共識是什麼？26共識……","quality":0.436},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2024-10-22T15:12:22.073000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:12:25.177000+08:00","text":"26是馬祖的一個地點……","quality":1},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:12:25.177000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:12:28.761000+08:00","text":"對，我知道，但是你的26共識的內容是什麼？","quality":0.938},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:12:28.761000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:12:30.443000+08:00","text":"因為你們不要92共識，要26共識，我尊重，但……","quality":0.533},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2024-10-22T15:12:30.583000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:12:38.889000+08:00","text":"形式上是剛剛那樣講的，我覺得他講這個話的意思是認為，92共識，那個我們認為不存在的共識是……","quality":0.949},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:12:38.989000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:12:40.729000+08:00","text":"沒關係，那26共識的內容是什麼？","quality":0.917},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:12:40.729000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:12:42.249000+08:00","text":"沒關係，你覺得不存在，那你的26共識是什麼？","quality":1},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2024-10-22T15:12:42.289000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:12:56.692000+08:00","text":"92共識那個是不存在的，即使是認為有共識的人，那也是二十、三十年之前的問題，現在兩岸、國際有新的局勢跟新的發展，應該要有新的機會，讓新的領導人跟新的兩岸事務的關係能夠來討論雙方的……","quality":0.925},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:12:56.692000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:13:04.794000+08:00","text":"現在已經是新的領導，賴總統是新的領導人，但是大家對賴總統的兩岸關係是越來越不滿意，所以院長，你認為根本的問題在哪裡？","quality":0.868},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2024-10-22T15:13:05.892000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:13:16.998000+08:00","text":"兩岸關係，我想總統一直堅持臺灣的主權跟國家的安全，這一點應該沒有人反對，但是他認為中華民國跟中華人民共和國互不隸屬，這個是有人反對啊……","quality":1},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:13:16.998000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:13:17.998000+08:00","text":"沒關係……","quality":0},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2024-10-22T15:13:17.679000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:13:20.060000+08:00","text":"反對的理由倒是很奇怪的……","quality":0.727},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:13:25.303000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:13:37.573000+08:00","text":"賴總統對於兩岸的論述有人支持有人反對，所以我的問題是說，因為不滿意的人越來越多，從這個數據來看，這是TVBS的民調數據，不是我李彥秀的數據，是從TVBS的數據顯示出來有越來越多人不滿意，我想要知道，院長，你覺得根本的問題在哪裡？","quality":0.615},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:13:37.733000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:13:39.014000+08:00","text":"如何解決？","quality":1},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:13:39.014000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:13:42.296000+08:00","text":"羅文嘉提出來的26共識，你覺得有沒有能力解決這個問題？","quality":1},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2024-10-22T15:13:43.557000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:13:52.349000+08:00","text":"雖然我手上現在沒有數據，但是我很有把握地請委員多看幾家的民調數據，再來綜合，光看一家難免偏失。","quality":0.977},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:13:52.489000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:13:52.970000+08:00","text":"好，我尊重。","quality":1},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:13:53.030000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:14:28.193000+08:00","text":"最後一個問題就是賴總統在國慶提到的祖國論，賴清德總統強調說……那天他談的祖國論有57%的民眾支持，但是你們非常熟悉的辜寬敏夫人──王美琇女士說，他要請問賴總統這個國家的歷史是從什麼時候開始，也就是深綠、獨派有很多人還是對於賴總統對國家歷史是從什麼時候開始是有意見的，所以我要請問院長，你們如何處理深綠、獨派的反彈？","quality":0.944},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2024-10-22T15:14:28.833000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:14:38.798000+08:00","text":"身為中華民國臺灣的總統，取的就是國家跟人民的最大公約數，難免會有人對他當時的講話有不同的意見，但是總統……","quality":0.896},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:14:38.798000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:14:39.558000+08:00","text":"所以不需要去理它？","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2024-10-22T15:14:40.199000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:14:40.739000+08:00","text":"不是不要去理它……","quality":0.857},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:14:40.739000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:14:41.739000+08:00","text":"把它當塑膠，繼續往前走？","quality":0},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2024-10-22T15:14:41.399000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:14:53.846000+08:00","text":"如果能夠取得最大公約數，我們繼續做這樣的論述，跟其他不同意見或者還沒有接受的國人去做更多的說明，比方你剛剛的第一題，我就希望我能找出不同意的人，我也希望未來我們有能力找出兩邊各有意見的人，把這個最大公約數能夠越集越大，這樣就是國家臺灣的團結。","quality":0.522},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:14:54.964000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:15:00.468000+08:00","text":"好，希望接下來無論是你們的26共識，希望下一次在做民調的時候，反彈的人可以越來越少，期待有更好的目標，有更好的結果……","quality":0.96},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2024-10-22T15:15:00.468000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:15:17.540000+08:00","text":"謝謝，我們也有這樣的期待。","quality":0},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:15:17.540000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:15:19.961000+08:00","text":"院長，我接下來還是要回到衛環這個主題。","quality":0.706},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:15:20.181000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:15:34.787000+08:00","text":"前幾組其實問到很多我們健保的問題，其實在這段時間，各部會為了財源的問題，大家都有很多的討論，財源確實是這一次預算審查當中的重中之重。","quality":0.934},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:15:34.787000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:15:40.329000+08:00","text":"這一次我們看到勞保基金在114年編了1,300億，雖然勞保撥補何部長說這是改革，但是對你來說，它也不見得是，反正撥補就是撥補，總而言之，勞保基金我們撥了1,300億；另外，在台電的部分，我們今年編了1,000億，明年又要給1,000億，所以就是持續地送上大紅包。","quality":0.16},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:15:40.329000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:16:09.066000+08:00","text":"這兩個政策，無論是對台電的撥補，還是對勞保基金的撥補，其實金額都不算小，對不對？","quality":0.457},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:16:09.066000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:16:09.507000+08:00","text":"算多嘛？是。","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:16:10.748000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:16:12.530000+08:00","text":"院長點頭嘛，對不對？","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:16:12.530000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:16:26.796000+08:00","text":"這個事情聽在邱部長的耳朵裡面，我們的健保今年只撥336億，哇，1,400億很多呢，1,000億也很多……","quality":0.886},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2024-10-22T15:16:27.377000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:16:35.641000+08:00","text":"那是健保財務健全的那一部分，健保我們還有很多，整個加起來是五百多億，甚至再加上公務預算移入的117億，這個數字更大，336……","quality":0.74},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:16:35.641000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:16:35.841000+08:00","text":"院長，院長，我……你讓我講完，我會說給你聽。","quality":0.625},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2024-10-22T15:16:35.841000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:16:36.841000+08:00","text":"336是健全財務的部分。","quality":0},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:16:35.841000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:17:14.726000+08:00","text":"你今年編列了336億的預算要去撥補健保，但是實質的健保的內容，院長，你看我後面的表就知道了，336億當中有一部分110億，本來就是政府依法要補足編列百分之三十六，政府應該負擔百分之三十六比例的健保經費，336億是這樣子，然後有110億是吃健保豆腐，然後另外134億是原來欠健保，另外10億是菸捐，所以你們現在只是把錢再撥還給菸捐。","quality":0.985},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:17:14.726000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:17:35.713000+08:00","text":"我為什麼這樣講，因為看到台電可以撥補1,000億，看到勞保可以撥補1,300億，在健保的部分，在很多醫界人士的眼中，大家就會覺得說，台電不能倒，那難道健保就能倒嗎？","quality":0.106},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:17:35.713000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:17:43.637000+08:00","text":"另外我還要提到，賴總統在今年宣布成立三大委員會，他說他要替國家發展擬定戰略，與民間力量展開對話，讓臺灣的策略成為世界的解方。","quality":0.596},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:17:44.698000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:17:54.783000+08:00","text":"這三大委員會當中有一個就是「健康台灣」。","quality":0.941},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:17:54.783000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:18:01.306000+08:00","text":"所以在我看來，民進黨一手舉著「健康台灣」，但另外一隻手就在踐踏我們的健保。","quality":0.656},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:18:01.306000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:18:05.408000+08:00","text":"對於很多醫界人士來說，台電不能倒，但是健保就是要持續吃我們的豆腐，那特別是，我最後1分鐘……","quality":0.282},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2024-10-22T15:18:05.408000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:18:07.350000+08:00","text":"委員，今年的健保費用已經高達九千兩百多億了……","quality":1},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:18:07.350000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:18:08.350000+08:00","text":"但今年只提撥336億……","quality":0},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2024-10-22T15:18:07.410000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-10-22T15:18:07.650000+08:00","text":"九千兩百多億。","quality":1},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:18:08.150000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:18:21.292857+08:00","text":"你今年就是336億，所以賴總統說今年不要再談點值，要看價值，但是在我看來，賴總統的價值就是持續叫醫界做功德。","quality":0},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:18:21.592857+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:18:30.164286+08:00","text":"就是持續叫醫界做功德，叫護理人員做功德，在我眼睛看起來就是這樣子。","quality":0},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:18:30.464286+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:18:41.035714+08:00","text":"包括之前有撥補240億，當時賴清德還沒選之前撥補了240億，從健保的準備金直接撥到健保基金。","quality":0},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:18:41.335714+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:18:55.907143+08:00","text":"所以我要請問院長，今年有200億放在安全基金裡面，有沒有可能我們真正的撥補去處理點值的部分，真正的去改善健保的環境？","quality":0.078},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2024-10-22T15:18:56.207143+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:19:01.921429+08:00","text":"委員的推論嚴重的錯誤，我們會給你正確的數字……","quality":0},{"speaker":"李委員彥秀","start":"2024-10-22T15:19:02.221429+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:19:06.221429+08:00","text":"我沒有錯誤，我數字觀念很清楚的。","quality":0},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2024-10-22T15:19:06.521429+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:19:11.092857+08:00","text":"我們給你正確的數字，再向您報告，謝謝。","quality":0.125},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-10-22T15:19:11.392857+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:19:18.535714+08:00","text":"謝謝李彥秀委員的質詢，謝謝卓院長跟相關部會首長的備詢。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-10-22T15:19:18.835714+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:19:29.407143+08:00","text":"接下來登記第8號洪申翰委員之質詢以書面提出，請行政院書面答復並列入紀錄，刊登公報。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-10-22T15:19:29.707143+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-10-22T15:19:34.278571+08:00","text":"再接下來登記第9號，請王世堅委員質詢。","quality":0}]},"gazette":{"lineno":171,"blocks":[["李委員彥秀：（15時3分）謝謝韓院長，我是不是可以請卓院長？"],["主席：麻煩再請卓院長備詢。"],["李委員彥秀：順便請邱部長、何部長。"],["主席：麻煩請衛福部部長備詢。"],["卓院長榮泰：李委員好。"],["李委員彥秀：院長，我的問題很多，我先問幾個四大族群關心的議題，就是關於勞健保行政補助費的部分。院長，你從民意代表出身，非常知道工會對於我們業務的推動，在職災、在各方面其實都協助我們很多，但是歷經了很多年，包括基本工資跟電價的調整，還有消費者物價指數每一年都在調整、增加，所以我在這邊要跟院長再次爭取，關於行政補助費對於各項工會的補助，未來是不是有機會再調整，甚至連動物價，有機會重新視財務狀況進行檢討？"],["卓院長榮泰：就我的了解，勞動部有在做這樣的研議，可能在往後的年度……"],["李委員彥秀：我知道是後年，因為我推動了好多年，我知道部長有承諾各工會說是後年，但如果今年財政狀況許可，我們在審預算，或多或少有追加減預算、有預備金，多多少少補助一些，我們可不可以將其放在討論、研議的範圍之內？"],["卓院長榮泰：這又回到……"],["李委員彥秀：視我們的財務狀況，好不好？院長。"],["卓院長榮泰：不只是財務狀況，這要回到審查預算的程序。"],["李委員彥秀：我們再來討論，好不好？這是我第一個問題。","第二個是少子女化的問題，何部長你可以請回了。關於少子女化的問題，每一個孩子都是寶，我們不僅要鼓勵父母多生，生出來的部分、質的部分如何照顧得更好也是重點。院長，在此有幾個數據，我們現在嬰兒死亡率創14年來新高，包括新生兒死亡率，今年是15年來的新高，我們就要去探究問題為什麼會如此。這當然有不同的問題，包括我們現在女性平均生育年齡是32.44歲，大家晚結婚、孩子生得晚，每3位婦女裡面就有一個第一胎生小孩是超過35歲，也就是高齡產婦。每一位高齡產婦其實就會增加早產的風險，所以我要再一次爭取，院長，我不知道你知不知道這個數據，就是早產新生兒前6個月所需的平均花費高達11.4萬，遠高於足月生產（36週至38週）的胎兒，足月生產前6個月的花費大概只需要2.8萬，所以很多有早產兒的婦女，還有早產兒基金會，前一陣子不斷地到立法院來跟各黨派做溝通。所以我希望在少子女化整個項目裡面，不只是建幼兒園或者是其他的層面，我希望對於非藥物的早產兒營養品、用品，我們是不是可以討論，將其放在少子女化那整個政策基金裡面，去思考這一塊，去照顧早產兒相關的一些營養品跟用品？院長。"],["卓院長榮泰：委員的考量、出發點絕對是正確的，實務上現在怎麼來做，包括他的花費以及現在怎麼樣……"],["李委員彥秀：我們這塊到底可不可以做？過去這塊從來沒有納入過，但是這一塊我們可不可以放在討論的政策裡面來研議，包括去補助早產兒家庭的定額照護津貼？"],["卓院長榮泰：我請部長說明。"],["邱部長泰源：報告委員，謝謝委員關心早產兒花費等相關的經費，早產兒的照護，的確從醫療上以及他後續的照護，需要很多的資源……"],["李委員彥秀：對，所以這一塊放進少子女化的整個政策裡面、基金裡面，看看怎麼樣去處理，所以請研議、討論定額的照護津貼，以照顧這些早產兒，好不好？因為很多年輕或高齡的，這些費用真的讓他們吃不消。"],["邱部長泰源：有關這一塊，我們會特別來研議。"],["李委員彥秀：那是5倍的差距，即足月兒跟不足月兒前6個月照護經費差了至少5倍以上。"],["邱部長泰源：是的，好。"],["李委員彥秀：接下來，早產兒照護中鐵的添加劑，現在全球是缺貨的，這個問題什麼時候可以解決？院長可能不知道，但部長你要知道，早產兒的母乳添加劑現在是全球缺貨，所以現在缺貨的問題，什麼時候可以給答案？早產兒需要母乳添加劑，但現在這個部分基於國際因素缺貨，所以怎麼樣去調度呢？因為現在是缺貨的狀況，所以我提醒你，請帶回去，因為……"],["邱部長泰源：我們馬上來了解國內的狀況，其實我們在缺藥相關的平臺上，它的功能非常的好，如果有任何的反映……"],["李委員彥秀：現在還是沒有！所以我先告訴你，現在是沒有的，請趕快去調度處理，3天之後告訴我調度的狀況，包括怎麼去處理。"],["邱部長泰源：好。"],["李委員彥秀：最後一個問題，院長，我長期都有在關注，院長，你周遭朋友中，一定很多人得過皮蛇（帶狀疱疹）。上會期我已經問過了，但是沒有給我具體的答案，就這件事情，我知道財政的狀況有限，但是這涉及很多高風險族群，包括三高族群，因此，我們視財務經費狀況來做補助，這部分我一直在爭取。現在有一些縣市對於有可能得帶狀疱疹的高危險群有一些補助，有一些縣市因為財務狀況不好並沒有做，所以我一直希望中央帶頭來補助、來做這件事情，至於是不是包括三高或者是低收入戶，或者是三高又是低收入戶，我們再來做考量，而且我們可以分階段來做，但是如果政府在第一時間釋出一些善意，至少照顧到經濟上有困難但是又是高危險群，換言之，如果經費許可，我們可以來試試看，但是如果連到底什麼樣的狀況、需要多少經費，你們連那個表都沒有做出來，我們怎麼去做進一步的討論、評估？所以院長，我們可不可以趕快做這件事情？"],["卓院長榮泰：好，謝謝委員，現在在很多公費疫苗的施打方面，是還沒有把帶狀疱疹納入公費疫苗……"],["李委員彥秀：是，這個我已經問第二次了，你很清楚。"],["卓院長榮泰：因為它的每一劑費用確實是高，但是一般隨著年齡的增加……"],["李委員彥秀：我沒有說要補助所有的人，所以我才說低收入戶跟三高，我們來評估看看需要多少錢，再來看怎麼做，但如果你們連評估都沒有評估過，我怎麼跟你討論。"],["卓院長榮泰：好，請衛福部來……"],["李委員彥秀：謝謝，部長你請回。"],["邱部長泰源：報告委員，我們會視疫苗的基金財源跟逐年疾病的負擔，國內是不是……"],["李委員彥秀：那你要評估出來，你那個表都沒送給我！"],["邱部長泰源：好，我們會再提報ACIP來……"],["李委員彥秀：好，我今天時間有限，請把表送給我，我會在預算審查的主決議提案中寫得很清楚，不然我就會做處理喔，我先提醒部長。"],["邱部長泰源：好的。"],["李委員彥秀：接下來我要問幾個問題，這是今天中午出來熱騰騰的民調，我要請教院長。TVBS今天下午有一份民調出來，是總統國慶演說之後的民調，有將近49%的民眾滿意賴總統的演說，但是也有41%的民眾不支持，國慶演說中賴總統強調要團結臺灣，但是從民調看起來是兩極化，院長，你認為問題點在哪裡？","部長，你可以請回。"],["主席：邱部長請回。"],["卓院長榮泰：如果看這樣的民調，我現在最有興趣的是想要去看看那21%跟20%到底不滿意的重點在哪裡，希望能夠找出來為什麼大家不滿意。"],["李委員彥秀：那如何去團結臺灣？因為這個照理說是要團結臺灣，但看起來是兩極化。"],["卓院長榮泰：找出原因之後，想辦法，就有辦法來團結臺灣啊。"],["李委員彥秀：好，希望院長可以找得到辦法，因為我今天問題很多，就不著重在這邊。","另外，在兩岸關係上的表現，只有39%滿意，有47%對於賴總統的兩岸關係是不滿意的，比照就職演說那天的民調又掉了2個百分點，也就是說，有越來越多的群眾對於賴總統處理兩岸關係是不滿意的，這是第一個問題。","第二個問題，我聽到羅文嘉副董事長說要跟對岸談26共識，請問院長，你心目中的26共識是什麼？26共識……"],["卓院長榮泰：26是馬祖的一個地點……"],["李委員彥秀：對，我知道，但是你的26共識的內容是什麼？因為你們不要92共識，要26共識，我尊重，但……"],["卓院長榮泰：形式上是剛剛那樣講的，我覺得他講這個話的意思是認為，92共識，那個我們認為不存在的共識是……"],["李委員彥秀：沒關係，那26共識的內容是什麼？沒關係，你覺得不存在，那你的26共識是什麼？"],["卓院長榮泰：92共識那個是不存在的，即使是認為有共識的人，那也是二十、三十年之前的問題，現在兩岸、國際有新的局勢跟新的發展，應該要有新的機會，讓新的領導人跟新的兩岸事務的關係能夠來討論雙方的……"],["李委員彥秀：現在已經是新的領導，賴總統是新的領導人，但是大家對賴總統的兩岸關係是越來越不滿意，所以院長，你認為根本的問題在哪裡？"],["卓院長榮泰：兩岸關係，我想總統一直堅持臺灣的主權跟國家的安全，這一點應該沒有人反對，但是他認為中華民國跟中華人民共和國互不隸屬，這個是有人反對啊……"],["李委員彥秀：沒關係……"],["卓院長榮泰：反對的理由倒是很奇怪的……"],["李委員彥秀：賴總統對於兩岸的論述有人支持有人反對，所以我的問題是說，因為不滿意的人越來越多，從這個數據來看，這是TVBS的民調數據，不是我李彥秀的數據，是從TVBS的數據顯示出來有越來越多人不滿意，我想要知道，院長，你覺得根本的問題在哪裡？如何解決？羅文嘉提出來的26共識，你覺得有沒有能力解決這個問題？"],["卓院長榮泰：雖然我手上現在沒有數據，但是我很有把握地請委員多看幾家的民調數據，再來綜合，光看一家難免偏失。"],["李委員彥秀：好，我尊重。","最後一個問題就是賴總統在國慶提到的祖國論，賴清德總統強調說……那天他談的祖國論有57%的民眾支持，但是你們非常熟悉的辜寬敏夫人──王美琇女士說，他要請問賴總統這個國家的歷史是從什麼時候開始，也就是深綠、獨派有很多人還是對於賴總統對國家歷史是從什麼時候開始是有意見的，所以我要請問院長，你們如何處理深綠、獨派的反彈？"],["卓院長榮泰：身為中華民國臺灣的總統，取的就是國家跟人民的最大公約數，難免會有人對他當時的講話有不同的意見，但是總統……"],["李委員彥秀：所以不需要去理它？"],["卓院長榮泰：不是不要去理它……"],["李委員彥秀：把它當塑膠，繼續往前走？"],["卓院長榮泰：如果能夠取得最大公約數，我們繼續做這樣的論述，跟其他不同意見或者還沒有接受的國人去做更多的說明，比方你剛剛的第一題，我就希望我能找出不同意的人，我也希望未來我們有能力找出兩邊各有意見的人，把這個最大公約數能夠越集越大，這樣就是國家臺灣的團結。"],["李委員彥秀：好，希望接下來無論是你們的26共識，希望下一次在做民調的時候，反彈的人可以越來越少，期待有更好的目標，有更好的結果……"],["卓院長榮泰：謝謝，我們也有這樣的期待。"],["李委員彥秀：院長，我接下來還是要回到衛環這個主題。前幾組其實問到很多我們健保的問題，其實在這段時間，各部會為了財源的問題，大家都有很多的討論，財源確實是這一次預算審查當中的重中之重。這一次我們看到勞保基金在114年編了1,300億，雖然勞保撥補何部長說這是改革，但是對你來說，它也不見得是，反正撥補就是撥補，總而言之，勞保基金我們撥了1,300億；另外，在台電的部分，我們今年編了1,000億，明年又要給1,000億，所以就是持續地送上大紅包。這兩個政策，無論是對台電的撥補，還是對勞保基金的撥補，其實金額都不算小，對不對？算多嘛？"],["卓院長榮泰：是。"],["李委員彥秀：院長點頭嘛，對不對？這個事情聽在邱部長的耳朵裡面，我們的健保今年只撥336億，哇，1,400億很多呢，1,000億也很多……"],["卓院長榮泰：那是健保財務健全的那一部分，健保我們還有很多，整個加起來是五百多億，甚至再加上公務預算移入的117億，這個數字更大，336……"],["李委員彥秀：院長，院長，我……你讓我講完，我會說給你聽。"],["卓院長榮泰：336是健全財務的部分。"],["李委員彥秀：你今年編列了336億的預算要去撥補健保，但是實質的健保的內容，院長，你看我後面的表就知道了，336億當中有一部分110億，本來就是政府依法要補足編列百分之三十六，政府應該負擔百分之三十六比例的健保經費，336億是這樣子，然後有110億是吃健保豆腐，然後另外134億是原來欠健保，另外10億是菸捐，所以你們現在只是把錢再撥還給菸捐。我為什麼這樣講，因為看到台電可以撥補1,000億，看到勞保可以撥補1,300億，在健保的部分，在很多醫界人士的眼中，大家就會覺得說，台電不能倒，那難道健保就能倒嗎？","另外我還要提到，賴總統在今年宣布成立三大委員會，他說他要替國家發展擬定戰略，與民間力量展開對話，讓臺灣的策略成為世界的解方。這三大委員會當中有一個就是「健康台灣」。所以在我看來，民進黨一手舉著「健康台灣」，但另外一隻手就在踐踏我們的健保。對於很多醫界人士來說，台電不能倒，但是健保就是要持續吃我們的豆腐，那特別是，我最後1分鐘……"],["卓院長榮泰：委員，今年的健保費用已經高達九千兩百多億了……"],["李委員彥秀：但今年只提撥336億……"],["卓院長榮泰：九千兩百多億。"],["李委員彥秀：你今年就是336億，所以賴總統說今年不要再談點值，要看價值，但是在我看來，賴總統的價值就是持續叫醫界做功德。就是持續叫醫界做功德，叫護理人員做功德，在我眼睛看起來就是這樣子。包括之前有撥補240億，當時賴清德還沒選之前撥補了240億，從健保的準備金直接撥到健保基金。所以我要請問院長，今年有200億放在安全基金裡面，有沒有可能我們真正的撥補去處理點值的部分，真正的去改善健保的環境？"],["卓院長榮泰：委員的推論嚴重的錯誤，我們會給你正確的數字……"],["李委員彥秀：我沒有錯誤，我數字觀念很清楚的。"],["卓院長榮泰：我們給你正確的數字，再向您報告，謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝李彥秀委員的質詢，謝謝卓院長跟相關部會首長的備詢。","接下來登記第8號洪申翰委員之質詢以書面提出，請行政院書面答復並列入紀錄，刊登公報。","再接下來登記第9號，請王世堅委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":195,"meet_id":"院會-11-2-5","speakers":["韓國瑜","江啟臣","賴瑞隆","陳亭妃","陳俊宇","黃捷","李坤城","邱志偉","魯明哲","林沛祥","黃珊珊","陳昭姿","林憶君","羅廷瑋","范雲","李彥秀","王世堅","盧縣一","邱若華","葉元之","何欣純","徐欣瑩","羅美玲","劉建國"],"page_start":109,"meetingDate":["2024-10-22"],"gazette_id":"1138101","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1138101_00004","1138101_00005"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第2會期第5次會議紀錄","content":"施政質詢\n對行政院院長施政報告繼續質詢─ 詢答完畢─","agenda_id":"1138101_00009"}}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}