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謝謝主席我是不是再請我們的這個部長 洪部長謝謝立委員"},{"start":19.455,"end":48.822,"text":"部長在你的臉書說上週我一上任以後我就指示同仁我們必須要針對舊安基金的資用進行檢討那你指示同仁針對這個舊安基金進行檢討你自己有沒有先針對舊安基金裡面所編列的這個計畫項目稍微看一下有哪些你是你認為說這些違規的資用項目不適當的資用項目不適當的計畫你覺得哪幾項是很特別很深刻的"},{"start":49.183,"end":49.785,"text":"提出來討論事實上也應該一併要檢討的不是只有媒體講的這一些演唱會"},{"start":55.273,"end":82.762,"text":"或是水電費或是什麼的你有沒有其他印象深刻的跟林委員報告其實其實我要求上週其實就要求同仁檢討我們其實確實現在看到的狀況是就是說他有他必須經過的程序的機制我是問你有沒有其他項目啦有不用講這麼多因為我身體不太舒服你講太久我等一下又要吐了不是因為你講話是我真的真的暈眩想吐"},{"start":83.516,"end":95.584,"text":"好,比方說我們其實看到勞動部下面有一間會議室的設備採購跟裝修那這個都講過了那你還有其他的項目2200萬其實我們陸陸續續真的都是陸陸續續在清查編列的不合時宜不應該編到這個救安基金來的"},{"start":110.43,"end":132.721,"text":"這確實是針對現在在救安基金裡面其實也許我們自己勞動部過去會有一套我們覺得為什麼可以編類進行講法但是從社會的觀感來說可能覺得是不適合的部長你到底有沒有看一下因為你也是曾經是我們委員委員會我就直接因為你都一直講不出來我直接就教於你我覺得這個錢是該花但是是不是應該"},{"start":137.104,"end":141.911,"text":"編載救安基金,絕對可以討論。第一個,辦理國內技能競賽及選手培訓編列,4億8500萬。參加國際技能組織賽事及交流訪問,編列7億3900多萬。"},{"start":154.329,"end":176.761,"text":"你覺得這個該編到這個基金裡面來嗎我跟您有個報告其實確實過去其實這個因為勞動部部本部的預算其實都一直很少這個會是救安基金的對大量收但12億多元我知道業務單位會認為說這符合在救福法裡面所謂促進國民就業是他用這個是"},{"start":178.522,"end":179.165,"text":"國際競賽是國際技能競賽國內技能競賽"},{"start":186.345,"end":207.88,"text":"跟委員報告因為我們在促進國民就業的過程當中有關如何提升國人對於技職的一個價值的一個認可這個部分是一個這競賽要辦到12億喔你們都辦了什麼因為這個部分比較特別在於說我們目前除了在花了12億的競賽到底是辦什麼除了分區的競能競賽跟全國的競賽"},{"start":209.501,"end":216.126,"text":"就是我們這個相關的技術職類我們都不知道說你們的競賽光是一個競賽不是演唱會300多萬國內和國際競賽就花了12億這個真的是有一點誇張那沒關係再把詳細細目通通送上來你們過去十幾億都怎麼花的第二個綠能產業作業安全促進計畫這個是職業安全與衛生那編到我們這個勞發署裡面的救安基金來不是救保"},{"start":238.903,"end":245.705,"text":"不是保險的這個安全上的是是編到這個促進就業的綠能產業作業安全基金的促進計畫花了1140萬這個東西不是應該就業安全為什麼獨厚綠能產業那綠能產業如果是因為高空作業一身危險那為什麼建築業沒有為什麼其他營造業沒有補助就只偏偏補助這個綠能產業"},{"start":266.938,"end":290.989,"text":"各位報告這綠能產業這案的計畫是我們子安署提的因為這個對阿子安署沒有編在你自己的救保基金裡面沒有在你自己的署內的業務然後編到這個安定基金來然後安定基金就算了你怎麼你怎麼只獨厚綠能產業高空墜落建築業為什麼沒有其他的那個容易一生直栽的產業為什麼沒有補助獨厚綠能產業而我們知道綠能產業"},{"start":295.251,"end":297.474,"text":"至少很多在股價上都是相當的表現得很不錯的"},{"start":301.036,"end":327.494,"text":"各位委員報告因為綠能產業從氫能太陽能太陽能等等都是算新的對啦為什麼是綠能那為什麼我們要看你的職業安全與衛生職災發生率最高的那一些產業為什麼沒有補助啊他們有比綠能產業還不危險嗎綠能產業有比我們最常發生的那些職災高的那些產業別還更重要重要到政府需要補助其他的常發生職災的卻沒有拿到補助嗎為什麼"},{"start":330.038,"end":331.34,"text":"這沒有補助款嗎?你確定嗎?你想把詳細的動資的狀況拿來好了"},{"start":345.956,"end":350.838,"text":"那我再就教一部長為了強化私立救福機構的就業服務的專業性勞動部開辦了以及技術式的檢定考試範圍要包括勞動法令招募和職業來輔導等等私立救福機構他設立許可及管理辦法這裡面就要求說你就業的這些服務的專業人力都一定要取得這個"},{"start":366.764,"end":366.824,"text":"林淑芬"},{"start":392.892,"end":415.304,"text":"還好一點現在是沒有證照的沒有專業認證的未來的失業者在輔導現在的失業者因為裡面都是承攬的以前都是用那個承攬以前都是用這個派錢那其實大家講說其實服務有關公共就業服務他其實要強化服務人員的專業的資格那所以要提要"},{"start":421.467,"end":421.707,"text":"請問部長你知不知此這樣的觀點"},{"start":441.386,"end":456.682,"text":"剛剛我聽林委員講我其實是支持這樣的觀點的當然是那因為以前的證照就業服務的專業人員有區分成仲介人力的還有輔導人員就是救福輔導的還有這個就業仲介的那現在整合成一張這個證照一張技術式證以後"},{"start":459.565,"end":483.959,"text":"他也具備兩項資格但是因為法規規定私立就業服務機構的專業人員比例因法定的設置標準所以該技術市政成為外勞仲介的必備的證照依法規規定估算私立就業服務機構的專業人員比例大概20到30%那他們其實是特別是私立的就業服務機構裡面一定要有這個證照那"},{"start":486.46,"end":509.391,"text":"看起來就是我們公立的服務機構裡面徵照的比例只有到63%那事實上扣除掉人資相關的徵照只有59%是具有以及這個徵照的這個資格那我們看就是說以及徵照要考什麼要考勞動法令要考職業輔導和招募就業服務人員的工作任務還包含"},{"start":510.431,"end":533.221,"text":"職涯諮詢就業輔導職業介紹就業市場的趨勢職業培訓和後續的追蹤輔導看起來這個就是要考的以及技術式的證照就是公立就業服務機構就業服務人員的工作的服務內容而這些要做這些服務內容的這些所有公立機構的人都不需要有這種證照這有一點有一點"},{"start":537.023,"end":558.358,"text":"有趣啊 所以我們在講說 勞動部到底是沒有硬性規定你們公立的要取得這個以及技術式的證照但是你們都說我們有在執訓啊 我們會做什麼法令啊 職業倫理 職業生涯的這一些在上課啊但在講法就是說 那這樣的話 那以及技術式的這個證照是雞肋喔 一點不重要嗎"},{"start":562.384,"end":567.227,"text":"那如果他是積勒的話那在私立就業服務機構有證照無證照也沒有保證品質啊那該證照到底是還有價值嗎還是乾脆就廢除了還是說事實上我們應該對證照制度應該蓋更多的肯定所以專業上認證上含金量應該更多就業服務的以及技術是檢定的"},{"start":586.139,"end":609.427,"text":"這個制度的精進 考試的精進 定位的檢討這個勞發署都應該要再檢討 是不是到底是要把它當成直接大家都不用了廢除了還是說更專業那證照上面的規範應該更精進含金量應該更高那如果含金量要更高的話你公立救福機構的這一些人都不需要有證照人家私立服務機構的還有證照勒"},{"start":611.98,"end":640.527,"text":"是跟委員報告這個部分有關公立跟私立救福機構的相關專業人員因為他的業務執掌的不同而對於他的專業裡面的這一些需求的一個內容是不是反映在我們的技術師證我就講了你們公立機構的業務執掌的範圍就跟考以及技術式的證照的內容是一致的是所以反而看起來是你們公立救福機構的這一些服務人員更需要擁有以及證照是"},{"start":642.457,"end":670.302,"text":"對啊那到底是要是要怎麼樣是要讓這個證照更專業那你們內部的公立的這個服務機構的所有的人什麼時候可以達成每一個輔導人力都是100%擁有專業的證照的這個資格的公立委員報告因為這個證照他的這個緣起的時間跟我們公立救福機構存在的時間還是有前後上的差異所以目前是採取鼓勵我們的對啦那你告訴我到底是時程上要不要追上啦"},{"start":671.854,"end":697.368,"text":"就是說未來多久你們希望每一個公立的都要有證照才能在公立機構當專業的服務者那個林委員我來跟業務單位討論一下針對拉高這個以及證照公立就業服務機構證照的比例施力的是100%那我們逐步的來拉高我們來提一個期程好不好"},{"start":698.328,"end":726.443,"text":"沒有證照的未來的失業者輔導現在的失業者的現象要解決就是我們來提一個逐步拉高的期程好不好好那另外的問題就改天再討論因為這個北分署的事情有一個制度面的問題我上次問過何部長洪部長也麻煩你回去一併思考就是說因為那個自殺的無性那個員工然後他們他比"},{"start":727.083,"end":745.439,"text":"下面有五個至六個勞務承攬的人力但是他沒有指揮監督權所以即便有人力他也不能叫他做事那這樣子的狀況你們通通派遣太難聽了所以全部改成勞務承攬就沒有派遣的事結果派遣你還可以指揮監督"},{"start":746.3,"end":746.36,"text":"林淑芬議員"},{"start":763.897,"end":779.065,"text":"其實我們在重新再調查瞭解的過程裡面非常清楚知道現在在人力結構上我們確實覺得它有不健康的地方整個勞發署都是這樣子在這個不健康的狀況之下是很容易出這些問題的這是潛在的原因"},{"start":780.105,"end":795.411,"text":"對你回去研究一下派遣然後勞務承攬但我最後再講一個因為剛才有委員一直提到林淑芬林淑芬林淑芬我在講說你認知的茶水間是設置在部長辦公室裡面對不對我就問這一句就好了"},{"start":796.491,"end":820.294,"text":"整個部長辦公室部長辦公室有幕僚工作室然後設在部長辦公室幕僚工作室進去他不是在我個人的那一間對他不是在你但是我問你幕僚的工作室是不是也是部長辦公室的一環所以我剛才說他在整個裡面你所認知的茶水間其實是在部長辦公室裡面所以並不是大家都會進去用"},{"start":821.175,"end":821.455,"text":"林淑芬議員"},{"start":842.182,"end":842.222,"text":"主席"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}