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是真的還是假的?"},{"start":100.885,"end":126.532,"text":"我們並沒有要求臨書去下架這些真實的粉專對嘛那這個是不是假的是不是AI深偽的這個是不是有人假造刑事局的身份去提出法律要求有沒有可能據我們了解是臨書他們內部在一個篩選機制上沒有我說這個通知他說是來自刑事局嘛"},{"start":127.674,"end":133.84,"text":"那你們又說沒有嘛對不對那有沒有要調查如果有人偽造嚴不嚴重"},{"start":134.802,"end":138.443,"text":"那這是被錯下架的粉專說他們收到通知是警政署這裡的資訊嗎那這是不是有人偽造還是是真的這到底是真的還是假的"},{"start":162.672,"end":177.331,"text":"跟委員報告,就我們的瞭解是臉書它內部的篩選機制它有不同部門,他們有認知他們現在就說是Criminal這個,這個刑事局嘛那你們如果不背鍋要不要調查啊"},{"start":178.363,"end":200.051,"text":"這我們會再跟他反請他更正因為他們是內部的不同方面聯繫到底是不是警政署你現在說不出來嘛是不是有人偽造你也答不出來嘛那市長在臉書上面PO了底下也有人留言市長也按讚了那通報這邊有沒有通報警政署去了解有沒有你只要說有還是沒有速發部有沒有橫向通報"},{"start":201.57,"end":215.951,"text":"有還是沒有?國會殿堂請說有或沒有?是跟委員報告這因為不是我月館所以這個細節我我並不了解那可以調查一下嗎?我們待會會有具體要求再來那我想問一下速發部"},{"start":217.373,"end":241.588,"text":"蘇巴部有沒有收集網紅白名單?有還是沒有?跟委員報告,因為有一些網紅他們就一直跟我們澄清說他們希望進入白名單但是沒有收集是他們主動要求我們做這件事情你確定齁?好,OK那你沒有收集那這封信是不是假的?是不是有人偽造你們提出收集?"},{"start":244.158,"end":265.27,"text":"這不是你們嘛對不對這個我要去確認一下你沒辦法確認你剛剛又說沒有好沒關係我們今天就了解真相這是不是你們這是不是錯假訊息這不是AI深偽我們是數位發展部反詐騙工作小組這是網紅提出的喔截圖喔是還是不是"},{"start":270.765,"end":284.87,"text":"報告委員我們在國會殿堂因為我沒有看過這封信事情在禮拜五的深夜已經發生您週末也發文然後呢說同仁很辛苦都是Meta的錯都其他單位的錯那訴發部有沒有責任"},{"start":288.651,"end":315.624,"text":"我們當然有責任我們事實上我們不推諉責任我們馬上加班去把這個事情給處理了說事發原因你們有沒有責任嘛沒關係那所以你們沒有收集白名單那我們之後再來瞭解啦我們非常有疑義說那你收集的目的是什麼如果你已經收集了又沒有辦法保護他們那到底目的是什麼你要收集各支嗎系統誤判、錯假下架、速發部有沒有責"},{"start":316.738,"end":334.873,"text":"有沒有責?如果發生錯假下架的話當然有責如果是責任在我們身上當然是有責如果已經是我們造成的當然是我們沒有責任所以責任不在你們身上你們就沒有責所以如果不是你們造成的你就沒有責任嘛對不對?好很好"},{"start":335.794,"end":352.246,"text":"你們數位產業發展部平台經濟的業務就在你們的下轄的業務範圍之下是臉書是不是平台經濟是你們數發部有沒有付有沒有一些單位政府有沒有單位付他廣告費我們有這麼多的預算做網路行銷我們是不是都把它全部砍掉"},{"start":358.752,"end":382.503,"text":"再來,打詐專法通過了以後,詐欺有關的廣告業者的平台是不是在你們下轄之下,你們有沒有責任?這方面當然有責任啊!對嘛!所以他就算只是他犯的錯,處發部也有責任嘛!這寫得清清楚楚的啊!那您剛剛是不是現在打臉剛剛的你自己?就算是吧!"},{"start":385.171,"end":410.851,"text":"好 這個態度我們都錄下來沒有關係大家事實公平是速發部這是您的美照謝謝你們要宣傳打詐的時候找平台業者來然後呢發生問題了說是平台業者的錯速發部沒有責任沒有關係我們不要去講這些有的沒的我們就只問一件事11月15號深夜從7點開始"},{"start":414.758,"end":417.34,"text":"大批網紅粉專下架什麼時候恢復的?次長知道嗎?"},{"start":426.454,"end":445.325,"text":"請問同仁報告委員大概12點陸陸續續然後12點13分的時候這個Meta有傳訊息給我已經陸陸續續已經恢復了然後我這邊會陸續有去監控我這邊有那裡的訊息也可以提供委員來看謝謝非常好非常精準的回答那速發部什麼時候發布的回應"},{"start":448.688,"end":469.14,"text":"蘇發部什麼時候發布的回應?關於粉專已經恢復了,除了這個大問題,請民眾不要恐慌我們蘇發部已經在努力了,你們什麼時候公開對這件事情發表回應的?什麼時候?這個我要回去查一下,因為當初不是我自己回應的,所以可能要請同仁說明一下"},{"start":470.771,"end":498.882,"text":"什麼時候來報告委員其實就像我覺得很多事情就像火災一樣發生的事情要趕快先處理善後所以目前來講其實一直以來我就一直在連續所有的粉專直到所有的粉專能夠確定恢復之後然後我們才來做適當的因應所以也因為這樣子到隔天的時候我們就有通報次長然後報告次長說這個到底目前現在情況怎樣所以次長也在演說適當的人跟大家講然後所以才會有剛剛委員看的那一封信說請大家安心如果你還有什麼問題的話"},{"start":499.742,"end":525.088,"text":"當然我也知道委員也很關心我也持續關注委員的一些臉書也做一個所以我們一起來努力把這個整個事情發生當然就是我們要救災 把它處理好以上謝謝 謝謝委員首先速發部的預算如果不夠的話可以提出來啦你們有很多的單位不是你們在救災的時候你們有沒有收發室你們有沒有一些這個要上傳資訊的部門不要講得好像整個速發部所有的人"},{"start":526.363,"end":539.308,"text":"都在救災啊當然不是嘛那到現在速發部也沒有做官方的這個提出啊你們在事發的平台上面你們到現在都還沒有聲明為什麼我要提這件事啊跟次長說明"},{"start":541.109,"end":562.587,"text":"我在11月15號晚上11點09分請大家關注這件事也是希望平台業者希望我們的政府部會趕快來解決不然民眾很恐慌會不會還有下一波的問題等等確實如您所說凌晨12點13分左右就恢復了我的這個更新就是在那個時候PO的"},{"start":562.847,"end":586.661,"text":"因為沒有拿到也沒有得到速發部的任何聲明所以我們當然很抱歉我們並不知道同仁在進行加班所以呢我們在這裡是說感謝Meta因為按下恢復按鈕的還是他嘛因為那個平台不是我們的嘛所以我感謝Meta在全力奔走聯繫大家一起努力嘛對不對那恢復了請問我這樣PO有沒有問題有沒有問題沒有問題吧"},{"start":592.104,"end":617.172,"text":"我沒有發表沒有什麼問題啊對嘛結果底下一批人都在講說為什麼只感謝Meta今天我也感謝速發部為什麼因為我們後來知道嘛對不對我們後來知道嘛所以我想請問速發部大家都說這個您剛剛說沒有直接責任那我就請教速發部有沒有通報業者Meta做快速下架的機制你有沒有可能跟他聯動"},{"start":618.868,"end":629.065,"text":"是 有可能阿有可能嘛 對不對這是你們速發部的官網寫的嘛快速下架是由政府部門通報的詐騙嘛你們有沒有可能不小心通報錯了"},{"start":630.428,"end":650.138,"text":"當然有可能,但是我們很小心就避免這種狀況啊那你的臉書上說沒有嘛對阿,那這件事情的確沒有阿,這件事情的確不是我們稍微通報到的所以你們說沒有嘛,所以我確認一件事,因為網友都在講,訴發部沒有權力也沒有能力去下架詐騙粉專我就此請教你,你們有沒有能力通報並且下架粉專"},{"start":652.619,"end":657.361,"text":"所以如果有錯粉磚下架也有可能是通報錯了對不對您就對或不對就好了對嘛沒錯嘛因為這就是你們的紀錄嘛一個小時之內去幫這些商業的業者去下架錯假粉磚嘛"},{"start":680.27,"end":707.806,"text":"你們也有說跟44位名人建立通報管道這個就是你們所謂的白名單可能還有更多啦這是你們官網上寫的您剛剛說不清楚數量沒有關係今天其實我的要求非常的簡單謝謝主席給我時間講完這三個具體訴求希望我們的政府部會一起協助我們讓我們不要打詐越打越憂心讓大家可以有一個安心的資通安全的環境首先"},{"start":709.311,"end":723.017,"text":"請求內政部的警政署一週內提供Meta收到警政署相關單位的法律要求之內容及調查報告以確認是否有偽造警政單位之犯罪可不可以一週內"},{"start":724.886,"end":744.653,"text":"我們全力來達成提供給本席另外第二點請數位發布一周內提供白名單到底要了多少人數資料的欄位到底要了哪些資訊因為這可能有個資或同意權的問題以及這個白名單跟這次波及的網紅的重疊比例我都不需要知道是誰"},{"start":745.573,"end":767.186,"text":"我們保護他們的隱私但是相關的資訊我們希望知道去確認有沒有程序或資安的漏洞大家要一起來努力可以嗎一週內我們會再去掉那個各自的訊息我的要求已經是不需要各自了最後一點請速發部一週內提供關於次長有發文這段期間速發部並沒有發公文"},{"start":771.368,"end":785.7,"text":"也沒有用其他任何方式通知臉書請提供我資料具體指出到底是哪一段期間以及調查了哪些其他的任何方式提供給本席有沒有問題一周內沒有問題嗎事情發生是什麼時候"},{"start":795.885,"end":818.443,"text":"就是禮拜五晚上所以你們通報到他下架不需要時間是不是不是啊所以前五分鐘前一個小時都不需要提供嗎那個委員我在那段話後面還有就是說沒有用其他任何方式通知臉書我記得我是寫說通知臉書下架那些我這一段是完全複製貼上的你要回去看也可以"},{"start":819.584,"end":842.67,"text":"沒有關係我沒有要玩文字遊戲大家一起來協同瞭解情況文字提供給我您剛剛說這段期間是從發生的時候開始所以你的意思是說很可能五分鐘前事發前五分鐘你們可能有提供下架囉下架通報囉前一個小時你們可能有提供下架通報囉有沒有這個可能"},{"start":843.61,"end":854.794,"text":"您要好好仔細的瞭解這個狀況,確認一下您的意識到底是什麼,請速發部具體的回文給我們,這樣可以嗎?可以,可以,沒問題。謝謝,謝謝次長,謝謝主席。"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:51:42.811000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:51:42.971000+08:00","text":"謝謝主席。","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:51:43.452000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:51:49.385000+08:00","text":"有請數發部林次長跟內政部警政署的代表，謝謝。","quality":0.95},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:51:54.412000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:51:58.476000+08:00","text":"次長好、副局長您好。","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T11:51:58.476000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T11:51:59.476000+08:00","text":"委員好。","quality":0},{"speaker":"林副局長信雄","start":"2024-11-18T11:51:59.476000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T11:52:00.476000+08:00","text":"委員好。","quality":0},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:52:00.278000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:52:18.414000+08:00","text":"前幾天大家真的很驚嚇，因為有非常多的粉專被下架，當你搜尋這些所謂的網紅，結果找到的都是像本席所示圖片右下角的詐騙訊息，反而是真的找不到，假的一大堆，包含我們的證交所也受到波及。","quality":0.864},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:52:20.450000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:52:31.575000+08:00","text":"我首先還是要感謝次長週末加班發文，也許也有很多同仁加班，我想公務人員非常辛苦，最後大家都是要一起來努力的。","quality":0.959},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:52:32.875000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:52:46.822000+08:00","text":"對於次長臉書有提到「至於臉書有沒有接到其他單位的要求，我們並不是很清楚」，在這裡我想要先請教一下警政署副局長，你有沒有發現這很可能是在暗指你們啊？","quality":0.91},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:52:47.142000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:52:47.302000+08:00","text":"你有沒有發現？","quality":1},{"speaker":"林副局長信雄","start":"2024-11-18T11:52:47.302000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T11:52:49.139333+08:00","text":"我並沒有特別……","quality":0},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:52:49.139333+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T11:52:50.976667+08:00","text":"沒感覺嘛！","quality":0},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:52:50.976667+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T11:52:52.814000+08:00","text":"對不對？","quality":0},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:52:52.814000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:53:14.774000+08:00","text":"不知道副局長有沒有發現，林次長發文底下的留言就有網紅貼上去說，他們的粉專恢復之後，第一時間收到臉書的通知，說是來自Criminal Investigation Bureau的法律要求，這個是不是警政署？對吧？","quality":0.905},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:53:15.775000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:53:17.696000+08:00","text":"是內政部警政署的英文名稱，沒錯吧？","quality":0.733},{"speaker":"林副局長信雄","start":"2024-11-18T11:53:17.696000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:53:18.377000+08:00","text":"是刑事局的英文名稱。","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:53:19.518000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:53:20.178000+08:00","text":"對，刑事局的英文名稱。","quality":0.778},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:53:21.539000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:53:22.220000+08:00","text":"是真的還是假的？","quality":1},{"speaker":"林副局長信雄","start":"2024-11-18T11:53:22.885000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:53:27.926000+08:00","text":"我們並沒有要求臉書去下架這些真實的粉專，沒有！對嘛！","quality":0.87},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:53:29.927000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:53:30.467000+08:00","text":"這是不是假的？","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:53:30.767000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:53:31.767000+08:00","text":"是不是AI深偽的？","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:53:33.188000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:53:37.989000+08:00","text":"是不是有人假造刑事局的身分去提出法律要求？","quality":0.95},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:53:38.729000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:53:39.149000+08:00","text":"有沒有可能？","quality":1},{"speaker":"林副局長信雄","start":"2024-11-18T11:53:40.210000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:53:44.491000+08:00","text":"據我們瞭解，是臉書他們內部在一個篩選機制上，公司之間的聯繫問題……","quality":0.621},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:53:45.151000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:53:50.775000+08:00","text":"沒有，我說這個通知它說是來自刑事局，你們又說沒有嘛！","quality":0.957},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:53:51.255000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:53:51.956000+08:00","text":"對不對？","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:53:51.956000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:53:53.257000+08:00","text":"那有沒有要調查？","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:53:54.158000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:53:55.820000+08:00","text":"如果有人偽造，嚴不嚴重？","quality":1},{"speaker":"林副局長信雄","start":"2024-11-18T11:53:55.820000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T11:53:56.820000+08:00","text":"當然，如果有人偽造，是嚴重的。","quality":0},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:53:56.820000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T11:53:57.820000+08:00","text":"那這是怎麼樣？","quality":0.167},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:53:57.820000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T11:53:58.820000+08:00","text":"他打錯字嗎？","quality":0},{"speaker":"林副局長信雄","start":"2024-11-18T11:53:58.820000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T11:53:59.820000+08:00","text":"這個跟委員報告……","quality":0},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:53:59.820000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T11:54:00.820000+08:00","text":"要不要要求Meta出來說明？","quality":0},{"speaker":"林副局長信雄","start":"2024-11-18T11:54:00.820000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T11:54:01.820000+08:00","text":"Meta他們本身我們是有提供一些黑名單，就是我們從網路服務平台發現很多偽造的，我們會請……","quality":0},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:53:56.982000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:53:59.003000+08:00","text":"不是，這是被錯下架的粉專說他們收到通知，是警政署這裡的資訊嘛！","quality":0.893},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:53:59.003000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:53:59.403000+08:00","text":"那這是不是有人偽造？","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:53:59.443000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:53:59.723000+08:00","text":"還是真的？","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:53:59.843000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:54:00.423000+08:00","text":"這到底是真的還是假的？","quality":1},{"speaker":"林副局長信雄","start":"2024-11-18T11:54:24.672000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:54:30.900000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，就我們的瞭解，是臉書內部的篩選機制，他們有不同部門，他們有聯繫錯誤的問題。","quality":0.763},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:54:31.802000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:54:36.067000+08:00","text":"對不起，他們現在就說是Criminal Investigation Bureau（刑事局）嘛！","quality":0.463},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:54:37.409000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:54:39.311000+08:00","text":"那你們如果不背鍋，要不要調查啊？","quality":1},{"speaker":"林副局長信雄","start":"2024-11-18T11:54:40.363000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:54:44.505000+08:00","text":"我們會再跟他們反映，請他們更正，因為他們是內部不同單位聯繫發生問題。","quality":0.71},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:54:44.505000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:54:45.585000+08:00","text":"到底是不是警政署？","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:54:45.965000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:54:46.945000+08:00","text":"你現在說不出來嘛！","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:54:47.506000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:54:48.326000+08:00","text":"是不是有人偽造？","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:54:48.846000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:54:49.726000+08:00","text":"你也答不出來嘛！","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:54:51.067000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:54:54.508000+08:00","text":"次長在臉書上面po了，底下也有人留言，次長也按讚了。","quality":0.826},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:54:56.529000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:54:58.069000+08:00","text":"這邊有沒有通報警政署去了解？","quality":1},{"speaker":"林副局長信雄","start":"2024-11-18T11:54:58.069000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T11:54:59.150000+08:00","text":"這部分……","quality":0},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:54:59.150000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:54:59.430000+08:00","text":"有沒有？","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:54:59.610000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:55:04.211000+08:00","text":"你只要說有還是沒有，數發部有沒有橫向通報，有還是沒有？","quality":0.958},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:55:05.012000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:55:06.635000+08:00","text":"國會殿堂，請說有或沒有。","quality":1},{"speaker":"林副局長信雄","start":"2024-11-18T11:55:06.795000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:55:11.922000+08:00","text":"是，跟委員報告，因為這不是我業管，所以細節我並不了解。","quality":0.87},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:55:11.942000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:55:13.184000+08:00","text":"那可以調查一下嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"林副局長信雄","start":"2024-11-18T11:55:13.184000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T11:55:14.184000+08:00","text":"是，我們會……","quality":0},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:55:13.184000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:55:14.707000+08:00","text":"我們待會會有具體要求。","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:55:15.528000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:55:23.356000+08:00","text":"再來我想問一下數發部，數發部有沒有收集網紅白名單，有還是沒有？","quality":0.893},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T11:55:23.996000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:55:31.080000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，因為有一些網紅一直跟我們陳情，他們希望進入白名單……","quality":0.929},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:55:31.080000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T11:55:32.080000+08:00","text":"所以就是有嘛！","quality":0},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T11:55:31.080000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:55:34.722000+08:00","text":"但是沒有蒐集，是他們主動要求我們做這件事情，但是我們……","quality":0.792},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:55:35.183000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:55:35.843000+08:00","text":"你確定喔？好。","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:55:37.964000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:55:40.226000+08:00","text":"你沒有蒐集，那麼這封信是不是假的？","quality":0.867},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:55:41.186000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:55:43.568000+08:00","text":"是不是有人偽造你們提出蒐集？","quality":0.923},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:55:46.158000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:55:48.579000+08:00","text":"這不是你們嘛，對不對？","quality":1},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T11:55:48.579000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:55:49.319000+08:00","text":"這個我要去確認一下，因為這個比較細節的部分……","quality":0.45},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:55:50.280000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:55:52.601000+08:00","text":"你沒辦法確認，你剛剛又說沒有？","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:55:52.761000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:55:54.482000+08:00","text":"好，沒關係，我們今天就了解真相。","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:55:56.123000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:55:57.804000+08:00","text":"這是不是你們？","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:55:57.804000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:55:58.725000+08:00","text":"這是不是錯假訊息？","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:55:59.545000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:56:01.166000+08:00","text":"這是不是AI，還是深偽？","quality":0.7},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:56:01.166000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:56:07.250000+08:00","text":"內容是「我們是數位發展部反詐騙工作小組」，這是網紅提出的截圖，是還是不是？","quality":0.906},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T11:56:12.765000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:56:15.546000+08:00","text":"報告委員，我們在國會殿堂，因為我沒有看過這封信，我真的當下必須去了解。","quality":0.677},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:56:16.486000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:56:23.269000+08:00","text":"事情在禮拜五的深夜已經發生，您週末也發文，然後說同仁很辛苦……","quality":0.926},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T11:56:23.449000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:56:23.709000+08:00","text":"是，非常辛苦。","quality":0.4},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:56:24.149000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:56:26.470000+08:00","text":"都是Meta的錯，都是其他單位的錯……","quality":0.938},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T11:56:26.470000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T11:56:27.470000+08:00","text":"我沒有說都是Meta的錯，也沒有說是任何……","quality":0},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:56:26.490000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:56:26.850000+08:00","text":"數發部有沒有責任？","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T11:56:30.651000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:56:35.573000+08:00","text":"我們當然有責任，事實上我們不推諉責任，我們馬上加班去把這個事情給處理了……","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:56:36.194000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:56:38.075000+08:00","text":"事發原因，你們有沒有責任嘛？","quality":1},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T11:56:38.075000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T11:56:39.095000+08:00","text":"事發原因已經都說明了……","quality":0},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:56:39.095000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:56:44.097000+08:00","text":"沒關係，所以你們沒有蒐集白名單，我們之後再來了解。是。","quality":0.87},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:56:44.798000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:56:48.419000+08:00","text":"我們非常有疑義，你蒐集的目的是什麼？","quality":0.938},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:56:48.419000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:56:52.141000+08:00","text":"如果你已經蒐集了，又沒有辦法保護他們，到底目的是什麼？","quality":0.958},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:56:52.141000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:56:54.042000+08:00","text":"你要收集個資嗎？","quality":0.714},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:56:54.042000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:56:57.624000+08:00","text":"系統誤判、錯假下架，數發部有沒有責？","quality":0.933},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T11:56:59.879000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:57:02.321000+08:00","text":"如果發生錯假下架的話，當然有責。對嘛！","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T11:57:02.321000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:57:06.865000+08:00","text":"如果是責任在我們身上，當然是有責，如果事情是我們造成的，當然是我們有責任，但是……","quality":0.886},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:57:07.065000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:57:11.849000+08:00","text":"所以責任不在你們身上，你們就沒有責，是不是？","quality":0.842},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T11:57:11.849000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T11:57:12.849000+08:00","text":"如果不是因為我們的作為，而發生了，當然我們就沒有責任。","quality":0},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:57:11.849000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:57:16.853000+08:00","text":"所以如果不是你們造成的，你就沒有責任嘛，對不對？是啊！很好！","quality":0.92},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:57:17.794000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:57:26.861000+08:00","text":"你們數位產業發展部平臺經濟的業務，就在你們下轄的業務範圍之下，臉書是不是平臺經濟？是。","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:57:27.982000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:57:32.885000+08:00","text":"你們數發部有沒有一些單位、政府有沒有單位付它廣告費？","quality":0.958},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T11:57:32.885000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T11:57:33.885000+08:00","text":"這方面當然有責任……","quality":0},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:57:32.885000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:57:33.506000+08:00","text":"我們有這麼多的預算做網路行銷……","quality":1},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T11:57:33.506000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T11:57:34.506000+08:00","text":"抱歉、抱歉！","quality":0},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T11:57:34.506000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T11:57:35.506000+08:00","text":"我誤解委員的意思了……","quality":0},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:57:33.506000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:57:34.226000+08:00","text":"我們是不是都把它全部砍掉？","quality":1},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T11:57:34.226000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T11:57:40.752000+08:00","text":"非常抱歉，誤解委員的意思了！","quality":0},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:57:40.752000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:57:50.857000+08:00","text":"再來，打詐專法通過了以後，詐欺有關的廣告業者的平臺，是不是在你們下轄之下，你們有沒有責任？","quality":1},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T11:57:51.937000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:57:53.038000+08:00","text":"這方面當然有責任。對嘛！","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:57:53.578000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:57:58.520000+08:00","text":"所以就算只是它犯的錯，數發部也有責任。","quality":0.882},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T11:57:58.520000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T11:57:59.641000+08:00","text":"這方面絕對有責任。","quality":0},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:57:59.641000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:58:00.681000+08:00","text":"這寫得清清楚楚的啊！","quality":1},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T11:58:00.681000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T11:58:01.681000+08:00","text":"是，委員講得完全沒錯。","quality":0},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:58:01.021000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:58:03.322000+08:00","text":"那您是不是現在打臉剛剛的你自己？","quality":1},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T11:58:04.002000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:58:04.483000+08:00","text":"就算是吧！","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:58:07.772000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:58:11.234000+08:00","text":"這個態度我們都錄下來了，沒有關係，大家自己公評。是。","quality":0.818},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:58:13.356000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:58:15.477000+08:00","text":"這是您的美照。謝謝。","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:58:15.477000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:58:29.288000+08:00","text":"你們要宣傳打詐的時候，找平臺業者來，然後發生問題了，說是平臺業者的錯，數發部沒有責任，沒有關係，我們不要去講這些有的沒的。","quality":0.981},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:58:30.389000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:58:39.340000+08:00","text":"我們就只問一件事，11月15日深夜，從7點開始，大批網紅粉專下架，什麼時候恢復的，次長知道嗎？","quality":0.972},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T11:58:48.454000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:58:48.574000+08:00","text":"請我們同仁向委員報告。","quality":0.3},{"speaker":"林組長青嶔","start":"2024-11-18T11:58:49.275000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:59:02.062000+08:00","text":"報告委員，大概12點陸陸續續，12點13分的時候，Meta有傳訊息給我，陸陸續續已經恢復了，我這邊陸續有監控，我這邊有LINE的訊息，也可以提供委員來看，謝謝。","quality":0.938},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:59:02.062000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:59:03.883000+08:00","text":"非常好，非常精準的回答。","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:59:06.024000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:59:07.325000+08:00","text":"數發部什麼時候發布的回應？","quality":0.917},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T11:59:10.688000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:59:13.590000+08:00","text":"哪一部分的回應？","quality":0.571},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:59:13.590000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:59:20.654000+08:00","text":"關於粉專已經恢復了，出了這個大問題，請民眾不要恐慌，我們數發部已經在努力了。","quality":0.941},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:59:21.314000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:59:23.956000+08:00","text":"你們什麼時候公開對這件事情發表回應的？","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:59:24.236000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:59:24.916000+08:00","text":"什麼時候？","quality":1},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T11:59:26.497000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:59:31.120000+08:00","text":"這個我要回去查一下，因為當初不是我自己回應的，所以可能要請同仁說明一下。","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T11:59:32.771000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T11:59:32.871000+08:00","text":"什麼時候？","quality":1},{"speaker":"林組長青嶔","start":"2024-11-18T11:59:33.871000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:00:11.244000+08:00","text":"報告委員，其實我覺得很多事情就像火災一樣，發生了事情要趕快先處理、善後，所以目前來講，其實一直以來，我就一直在聯繫所有的粉專，直到所有的粉專能夠確定恢復之後，我們才來做適當的因應，所以也因為這樣子，到隔天的時候，我們有通報次長，然後報告次長這個到底目前情況怎樣，次長也在適當的時間在臉書跟大家講，所以才會有剛剛委員看的那一封信，請大家安心，如果還有什麼問題的話……當然我也知道，委員也很關心，我也有持續關注委員的臉書，所以我們一起來努力，這整個事情發生了，當然就是我們要救災，把它處理好，以上，謝謝委員。好。","quality":0.951},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:00:11.244000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:00:19.226000+08:00","text":"首先數發部的預算如果不夠，可以提出來，你們有很多的單位，不是你們在救災的時候，你們有沒有收發室？","quality":0.977},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:00:19.806000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:00:24.487000+08:00","text":"你們有沒有一些要上傳資訊的部門？","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:00:24.487000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:00:29.984000+08:00","text":"不要講得好像整個數發部所有的人都在救災，當然不是嘛！","quality":0.958},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:00:30.804000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:00:39.168000+08:00","text":"到現在數發部也沒有做官方的提出，在事發的平臺上面，你們到現在都還沒有聲明。","quality":0.971},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:00:39.788000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:00:40.708000+08:00","text":"為什麼我要提這件事？","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:00:41.108000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:00:57.541000+08:00","text":"跟次長說明，我在11月15日晚上11點9分，請大家關注這件事，也是希望平臺業者、希望我們的政府部會趕快來解決，不然民眾很恐慌，會不會還有下一波的問題等等。","quality":0.984},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:00:58.542000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:01:18.935000+08:00","text":"確實如您所說，凌晨12點13分左右就恢復了，我的這個更新，就是在那個時候po的，因為沒有拿到也沒有得到數發部的任何聲明，所以我們當然很抱歉，我們並不知道同仁在進行加班，所以我們在這裡是說感謝Meta，因為按下恢復按鈕的還是它嘛！","quality":0.96},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:01:19.155000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:01:25.799000+08:00","text":"因為那個平臺不是我們的，所以我感謝Meta在全力奔走聯繫，大家一起努力嘛，對不對？","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:01:25.799000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:01:28.441000+08:00","text":"那恢復了，請問我這樣po有沒有問題？","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:01:28.441000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:01:28.641000+08:00","text":"沒有問題吧？次長。","quality":0.714},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T12:01:34.104000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:01:34.624000+08:00","text":"我沒有發表……","quality":1},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T12:01:35.765000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:01:36.825000+08:00","text":"沒有什麼問題。對嘛！","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:01:37.645000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:01:44.847000+08:00","text":"結果底下一批人都在講為什麼只感謝Meta，我今天也感謝數發部，為什麼？","quality":0.938},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:01:44.847000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:01:47.068000+08:00","text":"因為我們後來知道嘛，對不對？","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:01:48.629000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:01:57.931000+08:00","text":"所以我想請問數發部，您剛剛說沒有直接責任，那我就請教數發部有沒有通報業者Meta做快速下架機制？","quality":0.956},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:01:58.351000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:01:59.172000+08:00","text":"你有沒有可能跟它連動？","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T12:02:00.868000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:02:01.509000+08:00","text":"是，有可能。","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:02:01.729000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:02:03.472000+08:00","text":"有可能，對不對？","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:02:03.472000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:02:05.435000+08:00","text":"這是你們數發部的官網寫的嘛！","quality":0.923},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:02:05.716000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:02:08.681000+08:00","text":"「快速下架由政府部門通報的詐騙」嘛！","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:02:09.422000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:02:11.045000+08:00","text":"你們有沒有可能不小心通報錯了？","quality":1},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T12:02:12.428000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:02:14.829000+08:00","text":"當然有可能，但是我們很小心避免這種狀況。","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:02:15.189000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:02:17.190000+08:00","text":"但你的臉書上說沒有嘛！對啊！","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T12:02:17.551000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:02:19.972000+08:00","text":"這件事情的確沒有，這件事情的確不是我們錯誤通報。","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:02:20.232000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:02:20.552000+08:00","text":"你們說沒有嘛！","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:02:20.972000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:02:28.756000+08:00","text":"所以恕我確認一件事，因為網友都在講，數發部沒有權力也沒有能力去下架詐騙粉專。","quality":0.943},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:02:28.756000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:02:32.138000+08:00","text":"我就此請教你，你們有沒有能力通報，並且下架粉專？","quality":1},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T12:02:32.138000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T12:02:33.138000+08:00","text":"我們有能力通報，那能不能直接命令它做下架，目前是不行的……對嘛！","quality":0},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:02:33.138000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T12:02:34.138000+08:00","text":"你可以通報，然後最後它可以下架，對不對？","quality":0},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T12:02:34.138000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T12:02:35.138000+08:00","text":"一定要打詐專法，它已經通過了，但是還沒有正式施行，謝謝。","quality":0},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:02:34.619000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:02:35.700000+08:00","text":"所以如果有錯粉專下架，也有可能是通報錯了，對不對？","quality":0.955},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:02:36.620000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:02:37.601000+08:00","text":"你說對或不對就好了。是啊！對嘛！沒錯！","quality":0.733},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:02:37.761000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:03:13.096000+08:00","text":"因為這就是你們的紀錄，一個小時之內去幫這些商業的業者去下架錯假粉專，你們也說跟44位名人建立通報管道，這個就是你們所謂的白名單，可能還有更多啦，這是你們官網上寫的，您剛剛說不清楚數量，沒有關係。","quality":0.989},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:03:13.096000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:03:28.965000+08:00","text":"今天其實我的要求非常簡單，謝謝主席給我時間講完這三個具體訴求，希望我們政府部會一起協助我們，讓我們不要打詐越打越憂心，讓大家可以有一個安心的資通安全環境。","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:03:29.585000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:03:43.836000+08:00","text":"首先，請內政部警政署一週內提供「Meta 收到警政署法律要求」之內容及調查報告，以確認是否有偽造警政單位之犯罪。","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:03:44.116000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:03:45.017000+08:00","text":"可不可以一週內？","quality":1},{"speaker":"林副局長信雄","start":"2024-11-18T12:03:46.886000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:03:48.467000+08:00","text":"我們全力來達成。","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:03:48.467000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T12:03:49.467000+08:00","text":"全力來達成？","quality":0},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:03:48.767000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:03:49.367000+08:00","text":"提供給本席。","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:03:49.927000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:04:06.653000+08:00","text":"另外第二點，請數發部一週內提供白名單，到底要了多少人數，資料的欄位到底要了哪些資訊，因為這可能有個資或同意權的問題，以及白名單跟這次波及的網紅的重疊比例，我都不需要知道是誰。","quality":0.975},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T12:04:06.653000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T12:04:07.653000+08:00","text":"OK，這沒有問題。","quality":0},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:04:07.573000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:04:16.118000+08:00","text":"我們保護他們的隱私，但是相關的資訊，我們希望知道，確認有沒有程序或資安的漏洞，大家要一起來努力可以嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:04:16.118000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:04:16.378000+08:00","text":"一週內？","quality":1},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T12:04:16.378000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:04:20.921000+08:00","text":"我們會去掉那個個資的……當然！","quality":0.583},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T12:04:21.221000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:04:21.361000+08:00","text":"去掉個資的訊息……當然！","quality":0.333},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:04:22.522000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:04:24.103000+08:00","text":"我的要求已經是不需要個資了。","quality":0.846},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T12:04:24.103000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T12:04:25.103000+08:00","text":"可以，沒問題。","quality":0},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:04:24.923000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:04:45.778000+08:00","text":"最後一點，請數發部一週內提供關於次長發文「這段期間數發部並沒有發公文，也沒有用其他任何方式通知臉書」，請提供我資料，具體指出到底是哪段期間，以及調查哪些其他任何方式，提供給本席，有沒有問題？","quality":0.976},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:04:45.778000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:04:46.439000+08:00","text":"一週內？","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T12:04:46.439000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T12:04:47.439000+08:00","text":"這個我沒問題。","quality":0},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T12:04:47.439000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T12:04:48.439000+08:00","text":"事實上……","quality":0},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:04:46.439000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:04:46.579000+08:00","text":"沒有問題嘛？","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T12:04:46.579000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T12:04:47.579000+08:00","text":"我當場就可以說了，這個事情發生到我發文的那段時間，就是那一段時間。","quality":0},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:04:46.579000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:04:47.680000+08:00","text":"事情發生是什麼時候？","quality":1},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T12:04:57.885000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:04:58.606000+08:00","text":"就是禮拜五晚上。","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:04:59.166000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:05:02.849000+08:00","text":"所以你們通報到它下架不需要時間，是不是？不是……","quality":0.95},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:05:03.029000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:05:07.193000+08:00","text":"所以前5分鐘、前一個小時都不需要提供嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T12:05:07.193000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T12:05:08.274000+08:00","text":"我不是講說那一段時間沒有……","quality":0.083},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T12:05:08.274000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:05:16.280000+08:00","text":"委員，我在那段話後面還有，就是說沒有用其他任何方式通知臉書，我記得我是寫說通知臉書下架那些……","quality":1},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:05:16.300000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:05:18.662000+08:00","text":"我這一段是完全複製貼上的。","quality":1},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T12:05:18.662000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T12:05:19.662000+08:00","text":"對，但後面還有一段。","quality":0},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:05:19.182000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:05:20.423000+08:00","text":"你要回去看也可以。是。","quality":0.889},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:05:21.584000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:05:24.025000+08:00","text":"沒有關係，我們沒有要玩文字遊戲。","quality":0.929},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T12:05:24.025000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T12:05:25.025000+08:00","text":"沒關係，反正沒有問題……","quality":0},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:05:24.025000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:05:28.106000+08:00","text":"大家一起來協同了解情況。","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T12:05:28.106000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T12:05:29.106000+08:00","text":"我的意思是我可以提供給委員……","quality":0},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:05:28.106000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:05:44.650000+08:00","text":"文字提供給我，您剛剛說這段期間是從發生的時候開始，所以您的意思是說很可能5分鐘前、事發前5分鐘，你們可能有提供下架通報囉，前一個小時你們可能有提供下架通報囉，有沒有這個可能？","quality":0.987},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:05:45.610000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:05:53.868000+08:00","text":"您要好好仔細地了解這個狀況，確認一下您的意思到底是什麼，請數發部具體地回文給我們，這樣可以嗎？","quality":0.884},{"speaker":"林次長宜敬","start":"2024-11-18T12:05:54.068000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:05:55.692000+08:00","text":"可以、沒有問題。","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"葛委員如鈞","start":"2024-11-18T12:05:55.692000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-11-18T12:05:56.774000+08:00","text":"謝謝次長，謝謝主席。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-11-18T12:05:57.274000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T12:06:03.845429+08:00","text":"謝謝葛如鈞委員，請各部門儘速提供資料給葛如鈞委員。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-11-18T12:06:04.145429+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-11-18T12:06:08.431143+08:00","text":"接下來我們請楊瓊瓔委員上臺質詢。","quality":0}]},"gazette":{"lineno":660,"blocks":[["葛委員如鈞：（11時51分）謝謝主席。有請數發部林次長跟內政部警政署的代表，謝謝。","次長好、副局長您好。"],["林次長宜敬：委員好。"],["林副局長信雄：委員好。"],["葛委員如鈞：前幾天大家真的很驚嚇，因為有非常多的粉專被下架，當你搜尋這些所謂的網紅，結果找到的都是像本席所示圖片右下角的詐騙訊息，反而是真的找不到，假的一大堆，包含我們的證交所也受到波及。","我首先還是要感謝次長週末加班發文，也許也有很多同仁加班，我想公務人員非常辛苦，最後大家都是要一起來努力的。對於次長臉書有提到「至於臉書有沒有接到其他單位的要求，我們並不是很清楚」，在這裡我想要先請教一下警政署副局長，你有沒有發現這很可能是在暗指你們啊？你有沒有發現？"],["林副局長信雄：我並沒有特別……"],["葛委員如鈞：沒感覺嘛！對不對？不知道副局長有沒有發現，林次長發文底下的留言就有網紅貼上去說，他們的粉專恢復之後，第一時間收到臉書的通知，說是來自Criminal Investigation Bureau的法律要求，這個是不是警政署？對吧？是內政部警政署的英文名稱，沒錯吧？"],["林副局長信雄：是刑事局的英文名稱。"],["葛委員如鈞：對，刑事局的英文名稱。是真的還是假的？"],["林副局長信雄：我們並沒有要求臉書去下架這些真實的粉專，沒有！"],["葛委員如鈞：對嘛！這是不是假的？是不是AI深偽的？是不是有人假造刑事局的身分去提出法律要求？有沒有可能？"],["林副局長信雄：據我們瞭解，是臉書他們內部在一個篩選機制上，公司之間的聯繫問題……"],["葛委員如鈞：沒有，我說這個通知它說是來自刑事局，你們又說沒有嘛！對不對？那有沒有要調查？如果有人偽造，嚴不嚴重？"],["林副局長信雄：當然，如果有人偽造，是嚴重的。"],["葛委員如鈞：那這是怎麼樣？他打錯字嗎？"],["林副局長信雄：這個跟委員報告……"],["葛委員如鈞：要不要要求Meta出來說明？"],["林副局長信雄：Meta他們本身我們是有提供一些黑名單，就是我們從網路服務平台發現很多偽造的，我們會請……"],["葛委員如鈞：不是，這是被錯下架的粉專說他們收到通知，是警政署這裡的資訊嘛！那這是不是有人偽造？還是真的？這到底是真的還是假的？"],["林副局長信雄：跟委員報告，就我們的瞭解，是臉書內部的篩選機制，他們有不同部門，他們有聯繫錯誤的問題。"],["葛委員如鈞：對不起，他們現在就說是Criminal Investigation Bureau（刑事局）嘛！那你們如果不背鍋，要不要調查啊？"],["林副局長信雄：我們會再跟他們反映，請他們更正，因為他們是內部不同單位聯繫發生問題。"],["葛委員如鈞：到底是不是警政署？你現在說不出來嘛！是不是有人偽造？你也答不出來嘛！次長在臉書上面po了，底下也有人留言，次長也按讚了。這邊有沒有通報警政署去了解？"],["林副局長信雄：這部分……"],["葛委員如鈞：有沒有？你只要說有還是沒有，數發部有沒有橫向通報，有還是沒有？國會殿堂，請說有或沒有。"],["林副局長信雄：是，跟委員報告，因為這不是我業管，所以細節我並不了解。"],["葛委員如鈞：那可以調查一下嗎？"],["林副局長信雄：是，我們會……"],["葛委員如鈞：我們待會會有具體要求。再來我想問一下數發部，數發部有沒有收集網紅白名單，有還是沒有？"],["林次長宜敬：跟委員報告，因為有一些網紅一直跟我們陳情，他們希望進入白名單……"],["葛委員如鈞：所以就是有嘛！"],["林次長宜敬：但是沒有蒐集，是他們主動要求我們做這件事情，但是我們……"],["葛委員如鈞：你確定喔？好。你沒有蒐集，那麼這封信是不是假的？是不是有人偽造你們提出蒐集？這不是你們嘛，對不對？"],["林次長宜敬：這個我要去確認一下，因為這個比較細節的部分……"],["葛委員如鈞：你沒辦法確認，你剛剛又說沒有？好，沒關係，我們今天就了解真相。這是不是你們？這是不是錯假訊息？這是不是AI，還是深偽？內容是「我們是數位發展部反詐騙工作小組」，這是網紅提出的截圖，是還是不是？"],["林次長宜敬：報告委員，我們在國會殿堂，因為我沒有看過這封信，我真的當下必須去了解。"],["葛委員如鈞：事情在禮拜五的深夜已經發生，您週末也發文，然後說同仁很辛苦……"],["林次長宜敬：是，非常辛苦。"],["葛委員如鈞：都是Meta的錯，都是其他單位的錯……"],["林次長宜敬：我沒有說都是Meta的錯，也沒有說是任何……"],["葛委員如鈞：數發部有沒有責任？"],["林次長宜敬：我們當然有責任，事實上我們不推諉責任，我們馬上加班去把這個事情給處理了……"],["葛委員如鈞：事發原因，你們有沒有責任嘛？"],["林次長宜敬：事發原因已經都說明了……"],["葛委員如鈞：沒關係，所以你們沒有蒐集白名單，我們之後再來了解。"],["林次長宜敬：是。"],["葛委員如鈞：我們非常有疑義，你蒐集的目的是什麼？如果你已經蒐集了，又沒有辦法保護他們，到底目的是什麼？你要收集個資嗎？系統誤判、錯假下架，數發部有沒有責？"],["林次長宜敬：如果發生錯假下架的話，當然有責。"],["葛委員如鈞：對嘛！"],["林次長宜敬：如果是責任在我們身上，當然是有責，如果事情是我們造成的，當然是我們有責任，但是……"],["葛委員如鈞：所以責任不在你們身上，你們就沒有責，是不是？"],["林次長宜敬：如果不是因為我們的作為，而發生了，當然我們就沒有責任。"],["葛委員如鈞：所以如果不是你們造成的，你就沒有責任嘛，對不對？"],["林次長宜敬：是啊！"],["葛委員如鈞：很好！你們數位產業發展部平臺經濟的業務，就在你們下轄的業務範圍之下，臉書是不是平臺經濟？"],["林次長宜敬：是。"],["葛委員如鈞：你們數發部有沒有一些單位、政府有沒有單位付它廣告費？"],["林次長宜敬：這方面當然有責任……"],["葛委員如鈞：我們有這麼多的預算做網路行銷……"],["林次長宜敬：抱歉、抱歉！我誤解委員的意思了……"],["葛委員如鈞：我們是不是都把它全部砍掉？"],["林次長宜敬：非常抱歉，誤解委員的意思了！"],["葛委員如鈞：再來，打詐專法通過了以後，詐欺有關的廣告業者的平臺，是不是在你們下轄之下，你們有沒有責任？"],["林次長宜敬：這方面當然有責任。"],["葛委員如鈞：對嘛！所以就算只是它犯的錯，數發部也有責任。"],["林次長宜敬：這方面絕對有責任。"],["葛委員如鈞：這寫得清清楚楚的啊！"],["林次長宜敬：是，委員講得完全沒錯。"],["葛委員如鈞：那您是不是現在打臉剛剛的你自己？"],["林次長宜敬：就算是吧！"],["葛委員如鈞：這個態度我們都錄下來了，沒有關係，大家自己公評。"],["林次長宜敬：是。"],["葛委員如鈞：這是您的美照。"],["林次長宜敬：謝謝。"],["葛委員如鈞：你們要宣傳打詐的時候，找平臺業者來，然後發生問題了，說是平臺業者的錯，數發部沒有責任，沒有關係，我們不要去講這些有的沒的。我們就只問一件事，11月15日深夜，從7點開始，大批網紅粉專下架，什麼時候恢復的，次長知道嗎？"],["林次長宜敬：請我們同仁向委員報告。"],["林組長青嶔：報告委員，大概12點陸陸續續，12點13分的時候，Meta有傳訊息給我，陸陸續續已經恢復了，我這邊陸續有監控，我這邊有LINE的訊息，也可以提供委員來看，謝謝。"],["葛委員如鈞：非常好，非常精準的回答。數發部什麼時候發布的回應？"],["林次長宜敬：哪一部分的回應？"],["葛委員如鈞：關於粉專已經恢復了，出了這個大問題，請民眾不要恐慌，我們數發部已經在努力了。你們什麼時候公開對這件事情發表回應的？什麼時候？"],["林次長宜敬：這個我要回去查一下，因為當初不是我自己回應的，所以可能要請同仁說明一下。"],["葛委員如鈞：什麼時候？"],["林組長青嶔：報告委員，其實我覺得很多事情就像火災一樣，發生了事情要趕快先處理、善後，所以目前來講，其實一直以來，我就一直在聯繫所有的粉專，直到所有的粉專能夠確定恢復之後，我們才來做適當的因應，所以也因為這樣子，到隔天的時候，我們有通報次長，然後報告次長這個到底目前情況怎樣，次長也在適當的時間在臉書跟大家講，所以才會有剛剛委員看的那一封信，請大家安心，如果還有什麼問題的話……當然我也知道，委員也很關心，我也有持續關注委員的臉書，所以我們一起來努力，這整個事情發生了，當然就是我們要救災，把它處理好，以上，謝謝委員。"],["葛委員如鈞：好。首先數發部的預算如果不夠，可以提出來，你們有很多的單位，不是你們在救災的時候，你們有沒有收發室？你們有沒有一些要上傳資訊的部門？不要講得好像整個數發部所有的人都在救災，當然不是嘛！到現在數發部也沒有做官方的提出，在事發的平臺上面，你們到現在都還沒有聲明。為什麼我要提這件事？跟次長說明，我在11月15日晚上11點9分，請大家關注這件事，也是希望平臺業者、希望我們的政府部會趕快來解決，不然民眾很恐慌，會不會還有下一波的問題等等。確實如您所說，凌晨12點13分左右就恢復了，我的這個更新，就是在那個時候po的，因為沒有拿到也沒有得到數發部的任何聲明，所以我們當然很抱歉，我們並不知道同仁在進行加班，所以我們在這裡是說感謝Meta，因為按下恢復按鈕的還是它嘛！因為那個平臺不是我們的，所以我感謝Meta在全力奔走聯繫，大家一起努力嘛，對不對？那恢復了，請問我這樣po有沒有問題？沒有問題吧？次長。"],["林次長宜敬：我沒有發表……","沒有什麼問題。"],["葛委員如鈞：對嘛！結果底下一批人都在講為什麼只感謝Meta，我今天也感謝數發部，為什麼？因為我們後來知道嘛，對不對？所以我想請問數發部，您剛剛說沒有直接責任，那我就請教數發部有沒有通報業者Meta做快速下架機制？你有沒有可能跟它連動？"],["林次長宜敬：是，有可能。"],["葛委員如鈞：有可能，對不對？這是你們數發部的官網寫的嘛！「快速下架由政府部門通報的詐騙」嘛！你們有沒有可能不小心通報錯了？"],["林次長宜敬：當然有可能，但是我們很小心避免這種狀況。"],["葛委員如鈞：但你的臉書上說沒有嘛！"],["林次長宜敬：對啊！這件事情的確沒有，這件事情的確不是我們錯誤通報。"],["葛委員如鈞：你們說沒有嘛！所以恕我確認一件事，因為網友都在講，數發部沒有權力也沒有能力去下架詐騙粉專。我就此請教你，你們有沒有能力通報，並且下架粉專？"],["林次長宜敬：我們有能力通報，那能不能直接命令它做下架，目前是不行的……"],["葛委員如鈞：對嘛！你可以通報，然後最後它可以下架，對不對？"],["林次長宜敬：一定要打詐專法，它已經通過了，但是還沒有正式施行，謝謝。"],["葛委員如鈞：所以如果有錯粉專下架，也有可能是通報錯了，對不對？你說對或不對就好了。"],["林次長宜敬：是啊！"],["葛委員如鈞：對嘛！沒錯！因為這就是你們的紀錄，一個小時之內去幫這些商業的業者去下架錯假粉專，你們也說跟44位名人建立通報管道，這個就是你們所謂的白名單，可能還有更多啦，這是你們官網上寫的，您剛剛說不清楚數量，沒有關係。今天其實我的要求非常簡單，謝謝主席給我時間講完這三個具體訴求，希望我們政府部會一起協助我們，讓我們不要打詐越打越憂心，讓大家可以有一個安心的資通安全環境。","首先，請內政部警政署一週內提供「Meta 收到警政署法律要求」之內容及調查報告，以確認是否有偽造警政單位之犯罪。可不可以一週內？"],["林副局長信雄：我們全力來達成。"],["葛委員如鈞：全力來達成？提供給本席。","另外第二點，請數發部一週內提供白名單，到底要了多少人數，資料的欄位到底要了哪些資訊，因為這可能有個資或同意權的問題，以及白名單跟這次波及的網紅的重疊比例，我都不需要知道是誰。"],["林次長宜敬：OK，這沒有問題。"],["葛委員如鈞：我們保護他們的隱私，但是相關的資訊，我們希望知道，確認有沒有程序或資安的漏洞，大家要一起來努力可以嗎？一週內？"],["林次長宜敬：我們會去掉那個個資的……"],["葛委員如鈞：當然！"],["林次長宜敬：去掉個資的訊息……"],["葛委員如鈞：當然！我的要求已經是不需要個資了。"],["林次長宜敬：可以，沒問題。"],["葛委員如鈞：最後一點，請數發部一週內提供關於次長發文「這段期間數發部並沒有發公文，也沒有用其他任何方式通知臉書」，請提供我資料，具體指出到底是哪段期間，以及調查哪些其他任何方式，提供給本席，有沒有問題？一週內？"],["林次長宜敬：這個我沒問題。事實上……"],["葛委員如鈞：沒有問題嘛？"],["林次長宜敬：我當場就可以說了，這個事情發生到我發文的那段時間，就是那一段時間。"],["葛委員如鈞：事情發生是什麼時候？"],["林次長宜敬：就是禮拜五晚上。"],["葛委員如鈞：所以你們通報到它下架不需要時間，是不是？"],["林次長宜敬：不是……"],["葛委員如鈞：所以前5分鐘、前一個小時都不需要提供嗎？"],["林次長宜敬：我不是講說那一段時間沒有……","委員，我在那段話後面還有，就是說沒有用其他任何方式通知臉書，我記得我是寫說通知臉書下架那些……"],["葛委員如鈞：我這一段是完全複製貼上的。"],["林次長宜敬：對，但後面還有一段。"],["葛委員如鈞：你要回去看也可以。"],["林次長宜敬：是。"],["葛委員如鈞：沒有關係，我們沒有要玩文字遊戲。"],["林次長宜敬：沒關係，反正沒有問題……"],["葛委員如鈞：大家一起來協同了解情況。"],["林次長宜敬：我的意思是我可以提供給委員……"],["葛委員如鈞：文字提供給我，您剛剛說這段期間是從發生的時候開始，所以您的意思是說很可能5分鐘前、事發前5分鐘，你們可能有提供下架通報囉，前一個小時你們可能有提供下架通報囉，有沒有這個可能？您要好好仔細地了解這個狀況，確認一下您的意思到底是什麼，請數發部具體地回文給我們，這樣可以嗎？"],["林次長宜敬：可以、沒有問題。"],["葛委員如鈞：謝謝次長，謝謝主席。"],["主席：謝謝葛如鈞委員，請各部門儘速提供資料給葛如鈞委員。","接下來我們請楊瓊瓔委員上臺質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":58,"meet_id":"委員會-11-2-35-14","speakers":["林憶君","羅美玲","洪申翰","徐巧芯","黃仁","沈伯洋","陳永康","陳冠廷","馬文君","王鴻薇","賴士葆","洪孟楷","葛如鈞","楊瓊瓔","黃國昌","王定宇","林楚茵"],"page_start":1,"meetingDate":["2024-11-18"],"gazette_id":"11310101","agenda_lcidc_ids":["11310101_00002"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第2會期外交及國防委員會第14次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請國家安全局局長、數位發展部、法務部調查局、內政部警政署、國家科學及技術委員會報告\n「AI 技術在資安、深偽（Deepfake）影片及錯假訊息之影響評估及因應」，並備質詢","agenda_id":"11310101_00001"}}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}