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恰恰今天要在這裡說的是我們婚姻當產品的問題。我們婚姻關係都很大關, 當產品提供全國各地,其中蒜頭是最重要。 產品佔全國的高深,但是我最近收到很多電信, 蒜頭的收工期一直落。"},{"start":2293.453,"end":2313.072,"text":"再來看到施政開發期同樣一直落。．去年初．我們這個介紹驚嘈了三分之一。．介紹這期．給農民都非常痛苦。．算頭是一年一休的祝福。．現在修行期．介紹直接影響到．我們農民全年一個休業。．"},{"start":2316.115,"end":2328.012,"text":"現在完整後,什麼都起家,算頭1分之1分前就要過完課,未那一屆的介紹,先課都沒得到回報。請問整個那一屆未家,所有那一屆,到底為什麼勒?"},{"start":2332.037,"end":2344.103,"text":"本期查量,才發覺今年三個月內, 咱算蒜頭的進口量已經要到6千噸了。有這麼多的進口蒜頭,分透蒜頭的計劃當然會被扣到很高。所以,清潔這陣程,咱採取期也已經夠了。後來就會大量分透的蒜頭出産。 算計,總共如果繼續落,"},{"start":2359.577,"end":2361.558,"text":"要如何審核呢?"},{"start":2361.558,"end":2371.144,"text":"論壇收到我們產銷失衡的損害,賣一斤、撩一斤。 申告的會刊有可能毀滅。請問我們農業部,您有看到嗎?"},{"start":2371.144,"end":2374.846,"text":"發動領域政府對蒜頭的健康,及國內生產的管理是失控。"},{"start":2381.61,"end":2389.332,"text":"在此下中,要向政府建議,第一,農業部應該要重視我們軍土農園的管理,不應該採取其開放進口大量的蒜頭。第二,農業部應該要管理蒜頭的進口量,"},{"start":2400.456,"end":2405.498,"text":"提到WTO政考會議是由我去主要講解高關稅的選舉政考量。．然遲到申請過量,影響到我們農園的收益。第三,請農業國應該要輔導農園做申約成績,為補助我們國均值分拓的選舉。所以,合同要在這裏呼籲大家,"},{"start":2425.426,"end":2435.931,"text":"我們軍統的選舉應用計10個月．可以控制也能預防到新水管疾病。請得到支持我們臺灣分靈的選舉。感謝大家。謝謝丁委員學中的發言。接下來我們請登記第4位,紅委員孟凱發言。"},{"start":2460.39,"end":2489.189,"text":"主席各位同仁先進以及行政院的所有官員本期今天再一次陳志的陳痛的要再一次的呼籲電價調漲看起來是勢在必行但是過去這幾個月以來國民黨團一直要求蔡英文政府正式弱勢族群的新生相關的電價調漲簽罰動全身而如今今天要召開的電價審議委員會"},{"start":2490.83,"end":2505.659,"text":"雖然是今天才要決定但是早上起來媒體已經都大幅報導看起來漲價是勢在必行而且都已經講出可能會330度以下的家庭全部都納入平均調漲11%預計全國1340萬戶的家庭受到影響台灣93%的人民電價調漲會高達5%以上"},{"start":2518.627,"end":2538.057,"text":"所以我們要說都已經是確定了這樣的一個調漲的部分看起來蔡英文總統任內就是調漲了四次並且從未降價過累積的調漲幅度會高達三成以上這就是蔡英文總統的歷史定位嗎"},{"start":2538.817,"end":2561.918,"text":"有人馬上就算出來比較過去馬英九政府時代雖然調漲了4次但是也曾經降電價3次也因此平均來說漲幅是22.4%我們真的要問現在兩相比較是不是真的是選錯的人走貴的路這樣子的狀況有真的苦民所苦嗎?"},{"start":2562.731,"end":2589.149,"text":"再者昨天央行已經提前宣布升息半碼已經馬上被市場解讀說這就是避免通膨在打預防針當全球都在吹降息風的時候台灣不降反升尤其是想要打通膨但是可能造成家庭房貸等利息的增加而影響消費能力央行就是宣稱就是戳破綠營宣稱電價對於民眾影響不大的謊言"},{"start":2593.171,"end":2614.585,"text":"今天剛好是交通組的總質詢我們也看到交通部部長以及相關的官員都有來到現場我們過去一直在強調大眾運輸的電如果說也跟著調漲的話無論是台鐵、高鐵、公路客運都已經有說可能會運量票價甚至五都的捷運"},{"start":2615.445,"end":2643.327,"text":"臺北、新北、基捷、高捷、中捷也都說反應成本吃不消了。難道這一些物價調漲、票價調漲也都會是下一波迎接而來的嗎?政府能不能真的行行好,苦民所苦,感受一下老百姓真實的生活情況。萬物皆漲,只有薪水不漲,到目前為止就是民進黨政府八年執政下給國人最真實的感受。謝謝。"},{"start":2646.579,"end":2651.046,"text":"謝謝洪委員孟凱的發言。接下來我們請登記第5號陳委員經微發言。"},{"start":2661.192,"end":2681.061,"text":"主席、各位同事、各位行政院的官員以及媒體朋友早安本週二是國際社工日也表揚了臺灣優秀的志工但才過了一天卻有超過300位的志工在衛福部前陳抗陳痛地提出五點訴求這個現象何其諷刺啊"},{"start":2686.696,"end":2706.868,"text":"這兩週不只一件的虐童事件讓臺灣全體的社會感到痛心為何由中央主導的社會安全網這八年來平凡的失靈、漏接也讓基層、社工師、醫師、地方局處的同仁感到疲憊不堪以及心寒"},{"start":2708.206,"end":2732.121,"text":"因為出事之後往往都是基層在承擔而且今天公祭明天旺祭距離我們改革的盡頭遙遙無期根據衛福部自己的統計去年每三天就有一位志工受到暴力的對待包括言語暴力威脅還有肢體等等"},{"start":2733.388,"end":2746.842,"text":"這些在前線服務奉獻的朋友承擔著繁重的工作業務以及極大的心理壓力。但大家往往覺得社工就給他們解決所有社會的問題。"},{"start":2748.291,"end":2767.02,"text":"但他們是人,也有情緒,也會累。同樣身為人需要面對各種人生的課題,所以請大家不要將所有的期待與責任都丟給社工,反而要先改革當前社工安全網失靈的各項缺失。"},{"start":2769.104,"end":2797.018,"text":"大家知道社工在低薪高案件高強度高壓力的工作環境下燃燒著他們的熱情以及使命感為我們全國同胞負重前行因此要改善社工的勞動條件我們要增補員額提高薪資減少案量而且給予完善的支持系統不再讓他們獨自面對漫無邊際的情緒勞動"},{"start":2798.601,"end":2814.096,"text":"我們常常說社會安全網又破了又漏接了誰然後開始找人負責是誰沒有做好工作但曾幾何時我們有沒有想過社工也需要被接住也需要我們的體諒與支持"},{"start":2815.27,"end":2834.075,"text":"既然如此,我們至少要成為呵護他們的熱情一雙手,在風雨中為社工撐起安全的傘,讓他們有信心繼續走下去的動力,而不是舉辦好只為了儀式感的社工表揚大會,而真的為他們做點事吧。謝謝大家。謝謝陳委員、金威的發言。接下來,我們請登記第6號羅委員志強發言。"},{"start":2857.098,"end":2879.745,"text":"廢物監察院不如廢了吧!廢物監察院早點廢掉吧!賴清德的大弟子行政院前發言人陳忠彥被控於臺南擔任首長的期間為酒店業者關說八次接受性招待"},{"start":2881.358,"end":2906.634,"text":"監察委員的調查指出陳宗彥向酒店業者詢問小雲有空嗎?馬上隨即協助業者來追蹤工程的案件進度。時間續上關聯緊密。對於是否接受性招待陳宗彥既不承認也不否認,只說不記得了。"},{"start":2907.931,"end":2935.467,"text":"雖然陳宗彥的性招待關說為私的證據明顯這個廢物監察院卻用11票反對2票贊成未能通過對陳宗彥的彈劾我直接講為什麼啦因為這11個監察委員就在仰望上議啊未來的總統賴清德的大弟子他們不敢動啊"},{"start":2936.823,"end":2965.13,"text":"不要說這個只打蒼蠅不打老虎他連老鼠屎都不敢打連陳宗彥都不敢打那這樣監察委員照民進黨長期的理念就是幹嘛廢掉嗎陳菊擔任監察院院長也曾經說他的心願啊他的心願就是他希望他是最後一任監察委員啊監察院長"},{"start":2966.758,"end":2995.481,"text":"希望監察院廢掉啊講到要監察院的職能要把它廢掉領到監察院的薪水領好領滿很開心啊第六屆的監委全數是由蔡英文提名的絕大多數都是綠色酬庸不要說不敢糾正機關扮演所謂的端正關真的職能"},{"start":2996.812,"end":3003.22,"text":"甚至常常還淪為綠色打手變成東廠。上週我質詢監察院秘書長李俊毅"},{"start":3006.826,"end":3032.737,"text":"相較於上屆監委平均彈劾2.4案,本屆監委也只有1.8案。不管在糾正案、在所謂調查案、在人權報告、人權調查案上,全面的倒退,結果李俊逸還跟我講說,數字沒有意義啊。對啦,數字沒有意義啦。但是連老鼠屎都不敢彈劾就很有意義啦。"},{"start":3033.553,"end":3046.144,"text":"所以我的主張很簡單這種廢物監察院廢掉剛好謝謝羅委員志強的發言接下來我們請登記第7號陳委員冠廷發言"},{"start":3058.325,"end":3081.57,"text":"那謝謝所有的媒體還有我們今天在場的行政院的這些官員們。那我這次必須要再強調,調漲公糧收購的價格對整體的農業的重要性。我想農業部從110年年度開始實施的稻作試選山,那這個是配合國家的稻米產量。那麼可以理解這樣子是對整體的農業是有幫助的。"},{"start":3082.19,"end":3097.039,"text":"可是說主動減少25%的耕作面積也造成他們的這個整體的這個鬆弛量大概也減少25%所以說雖然政府有提供4萬5千元的休耕補助但是減少公糧的總量還是會給特別是老農一些心理壓力"},{"start":3097.819,"end":3123.232,"text":"那許多農民關切的部分是國內的公糧收購價額12年沒有調整。所以在這邊我們也是希望在場的所有的行政院的官員,包含院長如果有機會的話,可以來去思考一下這12年沒有改變的這個調整能夠在最後的這個任期內給予調整給我們的腦農一個可以幫助他們的方式。"},{"start":3123.832,"end":3143.85,"text":"那我必須再強調,如果公糧每公斤提高2到3元,它只是回復這12年來原物料的波動而已。換言之,這樣子的做法是不會影響到這個總量的管制的。所以說,這樣的做法我們還是鼓勵院長能夠考量這件事情,還有包含所有的這個農業部的官員,"},{"start":3145.371,"end":3169.49,"text":"能夠給農業重要的支持因為農業不是只有青農還有一些比較中上年中老農還是需要來協助的另外針對於青農的部分其實我們知道許多青農回到自己的家鄉那他們所需要的是土地那我們有一個農地租賃平台就是俗稱的農地銀行2.0可是上面能夠每一核的農地實在太少"},{"start":3169.91,"end":3197.018,"text":"所以我在這邊也是呼籲農業部來給予協助或者是其他各單位要總共來去全面性的協調比如說我們今天去查詢大概是只有34筆農地要出租這樣子看起來的話總計34筆裡面我們加一線只有一筆所以這樣子的農地銀行沒有辦法提供足夠的這個機會讓我們的農民特別是我們的青農能夠使用所以農地租賃平台他當然是正確的方向"},{"start":3197.498,"end":3213.984,"text":"可是宣導上面還是不足所以說沒有足夠的宣導的話首先不知道有這樣的平台第二個沒有足夠的能量的話就算知道這樣的平台還是沒有辦法來去做租賃使用所以我們是希望說如果能夠讓更多的農民能夠願意把手中的農地放到平台上面去出租"},{"start":3214.224,"end":3214.564,"text":"謝謝陳委員冠廷的發言。"},{"start":3246.141,"end":3270.129,"text":"接下來我們請登記第8號林委員沛翔發言主席陳院長"},{"start":3271.755,"end":3285.65,"text":"各位立院同仁跟媒體先進三天前3月19號本席得知了交通部通過了臺62線快速道路延伸至萬里的方案。針對這個延伸案陳院長跟行政團隊應該是知情的。"},{"start":3288.512,"end":3309.87,"text":"這條快速道路的延伸閘道雖然最後的目的地是新北市萬里區的景美路但該工程主要經過的區域則是基隆市的七堵區跟安樂區本席身為代表基隆市的國會議員對於中央政府變民的交通建設一向給予肯定"},{"start":3310.953,"end":3319.441,"text":"但是針對這個對基隆市來說重大的交通工程建設本席依然有以下的疑問跟建言"},{"start":3320.802,"end":3344.633,"text":"根據新聞媒體報導,臺62線快速道路的新閘道終點是在新北市萬里區。據說建設的目的之一是為了減低假日時到金山萬里遊玩的旅客塞車狀況。但以本席居住在基隆市安樂區多年的經驗,我認為在臺62線的延伸工程實施之時,"},{"start":3346.28,"end":3358.431,"text":"必務必要建置本席於上個月院會質詢時所提出的國道3號設置高架引道銜接台62線西向的快速道路。"},{"start":3359.5,"end":3378.577,"text":"因為目前雖然在地圖上,國道3號與台62號是有交集點的,也有引道來連接兩條主要道路,但是卻只有東向開往九份地區的引道,並沒有一條西向往台62線安樂端的引道。"},{"start":3379.707,"end":3405.69,"text":"因此造成假日旅遊車潮都是往國道3號基金交流道下高速公路,並由市區道路前往金山萬里地區。因此與在大五輪地區居住的3萬位基隆市民在週末的作息造成交通動線上的嚴重衝突。這是本期身為土生土長的基隆人,並自行開車往返臺北通勤多年的自身經驗。"},{"start":3407.591,"end":3432.62,"text":"基於以上理由,為了能夠有效的紓解假日金山萬里地帶的塞車困境,並促進此工程的目的之促進我們的區域經濟發展,本席強烈建議在臺62線快速道路延伸至萬里的工程規劃中,務必要將國道3號連接臺62線西向的道路做出高架引道連結,"},{"start":3433.74,"end":3460.675,"text":"不然將無法有效地把假日行駛在國道3號的車流引入台62線至金山萬里地區,最後花費了估計250億以上的公帑,卻無法達到疏解交通擁捨的目的。以上。謝謝林委員沛翔的發言。報告委員會,現在登記國是論壇發言的委員均已發言完畢,現在休息。"},{"start":5413.442,"end":5434.701,"text":"報告院會請秘書長報告出席人數。報告院會出席委員52人已足法定人數。現在開會進行報告事項。請秘書長宣讀第一會期第5次會議意思錄。宣讀立法院第11屆第一會期第5次會議意思錄時間中華民國113年3月15日上午9時1分至9時27分"},{"start":5439.615,"end":5463.59,"text":"時時至12時7分,下午20時32分至2時40分．三月19日上午9時至10時29分,下午20時30分至46分．地點本院議場出席委員、陳委員、昭氏等113人．內席官員、行政院長陳建倫等19人．主席院長韓國瑜．報告事項第一案宣讀本院第11屆第1會期第4次會議意思度決定、確定"},{"start":5465.575,"end":5484.582,"text":"第二次293案均決定交互相關委員會審查、處理或交互相關委員會。第294案至338案為內政委員會等所提出報告案。執行事項,其他行政院達戶部分一件,與委員執行部分兩件。"},{"start":5486.321,"end":5511.822,"text":"．對行政院院長提出施政方針及施政報告繼續質詢．決定．下次會議繼續進行交通指示質詢．討論事項．第一案決議．定期處理．報告完畢。報告委員會針對第一會期第5次會議意思錄．並無委員或黨團提出錯誤或遺漏之處．作以下之決定．第一會期第5次會議意思錄確定．請宣讀第二案。"},{"start":5512.611,"end":5530.375,"text":"第二案,本院委員謝龍介的20人領據,所得稅法第17條條文修憲草案請審議案。程序委員會見理情委員會交財政委員會審查。宣讀完畢第三案,本院委員陳昌明等18人領據,水利法第83條之10條文修憲草案請審議案。程序委員會見理情委員會交經濟委員會審查。宣讀完畢"},{"start":5541.24,"end":5569.21,"text":"第四案,門譽委員陳昌明的21人離聚,戶籍法第16條條文修正草案行水案,財政委員會見,立行會交內政委員會審查,宣讀完畢。五議,通過下案。第五案,門譽委員陳昌明的18人離聚,地方民意代表費用之極及村里長需補助費補助條例自內地7條之1條文草案行水案,財政委員會見,立行會交內政委員會審查,宣讀完畢。五議,通過下案。"},{"start":5569.775,"end":5596.673,"text":"第6案 本院委員 高津、宿美等19人離聚,原住民保留地進方補償條例第6條條文修憲草案侵水案,財修委員會見理情和會交、內政、經濟兩委員會審查。宣讀完畢五議通過下議案第7案 本院委員 高津、宿美等20人離聚,原住民族學校法草案侵水案,財修委員會見理情和會交、教育及文化內政兩委員會審查。宣讀完畢五議通過下議案"},{"start":5597.366,"end":5621.647,"text":"第八案,本院委員外媒0等35人離聚,性別平等工作法第15條條維修憲草案請選一案,程序委員會見,您請會交社會福利及衛生環境委員會審查,宣言為畢。第九案,本院委員外媒0等36人離聚,勞動基準法第50條條維修憲草案請選一案,程序委員會見,您請會交社會福利及衛生環境委員會審查,宣言為畢。"},{"start":5624.363,"end":5634.546,"text":"第十案,本院委員外邁林等28人離聚,學校衛生法第23條條維修正常請誰案,查詢委員會見,臨時委員會交及文化委員會審查,宣讀完畢。第十一案,本院委員洪孟凱等21人離聚,中華民國刑法第83條條維修正常請誰案,查詢委員會見,臨時委員會交及法治委員會審查,宣讀完畢。"},{"start":5648.462,"end":5672.35,"text":"無異議通過下議案．第12案本院委員侯孟凱的二十二人凝聚接避者保護法草案請水恩、財修委員會見、立行委員會交付司法及法律委員會審查．宣言完畢無異議通過下議案．第13案本院委員侯孟凱的二十二人凝聚、中華民國刑法第339條之4條維修正財案請水恩、財修委員會見、立行委員會交付司法及法律委員會審查．宣言完畢"},{"start":5673.069,"end":5676.15,"text":"五、一、通過下一案五、一、通過下一案五、一、通過下一案"},{"start":5701.38,"end":5703.46,"text":"五議通過下案五議通過下案五議通過下案"},{"start":5727.844,"end":5752.259,"text":"第18案．本月委員侯孟凱的20日連續預算法第83條條文修正草案情勢一案．修委員會見議員會交財政委員會審查．宣傳完畢第19案．本月委員侯孟凱的20日連續外送平台管理及從業人員權益保障法草案情勢一案．修委員會見議員會交社會福利及衛生環境委員會審查．宣傳完畢"},{"start":5753.035,"end":5779.969,"text":"無異議通過下議案。第20案本院委員鍾嘉斌等17人凝聚學校午餐法草案請水案。才修委員會見立行會教教育及文化委員會審查,宣讀完畢。無異議通過下議案。第21案本院委員林建啟等16人凝聚文化藝術講座及促進條例第15條條維修站草案請水案。才修委員會見立行會教教育及文化財政兩委員會審查,宣讀完畢。無異議通過下議案。"},{"start":5780.779,"end":5809.25,"text":"第二十二案本院委員林建啟等17人領據《文化基本法》第24條、第27條及第28條條文修正常案請審議案。陳秀元會見,您請會交教育及文化委員會審查,宣讀完畢。第二十三案本院委員林建啟等16人領據《文化創意產業發展法》第26條、第27條之一及第27條之二條文修正常案請審議案。陳秀元會見,您請會交教育及文化委員會審查,宣讀完畢。"},{"start":5810.046,"end":5813.547,"text":"五、一、通過下一案五、一、通過下一案五、一、通過下一案"},{"start":5837.588,"end":5858.664,"text":"第二十六案,本院委員賴世保短17年連續《個人資料保護法》第47條、第48條及第49條條維修正常勤水案,求求委員會見臨時會交、經濟委員會審查,宣布完畢五議通過下一案第二十七案,本院委員賴世保短17年連續《電業法》第74條條維修正常勤水案,求求委員會見臨時會交、經濟委員會審查,宣布完畢五議通過下一案"},{"start":5864.687,"end":5867.429,"text":"第二十八案．第二十九案．第二十九案．"},{"start":5889.482,"end":5908.448,"text":"第30案本院委員賴氏堡的18案領據所得稅法第14條之4條維修正常案請審議案。才修委員會見議請會交財政委員會審查。宣讀完畢。無異議通過下一案。第31案本院委員賴氏堡的17案領據所得稅法第17條維修正常案請審議案。才修委員會見議請會交財政委員會審查。宣讀完畢。無異議通過下一案。"},{"start":5913.663,"end":5931.588,"text":"第三十二案本院委員賴世保的18個年居所得稅法第17條條維修正常案請審議案。財政委員會見理事委員會交財政委員會審查。宣讀完畢。第三十三案本院委員賴世保的17個年居遇稅法第62條之一條維修正常案請審議案。財政委員會見理事委員會交財政委員會審查。宣讀完畢。"},{"start":5936.673,"end":5940.195,"text":"五、一、通過下一案五、一、通過下一案五、一、通過下一案"},{"start":5966.428,"end":5990.527,"text":"第三十六案本院委員賴世保的17人聯聚、民法部份條文修正草案請水恩、財修院會見、立行會交、司法及法徵委員會審查。宣讀完畢五議通過下一案第三十七案本院委員賴世保的20人聯聚、立法院執行刑事法增令部份條文草案請水恩、財修院會見、立行會交、司法及法徵委員會審查。宣讀完畢五議通過下一案"},{"start":5991.035,"end":6019.799,"text":"第三十八案本院委員賴氏堡等17人聯聚勞工退休金條例第14條第14條之一及第34條條維修正常案請水恩財修院會見立行會交社會福利及衛生環境委員會審查宣讀完畢五議通過下一案第三十九案本院委員賴氏堡等17人聯聚環境基本法第23條條維修正常案請水恩財修院會見立行會交社會福利及衛生環境委員會審查宣讀完畢五議通過下一案"},{"start":6020.302,"end":6044.77,"text":"第40案,本院委員陣天載的18人聯聚,原住民保留地進方補償條例第5條及第6條條條文修正常案請審議案,採取委員會見,立即回交內政經濟欄委員會審查,宣讀完畢。無異通過下一案第41案,本院委員陣天載的16人聯聚,全國新公民投票不在籍投票法草案請審議案,採取委員會見,立即回交內政委員會審查,宣讀完畢。"},{"start":6045.612,"end":6049.334,"text":"五、一、通過下一案五、一、通過下一案五、一、通過下一案五、一、通過下一案"},{"start":6070.083,"end":6074.324,"text":"五、一、通過下一案五、一、通過下一案五、一、通過下一案五、一、通過下一案"},{"start":6095.014,"end":6098.357,"text":"五、一、通過下一案五、一、通過下一案五、一、通過下一案"},{"start":6124.721,"end":6150.516,"text":"第48案 本院委員李柏毅等18人聯聚,學生佛堂法第11條條維修政策請審案,採集委員會見,以及會教教育及文化委員會審查,宣布完畢。無異議通過下一案第49案 本院委員李柏毅等18人聯聚,技術及職業教育法第11條條維修政策請審案,採集委員會見,以及會教教育及文化委員會審查,宣布完畢。無異議通過下一案"},{"start":6151.138,"end":6179,"text":"第五十案本院委員李柏毅等18人聯聚自動安全管理法第二條及第十一條條文修正常勤水案柴修委員會見例行會交交通委員會審查宣讀完畢五議通過下一案第五十一案本院委員李柏毅等18人聯聚國家運輸安全調查委員會組織法第一條及第三條條文修正常勤水案柴修委員會見例行會交司法及法治交通兩委員會審查宣讀完畢五議通過下一案"},{"start":6179.585,"end":6203.275,"text":"第52案,本院委員李博毅等16人聯聚,陸海空軍軍事官服役條例第55條條文修憲草案請水一案,求修委員會見,臨時會交外交及國防委員會審查,宣讀完畢。無異通過下一案。第53案,本院委員李博毅等17人聯聚,地方民意大把翻用之際,及村里長修補助費補助條例第6條條文修憲草案請水一案,求修委員會見,臨時會交內政委員會審查,宣讀完畢。"},{"start":6208.004,"end":6211.226,"text":"五一通過下一案五一通過下一案五一通過下一案"},{"start":6237.674,"end":6259.213,"text":"第56案本日委員馬文君等20人聯聚森林法森林第8條之1條文草案請申一案。草修委員會見理事委員會交接近委員會審查。宣讀完畢。第57案本日委員吳慶林等16人聯聚國土計劃法第45條條文修正草案請申一案。草修委員會見理事委員會交內政委員會審查。宣讀完畢。"},{"start":6260.014,"end":6264.095,"text":"五一通過下一案五一通過下一案五一通過下一案"},{"start":6289.192,"end":6315.632,"text":"第62本院委員陳素月等19人聯聚老人福利法增定第34條之一條文草案請水恩。陳水恩會見你請回交社會福利及衛生環境委員會審查。宣讀完畢。無異通過下一案。第61案本院委員陳素月等19人聯聚文明年金法第54條之一條文修正草案請水恩。陳水恩會見你請回交社會福利及衛生環境委員會審查。宣讀完畢。"},{"start":6316.69,"end":6320.252,"text":"五、一、通過下一案五、一、通過下一案五、一、通過下一案"},{"start":6344.437,"end":6372.228,"text":"無異議通過下一案。第64案本院委員陳蘇悅等18人已廢止。行政院農業委員會組織條例請選一案。查詢委員會見。擬請回交司法及法制經濟。兩委員會審查。宣讀完畢。無異議通過下一案。第65案本院委員已延緩了21年連續電子支付機構管理條例第29套條文修正草案請選一案。查詢委員會見。擬請回交財政委員會審查。宣讀完畢。無異議通過下一案。"},{"start":6372.932,"end":6400.592,"text":"第66案本院委員吳宗憲等16人連續立法院職權刑事法第15條之一、第15條之二及第15條之四條維修證草案請水一案。財修委員會見立行會交司法及法支援會審查。宣讀完畢。無異通過下一案第67案本院委員吳宗憲等17人連續立法院職權刑事法部分條維修證草案請水一案。財修委員會見立行會交司法及法支援會審查。宣讀完畢。無異通過下一案"},{"start":6401.104,"end":6425.627,"text":"第68案,本院委員吳宗憲的16項領據,立法院職權刑事法部分條文修正常,請水恩、財修委員會見,您請回交司法及法律委員會審查,宣讀完畢。第69案,本院委員吳宗憲的16項領據,立法院職權刑事法第25條及第26條條文修正常,請水恩、財修委員會見,您請回交司法及法律委員會審查,宣讀完畢。"},{"start":6426.889,"end":6452.288,"text":"無異議通過下一案。第七十一案本院委員吳宗憲的十七人連續立法院職權刑事法第十七條條文修正常情水案陳秀燕會見立行會交司法及法治委或審查宣傳畢。無異議通過下一案。第七十一案本院委員吳宗憲的十七人連續立法院職權刑事法第十五條主二條文修正常情水案陳秀燕會見立行會交司法及法治委或審查宣傳畢。"},{"start":6453.703,"end":6474.709,"text":"五一通過下一案。第七十二案。門員委員賴若龍等17人聯聚公子雲財產申報法第五條條維修證草案請審議案。財修委員會見議請會交司法及法證委員會審查。宣討完畢。五一通過下一案。第七十三案。門員委員蘇曉慧等16人聯聚海洋保育法草案請審議案。財修委員會見議請會交內政委員會審查。宣討完畢。五一通過下一案。"},{"start":6481.087,"end":6482.807,"text":"第七十四案．第七十五案．"},{"start":6506.018,"end":6508.6,"text":"第七十六案．第七十七案．第七十七案．"},{"start":6528.971,"end":6556.705,"text":"無異議通過下議案。第七十八案本院委員蘇曉慧等20人聯聚教育人員任用條例部分條文修正草案請審議案。才修委員會見你請會加入司法及法治教育及文化聯盟委員會審查。宣讀完畢無異議通過下議案。第七十九案本院委員黃秀芳等18人聯聚學生輔導法部分條文修正草案請審議案。才修委員會見你請會加入教育及文化委員會審查。宣讀完畢無異議通過下議案。"},{"start":6557.332,"end":6580.029,"text":"第80案,本院委員黃秀芳等18人鄰居,紀念平等工作法第15條條務修正草原清水案,採取委員會見,引起委員會將社會福利優先環境委員會審查,宣讀完畢。五一通過下一案。第81案,本院委員黃秀芳等20人鄰居,社會救助法第二條第4條及第14條條務修正草原清水案,採取委員會見,引起委員會將社會福利優先環境委員會審查,宣讀完畢。"},{"start":6582.799,"end":6585.381,"text":"五、一、通過下一案五、一、通過下一案五、一、通過下一案"},{"start":6607.677,"end":6611.099,"text":"五一通過下議案五一通過下議案五一通過下議案"},{"start":6632.657,"end":6652.722,"text":"第86案,本院委員陳盈等19人凝聚,勞工保險條例第58條條為修正財管情緒一案,陳述委員會見,您請回交社會福利及衛生環境委員會審查,宣讀完畢。無異,通過下一案。第87案,本院委員王洪維等23人凝聚,添殘期事業法第15條條為修正財管情緒一案,陳述委員會見,您請回交經濟委員會審查,宣讀完畢。"},{"start":6656.803,"end":6660.145,"text":"五、二、通過下一案五、二、通過下一案五、二、通過下一案"},{"start":6682.813,"end":6707.822,"text":"無異議通過下一案．第90案本院委員領得負責17人鄰居東東交通管理處罰條例第30條條務修正草原清水案財修委員會見理事委員會加入交通委員會審查宣讀完畢無異議通過下一案．第91案本院委員領得負責20人鄰居中華民國刑法第354條條務修正草原清水案財修委員會見理事委員會加入司法啟發支援會審查宣讀完畢"},{"start":6708.604,"end":6712.865,"text":"五一通過下一案五一通過下一案五一通過下一案五一通過下一案"},{"start":6733.732,"end":6737.295,"text":"五、一、通過下一案五、一、通過下一案五、一、通過下一案"},{"start":6760.532,"end":6764.015,"text":"五、一、通過下一案五、一、通過下一案五、一、通過下一案"},{"start":6785.956,"end":6789.457,"text":"五一通過下一案五一通過下一案五一通過下一案"},{"start":6814.721,"end":6823.527,"text":"第102無異議通過下一案。第101案本院委員臨處應等18日臨時家屬刑及非家屬刑宴稅法第32條之一及第48條之二條維修正常案請審議案。財修委員會見臨時委員會交財政委員會審查宣讀完畢。"},{"start":6842.56,"end":6863.769,"text":"無異議通過下一案。第10二案本院委員羅美玲等17人離聚海洋保育法草案請審議案。才修委員會見你請委會長內政委會審查,宣讀完畢。無異議通過下一案。第10三案本院委員張家俊等22人離聚公務人員退休之前服需法第37條條務修正草案請審議案。才修委員會見你請委會長司法起碼就委會審查,宣讀完畢。"},{"start":6868.001,"end":6896.392,"text":"五一通過下一案。第104案本院委員徐欣盈的《十方人連據》一條法題二十一條條文修正草原清水案。求修院會見你請會交社會福利及衛生環境委員會審查。宣讀完畢。五一通過下一案。第105案本院委員劉建國的《十方人連據》國民年輕法題五十四條至一條文修正草原清水案。求修院會見你請會交社會福利及衛生環境委員會審查。宣讀完畢。五一通過下一案。"},{"start":6896.837,"end":6921.666,"text":"第106案,委員員劉建國的17人鄰居,癌症防治法第16條條文修正草案請審案。陳秀陽會見,你請回交社會福利及衛生環境委員會審查。宣讀完畢。第107案,委員員劉建國的16人鄰居,老年農民福利今天專行條例第4條條文修正草案請審案。陳秀陽會見,你請回交社會福利及衛生環境經濟內政三委員會審查。宣讀完畢。"},{"start":6923.72,"end":6928.041,"text":"五、一、通過下一案五、一、通過下一案五、一、通過下一案五、一、通過下一案五、一、通過下一案"},{"start":6952.679,"end":6981.566,"text":"五一通過下一案。第1102本院委員李燕秀等21人聯聚,兒童及少年福利與權益保障法第25條及第26條條文修正草案請審議案。才修院會見你請回交社會福利優先環境委員會審查。宣告完畢。五一通過下一案。第111案本院委員羅廷偉等21人聯聚最深醫療法草案請審議案。才修院會見你請回交社會福利優先環境委員會審查。宣告完畢。五一通過下一案。"},{"start":6982.13,"end":6995.098,"text":"第1、1、2案本院委員羅廷偉等21人聯聚在政醫療執行管理條例草案請審議案。財修委員會間你請委員會交財政委員會審查。宣布完畢。無異通過下一案。第1、1、3案本院委員羅廷偉等18人聯聚納稅者權利保護法第4條條文修正草案請審議案。財修委員會間你請委員會交財政委員會審查。宣布完畢。無異通過下一案。"},{"start":7008.735,"end":7015.324,"text":"第114案本院委員羅廷偉擔事就任凌駒,未被法定所謂條條無修正財運起訴因案,暫休議員會見,以請回交財政委員會審查。 宣告完畢。"},{"start":7020.373,"end":7049.511,"text":"第1152本院委員黃建豪等17人離聚,地方民意達到費用之際,及村里者需付補儲費補助條例,則內地7條之1條文草案請審議案。才須委員會間,你請回交內政委會審查。宣告完畢。第1162本院委員黃建豪等20人離聚,就業務保險法第10條、第11條及第19條之3條文修正草案請審議案。才須委員會間,你請回交社會福利修正環境委會審查。宣告完畢。"},{"start":7050.563,"end":7054.865,"text":"五、一通過下一案五、一通過下一案五、一通過下一案五、一通過下一案"},{"start":7078.618,"end":7103.136,"text":"無異議通過下一案。第1、9案本院委員翁曉琳等18人凝聚社會救助法第11條條文修正草案請水案。財修委員會見議請回交社會福利及衛生環境委員會審查。訊訊完畢。無異議通過下一案。第1、2、0案本院委員翁曉琳等18人凝聚立法院職權性施法第25條條文修正草案請水案。財修委員會見議請回交司法啟發就委員會審查。訊訊完畢。"},{"start":7105.373,"end":7127.603,"text":"無異議通過下一案。第1、2、1案本院委員吳曉琳等19人聯聚中華民國刑法增添第140條之一條文采完請申案。才修院會見你請會交內政委員會審查。宣布完畢。無異議通過下一案。第1、2、2案本院委員徐宇珍等20人聯聚海洋保育法采完請申案。才修院會見你請會交內政委員會審查。宣布完畢。"},{"start":7130.486,"end":7134.268,"text":"第一、二、三案第一、二、三案第一、二、三案第一、二、三案"},{"start":7158.188,"end":7185.749,"text":"第1、2、5案本院委員徐曉欣的24人鄰居地方民意代表費用之際及村里整修補助費補助條例第6條條維修正常請申案。採訊委員會見您請回交內政委員會審查。宣討完畢無異通過下一案第1、2、6案本院委員徐曉欣的27人鄰居國家機密保護法第11條條維修正常請申案。採訊委員會見您請回交司法啟發之委會審查。宣討完畢無異通過下一案"},{"start":7186.36,"end":7197.07,"text":"第12期案 本院委員許曉新等18日臨時 中華民國新法第286條條維修線草案請審議案 財修委員會見 擬請外交及國防委員會審查 宣布完畢無異議通過下議案第128案 本院委員許曉新等26日臨時 護照條例第36條條維修線草案請審議案 財修委員會見 擬請外交及國防委員會審查 宣布完畢"},{"start":7210.475,"end":7237.134,"text":"無異議通過下議案。第129案本院委員徐曉欣的16人連續電信法第63條及第64條條文修正草案請水案。財修委員會見理事會交交通委員會審查。宣告完畢。無異議通過下議案。第130案本院委員廖偉翔等18人連續兒童接少年福利與權益保障法增添第6條之一條文草案請水案。財修委員會見理事會交社會福利協商環境委員會審查。宣告完畢。"},{"start":7238.032,"end":7261.46,"text":"無異議通過下一案．第13一案．本院委員廖偉祥等16人鄰居．中華民國刑法第77條及第272條之一條為修正草原侵水案．財修委員會見你請回交司法及法修委員會審查．宣告完畢．無異議通過下一案．第13二案．本院委員呂玉玲等16人鄰居．農業發生條例第60條條為修正草原侵水案．財修委員會見你請回交經濟委員會審查．宣告完畢．"},{"start":7265.02,"end":7268.141,"text":"五、一、通過下議案五、一、通過下議案五、一、通過下議案"},{"start":7287.577,"end":7307.153,"text":"無異議通過下議案。第13、52本院委員緩解短時欺人連續工廠管理輔導法部份條文修正財務請水恩。財修委員會見你請回交經濟委員會審查,訓斷完畢。無異議通過下議案。第13、62本院委員緩解短時欺人連續設防法部份條文修正財務請水恩。財修委員會見你請回交內政委員會審查,訓斷完畢。"},{"start":7310.714,"end":7335.555,"text":"無異議通過下一案．第13期案．保育委員莊瑞雄等20人聯聚．海洋保育法草原侵水案．財修委員會見你請回交內政委員會審查．宣讀完畢無異議通過下一案．第13幫案．保育委員莊瑞雄等18人聯聚．地方民意代表費用之際．遵令掌握事務補助費補助條例第6條條文修正草原侵水案．財修委員會見你請回交內政委員會審查．宣讀完畢"},{"start":7336.383,"end":7362.003,"text":"無異通過下議案。第13、9案本院委員鍾業雄等21屆臨居國民體育法第23條條文修正草案請審議案。財修委員會見理情會交交集文化委員會審查宣告完畢。無異通過下議案。第14、0案本院委員陳培宇等18人臨居國際法整理第6條之一條文草案請審議案。財修委員會見理情會交內政委員會審查宣告完畢。無異通過下議案。"},{"start":7362.625,"end":7383.578,"text":"第一四一案委員臺灣民眾老老團聯聚新住民基本法草案請水恩採修委員會見你請回交內政委員會審查宣告完畢第一四二案委員臺灣民眾老老團聯聚證券交易法第十四條條文修正草案請水恩採修委員會見你請回交財政委員會審查宣告完畢"},{"start":7384.266,"end":7389.448,"text":"五、一通過下一案五、一通過下一案五、一通過下一案五、一通過下一案五、一通過下一案五、一通過下一案"},{"start":7407.881,"end":7410.243,"text":"五、一、通過下議案五、一、通過下議案五、一、通過下議案"},{"start":7438.055,"end":7441.056,"text":"五、一通過下一案五、一通過下一案五、一通過下一案"},{"start":7463.123,"end":7466.705,"text":"五、一通過下一案五、一通過下一案五、一通過下一案五、一通過下一案"},{"start":7487.369,"end":7511.52,"text":"報告委員會臺灣民眾黨團提議改交審查由經濟委員會來審查。無異議通過下議案。第15議案經濟部海外修正出流管制計畫書與規劃書檢核基準及洪峰流量計算方法第五點及第六點規定。財修委員會見議請回交經濟委員會。宣告完畢。無異議通過下議案。"},{"start":7512.079,"end":7539.151,"text":"第152案 農業部函文修正公告立陶宛及美國愛德河州自公務員性降息流息性感冒非疫區刪除。才修委員會見你請回交經濟委員會。宣告完畢。第153案 農業部函文修正公告立陶宛及美國愛德河州自公務員性降息流息性感冒非疫區刪除。才修委員會見你請回交經濟委員會。宣告完畢。無異通過下一案 無異通過下一案"},{"start":7539.639,"end":7563.633,"text":"第154案（奴役部海維修鎮進門地區偶體類動物及其產品,禁止出往臺灣本島及其他離島。才修委員會見。您請回交基金委員會。宣傳完畢。第155案（奴役部海維修鎮停止自發生非洲豬瘟之滾下地區,以郵遞寄送輸入豬肉產品第二點規定。才修委員會見。您請回交基金委員會。宣傳完畢。"},{"start":7564.403,"end":7567.564,"text":"五一通過下議案五一通過下議案五一通過下議案"},{"start":7589.332,"end":7616.139,"text":"第15方案 財政部海外修正不仁計算收工外國企業所得適用辦法 財政委員會見民情和教材政委員會 宣讀完畢 無異通過下議案第159案 基礎監督管理委員會海外修正 基礎監督管理委員會主管政府捐助及經指令民間捐助財政法人監督管理辦法第14條附件五 財政委員會見民情和教材政委員會 宣讀完畢 無異通過下議案"},{"start":7616.598,"end":7643.155,"text":"第160案金融監督管理委員會和維修陣保險業辦理在保險分出分入及其他危險分散機制管理辦法部份談判陳旭委員會見您請回交財政委員會宣讀完畢五議通過下議案第160議案金融監督管理委員會和維修陣專業在保險業財務業務管理辦法陳旭委員會見您請回交財政委員會宣讀完畢五議通過下議案"},{"start":7643.769,"end":7664.237,"text":"第162案 金融監督管理委員會海維修正 請領會計稅證書與申請職業單期規則 裁修委員會件 歷經會教財政委員會 宣准完畢第1632案 金融監督管理委員會海維修正 有價證券等為融資融券標準第二條及第八條條文 裁修委員會件 歷經會教財政委員會 宣准完畢"},{"start":7666.966,"end":7672.247,"text":"五、一通過下一案五、一通過下一案五、一通過下一案五、一通過下一案五、一通過下一案五、一通過下一案"},{"start":7693.956,"end":7697.458,"text":"五、一通過下議案五、一通過下議案五、一通過下議案"},{"start":7718.757,"end":7718.777,"text":"第1、6、8、9、9、10、11、12、13、14、15、16、17、18、19、20、21、22、23、24、25、26、27、28、29、30、31、32、33、34、35、36、36、37、39、40、40、41、42、43、44、45、45、46、46、47、49、49、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、50、"},{"start":7747.935,"end":7748.895,"text":"無異議通過下議案無異議通過下議案"},{"start":7764.96,"end":7793.937,"text":"第172案,就議布函文國民中小學校長主任教師甄選儲蓄及借聘辦法名稱修正為公立國民小學及國民中學校長主任甄選儲蓄辦法並修正條文,採取委員會間歷行外交教育及文化委員會。宣讀完畢。第172案,就議布函文公立國民小學及國民中學海外蘭才子女專門設立辦方,採取委員會間歷行外交教育及文化委員會。宣讀完畢。"},{"start":7794.577,"end":7797.859,"text":"五、一通過下議案五、一通過下議案五、一通過下議案"},{"start":7815.913,"end":7819.034,"text":"五、一、通過下一案五、一、通過下一案五、一、通過下一案"},{"start":7843.635,"end":7844.596,"text":"無異議通過下議案"},{"start":7865.23,"end":7891.75,"text":"第178案 考試院行為修正公務人員特種考試 原住民族考試規則第7條、第11條條文集、第3條、副表3、第5條、副表7、副表8、財修委員會見、立行會交、司法及法制委員會 宣傳完畢第179案 考試院行為修正公務人員特種考試 國際經濟商務人員考試規則第9條條文集、第4條、副表2、財修委員會見、立行會交、司法及法制委員會 宣傳完畢"},{"start":7894.019,"end":7917.492,"text":"第18領案 考試院行為修正命題規則第6條條文及月卷規則第25條、第26條、第30條條文。陳修緣會見臨行會交司法及法事委員會。宣告完畢。第18議案 衛生福利部涵送本院制定社會福利基本法通過負擔決議第二項書面報告。陳修緣會見臨行會交社會福利及生活環境委員會。宣告完畢。"},{"start":7918.57,"end":7924.033,"text":"無異議通過報告院會第182案到第374案請依序宣讀其中第189案198到200案233到247案339到373案國民黨黨團提議改交審查"},{"start":7946.564,"end":7946.764,"text":"第182案、186、188、189、191、198、207、211、216到218、235、236、238到240"},{"start":7968.131,"end":7996.153,"text":"兩百四十三兩百四十四到兩百四十七兩百四十九三百四十三三百五十三三百五十五三百七十四案臺灣民眾黨黨團提議改交審查宣讀後以上提案均交相關委員會審查其餘議案均照程序委員會意見通過請問院會"},{"start":7998.274,"end":8020.128,"text":"有異議,無異議宣讀後通過,請宣讀。第18、2案至第197案內選部,第198案中央選舉委員會,第199案至第20案不到當場處理委員會,第20案至第20案援助民族委員會,第20案至第21案經濟部,第21案至第22案行政院主席總署,"},{"start":8020.928,"end":8045.034,"text":"第二、七、二、三、一、金融監督管理委員會第二、三、二、三、四、國立故宮博物院第二、三、五、集體、二、三、六、國家通訊全部委員會第二、三、七、二、四、七、數位發展部第二、四、八、總統府第二、四、九、考試院第二、五、零、三、三、八、國防部第三、三、九、三、六、交通部第三、七、零、三、七、三、核能安全委員會"},{"start":8046.054,"end":8053.202,"text":"第三期時段財政部還為113年度相關預算、113年度中央政府總算的預算決議分別簡訊相關報告,宣讀完畢。報告委員會,第375項項請一併宣讀,宣讀後均准予備查,請宣讀。"},{"start":8066.803,"end":8082.308,"text":"第三期委員．第3802為本院社會福利及衛生委會函為院會交付選上衛生福利部108年度中央政府總算權益案等案均已於年度預算執行期間．第3802為本院社會福利及衛生環境委會函"},{"start":8082.788,"end":8110.968,"text":"委員會交互審查財政法人國家衛生研究院109年度工作執行成果及收支決算案等案因已於送達後一年內完成審查至期限,原依決算法第28條規定適同審議通過。質詢事項：行政院答覆部分,先去函送本院常務委員金輝等所提質詢之書面答覆共11件,以本院委員質詢部分、本院盧委員志強等向行政院提出質詢共7件。宣讀完畢。"},{"start":8113.123,"end":8128.545,"text":"報告委員會,現在對行政院院長、施政方針以及施政報告繼續質詢。今天進行個人質詢、交通組之質詢。我們現在請登記第一號陳委員超明質詢。"},{"start":8146.421,"end":8172.638,"text":"今天只是我們的韓院長好那今天我剛好立法院總執行排在第一個我再次特別感謝國民黨的立委還有民眾黨的立委來跟我鼓勵加油還有民進黨的立委來共襄盛行這可以講是立法院總執行人最多最熱鬧的一天"},{"start":8173.539,"end":8196.582,"text":"我會在此相信我們的韓院長一定以和諧公平來主持會議來帶領我們國會的革新還有對國家重要政策作為一個最好的決定我相信這個是一個好的開始那現在我開始請我們行政院的陳院長麻煩請陳院長備詢"},{"start":8204.762,"end":8207.284,"text":"我覺得我在任何的職務上都是"},{"start":8233.925,"end":8244.821,"text":"我曉得這是官方標準答案,我問的是兩個心態的差別在哪裡?這副總統該勤商還是這行政院長該勤商?全大、四大哪一個?"},{"start":8245.262,"end":8263.034,"text":"各有各的責任我當副總統的時候因為要做年金改革又要做婚姻平權等等是有相當多的責任那在行政院長當然更多各個部會都有就像你剛才講的交通、未還、經濟都要involved都要同"},{"start":8266.758,"end":8281.908,"text":"解決煩惱的事情、複雜的事情比較多。我再請教你,你當行政院剩下兩個月,你有沒有感覺到我做一天和尚敲一天鐘,人走茶樑?"},{"start":8284.444,"end":8298.792,"text":"我想我剛才已經講過我做任何的事情都是競技業業的來做我一定會做到5月19日認真做到5月19日而且會跟新的內閣來做無縫的接軌因為剛好也是民進黨繼續執政"},{"start":8300.433,"end":8312.279,"text":"另外一個重點問題,像我今天要跟你執行的問題,你跟我講好或是答應下來的事情,你會不會交給下一任的行政院長,沒有這樣問這個意思,這個總執行就沒什麼用啦。"},{"start":8316.021,"end":8318.242,"text":"我會不會交代下去?我會特別感謝我們陳院長"},{"start":8340.629,"end":8367.131,"text":"我說你是所有官員裡面比較不敢講不真實話的人,因為我感受很深。在照巧交流不到,剛好選舉的期間,你們執政黨跟我的候選人站在一起,你看到我在那邊講話比較悲慘,容然把我名字講出來,所以我貢獻很多。不然我出的場合都是講沒有功勞,所以我這一點很稱讚。你是一個比較"},{"start":8368.968,"end":8397.21,"text":"誠實誠懇的人這是我一定要做的再來我想NCC我很少講話然後我自己有官司現在在打打了16次的官司新聞的自由報導跟平衡的報導很重要交通部長我講NCC我講NCC啦不是啊不是那個主委你也不要上來啦"},{"start":8398.188,"end":8420.393,"text":"我只建議一項,院長,16次的官司失敗,這代表了一種一連串的失敗。這是一件小事。行政機關都請了最好的律師,怎麼會一直失敗?我想,我想你,因為我從這以來沒有請過一個官員說你要下台怎麼樣,你要自動辭職。"},{"start":8422.008,"end":8440.613,"text":"因為我看了整個事件尤其我是無黨了真的關閉一個新聞台是很重要的事情你真的很你們很清率在處理這樣事情本來民主進步我感覺是民主退步我只說在這那個我跟你建立一樣的事情好不好"},{"start":8441.073,"end":8453.124,"text":"我可以講一下嗎?關於NCC這個相關的訴訟案,當然每一個人的算法都不一樣,不同審計也在算。但是實際上其中26個案,14件是勝訴,只有兩件敗訴。"},{"start":8460.43,"end":8462.051,"text":"好不好,這樣就好,來"},{"start":8488.565,"end":8489.306,"text":"我今天第一個就是"},{"start":8518.227,"end":8543.285,"text":"因應我們投擲紫苗大溪谷的計畫苗栗重大的建設我在這邊有三個大的重要建設請我們的行政院長還有我們的王部長要大全力的支持。第一個舞陽高高架化延伸到頭分的地方這個非常重要因為紫苗大溪谷計畫"},{"start":8544.324,"end":8573.327,"text":"是跟著新宿市連結在一起。所以你這個地方要趕快延伸到那邊,未來才有發展,交通才不會擁擠。還有一條,大家比較情為感謝院長期間,把那個新宿到香山啊,那個西濱的高架化。這一條也很重要,因為直覽、投運、貨輪都是連接著新宿縣、新宿市的。所以大西部這一計畫這個要完成。"},{"start":8574.329,"end":8593.011,"text":"然後一個大新竹的輕軌計劃,我給院長、部長您要知道,新竹市及廟的主覽投資是聯合在一起,生活圈也在一起。所以在這個新竹的輕軌計劃,你們勢必要延展到主覽投資,才能整個施解交通問題。"},{"start":8595.151,"end":8607.839,"text":"這會議可以轉到高雄市區嗎?我想這個前面兩個計畫委員都很清楚現在都在不斷的在推動進行當中那大新竹的這個輕軌計畫這個計畫基本上應該是地方政府"},{"start":8613.142,"end":8625.312,"text":"再來推動,那我們會看他推動的狀況,有必要的話,我們交通部會來幫助。地方政府推動還是中央政府推動?還是地方政府規劃?規劃來跟中央申請選委。這個我來處理,我會追蹤考核。再來第二點,"},{"start":8634.824,"end":8654.693,"text":"我們苗栗高鐵站中班勢必在行。我為2016年到2023年我們已經超過18萬進次了,以前很少我都不好意思開口。但是我們才一小時一班,我為了要來台北執行我都一大早要起來。"},{"start":8655.578,"end":8667.507,"text":"我希望不管你南下北上在兩個小時之間再參加一班,不然到我們那邊做高鐵的幫忙確實到一小時一班。"},{"start":8668.868,"end":8678.354,"text":"議長,這能幫我倒數嗎?因為我苗栗很尷尬,到臺北是10分鐘,到臺中才28分鐘就到了,所以你們都把他稱呼掉,你看桃園新竹,臺中的班次那麼多,我們真的發展,你們就拖廉一下。"},{"start":8694.585,"end":8698.188,"text":"我希望,我也拜託王部長,我馬上會召開協調會,您把計畫領好。我希望在我們陳院長的任內裡面把他通過啦,好嗎?"},{"start":8711.679,"end":8723.586,"text":"不要笑著不回答,好像是沒有你們的事情。我希望合理的,沒有這樣啦,一天一天單純單純通通的事情。我這個講我的空間已經很大了,兩個小時增加一班啦,這不苛刻的要求好不好。"},{"start":8739.957,"end":8747.869,"text":"不要只有大都會的地方,班次特別多。我們這個飛六都的班次特別少,真的要加強改進啊。"},{"start":8748.852,"end":8761.298,"text":"不要為大都市的人在生活,全部都依靠他們,我們這邊都沒有人在照顧,希望改進一點。我叫國體來研究,跟委員來討論。王部長,你跟高鐵公司講,叫他15天弄一個計畫出來,這個很快,我馬上召開協調會議。陳院長,你就答應,王部長答應通過好不好。"},{"start":8773.664,"end":8786.598,"text":"我請議員先研究,然後再討論。你院長在,你不敢亂答應,院長所答應,電台在消音。我講的都合理啦,我講的都合理,我講的都合理,我講的都合理,我講的都合理,我講的都合理,我講的都合理,我講的都合理,我講的都合理,我講的都合理。"},{"start":8791.177,"end":8815.868,"text":"鐵路雙軌化,我這講了久了,講了十幾年,我總執行七年。現在所有鐵路連東部都雙軌化,只有我們苗栗到台中這一段沒有雙軌化,雖然已經合定,6年完成。這跟我們的大四股計畫連接台中都是新指示,都是息息相關。這個已經合定。"},{"start":8818.987,"end":8827.975,"text":"十五點九公立我希望你們六年完成改為四年完成你交代一下啦,效率沒那麼高啦,這樣"},{"start":8829.709,"end":8849.02,"text":"五點九公里要做任何的不看靠的,表示我們行政效率很低啊。對,委員你也很清楚,這工程當然是可以進來可以辦,但是在這個規約、規約的中間,我們希望這最重要的要來進行。當然如果可以加緊,那就加緊。但是這個溝通不太清楚啦。我請補充簡單講一下,補充簡單講一下。你已經可行應過,來一個是綜合規劃啦,我們加速啦。"},{"start":8858.866,"end":8878.84,"text":"我們加速來進行這個麻煩一下再來驗離跨戰式的為什麼提了這一條當初我協調的時候說你們的雙軌計畫要把這個計畫放在裡面現在我們查了一下雙軌計畫沒有放著驗離跨越式的車站這一點你們這個一百六十幾"},{"start":8885.069,"end":8904.923,"text":"這只有三個月,還是要請你們鐵道局還是鐵路公司把它完成掉,因為縣裡的發展那個差別很大,一條鐵路直隔著兩邊的情形發展差別很大,而且一天有2200人在這邊上下車,這條你們來做一下。"},{"start":8907.15,"end":8912.335,"text":"我希望這有辦法跟政府再來溝通。院長,你是好人,這條你給我三頁,三頁而已,唉唷,還在後面。好不好?我現在會跟廟裡館政府來..."},{"start":8924.548,"end":8927.049,"text":"我跟委員講,這個3月20時苗栗縣政府的公文已經交通部有收到,所以我會請交通部開始來進行。"},{"start":8946.734,"end":8969.184,"text":"包括你們那邊的議員都提出來,我講你們那邊的都提出來,這個是利益富裕的地方。我這次好不容易才贏了一次,寫了五次沒有一次贏,但是我容然遭受,這個拜託你幫我完成一下,再下來。所以說館政府要加油啦?沒有啦,館政府要加油啦,就我不講了。就用地方來合作啦,這很重要。你給我答應喔,"},{"start":8972.745,"end":8973.205,"text":"臺中都要拜託時間到了"},{"start":8999.949,"end":9025.965,"text":"啊,這個以前我是從鐵道局,這個很成功的一個案例,就是3億的Royalbike要延伸到台中,其實那一段很漂亮,尤其台中的人口那麼多,兩邊一交流下來,這一條是在交通裡面光光景點,最成功的一個示範的一個基地啊。啊,現在我想說,一定,"},{"start":9027.186,"end":9043.135,"text":"市長,委員延伸到台中1點,麻煩您來幫忙一下,這裡面還有人都要來加強設施的地方。好,我給委員報告一下,確實是鐵道自行車的補分在苗年管政府在做的時候是做到新成功,就像你說的那樣。但是現在要延伸到台中的時候,我也要跟台中市政府再來"},{"start":9058.588,"end":9069.841,"text":"時間有限,你幫我放通宵的銅鑼科學引擎到通宵盡量。這一條,我希望在我日內能完成,非常重要的道路。"},{"start":9071.038,"end":9079.464,"text":"我相信我這四年的立委任期,我希望能斷工或是完成,我就功成身退了。我要請議長這樣緊張一下,請你拜託把我完成一下。"},{"start":9098.357,"end":9105.808,"text":"謝謝陳委員超明的質詢,謝謝陳院長的備詢。接下來我們請登記第二位,土委員全級發言,質詢,謝謝。"},{"start":9128.114,"end":9149.743,"text":"好,謝謝主席。那請我們陳建仁陳院長。再請陳院長備詢。各位院長。好,好,院長。我請問一下,我們大圓航空城這個徵收案,我們院長應該知道吧?我知道。"},{"start":9150.672,"end":9170.25,"text":"因為他是我們中華民國有史以來區段徵收最大的開發案那徵收這個面積也突破到3148公頃那當初這些搬遷的市民他這個徵收有兩種補償方式那院長知道哪兩種補償方式嗎?"},{"start":9171.817,"end":9178.143,"text":"主要分兩種,一種是現金的補償,還有一種是抵價地,一個是用錢用現金,另外一個就是也是用現金等值的抵價地,兩種方式給我們徵收戶的民眾去選擇。"},{"start":9195.959,"end":9210.166,"text":"那這些徵收戶他都是配合國家重大建設跟政策那所以我認為他們是不是應該都享有同樣的待遇對應該那現在他們面臨一個問題就是我們這些徵收戶他選擇現金補償的"},{"start":9217.059,"end":9237.877,"text":"他現金補償以後他的老農津貼跟國民年金沒有被牌付所影響但是後來這些徵收戶因為有百分之九十幾因為他們認為這個地他被徵收掉他希望拿回這個地那我們政府也希望說不用發那麼多錢出去用地去抵這個地"},{"start":9238.377,"end":9264.237,"text":"所以後來他們就選擇這個底價地但是後來當他們收到權狀之後收到這安置接貨權狀之後居然馬上房子都還沒蓋收到權狀之後就被這個排付條款排除在老農津貼跟國民年金之外所以是不是這部分我希望是不是應該享有同樣的待遇是不是院長這邊是不是可以來幫我們解決一下"},{"start":9264.757,"end":9281.552,"text":"我想這件事情的話我們行政院是由政府院長來召集相關的會議然後會來就這樣子的看起來比較不一致的這個的情況會來做相關的討論那當然他的老容津貼的這個部分呢"},{"start":9281.972,"end":9283.853,"text":"我希望院長再幫忙一下,因為那時候我們有提出"},{"start":9299.657,"end":9320.754,"text":"也希望政府院長在召開航空城這個專案會議的時候像3月11日我們希望說有希望來討論這部分可是後來我們發現好像並沒有討論所以希望院長這邊能夠交辦一下針對我們稅捐機關農業部跟衛福部的部分希望跨部會來解決這個問題"},{"start":9322.745,"end":9327.59,"text":"因為當初民航局也有跟衛福部跟農業部說其實應該這個底價地應該也是符合這個損害賠償性質因為這個所得稅法說他們因為這個拿現金"},{"start":9338.32,"end":9362.474,"text":"是符合損害賠償性質所以他沒有在排付之內可是不知道為什麼反而拿這個同等值的地居然被排除在外所以民航局也認為說應該這個拿這個底價地應該也符合這損壞賠償性質所以這部分希望我們院長幫我們這些徵收戶爭取他們合法的權益畢竟這些徵收戶都是"},{"start":9362.914,"end":9374.091,"text":"配合國家重大政策我們也不希望往後區段徵收有這些問題影響到民眾對於徵收表達強烈的不滿也怕他們抵制這個徵收"},{"start":9375.438,"end":9393.517,"text":"好,這個部分我剛才已經說過,我會請我們政府院長來召集相關的部會來討論。請院長這部分多幫忙。接下來我們看一下下一段針對我們道路改善的影片,我們先播放請大家來看一下。"},{"start":9398.936,"end":9422.111,"text":"這個是有加快速度這是前幾天我們去針對這個路段拍攝的這個影片他這一段路就是隨便走一段路那知道請問院長不然應該知道這一段是在哪裡吧知道對"},{"start":9423.683,"end":9443.031,"text":"那是在哪裡?就是在這個觀音這一段。那部長對這也了解,因為我相信非常多的民眾陳情,這台六一我們桃園這沿海路段,它似乎到觀音這個路段,那這個坑坑洞洞的道路非常非常的不平整,而且"},{"start":9443.951,"end":9444.772,"text":"這個部分我想我們請部長來回答"},{"start":9470.587,"end":9491.861,"text":"對,各位報告,從111開始修,今年會徹底,有筆經費4.5億,會全部把它改善完畢。什麼時候開始動工修?從111年就開始修了。那可是還是很壞啊。對,但是今年,今年113有4.5億會丟進去,總共把那個77公里全部把它修完。那預計什麼時候可以全面重複完成?"},{"start":9492.361,"end":9511.003,"text":"就是那個今年年底全部修完今年年底可以全部修復完成所以現在已經陸續在修今年年底我們就有一條完整的道路是現在大概已經修了三十幾公里了好那我也順便跟部長報告台六一也是這樣台六六我相信你也接到很多反應吧是是"},{"start":9511.283,"end":9521.349,"text":"還有我們台六六我們在觀音段現在還是平交入口常常發生很多的意外而且造成很多交通的瓶頸那這個全面高架什麼時候可以啟動?"},{"start":9537.983,"end":9555.991,"text":"現在有一段在施工了,現在這五個路口平面路口,比較靠海在關於這一部分是現在設計,事業會發包,然後另外再過來6K這部分現在已經在施工中了。"},{"start":9556.94,"end":9558.262,"text":"所以目前現在已經開始在施作,你說4月發保是嗎?"},{"start":9569.604,"end":9596.3,"text":"有一段在分兩標,有一標在施工,一標事業要花包。所以預計116年全部可以高價完成?對。好,那這部分還請我們部長來多叮嚀。那還有我們針對我們桃園市大園,國二甲台15線延伸到台61線這個新建工程,因為它這現在也是我們航空城主要的連外道路,那不知道現在這個進度到哪裡?"},{"start":9597.04,"end":9598.783,"text":"好沒關係部長因為我的重點在後面齁"},{"start":9613.004,"end":9632.094,"text":"因為這個國道二甲延伸到台六一它延伸之後最主要我們希望把這個下面下方這個道路是不是可以一併納入這個工程裡面不要到時候二次施工造成民眾這個二次的傷害而且到時候再施工絕對會把這個工程期又再延長"},{"start":9633.174,"end":9662.021,"text":"這有需要跟地方政府討論一下,因為這個跟地方政府有關係對,這個我有跟地方政府先溝通過他們說希望交通部納入經費的部分各方面他們希望可以全數配合但是最主要希望交通部能夠納入這個國道二甲台15線延伸到台61線希望把它納入規劃跟施作裡面那地方政府的部分他說經費各方面他們希望跟交通部來全面配合"},{"start":9663.519,"end":9691.048,"text":"這個需要討論一下因為我們一般是這個高價段是我們負責平面段包括徵收還有一些因為下方道路我們交通部有負責鋪平的責任那我是希望直接先納入不要做好以後到時候再來什麼可行性評估再來徵收土地再來做是不是應該先納入直接把這個工程在做高價橋樑的時候一次一併把它做好"},{"start":9691.628,"end":9717.291,"text":"委員當時的可行性評估就我的了解好像只是說高架路的部分並沒有在平面的這個可行性評估那如果現在平面要納進來這個我讓交通部跟地方政府齁一起來討論看看好不好因為今天講的這只要目的因為當初當初做的是做高架路的評估嘛因為民眾一直反映啦希望說能夠一併來施作因為這個下面這道路是一定要做的"},{"start":9717.851,"end":9729.786,"text":"為什麼不在座的時候一併來做,到時候有審時,然後民眾也不用說等到高架做好又再來做道路,他把這個工程期拉得很長。這請部長再跟我們多幫忙,希望把這個一併納入這個我們規劃跟施作裡面。"},{"start":9736.374,"end":9763.372,"text":"那還有我們現在五陽高價延伸就是剛剛我們陳昌明委員也有講國道1號這個陽頭路的拓寬就是陽梅道頭份那這個我們已經確定會去做了那現在針對陽梅的部分是不是能夠把這個陽梅的針射閘道一併納入我們的陽頭段的拓寬工程裡面"},{"start":9763.86,"end":9786.56,"text":"希望這個北出南入這個閘道能夠一併納入來一起施作。我們現在請高工局在研究啦,過去這部分有在研究。因為我有去了解啦,那你有請那個地方交通局去做這個可行性評估。那其實經過我們討論過,他說這個可行性評估是絕對要做。"},{"start":9789.162,"end":9816.244,"text":"所以很多民眾還有地方政府也希望交通部能夠把這個一併納入不要像我們舞陽高架那個中峰北交流道民國99年高架完成現在隔了15年現在才去做中峰北的交流道當初做的時候就希望做結果那時候不納入你看現在又在那邊施工民眾說15年前就可以規劃可以完成的東西為什麼隔了15年以後再來做"},{"start":9816.744,"end":9833.124,"text":"所以希望這個楊梅真色閘道也希望納入我們楊頭段的拓寬工程裡面。這個地方政府先提出來,然後跟我們一起討論這樣。好,那希望這個提出來,希望交通部能夠為我們民眾的福祉多幫忙配合。"},{"start":9834.745,"end":9836.206,"text":"還有也是這個羊頭段拓寬的"},{"start":9858.596,"end":9883.812,"text":"因為現在陽梅我們當初我們公路總局也有撥了一筆經費把我們陽梅深深路打通到秀才路然後再連接到我們的中山南路這一部分我們公路局那時候有撥了好像撥了兩億多的經費那像這個路段深深路打到秀才路這路段今年內就會通車接下來就要連接到我們的"},{"start":9884.552,"end":9884.572,"text":"韓國瑜議員"},{"start":9899.878,"end":9912.212,"text":"所以暫時停擺,所以是不是希望在北上方下一樣我們洋頭段這個拓寬工程高架下方道路我們是不是請交通部高工局也可以一併納入這個設計跟施作裡面。"},{"start":9915.215,"end":9943.742,"text":"這可能要看它的整個高層怎麼接啦我想還是一樣就是說有一些分析如果地方有這個想法我想說可以討論但是畢竟它工程面要去討論那我這邊提出那我也希望到時候我們要求我們地方政府交通局也來提出然後最主要希望交通部能夠來配合我們希望真的把這個工程能夠一次來完成不要做了以後又再二次施工造成更多的問題"},{"start":9944.822,"end":9957.258,"text":"還有我們之前我們楊梅交流道有在那個增設北上的專用道楊梅交流道有增設的北上交流道的專用道"},{"start":9957.927,"end":9984.497,"text":"﹚議員﹚"},{"start":9985.519,"end":9992.833,"text":"徵道路造成他們很多的危險性所以他們希望能夠在各個地方來徵社我們的機車專用道"},{"start":9995.199,"end":10018.886,"text":"這個部分因為它主要是要分流嘛然後我想說這部分也一樣就是交通局先提出來對我希望這部分交通局配合因為這之前提出像我們南崁跟中壢新戶交通道都有做這個計策專用道不知道為什麼到陽梅爭取的時候你們就百般的很多的問題說這也不行那也不行可是對我們來講我們覺得那都是藉口"},{"start":10019.426,"end":10030.536,"text":"因為平民旁邊就可以拓寬,就可以去做,所以這部分提出希望我們交通部這部分能夠來幫忙來協助,到時候來辦理這個會刊。希望我們行政院跟交通部為民來多幫忙"},{"start":10043.797,"end":10044.738,"text":"謝謝圖委員全機的質詢,也謝謝陳院長的備詢。接下來我們請登記第9號,嚴委員寬恒質詢。"},{"start":10075.398,"end":10081.846,"text":"主席、各位列席委員、各位列席官員、主席。我想請行政院陳院長。再請陳院長備詢。院委員早。院長早。早。"},{"start":10090.211,"end":10115.23,"text":"院長,以下每一項交通建設的質詢都非常重要,都將影響到整個大台中未來的發展。那因為時間有限,我先大概說明,就是中坑西南向臨外道路、西屯路四段銜接向上路已經在112年的8月份通車。這項建設從爭取到完工通車超過10年的時間,本期爭取的時間超過10年。"},{"start":10116.519,"end":10139.37,"text":"那這條道路確實通車之後有效的改善了由原北路跟臺灣大道上下班時間的車流。這條道路的誕生是為了要營運中部科學園區數萬多名的工作人員上下班疏導車流而生。但是現在面臨的另外一個問題就是西屯路三段跟東大路一段它成為交通的瓶頸。"},{"start":10140.47,"end":10163.918,"text":"中科西南向延伸特5號計劃道路都會沿路延伸到東大路新闢路段這一條道路是60米計劃道路現在地價高漲又改為實價徵收龐大的費用不是地方政府所能承擔市政府會儘速規劃爭取中央預算本席認為中科管理局也應該要積極向中央反映"},{"start":10164.718,"end":10178.829,"text":"臨海道路開闢的迫切性而不是只關心產業發展而忽略周邊交通的問題。那中部科學園區臺中園區擴建二期案通過都市計畫變更臺積電未來會持續擴敞。那基地位於臺中園區西側面積89.75公頃是為了因應臺灣半導體產業佈局需求及未來整體發展而開發。"},{"start":10190.646,"end":10209.336,"text":"那未來還會再增加5000個就業機會所以你可以想像到在現在的一個上下班的車流再加上5000部的汽機車還有往來運輸的大型車輛這裡的交通一定會癱瘓但是我們在地的居民沒有那麼多的10年可以等待"},{"start":10210.416,"end":10229.842,"text":"我們已經在112年的7月27日由臺中市多位議員還有施議會副議長以及中科管理局前往會館。當天科管局也有派員出席,更在會議記錄上寫下本次討論之領外道路對於疏解周邊交通確有幫助。"},{"start":10230.728,"end":10250.306,"text":"本席希望既然政府如此看重中科和台積電來台中設廠這對於台中創造就業機會是好事但發展半導體是我國的發展目標我希望到時候中央不要袖手旁觀因為這不僅僅是地方政府的責任中央應該要用最大的善意來予以協助"},{"start":10252.273,"end":10269.543,"text":"台中的生活圈道路系統,從東到西,從北到南,台74、台61、國道1、1號、3號、4號,除了東勢和平之外,幾乎可以透過快速道路和快速公路來進行銜接,但是本席的選區大度變成了孤兒。"},{"start":10270.779,"end":10291.132,"text":"本席爭取的大渡河美大橋2026年通車之後可以有效的分流國道3號龍井交流道和向上路的大型車輛可以透過河美大橋直接通往台中港區但是對於民眾的通勤車流幫助有限加上大渡只有一個主要道路就是省道台一線"},{"start":10293.734,"end":10314.732,"text":"緊有兩線到了沙田路由北至南貫穿大渡區。大渡進來的人口也持續上升,所以非常需要生活圈道路的開闢,這將對大渡龍井台中港區有極大的幫助。目前台74延伸到龍井台61線生活圈4號大渡延伸段,在2020年通過環評。"},{"start":10317.836,"end":10318.376,"text":"新聞新聞新聞新聞新聞新聞"},{"start":10333.376,"end":10356.586,"text":"未來會爭取111到116年納入生活圈道路交通系統建設計畫因為總經費非常龐大要請行政院來支持所以院長這部分你可不可以表態你願不願意支持大都區的這個生活圈道路委員你剛才提到的這有關於這一個道路的延伸還有這一個"},{"start":10357.385,"end":10383.195,"text":"大度的延伸段的這個部分都是屬於這個內政部營建署主政的部分那因為我們今天是交通專題的個人的質詢他們沒有來但是我可以跟您報告就是說這一個生活圈的道路當然是地方政府以來規劃嘛規劃完了以後把相關的看他的可行性必要性以後然後他就會提出計畫向內政部營建署來提出經費的補助"},{"start":10385.256,"end":10385.997,"text":"現在已經是全國第二大都"},{"start":10409.572,"end":10436.25,"text":"每每在預算上因為臺中市政府的財政狀況好所以就變成這個財力成績已經到達第二級如果按照現行的補助辦法就剛剛院長你提到說由市政府送上來之後經過內政部的一個審查然後來按照補助辦法來編列那依照現行的補助辦法是可以達到73%中央對臺中市政府在生活圈道路交通系統的補助計畫的補助範圍"},{"start":10438.672,"end":10455.384,"text":"那尤其這麼高的一個一個一個預算所以才要說在這邊請院長一定要全力的協助那臺中南線我們知道臺中南線捷運南線在100在1月29號已經有行政院來核定總經費1615.14億那這個地方要負擔939.55億高達58%反觀高雄市"},{"start":10465.806,"end":10471.152,"text":"這個捷運黃線總經費1442億那地方負擔608億比例為42%那另外一個小港林園的這個總經費553億那地方負擔220億那負擔比例41%所以"},{"start":10485.589,"end":10485.749,"text":"委員我講一下"},{"start":10505.135,"end":10517.91,"text":"好,我是在這裡說完,因為我們的時間非常有限。你有一個事情沒收到,就是市場部分你沒列在這裡考慮啦。市場部分,對。那另外就是鐵路高架的部分,因為我們雙軌化剛剛我們"},{"start":10521.714,"end":10549.395,"text":"這個陳委員也有提到那行政院1月29日合定的部分是雙軌雙軌的部分是161億長度從苗栗到台中38.3公里但是還有另外一個計畫大台中地區山海線鐵路雙軌高架化建置計畫的可行性研究那有部分是跟海線雙軌化有重疊所以因為台鐵在薩路站勢必要高架和捷運南線共構做一個銜接所以"},{"start":10550.626,"end":10568.788,"text":"目前以交通部112年9月11日的審查意見完成補充修正並於113年2月23日再次提報中央審查所以目前交通部113年3月5日交下鐵道局辦理審查作業"},{"start":10570.749,"end":10586.489,"text":"還有一個更重要的就是我們現在在烏日區的鐵路高架從大慶到烏日新站這個部分已經談了好久烏日大慶高架化他本案是延續107年10月通車的臺中都會區鐵路高架捷運化計畫"},{"start":10587.871,"end":10612.158,"text":"三點七公里他可以縫合一個區域的交通還有鐵道兩邊的一個經濟發展但是現在因為未來營運及產權還有獲益全部都屬中央所以這個部分可不可以請院長我們交通部長也在這邊這個鐵路高架烏日大慶站到烏日鐵路新站這部分可不可以做一個承諾進速的啟動"},{"start":10616.307,"end":10636.98,"text":"各位報告,的確這一次我們有協助台中市政府把所謂三海線分為兩個,第一個就是三線的大清呼日,另外一個是海線的大甲追分,那他們也報告都已經過來,我們初步審查大概大致OK,所以我們最近應該會他修正以後我們會報行政院國會來審查。"},{"start":10638.613,"end":10646.82,"text":"還要報國發會審查那這個要到行政院合定那什麼時候可以合定可不可以給我們一個氣象就是我們雙方會議當然在國發會各個相關單位的意見當然就競訴對加盟部來講競訴這樣好不好"},{"start":10652.79,"end":10654.251,"text":"其實我覺得這是一個給行政院一個洗刷汙名的機會,確實因為像"},{"start":10681.054,"end":10684.736,"text":"對不過剛才講洗刷汙名我不太同意不過我跟委員要報告就是說"},{"start":10706.803,"end":10734.626,"text":"很多的這個建設實際上地方政府是扮演很多的角色。剛才你講的那個中央補助款的部分特別是捷運的部分我們是有這一個所謂的自償的部分要把自償部分拿掉以後再來看中央跟地方的分配而這中央地方的分配每一個都會區都是一樣所以說你剛才講的那個52跟41是不能夠比的啦因為自償比例是不一樣不過不管怎麼樣"},{"start":10735.246,"end":10735.887,"text":"我聽到大家都很緊張"},{"start":10765.546,"end":10780.811,"text":"臺中市是一個正在成長發展的一個城市,人口也繼續的增加,這個增加也非常的快。所以說我們,我剛剛說一個洗刷汙名的機會是因為外界對於行政院會有一個大小眼的批評。"},{"start":10781.531,"end":10807.724,"text":"所以我們今天有這個機會,所以我們就沒有這樣,如果沒有這樣的時候,我們就要趁這個機會,把台中市,把這個都市的發展當中,我們行政院配合的地方,我們來協助地方,讓地方有一個比較好的發展。委員我也要拜託你特意跟大家講一下,那個自償比率要靠條件來比啦,如果不這樣的話,就說我們都沒有種南青種,沒有那個事情。"},{"start":10808.044,"end":10834.773,"text":"我們是聽受台中旗和聽受國用旗都完全受感。這個烏日鐵路大慶到烏日的高加化我已經提了超過10年了啦從當時的一個39億到一直到現在整個經費規模上看百億啦所以這個部分已經拖了那麼久不應該再拖那所以這一次如果說能夠在陳院長"},{"start":10836.148,"end":10859.211,"text":"您的任內然後完成這個審查跟核定我相信我相信這會是一個一個全新的里程碑另外而且我們對於地方的發展建設不分藍綠我們就是要一個陀螺一個橋樑包括整個大眾捷運就是要讓讓每一個人都能夠來使用要帶動地方的發展所以我們不要用那麼多政敵的意願"},{"start":10860.853,"end":10863.618,"text":"我就是沒有在陣地的意願,所以我說中央地方來合作。"},{"start":10866.946,"end":10895.125,"text":"接下來我再跟院長說明我們現在臺中市的高架道路環中路六段這個部分現在是整個環中路唯一沒有高架的部分在五段到七段中間大概1045米的部分那當初因為民眾反對所以在環中路六段的約有600多公尺是平面道路加上銜接閘道部分的工程起點到終點約1045公尺"},{"start":10897.466,"end":10909.613,"text":"現在的狀況就是說車子必須下橋之後再重新上橋,造成用路人的不便以及車速過快所造成當地民眾過馬路的時候心驚膽跳而且時常發生這些車禍。"},{"start":10911.222,"end":10933.261,"text":"本席在3月19日也邀請了議員、里長及相關的單位包括國土署以及地政局還有在地的這些機關前往會刊。這個地政局建議環中路可以踩全線高架化與光明路形成一個立體化的路口。改善環中路通過新車流"},{"start":10936.183,"end":10959.517,"text":"請問院長是否可以將此計畫納入一百一十一到一百一十六年生活圈道路交通系統建設計畫由中央來補助軍會協助地方完成這個本案的一個建設。像我剛才說的,我們中央地方要合作嘛,在市政府就趕緊把這個"},{"start":10960.718,"end":10980.536,"text":"我們請他盡速的把案件報告給中央,要趕緊上來,要上來的時候,我們請這個內建部的國土署來做相關的評估。如果沒有中央的補助,沒有中央的一個這個合定的話,地方沒有辦法來做這些工程。對,那如果是工程選擇通過,可以。"},{"start":10981.605,"end":10983.566,"text":"謝謝嚴委員寬恒的質詢謝謝陳院長的備詢接下來我們請登記第10號六委員先祥質詢"},{"start":11030.703,"end":11039.387,"text":"謝謝院長謝謝主席麻煩邀請我們的陳院長還有我們工程會主委再請陳院長備詢工程會備詢工程會要委員"},{"start":11046.354,"end":11061.864,"text":"院長好,謝謝院長那其實在我來立法院第一次委員會的算是質詢那在委員會的時候第一個當然第一天是工程委員會那我非常的肯定我們的吳主委他對於我的"},{"start":11062.424,"end":11081.293,"text":"當天的提問都是據實以告。當天的提問就是我們數位身分證的一個議題。吳主委跟我說明說我們經過工程會的協調,當天就是協調之後,內政部要賠給廠商2.8億元。後來經過一些社會的討論,除了當天賠償給廠商的2.8億元,可能還有一些前面已經投入的資本。"},{"start":11088.576,"end":11114.911,"text":"那我想趁今天這個機會來跟院長確認一下在我們的數位身份證上面我不要講賠償啦,賠償這個字眼可能不太好我們在數位身份證上面投資了多少的一個資源在上面呢?這些數字不包括我們的行政人員的資本的人事成本就單純給廠商的錢有沒有這經過社會的討論我們有沒有統計過到底花了多少錢?這個部分實際上"},{"start":11116.525,"end":11124.921,"text":"剛才講的有2.8億以外還有一個4.多億的經費。所以總共加起來大概多少?因為有人說是7億。7億多。"},{"start":11127.484,"end":11151.803,"text":"7億多但是我要跟你講那個4億多的東西實際上它是還是可以我們可以把它當作投資所以總共是7億多那每年大概還要再花6300萬的經費來做維護嘛所以就是拖了一天那我們就大概每天平均大概花20萬的經費來做設備的維護但是實際上它到目前為止還沒有任何的一個成效嘛那當天我也有請我們的吳主委幫忙"},{"start":11152.443,"end":11173.022,"text":"做後續的追蹤那有這樣子的一個結果那行政上面勢必有一些缺失那後續可能會有一些檢討我想確認一下可能這個工程會也不方便我直接介入啦那今天院長在這邊我直接請教院長有關數位身分證缺失的檢討報告我們有沒有辦法來把它提出"},{"start":11173.642,"end":11196.896,"text":"我想這個數位身份證當時在規劃的過程當中因為接受各界的反應所以我們就暫緩然後我們現在也就是說各自的保護要能夠更強化以後才來進行而且呢這些都尊重那有關是會有廣泛討論的嘛那我們可能行政單位會有一些檢討嘛"},{"start":11197.876,"end":11219.529,"text":"那我們是不是後續有會來做相關的檢討跟課程?當然啦,我們會繼續來檢討看看是不是我們什麼時候要開始再來推動等等。那相關的檢討大概多久以內可以做一份報告?那我們需要取得大家的共識。那現在剛才講到個資保護的部分嘛,那大法官事線的時候也說在個資保護的部分我們需要有設立,我還沒有講完。"},{"start":11223.431,"end":11248.844,"text":"設立一個各自保護的相關的機構然後各自保護的委員會我們現在在籌備處完成以後我們對各自的保護很完整以後當然再來討論怎麼樣來推動所以事有先後、事有緩急所以我們是這樣來推進的那有關至少在賠償的部分那後續我們行政院會不會做相關的檢討報告"},{"start":11251.545,"end":11276.545,"text":"這一個部分等到我剛才已經講過這個最重要的這個部分是因為我們還沒有達到共識講會或不會還沒有達到共識會或不會那我們最後要看看這個事情到底要你的檢討報告也可以出來說我覺得我們做得很好我們沒有錯啊我們都尊重就是我只是想要說我們能不能提供一份報告那我們要去要怎麼推動都可以寫在裡面如果要繼續推動要怎麼檢討呢"},{"start":11280.336,"end":11302.893,"text":"所以你就看看說等到了各支保護的機構出來大家對各支保護有那個完整的瞭解然後我們再來看看到底數位身分證要不要推。今天院長在這邊的回答就是針對目前數位身分證執行到這個階段那引發了社會的一些討論我們行政院不用做任何的檢討報告"},{"start":11304.194,"end":11327.085,"text":"我尊重我尊重這就是院長的回答我尊重請政院認為不用做任何的檢討報告是吧對不對不用嘛你們會後續再繼續推嘛我尊重我尊重這個話題就到這邊好謝謝謝謝我們的院長好謝謝院長那接下來接下來的問題我就來提一下地方的建設那到下一頁"},{"start":11328.562,"end":11355.443,"text":"那跟院長報告一下分享一下我們汐止人是非常熱愛大眾運輸工具的那一些背景資料先跟院長報告我們汐止的有幾個火車站3個啦那包括汐克火車站每天的預量大概2萬那排名第15名在台鐵裡面排名第15名汐止火車站也大概2萬排名第17名兩個加起來就是我們汐止的在台鐵裡面就汐止跟汐科加起來的貢獻大概4萬"},{"start":11356.704,"end":11384.218,"text":"那如果加起來的話大概在全國的排名大概會落到第7名也就是在板橋站之後那在新竹站之前也就是說我們汐止人非常的願意響應國家的政策來搭乘這個大眾運輸工具那包括這個圖片是這個南港展覽館捷運站板南線南港展覽館捷運站6號出口的一個每天晚上那邊排隊搭乘的民眾那這裡的民眾除了汐止還有基隆的民眾那都會在這邊接駁"},{"start":11384.958,"end":11411.627,"text":"所以說過去我們汐止的民眾長期以來都有一個訴求是希望說板南線是不是有機會延伸到汐止來那過去在相關的討論中因為台鐵第三軌卡住軌道的關係沒有辦法做延伸這是一些背景資料先跟院長報告那後來基隆捷運推動了之後決定把第三軌的路廊讓出來把它廢掉給基隆捷運來使用那我們汐止人就會不禁想"},{"start":11412.888,"end":11434.924,"text":"現在既然台鐵第三軌可以讓基隆捷運的路廊來使用了那為何不能讓板南線來做一個延伸這是我們汐止人的一個疑惑那所以說在我們公布方案之後舉辦地方的說明會也許多人都提出了相關的建議台鐵局這個鐵道局啦鐵道局在當天的地方說明會後"},{"start":11436.929,"end":11444.884,"text":"也承諾說我們會把這個評估報告就是板南縣延伸汐止的張書安納入到基隆捷運的報告規劃當中"},{"start":11449.748,"end":11475.156,"text":"代表說這個案子是地方可能有更多的一個期待那我認為啦因為基隆捷運的案子是在今年的1月31號的時候合定的嘛行政院合定嘛對不對部長領頭嘛那其實在這麼有爭議的一個建設當中我非常的不解我們其實大家都說在大選過後的內閣叫看守內閣嘛對不對我們看守內閣適合"},{"start":11482.902,"end":11498.835,"text":"問法很奇怪沒有所謂看守內閣這樣的四個字任何的內閣都需要好好的做事做到這個內閣下台為止所以任何時間都要做事沒有看守內閣不做事的這個道理第二個"},{"start":11499.462,"end":11499.642,"text":"我們這邊持開放態度嗎?"},{"start":11527.125,"end":11528.385,"text":"沒有問題阿,我都會去問阿沒有問題阿"},{"start":11557.031,"end":11557.191,"text":"委員我講"},{"start":11580.134,"end":11600.626,"text":"我剛才講過捷運是由地方政府來規劃來推動所以在這個過程當中三個市政府都已經北北基都同意的這個方案然後送過來基隆捷運這樣送過來所以中央來決定那如果是你要改變可以啊那就跟"},{"start":11601.506,"end":11628.505,"text":"臺北市政府、新北市政府還要再去談啊。那你談出來新的看法。你請現在的基隆市政府去跟新北市跟臺北市去談談你們的計畫是什麼啊。再來看啊。所以我們持開放態度嘛對不對。我跟委員提一點啦。比如說你關心了矽子跟矽科。如果南線到張書安站。矽子跟矽科都要在張書安轉城。但是現在搭基隆捷運是直接到南港站。"},{"start":11629.445,"end":11645.699,"text":"到南港站還不是要把南線轉成?我們的目的地又不是南港站當然你看到細科細子這麼多他們全部擠在張書安轉成所以這個應該是過去式的以前就是不演嘛最後我們用金融捷運來cover這個延伸段南線的延伸段"},{"start":11645.899,"end":11667.271,"text":"我覺得要整個基隆來考量不要只為了一個區來考量這樣委員你是代表整個基隆市我們當然可以為基隆來考量啊我從來沒有說反對這個延伸到基隆嘛我們就是部分中間路段的爭議的路線還有沒有討論的空間嗎我是覺得是重疊了真的重疊有沒有討論空間我個人是覺得"},{"start":11668.266,"end":11691.201,"text":"幾乎沒有討論,因為現在基隆捷運已經走這個路線到南港站,你現在從南港要再把它延伸,那不是重疊了嗎?所以說部分的路線,南港到張樹灣站這個部分,我們地方的訴求,部長很清楚嘛,就是用板南線來延伸嘛,那基隆捷運過張樹灣到基隆的部分,"},{"start":11692.242,"end":11702.131,"text":"就繼續推動嘛因為他是跟系統捷運結合嘛沒錯啊這樣你要走回頭路了就是以前臺北市他不願意做這一段後來在我剛剛一開始就跟你們說明過了第三軌嘛對不對"},{"start":11706.147,"end":11721.159,"text":"當初都是用第三個月當理由嗎?沒有,我跟你報告,現在已經中俄國家合訂,現在新北市政府要當主辦單位也要做了喔。你現在再重來就是這個再回到過去了。沒關係,我就是要跟我們院長跟部長來確認,地方政府"},{"start":11724.997,"end":11751.737,"text":"的態度地方政府自己去承擔。我們中央單位對於這樣子的一個合定的計畫還有沒有討論的空間去做調整?有或沒有?我覺得沒有了。因為我路線跟你重疊了啊。我現在是走我的輕軌到南港展覽館。你現在南港展覽館到張刷又變成這個南線的延伸。我是覺得這個...所以汐止人真的很可憐啊。汐止人很可憐。當初西東捷運的時候在規劃的時候"},{"start":11754.118,"end":11770.51,"text":"這個路線拖了很久部長也非常清楚臺北市端對於要不要做有許多的意見案子擱置了導致我們細子人沒有意見的案子因為臺北市的擱置我們整個案子拖到現在才分段來施工結果今天"},{"start":11772.096,"end":11800.299,"text":"一條捷運要經過細子完全不用尊重細子人的意見然後就為了當初某某人的一句話講出來的政策要把它來達成地方的意見完全不採納地方做的地方說明會要你們做的報告裡面錯誤有一堆拿這錯誤的報告來給地方政府不是不是那你要捷運是哪些錯誤我現在就回答你你是指哪些錯誤原方案我們基隆捷運我先請問我們基隆捷運當初設置的目的是什麼"},{"start":11800.979,"end":11804.341,"text":"然後我們在報告裡面寫基隆捷運轉版南線的人次的比例"},{"start":11823.018,"end":11823.618,"text":"不是,不是"},{"start":11852.658,"end":11863.896,"text":"不是這樣,如果當時在以前的市政府他願意把阪南縣延伸可是這件事情拖很久才你談到為什麼侯市長要做這個西東縣"},{"start":11865.575,"end":11886.657,"text":"但是最後沒辦法他覺得這部分還是請交通部來協助所以我們現在這一段一直以來都是台鐵第三軌的原因嘛就一開始先做背景的說明了嘛台鐵第三軌的原因拿掉了之後把南線延伸汐止的最大障礙拿掉了嘛不是這個原因是民生汐止線當時的台北市政府不想做"},{"start":11887.378,"end":11912.831,"text":"那侯市長希望做這個尾段這一段,您了解嗎?那是西東嗎?對,所以現在就這樣,因為你民進黨從頭做到尾,這當然是可行。現在是最後在新北覺得說這一段要必須跟中央基隆捷運結合起來,才有西東線跟基隆捷運兩個整合的這個案子。現在你再回到那邊去,我覺得這個整個都又回到過去了,現在已經"},{"start":11913.66,"end":11913.7,"text":"你這樣我"},{"start":11946.771,"end":11958.626,"text":"老公沒辦法,你這樣會讓你的汐止的選民吼,現在基隆捷運是搭在汐止站、汐科站就直接到南港站南港。你現在以後他們這一些都要搭台鐵到張樹灣站再轉你的那個。"},{"start":11962.57,"end":11965.793,"text":"當時大南港站是因為有高鐵,我再跟各位報告。"},{"start":11991.271,"end":11996.633,"text":"問題是你們的報告就寫說基隆捷運到阪南線的轉乘率只有6.74%每天8580人這是你們寫的啊所以我必須要回過來說一份檢討報告如果說他能夠讓人家幸福"},{"start":12021.567,"end":12038.635,"text":"我們都會尊重但是當地方的民眾提出建議之後我們鐵道局也答應要做了結果後續的報告卻是與我們地方的民眾所了解的事實有許多的很大的一個差異你要拿這一份報告來塞我們汐止民眾的嘴"},{"start":12039.935,"end":12044.717,"text":"你現在回到過去,這一段根本沒有人要做。我們最後把這一段接上來。"},{"start":12061.26,"end":12065.101,"text":"張素安我們的藍色如果說看左邊的箭頭最下面藍色那是阪南線他指到張素安而西東捷運跟基隆捷運"},{"start":12091.496,"end":12094.818,"text":"那位你現在已經進行到施工了"},{"start":12121.011,"end":12145.134,"text":"西東捷運要施工了,誰反對?沒有人反對過啊。欸,西東捷運這一段是基隆捷運的一段。我再講一次,張樹灣到汐止驅工所是哪一段?現在花包了,現在你再回頭講,這個只能二年前要講什麼。所以我要講的是南港展覽館到張樹灣站。這段跟西東捷運完全沒有任何關係啊。我問你喔。"},{"start":12146.567,"end":12173.138,"text":"如果你現在回來就是那表示我的基隆捷運從張樹灣到南港產專要不要做?如果不做我建議再討論那你要去翻案啊那你要跟雙北來談可以啊如果你要這樣的話就是當然可以啊然後如果這樣的話要從可行性開始做延伸這個意思臺北市政府要重新開始做延伸這個要走很多年"},{"start":12174.955,"end":12203.305,"text":"效果差不多阿所以委員你如果堅持你這個想法為了矽脂區的想法矽脂的民意代表當然為矽脂區的民眾講話阿沒錯阿那如果你這樣的方式那就從頭開始從可信心開始嘛那你我就講過你要跟地方政府在推動這個捷運建設的好好去想可以阿誰反對誰就來自己面對矽脂的民眾阿"},{"start":12207.186,"end":12232.917,"text":"委員他們已經決定蓋囉!他們已經決定蓋囉!而且可以蓋下去囉!那你叫他不要蓋嗎?現在設計準備要施工了。那是西東捷運,你一直把西東捷運跟阪南縣延伸兩個混在一起。您知道那個基隆捷運合併中華公園合併環並過你知道嗎?你知道接下來是什麼嗎?就是設計施工。"},{"start":12233.297,"end":12238.741,"text":"我的訴求很簡單整條基隆捷運我不想去影響到基隆市民的權益沒有爭議的路段我們沒有要擋他從張樹灣到基隆這一段"},{"start":12264.044,"end":12290.127,"text":"我們已經合定了,我們就全力的來施作,因為他也可以跟現有的系統線來做整合,就是剛剛兩位一直在提的共購共軌段這邊,完全沒有任何的爭議,完全沒有任何的爭議,我當然也希望全力的來推動。那現在要提的就是南港展覽館,就是南港站到張書翰的部分,重啟板南線延伸的一個評估。"},{"start":12292.091,"end":12312.904,"text":"委員你上次已經有結議了,我們也請台北市去做評估,但是做了以後這一段的基隆結議就不做了,那你這個重新啟動是現在開始,現在開始是什麼意思﹖可行性﹖現在是百年大計,我們不能因為球快,然後設計了一個方案,然後被我們的後代罵死。"},{"start":12313.971,"end":12336.064,"text":"每個方案這樣子做下去了,我們現在的民意代表沒有辦法面對以後矽脂的後代啊。那你現在如果要這樣做,那就就啟動啊。重來了,這樣重來了。你就啟動啊。所以台北就是重來了。你啟動以後你想的。我不是說要或不要,我只是要我們的行政院是不是能夠保持一個開放的態度。"},{"start":12337.906,"end":12365.627,"text":"去針對爭議的路段去重新做一個詳細的報告沒有你現在如果要啟動張樹灣到南港的板南線延伸這個事情就是就影響基隆捷運那影響基隆捷運的時候你就要讓地方政府要來做我說這沒問題我說這沒問題我們會去討論我們會去說服不是市政府講的那好啦我去跟地方政府講的時候地方政府說那你要先去跟行政院講啊每個人都推給別人"},{"start":12367.569,"end":12385.91,"text":"對不對?就是每一個單位每一個行政單位要有自己的態度嘛對不對?那我現在是立法委員我當然是問中央的態度啊地方政府會這樣講就是 甩鍋給中央政府的意思啦我當初在當議員的時候在董事群的時候問當初的 那時候劉河蘭是代理市長"},{"start":12386.451,"end":12401.038,"text":"他也是跟我說持開放態度啊我只要確認各單位都是持各方態度都是持開放的態度那我們就有進步的策劃吧交通部把案子給市政府了市政府到現在都沒有表達意見啊那所以你要去問市政府的意見啊"},{"start":12402.219,"end":12408.107,"text":"市政府表達意見以後再說嗎?市政府表達意見以後再說嗎?我們是這個案子要核定很不容易,因為核定要給經費了,現在你要重來開始"},{"start":12418.519,"end":12444.811,"text":"這是這是重新的就是再回到部分正義的路段從來相關的政治責任我敢提我當然敢擔啊不是不是你你的政策你要問說地方政府同不同意啊如果三個市政府都同意我我只問汐止的居民同不同意哦那不行那汐止居民同意那當然基隆同不同意基隆這邊清北市政府這邊我們來做溝通嘛對不對基隆是這樣他從八讀一票"},{"start":12445.441,"end":12451.509,"text":"就是一車到南港站現在你就是到你這個路線到時候變成一個Y字型的路廊"},{"start":12453.563,"end":12456.565,"text":"自己學交通也知道外資型的路廊在運輸效率上面多差"},{"start":12483.864,"end":12486.829,"text":"我們持開放態度嘛那沒關係地方政府要來溝通我來溝通嘛"},{"start":12487.902,"end":12513.352,"text":"你就是,他們如果要做可行性就重新來,我是覺得看他好,那不能因為這個東西來去卡張書安到基隆的部分嘛,對不對?張書安到基隆的部分沒有爭議的部分,就繼續吧。欸那個,基隆今天也改了,張書安轉變成要轉應站,我要重新站,都動到了,都動到了。我們的評估報告裡面就是用不會動到的方案去評估嘛,部長你自己連評估報告都沒有看過,然後現在來跟我講這些"},{"start":12515.589,"end":12515.909,"text":"好沒關係下一個議題"},{"start":12545.165,"end":12568.963,"text":"院長,這個我想跟你確認一下,我們的旁邊的王國才部長有沒有被調報過?確認本人嗎?去年的王國才是今年的王國才嗎?有一部漫畫叫獵人,裡面有一個角色叫熊狸狐,他變成人的形狀,然後模仿人的樣子,然後講話的樣子都一樣"},{"start":12570.148,"end":12572.45,"text":"現在也是這樣那可不可以部長再重複一遍"},{"start":12601.243,"end":12624.754,"text":"可以再重複講一遍嗎?還是我播一次你再講一遍?我交通部現在以行人路權優先,包括我們的四年四百億的計畫,包括各個條例的修正,現在都朝這方面在進行。好,這個反正就是在任部長那天以行人路權的改革跟交通安全當作最重要的一件事情。這是最重要的一個施政政策,沒錯。"},{"start":12625.794,"end":12652.641,"text":"那你說你會跟這個入權團體並肩作戰好希望他們當你最強的後盾但現在入權團體你也知道我現在要講什麼嗎?違罪不舉發不祭典這件事情您認為符合您說行人入權的改革跟交通安全是您當作最重要的一件事情這句話嗎?我跟你們報告現在我的確是我在這個道安跟民宴中間要起一個平衡點"},{"start":12653.533,"end":12682.23,"text":"市長你們細節也知道路邊停車都困難路邊停車都困難所以他不得不違規停車這件事情是很多聲音都給我了所以我們現在權宜的調整但是我們相關的行人設施包括穿越道包括人行道都繼續在建設所以我是說這個是目前的一個權宜的修法不代表我們行人的建設就是包括我們行政院送來立法院的版本包括"},{"start":12684.063,"end":12688.149,"text":"道路沒有改善以前就有可能啊"},{"start":12699.135,"end":12723.292,"text":"所以我們送來的法案所以挺能行到這件事情在院長的眼裡看起來是稀鬆平常的事情是不是?所以我們會送兩個法案做兩條法案的理由一個是道路設施的條例交通道設施的條例一個就是相關的這個祭典的條例這兩個任何人在執政的時候都一定要考慮到"},{"start":12724.753,"end":12724.913,"text":"只是不記點。"},{"start":12742.613,"end":12746.738,"text":"你要搞清楚就是說這是造法不計點。而且評調的結果72%的人贊成這樣的講法。贊成我們現在的做法。"},{"start":12757.089,"end":12777.715,"text":"事實上你打電話那個地方的偷掉車就偷走了你知道嗎?現在只是說民眾檢舉這個患難我們是希望說在違罪裡面讓這個民眾檢舉這個降低一點再到可是並不是不滑喔你看他你車連行到你打警察指把指把強度降低就是變相鼓勵沒有強度沒有強度降低啊"},{"start":12778.175,"end":12797.721,"text":"沒有降低?還包括去年交通部給警政署的這個可以勸導的原則還包括我們現在停在人行道民眾檢舉都沒辦法檢舉了。不能檢舉不代表不划你可以打給那個警察局或是你們那個看專線是多少1999還知道來就馬上拖掉了是"},{"start":12799.449,"end":12799.93,"text":"我要再拜託部長"},{"start":12814.517,"end":12835.166,"text":"可不可以一起跟我一起摸著良心,把您上次說過的話再說一次。我不用說話,我剛才已經說過了。可不可以在這邊再宣誓一次,院長願不願意再把當天跟大眾承諾的話再宣誓一次。沒關係宣誓更容易,院長願不願意宣誓上次在入權團體活動舉辦講的話。"},{"start":12841.289,"end":12845.971,"text":"謝謝廖委員先詳的質詢。也謝謝陳院長的備詢。辦委員會上午的質詢到此為止。下午2點30分繼續進行交通組織質詢。現在休息。謝謝。"},{"start":21611.567,"end":21613.131,"text":"報告約會現在繼續開會進行交通組織質詢我們請吳委員齊鳴質詢"},{"start":21650.01,"end":21655.396,"text":"主席請我們行政院長陳院長麻煩請陳院長備詢委員好首先恭喜院長我們台灣的股市已經來到兩萬多點這證明我們院長所帶領的行政團隊是穩健向前"},{"start":21672.932,"end":21688.318,"text":"然後我們高科技產業向台積電的亮眼帶動我們整個經濟的發展我們台灣半導體的AI產業未來是指日可待那近期台積電也確定在嘉義設廠未來配合屏東、高雄、台南"},{"start":21688.818,"end":21716.945,"text":"的科技園區成為南部的AI廊道已經逐漸的成形。那本市在選舉期間也特別提過我們土城三峽未來要發展AI產業廊道。而我們土城三峽這個過程也受到我們當初的賴清德總統他的認同。那土城三峽這幾年在本市以我中央的努力下我們的交通基礎建設發展得非常快速。"},{"start":21717.665,"end":21744.912,"text":"像除了便利的捷運,我們有山陰線、阪南線、萬大線還有土城交流道以及我們院長動工的京城交流道現在都開始在施作。未來我們更有六五的延伸快速道路加上土城工業區的基礎以及我們科技產業也在土城發展。土城山峽有相當多的土地的空間可以來做推動。"},{"start":21745.452,"end":21775.282,"text":"議員﹚"},{"start":21775.342,"end":21775.782,"text":"好,非常感謝,感謝議員"},{"start":21802.002,"end":21810.159,"text":"委員長,土層這個地方我們有一個施法延期有84公頃目前正在動工當中屬於"},{"start":21812.128,"end":21812.288,"text":"國有土地"},{"start":21836.664,"end":21839.425,"text":"我想要形成一個生態共榮生活圈"},{"start":21860.451,"end":21886.327,"text":"這讓它變成一個都市發展的典範我想這也是一個很好的構想那使得整個的產業有一個很好的聚落我想這也是一個很有遠見的看法對,因為我們一些高科技廠商他們都知道只要是土地的取得有困難那要是我們這個國有地我們去把它推動讓高科技產業進駐土城跟三峽這個地方然後造就我們這邊的"},{"start":21887.995,"end":21909.411,"text":"議員﹚"},{"start":21909.804,"end":21930.538,"text":"議員﹚"},{"start":21930.818,"end":21948.878,"text":"整個溝通協調的工作還不夠落實因為疫情期間大家都停板那是不是本席現在又是內政的召委我本席要來提案來延長兩年那看院長你的看法如何"},{"start":21949.261,"end":21964.819,"text":"好,按照法律上來講的話,我們是應該在114年的10月30號就要公告國土功能的分區作為目標。現在還沒修法前,當然我們要這樣做。但是就像委員所講的,因為碰到了疫情,我們都沒什麼辦法。"},{"start":21966.06,"end":21984.951,"text":"結果目前能夠提到內政部的就只有三個縣市就是連江縣、金門縣跟花蓮縣那其他的縣市理論上講起來應該在6月底以前陸續提出但是民眾也有很多的陳情案所以委員如果提出了這樣的一個"},{"start":21986.383,"end":21987.184,"text":"您的建議我們原則尊重"},{"start":22005.165,"end":22025.436,"text":"好感謝感謝我們院長的承諾因為這才不會造成民怨因為我們一個好的政策我們還是要跟地方大家做溝通才來推動這大家有個反衝擊謝謝院長然後再來我就好院長不然你先回座好了我要請我們交通部長"},{"start":22030.283,"end":22052.115,"text":"委員好部長部長剛才我跟院長報告就是我們六五的延伸在這邊我要特別的感謝我們部長還有我們的公共工程會我們的無主委因為我到那邊開會開了五六次總算有有個定案那我也知道我們現在整個"},{"start":22053.475,"end":22078.348,"text":"上網可行性評估的作業已經在做了那4月份也要做結標的動作那65的未來性65的急迫性因為大家都知道65在部長你上個會期會引落土城三峽為優先路段那整個現在整個推動的情形請部長來做說明"},{"start":22080.106,"end":22108.79,"text":"是,各位報告,這個計畫很謝謝委員的提案。那我們在行政院的桃州苗大溪谷計畫,把它列入一個重要的交通骨幹。就是從板橋尾端一直會到龍潭,整個會把它做一個延伸。那目前這一個在應該是1、5年底會完成評估,然後後續因為它已經拉入這個大溪谷計畫,基本上就是桃州方面來推動。就剛才談到"},{"start":22109.551,"end":22109.571,"text":"﹚廣告"},{"start":22124.015,"end":22124.675,"text":"部長,因為你看其實國道3號會塞車"},{"start":22139.315,"end":22166.822,"text":"都是因為短程的車流量像我跟吳主委他都對新北市對以前在臺北縣他有幹過幾張當過副市長他非常清楚因為都是短程的車輛尤其現在三峽臺北大學城的人口成長速度多快兩年前4萬多人現在已經6萬多人那整個車流量都一定都爆增那再加上"},{"start":22167.882,"end":22180.427,"text":"三峽臺北大學城新北市又規劃麥子岩重劃區還有我們的大干岩的重劃區那未來整個人口的暴增那現在樹林交流道"},{"start":22182.17,"end":22209.224,"text":"有空你到那邊看一下上下班絕對大賽車所以你這65是一個非常非常急迫性所以部長不管有什麼困難一定要去排除我們這個速度絕對都不能延宕是他的確有跟委員兩個功能現在就是三峽英哥這個交流道和樹林交流道甚至到這個土城的交流道都會賽所以這個除了這個科技狼帶的這個"},{"start":22211.107,"end":22240.644,"text":"北部跟這個桃園跟新北這個串聯以外另外一個就是國道3號的替代道路這一次我知道委員當時就是以這樣的這個想法來這個提出的他身兼這兩個功能那當然從通警的功能來講在這個這個三峽英歌道土城這一段是過去的瓶頸剛才委員提到那但是我跟委員因為我們現在其可行性是一直到龍潭那當然可以的話都同時完工"},{"start":22241.571,"end":22268.809,"text":"如果真的有什麼是不是要以這個三峽、英哥、土城這個優先我們就在這個可信評估裡面再做一個分析因為我看我們土城、三峽這邊優先路段先去規劃不然你說到桃園、大溪這邊的經費又非常的龐大那供給絕對會延宕那我們是先考慮不然你也可以解決我們英哥這邊的車流量三峽的車流量還有樹林的車流量"},{"start":22269.83,"end":22271.631,"text":"這是一個非常急迫性"},{"start":22288.191,"end":22305.193,"text":"我再來就是我們土城萬大協議縣萬大協議縣在107年我跟吳秉瑞、蘇巧慧我們三位到當初的行政院長爭取了萬大縣555億但是現在大家都知道在這幾年飆也飆不出去"},{"start":22306.574,"end":22318.924,"text":"切工、切料還有整個費用一定要提升那現在我們整個費用已經要調整到770億那部長那現在這個金額有沒有到位"},{"start":22319.594,"end":22344.809,"text":"是,現在是這樣,因為除了萬大綜合的這個第二期以外,比如說臺北市,還有包括高雄市、台中,他們的經費都有增加。那目前大概在跟我們這個財主大會做一個討論,就是說哪一些是純粹是延誤料上漲的,哪一些是地方政府他本身要負責的,比如說當時沒有規劃好。"},{"start":22345.709,"end":22366.132,"text":"所以我們現在會有一個這樣通盤的這個修改計畫的原則出來那我們現在這個原則大致有了所以我們現在這個也請他們按照這個原則去分析比較220億裡面哪一些是純粹這個因為物價上漲所導致的那目前正在進行中"},{"start":22367.298,"end":22384.55,"text":"因為這一定要快,你的整個財務計畫的修正,因為你現在已經樹林那邊已經開始在施作,那你土層這邊來停擺,那你中間卡在這邊,那這是一個非常嚴重的急迫性。是,我們會趕快來對這個修正經費趕快來做一個審查,趕快來處理。"},{"start":22391.482,"end":22404.398,"text":"好,這一定要趕快,因為現在已經飆出去了嘛,12月1號已經飆出去了嘛。然後你整個經費的方面還是要加快啊。然後再來"},{"start":22407.182,"end":22432.135,"text":"就是我們三峽三峽當初在我們交通部觀光局列入一個經典的城市那我們都知道三峽這邊我們的整個三峽河的整治也都完成了然後長湖橋的改建現在也發報在做了但是整個老街整個這個地方的範圍裡面就沒有一個停車場"},{"start":22433.075,"end":22460.649,"text":"那還好我在國安署在那個我們三峽國光街那邊還提拨了做一個平面的停車場但是還不符使用因為我們在長湖橋的旁邊一定要建造一個停車場立體停車場那我上會期也要求我們部長部長你會引路只要新北市願意把整個計畫排列在前面"},{"start":22461.79,"end":22482.957,"text":"我們交通部這邊原則上我們的前瞻雖然還有剩餘的部分你會全力來補助那現在我新北市已經溝通好了新北市跟我們的議員跟新北市溝通將整個排列在前面那未來這個停車場是不是如我們上個會期部長你所引落的我們來推動"},{"start":22483.976,"end":22502.305,"text":"是,我們現在在等4月份會做一個總檢討,的確過去260億裡面在一開始新北市政府並沒有把這個放在優先,現在它直接放在優先,但是因為我們錢用完,現在剩剩餘款,剩餘款就是有的花報不出去的限制放棄的。"},{"start":22503.513,"end":22518.183,"text":"那這部分就是到4月底5月初會有一個總的檢討那我也知道新北已經跟委員一樣把它放在前面所以我們就看我們捷運款的狀況來支持那萬一捷運款沒有了怎麼辦"},{"start":22520.269,"end":22541.791,"text":"這個看有沒有下一期阿,這個我們可能內部再討論看有沒有,比如說部長這不能說有下一期阿,我新北市答應人家你排列在前面,我們部長引諾了,總不能跳票阿不是,現在這樣,因為我們現在第一期是200億嘛,第二期60億嘛,那現在有260億在這個去年都分配完了,全部分配完了"},{"start":22542.375,"end":22564.581,"text":"所以我上次答應這個委員是說我們剩一款有的時候把你放在優先嘛那現在這個原則不變但是我要確定4月底會出有沒有結一款現在是這樣4月底就可以出到了嗎4月底會出對大概我們已經請各地方比如說發報部出去的趕快計畫退回等等的現在還不知道金會剩多少"},{"start":22574.589,"end":22583.194,"text":"謝謝吳委員親密。謝謝我們交通部的備詢。接下來我們請登記第12號吳委員配議質詢。謝謝主席。我請行政院院長。再請行政院陳院長備詢。"},{"start":22604.833,"end":22627.62,"text":"委員長好 院長我們是民意代表所以說實際上我們社區倘若有旅遊我們都會在早晨的時候到遊覽車出發之前來上車來跟民眾來打招呼問候那所以說我們看到高雄發生這一起遊覽車的事故的事件造成了一死15傷其實真的是感到相當的憂心"},{"start":22628.2,"end":22644.25,"text":"而且我們知道說其實在這個點煉花的事故之後2017年其實我們交通部已經針對我們的遊覽車客運業整體的管理安全有做出了一些改革的措施所以我想要先請問有關於這個事故發生之後因為報載媒體報導說2022年我們交通部的裁罰的件數針對超時駕駛就是我們現在看到在實務上最嚴重的問題"},{"start":22656.797,"end":22669.848,"text":"針對超時駕駛,我們2022年裁罰件數一年只罰了5件,有這麼少嗎?是,官委報告,疊弄案事件以後我們做一個很重要的事情,全國的遊覽車全部都監控。"},{"start":22672.253,"end":22692.439,"text":"所以他們就裝了GPS然後在我們這個樹林有一個中心所以我們可以看他路線還有包括駕駛他開車移動的時間那我們現在是這樣就是從我們的軌跡圖裡面去如果看到這個可能的這個超時如果你談是超時的部分就會去查核查核確實就會這個來採訪"},{"start":22696.363,"end":22698.164,"text":"議員2022年比較少,我看會不會和疫情有關係,也可能有啦。"},{"start":22720.577,"end":22734.304,"text":"我們交通部有裁罰,我們勞動部也有進行勞檢,有針對超時駕駛。我希望我們的聯合稽查也好,我們的裁罰也好,都是希望能夠預防意外。"},{"start":22735.004,"end":22739.025,"text":"委員的這個建議很好謝謝你關心這個所有的安全接下來我也要部長先請回我同時要請速發部"},{"start":22770.197,"end":22783.555,"text":"院長這是在2019年的時候我們國防部的國防安全研究院有一篇的研究來對我們提出一個警示也就是說我們必須要來去預防中國有可能來破壞臺灣的海底電纜"},{"start":22785.678,"end":22801.717,"text":"然後他延續有可能會造成的問題就是我們的通訊我們被斷網我們有可能會被切斷與對外的聯繫那事實上這也不是一個未來式2023年去年光是2月在一週以內就發生了兩次就是我們的臺馬電纜"},{"start":22804.363,"end":22828.379,"text":"關掉一次是因為中國的漁船把他拖斷第二次是貨船來源不明但是一樣造成我們電纜的破損在這個事件之後我們的國防研究院週報提出了三點的結論第一個是中國有可能持續運用類似的手段來破壞我國的網路韌性"},{"start":22829.139,"end":22848.198,"text":"第二點,我們必須要去建立備援機制來強化我們通訊的網路韌性。第三點,臺灣我們必須要接近烏克蘭來發展低軌衛星。所以我今天想要請問院長,我們臺灣對於預防中國來破壞我們的海底纜線,我們有沒有在做因應的對策?"},{"start":22849.298,"end":22877.116,"text":"對於海底纜線的這一個部分我們確實是有在進行怎麼樣加強它的韌性包括搶修的時間要快然後要有備援的這一個基礎那在這裡我們也會設置相關的保護所等等這是有關於這一個海纜的部分那中華電信也請海委會來加強這一個第一海纜的這一個巡迴的這一個保護那這個部分我們"},{"start":22880.704,"end":22903.517,"text":"所謂的這個備援通訊其中一部分重要的是低軌衛星那我看了我們行政院有提出太空三期計劃那甚至蔡英文總統去年還說三期計劃必須要加碼我們要加碼來投入400億來投入我們低軌衛星的研製甚至我們台灣要破壞我們自己的國家發射場"},{"start":22904.557,"end":22932.456,"text":"我們這幾年也完成了立法成立了國家太空中心所以我想請問院長針對太空三期計畫的加碼我們目前規劃完成了嗎?對,我們在這一個部分呢我們會積極來進行那這一個部分數位部比較有關係請數位部先來說明謝謝委員確實如同委員所說的就是我想非同步衛星包含已經在運作的中軌道衛星這個我們包含在馬祖以及"},{"start":22932.756,"end":22950.401,"text":"﹚"},{"start":22952.102,"end":22974.961,"text":"我們除了在努力要自治之外,我們也要進行跟國際的合作,對不對?目前我們數位部有沒有已經跟哪些國家來進行洽談了?我想除了剛剛講到的SES是盧森堡跟法國的之外,我自己去年也有到英國。那因為OneWeb這家公司比較特別,英國的政府對它是有所謂黃金股,就是有控制權的。"},{"start":22975.661,"end":23003.082,"text":"所以在我跟英國討論之後他們也很願意盡快的在供應鏈上面或者是在他自然的水準上面跟我們一起來測試沒有錯因為我們不能把雞蛋放在同一個籃子裡所以我們要去除這個風險就是你們講的我們必須要多元並且一直的這個網路通訊所以我們現在除了自製在努力當中這個700個接收站我們預計什麼時候可以完成對我們年底就可以完成那目前要分布在哪裡目前國科會在"},{"start":23003.422,"end":23017.69,"text":"在年底我們就會完成起來的接收站。其中因為最近我們立法院的委員非常的關心太平島的安全。但我想安全不是去用看的就有安全了。我們有沒有預計要在太平島來連接我們的通訊衛星?"},{"start":23018.53,"end":23038.522,"text":"有,剛才我有提到說我們中軌衛星已經在測試那至於說提供給就是太平島上面的五個國人來使用目前以我所知是大概4月的時候他們會來做調度頻寬一旦調度好就可以提供使用院長,我們看到美國跨黨派的議員才在上一週就提出一個法案要求美國太空總署也就是NASA"},{"start":23038.882,"end":23038.902,"text":"好。"},{"start":23055.778,"end":23069.814,"text":"那我也要提醒速發部我認為低軌衛星的發展不只對台灣現在這全球在冷戰之後新一波的太空進逐台灣我們沒有落後我們正在努力投入當中但是我認為速發部的這些說明其實不夠"},{"start":23070.555,"end":23070.895,"text":"謝謝委員接下來請交通部"},{"start":23097.11,"end":23121.009,"text":"院長同樣是在去年您有到萬華東元國小我們跟加納站的共購來視察萬大縣一起的工程當時我也在場那當時我們台北市市長蔣文安有特別來拜託院長就是因為我們都知道公共工程這幾年公共工程的經費上漲所以原定我們是751的預算那台北市我們政府計算了一下發現需要增加100億那當時蔣文安市長就提出來了"},{"start":23123.951,"end":23123.991,"text":"總體而言"},{"start":23138.968,"end":23162.494,"text":"希望我們中央能夠再增加補助427億的預算來協助我們興建台北市的軌道建設那雖然我跟我們市長是不同的黨派但是我是台北市的立法委員我必須要為我們台北市民來請命所以這個部分我是希望我們中央能不能夠持續的來支持台北市繼續來完成我們的軌道建設"},{"start":23163.314,"end":23192.337,"text":"我們會跟地方政府再來檢討,如果是屬於不可抗力的因素所造成的話,我們一定會請相關的部門來全力支持。我請部長簡單的說一下。因為不可抗力就是說物價啦,這個原物料的營業物價上漲這部分是不可抗力。那其他比如說他當時設計自己疏忽掉的,這個就要請他們來處理。目前用這個原則在...那個計畫送進來了沒有?"},{"start":23192.857,"end":23218.509,"text":"他送進來我們請他再做一些比較細的解釋我們還在審核這部分我們就朝向要支持公共工程的部分來支持好不好那因為我看這個民間很多坊間在說好像我們中央只是補助南部不補助北部該做的事情我們就要做我也去看了一下我們台北市過去中央支持我們台北市軌道建設的預算"},{"start":23219.79,"end":23247.291,"text":"加總起來從我們初期的捷運網絡到後面的環鑽、新義松山線等等總共我們中央是補助了6,775億這個是基礎的公共建設所以公共建設我們是不分黨派、不分藍綠、不分南北只要有這個需求就希望中央可以持續的來支持謝謝委員幫我們做了很好的統計講到臺北市的軌道建設很重要的一個地方、地標就是我們的臺北車站"},{"start":23249.172,"end":23277.678,"text":"臺北車站是我們首都的入口甚至是我們臺灣國家的門戶那在臺北車站的周遭呢我們臺北市正在進行的是西區門戶計畫其中呢我們中央我們交通部轄下的臺鐵跟中華的郵政也在我們西區門戶計畫裡面是一個重要的角色那我在關注的是雙子星雙子星在2019年的時候一度呢臺北市政府是想要交給南海控股"},{"start":23278.098,"end":23305.99,"text":"但是雙子星畢竟為在我們國門要地牽涉到了六鐵共構所以當時有送到我們投審會來審查嘛。審審會最後是否決了這個南海控股那當時呢包括我們台北市的前市長柯文哲還有現在桃園市的市長張善政都提出抱怨啊認為說中央是在卡案但是我要說的是好險投審會有如實的審查"},{"start":23307.083,"end":23327.839,"text":"為什麼當時投審會沒有給南海控股通過呢?院長我想最主要是因為他是這個中國控股的公司嘛他是中資嘛去年的時候呢南海控股被中國國營企業來沒收所以我說海水退了才知道誰沒有穿褲子還好投審會當年有如實依法來審查否則現在在我們的國門要塞我們雙子星"},{"start":23334.304,"end":23361.2,"text":"就會是中國的國企來進行開發這後果是不堪設想我們是六鐵共共下面也有我們高鐵也有我們台鐵所以在這邊我也是要提醒我們行政院我知道在推動政策的時候時常要遇到帶風向時常要遇到政治的攻擊但是我要拜託你們我們所有都是人在公門你們不是為哪一個政黨服務也不是為民進黨在捍衛是對的事情我們理直就要氣壯"},{"start":23362.321,"end":23377.821,"text":"因為這個是法律要求我們的法定責任該做的事情我們就要認真去做我們就堅持去做不想把它說明清楚院長我們可不可以努力來做到我同意而且謝謝你們你的鼓勵我們行政團隊一定會按照這樣的精神來做"},{"start":23379.042,"end":23407.255,"text":"院長那最後呢我是要拜託你因為我知道你也是我們臺北市中正區的居民嘛我相信你跟我一樣是期待我們臺北車站應該要是一個能夠去符合國際的標準跟國際的品質世界級的車站臺北車站呢臺北車站是我們台鐵寄出人數最多的一站也是世界評比裡面人潮前25大的車站但是呢我真的時常的在我們車站裡面看到很多的國際旅客"},{"start":23408.476,"end":23427.353,"text":"站在我們的地圖站在我們的指標前面停留非常久的時間現在我們很多來自於日本來自於韓國的旅客他們討論了很久臺北車站因為標示的不清楚儼然已經是一座迷宮了你們到YT的網站上面去搜尋影片"},{"start":23427.893,"end":23455.187,"text":"很多的這個外國的網紅YouTuber都在拍攝說在臺北車站裡面實在太容易去迷路了那我要講的是他其實的根本的問題是在於在臺北車站裡面我們有台鐵體系我們有高鐵體系我們有北捷體系歸臺北市政府管的我們現在還有基捷桃園市政府管在這個裡面有太多跨系統的單位光是我們的這個路標啊標示的指引"},{"start":23456.067,"end":23471.622,"text":"同樣一個中文的詞就有很多不同英文呈現的方式同樣一個地圖我們有不同方位的視角對於旅客來說這真的是是儼然是一座迷宮所以這雖然是一件小事但是也是一件大事"},{"start":23472.102,"end":23497.635,"text":"因為我覺得這牽涉到的就是我們中央跟地方如何去找到一個合作的機制。就我所知臺北車站目前我們臺鐵跟高鐵以及其他的單位就防災我們有一個跨單位的協作平台我是能夠拜託院長拜託部長我們重新來盤整臺北車站不只是站體裡面的也包括站體周遭的行人安全"},{"start":23498.015,"end":23498.716,"text":"謝謝吳委員配意的質詢,謝謝陳院長的備詢。接下來"},{"start":23524.417,"end":23528.18,"text":"我們請登記第13號,由號委員質詢。謝謝院長,有請行政院長。再請陳院長備詢。"},{"start":23554.62,"end":23579.122,"text":"院長午安本席想要就教一下院長就是說在目前我們看到許多的新聞都是民生的新聞那民生同樣的也影響到交通各種的成本那在去年的時候那記得年度的代表字你還記得是什麼字嗎我不太記得沒關係去年的話是缺"},{"start":23579.946,"end":23581.127,"text":"不一定啦。"},{"start":23603.888,"end":23625.863,"text":"因為我們在電價調漲的過程當中我一再強調的是我們以很細緻的方式來調漲我舉一個例子來看像民生用電在這個700度以下的那就是有將近1300萬戶的人只漲5%那5%的意思是什麼呢就是平均一天是七毛錢然後一個月是漲"},{"start":23626.343,"end":23628.464,"text":"所以就叫院長所以你認為這個漲的部分的話其他的名聲的相關的都不會再漲?所以說就不會調了嗎?"},{"start":23656.298,"end":23664.361,"text":"還是會調吧?什麼東西?電價還是會調上嗎?我直接跟您問其實這個電價的調漲啊它帶動許多民生的一些物價的上漲這是一定的這是大家可以預期的"},{"start":23674.745,"end":23690.019,"text":"所以說今年的話從一開始的話店家開始調漲之後我們可以預期今年的話大致上就是炒算一個漲字啦但是這個漲字來講的話不管結果怎麼樣大家要去迎迎要去面對所以就算今年的代表制是漲但是大家還是要嚴正以下來去面對你認不認同"},{"start":23691.767,"end":23714.565,"text":"我想我個人不認為漲勢一定會啦因為按照這個中央銀行的這個估計我們今年的CPI的成長的情況會比去年的2.49要來的低很多啦所以個人的見解不一樣我尊重委員的見解但是會不會漲直接告訴院長好了就是說"},{"start":23715.345,"end":23731.072,"text":"那個帶動的漲其實就是不斷的那西門町有一家水煎包店你看一個水煎包目前來講你預計在西門町帶一個水煎包大概多少錢我很少到西門町去但是我了解有人吃水煎包是28塊錢也有人吃12塊錢的"},{"start":23732.433,"end":23733.914,"text":"市長可以來幫您說明一下市場機制那是不是要調漲?"},{"start":23760.413,"end":23789.065,"text":"目前是高鐵啦,高鐵他提到要漲那高鐵的便當現在一個多少以及預計要調到多少他好像增加10塊錢所以現在一個多少110塊的便當所以說其實我坦白說以民生來講這個整個都會連著一起帶動那我接著就叫好就是說像目前來講這整個帶動的調漲的話未來在所謂的台鐵的票價也會調漲是吧"},{"start":23790.643,"end":23816.868,"text":"台鐵是這樣子委員你可能比我還清楚台鐵29年沒有調這個票價最主要的原因他也是有他的政策的任務而且要讓大家能夠有很好的通勤的便捷性但是台鐵我們剛才講過已經變成一個民營化的一個公司那我們會尊重這個民營化公司自己對於票價的調整當然他票價要調整的時候還要報到這個"},{"start":23820.669,"end":23840.756,"text":"這個匯率委員會來審議那我們也會來看看他是否有必要性但是呢為了要讓這一個大家通學通勤能夠得到很好的保障中央政府這邊一定會繼續在推動TPAS那這個TPAS的1200塊是不會漲的所以在大家在做通學通勤所需要的這一個大眾運輸費用不會漲"},{"start":23843.305,"end":23869.392,"text":"因為TPS的部分他會進行一些補貼那我清楚那台鐵的部分因為我跟院長說啊這個漲會不會成為今年的年度關鍵字啊其實取決也是在於行政院那如何能夠穩定物價穩定物價穩定的好那今年漲就不會是關鍵字代表字那如果穩定的不好那今年漲就是代表字沒有錯吧"},{"start":23869.912,"end":23872.093,"text":"所以說國家的角色,中央政府的角色他就扮演中央就是穩定物價。"},{"start":23894.304,"end":23907.068,"text":"院長我直接接著請教因為部長也在您的旁邊因為這個調漲的部分影響公共運輸的交通成本那在於公車以及計程車以及油價那這三類的話會不會調漲?"},{"start":23910.355,"end":23931.755,"text":"剛才已經講過公車的話,如果它是買TPAS的時候呢,那是不會調漲的吧?那這個油價的部分,到目前為止,我們並沒有調漲的這個,它有一個浮動的匯率,你也知道這個油價,我們有一直有在做相關的這樣的漲價,那計程車的部分目前?"},{"start":23935.979,"end":23939.92,"text":"所以我想大家都很清楚,當調整電費的時候,那燃油的這一些交通工具基本上沒有漲價的基礎。"},{"start":23955.146,"end":23973.485,"text":"那我這樣子講好了就是本席在這裡也希望院長跟部長因為在這個所謂的民生的這個物價上漲的時候公共因為今天是交通組的質詢那公共交通運輸的成本那希望就是行政院這邊跟交通部能夠確保該所提的這幾個"},{"start":23974.446,"end":23980.127,"text":"我在這裡也要呼籲就是說呼籲民眾盡可能的使用這個TPAS這樣的一個系統那這樣子的話在使用大眾運輸工具的時候呢就不會受到這個影響這我知道"},{"start":24003.768,"end":24015.173,"text":"但是我同樣的要問一下因為像目前來講穩定物價的小組是多久開始會?穩定物價小組是由我們行政院的副院長來召開相關的會議"},{"start":24019.134,"end":24045.809,"text":"所以說是一個月召開一次嗎?原本三個月改為一個月召開一次。我想問一下為什麼民眾對於這個穩定物價是沒有信心的原因是目前來講連他的會議紀錄在網路上面公布的還在去年12月就連新聞稿也還是停留在1月那如果像是這樣子的一個進度這樣子一個討論如何能夠讓民眾他們對於穩定物價是有信心的"},{"start":24046.669,"end":24068.416,"text":"這一個相關的新聞稿還有網頁的部分我可以去了解一下再跟委員做報告那接著就是在這個目前來講我記得院長你上任的時候曾經做了一個第一個的重大措施你覺得是什麼政策當時有一個紓困特別條例"},{"start":24069.349,"end":24092.22,"text":"你指的是這個嗎?是,我指的是那時候超收稅收,超徵稅收3800億嘛。對啊,那時候有進行的一個現金券的部分嘛。對,就是委員是這樣子。那我想問一下。那時候易厚特別條例,完了以後就易厚特別預算,那裡面就有這個普華現金6000億。易厚特別條例的這個部分我知道。"},{"start":24097.001,"end":24106.704,"text":"政府如果要普發現金的時候,就要看稅入稅出的盈餘有多少。在前前一年的時候,我們稅入稅出的盈餘高達到將近5000億。"},{"start":24109.765,"end":24135.802,"text":"我們在扣掉這個政府的應該要還的這個借債的這個部分我們還有3800億的剩餘所以我們有能力那今年呢稅率稅出盈餘大概在2800多那2800多再扣掉5%要來還債所以呢剩下來的部分大概只剩下1000到1500億左右那沒有能力因為我們花一次6000元的話就要有1440億的經費"},{"start":24138.564,"end":24163.859,"text":"我本席是建議啊,因為去年的時候發的時間點是敏感,因為去年的話是選舉年嘛,所以說跟選舉沒有關係,但是我坦白講,因為今天來講在疫情的話他這種景氣循環以及包括他這個陳述來講,他其實還是需要持續的來去做這些刺激市場的一個措施啊。"},{"start":24164.4,"end":24176.928,"text":"那所以說在今年你剛才講的目前需要花費的這個金額跟剛才超增之後扣掉來的金額其實是可以打平的情況之下那你們今年就不打算來去進行"},{"start":24178.293,"end":24204.866,"text":"我想我剛才已經講過因為今年的稅入稅出盈餘大概在2760億再扣掉1200億的這一個還債的情形剩下1500億我們最主要的目標就是來讓臺電能夠得到補貼要不的話電價就會像你講的一樣漲得更厲害那當然這個物價就更不能夠控制所以這個補貼這個臺電很重要第二個很重要的情形就是勞保我想您也很知道這個勞保現在的這個"},{"start":24206.907,"end":24230.882,"text":"也需要政府補貼的部分相當的大那如果這樣兩個合在一起可能1500億就已經用完了沒關係老保跟那個國庫撥補的事我趁午未完的時候會再跟您就教那我就接著問我們地方的建設那一樣是有請部長那其實今天來講我們不僅是代表著南投的鄉親還來進行這個質詢還反映我們的意見"},{"start":24235.858,"end":24250.548,"text":"在這個所謂的終結來南投的這個議題那我想請教一下院長在你上任到現在1年多將近2年的時間那你有到過南投會判或考察幾次?"},{"start":24257.333,"end":24276.467,"text":"總結的議題是這樣子,捷運在我們的分工上來說是由地方政府來提出相關的計畫,然後送到中央來審議,中央會按照他的非自償的部分再給補助,所以這個終結捷運的延伸到南投我想"},{"start":24277.708,"end":24305.84,"text":"台中市政府跟南農縣政府呢?今天在閻寬恆委員他也有提出終結的部分那所以在呼籲閻寬恆委員所提那目前來講我記得蔡英文她在8年前她其實就開出這個政見那在4年前她同樣在提那在上一次賴清德她來南投中興青春的時候她也再次提出這個問題那本席也知道說我們看這資料"},{"start":24307.22,"end":24329.889,"text":"過去許多蔡總統他提的部分沒有兌現的有很多那我就不一列舉那我直接就叫院長終結的部分有沒有辦法做一個宣示終結的部分我剛才講的很清楚捷運的發展是由地方政府提出來我們也很希望這個地方政府盡快的提出來他的這個構想"},{"start":24331.49,"end":24346.359,"text":"我剛才講過提出這個構想當然要跟南投縣來溝通跟委員來溝通一樣所以我們也很盼望如果覺得終結延伸到南投有必要請台中市政府趕快提出計畫我們會加速審查"},{"start":24347.779,"end":24373.941,"text":"那我相信計畫送過去也希望那個院長到時候是全力的支持終結到南投,可以嗎?如果計畫審查可行,這個委員我跟您報告一下,這個計畫來的時候首先呢就是地方政府做可行性評估,可行性評估以後才有參與。那所以說你就承諾說可以的話全力支持就好。那當然如果可行性評估過,好,當然就支持。"},{"start":24375.061,"end":24396.906,"text":"這個計畫地方政府扮演很重要的角色。舉個例子,像南線就是拖了幾段...我只要注定院長你願意全力支持終結到南投就可以,沒有問題。地方政府要提出計畫?地方政府一定提出啦,這一定提出啦。沒有啊,上次台中南線...我等要講事實,講事實。院長,那我覺得剩下一點時間,我要問您,"},{"start":24403.227,"end":24422.074,"text":"國道6號要打通南投花蓮,這案你支持不支持?這一個案子實際上我們有做過相關的評估,它的經費相當的可觀。但是這個是非參議。但是還沒有講完,這裡面還有兩個很重要的關鍵,第一個就是地質的穩定性,第二個就是生態環境的保護。"},{"start":24422.814,"end":24448.772,"text":"那在所以呢在做相關的評估以後我們才能夠去看說好可行了那未來要做這個環境影響評估完了要做投資效益所以剛才我要跟你講說一步一步來的對我知道但是這一個案子在技術上部長是可行的嘛那個現在我們在啟動一個地質地貿的調查在115會有結果那時候才知道說剛才院長所提的那些環境敏感地帶"},{"start":24449.372,"end":24472.401,"text":"但是是能夠技術上可行的話,院長也不會正向支持此案。這個是一個假設語氣啦。那如果假設的話。謝謝油化委員質詢,謝謝陳院長的備詢。接下來我們請登記第14號兵委員倩怡發言。"},{"start":24494.806,"end":24520.982,"text":"委員長好。有請陳院長。麻煩再請陳院長備詢。林委員委員長好。我們這一週已經算是第二次見面了,如果您有印象的話。那麼我覺得我們在這一週有兩次見面。我印象很深刻,你上次講划船的那個事情。是的。非常印象深刻。謝謝您還記得帆船這件事。所以你也知道本席在2月1號,"},{"start":24521.442,"end":24546.34,"text":"對﹖"},{"start":24546.4,"end":24562.811,"text":"好,那所以因為這樣的機緣我想跟院長分享一件事。那不知道院長有沒有聽過一條路叫做聖雅各之路?很多人說朝聖之路。好,那院長是不是要跟我們分享您所了解的聖雅各之路?"},{"start":24563.211,"end":24577.763,"text":"我沒有去過不過我很多朋友去讓我很心動不過我覺得這確實是一個很重要的發展觀光而且也是發展宗教還有修養人性心靈很好的一個路"},{"start":24579.161,"end":24591.748,"text":"謝謝院長那本席在過去幾年走過聖雅各之路那台灣其實有很多人現在也都在走這條路那越來越多的人往這個地方去朝聖那簡單來講就是在"},{"start":24595.269,"end":24614.567,"text":"1987年聖雅各支路已經被列為聯合國兩條很重要的這個所謂的宗教朝聖路線那當然這幾年不是只有宗教的人去走而是有很多帶著文化帶著性靈帶著這個宗教還有健身運動各項動機都有那甚至本期在這條路上也碰到了許多不同宗教的人"},{"start":24615.128,"end":24631.954,"text":"﹗"},{"start":24632.074,"end":24655.182,"text":"本席的一個禮物而且也是神給孩子未來的一個使命所以在這邊跟院長分享幾張有關於聖雅各路的這個圖片那院長可能可以在這裡面看到聖雅各路的一個標誌還有聖雅各路的我們到了終點的這個教堂那甚至本席還走到"},{"start":24656.783,"end":24658.724,"text":"本席在這邊跟這個院長的分享是如果我們看下一張這個"},{"start":24684.994,"end":24685.254,"text":"臨時提案委員"},{"start":24698.396,"end":24720.49,"text":"和古法有一些這個騎乘羅旅馬的這樣子的一個方式那還有本席會開始學帆船也是因為聖雅各路的啟發然後最終讓本席在這個路程上真的實際所碰到的是坐輪椅的人那真的很多人因此而完成了他們的夢想"},{"start":24721.544,"end":24743.575,"text":"﹚議員﹚"},{"start":24745.187,"end":24761.943,"text":"我領受到了在這條路上雖然很多辛苦但是我不敢害怕最後只剩下信心那在2017年因為我第一條路走成功了就走了900公里所以在那之後不僅心靈跟身體都受到了洗滌"},{"start":24763.664,"end":24763.804,"text":"神的啟示"},{"start":24779.881,"end":24807.688,"text":"是的,所以2018年呢那我真的感受到與神同行的恩賜那一年我覺得我得到了祝福的力量那2019年就是更特別了我在2019年底走到了聖地牙哥接下來2020年就疫情了那一趟路我真的覺得好特別就是不知道為什麼一直往前衝不知道到底是要衝向天堂還是後面有什麼東西在追那果真還好我沒有被疫情追到那我就已經回國了感謝"},{"start":24808.508,"end":24830.406,"text":"所以從2018年一直到2023年除了疫情那兩年我都在西班牙的某一個地方某兩個地方當志工一直到去年那我希望我今年也能夠去所以呢我其實很想跟院長交流一下有關於聖亞各路這樣一個概念"},{"start":24830.913,"end":24851.544,"text":"﹚臺灣﹚"},{"start":24851.704,"end":24864.716,"text":"您得來人何來人來之後其實有好多的傳教士不管是天主教或基督教在我們的偏鄉在我們的部落在山海很難去的地方他們為我們開拓了"},{"start":24867.173,"end":24886.13,"text":"一條公益之路,那所以我發現呢,不只一條,好多條啦,對,不僅是這樣齁,好多條,那本席列的是本席有走過的。好,所以本席就這樣子走走走,那在這個長步道上齁,還包括那個善國喜書記主教跟星雲大師之路,這是很特別的一條路。"},{"start":24886.97,"end":24905.333,"text":"本席就發現了一些其實是可以再成就讓這些路網能夠更好的一個方式比如說本席在2020年走了塔塔加到山海駿那我發現這個從玉山到鄭文溪的出海口的這條路那走到了這個茶山跟中埔的台山線"},{"start":24906.38,"end":24920.568,"text":"那不知道那個院長知不知道最近因為開放重機有很多重機也在山上走所以這個沒有動力的這樣子的一個概念呢其實對於行人跟腳踏車都有很大的困難所以呢本期時候這條路的發現"},{"start":24921.408,"end":24949.275,"text":"⋯⋯⋯"},{"start":24949.395,"end":24965.947,"text":"那所以一直到了這個走了善國喜主席主教的跟星雲大士這條路之後呢我就有很多感觸其實常常你沒有辦法從頭到尾徒步的很完整那這個是人的步道那接下來我們再來看看在2月16號"},{"start":24970.874,"end":24974.178,"text":"您要請交通部備詢嗎?請交通部備詢部長也來聽一下"},{"start":24986.314,"end":25015.594,"text":"那我就印下了那個交通部很有誠意的投入了很多錢要建制跟升級腳踏車步道那部長你們也很高興的在這個出發的地點那以前我們在行政單位每次要騎腳踏車都很高興從出發的地點大家都沒有什麼困難但是困難我們大概都碰不到只有真正在走的人會碰到所以本期也很希望有機會能夠聽聽這個次長祖密還有署長齊的心得那最重要的是這裡面有一句話說齊智行車不用太累"},{"start":25016.254,"end":25017.535,"text":"本席就很習慣在台灣走來走去跟騎來騎去,所以呢台灣真的其實很美麗嗎?"},{"start":25046.189,"end":25047.609,"text":"本席曾經在2022年去挑戰了100公里。"},{"start":25072.455,"end":25091.402,"text":"那當然還有200公里的那本席的那個100公里在那個兩座山之間就您可以看到這是在畫面上是本席那本席基本上都騎在車道不是自行車道您也可以看到自行車道的路幅我如果騎上去一定是被壓扁或者是基本上沒辦法騎"},{"start":25092.342,"end":25116.492,"text":"所以這些雖然我們現在建制自行車道然後有些單位在建設步道但事實上我們的長步道是連不起來的自行車道也沒有辦法環島的這是本席真正的經驗所以我們可以再來看看這個本席在今年的過年的時候又去檢視了一下日常公路跟我們的海岸線那我們可以看到這種腳踏車的路幅是可以通過的嗎"},{"start":25118.237,"end":25141.659,"text":"另外我們再看下一張,腳踏車還是騎在車子前面,因為那些陸服腳踏車也沒辦法騎,那人更沒辦法走。所以要完成我的聖雅各路福爾摩沙線我覺得是有蠻大的困難,我們可能要這個建制可能可以更人性化,然後更為這個弱勢者,我們所謂的弱勢就是"},{"start":25142.159,"end":25162.729,"text":"行人小於自行車自行車又小於許多的動力大小車所以呢那還有另外一個危險就是部落阿嬤的部落的安全吼那我們可以看到許多這個部落阿嬤的這個賓士車吼常常是跟那個很大的車在部落裡面這個跑得很快的車常常都是一起共行的"},{"start":25163.089,"end":25191.39,"text":"那非常的危險那尤其是在花蓮玉里高寮那邊的金針山那條小路有很多的阿嬤賓士車結果那個每一次大家要衝上金針山的時候都是非常快速的那有的時候或許這個交通部可以考慮一下許多部落其實是很值得人去走跟腳踏車去騎但是在裡面如何顧慮到部落的安全那而且部落裡面有一些很有趣的這個設計好像多良部落它裡面就有苦路14處"},{"start":25192.851,"end":25210.837,"text":"每一次我經過公路都看到好多車子停在那邊在看太平洋的美景。但是呢,如果他們能夠進入到部落看這苦路是四處部落所演展出來的這樣一個創意,我想大家會對台灣的風景有另外一種思考。"},{"start":25211.772,"end":25240.552,"text":"我同意所以是不是可以在這邊請命我們是不是可以重新檢討整個環島路線那我有幾個這個對不起還有這個徒步環島這個有個youtuber說了這個徒步環島屠殺的徒那真的自己要特別小心自己的安全那所以在台灣的用路對於人跟自行車是不太友善的所以呢這個台灣的道路是人的一場生存遊戲每次出門"},{"start":25243.215,"end":25266.67,"text":"我們現在努力的方向就是在做好這個腳踏車全省的全國的腳踏車道環島的腳踏車道還有行人道的這個改善那這個需要中央跟地方政府一起來努力做那我曉得有些地方政府很認真打拼我們會真的像委員所說的我們好好來檢視然後好好來改善"},{"start":25267.95,"end":25293.821,"text":"我這邊幾項建議我們是不是第一可以確認部落村落公路之人的人車共用或分道那這個部分還蠻專業的或許這個交通部可以找不同層次的人來做一個討論什麼叫做在自然界的人車分道那並計算動力車跟徒步的路幅雖然有的時候看起來有路有劃線但是事實上我們真的沒辦法走"},{"start":25294.662,"end":25321.327,"text":"第二個部分是建制聯通全島的長步道那長步道的定義就像我們走聖雅各路一樣所以我們能夠走得平安那基本上還是有一些設計上的這個網絡是需要思考的那另外建制長步道的支援系統就像我剛才講的那我們如果想要在這個求道的路上能夠真正感受到雨神交通的這個心靈層面那我們真的希望安全上可以讓我們少一點顧慮"},{"start":25322.347,"end":25345.453,"text":"另外建置部落內外道路安全的系統所以部落裡面尤其是東海岸還有這個中央山脈等山脈裡面的部落也請這個交通部這邊可以幫我們多了解然後多做一些討論然後再來建置然後最後規劃並建置大自然間的人車分道也就是人可以走什麼道然後車應該走什麼道"},{"start":25347.602,"end":25357.496,"text":"那這一點我相信應該如果做得到的話那臺灣就會成為一個更偉大的國家因為尊重弱勢就是一個偉大國家的展現"},{"start":25360.237,"end":25388.209,"text":"事實上您談的我們有兩個計畫,就是剛才談到的第一個是環島自行車的這個計畫,這從109已經開始做。然後就剛才談到的盡量讓它有獨立的這個自行車道來做。那第二個是我們現在在包括省道,事實上你在左右都省道的人行道不夠。所以我們公路局現在用永續提升行人計畫140億,現在在這個省道裡面這個人可能比較會走的地方優先來做。"},{"start":25388.729,"end":25390.669,"text":"神說我就是真理道路生命請讓我們無後顧之憂的行走"},{"start":25417.331,"end":25424.216,"text":"謝謝林委員的質詢,也謝謝陳院長的備詢。接下來我們請登記第15位葉委員原資質詢。再請陳院長備詢。"},{"start":25447.212,"end":25463.864,"text":"院長好今天早上賴清德副總統去參觀我們的無人機國家隊看到我們有一個無人機他是可以搭載這個輕用的比較小型的飛彈但是他的螺旋槳的馬達看到是Made in China那院長知道這事嗎"},{"start":25464.584,"end":25485.164,"text":"我知道,不過這不用大惊小怪啦,因為他還在測試的過程當中,而且他那一種Propeller,這個螺旋槳,現在都有國產的部分啦。測試的階段,台灣做不出來嗎?這個馬達,台灣做不出來?沒有沒有,可以做出來,但是當時的糖尿不大,所以現在,現在已經做得出來啦。做出來就為什麼要用Made in China?"},{"start":25486.089,"end":25494.059,"text":"但是最早期測試他自己裝的啊,這個沒有什麼,這不值得大家講話啦。 因為這個是無人機裸家隊,沒有說您的態度會這樣,難怪廠商會這樣嘛。以論上來講,我們民進黨政府一直宣傳說中國大陸的東西很可怕,有資安問題,然後再一大堆有的沒的。"},{"start":25504.891,"end":25526.269,"text":"現在我們的馬達居然跟他們買,第一個扶植他們的產業,然後第二個我們也做得出來,為什麼不自己做,為什麼不用自己的。第三,這個網路上已經酸,對啦,這個叫做中國國家無人機啦,好不好,有台灣的東西加上東海南,為什麼會酸是因為你們做好才會被酸啦,因為如果酸你還是這樣的態度,其實這個東西,你的回答其實很簡單,你只要講說我們會要求廠商以後馬達也要用台灣的,其實就好了。"},{"start":25534.655,"end":25560.93,"text":"那你的態度是說無所謂那我百分之百比較緊張未來會出現一連串這個狀況就是我們的軍用的東西都會用到大陸的東西因為都是測試階段那未來就是兩岸一起發展軍事產業了啦好不好那這個是因為網路的話題我跟你問一下來接下來我來問一下這個其他大家關心的這個詐騙的議題那有一個名人叫做謝金和"},{"start":25561.79,"end":25587.407,"text":"謝金河他在抱怨他說在他自己的臉書在臉書上或者是在YT什麼都會看到有人冒用他的名字就是說成立投資社然後就騙大家就加入投資社被詐騙嘛因為我看到那個部長也上來部長你已經知道嗎?知道這是什麼?這個右邊這個是我自己看到的所以我看到我的YT葉元之、袁之、袁惠跳在我的YT看到"},{"start":25588.188,"end":25602.016,"text":"那現在我覺得這個事情比較離譜的是謝金河說他自己去跟臉書檢舉或平台檢舉臉書是不理他的那除了謝金河不理他之外我們可以看到謝金河說他有跟打詐小組連線過"},{"start":25603.991,"end":25606.773,"text":"這個打詐小組應該是165 不過回答委員的問題我們現在在推動電子簽章法的修法只要立法院三度通過我們這個法律的依據"},{"start":25620.282,"end":25644.297,"text":"我現在就問你說有沒有跟你聯絡?有沒有跟你聯絡?那個是165那邊,但是我們在推動的時候...沒關係有沒有聯絡嘛,那你回答不出來就叫別人回答嘛,有沒有聯絡嘛。就不能夠看謝金河的廣告。院長,我的問題很簡單,就是說他如果說有跟打詐小組聯絡,但是你們...他說沒有作用,這個這句話是讓我覺得比較訝異的。就是說一般的民眾,包括謝金河都是民間...作用不大。"},{"start":25646.946,"end":25670.818,"text":"作用似乎不大。不要擴大他講的。我跟你講我們是討論事情,因為他是一個名人,他如果都覺得作用...院長等一下,不用緊張,我還沒有開始講。我的意思是說,他是一個名人,然後他去檢舉,第一個平台不理他,第二個他跟打詐小組他說作用不大。"},{"start":25671.178,"end":25696.188,"text":"那一般小老百姓去聯繫打造小組可能打造小組更不會理了那我現在想要問部長我就問唐鳳部長請教一下如果是有人跟速發部反映說他被冒名在網路上做被認為有詐騙的行為被冒名了找速發部速發部能不能幫我們的一般的民眾去跟平台講說你這個是詐騙請你趕快下架能不能做到嗎"},{"start":25697.108,"end":25725.224,"text":"我沒有幫忙165建立一個165往臉書或是Google...他會被理你?他會被理你?通常現在兩個小時之內就會移下來,但是問題是移下來之後他換一個帳號又登上來。所以你跟他講兩個小時他就移掉?對啊。通常是這樣。那為什麼他說作用不大?他所謂的作用不大就是他換個人頭的名字然後又PO一個。你沒有注意進去嗎?我蠻確定的。確定?那所以我第一個我覺得第一個就是說因為過去我們也有我們服務團隊有跟蘇阿布聯繫過是幫一般的民眾"},{"start":25726.549,"end":25748.054,"text":"請蘇巴布去檢舉那當時得到的消息是說他們只能處理民員的部分一般民眾的部分165也會檢舉沒關係你就在這邊宣布就是說以後大家只要看到網路上有冒名投資或什麼請跟蘇巴布或打造小組聯繫兩個小時就會消失就是165這個網站你按檢舉就可以了你就說這個承諾嘛我相信你可以解決很多問題啦"},{"start":25748.954,"end":25776.275,"text":"然後再來就是說我講一下不能夠解決很多問題原因在哪裡就像剛才你剛才沒有注意聽唐鳳部長他講得很清楚他現在下架是這一個號碼帳號下架可是他馬上利用其他的帳號在上來所以你要一個一個檢舉有比沒有好嘛你也要增加他的困難度你不能讓他一個帳號一直在使用嘛那很多人就認為說喔作用不大那我也懶得講了"},{"start":25777.316,"end":25799.891,"text":"現在你就宣誓說只要跟速發部說速發部有這個決心好好去處理那當然大家檢舉也就多了嘛那我覺得詐騙集團也我覺得一定會有作用啦而且我是建議就是說速發部跟我們現在要做啦不是不是我不是講更有效果的方法就是源頭管理都要做啦都要做啦都要做啦都要做啦"},{"start":25804.654,"end":25805.214,"text":"這是去年的時候"},{"start":25826.783,"end":25838.765,"text":"有委員啊,大概,欸這個應該也是系統的問題,就是去年有委員的時候講,如果警察有被,有接受到報案,然後有人被詐騙,他要去凍結那個警視帳戶的時候,都是用傳真的嘛。"},{"start":25839.229,"end":25864.578,"text":"那警察傳真到金融機構會衍生很多問題比如說卡紙啊比如說他傳真因為手寫啊手寫萬一寫錯的話會有別的帳戶被凍結啊或者是這個銀行端收到傳真紙有時候回撥警局找不到人啊很多問題那這個就會錯失打詐的這個第一時間嘛我不知道後來院長這個後來有去解決嗎這是去年5月的時候有委員提出來的"},{"start":25866.36,"end":25895.854,"text":"各位回答一下這個基本上來講是金管會跟內政部我們刑事警察局這邊我們聯繫工作我們打仗基本上是聯防每個部位每個階段都有不同的機關對對對沒問題你如果不知道你就都不知道好不好你不知道嘛因為不是你啦因為你在NCC不是你那院長你知道嗎因為這個東西當時警察一直在抱怨就是說他們用傳真其實時間上也耽擱了有的時候就是傳過去隔了好幾個小時之後那個銀行才收到所以這幾個小時錢就被領走了其實"},{"start":25896.434,"end":25924.095,"text":"蘇建,我不知道說這個改善了沒?這個有沒有改善,是不是這個個案,這個委員我不清楚,但是在去年齁,我們在這個銀行這個主詐的這個部分齁,就主詐的這個金額呢,就到了70幾億的錢。沒有啦,院長我們就是問事啦,我都點問題出來,你都在跟我,你都在做這個政令宣導。我的問題就是說這個問題解決了沒嘛?這問題解決了沒?好沒關係,院長你不知道齁,那我跟你講齁,"},{"start":25924.995,"end":25942.98,"text":"其實現在警政署他們有開發一個系統叫警視帳戶聯防通報制系統這個系統就是說警局以後你們就不要用傳真了你們就輸入那個系統就好了這樣就直接連線了有這個系統我也跟院長講一下在你的院下面的部會有這個系統存在但是我現在要告訴你就是說這個系統也是很爛為什麼"},{"start":25944.54,"end":25958.756,"text":"因為登打系統完之後他系統輸入還是要傳真啊這個是我最新調到他的通報流程嘛還是要傳真所以搞到警察跟金融人員更麻煩更麻煩要做兩次工"},{"start":25959.597,"end":25979.011,"text":"那我覺得今天為什麼會在這個地方提出來?因為唐鳳部長、IT大臣這個這麼厲害的網路神人你應該發揮你的功能幫這些機關做系統好不好不要只弄一些眼前面那些的這是給你的期許,謝謝因為我今天實驗會有限下一頁下一頁下一頁你沒有給他講話的機會不是不是給他"},{"start":25985.256,"end":25988.198,"text":"二類電信我想問一下現在二類電信主委一般是可以跟我們一類電信租到多少門號"},{"start":26010.487,"end":26020.224,"text":"二類電信現在沒有二類電信這個名詞的因為我們電信法落日以後我們現在電信管理法那個MEMO這個部分是採所謂的資源登記的方法"},{"start":26020.765,"end":26048.608,"text":"那志願登記的方法來講的話我們要區分他大概是個人申請還是企業客戶是這樣處理那可以申請多少門號門號基本上來講說比如企業客戶以原則上是以他我們依照我們的質疑以他有多少員工就有這個員工的數字那現在海峽電信一次可以申請幾十萬門號這個狀況已經沒有那是以前發生的事現在我們現在落實KYC這種情況來講現在不會出現海峽電信我是說一次可以跟一夜電信租多少門號一般的企業嘛"},{"start":26049.108,"end":26077.48,"text":"一般性比如說你的企業裡面只有50個人嘛那50個人來講的話原則上來講大概是這樣的門號去處理嘛所以不會再出現如果你要更加更多的情況來講的話這個時候就要落實KYC去處理為什麼需要這麼多我知道我知道但是現在還是有類似的12家電信公司嘛這是在你們網站上看到的不然這些不是第二類電信喔這是你NCC網站欸這個大概112年6月嘛所以後來這12家現在已經沒有了如果沒有有來登記的就變成所謂的MVMO這個業者嘛"},{"start":26078.801,"end":26099.384,"text":"對好那我就針對這幾家業者嘛,所以他們還是可以跟業業電信租門號嘛,可以租到50萬戶。他用企業客戶的名稱可以跟中華電信等等這些租門號。我的問題是這樣,他跟業業電信業者租了50萬門號,然後他再分租出去。那是以前了,現在不能分租。現在不可能50萬門號這種程度。那他能不能分租出去?"},{"start":26100.031,"end":26113.763,"text":"如果說企業客戶來講的話他比如說他可以批有些東西他可以批出去嘛我跟你講一個檢察官現在抱怨東西啊那個主委我認為說你應該去修正一下因為比如說他分出出去1000個門號那1000個門號裡面可能有100個門號已經被舉報為詐騙的門號了對"},{"start":26117.446,"end":26123.292,"text":"那你覺得這個業者他會不會主動說他把剩下900個門號直接停掉?會不會?會不會?你聽他講,聽他講。問題是現在就沒有嘛,你有要求現在就沒有嘛。"},{"start":26136.305,"end":26140.669,"text":"主委主委請教一下今天中天是不是又再次勝訴了對吧沒有那是一個在審的問題而已在審嘛所以在那一審的勝訴了嘛"},{"start":26160.347,"end":26179.2,"text":"主委你一直講說你NCC14次勝訴對吧?然後中天只有兩次勝訴嗎?請問一下14次勝訴是包括很多你裁罰出去中天沒有訴訟部分?那個也算勝訴喔!包括你訴訟!主委什麼叫勝訴?勝訴是說我跟你等一下等一下主委主委等一下主委"},{"start":26184.784,"end":26200.03,"text":"聖訴的意思是說,你如果說我去訴訟了,你跟我打官司,你贏了這叫聖訴嘛。還要說你裁把我,我不去打官司,然後你說你聖訴,那你每一次貼出去的裁決單都是一次聖訴,這太離譜了。"},{"start":26202.131,"end":26227.249,"text":"你們不要用話術實際上實際上你們在打話術不管是有沒有確定在好幾省就是一直連辦而且主委我問你另外一件事情啦我問你另外一件事情啦前兩天是不是有一個鳳凰雲前兩天是不是有一個鳳凰雲你們又敗訴了在那一庭沒有沒有沒有那就是敗審的問題嘛敗訴了嗎你那一庭又敗訴了你不瞭解訴訟程序嘛今天找訴訟成敗就是以確定為準嘛"},{"start":26232.212,"end":26251.823,"text":"那是確定我現在講進行中的我現在講進行中的啦不要再動了啦訴訟費是你出嗎你如果說最後你那一庭你出的話你每一庭都是那一庭出錢啦我跟你請教孟煌雲那個事情你今天早上跟記者講說你跟記者說那個是前朝事你有這樣講嗎"},{"start":26252.523,"end":26255.425,"text":"我不是跟你辯論喔不好意思那個主席"},{"start":26272.719,"end":26277.865,"text":"我沒有在跟他辯論,我已經讓你一直講了,但是我有問問題你再回答好不好?"},{"start":26283.749,"end":26311.189,"text":"放黃雲的部分今天早上記者訪問你你是說那個是前朝事為什麼因為當時我還熱情回答等一下等一下你可以直接講嘛你在反駁嘛那時候你講的是說因為那個東西是前面的規定前面前朝規定那前朝為什麼你要退前朝因為當時所有的委員絕大多數是說不要裁罰可是裁罰了所以記者就問你說怎麼會這樣你說那是前朝決定好前朝決定代表說你也覺得有點理虧所以你才會說是前朝決定"},{"start":26311.849,"end":26322.559,"text":"那請問一下每一次每一庭敗訴之後你有沒有上訴市民的決定是你的決定嘛所以實際上你也認為說鳳凰雲這個事情你如果是你不管是前朝現朝你就是會這樣裁決啊"},{"start":26323.865,"end":26330.766,"text":"政府機關要訴訟要輸很不容易啦你已經確定兩件很不容易啦我跟你講啦主委如果你打詐的決心有跟你關電視台決心那麼強的話台灣詐騙會少很多啦"},{"start":26350.73,"end":26354.511,"text":"謝謝葉委員援資的質詢,也謝謝陳院長的備詢。接下來我們請登記第16位,許委員巧心質詢。"},{"start":26387.262,"end":26391.448,"text":"謝謝院長。我想有請我們陳建仁院長。再請陳院長備詢。主委午安。"},{"start":26398.107,"end":26422.29,"text":"首先剛才議員之委員講說這個NCC主委陳耀祥說這個他沒有講陳耀祥說沒有講說是前一任的事情他就在這他剛剛沒有帶iPad上來沒有辦法show給大家看但是我必須說等一下我才會問到這個NCC主委但是你確實有講是前一任的事情核先續名我說前任不是說前場我才剛才講過前一任的事情你有沒有說"},{"start":26423.03,"end":26441.736,"text":"那是前任﹖對啊沒有說是前任的會員﹖所以他說你說的是那是前一任的事情﹖這句話我跟您確認您有講﹖哪一句話﹖您有講這一句話叫做那是前一任的事情﹖對啊前任的這個案是前任做成的決定的﹖我知道了謝謝﹖葉委員問他是前草﹖葉委員晒的錯了﹖我幫你們來這個"},{"start":26444.677,"end":26473.898,"text":"公道一下嘛前一任的事情就前一任的事現在大家知道了好嗎好是前一任那我想今天剛剛那個議員關心的有關這個無人機零件的事情我也很關心就是說呢2023年9月15號的時候這個蔡總統去視察無人機當時我們很開心還跟他報告說呢我們目前軍用的商規非常辛苦做到了100%沒有中國的零件我們覺得是很好的事情啊我們就是自己能做就自己做"},{"start":26474.318,"end":26498.116,"text":"但是呢今天他去的時候出現上面是MIC這個部分剛剛院長你有回答過了但我想請看下一張這個所謂的馬達齁驅動馬達上面呢不只他MIC喔其實你可以看到什麼在大陸的南昌三瑞智能科技股份有限公司製造而且可以查到售價是369塊美金我想問一下喔"},{"start":26498.536,"end":26526.633,"text":"那針對這次賴準總統去參訪那結果呢出糗了請問我們會不會要求這個廠商要做具體的改善這個廠商自己都已經說了啦說因為這是在測試的狀況下他已經裝了在測試而且現在台灣已經可以自己生產了所以不要為這件事情在那邊大驚小怪所以你覺得發現上面有MIC是大驚小怪"},{"start":26527.874,"end":26534.119,"text":"對啊當然這廠商都自己講了他在測試的過程啊現在在這裡問這個人沒意思啦這不是你把你把神聖的民主殿堂拿來做這個網紅的事"},{"start":26544.691,"end":26567.021,"text":"這個跟網紅沒有關係,我沒有提到網紅,這是前一位委員說的,請不要拍到我的頭上。我是要問行政院的態度會不會要求廠商未來在參展的時候也要注意我們所有的樣品上面也不可以是MIC,還是您認為MIC如果是在展覽當中OK,只是你不能做後續的生產,請問是哪一種態度?"},{"start":26568.081,"end":26585.815,"text":"當然我們是盡可能的不要有這個MIC啊。但是在展覽的時候當然我們會讓廠商再提高警覺。我跟委員報告發現這件事情以後很多的廠商不會再使用了啦。很多廠商不會再使用因為已經有國產了。對。"},{"start":26589.278,"end":26619.058,"text":"好,那我們再談一下電價跟民生有關的事情大家都很在乎喔那這一波電價調整平均達到11%那民生的部分漲了之外呢還有包含商用我會漲大家很關心的是啊現在呢如果電價漲了以後物價會不會漲尤其大眾運輸今天要特別跟這個院長來談的是台鐵、高鐵、捷運跟客運請問這四種大眾運輸工具會不會漲價什麼時候拍板"},{"start":26619.538,"end":26619.558,"text":" ﹝國道運輸﹞"},{"start":26644.679,"end":26667.346,"text":"臺鐵現在還在研議過程當中那他們還沒提出來嗎?他們還沒有提出來那我們有確認說大概在什麼時間比如說4月5月6月他們會去做相關的審議會拍板那這是臺鐵公司因為他們現在是公司化他處理事實上在處理啦然後他通過這個董事會以後就送我們的交通費力審議委員會"},{"start":26669.147,"end":26678.115,"text":"所以現在這個時間可能還有一段時間,不是馬上。再來就是高鐵的部分會漲價嗎?高鐵的部分,高鐵也是一個公司。這一個電的成本實際上對他們來說佔比不高。"},{"start":26684.281,"end":26688.424,"text":"接下來我要特別跟你們討論的是有關於捷運因為電費佔捷運的成本非常的高所以台北捷運佔13%"},{"start":26705.234,"end":26732.487,"text":"高雄佔14%你如果連覺得13%佔整個營運成本不高我尊重但是我作為過去臺北市議員臺北市的立委我覺得以電費佔捷運成本13%還有高雄佔14%這對於捷運來說是相當大的壓力所以我想請問如果地方這邊有呼籲說希望中央能夠動漲捷運的電價或者調漲以後給予電價優惠或補助政院這裡會同意嗎態度是什麼"},{"start":26732.987,"end":26759.461,"text":"委員你比我還清楚現在大部分在高雄或者是在臺北大家用那個T-pass那T-pass絕對不會漲價而且T-pass呢一直要到T-pass不會漲價我們知道我們是說單一票價的部分對啊那這T-pass不會漲價的話T-pass占了所有的臺北捷運跟高雄捷運的最大的部分那如果T-pass沒有漲價的時候那為了那個少數沒有用T-pass的人"},{"start":26759.861,"end":26777.827,"text":"那請問一下我們在臺北臺北桃園、高雄這些捷運公司如果說在地方上面它其實不分縣市有捷運的地方政府希望說政府對於他們的捷運電費動漲或補助的部分政院有相關的規劃嗎?"},{"start":26781.428,"end":26795.021,"text":"結運是地方政府管理講對了。但結運的費率呢是由地方政府來決定。那我剛才講過因為大部分搭的都是用TPAS那地方政府有這樣的一個數據他要漲價他沒有那個"},{"start":26796.685,"end":26812.365,"text":"正當性。我知道,我已經知道不漲價了。我是問說我們有沒有規劃對於捷運有相關的電費補貼或是動漲。沒有。OK好清楚了。那接下來我想要回到這個NCC的這個問題。剛才這個主委談到所謂的鳳凰雲的案件。"},{"start":26812.805,"end":26832.018,"text":"您是覺得說呢這個哪有敗訴喔那這個呢好我給你證明一下法律名詞它不是敗訴但是呢它叫做再審原告之訴駁回也就是說你們當時希望申請包含是在意等等的被駁回了我想問一下主委可不可以說明一下你們被駁回的理由是什麼您清楚嗎"},{"start":26843.245,"end":26868.621,"text":"那討論完的結果來講當然後來法院並不支持我們這個認定要採訪的部分就是說這個是涉及說我們的標準我們的認定的方式法院可能他認為他的認定方式應該改善那麼呢你們現在如果有30天有新事證可以申請再議請問目前對本案的態度NCC這裡會申請再議嗎還是接受這一次被駁回的結果再審就是說基本上這法律的部分我們申請再審嗎"},{"start":26869.621,"end":26883.628,"text":"所以我們會在內部溝通一下,那可能應該就不會再提﹖你們要內部溝通多久﹖大家對這個事情很想了解啊﹖我們這麼久才有一次在這裡詢問您的機會﹖如果您都說要再回去討論的話﹖下一次見到你也不知道什麼時候﹖我們是合一致的﹖合一致的問題關"},{"start":26887.37,"end":26890.373,"text":"你講到重點了,你們是合意制可是你諮詢委員會有16個人裡面12個人認為這個新聞沒有違法只有4個人認為有新聞違法的問題決議要發函改進的時候"},{"start":26903.007,"end":26922.204,"text":"你們還是罰人家40萬阿你們不能說有爭議的時候要帶回去討論因為我們是要合一致結果呢你想要罰人家的時候即便上面法院寫得非常的清楚12個委員認為沒有違法也決定發行改進結果沒有造罰如果沒有造罰的話你今天根本不用浪費人民的公帑不斷的去打這個官司來請你說明"},{"start":26929.511,"end":26954.552,"text":"基本上來講這個諮詢會議來講本來它叫做諮詢會議我們在法定程序上外部的委員所討論的這個部分他的意見要不要採納最後還是七個委員要去討論的問題反正我想參考你我覺得跟我的想法一致我就參考然後如果出狀況就是說那是諮詢委員給我們的意見那如果說我覺得你的想法跟我不一樣這只是參考用的我不一定要聽你的意見"},{"start":26954.932,"end":26958.433,"text":"所以您到現在還是認為當時NCC的處理方式16個人裡面有12個諮詢委員認為沒有問題然後他們決定要發函改進就好你們去拔了對方"},{"start":26972.978,"end":26988.428,"text":"從二人的角度來說,不要管到上一任,您覺得當時NCC的處理方式是正確還是錯誤?程序上沒有問題,而是說我們這種案子類型也有只是案子不是很多,但是問題是這次七個人共同討論出來的,這就是我們的決定。"},{"start":26989.028,"end":27014.136,"text":"我,未來審查預算是我們的決定,你們真的浪費太多的...沒有浪費的問題,沒有浪費...不斷的再審,不斷的對一個案子又打又打又打...委員,不斷的針對中天發言的是你們,中天只是一個案子和一家公司,我們監理的公司非常多,不是只有中天一家而已...因為你們亂打官司的也不只針對中天,我只是舉這個個案跟你討論啦,上一任的主委他們編了多少的訴訟費?"},{"start":27017.093,"end":27031.524,"text":"你編了多少的訴訟費?你知道你們增加了非常的多倍嗎?我們的救濟程序有改正過,我們法律以後沒有經過行政院的書院直接訴訟了。來我們接下來請訴發佈"},{"start":27037.048,"end":27050.918,"text":"月長我記得上一次有柯智恩委員問你說覺得速發布這個做得怎樣的時候你問他說股市兩萬點你不開心嗎我個人沒什麼感覺我沒有買股票可是我很在意的是我們編列預算有沒有按照實際的單位數去編列"},{"start":27052.679,"end":27070.227,"text":"那我們一般會想說我們政府部門裡面最常出國的可能會是僑委會可是我們卻比較了述發部跟僑委會的這個出國的項目天數跟出國人數之後發現數位發展部的出國比僑委會還厲害出國總天數述發部329天僑委會295天出國人數也比僑委會多總費用也比他來的多"},{"start":27077.831,"end":27098.568,"text":"再來我們就想進一步的來追查說你們在這個預算的編列到底合不合情理問題可能就會在於福報看下一張投影片我們針對亞洲的部分做了一個整理光是亞洲部分四趟有三趟安排的是商務艙照理來說這也代表說是高階公務人員在出國"},{"start":27099.369,"end":27126.505,"text":"而且這個我們去詳細看之後很多的費用其實有對不起來的情況我們看下一張投影片我們直接把去的同一個國家拿出來比較紅色的是舊金山三個然後藍色是倫敦然後還有綠色是華盛頓你可以看到的是你去同一個國家可是預算編列的標準根本不一樣同一個國家同一個城市每次的平均價格都不同"},{"start":27127.005,"end":27132.09,"text":"當然,因為無論是次長或者司長或者署長出席,他按照我們的這個報紙費用的標準,他是做不同的倉等,所以當然就會有不同的...這都是一樣的商務倉喔,我們都幫你挑過了。"},{"start":27152.008,"end":27156.252,"text":"還有不同的季節,還有不同的季節跟不同的道的地區。"},{"start":27169.924,"end":27198.416,"text":"我們看下一張投影片我們幫你都找出來了以7月8號到11號也就是你們要預計出國的時間來說它的價差可以說是非常的大首爾商務艙我們都講商務艙網路上報價3萬3你們編了9.6萬新加坡網上3萬4你們報的是7萬東京的部分的商務艙的報價也有很大的價差這代表你們當時在預算編列的時候就編的過高了有沒有管理上面的問題"},{"start":27199.416,"end":27222.662,"text":"您挑的這個是沒有辦法改時間沒有辦法退票的那種價格然後跟我們這種可以改時間的來比但是我們實際上用的時候如果有較低的價錢是按照時報時值來使用我都把各種的都查過了啦不是你說的那樣子實際上你們當初估的票價就是比較高我把可以改票的也列進去了還是一樣的狀況不好意思我很貼心的都替你想過了"},{"start":27224.282,"end":27244.438,"text":"還有再來還不只這樣部長您院長您可以看看你們的部長在整個預算編列的時候問題多大下一張投影片一樣我們在3月6號跟3月15號的時候請速發部提供相關的資訊速發部出席這個亞太網路資訊中心的會議要去紐西蘭跟日本可是他根本是在曼谷舉行的"},{"start":27244.858,"end":27263.301,"text":"在2月21日到3月1日就辦完了。訴發部不知道還提供給我們資料說你們要去泰國。結果根本已經辦完了。根本就要說要去日本。完全不一樣的。所以請問為什麼你們會有訴發部連自己要去哪個國家都沒有辦法掌握的情況。"},{"start":27264.509,"end":27266.671,"text":"院長最後一點時間可以說明一下我剛所提到的剛才速發布的這些問題您同意嗎?您覺得合理嗎?"},{"start":27293.853,"end":27297.555,"text":"謝謝徐委員巧心的質詢也謝謝陳院長的備詢接下來我們請登記第17號陳委員冠廷質詢"},{"start":27342.267,"end":27343.007,"text":"好,請院長。"},{"start":27357.022,"end":27374.684,"text":"今天是很高興用不同的身份在跟院長來對話那過去是行政院政務官的時候那我們把嘉義的很多問題包含我們講到的公糧問題交通議題等等有跟院長反映那也謝謝院長都能夠花時間去聆聽去了解然後去做一些改善"},{"start":27375.245,"end":27388.017,"text":"那特別是今天早上還有今天下午其實我們的吳啓明委員也提到國土計畫的這個部分那其實我們都是一樣我們的想法跟迴響都是一致的我們希望能夠延緩不過"},{"start":27389.485,"end":27410.75,"text":"今天我們準備了幾個跟交通相關的重大議題,想要跟院長來討論,包含民雄航太園區、民雄鐵路高架化、A3纜車還有緊急的救難的通訊等等問題。首先我必須談一下民雄航太園區,今天吳佩儀委員也談到包含低軌衛星的部分,這次也會在我們航太園區裡面來跟大家談一下。"},{"start":27411.63,"end":27425.818,"text":"民雄航太及無人機產業園區,它是現在全世界都在搶著發展的航太產業。那我們嘉義縣公共其盛,那我們現在行政院在民雄規劃了一個民雄航太園區要用來發展航太、軍工、無人機產業。"},{"start":27427.119,"end":27446.326,"text":"我想要請教一下民雄航太園區這個園區是以164線然後劃分為東西兩側那東邊是中科院航太及無人機園區西邊是民雄航太及無人機產業園區那東邊的這一個部分目前是沒有什麼開發的問題那去年12月動土"},{"start":27447.113,"end":27459.607,"text":"那未來要興建的是這個嚴肅大樓還有基礎工程大概是2025年底就能夠完工。現在有問題好像是西邊。院長我想請教一下現在到底是誰來負責開發這個園區是經濟部是縣府是國防部。"},{"start":27467.433,"end":27486.165,"text":"在這一個部分的話我想各部會都有他執事的該做的這個部分那中科院他是做這一個無人機園區的規劃那經濟部廠發署跟這一個嘉義縣政府是協助調查跟招商所以各有各的責任這樣子"},{"start":27486.425,"end":27510.358,"text":"是,那院長因為這個開發的總積費是68億元那應該是會由國發會納入工建計畫那是由,大概是由經濟部那個無人機專案辦公室來去處理可是他有這個經驗來去處理這個將近30公頃的園區嗎我是認為我也建議院長齁如果可以的話這樣的相關的開發工作還是要交給經濟部產業園區的管理局來處理"},{"start":27511.278,"end":27538.5,"text":"因為他下面有大概50個產業園區還有9個科技產業園區所以比較適合這樣的開發工作不知道院長現在是不是可以交辦給經濟部這樣子讓他的整個統整會更快速這一個部分的話我想這一個我們讓中科院跟經濟部我們再來做內部的協商我請那個副院長來做一下協調好不好看怎麼樣能夠把園區發展得更好"},{"start":27538.9,"end":27555.189,"text":"或中科院主責或經濟部的協助,我們討論完再跟委員報告。謝謝院長。特別談到低軌衛星是因為除了中科院部分,那兩個產業園區都有講到航太。"},{"start":27557.005,"end":27558.866,"text":"總統府之前在這個有正式的這個新聞稿都說未來會投入400億"},{"start":27580.862,"end":27602.534,"text":"﹚議員"},{"start":27602.967,"end":27612.192,"text":"謝謝院長因為我特別要強調一下就是說因為無人機航太原機我們大家基本上把所有的注意力都放在無人機產業但是其實低軌衛星剛才部長也有提到那包含在我們的一些重要的島嶼像太平島等等都有它的應用的地方"},{"start":27631.181,"end":27645.918,"text":"所以我是希望說現在已經有了這個雅創然後再加上雅創是一個這個做研理的研究的中心那未來生產的中心在民雄那包含低軌衛星他也不是只有這個衛星的這個部分而已還有地面的接收設備等等"},{"start":27646.579,"end":27661.08,"text":"我認為他是可以作為一個群聚的產業包含從民雄開始到太保整個地區太保民雄我們有民雄航太園區我們有台積電進駐其實是一個充滿未來性的產業我希望次世代產業區有一個完整的聚落所以我還是希望說"},{"start":27661.721,"end":27664.362,"text":"我想只要在自然確保無虞的情況下我們都很願意去跟國際的廠商來合作"},{"start":27687.666,"end":27708.642,"text":"委員剛剛問到的就是低軌衛星的接受器目前大概還是要透過一個基地台然後透過5G或Wi-Fi訊號再分享出去但我們也預測未來大概兩年左右慢慢就會有手機或者無人機可以直接連低軌衛星的這個狀況到那個時候我想廠商會變得比較多我們會隨時來評估我們在這邊也是希望透過國會的殿堂來去鼓勵這些產業能夠進駐謝謝院長謝謝部長"},{"start":27711.624,"end":27717.451,"text":"那接下來我們要談民雄的鐵路高架化還有他的車站整體的這個規劃跟高架橋下面的利用"},{"start":27718.67,"end":27742.771,"text":"這部分我們可能要請黃國才部長一起,謝謝。那鐵路高架化這一個部分,其實我們爭取這個高架化是從馬英九前總統時代是否決啦,他到現在經過賴清德、蘇貞昌還有陳建仁院長總算是核定動工,所以還是要代表我們的團隊還有我們嘉義的這些姓名們來表示肯定。"},{"start":27744.053,"end":27744.093,"text":"兩格一結"},{"start":27762.499,"end":27778.986,"text":"這主要的產權還是在台鐵公司,但是都市要變更,要經過地方政府來協助。據我的瞭解這空間的土地全屬應該是鐵路蓋好之前是鐵道局,鐵路蓋好之後就要移交給台鐵公司。"},{"start":27779.506,"end":27807.904,"text":"那正常來說這個高架橋下面的空間大概是給台鐵公司去做處理那現在的問題就是說臺中有類似這樣的問題是因為我們的這個研究室的研究員特別他是台中人他也提到說過去就是把財產點交給台鐵公司但是財產很難登記過去因為台鐵公司不太願意去處理這個部分所以常常會辦就拒絕辦理登記所以這些空間有些時候會變成說下面的空間有的時候就會荒廢甚至用鐵皮圍起來"},{"start":27808.985,"end":27832.688,"text":"⋯⋯"},{"start":27833.029,"end":27833.589,"text":"的確就是說鐵路的地下"},{"start":27851.84,"end":27851.86,"text":"謝謝,謝謝部長"},{"start":27879.168,"end":27895.694,"text":"接下來我們來談一下民雄戰前的開發還有他的這個日式宿舍群。院長最近這幾年有沒有去日本考察?最近因為我...比較困難因為身份的關係對不對?可能比較困難因為安全因素還有國際的情勢。那請問"},{"start":27897.781,"end":27923.673,"text":"議長過去在日本的車站你的印象是什麼?我還蠻喜歡日本的我以前在當學者的時候常常去那我覺得他這個有關於車站整體的開發做得相當成功不管是大阪也好或者是京都也好或者是神戶也好都做得是很成功所以他們鐵道公司賺的錢是這一些副業賺的錢反而比票價賺得更多"},{"start":27924.193,"end":27937.231,"text":"沒錯,因為日本的鐵道公司他可以利用他們車站的優勢那可能會做商場、做飯店或做出租公寓他變成一個總和營運的公司所以就如同你剛剛說的,像是九州JR的2002年"},{"start":27937.991,"end":27964.434,"text":"22年的總營收是2116億日元但是非鐵道本業的是70%所以說這是我們台鐵公司未來可以努力的方向找出自己的價值那幫國家賺出更多的價值這是很重要的那我們談回這個民雄車站的高價化在這個高價化核定之後鐵道局台鐵公司我想請教一下有沒有跟縣政府來談論整個民雄車站周邊的整體開發計畫"},{"start":27965.895,"end":27985.089,"text":"目前有,目前在做個案編,事實上這很重要,在鐵路高架最重要的點就是車站開發,當然談到日本的例子。目前也是希望在民雄車站包括一些複合商業大樓跟商店等等餐飲,還有一些生活娛樂的空間,目前有這樣的想法。"},{"start":27985.751,"end":28005.984,"text":"那其實整個車站我必須要再強調,因為說如果我們仔細看剛才的這個整個平面圖的話,大家可以知道說在我們未來如果興建站前廣場的話,或者是停等區,可能會遇到一些一些青年朋友來反映就是說他會不會影響到這個舊的民雄分局的宿舍群。"},{"start":28006.644,"end":28028.652,"text":"那這個宿舍群是從日治時代延誘到現在所以現在地方上是有聲音說他們擔心會不會因為這個規劃的話會影響到整個宿舍群的部分我想請問部長有沒有聽到類似這樣子的這種我目前沒有聽到但是過去在台北車站的確也有類似比如說宿舍群的保留跟你新開發什麼融合一體"},{"start":28029.252,"end":28051.39,"text":"我想這部分可以在兩邊再討論一下。謝謝部長,我指出這一點的目的是說,除了不是要讓他被影響之外,他在做整體車站規劃的時候,也能夠考量到舊的地景跟舊的文室。保留變成一部分。對,所以變成說在車站的規劃的時候,你在做整體規劃的時候,在做整個景觀營造的時候,可以納入這個景觀。"},{"start":28052.911,"end":28075.328,"text":"讓他成為一個重要的視覺點所以我們現在很多車站包括嘉義市的車站如果你仔細看嘉義市的車站的話他現在回復成他最古色古香的狀況所以他同時能夠維持他過去的古色古香的狀況之外又能夠把旁邊的這些周遭的景色融在一起那整個民雄鄉對我們嘉義縣第一大鄉來講那就是一個很好的示範地區"},{"start":28076.049,"end":28093.077,"text":"那我還是希望說交通部也好能夠整體開發的時候能夠把這個文化精神來放在裡面這是我們希望能夠做到的接下來想要請教好關於這個這個緊急通難救助的部分那可能這個部分可能要請部長蘇為夫部長在"},{"start":28108.168,"end":28128.654,"text":"其實我們嘉義縣山區有兩個主要的省道一個是台18那是到阿里山森林遊樂區那另外一個是台3可以到大埔鄉但是這兩個省道其實它通訊死角是非常多的譬如說中埔到大埔這個路段2023年1月到8月警方的統計死亡次數是超過60件"},{"start":28130.737,"end":28159.239,"text":"全國到底有類似多少這樣的地方為什麼會特別講到這個地址是因為包含大埔鄉長他帶領我們到整個每一個這個訊號時點的時候他都有強調說這一位鄉親他過去曾在這個地方交通事故那還好第二天下午有人發現所以趕快再送醫所以這樣子已經經過大概7到8個小時甚至10到18個小時所以這個地方的通訊很重要那我們這邊也是肯定任性司所有的任性司都有來去處理這個部分"},{"start":28159.699,"end":28188.698,"text":"那我是希望說未來院長是不是可以除了我們嘉義縣之外除了阿里、山大、帆路、竹崎等等全台灣各個重要的景區的重要的道路一定會有這樣的部分來做一個完整的統整那不管是交通部也好、數位部也好一起來統整一下來去避免這樣子的問題不知道部長跟院長有沒有辦法統合來去處理我想就我們當然可以來盤點然後我們也會跟NCC合作NCC來指定說那些地方應該要優先來加強那我們回來提供經費這個沒有問題"},{"start":28189.779,"end":28191.72,"text":"梅山市區和太平村各辦一個說明會。整體的交通部關於梅山纜車的可行性評估。"},{"start":28208.266,"end":28225.254,"text":"不知道是不是可以提早把它做完因為未來還有綜合規劃影響環境影響評估工程設計所以這個部分想要請教一下部長有沒有辦法盡快把它完成現在阿里山分管處就積極在進行做一些前置的座位那前置座位完可以的話就進入可行性然後再往後來走這樣"},{"start":28226.054,"end":28242.8,"text":"謝謝最後還是要補問一個問題就是關於加一TPAS的部分因為其實有很多鄉親特別在包含各個市議員都有來到我們的辦公室來討論到這個部分其實TPAS在我們加一是399元但是我們只有大林到南進等於是只有6個鄉鎮"},{"start":28243.8,"end":28244.861,"text":"謝謝陳委員冠席的質詢,謝謝陳院長的備詢,包括院會。"},{"start":28271.517,"end":28275.321,"text":"現在休息10分鐘,休息之後我們繼續進行質詢。現在休息。"},{"start":28873.748,"end":28875.089,"text":"報告院會現在我們繼續開會。接下來請陳委員停飛質詢。"},{"start":28888.524,"end":28888.744,"text":"陳建仁議員"},{"start":28900.656,"end":28923.146,"text":"我想去討論一下這一次其實當我們在交通規則的部分地方有很多的爭議其實你知道我們現在各類公路並沒有統一的規範然後有所謂的到底誰這個速限然後要怎麼樣去標示的部分並沒有一個統一規範"},{"start":28924.446,"end":28949.866,"text":"也就是說今天國道是高速公路局省道是公路局市道是地方政府縣道是地方政府區道是地方政府鄉道是地方政府但是呢我們發現當我們這一次因為有一個叫如果超過我們最高限速的40公里我們是要吊扣駕照的這是很嚴重的"},{"start":28950.762,"end":28975.54,"text":"可是我們因為事權不統一當我從國道然後直接到了平面道路也就是進入到市道、縣道或是區道的時候我根本不知道到底它的線數是多少然後呢大家都有開過車很可能你從高速公路下來你不知道第一個它的速限"},{"start":28976.761,"end":28989.751,"text":"然後呢可能一採等到你一個月兩個月之後你可能要被吊扣駕照這個是很嚴重而且他的嚴重是會因為這樣子而喪失了他的工作權"},{"start":28992.165,"end":29005.119,"text":"部長,你有沒有聽過這樣的一個陳情?我跟各位報告。第一個,我們全國的不管從國道到地方,我們有一個標誌標線號誌設置規則。那速限的部分一般是我們設計,就是說設計速度的85%以那個來設定。"},{"start":29010.744,"end":29034.111,"text":"現在只有清楚的就是高速公路所以高速公路大家很清楚說我大概110我只要到150這個部分你就一定要被調控可是你在其他呢你在一般的市道、縣道甚至省道也好更不用講到區道或鄉道"},{"start":29035.779,"end":29055.026,"text":"公路局的部分像我們的快速道路也都很清楚80、90省道基本上也清楚那現在很多是在地方因為它面積很廣地方的部分那我們是覺得這個部分在他們的標誌就是限速的標誌不管在地上還是在路旁這個都很明顯這第一個"},{"start":29056.186,"end":29070.607,"text":"是不明顯啊根本因為他就是事權不統一根本沒有一個標準說大概在多大的一個所謂世道跟憲道要多少的憲數所以現在都是各自為政了"},{"start":29071.428,"end":29087.995,"text":"所有的所有開車的人沒有辦法很清楚你沒有很清楚的話你很容易就踩到了那個紅線你踩到了那個紅線你被調扣而影響到就是你未來有可能你的生計問題這是很嚴重"},{"start":29091.649,"end":29108.979,"text":"因為我們沒有做好配套。我跟你講縣市政府的部分的確有的他為了適容所以他放的非常少。而且通常都是在你審到接過來之後。審到接過來之後你看你原本如果70"},{"start":29111.462,"end":29129.054,"text":"70審到70限述70可以到了居到鄉到有可能只剩40曾經還有人說有30的你看這一下來是馬上就面臨了那個臨界所以我們是這麼講這麼建議就是說他是在不知情的狀況不是說我們現在絕對絕對不鼓勵超數也不鼓勵飆車這個絕對不行的"},{"start":29137.119,"end":29148.69,"text":"我們現在是說在沒有任何知情的狀態因為你從省道下來說真的大家不會覺得說怎麼會他的限數是這麼低"},{"start":29150.572,"end":29178.411,"text":"對不對那你從70本來限速70然後下來到一般你是不是踩了就過了過了他在不知情喔不是說我要飆車不是喔也不是說我故意要去競速喔都不是是在不知情狀態之下尤其在交界的地方喔對啊很危險啊是非常非常危險而且沒有標示那你怎麼樣欸如果你下來一看到我馬上再踩"},{"start":29181.523,"end":29206.313,"text":"我想這部分就是說如果兩個的速限差很多在交界地方結果又有測速照相這個本身是比較有問題的我有問題啊部長你講有問題可是問題是問題是這個即使去跟你們陳情都沒有用啊因為他確實標的線數就是這樣那你說確實有問題是你要去改變"},{"start":29207.373,"end":29224.362,"text":"不是說今天在這樣的一個區塊當中讓所有的人現在願生宰到啊。你有沒有聽到這樣的抱怨?事實上這樣,像我們的快速道路也一樣,在走的時候90變80會馬上有一個標示。"},{"start":29227.403,"end":29254.543,"text":"那如果他下了地方以後應該在交接的地方要有個明顯的標誌我想這部分我們該來跟各地方的尤其六都的交通局稍微討論一下要比較明顯的標誌我們利用這一段時間我們收到很多陳情案很多陳情案你知道嗎那個所謂的在不知情狀態之下然後莫名其妙收到單子然後呢就說你被調扣了"},{"start":29256.075,"end":29268.191,"text":"原因是因為你超過限速40,最高限速40公里。可是他說我怎麼會,我怎麼會超過我這麼小心的人,可是沒辦法。"},{"start":29269.119,"end":29283.223,"text":"另外他那個在100跟300公尺就要說前有測速照相這個也要做我想這個是就是要有個標誌說前有測速照相這個如果沒有的話是可以申訴的我們已經把"},{"start":29286.964,"end":29315.476,"text":"所有你們從高速公路局、公路局、地方政府我們去調所有你們對於這所謂連接然後到底事權怎麼統一沒有人知道沒有人知道然後呢就一味的用我們現在這樣子一個所謂的測速照相然後拍到了就到了啊你根本沒有辦法更改"},{"start":29316.291,"end":29331.99,"text":"大致這樣齁,就是說我們一般高速公路大概110嘛,快速到90,地方原則是50啦,大概以這樣,但是那50它可以隨地方有時候變40或怎麼樣或調,基本上大概是,如果你開到47你要注意說這裡是50,要注意這個是。"},{"start":29333.792,"end":29345.93,"text":"沒有重點是現在的問題是在於現在所有的地方政府的狀況是非常亂的就像部長你說的你講的是原則"},{"start":29347.298,"end":29370.94,"text":"可是有些會因為地方的狀況跟需求而有所調整可是這個調整沒有人知道沒有人知道我一直強調的是大家都是在不知情的狀況不是故意要去競速不是故意要去飆速而是在整個不知情而且是正常速度正常速度之下"},{"start":29372.509,"end":29397.617,"text":"然後你今天因為我們已經把它變成有一個壓力在上面所以如果你沒有去處理我們問了所有的單位沒有人知道怎麼辦啊因為事權沒有統一啊然後各個公路單位或是各縣市政府大家都不想躺這個渾水那怎麼辦那所有用路人就比較倒楣"},{"start":29398.987,"end":29426.204,"text":"應該在交接的地方要有一個明顯的標誌。不管是地面或是標誌。所以部長去了解一下就是說你要有一個整體就是說了解到底標準要怎麼定到底我們在整個道路規範當中設施對你要在什麼時候跟人家提醒提醒說這裡限數多少"},{"start":29429.953,"end":29441.97,"text":"你沒有的話你已經讓大家陷入到不知情狀況然後莫名其妙收到單子已經要被調扣了這叫不知情而不是故意去競訴或飆訴"},{"start":29443.746,"end":29465.661,"text":"好,我們來找各地方的交通局來討論一下,在每一個交界,比如說速度變化的交界都要很明顯。甚至是你們也要有一個很大的緩衝,你要緩衝讓大家知道,這很重要,否則你這樣一連接明明我就是這樣順順的開,我哪知道下去他減為30。"},{"start":29468.106,"end":29480.801,"text":"70到30他是不是已經要跑反了對啊要擴排了欸要擴排就是說他也不能說開10公尺就變了那個一定要有一個緩衝嘛所以有一個緩衝我強調你要有緩衝這部分部長多久多久要給我們看"},{"start":29488.406,"end":29506.662,"text":"我會請我們的司理趕快跟各地的交通局檢視一下剛才談到尤其像高快速道路下來以後跟地方的這個交界的這些標誌有沒有清楚那我們來找他們還有在各地方政府他們自己所訂的這些限數你要給他們一個標準"},{"start":29508.644,"end":29532.219,"text":"否則說真的,什麼樣的一個條件要到什麼樣的程度,什麼條件要到什麼程度,我覺得這個也應該要有一個方向。那我們所有的開車的人或是騎車的人才會知道。這個再麻煩齁。那我再給這個我們院長看,院長你有沒有看到,這個連你的照片都會被盜用。很困擾對不對,連院長都會被盜用欸。"},{"start":29535.64,"end":29551.919,"text":"所以你看多嚴重,很嚴重對不對?對,這個詐騙的手法不斷的出城翻新,然後而且越來越精緻,我是覺得在打詐的努力上我們需要加強。"},{"start":29553.22,"end":29578.947,"text":"真的要加強但是在網路當中我們怎麼加強我覺得最近大家都會把這個焦點風頭好像全部擠到數位部上面我覺得我們是要重點是要怎麼樣解決問題才是重要我想問部長就是說電子簽章法其實我有提案就是說電子簽章法的部分你認為現在最大的問題是在哪裡"},{"start":29579.85,"end":29596.412,"text":"是。我們本來的電子簽章法20年前的版本我們並沒有說數位簽章就是國家好像發一個印鑑證明的這樣子的一個簽章具有推定為本人簽名的效力。因為這樣的關係所以像Facebook您剛剛看到的或者是YouTube等等的平台"},{"start":29597.032,"end":29615.578,"text":"結果就是說他並沒有用這種高強度的數位簽章導致說任何人他可以換一個人頭帳號再換一個人頭帳號然後每個人都變成跟名人名字聲音差不多或者甚至同名同姓那但是如果有一個類似硬件章這樣新的數位簽章其實除非他名字剛好跟我一樣不然就不能用我的名義去看廣告"},{"start":29616.314,"end":29633.076,"text":"所以就是用高度管理在電子簽章的部分可是問題是現在電子簽章有一個狀態就是事權的問題事權現在似乎在網路廣告的部分是經濟部在管的吧"},{"start":29633.773,"end":29648.205,"text":"其實本來電子簽商法也是經濟部在本部成立之後我們就變成電子簽商法主管機關那至於您剛剛提到網路廣告平台業我們已經正式跟經濟部發函希望他們設立這個業之後讓我們來當主管機關經濟部已經原則同意了"},{"start":29648.447,"end":29677.27,"text":"原則同意,多久?我覺得這是配套啊,這一定要先做啊。你沒有先做,你變成四權不一的話,你執行也會有問題啊。那好,原則同意,那多久要完成這所謂的整個轉接?有一個預告程序,那經濟部跟我們是說大概兩個月左右。因為法案三讀也需要時間嘛,我們現在是大概差不多的時間,應該是可以上路。所以同步,同步。希望。其實電子簽章法它有一個很重大的"},{"start":29678.01,"end":29693.526,"text":"和阻力也就像部長所說的他是用高強度的你要去做簽章的動作那你這個簽章完之後你當然就會有一個認證那這個認證完我就認你像未來這個院長"},{"start":29694.527,"end":29720.958,"text":"他就不會出現在上面了因為不是他認證的所以這個很重要所以速度一定要快尤其很多的民眾真的不知情我還是要講民眾的不知情就會造成很多的麻煩跟困擾所以在網路的整個所謂詐騙的部分除了廣告其實網路詐騙部長我們到底要怎麼辦除了電子簽商法修訂之後"},{"start":29721.918,"end":29745.297,"text":"還有什麼方式可以有效去管理降低網路詐騙?其實電子想法不只能夠用在網路廣告上面。好比像有所謂的C2C就是個人的賣家的這種電商。那以前當然如果公司行號自己開一個電商你可以知道它設立在哪裡。但是如果是個人的拍賣啊或等等那其實透過數位簽章你也可以要求說這個賣家他必須用真實的姓名"},{"start":29746.097,"end":29746.117,"text":"﹚廣告"},{"start":29761.786,"end":29777.385,"text":"所以部長電子簽章法完成之後修法完成之後你認為我們就可以有效去嚇阻所有的網路詐騙嗎?就是說特別是在冒充名人或者冒充知名的這種人物或者直播主或者拍賣"},{"start":29777.927,"end":29802.312,"text":"⋯⋯⋯"},{"start":29815.335,"end":29841.609,"text":"謝謝陳委員停飛的質詢。也謝謝陳院長的備詢。接下來我們請登記第19號羅委員明財質詢。主席、潘院長、這座列席的處列席官員、各位媒體記者、見證小姐大家好。請陳院長。請陳院長備詢。"},{"start":29850.29,"end":29877.971,"text":"市長你好你好在立法院質詢的這個時間是不是這一次是最後一次見面對應該是好像每個從政為官者都希望多做一點事特別是對台灣對中華民國好的事我們看到疫情結束了以後這個海外"},{"start":29878.837,"end":29903.632,"text":"有很多的國家包括新加坡、日本等等、泰國他們的觀光人潮是一波接一波感覺整個觀光整個景氣都復甦動起來了臺灣現在面對的有很多觀光客不如五年前、不如十年前大概"},{"start":29905.114,"end":29933.533,"text":"觀光客考量的問題大概有兩點第一點就是地緣政治的問題他們說那如果到台灣來會不會覺得很害怕會不會隨時有戰爭如果沒有戰爭為什麼一天到晚在兵推所以本席在這裡要請教一下陳院長那麼現在"},{"start":29934.755,"end":29945.086,"text":"台灣會不會推動獨立?會不會再一次來推動所謂的台灣的獨立公投?"},{"start":29946.338,"end":29971.719,"text":"我想委員剛才講的這個觀光其實我要跟委員做報告去年我們定的觀光的目標是600萬人已經圓滿達成今年我們會把這個目標定在這一個疫前的情況到現在為止實際上從這個東南亞或者是東北亞甚至港澳來的人數其實是不少所以並沒有你所講的就是說什麼"},{"start":29973.561,"end":29973.581,"text":"﹚廣告"},{"start":29989.594,"end":30015.441,"text":"我想你剛才問的一個好問題我們現在政府的政策就是希望能夠維持現狀那我們也不希望任何的威權國家是來當方面破壞了這一個現狀的狀況那這樣當方面的破壞實際上使得台海不穩定甚至影響了世界的這個繁榮和和平所以這是我們希望這一些威權獨裁國家"},{"start":30016.561,"end":30017.021,"text":"所以院長所以現階段"},{"start":30045.197,"end":30060.081,"text":"會放棄臺獨的推動我們現在的努力就是維持現狀所以就不搞臺獨了我想臺灣本身就已經是一個主權獨立的國家所以就不會再碰這個所謂的臺獨的公投"},{"start":30061.676,"end":30063.797,"text":"我們現在希望維持和平安定的現狀其實不僅是國內大家的一個多數的認同"},{"start":30087.407,"end":30113.205,"text":"甚至很多海外的一些旅客他們也希望說來臺灣度假嘛是一種輕鬆愉快的事情所以希望能多多做宣導這個很重要剛剛本席講到第二個重要的這個因素就是過去啊臺灣啊讓人家印象最深刻的就是Night Market你知道 院長你有沒有去過寧夏夜市"},{"start":30117.781,"end":30143.757,"text":"我好喜歡台灣的夜市很多的外國朋友說台灣這個unique好棒的地方喔那最重要的是台灣的人熱情第二個食材美食哇好多喔最重要最重要一點是便宜但是院長成績何時啊糟糕現在一碗滷肉飯要多少錢"},{"start":30147.475,"end":30176.77,"text":"我很少吃乳酪飯,抱歉。一碗現在起到60幾塊啦,唉呦,我的天啊,更不要說是炸雞啦,或者是知名的台灣珍珠奶茶。我們現在都很害怕擔心就是過去我們覺得很驕傲,來我來來來我帶你去吃啊走啊走啊。昨天啊,一、兩千塊喔,爸又煮,又高興,但是現在大家喔,帶著蛋啦,"},{"start":30177.898,"end":30199.888,"text":"委員啊,怎麼辦啊?聽說電價要飆漲了。院長啊,電價一飆漲啊,漲個10%、11%,萬物起漲,老百姓受不了啊。所以我在前幾天啊,財委會我提了一個案,就是紅標米酒啊,是暫時凍漲。"},{"start":30202.742,"end":30230.521,"text":"但我覺得財政部部長也從善如流所有的委員都支持就決定動場所以本席在這裡請教院長可不可以考量多數民眾這個生活不容易就如同我們的過去韓市長現在的韓院長所說的這個莫忘世上苦人多其實這句話我在每一次質詢我都放在心裡"},{"start":30231.861,"end":30250.736,"text":"這個世界上臺灣百工百業,現在是非常的辛苦,大家的人民都是嗷嗷待哺。所以本席建議院長第一個要做的就是今年紅包每個人拜託拜託一萬塊不要縮水。"},{"start":30251.687,"end":30262.145,"text":"去年大家領到6000塊 不可能有點感謝 不可能今年每個人發一萬塊表表心意雖然是杯水車薪啊"},{"start":30263.073,"end":30284.576,"text":"因為電價10%一漲下去了以後哇全民哭哈哈每個一萬塊要2350億那去年的稅入稅出營餘今年來算是2670億再有5%要房債所以剩下來只有1500億所以你講一萬塊那個是空口說牌話是完全不可行的事情"},{"start":30285.117,"end":30305.271,"text":"而且政府更重要的是這一些剩下來的錢就來補貼電價啊所以我們給台電啊那你不是說電價不能漲漲了以後物價會上漲那為什麼不來補貼電價呢再來勞保不足所以我們為什麼不補貼勞保呢所以這樣子照顧的人是更多所以政府在"},{"start":30306.172,"end":30328.828,"text":"在這一個行政的時候呢,不會隨隨便便的就說我要花多少錢。這是不負責任的做法。所以院長現在是怕錢不夠是不是?對啊,我們稅入稅出的盈餘今年大概2670億左右。在財委會二、三十年齁,你如果缺錢齁,你來找我。我報幾項給你稍微批評。"},{"start":30330.916,"end":30343.502,"text":"我手上的一堆資料有人檢舉他們自己家裡起碼海外有一兆移政稅換言之這個查下去馬上國庫可以多出五千多億"},{"start":30345.029,"end":30362.534,"text":"你如果有興趣的話缺錢的話你來找我我為全民來找錢我還是希望說每一個人還是可以盡量一個人可以發一萬塊的紅包那因為時間的關係如果有需要的話我絕對不會嘗試我把我30幾年的經驗"},{"start":30370.768,"end":30398.834,"text":"包括國有地、閒置地都可以充分拿來利用。把這些最辛苦的民眾放在我們的心頭上。我們能做多少,多多來為他們來排憂解難。因為今天是交通話題。因為今天是交通話題,本席是地方出身,我還是為地方來請命。第一個就是捷運延伸至深坑。"},{"start":30399.898,"end":30412.568,"text":"延伸至時定地方已經喊了十幾年了包括蘇貞昌蘇院長以前當老縣長的時候沒有人反對到現在還是遙遙無期要拜託陳院長是不是給一點"},{"start":30417.995,"end":30442.41,"text":"關懷的力道讓他速度快一點委員你很清楚這個捷運的這樣的一個推動是地方政府的事情所以呢捷運有任何像是深坑輕軌要推動的話那就新北市就要做可行性的研究那新北市政府現在正在辦可行性的研究那可行性研究以後可行的話那我們就會進入了這一個綜合規劃然後來進入這個"},{"start":30445.692,"end":30453.597,"text":"以後的這一些步驟所以這一個部分我們也樂觀其成說新北市有在做這個可行性的研究"},{"start":30455.145,"end":30479.355,"text":"院長會支持嗎?我還沒講完。這個研究的情形,它是在112年5月1號提給交通部。這個提給交通部以後,我們交通部已經報到行政院來。還有一些意見需要新北市政府來做修正。所以我們現在也在等這個新北市政府的"},{"start":30480.476,"end":30503.876,"text":"來提出這一些修正的報告所以新北市政府快一點我們就可以快一點所以這個事情請委員多多敦促一下新北市政府這一次會期我是財委會的召委我馬上最快的時間來召集各部會召開一個協調會也好或者是合作的會議也好"},{"start":30505.798,"end":30532.313,"text":"從早上開始開會沒有結論出來我們就不下班一次到位一次完成你覺得院長可不可以這樣做你開會是要講深坑輕軌的事情嗎深坑輕軌的事情我們把中央跟地方到底問題出在哪裡如果說是缺錢那就找錢的問題嘛我來想辦法嘛我來拜託行政院一起努力來找錢"},{"start":30533.975,"end":30554.436,"text":"那委員你就吹出一下新北市政府趕快交修正報告來。那我就兩邊一起召集會議來吹出。另外一個就是捷運環狀線南環段的部分,現在開始動工了,但是物價飆漲,好多都是流標流標,不曉得這個速度可不可以快一點。"},{"start":30555.417,"end":30574.633,"text":"現在因為臺北市政府現在因為經費不足,他最近有提一個計畫就是北環南環加起來還有包括其他總共要增加700多億的預算那目前我們就行那個我們的審議研究就是說是可不可以規則一地方比如說這個"},{"start":30576.015,"end":30604.514,"text":"﹚議員"},{"start":30604.614,"end":30630.899,"text":"因為以前是大選區,汐止也是我的選區同樣一個時間20年喊了半天我們安坑縣在這邊要謝謝相關人員謝謝部長安坑縣輕軌在去年就完工通車了結果到現在喊了20年的前運西東縣現在還是遙遙無期我覺得看了好難過我真的是為汐止人"},{"start":30631.874,"end":30635.517,"text":"另外一個就是有關新店安坑地區安城快速道路以及華城快速道路希望"},{"start":30655.18,"end":30668.86,"text":"這個路就是差一小段安城快速道路因為當地有很多的居民幾萬再加上很多的學校上下班堵車堵得很厲害小小一段5公里"},{"start":30669.687,"end":30688.386,"text":"可是打通了以後卻讓整個地方交通更快速更便捷所以在這裡也要拜託陳院長可以多多與關心經費不多30億我很關心但是新北市政府的關心更重要這個計畫是新北市政府"},{"start":30688.686,"end":30713.944,"text":"要來推動那新北市政府如果不來努力推動不提出計畫我們沒有辦法補助所以請委員還是再推出一下新北市政府加油加油加油好不好那我就來再召開一次那個不斷電的24小時開會把這些事情具體的落實另外一個央北環塊跟國道高架段的這個問題"},{"start":30715.265,"end":30735.501,"text":"因為都市計畫的發展,央北14張未來會多2萬戶,交通勢必會造成很大的困境,所以未雨綢繆拜託這個部分也開始左手動起來開始思考。因為時間的關係我可能有部分會"},{"start":30736.414,"end":30738.115,"text":"謝謝羅偉明、柴子勳、謝謝陳院長的備詢。"},{"start":30766.057,"end":30770.423,"text":"接下來我們請登記第20號賴委員瑞隆質詢。再請陳院長備詢。"},{"start":30786.28,"end":30807.171,"text":"院長好,其實明天也是香港重要的一天,就是說香港離台灣很近,但是香港的整個這一段時間以來的變化,其實台灣高度關注。那最近看到這個香港基本法23條的部分的快速的去修訂,那明天來實施了。那我個人其實"},{"start":30808.857,"end":30826.744,"text":"認為這對香港來說是自由人權上面很沉重的一天。那院長怎麼看待?我其實對香港一直寄予惑望,因為香港算是在亞洲地區很早的一個自由民主法治的一個城市,可是越來越背離了這個道路。"},{"start":30827.344,"end":30827.364,"text":"﹚廣告"},{"start":30842.978,"end":30843.919,"text":"香港過去的東方明珠這樣的一個叫自由經濟的一個體制"},{"start":30860.558,"end":30860.978,"text":"﹚第11屆第6次會議"},{"start":30876.471,"end":30900.275,"text":"危害國安甚至於境外的干預這個都是很抽象的一些概念過去我們看過中國一個專制的很容易變法對就是說如果這是在一個民主國家當然這些可能大家比較明確一點因為這都要很明確的但是在中國香港現在一國兩制下的時候中國這樣的處理方式我們過去看到不管是從這個李明哲或者是傅查等等案件"},{"start":30901.021,"end":30903.023,"text":"香港這樣的狀況其實會讓大家非常擔憂"},{"start":30922.169,"end":30938.87,"text":"現在很多的訴求所謂的一個中國所謂一國兩制所謂這個九二共識的部分這個臺灣人民還值得相信嗎我向臺灣人民一定要提高警覺而且要以香港為界我們知道如果臺灣沒有自由民主"},{"start":30939.37,"end":30939.59,"text":"﹚發言委員﹚"},{"start":30968.738,"end":30971.775,"text":"這一個區域才會越來越穩定、越和平、越繁榮。"},{"start":30972.706,"end":31001.207,"text":"我們期盼的是不只香港,我們現在中國大陸其實都應該走向自由民主這樣的路線來前進,這個對於整個人權,對於整個長遠的發展,對人民的福祉都是一個穩定的結構,那我認為其實應該都要朝這個方向,但是我認為內部也更應該團結,一次對外,對於威權專制這樣一個體制的時候,其實它有很多的一些意圖說內部應該更團結,朝夕應該更團結來一次對外,我認為才會讓世界各國看到,讓中共看到說台灣在這一塊的一個決心。"},{"start":31006.511,"end":31027.648,"text":"臺灣每年還是有相當多人去到香港,我今天早上也聽到江部長也有提醒去香港必須要很謹慎小心。院長有沒有怎樣的呼籲,如果對臺灣人民從今天開始實施,未來如果到香港去的話有沒有什麼要特別要注意?我想因為臺灣的人民也蠻多要到香港,"},{"start":31028.448,"end":31044.328,"text":"香港基本法23條明天要實施所以我在這裡呼籲臺灣的人民要去香港的時候務必要特別注意到自己的安全那一定要確認以後才去香港我想這一件事情"},{"start":31044.548,"end":31044.568,"text":"當然"},{"start":31073.666,"end":31089.882,"text":"再回到今天交通的主題其實高雄在10年前有邀請小鴨到展出其實香港10年前也有高雄10年前有兩隻都很成功10年後香港也展出了兩隻高雄也再展出了兩隻"},{"start":31090.917,"end":31116.854,"text":"但是就是都是一個很成功的一個展出那對於高雄來說這10年來其實也不只10年很長遠努力其實創造很多的效益10年的時候那時候當然我在擔任新聞局長的時候就在推這件事情其實有很大的效益10年後高雄市政府期盼市長更大力的推動其實效益持續擴大那這個也是中央地方大家共同合作的結果那我想講的是也希望未來包括院長跟部長能夠繼續支持高雄的這些產業的發展當然"},{"start":31118.155,"end":31118.375,"text":"院長去看過小鴨的那個嗎?"},{"start":31146.02,"end":31171.836,"text":"我沒有去高雄想像不過我很多的朋友還有年輕朋友都會到高雄去看音樂會阿等等高雄確實是已經不一樣了脫胎放骨跟我小時候的高雄完全不一樣所以我是以高雄為榮了院長是高雄部長也長期在高雄服務我想都共同為高雄會付出很多那我想高雄的努力需要大家共同支持那接下來我想講的是高雄機場的部分其實去年在這個場地上面半年前阿也跟"},{"start":31173.257,"end":31198.956,"text":"議員：部長也談過就是高雄的國際機場的航班航點恢復的太慢半年前的時候跟院長部長有請求要求是在能夠在這個年底前達到八成的目標那當時的時候部長是跟我說這個會努力來做但是到了今年的上半年的時候到目前為止都還只有73%左右而已那事實上相較於這個桃園的部分我們看一下桃園的"},{"start":31200.397,"end":31207.322,"text":"目前新加坡跟沖繩已經恢復了接下來我們就是日本的那個雜黃跟熊本這是尤其熊本是剛剛施政委員長上半年能不能全數恢復"},{"start":31224.609,"end":31239.449,"text":"我們努力看起來會有點問題但是盡量比如說朝九成我希望院長部長全力來支持這個對於南部的發展很重要不要讓很多南部的鄉親還要到桃園去才能夠做很多的不管是甚至很多"},{"start":31240.529,"end":31241.55,"text":"我們一起來努力那我想"},{"start":31264.33,"end":31290.276,"text":"繼續發展高雄的好的觀光產業讓南部的鄉親有更便利的商務觀光的這些的一些好不好這對南部的發展很重要對南北的平衡也很重要在也把握時間也謝謝院長大力支持然後前鎮漁港這個八十億利潤的院長的大力支持我們看到日本的豐洲市場其實有軌道建設不管從原先的竹地到豐洲你到了做捷運就可以到達這些重要的一個漁市場"},{"start":31290.876,"end":31297.87,"text":"那同樣的前陣漁港在整個立任院長的支持下的時候也花了80億來做整個全面的一些整整"},{"start":31298.649,"end":31327.285,"text":"整治啦齁那他其中還有另外一個重要因素是交通上必須要更加的便利那現在捷運的黃線已經開始在進行也謝謝整個行政院的大力支持那到了前鎮高中站這邊那其實再接兩站就可以進到了前鎮漁港那也希望院長跟部長可行性評估已經其中報告出來去年出來了那可行性評估在今年上半年應該會出來也希望院長跟部長繼續來支持前鎮漁港支持捷運黃線延伸到前鎮漁港"},{"start":31327.665,"end":31353.525,"text":"比照日本的豐洲族立項有一個很便利的一個交通發展讓整個漁港的經濟生活更加速來發展。我們希望高雄市政府趕快提出那個可行性的評估報告。那出來之後的話院長跟部長會全力支持。我覺得很多的重大建設都是百年建設來看其實現在如果做了一些決定就會可惜就像當年高鐵如果有從左營到"},{"start":31354.502,"end":31373.201,"text":"澳洲車站的話那相信對南高雄的發展更便利。臺北就會有山站了那高雄當年的如果有更有遠見去做決策當然那是另外一個這個前朝的時代做的啦但我們就不變但是我是說國家重大建設要更有前瞻性不要未來30年50年後來發現說當年這個決策如果做的話恐怕會對"},{"start":31377.104,"end":31404.873,"text":"當時會完全的不一樣的一個發展那我們希望重大的國家重大建設這是要中央大力來推動我們也希望更有遠見更有格局來思考好不好請院長再大力支持部長大力支持6月提出來啦出來之後我們也希望好不好這個地下的黃線的延伸請部長院長大力來支持好謝謝再來另外一件也是重要的建設啦齊金其實非常多外國人包括國人都很喜歡去旅遊那他其實是"},{"start":31405.493,"end":31428.265,"text":"過去它其實是半島它不是離島但是因為開高雄港的關係把它截斷之後它變成是一個離島了那現在我們是靠第一條的過港隧道在延伸那那個年限已經接近了那我們有做了一些延壽的工程那但是第二條過港隧道也應該要儘速來做啟動因為第一條年限已經快到那我們延壽了那第二條可行性也是已經規劃出來"},{"start":31429.426,"end":31453.212,"text":"那我也希望這一條未來的這個第二過港隧道能夠規劃讓其經常有說講到很多人講說他像新加坡的聖桃沙一樣那但是如果聖桃沙也是有很便利的軌道運出去那如果我們更有格局更遠近協助不只是第二過港隧道過去同時間未來規劃比如說輕軌等等能夠進去的話"},{"start":31453.792,"end":31471.976,"text":"他對當地的這個綠碳對當地的這個觀光的發展都有相當大的幫助那他是一個非常有潛力的地方他是高雄最早發展的地方有最早的媽祖廟有古老的宗教砲台等等的所以他其實是非常具有潛力的地方"},{"start":31472.396,"end":31493.254,"text":"我也希望院長、部長能夠大力支持可行性評估過了之後,也能夠來支持這樣的第二過往隧道建設。院長可以嗎?可以,我想就把這個可行性研究趕快完成,很重要。因為他現在出來大概是兩個路廊,一個是從廓建路,一個是漁港路經過。"},{"start":31494.468,"end":31516.698,"text":"那也希望院長到處所出來的時候,院長能夠大力來支持好嗎?好。他延受到138年,就是現在舊的要用到138年,所以他動工我們初步評估是10年到15年前開始動工。對我知道,就是說他其實第一條是有經過延受啦,延長壽命一段時間了,但是延長了之後他就靠這一條而已。"},{"start":31517.498,"end":31517.518,"text":"拜訪議員"},{"start":31541.784,"end":31543.546,"text":"這個對於高雄未來的持續的把人才留在高雄也是一個重要的一個過程。"},{"start":31560.165,"end":31580.199,"text":"就是他大概138年前10年跟15年就要開始興建了,這個時間要抓準抓準這個時間。我知道,不過都是要希望能夠提早好不好。對,現在的程序就要開始走。我希望都能夠提早啦,很多事情都是要提早,我還是要講第一過港隧道的年限其實已經快要到,是我們延壽他的延長了,但是我講的是"},{"start":31581.52,"end":31602.919,"text":"當地的大家都還是會擔憂,另一方面我也希望大眾運輸的思考能夠盡快的進去,好不好?這對於旗津的發展,你可以想像嗎?幾乎萬一有任何一些狀況的時候,旗津就形成是一個孤島,沒辦法出來。它要出來還要靠著做這個渡輪才要出來的。所以我一直說,當時是開高雄港才形成這樣的一個狀況嘛,我希望政府能夠更給予支持啦。"},{"start":31604.122,"end":31606.644,"text":"我希望能夠思考迄今國家風景這樣的概念"},{"start":31630.247,"end":31650.572,"text":"﹚議員"},{"start":31651.177,"end":31679.28,"text":"我想這一個部分我們還是就像剛才的一樣看高雄市政府來評估看看他的情況,因為有...院長現在是高雄市政府負責,我只希望交通部公安局主的力道能夠進來來協助。對,如果需要交通局這邊來協助幫忙的地方。我希望這個...那最後一個還剩下一點點時間的時候,高雄的新航廈,機場的新航廈第一期大概到這個原先規劃到20..."},{"start":31680.681,"end":31682.863,"text":"謝謝賴委員瑞榮的質詢,也謝謝陳院長的備詢。接下來向院會報告登記第21號"},{"start":31704.554,"end":31728.665,"text":"郭國文委員．第22號黃捷委員．第23號楊耀委員．第24號王美惠委員．其四位委員的質詢均以書面提出．請行政院書面答覆．並列入記錄刊登公報。在接下來我們請登記第25號盧明哲委員質詢。"},{"start":31739.473,"end":31743.758,"text":"呃謝謝呃韓院長有請我們行政院陳院長請陳院長備詢呃陳院長我看到那個我們王部長可以一起上來齁首先呢請交通部"},{"start":31757.152,"end":31781.382,"text":"從去年疫情趨緩之後這個旅遊完全開放不光是國內的旅遊到國外的旅遊但我們發覺從今年開始蠻明顯的原本我們在國旅的很多的觀光業界各個產業鏈的期待憑良因獎比現在會覺得說你看到這上面嗎"},{"start":31782.602,"end":31802.619,"text":"我們青年假還沒到那目前的一個初步的一個報導我希望能夠更好大概定房率到4成5我們希望能夠再高在春節旅遊的時候那已經過了嘛大概定房率大概到6成那其他點點滴滴就不講有些相關產業觀光的一些店家他們也不斷的一個反應"},{"start":31803.66,"end":31803.86,"text":"我請部長來回答"},{"start":31833.315,"end":31852.132,"text":"事實上現在國旅在那個假日還是很熱我跟這個委員報告那當然就是說冬天比較差是在離島的部分那前陣子我們跟離島幾個委員討論怎麼樣來做一些促銷比如說這個硬具買一送一等等的這個促銷也在做"},{"start":31853.069,"end":31874.146,"text":"那當然就是說因為國境開放以後有一些人會往國外來跑所以我們跟這個所有的觀光業在談就是說你的吸引力一定要這個能夠吸引大家願意留在國內那這部分包括我們觀光署的相關的建設計畫包括這些國境面歷緊急的計畫、風管處的相關的計畫也都在進行"},{"start":31879.15,"end":31895.058,"text":"你剛剛講這個我也非常認同因為疫情的時間我們編了很多的預算也投入了我們當時的觀光局、交通部很多的預算有些是直接希望促銷國旅的有很多是硬體的一個改善"},{"start":31895.598,"end":31919.572,"text":"那時候觀光局局長也再三不是光答應我跟委員說我們正好像各國一樣能夠藉這個時間把所有的基礎設施景點相關設施把它弄好可是我們看到最近在出國那個熱潮有沒有看到幾則報導我心裡是覺得雖然有點不服氣可是人家講的又好像是真的他說日本經過這個兩年多的疫情"},{"start":31921.773,"end":31950.856,"text":"他說已經進化升級,國旅還在原地踏步。我講的是非常廣泛的,有私部門有公部門的。你對於這句話這個報導,就是國際的很多的一個吸引觀光客在他疫情的階段他的基礎建設甚至觀光想方設法讓他提升。就是希望以後之後他能夠在世界的市場"},{"start":31951.876,"end":31970.855,"text":"槍得頭籌,你覺得臺灣這個有沒有落後?院長要不要講一下?我想這個要促進這個國旅,實際上中央政府的推動當然是很重要,我們觀光署很重要,但是地方政府也很重要。剛才賴瑞榮委員就提到,在像高雄,"},{"start":31972.778,"end":31987.488,"text":"國旅來講的話那高雄每次音樂會的時候不得了很多很多所以我們也希望說中央跟地方一起配合來發展這個地方的觀光的特色那像高雄這樣的辦了很多的這個重要的音樂會的時候"},{"start":31990.07,"end":32014.402,"text":"國旅的部分就會增加那這個確實是需要中央跟地方一起來努力的。好院長但是我們希望說整體啦各個城市各有特色各有想法各有努力真的很棒那我們想整個我們居然觀光局生屬了大家都對它有期待我相信院長也是那現在我請教一下這個是今年我們希望"},{"start":32017.222,"end":32032.793,"text":"國人希望能夠旅遊,但如果國人旅遊目前還沒有辦法達到這樣的熱潮,我們希望國外來臺的旅客,不管是商務也好、純觀光的人都希望多一點。那這個部長特別有說過,今天的目標是1200萬人。"},{"start":32035.56,"end":32050.039,"text":"那你那時候也說那時候當然因為之前嘛希望那個陸客呢也能夠來台啦如果沒有辦法沒有辦法開放陸客的話也會持續想辦法努力啊那現在看起來齁看起來這個"},{"start":32052.125,"end":32056.949,"text":"的確當時觀光署1200萬裡面大概有200到250萬是入客當然就是說我們去年大概是這個狀況600萬有100萬的入客結果我們最後是648萬"},{"start":32081.674,"end":32107.719,"text":"當然我們目標是這樣那當然就是說入客能早一點開放來那當然這個目標早一點達到那如果沒有的話我們繼續來努力目前還是這個目標還沒有修正大概以這個就是扣掉入客的部分大概是1000萬不過你現在1月到2月幫你統計了118萬平均大概50接近60萬如果這樣12個月的話我再預估可能700到800萬"},{"start":32109.119,"end":32137.535,"text":"所以我覺得這是設定目標我們在這裡不是吐槽要努力要努力嘛如果現在是七八百萬到底該怎麼樣去補足那我那一天聽到了這個院長應該你也知道吧我們一年大概有500到600萬轉機的旅客那他的免簽證的觀光時間怎麼訂定這個我們近期內也會來做個敲定讓轉機成為觀光客的一個來源"},{"start":32139.244,"end":32166.983,"text":"說真的那天聽到我們副院長的他這一席宣布其實我個人是比較我很贊成我也很興奮為什麼大家都知道轉機客旅遊因為時間有限如果真的可乘的話機場附近的城市機場附近的景點是優先獲利我相信桃園機場桃園當然我覺得這如果可以開放很重要往北可能到盧竹新北大家都會在第一線受惠"},{"start":32167.543,"end":32186.274,"text":"那這個部分一個月過去了嘛2月22號那現在3月22號那院長那個因為這個他不是交通部的真的跨很多的一個單位的那這個部分院長你知道這個宣布嗎我我我記得當天是我我也在"},{"start":32187.355,"end":32193.818,"text":"當時副院長是希望625萬但是在跨部會包括外交包括移民署討論的時候認為說有一些轉機進來如果免簽證會有一些問題所以這個問題現在還沒有處理好"},{"start":32214.548,"end":32220.873,"text":"因為簽證的部分,免簽證有牽涉到很多課題,尤其過去沒有這個不能都一定要簽證的國家,你要不要在機場讓他直接免簽證寄來。這個這個我在那個會議長我召開會再討論。"},{"start":32238.647,"end":32256.882,"text":"這個還在研議中。以112年來說我們轉聚率客到達625萬當然未來是怎麼樣不清楚但至少幾百萬人五六百萬可能是一個可預期的客戶的一個來源那當然有些人很快轉聚他不可能會出來嘛所以我拜託你們趕快去研究讓"},{"start":32258.503,"end":32284.018,"text":"現在我們覺得4小時之內我覺得對於交通部也是要看一下像章宜機場他們在機場那個領域裡面那個小城市的觀光很熱門有些瀑布有些什麼綠袋很多兒童園區他有些收門票的在裡面就有產值不是存給你觀光的當然你說那免稅店大家都有我倒是覺得一、二行家看起來沒機會了"},{"start":32285.078,"end":32312.037,"text":"三行下三行下因為還有時間我是真的是建議就是說這轉機客要去吸引到不一定時間短的他進不了城市四小時之內的我覺得如果我們有一些像世界特色機場的他去那邊都必定要去看我倒是覺得這個部分我在這裡建議你在三行下能夠考量有降德的室內的包括在進在那個機場"},{"start":32313.098,"end":32341.938,"text":"這個小城市裡面的觀光那8小時有可能甚至8小時以上的我們鄰近的城市是非常期待非常深啊因為我們在判斷機場最重要直接的交通工具就是機場捷運機捷機捷不管從A12、A13一航廈、二航廈甚至他們能夠搭一站、兩站搭幾站很快半個小時抵達的部分坦白往南就是"},{"start":32342.638,"end":32342.658,"text":"﹚廣告"},{"start":32360.555,"end":32361.976,"text":"一步一步向前走"},{"start":32381.462,"end":32409.14,"text":"院長多費心好不好?這個部分我剛才已經講過這個已經請政府院長來召開相關各部會的這個會議那這個也正在演繹當中所以我相信這一個政府院長的這個會我們會繼續請他再來推動那剛才您講的這一些構想是不錯那現在就是我們有很多的需要解決的這一些"},{"start":32409.81,"end":32409.93,"text":"好的"},{"start":32418.285,"end":32441.518,"text":"這個未來這個機場捷運的承載的功能越來越多了當然疫情之後乘客的回流第二個當然行政院我們T-PASS很多的民眾通勤他也選擇了集結所以目前的整個這個承載的人次是快速的成長第三個當然機場國門他原本的功能那現在我們預計"},{"start":32442.739,"end":32472.739,"text":"議員．"},{"start":32472.919,"end":32498.492,"text":"因應未來的人潮需要9列的直達6列的普通。目前溝通了好幾次,行政院級我們也介入了,說大概中央目前的評估,雖然還沒有定案,還沒有確定,大概是給三分之二,直達6列,普通4列。經費原本大約90億,現在變成60億。"},{"start":32501.593,"end":32520.652,"text":"那目前為止我相信院長你也知道我們副院長也一直在協調這件事情那這61要怎麼補助啊這個院長這邊可不可以多幫忙一點我想這一個補助的情況還是會跟地方政府再來協調"},{"start":32521.593,"end":32541.798,"text":"那這一件事情我跟您報告一下實際上我們副院長跟我們桃園市政府有很密集在溝通至於這個金額是多少當然他們還會在商量的過程可是我們會盡可能的來協助這個集結購車這個我們確實是有這樣的希望他們也能夠提出計畫"},{"start":32548.399,"end":32574.065,"text":"政策指示盡可能因為我覺得未來是不是總共要15例那我覺得至少第一階段大家達成共識先上因為這個車從訂購到真正製造在進場都好幾年之後了搞不好我們已經這個轉機客都已經進來了所以我們當然希望第一階段能夠快一點所以剛剛院長特別說我們盡力幫忙當然我們也知道嘛有些道理我們在評估的時候那一天"},{"start":32574.825,"end":32574.845,"text":"直達車"},{"start":32586.667,"end":32611.889,"text":"我們這個行政院跟交通部認為跟中央政策相關地方是承載了中央的一個國門的責任因為主要國境進出它的一個重要的交通工具它就進進出出搞不好也不到我們城市裡面來這個部分中央補助84%就得補助大部分因為我覺得這合理啦真的合理因為有些人拿行李就去上飛機了也不到桃園也不到新北"},{"start":32614.844,"end":32630.6,"text":"所以部長我要問一下最主要84%的來源他是承載了國進出入所以才這樣考量的是不是?你們在內部的討論是這樣嗎?對 這個政務院長有開過會就是直達車比較像是國家的門面在進出"},{"start":32631.946,"end":32656.613,"text":"那這個普通車比較地方,像台北捷運地方性的,所以他現在就是用直達車84%,那剛才談到60億,算起來就大概30億了。好,這個普通車,因為你們普通車變零趴,零趴的原因是你們的成績啦,現在三個城市嘛,桃園、新北、台北,你們自己每一站來來去去,人民走動的過程,我理解啦。"},{"start":32657.213,"end":32675.251,"text":"其實這個推斷的邏輯我是真的是可以接受如果普通車真的是這樣的話但是我是覺得這個思考有一點北向思考就是說我有台北的觀點因為我直達車目前主要是跑台北新北停兩站就直接殺進機場"},{"start":32677.192,"end":32694.128,"text":"主要當然現在一天幾十班裡面有給大概8到9個列車也讓他跑到中壢金浦站是有但是絕大部分都在臺北出發那首都我沒有意見我沒有意見首都是這樣的"},{"start":32695.009,"end":32710.985,"text":"那可是南向思考我們要往南邊走的人呢?這些旅客呢?或者國人或者旅客要從機場南端要進國門有沒有用機捷這件事啦?所以我現在在討論這個事情因為A23站是中壢火車站"},{"start":32718.687,"end":32745.998,"text":"難得一條季節連串接了臺北火車站是頭尾巴到了中壢火車站這兩個很特別可是我跟你講臺北火車站有直搭車中壢沒有直搭車對不對就算我們現在在幾年蓋好之後中壢沒有直搭車因為訊號的關係我們在前面兩站就用手動切就切了車沒有辦法直接衝進來所以他只能"},{"start":32746.818,"end":32746.838,"text":"﹚一、"},{"start":32760.776,"end":32761.277,"text":"拜託到高鐵"},{"start":32778.678,"end":32778.698,"text":"﹚廣告"},{"start":32798.366,"end":32812.9,"text":"但如果證明是有我這邊拜託院長部長因為還要繼續討論他確實有承載承載的實際的數據呢那不是說故事中立站還沒通喔中立站一通我相信火車串接的人會更多現況"},{"start":32815.239,"end":32826.866,"text":"就是我南端從青埔到中壢A22還沒到火山前一站在整個中壢市區跟青埔地區這一個月我抓一個月2月21號到3月21號到昨天為止這幾個站進站人數51萬8"},{"start":32834.409,"end":32859.686,"text":"進站就從那邊跑進來,進站要去什麼目的地呢?都有,去台北也有。但是他們的目的地是在A12、13跟14A機場的那個旅館的,總共是19萬7千多人。也就是說具體的數字,很多人搭乘普通車,因為他沒有直搭車,有38%的人就是直接去機場。"},{"start":32861.573,"end":32884.616,"text":"所以我要拜託這個數據我想私下我再給交通部我再給行政院你們參考一下我在講的是普通車也承載了南向我們的國人旅客直接要去機場的這樣的一個國家的責任所以我覺得應該要給予補助這個部分如果數字是這樣院長你是不是能夠至少不能是0%吧"},{"start":32886.257,"end":32910.865,"text":"我想這個謝謝委員跟捷運公司調出這個資料因為我們以往沒有這樣的一個數據那這個數據當然也就請這個桃園市政府來提供在會議上讓這個政府院長也能夠納入考慮那確實你如果說是這樣的話那就要看說哪一些我不曉得他這個數據做的是從"},{"start":32915.666,"end":32933.413,"text":"是從哪裡進站的?清普地區A17是清普有三站清普地區有中壢和清普跟高鐵一直到中壢市區從清普去的話對清普到中壢市區上車要往北向坐到站點下車有這麼多這樣的好不好?"},{"start":32934.013,"end":32938.816,"text":"我只提供一個意見,你們可以吊一整年的好不好,但是拜託普通車不要零趴,他也承載著國家責任,這是我今天"},{"start":32953.564,"end":32977.395,"text":"拜託你們,可以嗎?給部長做一個回應那個委員你知道機場捷運當時是兩段連起來的,一個是這個紫線是當時的桃園的紫線,一個是機場到台北的通勤路線,現在精神是這樣,這是地區的捷運。謝謝你,院長都說要考慮了,就拜託你回去考慮一下,因為我時間不太夠了。接下來要請教一個重大的問題"},{"start":32978.697,"end":33002.267,"text":"因為是我在上屆立委這個一上任的時候主要關心的問題一樣是我們桃園鐵路地下化的一個問題這是三年前110年3月整整三年前提出總諮詢去跟交通部那當時我記得應該已經是王部長那我就只想問一件事因為當時的這個部分是走到這個工程"},{"start":33004.765,"end":33024.235,"text":"已經細色發包了。工程動工預計是111年4月,現在的時間點是113年的3月。我想請教一下,這樣的好不好,因為院長可能軌道工程他管太多,我想請教部長。那我就想說民眾人在問我啊,完工日期"},{"start":33025.865,"end":33026.025,"text":"應該各加3年"},{"start":33048.7,"end":33059.076,"text":"各加三年。原因第一個是桃園站的文資,第二個因為現在憑證的延伸要放到這一期裡面,所以應該各加三年。再加三年?"},{"start":33059.076,"end":33060.819,"text":"各加三年,對。你老實啊,那我可以下課了。"},{"start":33064.131,"end":33090.604,"text":"但是拜託不要再給我這個報告你說今天再加三年跟我講真心話可是三個禮拜你就沒跟我講真心話好啦那今天的情況那你也知道就現在施工進度只有憑證開工啦就總工程主體工程他的全工程進度0.18而已啦距離還很遠啦這我沒有要怪誰啦就是事實的資料讓民眾期待"},{"start":33091.604,"end":33107.092,"text":"最大是在憑證這個臺灣市政府認為要放到這一期那憑證剛剛從可行性開始你其他都在施工會被他偷到被他偷到其實今天一次反正有那個紀錄立法院都有紀錄一次講清楚憑證"},{"start":33109.053,"end":33119.63,"text":"的站當然大家知道會延期嘛可是我們講先不要講憑證好不好先不要講憑證發生的事大家看前面三個是當時承諾108年世衛會完工的"},{"start":33122.756,"end":33145.841,"text":"桃園內立中立三站說我們118年會完工的現在發生什麼事呢當然我也謝謝鐵道局努力啦終於發包出去了啦所以我倒不是在有發包出去不錯了但是現在發包出去我們一看工期嘛以桃園站預計7月開工你們跟他合約簽訂的日曆天的工期嘛公共工程委員委員會也在這裡嘛"},{"start":33146.861,"end":33169.738,"text":"兩千四百六十四天啊將近六年多的時間啊我就簡單就是沒有任何的理由再來常常不可規則的一天都不延也要到一百二十年對不對那終於也是啊到一百二十年五月所以你的意思說一百一十八年本來的你加三年所以我就沒有意見啊就比如說"},{"start":33171.107,"end":33182.804,"text":"一定會有還要工程一定還會演一點尤其桃園站現在有三大不確定會造成比較大延期的因素第一個就是您剛剛很了解的憑證難言"},{"start":33186.069,"end":33210.367,"text":"1.2公里那個比較嚴重因為現在修改計畫之後還要重新環境評估、環差分析再來走一遍其實我聽了有一點頭痛那第二個是桃園站的文資問題文資的問題但是我覺得要積極啦要積極那當然第三個其實就是經費的問題"},{"start":33213.171,"end":33238.935,"text":"我要拜託現在這是另外一個角度來反戰現在這個問題啊。現在台灣鐵路地下化現在發生什麼事啊?其實我們最近都在問欸內地戰還有三個戰還沒超標出去嘛。內地戰我們台灣醫院戰跟那個新北的鳳鳴戰我一直在問說欸四個戰已經終於今年標出去了另外三個怎麼不標不標不標?結果私下了解沒錢了。"},{"start":33239.721,"end":33261.584,"text":"沒錢的原因呢?我們只有1048億吧?院長部長你們看一下下面幾個數據就是我們系社PCM大約框了21用地費框66億然後臨時佔臨時工程主體工程還有一些監照總共加起來"},{"start":33262.125,"end":33263.026,"text":"平政要重新提一個修正計劃"},{"start":33284.346,"end":33311.252,"text":"他現在要把內力站、陶衣站、鳳鳴站整個包進去啊包進去啊去走一個奇幻旅遊啊奇幻旅遊就一直等等等等其他三個本來沒問題的嘛本來沒問題只是差錢但你把它包進去他就要等環差分析他要等重新國發會整個繞一圈因為我很多工程繞幾圈我都清楚我很害怕可是第一個"},{"start":33312.608,"end":33332.964,"text":"原來的1046億現在幾乎很明確會變成1500億以上那這個部分經費會不會有問題?這個部長覺得?包括南沿還有包括整個物價上漲的部分我們初估會增加700億"},{"start":33334.554,"end":33336.036,"text":"施政計畫現在已經完成了,準備來報施政計畫"},{"start":33349.488,"end":33377.837,"text":"所以增加700億因為我這邊算就至少是500億啦所以你說真的700億我是覺得就一次把大概的可能情況講清楚這種東西不要微調也許民眾覺得哇怎麼那麼多但是事實上大家在這個領域提出具體的核算的數字因為我問鐵道局局長他實不講欸他沒有吃那個老實素的藥所以他實不講他說可能一毛沒增加哇靠"},{"start":33379.198,"end":33407.817,"text":"這個但是今天把這個事情講清楚所以現在要非常積極我要拜託院長要不管未來因為要扯到國發會又要再繞一圈又要我們行政院我想現在可以去做的可以去評估的我要拜託要簡化鳳鳴站、陶藝站、內地的整個過程不要讓他們再受折磨一次大家排隊能不能讓他們先排出來這三案先走然後憑證延伸案"},{"start":33408.837,"end":33417.783,"text":"因為他還要環差分析嘛,他的速度會慢一點。這個部分是不是請你們考量,能夠分工,分別來做一個處理,可以嗎?"},{"start":33418.669,"end":33430.673,"text":"你意思是說分段通徹的意思是嗎?分段嗎?不是啦,我說工程啦。我們現在就花包,現在該走就走。我知道啦,你現在內力,你整個繞完之後,環差分析我跟你講一年啦。"},{"start":33438.735,"end":33459.034,"text":"一年之後你才讓他發包。我跟你講喔,其他的工程是含有暫提的喔,含有暫提的。它的複雜性不像平正延伸工程,它只是地下讓軌道拉長,它相對的工程、工法、工期會減少很多。所以你不能讓他們弄在一起。到最後,"},{"start":33459.674,"end":33477.341,"text":"那到最後不好意思喔最後完最後那個憑證會先那個地下會先挖好那有什麼用所以我拜託院長部長我今天講這個拜託你這三個工期都要很久一定要讓他們先一個單獨一個案子先跑讓他們先發包憑證要經過這個"},{"start":33481.824,"end":33483.505,"text":"楊局長是不是這樣?你好像臉色不太同意喔?"},{"start":33498.663,"end":33523.34,"text":"拜託啊這三個只欠東風的錢的案子讓他們先跑啦趕快找到錢先發包另外一個還有很多行政程序要經過發會的那我們在另外的行政來推動好不好我就做這樣的一個拜託也希望院長能夠再多幫忙好謝謝非常謝謝魯明哲委員的質詢也謝謝陳院長的備詢"},{"start":33527.301,"end":33544.567,"text":"接下來登記第26號賴委員會員,登記第27號林委員楚英,登記第28號王委員世堅,三位委員之質詢均以書面提出。"},{"start":33545.972,"end":33568.301,"text":"請行政院書面答覆並列入記錄刊登公報。報院會交通組織質詢已詢答完畢。非常感謝陳院長以及相關部會首長列席答詢。三月26日星期二上午9時繼續開會進行司法及法治組織質詢。現在休息。"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}