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CANADA"},{"start":1817.309,"end":1831.36,"text":"報告委員會初期委員14人已經達法定人數我們現在就開始開會本週一、三、四為一次會我們首先要進行報告事項請議事人員宣讀上一次會議的議事錄"},{"start":1833.174,"end":1859.209,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會．第3次全體委員會議．事由．中華民國113年3月11日上午9時至11時43分．中華民國113年3月14日上午9時至11時57分．地點本院群閑樓1連1會議室．出席委員．黃孟凱委員等13人．請教委員．柯志溫委員等2人．列席委員．中嘉賓委員等20人．列席人員．3月11日教育部常務次長．林騰甲、翠童有關人員．"},{"start":1860.329,"end":1874.81,"text":"3月14日．國家科學及基礎委員會主任委員．正宗率統有關人員．主席林昭吉委員引進3月11日．報告事項．1.宣讀上次會議事錄．決定議事錄確定2.教育部列席就國家運動科學中心如何協助運動選手．"},{"start":1875.991,"end":1897.017,"text":"提升參加國際競賽成績之具體作為進行專題報告．並備質詢。本人議程由委員洪孟凱等16人提出質詢．均經教育部常務次長林成角及相關人員即席答覆說明．另由委員克珍等5人提出書面質詢．決定依報告及詢答完畢為委員所提書面質詢．或相關資料列入街路並刊登公報"},{"start":1897.697,"end":1919.629,"text":"三對委員質詢．要求提供相關資料或未及答覆部分．請相關機關盡速以順應答覆．通過臨時提案二項．3月14日報告事項．國家科學及技術委員會主任委員．正宗列席．包圍有關看護並備質詢．本議程由委員萬美玲等14人提出質詢．均經國家科學及技術委員會主任委員．正宗及相關人員即席答覆說明．"},{"start":1920.269,"end":1935.894,"text":"利由委員、科資安等5人提出書面質詢．決定一、報告及詢討完畢．二、委員所提書面質詢或相關資料列入介入並刊登公報．三、對委員質詢要求提供相關資料或未解答附部分．請相關機關盡速以書面答覆．通過臨時提案三項．宣讀完畢"},{"start":1938.203,"end":1955.432,"text":"好,因為我們在場的委員沒有達到這個議決人數的三個人所以我們的議事錄暫時不確定那我們今天的議程是邀請教育部、司法院、法務部還有內政部列席就校園暴力事件的處置、少年犯的回歸校園的輔導機制還有前科紀錄是否塗銷我們要來進行專案報告並備質詢那我首先介紹在場的委員好,委員都在"},{"start":1966.397,"end":1966.917,"text":"3月18日、20日及21日三天一次會議"},{"start":1992.885,"end":2004.454,"text":"還有我們司法院少年級家事廳的法官傅曉萱﹑還有我們的少年保護官溫逸賢﹑還有我們法務部矯正署的周輝煌署長﹑還有法務部檢察室的主任檢察官朱華君﹑"},{"start":2017.749,"end":2033.969,"text":"謝謝,還有我們校政署的其他同仁我們就不宜介紹還有我們內政部警政署刑事警察局的副局長林信雄副局長謝謝,還有我們衛福部保護司的郭采榮副司長"},{"start":2035.922,"end":2049.275,"text":"還有我們社會及家庭署的蔡淑珍科長謝謝還有謝謝我們其他一起與會的這些相關的同仁謝謝大家那我們現在是不是就請我們的潘部長因為今天報告人數非常的多我們是否請我們的潘部長進行報告報告時間10分鐘"},{"start":2058.894,"end":2083.911,"text":"主席、各位委員、女士、先生、各位朋友、大家早今天應邀貴委員會就《校園暴力事件之處置、少年犯回歸校園之輔導措施及前科紀錄是否塗銷》進行專題報告以下僅就校園暴力事件預防及處置跟強化高關懷學生回歸校園輔導機制來進行重點的說明那詳細的再請委員詳參書面的報告"},{"start":2086.572,"end":2111.652,"text":"針對校園暴力事件預防及處置校園安全的維護跟暴力防治向來是教育部局委重視的課題以下就校園安全防護及通報機制跟強化．輔導管教及校園安全檢查的作為說明如下在校園安全防護及通報機制方面教育部訂定校園安全及災害事件通報作為要點維護校園安全實施要點以及校園安全防護注意事項強化校園防護機制實施計畫"},{"start":2114.654,"end":2134.357,"text":"以令學校可以就事前預防、緊急處理﹐外部資源及輔導介入等面向﹐來進行校園安全的預防措施﹐防患以未然。上開校園安全防務的相關措施﹐包括奠定各級學校重大緊急校安事件的處理流程﹐以及警政單位簽署﹐"},{"start":2135.438,"end":2160.391,"text":"維護校園安全資源約定書等．以完善整體校園安全的防護五項規定所指的在認為有必要第三是在教育部亦明定校園安全事件通報作業及處置流程．以作為學校教育人員平時及遭遇突發狀況的行動的準備在強化輔導管教及校園安全檢查的部分"},{"start":2160.971,"end":2179.178,"text":"針對學校訂定校園教師輔導以管教學生辦法注意事項在92年發布以來經過6次的修正此次也因應近期確實有在校園安全上面需要能夠在這方面來重新再做一個整理教育部也組成工作小組"},{"start":2180.699,"end":2195.172,"text":"擴大邀請．包含校長、教師、學生．家長、兒少團體及各縣市政府教育級代表．召開多次的諮詢會議及工作小組會議．進行有關注意事項的．全面性的調整跟整理．在2月5日．"},{"start":2197.454,"end":2220.15,"text":"來發布實施．那本次注意事項．修正是以維護校園安全作為一個前提．並以維護教師的管教權．保障學生相關權益．強化學校及家庭及設政單位的念解．以及強化校園安全檢查機制跟流程等原則．來進行全部條文的修正．並提供學校．訂定教師輔導與管教辦法的參考範本．以協助學校來訂定相關的辦法．"},{"start":2224.753,"end":2239.26,"text":"另外為了保障學生權益．並使校園安全檢查機制更加的明確．也制定校園安全檢查操作的手冊．製作校園安全檢查流程．跟各級學校訂定校園安全檢查規定的範本．來提供給各校參考運用"},{"start":2240.84,"end":2267.594,"text":"並請各校結合每學期開學友善校園周來進行校園安全的先導．也強化各校在處理校園安全事件的應變能力．包含要每個學年都應該要做各項有關校安議題的演練．這方面也能夠讓學校能夠在這方面有提高安全的防治的意識．以及能夠做緊急事件的應變．"},{"start":2269.375,"end":2284.528,"text":"那麼在強化高關懷學生回歸校園輔導機制部分．為完善高關懷學生輔導處域的工作．教育部處在現行法規基礎．持續督導地方政府跟學校來落實執行．並以司法院、行政院相關部會．"},{"start":2285.208,"end":2307.028,"text":"各地方政府及學校代表．就強化個案協助關懷機制．擴充中介教育措施．以及政治學務輔導人力的議題來進行研商．具體的內容說明如下．在督導各地方政府及學校落實偏差行為的．預防跟輔導部分．行政院跟司法院依據少年事件處理法．第86條第4項的規定．"},{"start":2310.51,"end":2325.017,"text":"110年發布有關少年偏差行為預防及輔導的辦法也在同年的3月定定少年偏差行為預防及輔導轉嫌的流程作業圖教育部也持續請各地方政府及主管學校依此來落實"},{"start":2325.717,"end":2348.154,"text":"那麼在強化個案協助關懷機制的部分．若實跨網絡的專業合作．教育部在今年2月2日召開校園安全諮詢會議．那麼針對少事法第42條第5項的規定．所指認為有必要．那麼也具體的建議．當少年有危害他人生命身體之餘的．這樣的一個為條件的特定對象．能夠在"},{"start":2350.155,"end":2379.174,"text":"這個做法上面能夠有一個更明確具體的讓這個參與學校有能夠充分的參與那麼也在這個3月12號跨院的協商平台有達成以下的共識那麼司法院也喊請各少年法院在少年調查官審查調查階段所召開的個案聯繫會議或裁定前少年法院所召開的個案跟資源聯繫會議對於上述的這樣的特定的對象"},{"start":2380.015,"end":2395.013,"text":"應該邀請該個案就讀學校指派適當代表出席說明提案．並與會中進行個案的討論．評估該生是否可直接入校入班．或是因行採行中介教育的措施．例如進入到學校內提供的中介教育中途班．"},{"start":2395.513,"end":2416.505,"text":"或進入社區中介教育的基地．進行適應銜接機制．以協助支援學校．能夠進行個案輔導的措施．那司法院發函促請少年法院．在調查審理跟保護執行期間．學校如認為有上述中介教育需求．以少年法院跟相關機關．依照司法第42條第5項及第6項的．法令召開支援聯繫會議的時候．學校也應該指派適當的人員．"},{"start":2423.549,"end":2436.008,"text":"來參與評估、協商跟決定．有關在多元中介措施的基地．由教育部來協助各縣市政府．共同擴充教育基地的建置跟推動．以協助學生、就學及生活的調適"},{"start":2438.376,"end":2460.172,"text":"有關這部分．現行教育部國教署．針對高關懷學生．已經補助地方政府辦理多元教育輔導的課程．為強化高關懷學生過度中介教育措施．也另外邀請各地方政府、民間團體．共同延長中介服務的這個基地的合作的模式．那麼預計會在今年3月來發布．"},{"start":2462.753,"end":2481.123,"text":"有關補助協助、則小市縣市推動教育基地建置的計畫．各縣市政府也會在5月前．持續來完成相關中介基地的擴充．落實三級預防及輔導工作的部分．也朝政治、學務跟輔導人力．"},{"start":2483.324,"end":2487.248,"text":"提供發展性輔導、介入輔導及處理性的輔導．為提升各級學校．各學校輔導人力資源跟量能．"},{"start":2502.524,"end":2506.286,"text":"高中以下也朝向增加專業輔導人力的方向來做規劃．在現行捷輔法的規範之下．來增補相關的專輔的人力高中已經完成了人力的增補"},{"start":2521.152,"end":2523.494,"text":"國中會在114學年度來完成．國小則從120學年度提升到116學年度．而未來要增加的這些．輔導教師的人力跟文報告．人數是超過2000人．會依照這樣的期程逐步來增加．"},{"start":2540.991,"end":2544.272,"text":"學校也反映在有關學務工作的負擔．這部分在經過的討論也分階段來進行．會補助高級中等以下學校．協助學務輔導工作教師來檢授授課的結束．"},{"start":2557.777,"end":2572.307,"text":"那另外也會依照現行國民小學及國民中學﹐班級編制跟教職員嚴格編制的規定﹐那麼對於比較大型的學校61班以上﹐原來可增加1到3名的學務處的副組長﹐那麼在這個階段教育部會先行來"},{"start":2577.852,"end":2602.637,"text":"針對這方面來學制這些大型學校優先能夠來聘任有關副組長的職務那也會來修訂有關國民小學跟國民中學班級編制教職員掩耳編制目標是希望除了剛才所說的60班以上那在幾個階段確實學務的人力負擔工作繁重也會在修訂這個準則來逐一的"},{"start":2604.757,"end":2604.917,"text":"．3月18日及21日"},{"start":2626.235,"end":2650.626,"text":"還有我們包含這次有關司法院相關的這些體系能夠建立起這樣的一個更好的網絡讓第一線的學校在面對這樣的學生的安置的時候能夠有一個更好的支持的力量也來協助老師做輔導管教的這樣的工作以上報告謝謝好我們非常謝謝潘部長的口頭報告我們接下來謝謝我們接下來是不是我們請司法院的謝廳長來進行報告我們報告時間6分鐘好嗎謝謝廳長"},{"start":2661.089,"end":2669.662,"text":"司法院警就今天關於校園暴力事件的處置的部分跟司法院有關的部分來跟各位提出一個專題報告"},{"start":2671.044,"end":2694.383,"text":"首先我必須要提出來就是說其實維護每一個學生跟兒少他們的身心健全是憲法明定的國家的保護義務這個大概是從不管是後來的103年我們把兒童權利公約內閣法化之後它所涉及的對家庭教育對學生的輔導包括對於教育的平等"},{"start":2696.443,"end":2719.629,"text":"有些孩子需要特殊教育這些身心特殊需求的孩子其實都是給一個國家應該賦予每一個家長其實他的孩子都有享有這樣的一個適性教育的一個權利那如何做到呢我想在整個剛剛教育部潘部長的說明當中可以看到以下我大概僅就司法院負責主責的少事法"},{"start":2720.149,"end":2744.401,"text":"那剛剛部長有提到對於少年偏差行為的處理機制呢目前少年事件少年法院大概分配給司法院這裡其實有兩個類一類呢是曝險行為也就是說是我們的少司法的第三條一項二款它規範的有三類那其中有一類呢比如說他如果無故經常攜帶危險器械那這個大概都會列為目前"},{"start":2744.941,"end":2771.943,"text":"行政輔導先行．也就是去年7月1日上路．會由內政部警政署的少年輔導委員會主政．但是各地方政府首長必須要統合教育．保護體系還有其他的包含勞動．也就是就業這個部分去協助每一個少年在偏差行為．就是我們在兒權公寓的國際專家．也就是我們的國家報告．要求司法院要廢除愚犯"},{"start":2772.803,"end":2793.985,"text":"目前我們其實在輔導先行上路已經超過半年這部分我們其實跟內政部也一直持續的在針對少輔會型的輔導先行的一個實施的狀況來去做一個滾動式的一個檢討各地的也會由地方政府跟地方法院會做一個這樣一個定期的聯繫的會議司法院跟"},{"start":2794.986,"end":2808.853,"text":"行政院就由剛剛部長說的我們跟行政院在林政委的一個就是主政之下會跟司法院對這個部分也都會有定期的檢討機制那第二類是少年的觸法行為比如少年竊盜"},{"start":2810.374,"end":2811.595,"text":"．3月18日及21日三天一次會議"},{"start":2830.528,"end":2852.503,"text":"也就是說少年法院在校園暴力的這一題依照我們目前的機關效能的分責處理就是由剛剛潘部長提到的上次86條第4項有規範一個偏差行為的預防跟輔導辦法那這裡面其實有一部分是由少府會或者是由教育部的學生輔導法去進行這個三級的輔導"},{"start":2855.965,"end":2871.112,"text":"有剛剛我提到的曝險行為跟觸法行為才會由這個少年法院來去做一個主責這大概是一個前提性的說明那第二點要做一個報告的是因為今天的時間有限那其他的詳細內容降入我們的書面報告"},{"start":2872.132,"end":2887.33,"text":"第二個部分要讓大家知道就是少年法院我們的一個know-how就是這個案子移送到法院之後法院設置有少年調查官其實就是像我們今天有到場的溫逸賢的調保官他其實會進行法官會請他提出一個調查報告"},{"start":2892.876,"end":2917.179,"text":"那會去做家庭訪視、瞭解家庭功能再來就是會進行學校的一個受教育的情形還有其中更重要的是這個少年有沒有一些人格或者是一些教育需要特別協助的部分那就會去展開跟學校之間的這個溝通或者是保護系統的這個一個相關的聯繫那就可以用到剛剛部長有提到的少數法42條的五項"},{"start":2918.98,"end":2920.862,"text":"若做成保護處分後,在執行階段也會召開資源聯繫會議,適時調整18歲以下的學生各項協助及輔導"},{"start":2935.999,"end":2957.177,"text":"包括如果說這個少年飛行跟父母的一個疏忽教養是有關聯性的那少子法有一個去補充兒權法的一個就是由保護系統裁定的強制性親子教育那少子法有一個司法型的強制性親子教育那這也是這段時間以來各界一直很關心的"},{"start":2958.258,"end":2975.393,"text":"我把最後一點時間來提到我們在報告的第5頁以下對於教育機關的輔導機制也就是教育端有學生輔導法但是一旦少年法院介入之後大概我們就會請各行政機關包含警政"},{"start":2975.953,"end":2995.481,"text":"教育還有衛政還有我們的保護系統能夠去在司法的這個整合資源之下能夠配合來去協商出依照我們調查官評估出來的少年的虛保性也就是這個成長中的孩子他各個面向是需要國家怎麼樣來協助他的一個就學的這個需要"},{"start":2996.381,"end":3016.428,"text":"除了透過這個部分的資源聯繫會議之後．剛剛其實部長有提到．如果在符合學生的一個適性教育之下．可以採取中介教育措施．現在教育部因應這個校園安全的需要．也在拓展多元跟漸進式的中介教育措施．只要這個少年符合．"},{"start":3017.028,"end":3037.269,"text":"每一個這個就是我們法院的評估大概都可以去進入這樣的一個就是評估的當中那這個部分也要請各位能夠去做一個瞭解那等一下如果針對塗銷的部分那有委員全群我們再進一步目前SARS把修正我們是朝向就是要去增加少年的前案資料塗銷的條件"},{"start":3038.71,"end":3066.236,"text":"那舉例來說如果他受刑的宣告執行完畢三年內必須是他沒有再有處罰那其實才能夠去塗銷他的請安紀錄以上請各位能夠這個就是明白謝謝好非常謝謝謝謝廷長等一下我們要去委員有任何的需要詢問的話再請您做詳細的說明那我們現在場內有已經有三位委員到了所以我們是不是先確定一下上次會議議事錄有沒有錯誤或是遺漏之處"},{"start":3067.156,"end":3075.293,"text":"如果沒有的話那我們就議事錄確定等等我們現在還是要再請一下我們矯正法務部的矯正署的周署長來進行一下報告謝謝"},{"start":3085.939,"end":3110.437,"text":"主席、各位委員、各位先進大家好我是法務部矯正署署長周慧芳本部的專題緊究觸法少年跟暴嫌少年的相關法律規定的處置以及在所及在校學生的輔導、少年的輔導機制的部分來做一個報告"},{"start":3111.238,"end":3130.774,"text":"那因為我們前半段的部分．有關處法復選少年的法令規定的處置．是由我們法務部的主任檢察官來做報告．後面的輔導機制就由本人來做報告．那讓我們朱檢察官來做報告．謝謝"},{"start":3137.606,"end":3163.734,"text":"張偉,各位委員以及與會先進大家好那緊就校園暴力事件以及前科紀錄是否塗銷部分進行報告那依照少事法的規定,少年事件分為曝險事件以及處罰事件那曝險事件的部分呢,執法人員只有曝險事件的時候就要通知少福會來做處理那執法人員只有處罰事件的時候就要移送到少年法院來做一個辦理"},{"start":3165.855,"end":3181.726,"text":"司法警察機關在移送出法事件至少年法院之前．可以依照《少事法》規定．或準用《刑事訴訟法》規定．以及準用《通保法》規定來進行相關調查．依照去年剛通過的《少事法》第18-7條的立法說明．"},{"start":3185.048,"end":3202.093,"text":"警察官在辦理這個相關的刑事調查案件的時候刑事偵查案件的時候如果只有少年處罰事件就應該要立刻移送到少年法院那不能夠針對這個少年再進行偵查那少年法院取得這樣子案件了以後他經過相關的調查"},{"start":3203.713,"end":3231.829,"text":"可以依《校事法》第27條的相關規定將這個案件再移送回地檢署那地檢署檢察官在這時候受理了就必須進行偵查然後並照偵查的結果來做一個起訴或不起訴處分那另外就是少年處罰事件的被害人呢如果有死亡或受重傷的情況的話可以依《犯保法》的規定來申請補償金那我們的犯保協會及在地分會也會提供相關的保護措施"},{"start":3232.469,"end":3258.043,"text":"那如果少年處罰事件的被害人他沒有死亡也沒有受重傷當然依奉保法的相關規定也可以獲得相關的保護措施那本部在去年少事法通過然後施行以後我們有做一些相關的教育訓練來提升檢警對少事法的認識那我們的奉保協會及在地分會也隨時在接獲通知之後都可以即時啟動保護機制提供保護服務"},{"start":3260.024,"end":3264.225,"text":"前科紀錄是否塗銷、是否廢除或修正這事涉上年保護政策是屬於司法院主管事項本部尊重司法院權責"},{"start":3285.977,"end":3314.494,"text":"謝謝我們的朱主任檢察官所以我們的署長還要額外再做一些補充後續的說明就對了是,是,謝謝主席我們少年矯正學校收容的是處罰的少年那在所的在校的輔導機制可以講在少年關護所的部分我們分別辦理鑑別、留置觀察還有收容保護還有所謂的羈押羈押是收容少年我們叫收容少年被告"},{"start":3315.334,"end":3333.021,"text":"那他在少關所只要是做的是少年鑑別工作比如說進行一些身心評估還有他的行為的觀察另外要落實他的基本生活教育就是說一些生活適應能力還有一些人際關係的互動學習經由團體生活來培養他們的一個人際關係的再加強"},{"start":3338.683,"end":3362.599,"text":"另外就是說要培養他的正確的社會生活的態度另外也會要辦理特殊教育資能以及實務的工作、演習的交流等等那在我們的矯正學校裡面來講我們會有所謂的三級輔導先有所謂的發展性的輔導這發展性輔導是針對全校的學生"},{"start":3363.799,"end":3381.665,"text":"如果說針對這個發展性輔導可能有些學生還是會有一些無法滿足他的個別需求或是適應欠佳重複發生問題的話或是有遭受比較重大創傷經驗的這些學生我們會依他的個別化需求來訂定相關方案"},{"start":3382.205,"end":3399.222,"text":"那經過這個所謂的進入性輔導．那有少數的學生他還是無法有效協助．我們會給他做一個特殊的心理治療．還有社會工作、生理治療等等以上是那包括出手轉嫌最後補充一下"},{"start":3400.484,"end":3418.963,"text":"進來我們少關所我們是三天內會通知社區的學校但是他出所的話我們會儘快所謂儘快是說我們會用電話或是傳真來跟社區的學校做聯繫那少角校的話是在他學生進來的時候"},{"start":3421.185,"end":3432.896,"text":"我們也是大概三個月之內會啟動相關的個別廚藝那他出校的話也是五天內我們會通知相關的人體學校來做銜接謝謝"},{"start":3435.543,"end":3443.933,"text":"好 我們謝謝周署長還有我們朱警察官的口頭報告我們現在進行詢答每位出席委員詢答的時間是8分鐘必要時間延長2分鐘列席委員質詢的時間為5分鐘那發言登記的截止時間是上午10點30分"},{"start":3453.644,"end":3474.338,"text":"如果委員有臨時提案的話就請在10點30分前提出並於本委員這個本委員會的委員范雲質詢結束之後我們就會進行處理處理提案的時候若提案委員還有聯署的委員都不在場的話我們原理不予處理我們是不是首先請發言登記第一位的萬美玲委員質詢謝謝"},{"start":3480.933,"end":3485.631,"text":"好 謝謝召委 我們有請潘文忠部長以及矯正署周輝煌署長"},{"start":3491.829,"end":3513.199,"text":"委員早部長早我想往年我們都知道7月是對於學生們的一個考記但現在看起來3月這個考記更嚴重那就是3月份現在幾乎都是私校大爆滿那這幾天幾乎是本席了解的臺北市、桃園市所有私立學校都在考試人數之多之可怕的不知道部長有沒有看到"},{"start":3514.359,"end":3530.829,"text":"這個整個私校的錄取率從少的大概10%左右多的大概到23%、24%真的是窄門中的窄門那為什麼大家通通要去考私校而且從過去到現在人數值增不減那錄取率只是一直在往下降"},{"start":3531.249,"end":3550.892,"text":"我想從過去對於這個公立體制家長的不信任以及108信課堂上來他們覺得的壓力那到了這個現在整個教育現場上很多的問題特別是在最近校安的問題我想這些在在都是造成私立學校考試大爆滿的一個原因所以因此今天本席就來討論"},{"start":3551.733,"end":3577.586,"text":"也是今天召委所排的主題關於我們的校安在去年12月25日也就是國中校園的割井案我想那一天震驚了所有不管教育界、全國人民的心我想都受傷了我相信部長也不好受但是我們今天來討論也就是說這個割井案的犯行人他其實是從少關所出來然後返回校園去了"},{"start":3579.367,"end":3593.536,"text":"其實這個案子發生以後到現在我相信教育部也好、各學校也好其實本系也跟很多教育界的人去討論過這樣的一個議題我們發現事實上在司法機關跟教育機關的橫向聯繫是非常薄弱的"},{"start":3594.677,"end":3594.937,"text":"委員會主席"},{"start":3615.566,"end":3615.646,"text":"5天的時間內"},{"start":3631.295,"end":3638.921,"text":"現在學校不管是校園的人力、輔導人力、行政人力其實都不足你突然間有這樣的一個個案回到學校來而這個通知只有五天的時間怎麼有辦法做好一個應對那當然部長"},{"start":3647.368,"end":3667.227,"text":"現在教育部也去思考怎麼樣去應對這個問題我們看到國教署提出了一個計畫說補助地方政府推動中介教育基地的建制計畫部長您在之前也有提到目前已經有設置了88個這樣的中介教育基地預計3月來啟動"},{"start":3669.369,"end":3669.469,"text":"88個有在協助相關"},{"start":3684.985,"end":3688.949,"text":"這些等於說有點像我們需要高關懷學生的團體但是我們評估討論之後有33個團體是具有過去接觸、協助、互顯少年的這個才是我們要合作的對象因為我也知道我們現在中途的階段有好幾個有學校的辭彙班、有高關懷班甚至有在跟社區有13個縣市的那種合作中途班"},{"start":3710.269,"end":3714.316,"text":"這些都還不是暴險少年我們現在要強化的是真正暴險少年所以這一次剛才跟委員報告這邊所談到的會在月底跟五月讓來做的就是要協調來建置這個針對暴險少年的中介基地"},{"start":3725.333,"end":3731.216,"text":"但是現在這樣聽起來我想我們都理解教育現場現在的狀況也就是說現階段這88個可能有很多過去已經在做在協助的這些團體但是恐怕那個強度是不夠的所以我們現在這88個是過去既有的團體我們在做這樣子的一個協助但角色上面"},{"start":3744.744,"end":3762.139,"text":"至於現在我們校安這個有很多我們沒有辦法想像到的狀況而且是嚴重的狀況所以現在我們要來補助各地方政府來做中介教育基地那本席也知道之前你們也找了這個直轄市的這個教育局那我不知道縣市有沒有"},{"start":3762.679,"end":3770.68,"text":"有大家一起來討論那現在呢當天在討論的時候其實並沒有壓時間但現在本席看到了書裡面意思講說3月中就是3月我們現在這個計畫出來嘛那我們要開始這個發布怎麼去補助但5月就要地方政府去完成那現在地方政府都在跟我講說各教育局說3月現在出來那天討論完以後啊只有一些初估的計畫那經費怎麼補助怎麼做那到底這個強度要做到多強"},{"start":3791.624,"end":3806.312,"text":"那通通沒有那現在5月就要成立了你這個是喔你們喊一個口號跟政策出來雖然利益良善但你通通丟給這個地方政府他哪有辦法這樣去執行這是第一件事第二個喔還有一件事你們可能忽略了喔那也就是說"},{"start":3806.792,"end":3821.478,"text":"今天呢 少關所裡面的少年到底出來以後有多少是要到哪一個縣市去到哪一個學校去你們現在 你們應該說都沒有一個跟司法單位很好的一個銜接這個量沒有 請問一下 這個標案怎麼標"},{"start":3822.679,"end":3836.283,"text":"我今天是要標少關所出來是一個學生十個學生還是二十個學生沒有所以現在呢你們那天開完會以後到現在各地教育局可以說不要說他們沒有開始啦不知道怎麼開始所以這是第二個問題喔那麼第三個問題喔部長請教喔也就是說剛才其實我們有聽到啊校政署啦或者是我們蔣下官都有提喔"},{"start":3846.266,"end":3871.581,"text":"我們在這個少關所也好矯正學校也好我相信都有它一定的功能在可是看起來這個功能對於少關所的孩子出來以後我們要返回學校中間的銜接它還是產生問題了嘛那所以我們才想說要做這個中介教育基地但是這個基地跟我們在矯正學校跟在少關所裡面的功能怎麼區分又我們當這些孩子回到這個校園以後"},{"start":3873.362,"end":3893.772,"text":"中介基地以後什麼時候才可以離開什麼時候才能夠進去看起來那天開會都沒有這些細節部長請說明你真的了解好深入我跟你們報告一下第一個擴充中介基地這件事情教育部、國教署已經跟縣市開過三次的會議其實討論到很細很多縣市也很急因為都知道"},{"start":3894.272,"end":3894.612,"text":"委員提到很關鍵也是學校最擔心的"},{"start":3919.994,"end":3945.808,"text":"這個孩子在少保官或少教官進行調查或要做裁決的時候一定要讓尤其說有傷害他人生命跟身體之餘的這樣的特定對象要讓學校充分參與所以這個才是在源頭裡面我們能夠評估比較更客觀的來看可以做怎麼樣的安置才不會說貿然弄到學校去可能會造成其他學生、同學、師生的"},{"start":3947.949,"end":3973.802,"text":"這是在這一次在跨院的會議裡面我覺得是一個非常重要的突破也反映了學校他們最擔心的事情這個目前也確定我跟委員報告這次我也很謝謝司法院他們在事辦有一個高風險保護對象的這些事辦計畫其實這裡面很多的概念就是委員關心的他到底應該分級分類而且不是說裁決啦後面"},{"start":3974.562,"end":3980.504,"text":"也要再持續關心因為這些孩子的行為要一點時間那剛剛北下一個問題最重要的問題就是現在這個中介基地我們要招標嘛要一個標案出去嘛不管是給哪一個團體那量能我們到底要用多大量能去招標那我想這個署長在這裡那剛剛特別提到出關所的地方其實我一直在想"},{"start":3997.771,"end":4011.576,"text":"就是司法單位跟教育單位到底你們的銜接是不是應該要再縝密一點那麼從少關所出來的孩子到了教育的這個領域回到學校我們怎樣才接得住他現在看起來有接不住的狀況那所以"},{"start":4013.637,"end":4033.203,"text":"我覺得少關所這些保護官或調查官也好有時候有自己的想法過去我們還希望不要把這些孩子標圈化或他的個資、隱私等等怎麼樣在顧及的情況之下來到你所謂的中介教育基地那這個量能怎麼做現在標案各縣市教育局怎麼標"},{"start":4034.143,"end":4042.067,"text":"我跟委員報告因為這個是我們要他成立基地的原因不是說你已經設定好他一定會有多少人但是如果你不做好這個準備當我們開始進行剛才委員提到的當少調官開始進行我們最後才覺得說這個孩子的"},{"start":4049.331,"end":4058.654,"text":"行為樣態適合到社區的中介基地你不能不做準備所以現在目前在做的是這件事那委員那個司法院的那個事辦計畫其實裡面非常重要的剛才委員提到出去到底適不適合進到學校這個裡頭是有我們這樣的一個計畫裡面它其實裡面有談到這裡頭會有相關的社工人員或心理心腹的輔助員"},{"start":4074.178,"end":4074.458,"text":"520到了以後呢你就要把這個"},{"start":4104.145,"end":4104.826,"text":"五二零五中分"},{"start":4118.766,"end":4128.893,"text":"學校裡面 國小、國中或高中各級學校的暴力事件跟偏差行為通報案件數我看了真的覺得好難過從111年到112年我們看到國小從過去的4828件竟然暴增到9370件成長了將近兩倍那麼所有學校加起來111年是16264件112年也成長到26171件"},{"start":4145.725,"end":4146.245,"text":"好,這順便有提到,我們再詳細的再跟委員說"},{"start":4170.66,"end":4183.133,"text":"好,謝謝部長,謝謝署長,謝謝萬委員接下來我們請登記第二號的陳培宇委員,謝謝好,謝謝主席,那有請部長好,部長"},{"start":4186.836,"end":4203.349,"text":"委員早部長早前兩天不知道部長晚上有沒有看到一個新聞就是一個社工被上手銬這件事情我不知道部長過去您的工作經驗當中有沒有認識很多像社工這樣子的第一線的基層的工作人員但是那一天晚上我收到非常多社工朋友的電話"},{"start":4204.17,"end":4232.831,"text":"甚至還有在耳保社工背後的心理師兩三個心理師打電話給我說他們不知道接下來這個禮拜要怎麼面對這些第一線的耳保社工那於是呢我們可以看到東海社工系就發了一封信給系上的同學當然也是給未來可能想要念社工的同學因為孩子們的學測剛考完準備開始填志願部長您身為教育部長你要不要對這些孩子這些同學或是在第一線的社工給予一些信心的承諾或者是喊話"},{"start":4234.072,"end":4251.34,"text":"謝謝委員我想這個就是因為保姆戀童的事件這個整個社會大家都很心痛也很震驚那確實為那則新聞畫面我有看到在第一時間確實會有很也很震撼因為我所了解我們的社工"},{"start":4251.86,"end":4267.747,"text":"同仁不只在學校,其實在地方服務也接觸很多社工的夥伴其實真的都是衝第一線的在面對學校學生甚至有部分是家庭有情形的時候其實他們真的是承擔非常多的"},{"start":4268.207,"end":4291.555,"text":"應該是說這些兒保社工其實尤其幫忙承擔了教育部在照顧的國小學生、國中學生、高中學生他們的原生家庭或是社區環境失去功能的時候其實是這些兒保社工幫我們教育部在社區接住了這些孩子所以我才要在這裡要拜託部長給予目前或者是未來想要繼續從事社工或是想要在這個領域發揮自己的專業"},{"start":4293.555,"end":4317.26,"text":"發會自己的這個專長的時候我覺得我們要作為他們的職程所以後續這件事情我們也會協助相關的系所在跟教育部持續保持討論那當然後來衛福部又提到了關於這個兒童專責醫生的部分那我相信也相關的醫學院我想部長你也知道兒童已經是很缺的醫生的科目了對不對我相信教育部在相關的事情上都必須要有所態度跟有所表示對嗎"},{"start":4318.36,"end":4320.602,"text":"因為醫學系出來很多學生的志願選填確實所看到兒科的部分在醫院都有反應有不足的情形那教育部也跟衛福部也在這方面有提出一些因應尤其是衛福部這邊有一些激勵的因素"},{"start":4340.594,"end":4346.518,"text":"教育部及衛福部必須在這件事上加強對話新北割喉案在3月21日裁定部長您覺得孩子們不管之後的判定到底是要送到矯正學校、少關或相關保護管束的機制學校準備好了嗎?"},{"start":4364.248,"end":4364.408,"text":"面對這些處罰少年"},{"start":4387.453,"end":4395.035,"text":"反省或有一些偏差的行為暴嫌的少年是否適合直接進回學校或應該安置其實在這一次裡面是一個非常強調的重點應該是說過往我們只要看到有類似的新聞事件確實教育部會聯同其他的跨部會趕快提出所謂正面因應的資源跟策略但是我覺得我們都在教育現場待過我今天必須要殘忍地問部長一個問題"},{"start":4412.981,"end":4430.403,"text":"其實我們都準備好了我們看似我們都準備好了但是我們必須要承認在第一線的現場有非常多不利於學生回歸校園的因素我想部長你心裡應該非常明白跟清楚我們到底要如何排除這些因素我們除了正面做非常多的支持跟資源之外"},{"start":4430.703,"end":4446.596,"text":"但是面對這些校園裡面騎士的氣氛同儕啊或是社會的氣氛還有老師如何看待學生老師是不是真的覺得教育部有跟他們站在一起準備迎接這樣子孩子的回到校園我覺得這件事情應該沒有辦法在今天討論完但是我務必要從第一線的教學經驗"},{"start":4447.817,"end":4467.612,"text":"提醒部長也要拜託教育部在協同跨部會在討論這件事情的時候我覺得我們不能再逃避面對的是不利於學生回歸校園的因素我覺得這是非常沉重的提問那我想今天就不再多問但是要拜託教育部積極面對這件事情我必須要再一次強調這是殘酷的現實但如果不去面對這個現實我們很難想像學校老師會如何看待後續這些孩子們回到校園"},{"start":4473.777,"end":4481.342,"text":"或是教育部給這些正面的資源跟政策．是不是真的可以落實到第一線老師的家長跟學生．都同時有覺得受到照顧?以上我跟委員報告．確實這次在討論的情形．不只是剛才跟委員會委員們報告．我們跟跨院．包含司法院的這些未來合作跟機制．司法院也會再有這樣的事辦計畫去擴大"},{"start":4496.932,"end":4501.575,"text":"有關真的跟這些暴險少年非常需要的人力跟他的專業這個我想在上緣上面真的會做比較更適切的討論跟判斷那在學校端這一部分我想我們除了增加必要的人力之外其實我們還不斷的去強化因為這樣的孩子不是每個都是一定造成那種傷害有些孩子可能是對"},{"start":4521.966,"end":4529.491,"text":"他的樣態行為也不是說完完全全一定要隔離以校園所以我們在中途的過程當中其實是有幾個不同的那這邊我就往下再跟部長討論但是我再次要強調這個問題非常重要那於是我們往下來看教育部其實在相關的校園暴、校安事件統計當中資料我們看到非常多其中我們發現在不同的學制不同的事件相關的統計其實教育部在相關的報告裡面都有"},{"start":4547.182,"end":4547.483,"text":"教育部的結論"},{"start":4563.283,"end":4579.609,"text":"縱觀本項暴力跟偏差事件資料分析發現．高級中等學校的暴力事件．跟偏差行為通報發生率仍然是最高依序是國小跟國中．那教育部自己都說了．應該持續探討事件發生的原因跟防制之道．"},{"start":4579.989,"end":4602.454,"text":"也就是說我們在整份報告裡面只有看到這麼一段話是教育部自己知道相關的因應跟防制措施所以我們也希望在今天所有的業務報告當中我們除了看到後續很多所謂捕破網的動作之外到底積極如何防範少安事件再度一再一再一再的發生我相信具體的策略不管是做持續探討的研究或者是後續專家學者的討論把孩子們的第一線的現場狀況反映出來就如同我剛剛說的那個問題非常重要"},{"start":4609.895,"end":4639.615,"text":"那往後我要跟部長談另外一個事情其實這裡是很多第一線的老師甚至是這個矯正學校的校長跟我們分析的我們來看相關的研究報告說在少年犯的非語文測驗跟一般少年沒有顯著差異可是少年犯的語文理解能力卻比一般少年來的低也就是他們在抽象推理思考上可能是因為原生家庭環境的文化資源累積能力不足導致於孩子去到學校之後對於抽象推理思考能力表現比較不好再往下看第二個"},{"start":4640.175,"end":4668.778,"text":"那部長你一定知道在學校第一線的現場因為學術成績的不佳可能導致某些老師或是同學會在這些孩子身上貼標籤於是孩子可能就走得越來越遠離這個所謂主流學術學習越來越遠於是我們就看到犯罪跟偏差行為可能就會開始出現高峰是15到16歲往上到23歲但是我們看到第一線很多老師告訴我們當五六年級所謂學術科目開始變難的時候很多孩子就開始表現出偏差行為"},{"start":4669.538,"end":4680.145,"text":"實際上大部分是來自家庭資源的不足他們甚且認為到了後期不管是從司法端、法務部或是矯正學校看到這些孩子其實都有特教的"},{"start":4681.417,"end":4681.597,"text":"．3月18日及21日"},{"start":4700.987,"end":4717.375,"text":"所以我這裡用一個隱性特教的部分就是拜託教育部是不是後續我們要積極的規劃跟去理解目前所謂這些偏差行為的少年他們是不是有沒有被看見的特教特質在身上導致於他們在學習上有困難他們在表現主流學習的科目上也有困難"},{"start":4717.915,"end":4735.229,"text":"於是他們就不得不往另外一個可能可以接受他們所謂黑幫的文化去那我相信這個部分部長跟署長你們都來自第一線教育基層一定可以明白我說這個部分所以這個隱形特教部分是不是可以請部長簡單回應一下是 我跟我們報告謝謝委員我想在學習表現這個確實會去影響孩子成就感"},{"start":4738.812,"end":4760.33,"text":"還有他對這整個學校文化的歸屬感和認同所以校園部所提的那個學習輔助計畫其實現在已經都是在從月小年紀就開始也比較希望能夠在這上面不要讓孩子在最基礎的學習上就開始產生委員所說的一直在隱藏著他未來發展的限制這是第一點跟委員報告這也是一個我認為很必要的雖然你們這麼狂說"},{"start":4762.432,"end":4768.793,"text":"這次委員知道在特教法這次的修還有我們所要提供更多特教的資源上面為什麼希望能夠更好的去關照包括進級也有部分特教的孩子因為情緒失控去打老師等等的這些現象"},{"start":4788.578,"end":4788.918,"text":"我們就先不要再講特交助理"},{"start":4803.643,"end":4823.15,"text":"我想在後續特教的很多相關執法跟實施辦法當中我們辦公室會積極再跟教育部討論如何幫助這群所謂隱形特教的孩子就是他的家長看不出來老師在繁忙的教學工作當中也看不出來可能就只有看到孩子外在的行為偏差這個部分也要拜託教育部持續跟我們一起關注不好意思再給我最後一點點時間"},{"start":4824.15,"end":4841.19,"text":"就是關於這個中介剛剛那個萬美玲委員已經問了可是我們想要問這個中介基地目前我們看到最大的困境就是相關的服務量能相關的專業人員是不是都可以入法把相關這些該配置的東西都配置進去再來呢這個中介教育其實有現場的老師告訴我們另外一個困境"},{"start":4841.71,"end":4870.186,"text":"中介教育在聯繫會議一決實施之後相關控管的機制要如何建立跟運作剛冠美林委員問了類似的問題還有就是目前校官所出到學校端都只有說得召開相關會議但是第一線老師告訴我們必要的時候必須要召開聯繫會議是必要喔必須而不是得召開聯繫會議那我相信現場的困境部長跟署長您一定知道這邊我們就做一個快速的提醒我們之後會再跟教育部持續的討論我跟委員報告"},{"start":4870.926,"end":4898.32,"text":"為什麼這次不是只有教育體系、學校體系在協助為什麼能夠跟司法院有做這個連結那個少保官、少調官其實在這個案子裁決後安置的連結後面其實他們應該如果從司法院的報告那是一個非常重要一道還有強制的這個後續我們會再跟部長討論這個是關鍵這個如果不連結像司法院所提有這些高風險的個案不可能由學校單一處理單獨承受"},{"start":4900.441,"end":4925.276,"text":"好那最後一個就是關於學輔法的部分我想要跟部長討論一下目前矯正學校的孩子他們是不適用學校輔導法這個部分我覺得後續我們應該會有很多時間跟機會必須要談論他們畢竟還是未成年的學生雖然他們在法務司法院的系統當中但是其實第一線老師跟校長主任告訴我們這些孩子不能被排除在學輔法以外我相信這是我們大人要繼續努力的事情好嗎部長好謝謝部長謝謝署長謝謝主席"},{"start":4928.603,"end":4937.688,"text":"好,謝謝陳培宇委員,請部長回座那我們下一位請柯智恩委員、柯昭偉質詢謝謝主席,我是不是可以請教育部的潘部長、司法院的家事廳的廳長、法務部的代表還有內政部的警察、刑事警察局的副局長請各位,好不好?"},{"start":4958.622,"end":4965.071,"text":"請教育部潘部長、司法院謝廷長、法務部矯正署的周署長、刑事局林副局長"},{"start":4968.183,"end":4995.385,"text":"好,非常謝謝各位為什麼請這麼多人過來我想我們大多非常關切我們所謂的校園的安全我覺得今天真是一個Blue Monday為什麼八樓在討論受虐兒然後我們在一樓在討論校園暴力的事件一個孩子在我們台灣的社會要讓他安全的成長是牽動非常多人的心思那我一直認為今日的少年犯如果我們不好好的處理的話明日就會變成成年犯"},{"start":4995.885,"end":5014.416,"text":"所以我們如果剛剛大家一直不斷在討論漏接不希望發生事情來漏接我們就先來討論一下如何來對接還有誰該要來承接我們先來看一下下面一個數據我們想這個部分裏面我們一年受理保護管束的人大概有1萬多這是一個數據顯示那是2020年統計受理14316人但是只有5330人是交付保護管束"},{"start":5024.722,"end":5048.706,"text":"大概只有占37%．而且我們依照我們剛剛一直不斷提到的．少府會的工作報告．說實在的．在2023年7月到11月．少府會只收到541案．而且開案輔導只有302案．保護的這麼多．然後受理的這麼多．然後再加上你們所承接的．我想請問各位．這些孩子到哪裡接受保護管束．"},{"start":5050.134,"end":5063.891,"text":"然後呢去到哪裡去有很多社工還有我簡單的問一句各位你們彼此這些單位來自不同的單位你們彼此熟嗎你們彼此有對接嗎這才是我要的問題好不好請各位很快時間告訴我一下"},{"start":5065.564,"end":5080.92,"text":"跟委員報告因為教育部是學校這個體系確實我們在跟警政單位、衛福單位在過往在這一方面是比較有定期長期的這樣的一個會議而且包含我們說涉及毒品濫用跟警政單位之間"},{"start":5081.5,"end":5092.57,"text":"委員長沒有問題你可以有很多的說法我剛剛聽了很多你們的報告每個都覺得自己好像給孩子在發生事情的時候做了很多的妥善的處理我們就直接問我們刑事局的副局長好了我們目前來說我們修了這個少年事件的處理法我們成立了少府會"},{"start":5099.075,"end":5104.779,"text":"欸 少府會沒人沒錢沒資源位階又很低有些縣市的少府會根本就跑到警察局的少年隊千萬欸 你們少年隊這麼神嗎處理這麼多事你有沒有看到那個法規裡面這麼多的事情我想請問一下有些地方請問一下警政署你們的少年隊有沒有辦法承接這些事"},{"start":5121.033,"end":5136.601,"text":"謝謝委員的關心和提問有關於少婦會的部分目前它從110年代我知道我說你們我現在只問少婦會要承接這麼多的事情有些縣市單位根本沒有成立把它直接丟到你們的警政署下面的一個少年隊有沒有這種事有嗎"},{"start":5137.921,"end":5154.193,"text":"稍微目前我們人力除了運用社安網的人力來增加以及各縣市政府我們從114年到現在已經增加260名的一個成功當然我們希望繼續我現在就是說孩子越生越少少年犯是越來越多就是我們所謂的問題我剛剛只問到了我們不要漏接但是對接的問題在哪裡你看連我們在八樓被我們"},{"start":5160.798,"end":5167.561,"text":"被我們叫質詢的衛福部都可以提出來他說稍委會的專案對接是有落差的案量非常的低而且很多的縣市根本不願意提供這個偏差行為的個案輔導還有很多縣市根本拒絕這個接受這個所謂先超輔導的這個個案有沒有這種事情那有這種事情的話司法院該怎麼樣來處理你成立這麼多委員會卻沒有辦法對接這要怎麼來處理"},{"start":5186.898,"end":5207.13,"text":"報告委員,據我所知,我們目前地方的縣市的少府會並沒有拒絕相關的一個輔導工作在增加的年齡上,我們目前是應該可以承接有關少年法院或是少年公務所他們的...你們沒有拒接,你們卻把這東西可能丟到別的地方去然後我只問嘛,剛剛我們少府會所要承接的這麼多的狀況,你們有能力嗎?你們少年隊就是抓警、抓小偷、抓嫌疑犯還有時間來處理這些心理諮商、輔導、社工"},{"start":5216.576,"end":5216.776,"text":"3月18日、20日及21日三天一次會議"},{"start":5246.559,"end":5259.81,"text":"人力不足我現在發現每一次早上一出事都是說我們的這個缺的一個人力我們現在只要來看看但是呢法院的人力不足跟暴險少年回歸校園這是兩碼的事情我們先看下面一個數據對我個人來說彼此之間沒有對接才是讓這事件沒有會被漏接的最大的原因我們來看一看嘛這是根據你們的資料顯示"},{"start":5271.28,"end":5285.265,"text":"目前高風險的案件還有966件這是少年法庭告訴我們的我想請問部長你知道這966件的這些人有多少在學校嗎如果你們彼此熟彼此都可以互相來做對接你知道這些有多少在學校嗎"},{"start":5286.055,"end":5290.276,"text":"還有警政署也出來講一下話少年嫌疑犯已經有17900人然後呢比上一年還增加的12.94下面這個資料有這麼多的這些狀況當中你們彼此間沒有對接然後一發生事情你就告訴我說我們要立刻花多好時間最快時間回到學校我只請問真的只有回到學校嗎?真的只通知學校嗎?"},{"start":5314.921,"end":5323.308,"text":"這些人適合回學校嗎?所以證明裡面有太多的問題存在了很多人不適合學校的話這還只是966是高風險案還有非常多的黑數我剛特別提到了你看我都不想放這期的影片"},{"start":5330.373,"end":5333.856,"text":"如果你照剛剛這樣說法的話教育部的這個校園系統顯示剛剛把那個數據拿出來112年高中值以下的暴力事件跟偏差行為是27000比110年還多增了1萬多件多增了1萬多件你如果把它平均起來一天平均校園的暴力事件是73件部長你有沒有看到而且你如果看到3月5日這件事情的話"},{"start":5357.033,"end":5363.654,"text":"這個孩子被呼巴掌呼了20幾個然後呢其他的學生就這樣看著他我都已經不知道這樣的一個事件竟然可以讓學生看得大家都很漠然然後呢我不願意放的原因是因為我看了會傷心還有脫衣服毆打的這種霸凌的影片滿天飛部長你看到這些狀況你的心裡感覺到底是什麼樣我跟委員報告喔委員剛才談到這個112年跟111年的這也是過去我們一直在強調不要讓孩子在學校真的有受到"},{"start":5386.818,"end":5388.3,"text":"你現在是告訴我因為是鼓勵通報所以讓過去的黑數可以浮上來所以數字才這麼多"},{"start":5409.842,"end":5426.222,"text":"這個數字通報數之後才我們說那學校應該要進一步的確認甚至如果這個通報數像委員所提到的像這個案子我一定會去追不只是學校真的說確實就屬實的我一定要求國教署一定要跟地方政府不要讓學校這個事情就不了了之"},{"start":5427.563,"end":5431.487,"text":"還有一個非常簡單的一個問題就是我們隨便舉個例子來說好了習為偏差的處罰少年離開的少年關乎所或矯正學校我剛剛所提到的誰來承接你知道還想陪你長大聯盟的家長的訴求就是很多的處罰的少年一進到少關所1到3月"},{"start":5445.999,"end":5447.42,"text":"一年有五成的學生會有再犯刑事案件的這樣一個比例一年有五成"},{"start":5470.078,"end":5497.037,"text":"這些孩子出來然後呢我們教育部各單位只告訴他我會最快時間把他放回學校通知學校那我要問學校這麼多樣的一個狀況而且這些矯正的孩子我們後面我們需要給他輔導可是他的這個債分率這麼高甚至有一個矯正學校的這個心理諮商輔導師告訴我他有一個學生放出去之後兩三個月就自殺死掉因為他一出去又被追殺然後他自己又不想再犯案"},{"start":5497.617,"end":5502.88,"text":"他沒有選擇,他就跳水自殺。這種事情不是只有一件。怎麼辦?這怎麼辦?所以我一直強調,矯正基礎如果沒有做好的話,我們整個的問題都會非常的嚴重。這是一個很大的問題。接下來我就要問一下嘛,為什麼少年犯有私密要再換?還有呢,他們回到學校會是一個什麼樣的狀況?你看少關所,三個月之內就把你放出來。"},{"start":5521.869,"end":5538.003,"text":"那時候的戈景安的這個郭姓少年就是從少關所出來把他放到學校然後再把他轉校然後造成這麼悲劇的一個產生所以呢有沒有可能讓這些孩子在出少關所的時候給他更完整的一個評估有沒有辦法做到這一點他不見得要放回學校啊還沒有什麼其他的地方可以承接我們不要漏接但是我們你們又沒有對接我們誰來承接"},{"start":5550.029,"end":5563.889,"text":"報告委員．有關畫面上是郭姓少年．他在我們少關所是今年的3月近年沒有 那個 署長你不要再話說從前 從盤古開天沒時間了啦你只告訴我以後怎麼來承接"},{"start":5565.957,"end":5569.718,"text":"我最後好謝謝你我最後只問部長一個問題給我一分鐘部長因為是這個問題裡面因為發生太多的問題很多的家長我知道你們也就放寬了非常多我只問一件事情"},{"start":5586.224,"end":5593.032,"text":"如果你今天是部長你變成潘老師潘文忠老師好了如果A同學向潘老師檢舉B同學有彈簧刀的話我請問潘老師怎麼來做這個處理"},{"start":5600.248,"end":5619.173,"text":"這次從這個事件我們有做了很多的討論跟檢討也來自很多學校第一線的意見為什麼會對於有關在安全檢查上面有一個傷害對象的這種特定學生會進行安全檢查甚至這些部長我知道你解釋非常多我只問你潘老師你怎麼樣處理當A同學跟潘老師說有B同學有談環報的時候你怎麼處理"},{"start":5625.555,"end":5639.926,"text":"你的SOP是什麼這是所有全國的老師想要看的啊我剛剛委員報告說為什麼很密集的討論跟公佈的這個事項就是為了要處理這些相關的流程那你怎麼處理你如果是一個回歸到你過去的這個潘老師的話你怎麼來處理這個狀況這個學校本來就要有一個應變的小組作業當發生這個事情不要老是單打獨鬥也是危險啊你原來在進行這件事情的時候事實上還有一個跟如果這個"},{"start":5652.296,"end":5663.764,"text":"所以你們教育部有很多的法規需要我只要提醒部長因為我時間到了我要提醒部長目前為止老師發生事情為什麼老師都不太敢去介入處理因為老師現在處理的是一個模擬兩可的輔導的管教辦法"},{"start":5667.546,"end":5677.413,"text":"但是它萬一處理不當的話學生或教長可以用非常明確的刑法或是明法來告老師這就是目前我們老師的困境一個是模擬兩可 一個是明確你叫老師怎麼辦提到那個緊急的處置學校實際上一定要常態的做這方面的研練跟準備那不是說我在讀運氣這個是跟委員報告第二個是在這一次的注意事項其實對於老師阻卻違法的這個討論"},{"start":5695.145,"end":5698.307,"text":"所以剛剛光是我問潘老師這個問題潘部長你就會發現身為老師當他變成這個角色的時候其實他是處在一個非常危難的狀況如果剛剛被暴 逼同學暴 老師去查了沒有那到時候家長是不是又反過來告老師這就是一個目前"},{"start":5723.78,"end":5725.121,"text":"我只希望我只告訴你這是來自於基層的聲音我想我們會後續在這件事情上面會再做額外的一個做處理因為過去這段時間"},{"start":5749.136,"end":5750.517,"text":"接下來我們請登記質詢第4號的葛如君葛委員 謝謝"},{"start":5784.561,"end":5787.865,"text":"謝謝 主席 有請教育部潘部長麻白部長 謝謝"},{"start":5791.821,"end":5815.34,"text":"委員好謝謝部長這是我們今天第二次這一次第二次見面非常高興因為我們真的有非常多的議題要來跟您探討首先要感謝召委今天特別安排校園暴力處置的專題報告近來真的發生了很多的校園暴力的事件無論是學生或老師之間其實都會造成一些關係的緊張或者破裂需要我們投注更多的心力去預防"},{"start":5817.141,"end":5839.238,"text":"不知道部長知不知道去年Netflix上面熱播的韓劇《黑暗榮耀》探討的就是校園霸凌的議題上線短短三天在全球非英語影集的排行榜就攻佔第一名甚至到最後的統計6.2億的小時觀看人數到現在還是非英語的全球第一"},{"start":5839.858,"end":5867.577,"text":"在全球79個國家還擠進了前10名可見校園霸凌可以是一個全球性的議題除了這個劇情吸引人之外可能也勾起了很多人在求學階段的多少可能曾經受到霸凌的問題的回憶首先想要請教一下教育部的部長您認為在高中以下的求學階段有多少比例的學生曾經有過被霸凌的經驗"},{"start":5868.899,"end":5879.32,"text":"跟我們報告我想估計多少比例是比較不容易因為教育部本身就有我想部長應該還是要有一個概念到底是100個人裡面有一位還是十位"},{"start":5880.226,"end":5898.418,"text":"我跟委員報告為什麼剛才我們召委在提到那個數據從111到112教育部就是擔心孩子在學校受到霸凌或欺負甚至傷害而不敢講隱忍所以強力的鼓勵甚至有賦予學校有通報所以隱忍很危險所以我們來看一下"},{"start":5899.298,"end":5915.268,"text":"根據這個教育部的校安統計的資料112年的霸凌案件的通報件數是3050件確認的案件是285件以教育部112年度高中以下學生人數的統計國小120幾萬人"},{"start":5917.99,"end":5929.944,"text":"國中54萬人、高中60萬人所以高中以下的學習階段的人數大概是238萬人雖然說霸凌事件可能不只涉及一個學生但是以發生比例來看我們可以看到這個數字跟剛剛的這個所謂的2000多個"},{"start":5933.969,"end":5945.766,"text":"所謂的3050件然後確認案件只有285件這個在校園的霸凌裡頭的發生率或者所謂確認發生率竟然只有萬分之1.1像請問一下部長您認為這個數據合理嗎"},{"start":5949.612,"end":5958.703,"text":"我一直說怕孩子在這上面有一萬個人裡面只有一個人是確認霸凌的案件這個合理嗎?請問部長合理嗎?請問部長合不合理?"},{"start":5964.21,"end":5965.291,"text":"根據衛福部110年公布的《青少年健康行為調查報告》"},{"start":5984.851,"end":6006.042,"text":"國中學生在調查期間30天內被霸凌的比例是5.8%是我們剛剛看到的萬分之1.1的500倍高中職生被霸凌的比例是4.3%106年的科技部傳播調查資料庫的調查結果甚至指出四成以上的國小學生、三成以上的國中生"},{"start":6006.542,"end":6025.555,"text":"一成五的高中生表示自己曾經有被霸凌過的經驗這些其他指出的這些官方統計數據和你們教育部的校園霸凌統計資料相比可以說是天差地別我認為本席認為教育部不能只以通報系統為主"},{"start":6027.136,"end":6044.885,"text":"應該比照其他部會以主動調查的方式來積極了解校園霸凌的真實情況以避免校園霸凌案件一再產生黑數剛剛部長也提到了隱忍的狀態不只如此我們來看一下教育部近年的霸凌事件統計的資料這是你們提供的資料"},{"start":6046.69,"end":6051.711,"text":"我們可以看到從109年開始校園暴力事件的通報件數一路上升從109年的1026件暴增到112年的3050件征服高達3倍但是暴力案件的確認率請看右邊黃色的部分卻一路下滑從109年的23%下降到112年的9%"},{"start":6071.835,"end":6077.677,"text":"看起來我好像校園暴力事件變少了但實際上是什麼?被確認的比率變少了那這些人變成他通報了以後結果沒有被確認他們結局到底是怎麼樣呢?請問部長您認為這是校園暴力事件的誤報率增加還是確認機制出現了問題需要調整?"},{"start":6091.441,"end":6112.285,"text":"我跟委員報告因為現在教育部的通報所涵蓋的面相跟類型其實是有做更多細項從過去的70幾件到現在已經增加到100多項就是希望更了解細的我要跟委員報告霸凌如果從國際的來講它有它的定義但孩子感受到的未必是到底是不是霸凌"},{"start":6112.645,"end":6114.006,"text":"所以我們要科學的定律來感受孩子們的心理感受嗎我想我們現在要有同理心"},{"start":6129.599,"end":6144.292,"text":"我們不要用這些規則、規範或科學用在這種地方無論是哪種情況,我們認為都表示現行的校園暴力的處理機制出現Bug,我們都希望都沒有Bug也在教育部裡面發生必須盡速的修正,更令人憂心"},{"start":6145.453,"end":6166.699,"text":"在現行的校園暴力事件的處理上面當學校因為因應小組不受理案件假設檢舉人未提出身負或身負再次被否決則案件進行結案這是你們的流程喔也就是我如果通報了剛剛的那3000多件只有9%被定案那麼91%的直接就去結案了"},{"start":6167.259,"end":6185.755,"text":"我們到底有沒有追蹤想請問部長這些小心翼翼、膽戰心驚、深夜睡不著覺挺身而出的檢舉人在案件被結案以後要如何在原本的校園裡頭環境自處他們後來有沒有辦法順利從原班級原學校畢業我們到底有沒有追查"},{"start":6186.377,"end":6191.26,"text":"我跟委員報告每一個通報的案件一定都會列觀這個是我要先講的包括還沒確認的嗎我跟委員報告後續啦因為過去確實也有談到說學校在處理這些事情的客觀性所以在我們現在新調整"},{"start":6202.566,"end":6205.128,"text":"請部長以同理心設想假設每個通報案件的背後都有受到傷害或者不願意人眼旁觀的學生在這些小組裁定以後結案以後我們認為應該要做後續處理"},{"start":6226.363,"end":6246.268,"text":"部長,我認為教育部有需要重新檢討處理流程．加強截然後對檢舉人身心狀況關懷追蹤的必要性希望請您將檢討報告．或者新修改的規範於一個月內提出給本席委員,這一部分我們正在做最後的總整理太好了,謝謝真的要拜託你們一定要非常非常的關照同學們的心理鼓勵、通報是我們的態度"},{"start":6250.209,"end":6267.9,"text":"但是確認率還是要提高喔那助力的過程為什麼會說在這次霸凌的準則裡面會去做修正就是要回應我們關心的我們認為同學的心理也很重要我們不要拿這些準則來壓這些學生那就是希望了解真相跟助力我想後面還有很多重要的訊息"},{"start":6268.8,"end":6288.852,"text":"目前新世代身處社群的文化．大量的新的工具根據教育部提供的統計資料近年來學生主要的霸凌形態正在由傳統的肢體暴力轉變為透過言語關係或者網路的新形態霸凌以往的校園霸凌事件是比較容易確認的"},{"start":6289.753,"end":6290.474,"text":"4年的平均確認率只有13%"},{"start":6309.794,"end":6324.669,"text":"其他的肢體暴力的確認力都相對的比較高我要提醒部長新興科技、先進科技正在被誤用可能成為新的網路霸凌工具近日美國就發生一起網路霸凌事件不知道部長有沒有關注到有學生在網路上惡意的散佈AI生成的偽造的照片"},{"start":6331.115,"end":6357.476,"text":"把同學的臉拼接上裸體散佈這些偽造的影像在美國校方決定嚴懲把五名涉案的加害學生予以退學這樣的事件其實現在正在指數形態在全世界各地發生包含美國、加拿大、西班牙、巴西都出現深偽技術Deepfake的有關網路霸凌我們甚至認為這個都在那些沒有被確認的黑數當中因為我們的政府好像對於Deepfake的驗證"},{"start":6358.457,"end":6376.94,"text":"時間都拉了很長能力不一定很強想請教部長目前我們是不是應該提升加強深層式AI或者deepfake相關的一些教育教學或者理解讓他們知道這些內容很可能都是假的考量到兒童的心智發展跟數位素養"},{"start":6377.481,"end":6405,"text":"我們是不是應該要比照聯合國教科文的組織．針對高中以下的學校．訂定深層式人工智慧．或者Deepfake的危險性的使用指南．並且提出深層式AI的建議使用年齡是,謝謝委員這個指教．確實在網路上的霸凌的現象．比我們在學校實體．確實挑戰更大那這方面．也藉由目前我們．所進行的這些數位進進方案當中．尤其特別對於老師的增能．就是剛才委員所指教的"},{"start":6406.862,"end":6430.16,"text":"我們真的要提醒部長目前國教署提供的資料關於DeFake的討論教材就深度偽造、深偽技術只在高中階段也就是只有16到18歲所以16歲以下的學生對於這樣的危險性可能完全是不知道的希望能夠請教育部來研議我認為閉合不談不是最好的教育方式"},{"start":6430.66,"end":6436.262,"text":"希望教育部來研議針對國中至國小的階段給予適當的教材與預防身為技術遭到誤用甚至成為霸凌的新方法希望能夠將研議結果在一個月內提供給本席可以嗎這個跟委員報告整個資訊教育素養還有這部分是由教育部的資科師在整個統籌所以剛才委員所提的我想跟我們目前要努力可以提出我想一個月內我們把我們現在目前進行的情形跟委員"},{"start":6457.51,"end":6475.058,"text":"最後提醒部長暴力事件真的不是只在戲劇當中一定要一起來加速對現行校園暴力機制的處理方法接下來可能會有很多新的方式出現我們要一起來保護檢舉人、受害人為最高原則結案不代表暴力事件的結束"},{"start":6475.758,"end":6501.744,"text":"很可能是新的霸凌事件的開端我們要持續追蹤關懷另外世界上的其他國家已經出現新興的霸凌工具或霸凌的形態教育部應該要加速了解並且提出預防措施他山之石可以工作教育部一定要儘速的調整現行校園霸凌的處理機制並提供校園端必要的外部資源以因應新形態的會越來越可怕的校園霸凌事件的方法我們非常認同委員的提醒謝謝部長"},{"start":6506.392,"end":6518.201,"text":"謝謝我先預告一下我們本委會在第7號就是這個郭育晴委員質詢完畢之後我們會休息5分鐘好我們先休息5分鐘那接下來我們先請登記5號的葉元智委員麻煩請教育部長謝謝好部長謝謝"},{"start":6534.145,"end":6562.742,"text":"葉委員好部長好部長大家都非常關心校園暴力也非常關心校園霸凌但是這個事件層出不窮然後越來越嚴重你覺得教育部不應該要檢討委員這個議題本來教育部就是一直是重要的議題對啦對啦也一直在精進中要面對問題啦好不好我們接下來其實都是跟你討論問題是我覺得其實有學生人權是蠻重要的但是保護那些想要在學校好好學習的學生他也是很重要"},{"start":6564.122,"end":6590.897,"text":"給老師在教學現場足夠的尊重以及適當的工具也是很重要所以我覺得在保護學生權利的同時怎麼樣兼顧可以讓那些好學生想要學習學生好好學習安全的回家這個是教育部責務旁貸的以現在的數據來看的話實際上教育部在這方面是失職的必須要講是失職每次看到這些事件在新聞出現大家都非常痛心"},{"start":6591.497,"end":6605.857,"text":"那剛剛我看到很多委員在跟部長的答詢部長都說學校要怎麼做學校要怎麼做可是我就非常好奇就是說像部長你真的知道學校特別是老師在第一線的真實狀況嗎你有去了解過嗎"},{"start":6606.997,"end":6628.126,"text":"委員我討論政治政策都會邀請第一線的學校來參與對可是我跟老師 包含這次注意事項的管理我主持會議還有工作小組會超過7次我建議你微服出巡到學校去跟老師聊聊看你會知道跟真實的聲音邀請來的第一線老師一定會講真實的心聲不一定有時候你在他不見得會講不會啦那我跟你講一下我聽到了嘛好不好好我跟你講我聽到了請問指教對"},{"start":6632.108,"end":6652.342,"text":"現在應該大家都推那個正向教育正向教育很棒啦所以老師也不太敢罰嘛那另外就是剛剛講說這個要收書現在是要放寬一些收書包的規定嘛對吧就是安全檢查啦對啦 可是實際上你知道嗎有時候收到一些違禁品比如收到彈簧刀今天收到彈簧刀可以怎麼做"},{"start":6653.615,"end":6676.888,"text":"委員這次的注意事項連這個細節我們都有一個手冊他就是應該做保管啊保管嘛對嘛保管他保管然後再通知家長領回嘛對不對先做保管這樣看這個學生的樣態不是說直接就叫家長領回對這就不能沒收嘛然後後來之後家長就可以有的時候家長可以領回嘛對嘛有的時候嘛這個就看他調法的結果然後家長領回之後呢隔天學生再帶彈簧刀來啦"},{"start":6678.169,"end":6703.536,"text":"然後保管一段時間再叫這樣領回啦然後領回之後再帶來啦然後就這樣無止盡啦然後再來就是這還是針對說學校老師覺得說這個學生不是那種幫派小孩他們還敢收啊如果遇到幫派小孩的話老師敢收嗎老師不敢惹他們啊老師有家庭啊老師如果說去惹那些幫派小孩這些幫派老大在家裡在門口等他了啦"},{"start":6704.116,"end":6708.967,"text":"所以這些狀況部長真的要去了解一下我還沒講完不要急著插話好不好因為我也沒有在ㄉㄧㄤ你我們只是討論問題"},{"start":6715.39,"end":6743.988,"text":"我覺得把所有的問題都推給學校推給老師其實給老師很大的壓力現在在每個學校裡面很多生教組長都是代理老師在兼任為什麼因為正式都不敢做嘛都不敢去惹這些幫派小孩啊所以不是說所有事情都全部推給學校應該要找少年隊介這是我的建議啦找少年隊很多幫派小孩他們背後都有大哥有老大的你找少年隊去壓制他們老大跟他們講說在學校裡面要有學校的規則"},{"start":6745.749,"end":6771.457,"text":"你要在幫派混當然有另外警察可以去處理但在學校就是要做學生不可以針對老師否則的話叫那些少年隊去找他的老大麻煩嘛否則你叫那些老師老師回到家也是要抱小孩啊也是有家庭要養你你叫他去對那些幫派小孩他敢嗎所以真的我覺得第一個真的是要針對問題第二個喔我建議啦是不是在國中的部分可以增加校安人員現在高中有校安人員嘛"},{"start":6772.017,"end":6789.608,"text":"對,有一些像軍人退伍啊、教官退伍去當校安人員但國中沒有啊實際上國中這個問題才是比較嚴重的嘛所以部長可不可以研議一下我覺得編個預算讓所有的國中可以有至少按照比例可以有一到兩位的教安人員這做得到嗎"},{"start":6790.672,"end":6807.523,"text":"我跟委員報告一下我應該講這個絕對不是讓老師單獨承擔所有的事情如果從少事法的規範裡面我跟委員報告如果這個孩子是西界比如像已經是違背的像彈簧刀等這個機械不是需要沒收那個其實是可以通報到我們包含少福會或"},{"start":6810.084,"end":6815.567,"text":"有相關的單位由這些來做協助如果遇到緊急狀態之下本來就有學校跟警政之間有這種互相支援的契約而且這個做法才不會讓老師真的面對這個問題怎麼可能由老師來單獨承擔"},{"start":6826.252,"end":6853.293,"text":"學校的這個應變跟這個輔導委員會對這些特定的孩子事實上應該有這個機制而不是說我只在學校你講的意思是說有這個機制有這個機制但是沒辦法執行嘛你也是教育專訪你知道就是很難執行嘛今天的老師面對到幫派小孩沒有壓力嗎不是啊你剛才講的就是現在的機制啊我在台北縣服務的時候就是這樣啊我跟少年隊為什麼密集的合作"},{"start":6854.053,"end":6872.751,"text":"就是說當有碰到一些學校應該支援現在的機制也如此啊我認為一定是不夠啦一定不夠我剛剛講的是說少年隊能不能直接去找去幫派跟他們去跟壓制他們但這個學校因為如果說你不這樣做的話你剛剛講了嘛你在台北縣服務時代就是這個機制那為什麼到現在問題還是一直存在"},{"start":6873.353,"end":6878.394,"text":"所以說問題沒有解決嗎現在你提的這個現象我應該在說當時的台北縣在這個方面從一千多個中小學生降為五百多個這個當時教育局跟警察局之間的合作包含跟學校的支持部長 部長連掃蕩學校周邊的如果說你已經做得很好的話我們今天不需要在這邊討論這個專題現在新北出現的這個事情你也知道啊"},{"start":6899.36,"end":6921.564,"text":"你不用去扯什麼新北不新北啦只是簽名在那邊開開規矩被涉嫌發生怎麼樣嘛我當時我跟委員報告我沒兩週會主持一次這樣的會議我現在是在這邊跟你討論說這個問題還是繼續存在我們把問題解決你跟我扯說在新北幹嘛以前怎樣以前如果做得好我們現在不會有這個專題報告嘛因為委員一直覺得說學校跟少年隊之間沒有連結我現在就跟你們報告現在就有機制啊做得不夠嘛"},{"start":6926.005,"end":6940.284,"text":"就做 不然的話為什麼會發生這個狀況不是 如果學校碰到孩子也不願意跟警政單位連結委員 你覺得這個情況應該怎麼辦我跟你講 我現在就是告訴你真實的狀況就是很多老師也不敢去惹這些幫派的小孩不用他惹啊 校長來通報 請務人員來通報校長敢通報嗎"},{"start":6942.967,"end":6943.107,"text":"那校安人員呢?"},{"start":6963.21,"end":6967.213,"text":"我跟在這個報告裡面我提到了我們會來再增加國中有關在這方面學務處的副組長的部分會先來增設對於部分因為現在說在學務處的負擔很重我們除了檢課的終點協助以外這方面會來修有關這個設置條例這個編制編制準則希望能夠在上面來增加人力"},{"start":6989.917,"end":6990.178,"text":"教安人員"},{"start":7006.055,"end":7017.184,"text":"一個人不是去了如果是一個約聘的人員請問委員如果單獨一個人永遠就在這個學校也沒有任何的這種發展升天的機會不過高中就有校安人員啊高中的校安的創新人員是因為他本身是過去我們教官的這個機制之下我們有同時他就是一個體系啦"},{"start":7026.732,"end":7043.352,"text":"那你可以找高中體系來支援國中嗎?這個我們可研議,我只是跟委員先報告這個階段我們會先做什麼?尤其有些學校有需求才會這邊提出來我剛剛跟委員報告說他的做法我們會採取多管道的模式但是會來增加人力"},{"start":7044.761,"end":7062.694,"text":"所以我覺得你還是研議一下好不好因為也是有人跟我反映啦就希望在國中可以成立校園人員只要一到兩名其實就夠了啦那你說本來高中有機制你就高中機制原本的他原本在高中服務的他有一個資料庫請他來國中一到兩位就可以了啦"},{"start":7063.888,"end":7083.655,"text":"委員這個因為涉及到編制等等我們可能要再做一些編制這都是技術性的問題你就看要不要做而已嘛沒有我跟委員說我們會有階段性的做法好那再來是現在18歲以前的剛剛現在講的那個前科塗銷現在教育部的方向是怎樣這是主管當然由司法院在主管對"},{"start":7084.375,"end":7103.282,"text":"那教育部的態度應該是這樣說從教育來講就是這些我們犯錯的少年還是應該要給相關的這種改過的機會但是呢是否連線的時間一到就塗銷我覺得這個要斟酌啦一定是所以教育部是希望維持就不用塗銷嘛"},{"start":7104.082,"end":7107.106,"text":"我要跟委員說那是應該比如說學校也有所謂的銷過的機制學生犯了過但是後來有優良的表現我覺得要塗銷這個事情要非常謹慎所以我是說要有相當條件能夠確認到孩子確實是改過了"},{"start":7121.442,"end":7148.472,"text":"這個孩子今天很多孩子他在犯案的時候跟他這個新聞報的啊跟女朋友炫耀啊說我做這事沒關係反正法律會保護我啊之後呢我就可以成為黑幫老大他們現在做很多事情是故意的啦他覺得說前科會塗銷然後假設三分之一就可以出來了嘛刑期也可以減少嘛所以他覺得做這個事情我以後出來關一下就變大為了嘛就像就像這個割喉案這個郭鑫少年他之後會關關出來是幾歲"},{"start":7151.223,"end":7175.136,"text":"大概幾歲大概21歲20到21歲左右出來之後他就變大圍了所以如果說我們的法律是定的那麼寬鬆的話就會讓我覺得校園安全出現更多的漏洞因為司法院對這個議題很重視他正在會收集幾個部會的建議教育部我現在是問教育部嘛我是希望教育部可以堅持啦這個東西不能塗銷啦"},{"start":7179.798,"end":7205.761,"text":"而且我跟你講這也沒有違反保護機制為什麼因為說實在每個人走在路上我們也不會知道他有沒有前科只有警察會知道嘛就他未來如果犯案的話警察會知道說他之前有前科或是在判案的時候有一般人是不會知道的但是如果說把他塗銷之後很多人就會覺得反正沒有前科啊我就為所欲為的啊那善良的小朋友怎麼辦所以我覺得教育部這個部分希望能夠站在"},{"start":7207.13,"end":7207.891,"text":"主席謝謝麻煩請潘部長"},{"start":7242.637,"end":7264.394,"text":"去年韓國瘾及黑暗榮耀用校園霸凌來題材讓造成全球也是排行冠軍那現在很多人重視到校園霸凌的問題那本席先就教幾個校園霸凌的問題有民調顯示說有近三成的兒少不認為自己在學校安全你有沒有看到這樣的一個報導"},{"start":7265.527,"end":7290.827,"text":"因為過去也有很多的相關調查相關資料只是這個我並沒有進一步比較客觀的去確認過平均高中職以下的暴力跟偏差行為一年有兩萬六千多件平均每天發生71件的暴力事件那去年調查發現有三成的兒校不認為自己在學校安全你不覺得這很諷刺嗎?"},{"start":7292.222,"end":7306.469,"text":"通常來講家庭、校園感覺應該是合理上來說比較安全的地方但是居然有三成的兒校不管是國小、國中、高中生會認為是說在學校不安全我們這幾年投入那麼多的一個努力到底為什麼還會有這樣的狀況"},{"start":7308.103,"end":7308.483,"text":"所以部長"},{"start":7335.42,"end":7350.771,"text":"這樣我就直接請問嘛你覺得說現在的數據遲遲上升是因為通報變多還是案件變多委員這個要進一步去做確認那如果說你沒有辦法確認你為什麼憑什麼在這邊講說是因為通報變多這是你的邏輯啊有幾個因為我們的類型其實一直在擴大啦那當中對霸凌的比如通報數是3000多件那確認數大概是200多件"},{"start":7362.283,"end":7374.566,"text":"我是以霸凌因為霸凌有它的定義啦這不是因為孩子比如說受到比如跟同學發生衝突他覺得被霸凌但是如果說進一步的去確認是不是應該要再確認我只是跟委員報告那個數據我們掌握到的就是鼓勵通報一定是責無旁貸的事啦當然再來一個當然就而且也應該不應該有過去這種隱匿的漏息對 對不對所以委員那次來考慮我一次說我先請教我再請教你"},{"start":7388.53,"end":7389.611,"text":"委員我要這樣子講因為如果以我們在"},{"start":7406.383,"end":7421.684,"text":"因為現在很多人會覺得是說是不是因為這個霸凌的事件頻傳而今年明星私中傳出報考的人數激增私立中學比頂尖的大學還要難考那這樣子的現象如果真的發生的時候我們怎麼樣重建我們公立體系"},{"start":7422.345,"end":7422.445,"text":"委員報告"},{"start":7441.451,"end":7441.751,"text":"本席國一"},{"start":7460.127,"end":7476.287,"text":"總共人數是21萬相較於去年是18萬整整多三萬一千如果三萬一千多多少比例將近將近兩成你就會知道為什麼去讀師中的像你服務的新北新北要增加兩百班"},{"start":7477.529,"end":7491.429,"text":"這個方法如果以比例來看你要去想本來就想要去進去進入師中的一定會因為師中的民口不是一直變大嗎他就固定的所以我就這個人數是非常特殊的龍年跟兔年之間差了三萬一千人新光國一"},{"start":7492.55,"end":7513.797,"text":"就是明年要升國一所以從那個數據我想我要跟委員報告的是這個訊息我也請署長一定要特別去留意但是對於師中過去因為私校法有一個57條還是第幾條有開放讓私立學校可以用各種的方式過去委員也經常指教不是委員委員會這邊都說像中部那種小型年考的說實在"},{"start":7515.818,"end":7529.133,"text":"9年義務教育台灣走過後還在出現這個現象這個我覺得我們教育機關是應該要來慎重的注意啦孩子即使是為了擠這個窄門結果說真話放棄了不然之前才有一個家長"},{"start":7530.034,"end":7533.475,"text":"最重點是說現在霸凌事件頻傳造成普遍家長若不信任這個公立學校而造成大家是往私校擠就造成兩個現象一個是越來越多人可能會去針對私立學校的一個報考"},{"start":7555.362,"end":7568.974,"text":"那另外一個部分就是說對於公立學校我們的老師我們的教職員也會有士氣低落的影響嗎等一下再來跟你就教這個部分你剛剛也提到了非常好本席等一下會問但我先講請教校園霸凌影片"},{"start":7570.325,"end":7587.165,"text":"現在很多時候看到賴群組轉傳我們會知道這個霸凌是因為那個影片本席之前也有提過就是說會有霸凌事件而會有其他人拍影片經夢想像上他是要在欺負那個被害者他是想要在取樂他是想要在嘲笑他是想要把被害者"},{"start":7589.487,"end":7607.202,"text":"這個受辱的畫面也拍下來這一個部分另外一個部分可能是當下他想要做個記錄譬如說像上禮拜有這個學生跟老師的這個衝突的時候就是當場教室裡面的同學把它拍下來那我現在先請教說霸凌影片出來之後的這個處理機制"},{"start":7608.763,"end":7632.405,"text":"有沒有跟我們相關單位來聯繫去做這個下架以及做心理後續的輔導是,謝謝委員這個提醒我跟你們報告就是近期有幾個校園的這個事件上因為在那個平台上面我們就會請要求學校因為一定會掌握到就是要跟iWIN做這方面的下架的要求至於委員剛才提到有些被Download下來以後就在那個社群裡面"},{"start":7632.745,"end":7656.682,"text":"尤其是校園對這個是比較難的因為他已經被但是在那個平台裡面我們第一時間一定會這樣做那我也跟委員報告這個真的我們要再努力了之前也有一個影片不知道我有沒有看到就是學生把老師什麼時候壓在然後用什麼結果查證以後那個事情是根本就不是這樣的事情不是嗎他不是不是也是在新北的一個學校"},{"start":7657.502,"end":7663.744,"text":"是老師講不是?同學講不是?還是你聽學校的講法?學校正式求證,而且也正式說明,有對外說明沒有,我要跟委員報告的是網路的這些訊息,確實我們要不斷地去做這方面當然,像學校一個拍戲劇的影片,結果把它當成這個對非常多社會也是很震撼學生把老師綁在後頭,然後用什麼板叉去弄"},{"start":7684.031,"end":7686.492,"text":"那我現在要問的是說在霸凌影片的部分我們怎麼樣有做後續的一個輔導"},{"start":7710.027,"end":7736.684,"text":"委員就是一定會先做下架那之後如果像這一些因為還是會要求到縣市跟學校對於這個個案在後續的處理上面因為有雙方這個部分其實我們不是說下架就沒事了一定會去追蹤到因為這個可能就會進到多數的這些我們掌握到都會進行到霸凌尤其生對生的後續的處置的作業一直到這個案子是真正的作為一個處置"},{"start":7737.645,"end":7759.472,"text":"好 剛剛部長你還有提到就是所謂剛剛葉元之委員問到戴彈簧刀的一個部分我先確認一下你們剛剛講的確實是彈簧刀嗎?是嘛 彈簧刀嗎?那如果說是彈簧刀的話我們沒有任何的法令可以去規範嗎?葉文昌司法的規範就是這樣啊什麼樣子?那就是戴著就是那個什麼刀械這個本來就是可以通報的對啊"},{"start":7760.752,"end":7767.255,"text":"那個不是沒收的概念而已是啊那為什麼你剛剛回答的時候都沒有講這個方向因為委員一直沒有在我要跟他報告說委員這個少事法的規範裡面這個已經不是讓老師單打獨鬥也不是讓學校單打獨鬥本時要特別強調的是不只是少事法社會秩序維護法也都有一樣的概念"},{"start":7782.823,"end":7796.14,"text":"彈簧刀雖然我們沒有在槍砲彈藥管理條例裡面沒有規範到彈簧刀但實際上它所的用途是野外求生或者是觀賞收藏用而絕對不是讓任何人可以隨便的隨時擠彈"},{"start":7797.321,"end":7819.102,"text":"所以只要發生隨身攜帶的話該通報該處置本來就應該要處置啊怎麼會讓大家覺得說好像校園是一個話外之地所以部長你正式的再做一次強調到底現在老師如果說有收到學生有帶任何的違禁品尤其是有傷人的利器的時候老師應該怎麼做"},{"start":7819.802,"end":7840.512,"text":"跟委員報告因為學校本來就有這種如果有碰到這種情形就有通報這個通報當然就可以通過到我們還有警察機關警務機關然後少年隊對不對最後啊本席也要在一分鐘的時間來說明一下剛剛你有提到這個高中的一個部分"},{"start":7841.533,"end":7856.512,"text":"在這一次我們有提到說這個高中免學費這開始要推動高中免學費但是有所謂排付條款可是現在是補助了公立學校免學費、私立學校免學費但是有一群人是沒有被補助到"},{"start":7858.111,"end":7883.909,"text":"對 是不是因為當時高級中等教育法修法的時候在委員會這邊當然當時委員會這邊立了一個非常輕易的彈書你現在今年二月要高級中等學校全部都免學費上路嗎沒有 那個法規那個法規就是有個彈書那個彈書當時我有調出這個要不要去處理那個朝野的立委在這上面有非常奇異的看法所以當時立法上面就是排除"},{"start":7885.089,"end":7905.369,"text":"所以是立法的原因嗎?但是因為是你們今年要推動的時候,這是政策面的考量喔?所以說是很多的學校、私校的家長是被排除在外的?他是有三種,一種就是直升到學校或辦理讀招"},{"start":7907.151,"end":7916.281,"text":"獨招,它是從招生不是從貧富的,從招生的上面的規定。是啊,就是從招生的規定。對對對。但是本席在講講這樣子有多少人?有多少學生?"},{"start":7917.954,"end":7918.394,"text":"委員這個是因為這個是涉及到入學的規範"},{"start":7942.584,"end":7962.669,"text":"本席現在提出來不管是什麼樣的原因現在結果我現在講的是結果結果就是有這樣並且本席在今年開始因為你們已經開始實施了之後才發覺說很多的家長他們自己看了原來不是說政府宣傳很多啊高中免學費啊但是我的學我的孩子的高中為什麼沒有被納入"},{"start":7963.669,"end":7982.621,"text":"那這樣子就是你們故意排除在外啊他就一直問我們說難道我們不是台灣人嗎難道我們沒有納稅嗎難道我們不是一般高中生嗎確實他們也是高中生啊要不要補救要不要檢討可以研議啊可以研議但這個研議一定要大家有共識啦因為那個要修教育不能教育法"},{"start":7982.921,"end":8007.151,"text":"但是應該要求教育部是不是先針對到底有多少人並且要用到多少的預算先做一個評估委員那個預算絕對不是大的問題就是因為不是問題所以說我們才問說為什麼還要你分族群為什麼你還要分化為什麼還要搞特權這個是當時立法院朝野委員強調我把那個資料給你參考你就會知道本席有看過那資料當然重點在於是這是你們的政策"},{"start":8007.751,"end":8010.752,"text":"好,這個我們整理,本來就已經整理過,來做政策這方面的討論"},{"start":8035.316,"end":8036.398,"text":"主席好有請部長部長辛苦了"},{"start":8050.073,"end":8050.293,"text":"委員好"},{"start":8070.482,"end":8089.869,"text":"他們的這個應該是說即將在8月就要上路了啦第三期對 第三期的部分那當然其實在這個教育部國教署其實之前也提到了這第三期的一個草案但是有很多的所謂的退場機制包含師生筆可能如果不符合規定或者是說這個學校在三年之內曾經有什麼樣的一個事故的話可能他們就必須要被"},{"start":8095.211,"end":8095.831,"text":"我跟委員報告"},{"start":8122.219,"end":8139.406,"text":"因為現在第三期的訂約的條件目前還沒有定案下來因為各界包含家長、教保人員的待遇還有家長的期待以及教保服務品質等等還有包含剛才委員提到那個深思比一比十二怎麼進行的期程"},{"start":8139.966,"end":8146.388,"text":"所以這個還沒有定案可是這樣子8月就要上路了我跟委員報告一下所以也沒有所謂現在哪個學校是退場或等等的那這個我跟委員報告目前整個已經都收集了相關的資料那會在3月底就會正式的把這個方面做定案跟對外來公佈那縣市才可以依據這個來做縣市內的相關有意參與總共用的這些的後續的訂約的事項"},{"start":8168.413,"end":8184.5,"text":"其實我相信應該很多的本來的私立幼兒園其實他們也很願意能夠參加所謂的全公幼但是因為現在我們看到的我目前所收到的一些陳情包含是桃園市他們開了第一槍等於他們開了第一槍之後"},{"start":8185.06,"end":8185.12,"text":"來得及"},{"start":8201.28,"end":8227.115,"text":"那我跟委員報告因為在規劃的過程確實為了確保這個教保服務的品質甚至過去也有部分的幼兒園有出現這種管理不當甚至教保人員去虐待管教孩子的事情然後這個也是社會要求但是我聽到的有很多其實願意加入準公幼他們其實本來在私立的幼兒園他們也經營了大概二十三十年都是非常優質的但是這個政策一出來的時候其實會"},{"start":8228.475,"end":8228.615,"text":"主席"},{"start":8252.288,"end":8262.89,"text":"退出所謂的准公幼的一個名單之外的話其實他們等於每個孩子每個月要多付大概3000到9000這對很多的家庭來講是很成功的負擔因為剛才講到時間根本還沒有定案下來也就沒有所謂哪個園或什麼桃園市有幾園這個是一個時間第二個就是在我們研議的過程當中因為如果真的不適合的園所勉強加入我想對很多家長也會有疑慮"},{"start":8279.933,"end":8296.037,"text":"對於如果有退場比如他原來已有加入沒有進行續約的對於家長權益的保障這個是我們主要的配套措施我給您一個建議好不好因為其實有很多的私幼其實他們也許在第二期的時候他們說是1比15他等於多收了三個孩子"},{"start":8296.437,"end":8296.757,"text":"主席主席主席"},{"start":8315.333,"end":8330.938,"text":"那在國教署召開諮詢的相關的會議確實有這樣的意見這些都是在我們最後要定案前會把它做重整的考量但是確保就是說原來就讀又夠准公幼家長的權益比如得到政府的這些協助的這種一定會保障"},{"start":8333.679,"end":8358.965,"text":"謝謝部長的回應接下來我們就進入今天我們在討論的所謂的這個校園安全的一個部分了那前一陣子其實大家都可以看到所謂的師生上面的一個衝突其實也引發了整個我們對於所謂的國高中生他們因為剛好面臨所謂的青春期他們在面對所謂的校園安全上面我相信其實不是只有那樣子的孩子跟那樣子的一個老師其實他們在"},{"start":8360.685,"end":8384.291,"text":"對應所謂的這樣子的一個校園安全他們其實是會有一些疑慮跟擔心的那我們可以看到其實教育部在111年各級學校的安全的報告的分析我們都知道其實關於老師跟青少年的學生們他們在溝通上也就是說他們其實是需要花時間去關心這些孩子的我才能夠知道每個孩子的一個狀況"},{"start":8385.351,"end":8410.125,"text":"我們現在可以看到以平均單級的人數來說在國小的話一般大概是23人所以我們以公立的學校來說那在國中的部分是25將近26人高中其實有30人那也就是說在校園安全其實發生比例最高的就是出事最多的應該是所謂的高中這個部分我們在人力的部分要怎麼樣來配合"},{"start":8411.346,"end":8425.341,"text":"我跟委員報告當然這是一個平均數的概念因為台灣少子化後其實有相當多的學校學生人數是低於這個平均數那在過往這段時間我們其實"},{"start":8425.982,"end":8431.404,"text":"高中的部分其實是最優先的將輔導教師跟專輔人員的部分最快達成依照現行學生輔導法的方面來做這方面人力的尤其是專業的這方面的人力的政治那國中"},{"start":8445.39,"end":8451.133,"text":"會在114學年度達到那國小我也把它提前從120學年度提前到116學年度因為我想這一些是剛才委員所提到真的越來越多孩子可能在這方面需要有更多專業的人力因為其實有很多的事件它會是同時發生它不是可能只有這一班在發生那其實校安人員或者是我們的學校的專輔的人員"},{"start":8470.885,"end":8494.78,"text":"其實他們到達現場去處理應變的能力到底夠不夠這也是我們真的也必須要討論進去的是好那另外呢其實就是在於所謂我剛剛有講到老師跟學生之間的長期的一個溝通跟了解其實才是他們解決問題最重要的一個關鍵但是現在因為有很多的實資其實是沒有辦法到位的包含"},{"start":8495.06,"end":8495.2,"text":"委員會委員會委員會"},{"start":8511.936,"end":8529.513,"text":"特質其實他沒有辦法第一線的掌握這是不是跟校方有沒有告知也有關係對 我跟委員報告因為如果對我們說特教學生或比較特別的一些要高關懷的學生在原來的學生輔導法裡面其實一個非常重要的"},{"start":8529.813,"end":8546.507,"text":"他就是一個學生輔導委員會校長就是那個召集人這就是應該要很清楚的對這方面有所掌握那對於說比如當然待課老師比如北市出現的這個問題學校檢討下來北市教育局這邊提到的就是校方可能在這個讓要去待課這個老師對於學生這班上的特殊狀況的孩子並沒有適當的做銜接"},{"start":8556.755,"end":8574.308,"text":"像這個我想也是教育部未來要跟縣市還有學校這邊在這方面可能要再更多的連結因為這一次那次的衝突他們檢討下來因為有請國教署這方面深入的了解確實學校跟教育局所反映出來的這個確實是一個當時產生衝突一個還蠻重要的關鍵"},{"start":8579.011,"end":8602.771,"text":"其實剛剛有很多的委員都有提到所謂的校園霸凌的事件其實霸凌不只有單純在學生跟學生之間其實霸凌也有可能會發生在老師或者是校長對於學校的孩子霸凌的一個事件這個部分我不知道部長您有沒有掌握因為其實我們知道在去年4月份的時候其實我們有特別提到所謂的不適任的校長的問題那根據所謂的這個國教法"},{"start":8605.794,"end":8606.214,"text":"因為其實看到這個表格我們會發現"},{"start":8635.292,"end":8649.147,"text":"在文法上面定下來目前國教署所授權的執法正在做最後的整理什麼時候可以出現因為我們看到其實在關於所謂的校長跟教職員對學生的一個霸凌其實它高達13.23%那這個比例其實已經來到了"},{"start":8653.131,"end":8653.231,"text":"主席"},{"start":8688.288,"end":8690.533,"text":"好謝謝我們現在就先休息5分鐘"},{"start":9007.722,"end":9032.903,"text":"好我們現在繼續開會那接下來我們請登記第8號的羅廷偉羅委員好謝謝主席我想有請潘部長還有周署長小政署周署長還有我們的謝廷長、郭副司長"},{"start":9035.277,"end":9036.918,"text":"麻煩部長、署長、廳長、郭副司長請問部長,目前多少保護管束的人在學校?"},{"start":9055.806,"end":9083.016,"text":"那個詳細的數據可能在我們...沒關係那我可以請問一下這個司法部分但是我會覺得很奇怪就是說因為他已經保護管束了他回到校園也就是在我們的教育部管轄範圍我覺得教育部應該要有權責去瞭解到底有多少的孩子已經回到了學校那你個人認為這些學校回到學校以後適不適合繼續留在學校"},{"start":9083.997,"end":9097.689,"text":"委員關鍵這個議題也是我們前一段時間一直在跨部會、跨院在努力的部分就是因為現在如果涉及到暴險少年或司法少年那在他有個過程一個就是調查過程"},{"start":9098.49,"end":9098.67,"text":"主席"},{"start":9123.892,"end":9129.917,"text":"應該要邀請學校能夠在調查的過程以及裁決的過程能夠充分的參與這個就會回應到委員所提到的這種高風險的對象我想我們在討論的過程當中學校或主管機關這邊就能夠更充分的來參與這樣聽起來好像不太適合嘛 對不對"},{"start":9144.069,"end":9169.336,"text":"這樣才會更加委員所關心的適不適合回到學校這應該是大家要重整的去做客觀的條件上的討論跟決定好那但是我覺得對於剛剛我想問第一個問題就是保護管束的人多少在學校我覺得從今天開始以後我覺得教育部有責任去做一個串接去了解有多少的孩子回到了校園我覺得這個是教育部應該要關注的一個議題"},{"start":9169.656,"end":9172.718,"text":"現在少年關務所跟矯正學校對於安置所內的一個少年都如何進行輔導?成效如何?再犯的機率你們有評估過嗎?"},{"start":9188.049,"end":9190.01,"text":"那目前成效呢 成效如何"},{"start":9211.138,"end":9234.955,"text":"目前在每個案子大概法院大概都有在take care這些案件對包括這個安置機構的他也是在社區當中比如說臺北的孩子然後被安置到花蓮那花蓮地方政府就會收到法院的通知那就要去安排這些他的就學跟他就業甚至於說有些孩子會在這個就是就學期間接受心理智商這些大概都有一個安置輔導計畫"},{"start":9236.056,"end":9263.661,"text":"我覺得個人你回答了很多但是都沒有切中我們的要點我覺得就是少年保護的執行力就是不髒讓我們覺得這樣子的事件會層出不窮在這些少年離開少關所或者是矯正學校以後地方法院的少關人我們看到他的人數也真的不足司法院在自己的報告也寫到新北校園暴力事件的發生顯示實務上多數少年法院調查保護是人力不足"},{"start":9264.201,"end":9290.436,"text":"市長我想問一下人力不足這件事情是老問題的在人力不足的情況之下要如何做好輔導功能跟委員報告就是2月1號呢我們其實已經有進行一個就是緊急的評估就是我們透過這個示範計畫希望把保護管束現在在社區就學中的這些少年透過示範計畫把評估這個風險就評估這個少年的風險因子那列入這個保護管束示範計畫什麼時候會結束"},{"start":9292.077,"end":9295.179,"text":"司法院要成立新的少年法院這個會不會與地方法院的少年及家事法院有跌床駕屋的一個問題"},{"start":9321.381,"end":9321.401,"text":"委員會議"},{"start":9341.608,"end":9360.302,"text":"聽長我覺得法院不是越來越多越好那如何能夠強化我覺得重點還是如何承接這些少年當然當然我想新北國中這個戈井案加害人稱收容與少年關務所故意少年事件處理法應該由少年保護館進行專責社區的一個處遇但為什麼沒有留意"},{"start":9361.606,"end":9380.918,"text":"跟委員報告這個個案據我們的了解其實保護官也都有跟學校的生肖組長還有輔導老師那其實跟學校端也都有開過相關的會議對但是我們有少年保護官這個部分有專責處理這個部分可是我就覺得沒有留意到那廷長我覺得這位少年回到學校以後他並沒有被制度給接住難道他被放棄了嗎"},{"start":9381.823,"end":9397.528,"text":"還是都交給學校全部都交給教育部跟委員報告這段時間他從少關有出來其實就是在保護管束期間就會有一個保護官跟學校去討論如何的讓少年在學校可以接受輔導還有保護官的這樣的一個監督跟他的一個輔導計畫的進行"},{"start":9399.309,"end":9426.345,"text":"所以這個部分其實大概都有相關的制度我想剛剛有一些立委也在討論我覺得有少年保護官一起來負責才能增加對犯罪少年的一個約束力而不是少年丟回了學校就丟給我們現在的教育部我想這部分我要幫教育部講一些話我覺得應該是要串接起來一起來承接這些少年一起來協助我覺得這部分應該有待加強政府到底給這些處罰少年什麼樣的資源你可以簡單說明嗎"},{"start":9427.773,"end":9427.873,"text":"主席"},{"start":9443.254,"end":9443.714,"text":"．3月18日、20日及21日"},{"start":9460.285,"end":9488.839,"text":"人力真的不足啦支援真的有限啦那再來就是少輔會嘛現在少輔員社工能不能夠因應轄內的一個需求我覺得這個部分應該是不夠要怎麼去做一個輔導少輔會可能就要問內政部了因為行政輔導先行其實跟委員報告行政輔導先行其實就是我們被整個國際專家認為我們要廢除愚犯所以行政輔導先行是會由行政院由地方政府首長帶領的少輔會去進行少年的輔導事件"},{"start":9489.639,"end":9504.633,"text":"我另外因為都有加上台我就一併一起講啦我覺得最後還有一個要值得討論的少關所跟矯正學校現在安置人數有限如果安置人數都已經滿員了要如何安置這些人這也是我們應該值得去探究的一個問題啦"},{"start":9506.067,"end":9508.849,"text":"我都一併叫上台了嘛所以我想說有聽到問題可以直接回應沒關係"},{"start":9524.64,"end":9548.213,"text":"報告委員如果就少關所的部分原則上我們會在他出所因為他有時候是當庭釋放擇戶讓我們會盡快的聯繫他的學校那在少教校的部分教政學校的部分我們比如說他是出去校就學我們會跟當地的教育主管機關聯繫"},{"start":9549.534,"end":9565.066,"text":"所說我知道我現在的意思是說如果滿園了額滿了那你這要怎麼處理你有配套嗎整個少關所跟矯正學校滿園的話所謂滿園是說暴滿嗎安置人數啊有限啊那整個人數暴滿啊"},{"start":9565.95,"end":9590.869,"text":"安置的部分我們會跟當地政府或是更保來做聯繫我希望未來我們在更強力度的去關注這些議題的時候可能會有人數提升那我們應該要因應這樣子的部分我想教育部真的我們也要知道我還是要提醒一下庭長剛剛我們提到有些工作有些是教育部的但教育部他們應該要負責的是尚未處法的預犯"},{"start":9591.93,"end":9618.409,"text":"預防防罪的一個教育但是如果有些孩子他已經受到了這些保護管束了他應該司法部門應該要幫忙協助教育部來一起關注我想這些問題都是串接在一起的所以今天召集人才會幫我們把大家召集在這邊做一個聯席那我另外我要跟教育部再說教育部中小學目前有沒有辦理情緒跟溝通的一個教育"},{"start":9619.268,"end":9636.314,"text":"跟委員報告目前在十二年國教課綱裡面不管是在健體領域或是我們相關的輔導課程裡面確實有把這一個部分是一個重點因為發現到我想這部分我們非常的重視不管是倫理、道德、禮義、廉恥"},{"start":9636.954,"end":9638.354,"text":"字幕由 Amara.org 社群提供"},{"start":9655.889,"end":9661.153,"text":"根本報告這個情形因為我們現在都在持續的設置當中那對於未來我們在修的這個協會輔法裡面有特別在談到不是輔導教師剛才那個是輔導教師的編制還有專輔人員就是各類的部分會在後續修法的這部分有在擴充有關專輔的這方面的人力"},{"start":9678.666,"end":9692.965,"text":"好我想這個東西我們都非常注意所以我還是最後要跟您再提一次因為上一次我覺得您有回應一個良善的一個溝通我們還是想要繼續追夜光天使的一個進度委員這部分國教室有跟台中教育正在談怎麼樣事辦"},{"start":9693.666,"end":9711.739,"text":"OK嗎?因為我想這個部分我們要跟這些有心人士、特殊的團體跟黑道來拔河搶孩子如果關注國中孩子在課後以後他們的一個相關環境、生活我覺得葉光天使真的能夠事班在台中現在經費有沒有問題?"},{"start":9713.24,"end":9713.26,"text":"謝謝委員 謝謝"},{"start":9745.855,"end":9746.176,"text":"張雅琳委員"},{"start":9762.072,"end":9788.037,"text":"部長好就是說今天呢因為其實校園的事情和事我們都不希望它再重演嘛所以我們都希望積極的預防所以今天就來跟部長討論一系列的一些相關的預防措施那首先呢是說我們可以看到這張圖表就是說我們學校的校園事件是屢創新高尤其是在國小增加了非常多的數量那在前面的委員也有關心到說你有提到我們會增加一個會修改這個任用條例來增補人力嘛是嗎"},{"start":9789.917,"end":9792.778,"text":"所以這次是反映了之前可能大家沒有通報的一個狀態"},{"start":9810.243,"end":9824.017,"text":"因為過去社會都會有關注說感覺好像學校是不是還有很多黑數所以這個是我們近年一直在強調的重點刻意學校有這樣的通報責任當然把通報的機制像那個專線改成用比較簡單的18531953的概念"},{"start":9828.962,"end":9849.132,"text":"這個數字真的增加了那我應該提到的就是說有關在我們依照原來學生輔導法目前都在增補當中的輔導教師跟專輔的人力那國小的部分會再提前到116學年度來完整這樣子我跟你們報告後續國中跟國小會增加2000多的輔導教師"},{"start":9853.834,"end":9860.456,"text":"副導教師那校園人員的部分呢?那個部分因為學務的這一塊我們有分階段來執行因為現在負擔比較重國中尤其大型規模既有的員偶編制準則61班以上他可以來增加一到三位那過去我了解到縣市可能經費有限這樣的學校也沒有真的去讓他雖然有準則可依據但沒有實際執行"},{"start":9881.422,"end":9907.676,"text":"現階段因為規模越大要處理的事務越多這個我們會優先的來補助縣市能夠把這個做成就是國中小都會一起嗎還是只有國中而已主要是國中後續會把原有準則再跟縣市討論要做一個修正希望不是只有61班以上希望在30班以下或30到60這個國中階段真的孩子也處於在身心發展變化大這個部分我們會第二階段處理"},{"start":9909.244,"end":9914.085,"text":"那我想知道這大概是什麼時候會去進行呢?那個有關61班以上的部分我們現在就會進行因為他的準則已經確定了那在低於60班以下呢?那個因為還跟縣市討論大概需要差不多一兩個月的時間因為那個修了準則縣市才會一起啦因為等於說涉及到人事編制的問題"},{"start":9930.25,"end":9949.492,"text":"好,那相關的那些計畫還有後續如果有一些怎麼追蹤的話再提供給我們辦公室,謝謝那再來第二個部分就是說因為我們可以看到就是說我們的這個因為我們有分八類校園事件嘛那其實八類裡面都有一個叫做其他的選項那其中呢我發現這個最多的暴力事件其實是暴力事件的偏差與偏差行為所以這是統計的數字"},{"start":9951.134,"end":9977.487,"text":"其中我觀察到我們有一個選項增加了73%叫做其他校園暴力或偏差事件等於說這個數量增加了這麼大到底是不是有新型態的暴力事件出現了而我們沒有發現呢?我們有詳細的去了解這裡面的類型嗎?這部分除了這幾大項以外其實我有請同仁、校安中心這邊再細分更多因為了解細分更多會比較真的去聚焦"},{"start":9977.807,"end":9977.927,"text":"主席主席"},{"start":9995.481,"end":10002.308,"text":"這個我有請校園中心已經整理了我想把那個資料再給委員看整體數據是這樣只是它的分類更細了解那我想請教部長那我們還沒有再分類到地點這件事情因為它到底發生在什麼地方其實也是蠻重要可是我從現在報告是沒有看到的"},{"start":10012.598,"end":10032.78,"text":"那個可能要到我們那個校安通報的系統資料庫裡面其實我有請他們定期要把幾個我們說看起來就說造成這方面困擾更大的或發生頻率更高的這些有提但是沒有到各個每一個個案都分到這麼細"},{"start":10033.821,"end":10052.609,"text":"因為我想要講的就是說因為之前我們是有補助到地方縣市政府地方部組是有補助說要在校園裡面裝設教室裡面去補裝設這個緊急電話或是急救靈而是如果我們沒有真正的了解事件是發生在哪裡那有可能我們做這件事情是沒有辦法解決問題的那個應該不是教育部的政策應該是有部分縣市"},{"start":10054.79,"end":10056.812,"text":"提出來以後大家也發現到這個可能要斟酌啦因為我跟委員報告過去這幾年教育部在有關校園內我們叫做自然死角啦也就是比較孩子少去的地方或像廁所等等的其實補助了將近19億多"},{"start":10072.728,"end":10091.938,"text":"就是希望能夠改善這些孩子在那裡萬一一旦碰到什麼狀況可以做一個緊急比如那種急救靈等的類似或是照明因為有些地方很陰暗這連大學都補助所以我們其實在校園通報可以看到這些詳細的地點的分類對嗎應該說歸類比較重要的幾項類型"},{"start":10098.862,"end":10121.141,"text":"上個禮拜有個桃園式的快樂國小他們有做一個演習真的有外人闖進校園的時候要找小孩算帳的時候大家應該怎麼辦這個演練的過程是非常的逼真小孩都留下了很深刻的印象校方也說這可以提供小孩的安全意識我也知道在104年的時候其實教育部是有編"},{"start":10122.362,"end":10141.603,"text":"有頒布一個叫做強化校園安全防護機制的實施計畫並且要求這個這個全國高中以下的學校來執行那我想知道這個計畫現在還在執行中嗎是因為委員提到那個成立應變小組還有演練演練是各種的然後每學年至少要一次"},{"start":10142.344,"end":10171.329,"text":"每學年至少要一次原因就是說因為現在怕學校有時候會覺得平常可能也沒有特別去注意會不會發生什麼事情那當時我們就說你一定要有演練你一面小組才知道說真的碰到比如說啦碰到一個孩子像我們說發生的這個事件你一定要有個怎麼樣的啟動才會後續去做其他的整個處理甚至疏散等等的這一些這個不演練即使不是可能事情發生一定會手忙腳亂"},{"start":10171.869,"end":10172.589,"text":"每個學年現在是有要求的那我想就是說"},{"start":10199.049,"end":10221.379,"text":"我們其實現在有一個東西就是說因為其實校部長知不知道這一個案例就是說腐蝕奇蹟就是在那邊的小學當時在三一大地震的時候這個學校的小孩幾乎是99%的一個存活下來那他們在國中畢業之前接受了35個小時的防災教育所以是非常多的所以我希望就是說我們應該要提供的不同種的腳本"},{"start":10222.64,"end":10223.28,"text":"這件事是現在委員所提到的規範"},{"start":10241.914,"end":10242.514,"text":"提供學校與警政單位討論"},{"start":10262.584,"end":10262.925,"text":"好,沒關係,我們..."},{"start":10290.313,"end":10306.751,"text":"中介教育的部分上次我們其實有在講那當時是部長有講說三月底嗎但是我看今天的口頭報告變成是五月的時候才會三月底我們會把補助縣市建制的機制給縣市因為這之前跟縣市討論了三次那也希望說縣市因為我們也跟民間團體有討論"},{"start":10308.853,"end":10320.457,"text":"所以我想問一下就是說真的是提到是5月上面會完成跟他們至少簽妥這個就合作契約對合作契約那我想要知道現在各縣是簽妥的一個狀況是什麼因為現在我們3月才會把都還沒有簽"},{"start":10323.918,"end":10341.777,"text":"對 因為也聽取縣市很多的意見他們認為民間團體合作是一個模式他們也有縣市自己本身也有公設的部門他們也認為可不可以有這種機制我說本來就是它多元但目標都是有一個這一次的對象特別談到可能就是暴險少年跟司法少年為主要對象"},{"start":10342.979,"end":10362.297,"text":"我再問下一個就是說因為中介基地進去之後他們會受到什麼樣子的教育會不會有常規正常的教育去來協助他們不要剝奪他們的受教權第二個部分就是剛剛其實前面的委員都有提到那我想要問的是說少保官如果他覺得小孩可以離開了但是校方覺得不可以那這個學生他會怎麼辦"},{"start":10364.379,"end":10369.6,"text":"這個規劃就會跟學校教育體系的連結會更緊密就是說如果因為過去少保官、少教官、少真化對這些不顯少年是真正才有約束的能力他可以重新再看孩子的表現再做裁定他也可能讓他再回"},{"start":10391.664,"end":10415.313,"text":"稍關所可能再回矯正學校那一般教育人員可能比較沒有辦法有這個所謂這種對象那未來如果這個我們中介基地的安置這個討論的前提也是由這個我們說在做裁決前的討論跟決定那事後追蹤我想也希望這個幾個專業的人力跟機關也能夠一起這個才能夠真的貫徹啦"},{"start":10417.054,"end":10438.401,"text":"好,那我想就是在最後一句話就是說因為剛剛好像還是沒有聽到說他到底在學校在這個中階地域會不會有常規的教育所以這個也許我們事後也可以再跟那個教育部這邊請教因為我還是想要確保孩子在這邊有足夠的受教權那再來就是說還有一個就是說校方如果拒絕的時候該怎麼辦校方如果不讓他回去的話這也是我們事後再來詳細的討論,謝謝是,好謝謝"},{"start":10446.308,"end":10447.329,"text":"登記事項李懿錦委員"},{"start":10461.889,"end":10482.162,"text":"我想面對今天這個議題我們很清楚知道沒有人有權利剝奪他人的生命那也不論一時的憤慨或是年少輕狂都不是理由所以校園殺人事件而令人悲痛憤怒而且完全沒有辦法接受可是我既然今天要談到這個議題就要放下這個所謂的"},{"start":10482.842,"end":10508.894,"text":"私人的情緒然後要用立法委員的身份來跟您來探討我們如何防範這個悲劇於未然那我們試著想像一個情境就假設有一個15歲的少年是A在他國小的時候媽媽吸毒致死那和他相依為命的爸爸欠債又所謂槍爆彈藥前科那少年A的爸爸再婚繼母又因為販毒被關"},{"start":10510.074,"end":10534.87,"text":"那請教這個少年A算不算處在高風險又或是所謂的脆弱家庭那我們是不是是否要在避免標籤化的情況之下及早及急介入在少年A成長的過程中就給予輔導那面對少年A的情況我們現行的機制到底有什麼樣的資源可以給予協助部長"},{"start":10536.094,"end":10561.098,"text":"我跟委員報告這個委員所敘述這家庭的狀況如果不涉及到我們少年本身他就是我們常態的孩子那當然對於他的處遇跟家庭這方面我想在學校還有我們相關的一些資源應該給予常態的教育如果是經濟弱勢委員知道我們有或是學習上的弱勢我們是有幾個機制可以去幫助"},{"start":10561.658,"end":10562.138,"text":"3月18日及21日三天一次會議"},{"start":10577.691,"end":10577.951,"text":"主席"},{"start":10607.591,"end":10609.593,"text":"中午犯下新北國三少年殺人案的背景相符合"},{"start":10630.615,"end":10652.57,"text":"那所以悲劇已經釀成那我想說我們就要防止第二條生命不能再犧牲那換句話說郭姓少年已經鑄成大錯可是罪與罰之間該怎麼拿捏才能真正讓一個那麼年輕那可是又犯下重大錯誤的人同時他在受處罰的同時也能改過自新不要一步錯步步錯"},{"start":10653.951,"end":10669.08,"text":"所以我們放在心上一件事就是說對於這些相當小的年紀就犯下大錯的人來看對他來講還是來日方長所以我們其實是要我們多的是我們跟他在社會上"},{"start":10669.56,"end":10671.401,"text":"一月4日教育部有召開所謂的校安諮詢會．潘部長您在會後有表示說將會跟地方、民間來合力．"},{"start":10691.355,"end":10696.457,"text":"擴充中介教育基地並建立個案輔導的評估機制經本辦跟徵詢專家的結論專家所關心的包含以下幾點建立中介教育基地要配置充足的心理專業人員"},{"start":10715.346,"end":10718.908,"text":"第二是我們這個處法少年回歸校園前的所謂的個案轉型的會議相當重要因為這個個案轉型的會議不只是一場會議而且它是一個緊密的網制就像我們秀愛PTT一樣"},{"start":10730.433,"end":10748.787,"text":"他其實是需要跨越部門跟專業的合作跟評估而且會議紀錄也應該正式發文讓各個單位配合辦理以便行政的溝通那第三是我們各縣市都有所謂的家庭教育中心那當然除了教育課程之外是不是也要針對"},{"start":10750.148,"end":10752.029,"text":"我跟委員報告有部份教育部這段時間給我來說明有些可能或許我們司法院或什麼來補充"},{"start":10772.742,"end":10772.922,"text":"委員會主席"},{"start":10792.426,"end":10803.909,"text":"特別會針對暴險少年或司法少年因為這個也就是有一些個案產生像比如新北的這個事件的這種對象我是舉例啦就比較希望如果經過我們一個機制裁定後覺得暫時還是不要立刻回歸到學校的這個做法"},{"start":10813.012,"end":10813.512,"text":"委員會主席"},{"start":10837.625,"end":10837.665,"text":"主席"},{"start":10858.712,"end":10859.552,"text":"上海大學教育學院副教授"},{"start":10880.197,"end":10880.958,"text":"請教育部、司法院、法務部及內政部列席"},{"start":10899.521,"end":10921.309,"text":"一過這一段以後適不適合回學校我想用這樣的專業做評估應該會更客觀也會讓這些學生在回歸前得到比較適切的評估跟安置這個是我想對於目前我們在整個跨院的合作裡面這個都有共識那教育部啟動中介基地的協助縣市已經啟動那司法院這邊2月1日開始的那個事辦計畫我有詳細讀過真的也就是過去學校反映到"},{"start":10928.672,"end":10930.393,"text":"從頭到後面的追蹤也能確保少年在保護管束的過程當中是真正有調整"},{"start":10936.892,"end":10961.408,"text":"那接著因為最近有保姆虐童的事件先期社會很大的討論那本席對這起事件也感到相當痛心那我們為了防止這樣的悲劇再次發生所以是立法跟行政單位都絕不能這個懈怠的責任所以其實幼兒園也屢屢出現這種不當對待學童的事件那剛好准公幼"},{"start":10962.048,"end":10985.873,"text":"今年8月將邁入第三期 原所準備要重新申請這是一個全面檢視准公幼的機會包括他的辦學、教學、保育品質等等那我想之前全教總我指出准公幼政策上路之後統計六都違規的比例達到三分之一就等於說"},{"start":10986.533,"end":11005.297,"text":"每三家准公幼就有一家是有違規紀錄的那家長把心安寶貝送到幼兒園那必定是希望寶貝受到最好的照顧那本席對虐童絕對是零容忍所以我想對於幼兒園的幼教師跟教保員的工作權益有沒有得到保障我覺得這個攸關這個會不會有虐童的這個機會所以我想提高審查的門檻"},{"start":11013.459,"end":11036.315,"text":"對幼準工及嚴格監督這是必然的現在教育部正在擬定第三期草案目前的草案我想自今年8月起有要求師生比就當是我們努力的從1比15到1比12當然還要上傳午餐跟點心的照片還有教保委員員的薪資要調整調整2000塊也訂出所謂的退場機制"},{"start":11042.179,"end":11066.917,"text":"那當然我要就叫部長是說現在因為幼兒園已經陸續在招生中那部長剛剛好像也有回答說3月底會交這個審查的辦法這個案子到各縣市政府讓他審查那審查應該也需要一段時間所以如果有學校還沒有申請過關可是他已經"},{"start":11068.098,"end":11088.751,"text":"招生招生了就是說他已經導致報名好的學童們可能要改讀其他的學校這樣對這些學生是不是有權益上的損失家長是不是會措手不及那從總體面來看教育部到底有沒有掌握我們第三期的規定上路之後那全台灣到底有哪些總公幼會因此而退場"},{"start":11089.691,"end":11115.643,"text":"那受到影響的學生數大約有多少那有沒有預警的機制讓學校端跟家長都有所準備部長我跟委員報告確實目前這個第三期的合作契約的條件正在做最後的確認因為就是剛才委員所提到教保服務品質、教保人員的待遇還有管理那件事情還有加上生死比的幾個政策"},{"start":11116.523,"end":11124.985,"text":"所以重整後目前在3月底會正式公布對外那縣市也會依這個規範來做後續的審查如果有意願的那我也跟我們報告這個我們私校退場條例的概念會應用在這上面如果這個幼兒園已經不再續約那但是他本來就就讀小班、中班還繼續在讀的這些孩子會列為我們一定會去保障家長的這個權益的角度來思考"},{"start":11145.271,"end":11145.751,"text":"吳佩奕委員教育部長"},{"start":11172.256,"end":11189.912,"text":"委員好部長好去年不幸發生的新北市的歌喉案社會各界都很關心那後續我們教育部以及相關其他部會也啟動了多次的會議也啟動了相關機制的修正不過我還是希望就去年這個事件的通報"},{"start":11191.213,"end":11196.878,"text":"其中的細節事實想要做一個釐清因為當時我們非常關心的是因為第一時間新北傳出案件的時候學校對外對媒體發布的說這個是一個這個是美工刀造成的意外傷害但是根據我們教育部的校安通報的要點這個是屬於緊急事件兩個小時之內一定要完成通報對不對"},{"start":11218.979,"end":11228.702,"text":"所以我想請問當時這個學校有沒有在兩小時之內完成通報?若它是屬於緊急事故就我們的通報要點"},{"start":11239.099,"end":11241.08,"text":"請問當時我們收到通報的時候因為在我們通報類別裡面也是有分類的"},{"start":11257.085,"end":11279.822,"text":"有意外事件有暴力事件與偏差行為那因為當時媒體上面學校第一時間的時候對媒體說是一個意外所以我想請問當時我們教育部這裡收到通報校園中心收到通報通報過來的是屬於意外事件還是暴力事件委員這個我再確認一下好了不好意思現在有沒有資訊"},{"start":11293.605,"end":11306.56,"text":"為什麼我要問這個問題呢?因為我看了我們的通報要點以及後續的處理的流程等等你是意外事件還是暴力事件第一個對於學校的家長"},{"start":11308.41,"end":11322.155,"text":"他在心理的預期上以及準備上以及後續的處置他可能都會有極大的落差以及不同所以我認為正確通報的必要性是非常重要所以我需要確認當時通報給我們的是屬於什麼案件"},{"start":11325.776,"end":11343.563,"text":"跟委員報告我剛才請同仁確認當時兩小時之內的通報學校通報給校園的是暴力是暴力事件對暴力這個總統就我所知在事件發生之後我們教育部也協同新北市政府教育局也召開過檢討會議這部分我希望我們教育部能夠來協助輔導未來的地方政府要去輔導學校在事件發生的當下確認了事實之後再來對外做發布"},{"start":11354.767,"end":11356.068,"text":"在這個案件之後呢我們也注意到說像這樣的案件發生它其實是會造成"},{"start":11370.661,"end":11373.882,"text":"學生的集體的創傷它其實是一個集體性的事件因為這麼多人目睹了那學校我們原來就有新府相關的資源在本案發生之後在新北市的處置因為就我看的資料學校裡面的新府人力是不足的"},{"start":11389.508,"end":11392.989,"text":"我跟委員報告這組委員所提的在第一時間我了解後我也請新北教育局局長一定要除了受傷害的孩子還有行為人以外"},{"start":11413.815,"end":11414.596,"text":"請教育部、司法院及內政部列席"},{"start":11429.374,"end":11431.036,"text":"請教育部、司法院、法務部及內政部列席"},{"start":11445.497,"end":11457.02,"text":"在整個進行過程當中還有相關的措施跟資源能夠及時做協助是 部長在我們教育部的這個規定裡面其實當學校有需求的時候因為各縣市的輔資中心資源條件也不大一樣學校也是可以來尋求校外外部的身心精神醫療資源等等相關的協助就本案來說我們學校有沒有尋求外部的協助應該這樣子說這個部分"},{"start":11472.824,"end":11473.304,"text":"請教育部、司法院及內政部列席"},{"start":11491.834,"end":11491.874,"text":"主席"},{"start":11513.617,"end":11530.124,"text":"我應該這樣子提到因為為什麼會有當時在設立輔資中心他其實主要就是希望能夠跨校際的屬於在一個縣市裡面能夠他不一定是指在輔資中心的成員你其他的所以我們有這樣相關的名稱那另外一個比較當然有涉及到我們學校也會跟比較多的應該都是跟醫療單位有合作的契約"},{"start":11539.147,"end":11541.888,"text":"部長我是建議這個部分我們是不是可以有明確的這個流程以及相關的清單因為台北市這幾年已經開始有在建立跟民間的這個資源的連結網絡這種在盤旗下機有的機制之下從這個個案發生如果有可以再強化的部分今天就我們看到"},{"start":11556.616,"end":11569.921,"text":"新北的這一案他輔資中心的人力一共是17人那輔資中心平常就有他們例行性的業務所以你當這個突發的意外狀況發生的時候他是需要一定的人力來進駐這個單位但倘若這個意外"},{"start":11573.322,"end":11573.502,"text":"在校園裡面我們可以啟動關懷輔導機制"},{"start":11603.052,"end":11607.975,"text":"然後呢在他進到曝險階段或是處罰階段成為少年司法案件之前中間有一個中介的過程那中介教育一個他是可以成為我們的防線也許他在關懷輔導階段"},{"start":11622.105,"end":11645.548,"text":"我們就可以成功的拉住他那一個是當他已經進入到少年司法案件之後我們經過相關的評估他可能也需要有不同的後續的這個中介的措施的方式所以我覺得中介教育是非常重要的但是我們看到在這個我這個字表上面在中介以及少年司法案件中間"},{"start":11648.202,"end":11672.06,"text":"有一群少年他是中輟生就我們現在手邊拿到的資料每一年我們國小的中輟生有將近300人國中的中輟生一年度有將近2000人這是屬於未就學也未就業的這個少年那現在這一群人在我們教育部裡面是由清法署來進行輔導關懷追蹤是不是"},{"start":11674.241,"end":11674.261,"text":"韓國瑜議員"},{"start":11693.238,"end":11709.062,"text":"還有合作中途這些都還不是到我們這一次我們要強化的是有關真的司法少年從少關說我們的中介基地是用來協助已經處罰的司法少年沒有錯另外我現在講這些中錯生他只是未就業那我們現在清發署能夠去提供他們什麼樣的協助因為我們終究希望"},{"start":11717.284,"end":11717.965,"text":"國中畢業以後衛生學、衛教業的這方面請青年署擴大量能"},{"start":11733.095,"end":11738.258,"text":"現在目前服務量已經到3000多位了也就是比較希望能夠更去抓到如果他知道比如說這個孩子就準備要重考這個類似我舉例這個當然我們就不用那麼擔心這個孩子什麼都沒有這個就很要去做所以現在青胞組專案在處理這個衛生協會就業的部分是以這個機制能夠確實的掌握到每個個案的狀況過去的服務量能只有幾百位我覺得是不夠的"},{"start":11760.649,"end":11767.212,"text":"是 沒錯 因為我看了清法署我們這幾年相關的處置那事實上沒有錯我們每一年會開一次兩次的跨部會會議這一群未就業的青少年他們絕對也是需要我們來自跨部會橫向的聯繫來協助他們因為我們希望在他哪一個階段裡面我們就有機會把他們撈回來有機會讓他們可以回流"},{"start":11787.202,"end":11798.751,"text":"所以我看我們除了有跨部會的會議我們有分區的會議我希望我們教育部是不是可以來協助讓清發署針對未就學、未就業的這一群青少年我們是有機會能夠把他們拉回來讓他們有機會能夠回流到校園這部分我認為我們需要加強橫向的聯繫好 這部分我們再持續努力我說從過去幾百位到現在三千多位"},{"start":11814.462,"end":11814.582,"text":"陳秀寶委員"},{"start":11842.199,"end":11844.479,"text":"謝謝詹委請潘部長來部長委員好部長早安首先我這邊先請教部長之前我們深港鄉有發生一個三姊弟他在放學的時候穿越馬路發生車禍那這個其實我們全國各界都非常的關心也伸出援手來協助他家中的困境那大家也都非常關心兩位姊姊後續的醫療的狀況醫治的狀況但是在這邊我要請教部長"},{"start":11871.446,"end":11875.032,"text":"這個事件發生之後,學校對這三項事件．對在校學生有沒有啟動相關的心腹機制?"},{"start":11880.799,"end":11887.003,"text":"這部分我可能再了解一下因為除了說對這三姐弟我們後續的我們要來關心說他們的後續的治療的狀況那對交通安全的提升那其實對在校學生這一個是一個很大的衝擊所以說這個部分學校應該做一個妥善的一個處理來對學校的這些同學這些學生做一個心腹的這個"},{"start":11903.433,"end":11904.093,"text":"委員提醒那一段我再瞭解一下"},{"start":11932.665,"end":11952.811,"text":"關於今天的主題其實近日很多校園事件一流所聞那發生這樣子遺憾的事件本席也感到非常的痛心但是本席這邊更關心是說在我們事件發生之後教育部這邊有意義來修正學校訂定教師輔導與管教學生辦法注意事項"},{"start":11954.772,"end":11965.178,"text":"這個修訂有沒有符合我們教育現場的需求這次的修正呢教育部是以校園安全諮詢會的意見然後新增了特定學生的定義條件以及校園安全檢查的這個機制的流程陪同人員的彈性措施等等並且在2月5號就修訂完成那請問部長喔新學期到目前為止實施的狀況如何教學現場的相關人員有沒有什麼意見的回饋"},{"start":11984.551,"end":12002.302,"text":"跟委員報告,因為這次的注意事項確實是做全面的盤點那也很細密的邀請我們相關,包括校長、教師、學生還有我們一些長期關心學童安全的團體還有縣市,詳細的開了7次的會議,就逐一逐一的討論"},{"start":12004.284,"end":12013.272,"text":"這裡面當然也包含有時候老師們關心的一到五突發事件他們在這方面怎麼做才不會說動輒得救有一個叫去除有關免罰的這個做法這個確實也是來自學校希望這方面能夠讓學校老師們在做必要管理的措施"},{"start":12027.125,"end":12033.968,"text":"在這個校園安全諮詢會這個意見我們納入之後我們來修訂我們是不是也要採納在教學現場老師們的意見、學校的意見對、然後這一次全面的討論裡面也包含到我們說剛才委員談到我們歸納下來對於說可能會造成其他學生、人員有生命、身體這種對象那也要能夠進行相關的不定期、隨時的安全檢查的概念"},{"start":12057.119,"end":12077.957,"text":"在校園的安全諮詢會上面教育部你們有提到就是說會規劃各縣市政府聯絡處呢要來增置高關懷學生的個案輔導員並且增置中小學學務以及校安人員等等的配套措施那這邊呢我要想要請教說我們目前這個配套措施的研議以及進度如何"},{"start":12078.377,"end":12083.961,"text":"那其實我希望說教育部你們在滾動檢討新的學校訂定教師輔導與管教學生辦法注意事項這個實施成效呢你們要配合實施的狀況我剛剛提到的要配合現場教學現場他們的需求來做調整同時也要很積極的來推動因為相關的這個規劃我們趕快去實施才能去應應到越來越多這樣的事件發生"},{"start":12103.756,"end":12122.777,"text":"委員提到有一個對我們現在叫做各縣市的聯絡處當時大家在提這個構想的時候會覺得因為聯絡處其實我們的同仁包含軍訓教官、創新人力其實長期也都在協助這些我們說高關懷學生包含毒品防治等等的"},{"start":12123.978,"end":12147.715,"text":"在討論的過程當中學校校長或我們同仁他們比較希望說這方面是一個輔助還是希望能夠在學校端對於輔導人力能夠加速的來按照學務法來充實以及對於學務處很繁重的這個工作能夠增加因為那個是每個學校等於說日常會去碰到的行政書所以我們在這方面反而是大家經過幾次討論會先以這個為重點那聯絡處的部分"},{"start":12153.399,"end":12158.201,"text":"能夠持續來協助畫校間的這種工作所以還在規劃這個相關的措施還在規劃有關輔導教師的這部分的人力會提前先要說教育部你們這邊要積極也要再快一點"},{"start":12169.806,"end":12180.134,"text":"本席發現在校安通報中暴力事件跟偏差行為中國小、國中、高中每個階段的暴力事件是一年比一年多那你看一下這個資料從101年國小是968件"},{"start":12185.078,"end":12201.705,"text":"10年之間到112年變成9370件將近10倍那國中、高中都增加了將近有4倍有8000多件所以說國小學生這樣的暴力事件的增加的速度應該是"},{"start":12203.506,"end":12215.797,"text":"部長您也感覺到這是很嚴重的應該也跟我一樣是很震驚那除此之外國小教師有反應暴力事件的發生年齡層有向下延伸的趨勢在過去可能在高年級才會發生這樣的狀況現在從中年級從三年級開始就有這樣的現象發生這個部分"},{"start":12222.543,"end":12227.746,"text":"部長您知道嗎我跟委員報告這個112跟111或幾年這個部分其實通報的人數就如剛才委員所提到的這個這個我也跟委員報告一個情況因為過去外界很多的調查都說我們學生可能有受到霸凌或有這些衝突但是隱忍"},{"start":12244.835,"end":12247.317,"text":"當然部長您的意思我理解因為有通報所以我們才知道有這樣的事件所以造成說以前可能沒有通報所以不知道說有事件這麼多但是有這麼高的發生的件數這個是我們必須要去正視的它真的是一個很嚴重的現象"},{"start":12270.256,"end":12275.778,"text":"有老師分析可能是因為現在的網路科技比較發達學生接觸這些3C產品使用太多導致說我們的孩子現在比較少跟人實際上的去溝通也導致說他們的情緒控管能力會變得比較差尤其是這個短影音的影響因為它是一種快速表達跟快速的接收"},{"start":12289.921,"end":12296.306,"text":"所以說今天我指出這個現象是希望說教育部你們要正視這個狀況的嚴重性並且我們應該去分析是什麼原因造成孩子們暴力的這個事件增加我們在學校的課程裡面是不是應該要增加一些溝通的或者認識暴力相關的課程告訴我們孩子們溝通以及暴力行為這個溝通的重要以及暴力行為的不可取因為有時候其實我們孩子這麼小的年紀有時候他其實可能"},{"start":12319.705,"end":12324.549,"text":"沒有認知到說他這樣的行為是很嚴重的傷害暴力的行為有的孩子只是覺得說他是一種學習或錯誤的模仿但是他沒有意識到當他手中如果是有筆有美工刀的時候這個揮出去對其他人的傷害性有多大有多麼的嚴重所以這邊我要呼籲我們教育部我們要從源頭來追溯說"},{"start":12342.142,"end":12365.774,"text":"暴力事件發生以及這些偏差行為發生的原因並且我們應該融入課程讓教育孩子教育我們的學生這個暴力事件的嚴重性部長您覺得是委員所提的這個我非常認同我想從教育上尤其是不管是情緒或跟人溝通互動等等的這些在我們12年國教的課綱裡面其實有這個課程但是能夠再更深化強調我覺得很必要"},{"start":12371.397,"end":12375.002,"text":"有時候定在課綱裡面所以我剛才一直提到說教學現場老師的意見的反應非常的重要對對我跟委員報告就是因為有這個課就表示有這個課程尤其是我們像輔導專任的輔導教師那孫師是不是成效不佳我們要檢討這一點就我說我們要再深化"},{"start":12388.839,"end":12410.517,"text":"這邊再跟部長您討論根據警政署的統計通報112年少年嫌疑犯比上個年度增加了1000多人增加的幅度高達12.9%是將近13%那少年犯罪形態又以詐欺以及兒少性剝削增加的幅度最大其中兒少性剝削的增幅竟然高達60%"},{"start":12412.278,"end":12412.358,"text":"委員會主席"},{"start":12431.004,"end":12432.965,"text":"請教育部、司法院、法務部及內政部列席就:「教育部、司法院及內政部列席是否塗銷?」"},{"start":12458.695,"end":12459.976,"text":"網路的這方面造成的影響確實非常大所以我們對於這方面在學校的"},{"start":12480.665,"end":12488.489,"text":"有關資訊素養的這方面這個確實是一個重點那對於真的有關詐騙的這個現象我們從過去反讀入班宣導現在也把詐騙這個事情放進來不只是詐騙部長我在這邊要提醒你們就是說如果說我們的成效沒有那麼好就表示說我們該檢討這邊主席再給我一點時間我趕快把他講完那學校"},{"start":12508.055,"end":12520.901,"text":"學校的老師在面對孩子這些暴力偏差行為那其實有時候對象不只是學生對學生也會有學生對老師那根據教育部的統計我們高中以下的教師被不當對待的這個通報事件已經"},{"start":12523.962,"end":12529.483,"text":"也比往年從111年的71.6%到今年2月已經提升到88.7%相對的我們的教師他所面對的壓力是越來越大那我們的教師他透過這個新府的資商管道尋求協助的人數也一年比一年多所以說我們現在除了關心我們的孩子也要關心我們的教師因為他們承受著各種的壓力"},{"start":12548.328,"end":12549.309,"text":"教育部現在除了對我們的各學校來示範學生的心理調適價這邊也想請教育部這邊來研議是不是評估一下增加教師的心理調適價"},{"start":12563.507,"end":12563.547,"text":"請你們審慎評估"},{"start":12584.711,"end":12598.36,"text":"謝謝委員我想對老師心理支持我們今年的預算增加10倍就是希望也要幫老師解決他心理上的一些壓力那委員所提的調適下這個可能我們相關各類人員應該要一併的做一些討論謝謝好 謝謝部長接下來我們請范雲委員在范雲委員質詢結束完之後呢我們就要處理我們的臨時提案 謝謝"},{"start":12613.144,"end":12613.806,"text":"謝謝昭葦,據說有今天這個專題,我們請潘部長,謝謝"},{"start":12620.93,"end":12644.548,"text":"響鐘"},{"start":12645.368,"end":12670.618,"text":"其實風險的來源有一個部分就是教育體系跟司法體系各自為政只要人不在自己的系統中就不管當然司法體系沒辦法兼顧課業教育體系輔導人力的不足讓少年教師同學家長目前都有很大的焦慮我們整理了從我們看到的資料當中就是這個暴險跟觸法少年回歸校園的問題中"},{"start":12672.759,"end":12674.141,"text":"發言委員．3月18日及21日三天一次會議發言委員．3月18日及21日三天一次會議"},{"start":12687.817,"end":12688.478,"text":"您是否同意需要轉弦的機制?"},{"start":12718.38,"end":12745.692,"text":"我贊成,而且我跟委員報告這次也是我們幾個跨部會包括跨院的討論的一個重點就是在於我們這個少教官或少保官對於這些司法少年要做這個瞭解所謂的調查跟要做最終要裁決就是委員說是不是應該安置在什麼地方的判斷這一段是我們這次幾個跨部會、跨院非常聚焦討論有的共識"},{"start":12747.313,"end":12747.993,"text":"司法院主導的保護管束風險管理計劃"},{"start":12772.128,"end":12798.162,"text":"那我想請問的是就是我想請問先請部長好了我剛研究了一下就是說我們辦公室之前看到有點不清楚這兩個之間的關係社區中介教育跟司法院事辦中的保護管束風險管理計畫那你們要做分類跟風險評估就是我剛所講這一塊那這裡面有沒有學校的代表在裡面那個請問司法院的廳長謝廳長"},{"start":12800.646,"end":12825.395,"text":"那個保護管束風險管理計畫沒有你說委員是說你們事辦中的就是今年2月1號開始事辦到明年的跟委員報告其實從110年開始我們跟行政院包含教育部每個個案其實都會只要少年在學校上學那學校一定會跟法院法院也會跟學校但會密切的去了解學校在"},{"start":12826.756,"end":12843.417,"text":"會有學校的代表參與這個風險管理的個案的討論嗎?會,以台南地院來說,1號開始每個禮拜他們大概就會去檢討主案的去評估少年風險因子那如果說要開會就會通知學校派員來"},{"start":12844.298,"end":12844.698,"text":"我有跟委員報告"},{"start":12863.866,"end":12883.363,"text":"我們原來對不到叫做暴險少年或司法少年的這部分原來的教育體系就有關高官懷班或資源班或不資源班那個辭彙班跟中途學校合作的這種模式啦那這個模式基本上的對象"},{"start":12885.424,"end":12885.524,"text":"主席"},{"start":12915.064,"end":12919.409,"text":"教育部長,我們直接監督的是教育部,那是不是針對剛剛講的六都事辦的計畫跟你們社區中介教育跟回學校中間的評估"},{"start":12929.821,"end":12930.041,"text":"主席主席主席"},{"start":12950.774,"end":12953.977,"text":"整個要啟動這個機制我覺得這幾個非常關鍵的比如說我們少年法庭的少保官或調查官或我們要即將準備要接受這個學生或原來就是這個學校的學生然後我們幾個相關的機構應該在這樣的討論過程能夠有充分的交換意見"},{"start":12974.696,"end":12977.019,"text":"這個是不是轉弦會議我不知道只是說這個會議我們認為在調查過程尤其是學校應該可以更深入了解到說這樣的少年到底他的整個行為的情況就是學校是不是接得起來"},{"start":12990.993,"end":12991.473,"text":"主席主席"},{"start":13013.988,"end":13028.073,"text":"因為這個可能在進行中因為司法院這個我讀過這個方案是真的跟過去來講是一個更能夠對於這些暴險少年當然也要支持有更多的人力少保官來因為到事後比如裁決後的持續追蹤列管"},{"start":13032.754,"end":13043.697,"text":"其實這個需要時間跟人力那如果是這樣我覺得教育體系、學校體系跟我們司法體系它就連接得很好那個中介基地是一個場域就是說它可能要幾個月後評估後才適合回到學校但是這個人力上的幾個主管機關我認為是一個非常重要的串接"},{"start":13053.223,"end":13055.564,"text":"教育部規劃的這個社區中介教育基地我覺得非常的重要請問目前你們對於哪些少年需要進入這個基地那什麼時候離開有沒有規定那一樣的就是說這個本身回學校的時候是不是有轉嫌機制"},{"start":13075.672,"end":13080.356,"text":"這個就跟您上面所關心的我們教育單位跟司法體系會有關聯性的這個教育部跟各縣市未來在3月這個方案定下來5月開始這個其實我們當時設定的對象是有別於過去屬於中作孩子或家庭功能比較不彰的他不是暴嫌少年"},{"start":13100.193,"end":13117.472,"text":"其實我們本來就有幾個中途的教育的措施在那這一次這個基地比較是撫顯少年或司法少年為主要的所以在跟民間團體合作的這方面目前三十幾個團體也都是過去有接觸協助過撫顯少年的這種經驗的團體為主"},{"start":13122.216,"end":13124.058,"text":"關於最後回到校園之間誰應該參與轉弦的會議或機制也請部長一個月報告裡面一起給我"},{"start":13137.526,"end":13161.291,"text":"那因為時間的緣故我想直接問部長一個相關的問題剛剛並沒有人問的因為我們知道這裡面的觸法跟暴嫌少年其中有一種是性犯罪就是性侵的據說這樣子的一個少年那相關的輔導廚藝裡面它的每一關因為性媒體教育法主管機關是教育部那這裡面的每一關會不會有相關的專業人士參與跟進行呢"},{"start":13166.087,"end":13188.279,"text":"委員如果因為性別平等教育法所處理的大概都是跟這些性別事件但是委員所提到這一類對象的學生過去教育部也在全國有幾個地方就是有關屬於性剝削等的已經是處罰的了他也有幾個中途學校"},{"start":13189.52,"end":13205.513,"text":"因為我們上週《性平法》、《三法》剛好三八婦女節實施九鎮學校我們也設置了性平會那教育部是不是也可以就是說回去檢視一下那少年在不同的階段相關的機制裡面是不是都有專業的人員一起參與他的輔導處置"},{"start":13209.997,"end":13213.041,"text":"現在目前如果說已經經過防治條例的這些措施之後的學校目前就是有幾個據點以這個對象為一個處理"},{"start":13228.3,"end":13252.125,"text":"那相關的這部分也給我辦公室一個月一個報告好嗎好這個關於這個性犯罪的部分那最後呢我想針對司法院的部分我非常認同就是你們目前的人力不足以承擔這麼重要的工作那調查跟保護目前沒有分類調查官兼保護官也是個問題那我想我們應該要一起爭取鬆綁員額能夠增加少年調查官跟保護官的人力讓他們能夠適當的分工"},{"start":13258.246,"end":13259.227,"text":"今天有委員提出臨時提案共計三案我們現在先請宣讀"},{"start":13275.168,"end":13294.619,"text":"一案,私立學校並列入《專府學校及停辦建築博古牌效應》出現．對此,學校受教以及教職員工權益務必權利行為．但所屬教師轉職等相關事務應應列入協助．以免故此失禮。私校退場條例於2022年公募實施後．"},{"start":13295.699,"end":13300.944,"text":"專府及停辦學校教師離職轉校之契約、賠償以及離職證明取得等問題重申政府有照顧並保護學生、教職員與教師之義務會避免造成後續問題不斷擴大應針對私校退場條例以及相關原則規定進行檢視與補強第二案"},{"start":13316.079,"end":13334.253,"text":"有鑒於中華足球協會以剝削式的合約．並以恐嚇威逼式說法．要求女足國家對球員簽訂情誓．該協會主措以嚴重影響國人信任．讓球員心生恐懼的心理壓力．造成女足發展阻力．"},{"start":13334.773,"end":13362.455,"text":"依據國民體育法第33條以及第43條規定（體育署應主動介入並進行後續督導考核（讓體育競技及女足發展重回正軌（找回國人信心。第三案東海國中從民國57年創校到現在（一直是臺東學生數規模第二大的國中（但是創校56年來一直都沒有體育館（跟大型室內學生活動中心（"},{"start":13363.215,"end":13380.074,"text":"五十六年來沒有任何一屆的畢業生是在學校的禮堂參加完畢業典禮走出校園五十六年來無數教職員學生殷切期盼能夠容納全校師生的大型室內活動場館"},{"start":13381.375,"end":13407.904,"text":"為解決該校此疑困境．臺東縣政府積極籌備相關預算．為該校活動中心新建經費高達一億二千萬元．臺東縣政府已利用花中基金申請七千萬元補助．人有五千萬元的缺口需要中央協助．為維護東海國中師生教育權益．保障學生活動安全．原提案要求教育部應於一個月內邀集各所屬機關．召開會議延伤"},{"start":13411.705,"end":13423.188,"text":"經費補助是與提案人萬美玲、柯志恩、羅廷偉、葛羅鈞、黃建斌宣的完畢好,我們針對第一案那個提案人林倩琦委員有沒有意見?針對第一案我們教育部這邊跟我後來有一個通案的好,那我們請部長來做修正說明好不好?好,謝謝那部長可不可以請做一些修正說明?"},{"start":13440.046,"end":13455.71,"text":"好,謝謝主席還有各位委員針對第一案您委員的跟我們幾位委員的這個提案剛才跟委員這邊有做報告可能會做部分文字的修正我說明一下就在說明3的第一行開始"},{"start":13459.191,"end":13473.908,"text":"教育部應針對私校退場條例後面我們就發函要求各校針對那個我們就建議把它刪除之後定定有關教師聘任契約之離職賠償以轉職證明等約定時應"},{"start":13481.676,"end":13505.678,"text":"符合一般法律規定或比例原則例如教師離職預告超過60日及不應要求離職賠償或拒絕發給離職證明等提供私立學校來做一體試用做參考那詳細的文字如果委員同意我們再把這個給我們議事組這邊可以做這個文字的整理"},{"start":13509.673,"end":13512.555,"text":"教育部,體育署這邊有來調了幾個字那是不是這幾個字我們也同意就比較中性一點的寫法"},{"start":13531.861,"end":13532.081,"text":"補充說明"},{"start":13562.301,"end":13582.856,"text":"求委員等到該協會舉措以後面那幾個字也刪除嚴重影響國人信任那幾個字刪除還有讓求委員心生心理壓力、恐懼的那幾個字委員同意刪除那在說明的一經爆料中華足協要求"},{"start":13583.834,"end":13602.079,"text":"後面剝削選手還逼迫這幾個字我們就刪除然後說明一的第二行提訴雖曾從旁瞭解但主席仍一意孤行這幾個字做刪除修正然後說明是因為這個案子主席已經這個"},{"start":13604.119,"end":13604.479,"text":"有關於第三案的部分"},{"start":13632.797,"end":13633.578,"text":"提案委員黃建斌"},{"start":13654.81,"end":13658.511,"text":"主席、在場委員、先進列席的政府機關事長、官員、會長、公共夥伴、媒體及女士先生"},{"start":13683.926,"end":13702.674,"text":"有幫節省時間了吧有請潘部長委員午安部長好部長我們今天都在關心一些校園內的暴力那你認為現在少子化你覺得我們青少年的犯罪率是降低還是提高"},{"start":13703.609,"end":13712.296,"text":"像所謂的校園安全亮起紅燈大家認為暴力事件是現在最大對學生的侵害你認為呢暴力事件是目前學生犯罪的最主要的原因嗎"},{"start":13732.206,"end":13753.14,"text":"跟委員報告如果就我們掌握到通報的這些內容裡面應該來說有幾個類型就包含剛講暴力等等的通報這些算多還有一個其他的類型我告訴你其實大家有一個錯誤因為暴力是很矚目但大多數的青少年犯罪是什麼是詐欺"},{"start":13754.727,"end":13774.292,"text":"炸器才是目前我們青少年犯罪率當中節節升高的主要原因它對我們學子的強害、違和更甚於一個暴力事件往往下看其實啊為什麼學生會去參與炸機?您覺得呢?他是當車手嘛對,這個是我們掌握到對,那為什麼學生會去當車手?"},{"start":13776.806,"end":13802.301,"text":"有些誘因吧有誘因但是他可能看在錢的份上他可能不曉得後果很嚴重教說青少年犯罪是加重刑責教說的人很清楚找年輕人去犯罪找學生犯罪很嚴重的但是往下看但是青少年當車手他的未來怎麼樣對他一輩子的影響他可能信用破產他可能沒辦法貸款買房子這個部長你覺得我們的年輕人知道嗎"},{"start":13804.071,"end":13827.45,"text":"有些可能不那麼清楚是的所以我覺得呢其實青少年犯罪除了少數的暴力事件讓大家社會矚目之外更潛藏著這些青少年他的觀念上他不曉得這些犯罪的嚴重後果所以呢我們看到有一個施改前進校園講座的列車啟動你知道他們到哪裡去宣講嗎重庭給你標出來了"},{"start":13831.94,"end":13832.48,"text":"大專校園"},{"start":13855.469,"end":13860.474,"text":"目前看到有一些有幾年齡稍長18歲以下確實是這個教育部因為行政院有一個防詐的辦公專案所以我們會再討論委員這個建議我想我們會提出來"},{"start":13873.027,"end":13901.122,"text":"因為這個市改列車是法務部在主導的啦我會請法務部來繼續參與來,法務部的也請上來,待會問到你另外呢,學生參與市改現場給予一些回饋降低犯罪另外一個作法呢,就是讓學生知道你犯的罪不只你自己未來的發展人生會受到影響你也害了人家造成的傷害往下看這個是日本來那個法務部的是是哪一位?是廳長嗎?"},{"start":13903.718,"end":13912.626,"text":"教政署周署長跟朱責任檢察官來 那個署長是你知道日本有一個感化教育的機構吧"},{"start":13915.205,"end":13935.815,"text":"知道所以他們目前的做法就是說讓這些少年院就是我們說的我們的類似少監或者說矯正機構的少司法他們去理解被害人他們家屬的心聲讓他從這樣的犯罪受害人的一個心理去同理去檢討他你覺得我們台灣的矯正學校會參考辦理嗎"},{"start":13938.862,"end":13960.3,"text":"報告委員我們矯正學校是會做一些比如說相關的入校的一些輔導調查讓他去了解被害人也是很痛苦的有沒有做到一個同理心的教育我們會有三級輔導來 那個部長你覺得這個有沒有需要在法務部的矯正學校去加入這種事情這樣的一個同理的一個課程"},{"start":13962.609,"end":13971.406,"text":"如果從教育的角度我覺得是能夠讓他們多一點機會我來介紹一位是他們的名陽的校長但是他說到了他這裡啊"},{"start":13973.001,"end":13995.615,"text":"他能救的很有限大概大多數會在回籠只成為成年犯而已為什麼他這麼悲觀他說10歲就決定了啦什麼意思他看了這些少年犯他瞭解他們成長過程很多都是私能家庭下的受害者他們10歲的人格偏差造成偏差行為一步步走上歧途他說教育資源、輔導資源要及早投入您同不同意"},{"start":13996.095,"end":14022.543,"text":"同意 同意好 往下 各位報告學生輔導法為什麼我們這次增加人力 就是在小學的部分也是這樣的概念是的 所以我很開心的看到 欣慰的看到你們有一個計劃 今天的書面報告要提早在國小的輔導人力116年度完成 提前4個學年對 是 所以我最後結論的 因為主席的要求 我們的結論法務部是不是可以加強青少年的法治教育 四改列車開靠的中學及高級中學的教育現場 國中跟高級中學可以嗎"},{"start":14023.783,"end":14029.067,"text":"請教育部提出到116年你們整個國小輔導人力的增補計畫讓我們知道教育部很積極地在辦理"},{"start":14049.69,"end":14057.213,"text":"好 謝謝莊建斌委員 謝謝部長 那我們接下來謝依鳳委員 謝依鳳委員 謝依鳳委員 黃建斌委員謝謝主席 請教一下我們的教育部部長謝謝"},{"start":14080.089,"end":14080.209,"text":"主席"},{"start":14110.269,"end":14128.22,"text":"謝謝部長 部長本席再次強調就是貧窮不是台東的原罪貧窮也不能限制孩童他的未來跟發展這邊我要再請教育部就針對本席提的這個案子能夠來協助以及未來台東的跟教育有關的資源等等來挹注在台東偏鄉這邊來協助他們發展"},{"start":14129.94,"end":14129.98,"text":"主席"},{"start":14143.424,"end":14164.958,"text":"部長今天質詢之後臺東縣的所有的教師、教職員應該都很感謝那同時我想要再幫教職員講一些話就是我們最近發生的校園暴力的事件我覺得其實在討論到學生人權的同時其實我們也要去考慮到學校管理這一塊本期建議真的要合理的授權來共同維護校園的安全"},{"start":14166.138,"end":14191.834,"text":"我們剛才提到就是學生進入校園之後他所帶的違禁品這件事情是會造成很大的隱憂因為你根本不知道學生的書包裡放了什麼東西所以這邊也要請教育部這邊來研議那盡量避免發生這樣的憾事特別是剛才我們中央兵委員提到的小學的部分學生很多他不懂他會去模仿會學習像小朋友會帶著像我的小孩才7歲他帶著堂皇老學校玩"},{"start":14192.754,"end":14193.195,"text":"請教育部發言委員"},{"start":14209.995,"end":14227.506,"text":"我跟委員報告這次確實從新北的這個校園事件後教育部跟地方政府還有我們相關的這些校長、教師、學生團體做了很深入的討論當中跟老師的這個輔導管教的這方面也在這一次裡面有一個阻卻這個違法事件"},{"start":14229.867,"end":14252.501,"text":"就讓老師在面對這些做管教上面能夠不要去接受到處分甚至影響到考機這是這次注意事項裡面一個重要的修正重點那另外像有一些我們說比較有傷害他人生命的這些特定對象在整個安檢的這方面也支持學校應該要有一個更機動的這樣的一個機制"},{"start":14255.663,"end":14255.843,"text":"．3月18日及21日"},{"start":14272.815,"end":14300.374,"text":"謝謝部長相信部長在這個會後應該會研究出一個更適合未來我們在管理上的方法確保不管是學生或是老師在校園安全上能夠來提升那再次的也再次謝謝部長的允諾那謝謝對台東未來的資源能夠更加的投入那謝謝部長謝謝主席主席謝謝謝謝台東來的建兵委員他大概是我們這個今天最有禮貌的對不對跟你謝了好多次謝謝部長"},{"start":14306.217,"end":14311.319,"text":"林德福委員、林德福委員、林德福委員、林月琴委員教育部部長、法務部教政署署長、周署長委員好"},{"start":14332.843,"end":14357.399,"text":"部長好我想新北這個案子我覺得教育部應該有很多要去檢討可是先來談就是轉型機制因為從高結構的一個轉到非結構那的確如果你要進到學校體制裡邊的確有很多問題要面對因為整個銜接準備不僅要有連續訓"},{"start":14358.5,"end":14382.578,"text":"最主要下降我們的再犯率可是孩子進入到回到社區裡邊事實上是家庭如果是失功能的話事實上有一點困難可是我看現行的整個轉型機制大部會間真的就是在各做各的如果事實上是過去高結構要走到非結構的話有沒有更多的機制把孩子接住可是看起來"},{"start":14383.739,"end":14388.982,"text":"校園暴力事件之處置、少年犯回歸校園暴力事件之處置、少年犯回歸校園暴力事件之處置、少年犯回歸"},{"start":14405.002,"end":14411.447,"text":"整個的轉嫌目前我看到的幾乎就是按照我們兒童權法裡邊71條我覺得這個就要問法務部這邊因為轉嫌只有資料轉嫌"},{"start":14419.059,"end":14446.344,"text":"那幾乎事實上是沒有所謂的關係轉型那這樣在矯正學校所提供的一些教育處理第一個也不見得是符合孩子的需求他沒有去提供甚至他未來回到學校裡邊他回歸社區的能力跟意願有沒有提供比較適合的支持功能在教育這一塊看起來事實上是沒有"},{"start":14447.544,"end":14472.219,"text":"甚至於關係轉型這一塊在前年二全公益審查的時候主席Duke講到說你如果要孩子在角質體系裡邊如果父母要能夠去銜接上的話基本上應該是要讓他能夠去看他可是如果我今天住台北跑到桃園去只讓他面會30分鐘所以他問我們說到底你"},{"start":14472.759,"end":14493.399,"text":"可以讓家長跟他接觸的可能性是什麼有沒有就近性就便利性甚至時間我們30分鐘韓國還有合宿的那個宿舍那讓他們可以跟孩子有比較建立比較好關係為什麼要建立如果沒有做關係轉現一旦孩子回到社區就會發生新北的這個案子也就是"},{"start":14494.5,"end":14504.286,"text":"到社區社工比藥頭跟當派還要難搶到小孩所以如果不做好這個狀況的話沒有做好社區轉型的時候那大概"},{"start":14505.66,"end":14506.1,"text":"今天點名部長跟我們的署長"},{"start":14531.374,"end":14531.714,"text":"施法不退縮"},{"start":14556.38,"end":14564.248,"text":"沒有問題希望能夠落實這個相關規定然後積極提供我們少年必要的協助再麻煩我們的謝廷長"},{"start":14568.148,"end":14591.743,"text":"謝謝還有一個學輔邀集席那就是我們的教育部可不可以趕快把學輔法送出來已經擱置了滿一段時間而且學生輔導諮商中心如果採任務編制非正式機構的話在各縣市運作不太相同的話基本上幫不上學校的忙沒辦法把孩子去接住另外一個我覺得"},{"start":14592.984,"end":14607.7,"text":"這個已經也是社安網的一部分家庭教育中心本來我們期待的功能已經補社工進去是不是要讓這社工更有功能來協助家庭改善否則孩子回到社區家裡又失功能的話根本沒有辦法做好事情所以也請"},{"start":14608.601,"end":14634.939,"text":"部長這邊對於家庭教育中心可不可以針對應該要主動介入這個能夠落實因為法裡邊本來就有規定可是我現在看不到家庭教育中心功能過去我在民間在六都單獨兒少委員會的時候每次在提案都提說那你們社工有的社工到現在還沒到位所以請部長可不可以督促各縣市趕快到位因為轉弦制度的改善方式要從家裡跟社區跟"},{"start":14635.419,"end":14637.74,"text":"羅志強委員、羅志強委員、羅志強委員和新淳委員"},{"start":14666.499,"end":14669.212,"text":"謝謝召委科召委喔 那我們是不是請部長好 部長"},{"start":14674.116,"end":14678.699,"text":"委員好部長好好久不見部長過去我一直在教育委員會我們也就今天相關的校園問題跟孩子的一個輔導問題我們已經當面溝通了好多次但是很遺憾或是說我認為好還可以更好就是說我們發生了一連串的事件告訴我們不夠好我們還必須要再檢討再改進"},{"start":14700.933,"end":14701.473,"text":"臺中某校園也發生家長攜帶武士刀進入校園"},{"start":14718.766,"end":14719.907,"text":"校園暴力事件之處置、少年犯回歸校園暴力事件之處置、少年犯回歸"},{"start":14739.74,"end":14758.448,"text":"事前就可以預防事前如果沒有辦法預防的時候事後如何面對處置我覺得這個整個緊急應變的SOP這個是全國性的問題是保護我們的孩子所以部長就這幾件事情發生了之後我們的檢討是什麼"},{"start":14759.068,"end":14788.032,"text":"是 跟委員報告當然就這些事件後教育部邀請各縣市還有我們相關團體校長、老師們大概做了蠻多討論也把原來跟這個校安有關還有老師的輔導管教那個注意項做全面的調整那這個裡面確實也在老師的輔導管教這上面能夠賦予老師有一些更合理有效的這個管教部長我舉個例子成就基層的教師就來跟我"},{"start":14788.652,"end":14812.269,"text":"反映說,比如說孩子帶一些比較所謂的危險物品進入學校那在書包裡面,老師沒有權限可以收書包這第一點第二點,老師怎麼如何從何而知他可能攜帶危險物品這個是面臨到剛剛部長你講的我們可以給校方或者是老師到某哪個程度的一個"},{"start":14814.332,"end":14815.212,"text":"家長攜帶武士刀進入校園誰可以發現他裡面有帶武士刀"},{"start":14830.779,"end":14841.703,"text":"所以在這個部分我們也做了像委員所說的有一個非常完整的可操作的手冊主要是讓學校可以來進行這方面那當然委員提到一個非常關鍵的那個學校還是要我們對於已經就是本來就有相關應變的這個小組跟演練因為演練這件事情我覺得才能夠提升他們真的碰到緊急事項也可以去做應變"},{"start":14858.269,"end":14874.845,"text":"部長應該是說就各種情境去做一個模擬然後去做一個討論甚至建立起你剛剛說的不同情境之下的一些安全問題我們如何能夠緊急及時的反應跟處理"},{"start":14876.727,"end":14902.347,"text":"由如何在第一時間上面可以跟其他相關的單位比如說警政單位如何合作如何來面對這個緊急的危急的一個狀況這個其實我知道寫手冊寫SOP是必要但是模擬在現實實務面上發生的當下如何處置其實是更重要委員所提的這個真的是關鍵因為現在我們所給學校的本來在有關"},{"start":14906.27,"end":14912.933,"text":"跟臨近的警政單位合作這是每個學校都要具備政治是用最緊急鍵當發生的時候你一按事實上就會連結到我們說派出所他們就會來支援那剛才委員提到那個演練本來在我們給學校縣市的這個裡面就有每學年一定要但是落實這件事情我覺得教育部可以再激進"},{"start":14934.144,"end":14934.344,"text":"李卓人議員"},{"start":14956.8,"end":14959,"text":"每學年你一定要去做各種的幾個樣態我覺得應該來做這方面應該更弱一個這樣的練習其實對孩子、對老師、教職人員來講也是一個維持防護的意識"},{"start":14982.425,"end":14986.248,"text":"所以再拜託部長這應該跟地方教育直接來做好然後把它落實那另外當然時間不夠我還是要提醒部長校園裡面的這個毒品問題這個很多家長都不斷的在關心跟反映希望政府應該要有更積極的作為那還有學生輔導法過去我們修法所以呢我們那個輔導的人力要增加要補強那我希望能夠到位跟落實"},{"start":15010.629,"end":15012.47,"text":"謝謝主席,麻煩有請部長還有體育署署長。"},{"start":15038.368,"end":15054.924,"text":"部長、署長也許上一次執行的主題就是足協竟然拿了國家每年拿了國家上億的補助結果連足球員的錢都在欠上一次執行完了以後我馬上就接到投訴了"},{"start":15055.885,"end":15079.344,"text":"上一次署長說去年欠的錢都還完了但署長可能忘了附加補一句前年的錢一堆都還欠著為什麼前年的錢一堆都還欠著我們的主協理事長那個時候鄭文燦那時候鄭文燦在到主協理事長的時候說中華男竹睽違三年半首勝要發30萬獎金鼓勵全隊"},{"start":15082.806,"end":15107.398,"text":"結果我收到我們這一些足球國角他們的投訴是什麼他們的投訴是你根本不要講鄭文燦所講的30萬獎金連出場費、集訓費、車馬費到目前為止我在表格上面所列的這一些國角他們一致的反應是一毛錢都沒有拿到"},{"start":15109.371,"end":15115.807,"text":"這個是我們足協對待我們這一些國角的方式嗎?署長這件事情你有沒有掌握?"},{"start":15117.196,"end":15141.004,"text":"報告委員目前竹鞋還有八千萬的債務目前的確還包含大約四百萬是選手的部分以及工作人員的部分所以要欠到什麼時候報告委員這部分竹鞋目前跟廠商還有竹鞋跟廠商怎麼樣我不管啊他們已經承諾今年所以這一季是以選手的這部分的欠款優先來償還這樣叫優先來償還喔他是以今年這一季開始"},{"start":15145.607,"end":15163.423,"text":"當初這件事情發生的時候竹賢秘書長是誰當時在累積的債務是在在我之前的那一任秘書長方敬仁的期間累積表現我說在第一次這一場鄭文燦宣布要給他30萬獎金這一場的經費應該已經還了那時候秘書長是誰這一部分是我是你 有還嗎這一部分應該已經還了我再跟你講一次"},{"start":15172.331,"end":15194.978,"text":"這些人全部投訴在12月111年12月之前的的確還沒有還沒有錯沒有給嘛就你當秘書長的時候嘛我是在12月的時候當秘書長這一場應該是還的可以這樣子對待足球國角嗎更離譜的事情是什麼報告委員去年足場費他們的確足血有在去年的部分差點陸續償還但是他們的確在111年之前的確沒有辦法還你說陸續償還償還了哪一個人"},{"start":15199.403,"end":15217.64,"text":"報告委員112年的確沒有在虧欠但是他們足協的確表明他們現在還有現在我具體的問法2022年國際足球友誼賽浩大喜功啊頒30萬的獎金啊就搞到現在2024年啊連出場費都沒給啊可以這樣搞喔可以這樣搞喔報告委員他們已經在陸續長環沒有錯"},{"start":15226.212,"end":15245.66,"text":"要欠這些球員欠到什麼時候?他們希望在今年可以把這400萬把它還清你們這些喔當初去當理事長、當秘書長現在當行政院副院長、當體育署署長拍拍屁股不關你們的事了報告委員在他累積快速累積債務的期間並不是在我任內到底是在誰任內啊?你們自己去吵足球員關心的事情是什麼?"},{"start":15254.341,"end":15258.645,"text":"幫我們國家為國爭光,到現在還欠錢,部長可以接受嗎?"},{"start":15260.769,"end":15288.877,"text":"委員這個我想代表國家去我們一定要做最大的努力那我也一直請所長因為他對這個生態也了解啦那也積極的說目前這個債務的償還一定要設定剛才委員所提到的對球員的設定到什麼時候現在這些足球員啊很無助啊他們被人家踢來踢去踢來踢去啊當初做新聞很會啊做公關很會啊真的足球員連出場費都沒拿到"},{"start":15290.346,"end":15311.441,"text":"無人聞問啊!無人聞問啊!部長可以接受嗎?委員這個部分我想教育部體育署這邊也做了徹底要求剛才我跟委員報告的今年一定要解決虧欠...原因說今年喔?要簽到年底喔?他現在我是說能夠積極趕快處理這個事情需要多少時間?需要多少時間?"},{"start":15318.254,"end":15334.963,"text":"不敢給大家答案喔?更離譜的是什麼?這件事情請部長、署長回去查清楚錢沒有拿到喔?結果竟然中華民國足協的扣腳平單寄給人家咧?發扣腳平單的是足協欸"},{"start":15336.368,"end":15348.573,"text":"我那時候知道這件事情後我大驚失色欸球員沒有拿到錢結果有扣繳平單說要扣他的稅部長你會不會覺得很誇張這是怎麼回事錢到哪裡去了"},{"start":15351.857,"end":15374.91,"text":"沒有獎金錢沒有給人家有扣繳平單欸現在是錢逐血放在口袋裡面沒有發錢給球員然後出扣繳平單說欸你的錢已經入帳了要扣稅部長這件事要不要徹查提訴已經在查單這件事要不要徹查是喔需要多久"},{"start":15376.53,"end":15404.768,"text":"我老實跟你講喔我老實跟你講喔這個已經不是欠錢不還喔這個有偽造文書喔違反商業會計法喔沒有給人家錢趕出扣繳平單說錢都給了理不理虎部長需要多久委員這不是讓體育署因為他現在正在查處這件事需要多久需要多久三個月內好不好三個月需要這麼久喔那查清楚嘛"},{"start":15405.71,"end":15408.171,"text":"謝謝黃國昌委員 謝謝部長、署長接下來我們請翁曉林委員"},{"start":15434.216,"end":15435.599,"text":"主席,有請部長。"},{"start":15441.235,"end":15467.403,"text":"是部長好我想這些年其實大家都非常關心校園安全的問題那麼尤其從去年發生了這個新北市國中生的這個刺警案然後到最近那又陸續看到新聞上有這個北投高中的這個特教學生的這個情緒他跟老師之間的衝突然後陸陸續續又還有一些案子其實這些問題其實都"},{"start":15469.724,"end":15472.69,"text":"重寫了一個蠻嚴重的問題就是在現在的校園裡面的暴力行為是不斷地攀升麻煩下頁"},{"start":15481.308,"end":15505.688,"text":"大家可以看到其實從100年到112年有關於就是國小、國中和大學的暴力事件的數字那這個圖表其實是來自於教育部有個校園安全暨災害防救通報處理中心資訊網上面我所找到的資料那在這個資料裡面顯示你可以看到其實從國小的暴力事件從100年到112年它暴增將近8倍"},{"start":15510.473,"end":15529.51,"text":"國中與大專院校的暴力事件大概就是這十年大概也提升兩到三倍以上所以再再地顯示其實校園暴力事件的問題這個已經不是一個最近才發現的而是一個已經這十年來長期都看到的狀況我想請問就是部長您看到這樣子的一個統計數字您的看法是什麼"},{"start":15535.535,"end":15553.642,"text":"是,跟委員報告那確實過去校園內這種學生跟學生之間的一些衝突甚至霸凌的社會各界都關注所以教育部在近年也強力的要求啦這個因為過去也都說很多孩子真的受到霸凌或什麼又不敢講就所謂的隱忍"},{"start":15554.502,"end":15560.186,"text":"這個現象我們一直覺得學校應該要更在這上面真實的去把相關的情形要做通報所以我們對通報上這幾年我也有看到這樣的一個數據當然這個重點或是你通報之後後面對於查處跟我們才能夠進一步的去做這方面的追蹤"},{"start":15576.139,"end":15592.219,"text":"謝謝部長的回應我想這個部分的話基本上已經不是只是單純的被霸凌很多的衝突事件都在校園裡面產生那您認為這個部分其實跟現在校園裡面師長跟學校他的管教"},{"start":15593.22,"end":15594.561,"text":"對於現在的學校跟老師的教育管教權"},{"start":15612.813,"end":15616.177,"text":"校園暴力事件之處置、少年犯回歸校園暴力事件之處置、少年犯回歸校園暴力事件之處置、少年犯回歸"},{"start":15630.675,"end":15630.815,"text":"請問一下部長"},{"start":15652.535,"end":15665.055,"text":"您也常常有出國您知道我們出國的時候經過海關海關人員會針對我們的行李進行檢查嗎?會那您認為為什麼有檢查的必要?他這樣檢查沒有侵害我們的隱私權嗎?"},{"start":15666.441,"end":15675.147,"text":"委員我想因為出入大概跟這個尤其是航空的這方面的安全我想到各國大概都簡單來說這跟公共安全有關 是然後麻煩下一頁那麼為什麼學校的老師還有這個來進行這個書包的檢查這就侵犯了隱私權難道也不與這個難道不會與這個學校的安全有關嗎跟我們報告"},{"start":15692.518,"end":15697.199,"text":"因為過去檢查的過程也出現了一些有點過度的有些是過度了所以才會有些討論那我想就是有關於這個部分其實這應該是要回歸到由每個學校自己去訂定校規然後依據學校的各個不同的狀況來規範學生的這個獎懲的行為那麼現在其實依照我們現行的法律校規應該是不是由學校自主訂定呢"},{"start":15722.504,"end":15726.005,"text":"校規定定要經過學校的校務會議,等於說也是一個充分的討論我們知道其實現在各個學校裡面訂立校規不是就是依據了這個"},{"start":15739.638,"end":15741.339,"text":"請問一下部長您認為教育是這個注意事項法律性質是什麼"},{"start":15759.489,"end":15786.87,"text":"注意事項主要是根據這個有關學生輔導法那就要固定這個是給校做參考所以您的這個注意事項的第一條裡面有講的就是這是要這個依據這個基本上是要去訂定學生輔導管教辦法但是你們一直沒有這個輔導管教辦法但是卻用一個注意事項來取代輔導管教辦法那本席認為說這樣子的一個這樣子的一個法律作為基本上是很不恰當的"},{"start":15788.031,"end":15814.714,"text":"應該是要將整個的輔導管教的注意事項裏面的內容要提升到法律的位階麻煩下一頁所以就這個部分的話是不是你們應該基本上要去檢討有關於學生輔導辦法或者是說未來在國教辦法以及在高等教育辦法裏面自己要去把相關的內容把它明確化"},{"start":15815.663,"end":15820.385,"text":"學務法這個規範是讓學校訂定這個所以教育部才會以注意事項來因為訂的主體是學校所以就是說您的注意事項它基本上學校可以不用注意所以它只是參考而已是不是那注意事項就這樣啊"},{"start":15837.072,"end":15859.141,"text":"所以學校也可以不遵守這個不去看到這個注意事項裡面的內容它也可以依照它自己裡面的這個經過校務會議通過之後擬定校規所以校務會議的校規通過的校規它是可以超越這個注意事項裡面的內容所以學校也可以自己訂定規則在校規裡面說我要去檢查書包"},{"start":15862.022,"end":15862.142,"text":"主席"},{"start":15892.282,"end":15892.662,"text":"無私要委員、政天才委員"},{"start":15933.914,"end":15935.876,"text":"法務部長不好意思"},{"start":15953.134,"end":15979.502,"text":"好部長這個有關今天的一個議題真的是一個非常非常的重要但是這幾年來我們對於這個校園這方面的暴力事件頻傳確實是一個事實我們看這個下一張下一張好我們看這個"},{"start":15981.127,"end":15984.488,"text":"從101年大學到112年從101年的347件到112年的1069件暴力事件以偏差行為高中子101年的2441件到112年的8462件"},{"start":16006.116,"end":16012.299,"text":"國中101年是2653件到112年的8339件國小101年是968112年是9368管教衝突事件一樣兒童少年保護事件都一樣從101年到112年"},{"start":16036.218,"end":16037.12,"text":"指指往上"},{"start":16050.217,"end":16069.435,"text":"我跟委員報告這個通報是教育部強烈的要求地方政府跟學校因為當學校在校園內受到比如霸凌或有其他這些不當對待不要隱忍學校有通報的責任這才會讓委員看到這個在112年比111年會有在這樣的通報數的增加"},{"start":16074.58,"end":16074.86,"text":"通報的結果你剛剛是講通報"},{"start":16102.683,"end":16115.376,"text":"委員這個是通報數據啊對因為有通報所以有了這個結果但是有這樣的結果這麼多年來卻沒有很好的因應的措施啦我們現在談"},{"start":16117.079,"end":16145.668,"text":"怎麼去因應這些 怎麼去減少這些竟然通報是應該的 一定要通報但是怎麼樣去減少 怎麼去解決這些問題這個才是一個重點我們看這個 我們就講這個你的報告裡面的校園安全4策略事前預防 絕對要做"},{"start":16146.618,"end":16174.079,"text":"但是呢這個校園事前預防就是三行、四行大家怎麼做顯然這個沒有達到那個報告當然是折要這裡面我們有詳細的計劃辦法都是到達學校我知道緊急處理外部資源輔導介入我們現在是不是要去究責我們沒有要去究責"},{"start":16175.453,"end":16201.754,"text":"現在就是怎麼去解決這些問題了怎麼去解決這些問題所以這個部分是這個要請教育部要去審慎的要跟學校、老師要好好討論所以這個部分到底這個外部支援已經太慢了太慢了那有沒有可能有更好的方式"},{"start":16203.258,"end":16230.432,"text":"有沒有更好的方式因為老師也很難啊老師也很難啊光靠老師是不夠的也很難到底要怎麼樣去解決外部之言有沒有可能我也很想講但是到底講好不好我不知道譬如說既然已經發生這種事情"},{"start":16232.334,"end":16258.453,"text":"剛委員提到說就檢查就檢查嘛最起碼不要受傷害嘛大部分學生不要因為暴力然後受傷害這個是一個需要好好地檢討的地方另外如果真的是需要有沒有可能增加警力增加啦 要增加警力就派出到學校"},{"start":16260.626,"end":16261.127,"text":"尤其是教官"},{"start":16279.366,"end":16305.371,"text":"教育部是否有因應措施都一邊討論要去檢討要去好好地去處理謝謝委員指教 謝謝好 謝謝鄭天才委員 謝謝部長鄭振前委員 鄭振前委員 鄭振前委員王美惠委員 王美惠委員 王美惠委員徐欣盈委員 徐欣盈委員 徐欣盈委員"},{"start":16306.431,"end":16308.072,"text":"今日登記質詢的委員都已經發言完畢了．"},{"start":16321.499,"end":16349.83,"text":"另外有吳村城委員、陳冠廷委員、沈博洋委員及羅志強委員提出書面質詢然後今天的會議我們做的決議如下報告及詢答完畢然後委員所提的書面質詢或是相關的資料請列入記錄並刊登公報對委員質詢要求提供的相關資料或是未及答覆的部分請相關機關盡速以書面來做答覆報告委員會我們今天議程處理完畢現在休息謝謝各位"},{"start":16353.966,"end":16354.267,"text":"主席"},{"start":16374.783,"end":16379.19,"text":"3月18日、20日及21日三天一次會議"},{"start":16389.185,"end":16389.385,"text":"主席"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}