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：一、邀請相關部會首長就：一、邀請相關部會首長就：一、邀請相關部會首長就"},{"start":213.649,"end":217.673,"text":"二、審查行政院函請審查行政院函請審查行政院函請審查行政院"},{"start":234.369,"end":259.48,"text":"為什麼會有這麼大的懸殊?這第一個,我要請交通部拜託你多多的關心台中。台中部我請,因為時間有限,我請次長你針對我剛剛提問的部分做一個一次性的回答,簡短的回答,快一點好不好?所以我簡直報告一下,剛剛提到那個費用的部分,前瞻預算因為它預算有限,那剛剛提到的,譬如說我們以台中南線,它其實是編在公建裡面,"},{"start":260.16,"end":260.18,"text":"蘇貞昌議員"},{"start":283.528,"end":304.435,"text":"蘇長,我加快因為我今天要講的就是我們台中南山解水溝的部分那你也很清楚一期、二期已經完成一期、二期加起來是6.5公里的河道已經完成但是工程的完整性最重要第三期就是整個延伸到上游清泉崗機場"},{"start":305.495,"end":306.776,"text":"二、審查行政院函請審查行政院函請審議"},{"start":327.064,"end":344.941,"text":"跟委員說明事實上我們跟臺東市政府合作過去投資了50億完成了二、三期的建設剛剛委員所談到的第一期的部分我想整個沙鹿淹水最嚴重的地方大概光田醫院它若是能從臺灣大道那邊"},{"start":345.962,"end":363.978,"text":"然後做一些提前的節流,導注到我們這邊來。主長,你剛剛提到的最重點,為什麼那邊會淹水?因為上游就在清泉崗機場,整個這個水都會往這個沙路的這個市中心來。所以我們剛剛提到一期、二期是在榮景段,榮景段已經完成了。"},{"start":364.138,"end":364.298,"text":"主席"},{"start":382.961,"end":383.481,"text":"主席主席主席"},{"start":402.489,"end":415.09,"text":"委員好謝謝我們不好意思是我們的副主委現在就是說我們知道這一次八大項七百多億對不對沒有一項在台中市"},{"start":416.321,"end":444.357,"text":"沒有一項跟台中有關係,都沒有。然後呢,超過一半400億是要靠這個競爭型預算來爭取。就是地方政府,剛剛念到的任何一個地方政府提出申請計畫,計畫寫得好、說得好、受到青睞,還是說中央計畫最後拍板點頭要哪個縣市就哪個縣市。我們一到四期超過7600億完成的部分,台中市佔208。"},{"start":446.172,"end":471.611,"text":"二零八、兩百零八億這個不用比較這大家都知道連高雄的零頭都不到高雄是一千兩百多億所以現在第五期我跟你講台中市在前瞻裡面比嘉義、比屏東更少人口是第二大、內基第六大但是我們呼籲就是說各部會還有國發會對於整個台中市的發展我希望是得到一個"},{"start":473.212,"end":496.821,"text":"公平一點的來處理不管是我們未來預算的申請還有這個建設的推動跟中央的要求的補助拜託大家公平對待可以嗎是是一定跟我們報告其實因為第5期預算規模有限所以像剛剛您提的捷運建設很多是在納到公建計畫我們上個會期我們那個剛剛提到的那個烏日大慶烏日站的部分現在還在國發會"},{"start":498.762,"end":499.263,"text":"蘇巧慧委員休息30分鐘"}]},"gazette":{"lineno":1743,"blocks":[["顏委員寬恒：（11時31分）主席、各位列席官員，大家好。主席，有請國發會……"],["主席：請國發會詹副主委。"],["顏委員寬恒：水利署。"],["主席：請水利署賴署長。"],["顏委員寬恒：還有交通部。"],["主席：請交通部伍次長。"],["顏委員寬恒：謝謝主席。我先請問交通部伍次長。"],["主席：請伍次長。"],["伍次長勝園：委員好。"],["顏委員寬恒：次長，在這一次的第五期計畫中，交通部主責的部分超過144億元，我幫你整理了，軌道建設包含淡海輕軌、臺北萬大線、桃園捷運系統，還有高雄岡山捷運、臺鐵集集支線、臺南市區鐵路地下化、嘉義縣市鐵路高架化，這些部分都很重要沒有錯，但是臺中市的捷運藍線正在綜合規劃，還有機場捷運橘線、藍線延伸到太平、捷運紫線屯區環狀線，還有捷運綠線延伸段，包括到大坑以及到彰化，結果前瞻五期中沒有一項跟臺中軌道建設相關啊！臺中的軌道建設是零！零！是零啦！真的是零喔！所以叫臺中真的是……不只是我們這些臺中市的委員，也讓臺中市的市民情何以堪！這是第一點。中央沒有把臺中的軌道建設、捷運放在前瞻計畫裡，我想請問交通部，前瞻計畫當中，臺中軌道建設經費是零，那之前包括國發會、交通部承諾的烏日大慶段鐵路高架化還有海線鐵路雙軌化，第一，進度到哪裡？再來，就是烏日大慶段鐵路高架化現在正在等國發會核定。烏日的情況大家都知道，過去從大慶一直到豐原的鐵路高架化預算超過300億元，都是由中央全額補助，地方不用負擔，但是現在我們提的大慶到烏日站計畫，地方要負擔56%。鐵路屬於國有財產，不管是營收、營運都歸中央所有，高架之後，高架橋下所有空間也都歸中央管轄，所以就這個部分我要拜託交通部，進度一定要加速。","再來是經費部分，我們作了一張表，跟其他縣市作了比較，在桃園市鐵路地下化案中，地方經費占25%。嘉義的高架化案，地方占14%，嘉義的延伸計畫占15%。臺南市地下化僅占12.5%、高雄市占29%，臺中市就要占56%，負擔56%啦！我現在不是在比較，而是問中央到底願意幫地方多少？這些收益全部都是中央的，包括橋下的空間都屬於中央。前瞻預算分配不均這點不用比較，大家都很清楚，大家都看得出來，臺中市現在是第二大城，在112年度，我們上繳中央的部分是2,168億元，但回配率是10年最低，只有不到40%，拿到860億元。不能讓好學生變成壞學生啦！上繳那麼多，分配回來的卻那麼少。然後，臺中的自籌超過56%，跟我剛剛念到的其他縣市為什麼差距這麼大、這麼懸殊？這是第一點，交通部，拜託你多多地關心臺中！","因為時間有限啦！我請次長針對我剛剛提問的部分作一次性的回答──簡短的回答，快一點好不好？"],["伍次長勝園：是，我簡單報告一下。關於剛剛提到的費用，前瞻計畫因為預算有限，剛剛提到的，譬如說臺中捷運藍線，其實在公建裡面就有編，這絕對沒問題！另外剛剛提到的烏日這些建設，線路計畫也送進來了，我們看一看之後，如果沒問題，會往國發會送。"],["顏委員寬恒：好，儘速。","次長，那我再要求一下，不足的部分可不可以透過專案來協助？研議好不好，次長？"],["伍次長勝園：好。"],["顏委員寬恒：好不好？"],["伍次長勝園：好。"],["顏委員寬恒：我再請水利署，不好意思，請水利署。署長，我加快啦！今天要講的就是臺中南山截水溝這部分。你也很清楚，一期、二期已經完成。一期、二期加起來6.5公里的河道已經完成，但工程的完整性最重要，第三期──就是整個延伸到上游清泉崗機場，整個沙鹿上游、大肚山臺地就在第三期範圍內，如果第三期沒有做，一遇到強降雨，又遇到極端氣候，整個海線一定淹水！這點無庸置疑。這個部分初估要65億元，包括土地徵收跟地上物補償就超過29億元啦！這部分拜託水利署多幫忙，願不願意？"],["賴署長建信：跟委員說明，事實上，我們跟臺中市政府合作，過去投資50億元，完成了二、三期的建設。至於剛剛委員所談到的第一期，我想，整個沙鹿淹水最嚴重的地方大概是光田醫院啦！"],["顏委員寬恒：對。"],["賴署長建信：若是能從臺灣大道那邊作一些提前截流的設施，導入這邊，我想會有效果。"],["顏委員寬恒：署長、署長，你剛剛提到最重要的重點，為什麼那邊會淹水，因為上游就是在清泉崗機場，整個水都會往沙鹿市中心來，而剛剛提到的一期、二期是在龍井段，龍井段已經完成了！"],["賴署長建信：是啊！所以說……"],["顏委員寬恒：所以三期最重要啊！一期、二期完成到現在已經兩年了，三期卻都沒動靜。你們說臺中市不送案，問題是臺中市沒錢啊！所以說水利署要幫忙，如果你們願意幫忙的話，臺中市府才有辦法、有能力負擔他們要配合的部分嘛！好不好？"],["賴署長建信：好，謝謝委員指導，我們希望改善問題，並且用最少金額的方式來做改善……"],["顏委員寬恒：對，好不好？"],["賴署長建信：至於如何評估，是不是容我們會後再找時間跟委員作說明，好不好？"],["顏委員寬恒：好，署長，拜託好不好？抓緊時間。","最後30秒，謝謝，我想請問國發會。"],["詹副主任委員方冠：委員好。"],["顏委員寬恒：謝謝。不好意思，是副主委……"],["主席：是詹副主委。"],["顏委員寬恒：副主委，我們知道這次有八大項、七百多億元，對不對？"],["詹副主任委員方冠：是。"],["顏委員寬恒：但沒有一樣在臺中市啊！沒有一項跟臺中有關係啦！都沒有！然後，超過一半有400億元是要靠競爭型預算爭取，就是由地方政府，剛剛念到的任何一個地方政府提出申請計畫，看誰計畫寫得好、說得好、受到青睞，或者主管機關最後拍板點頭要給哪個縣市就給哪個縣市。一到四期超過7,600億元啦！我指的是完成的部分，臺中市佔208億元，這個不用比較，大家都知道，連高雄的零頭都不到，高雄是一千兩百多億元啦！現在是第五期，我跟你講，臺中市在前瞻計畫裡面，預算比嘉義、比屏東更少，但人口第二大、面積第六大。我們呼籲各部會還有國發會，對於整個臺中市的發展，我希望得到公平一點的處理，不管是未來預算的申請或針對建設推動向中央要求的補助，拜託大家公平對待，可以嗎？"],["詹副主任委員方冠：是、是，一定。跟委員報告，其實因為第五期預算規模有限，所以像是剛剛您所提的捷運建設有很多是納入公建計畫……"],["顏委員寬恒：我剛剛提到的大慶到烏日站計畫上個會期……現在還在國發會！不曉得什麼時間才會出來。"],["詹副主任委員方冠：我們會儘快處理。"],["顏委員寬恒：好不好？"],["詹副主任委員方冠：好，謝謝。"],["顏委員寬恒：儘快，謝謝、謝謝。"],["詹副主任委員方冠：謝謝委員。"],["主席：謝謝顏寬恒委員。","待會在蘇巧慧委員質詢完畢之後休息30分鐘，讓大家吃飯。","接著請萬美玲委員。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":312,"meet_id":"聯席會議-11-2-20,15,19,22,23,26-1","speakers":["陳玉珍","林德福","吳秉叡","李坤城","陳亭妃","賴瑞隆","林宜瑾","郭國文","賴惠員","賴士葆","洪孟楷","顏寬恒","萬美玲","王世堅","蘇巧慧","王美惠","張雅琳","柯志恩","王鴻薇","陳超明","陳菁徽","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","李昆澤","黃秀芳","吳沛憶","林月琴","郭昱晴","陳秀寳","陳培瑜","李柏毅","張智倫","李彥秀","黃健豪","徐富癸","張宏陸","謝衣鳯","楊瓊瓔","劉建國","范雲","游顥","林倩綺","王正旭","何欣純","羅明才","鄭正鈐","王育敏","葛如鈞","邱志偉","羅廷瑋","盧縣一","吳春城","黃珊珊","林俊憲","黃國昌","蘇清泉","陳昭姿","蔡其昌","張嘉郡","陳素月","邱議瑩","葉元之","邱鎮軍","蔡易餘"],"page_start":67,"meetingDate":["2024-11-20"],"gazette_id":"11310301","agenda_lcidc_ids":["11310301_00003"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第2會期財政、內政、經濟、教育及文化、交通、社會福利及衛生環境委員會第1次聯席會議紀錄","content":"一、邀請相關部會首長就「中央政府前瞻基礎建設計畫第4期特別預算執行情形及成效」進行專\n題報告，並備質詢；二、審查行政院函請審議「中央政府前瞻基礎建設計畫第 5 期特別預算案\n（114年度）」（僅詢答）","agenda_id":"11310301_00002"}}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}