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時候你們宣傳的是說如果參加這個台灣雲市集然後一般的民眾如果叫外送的話可以用來綁定嘛不用排隊嘛而且經濟部還有補助嘛所以有多少家餐廳加入這個外送平台服務"},{"start":78.988,"end":81.955,"text":"就是6萬8千6萬8那你覺得多還是少你覺得多還是少這有達到你們預期的目標嗎"},{"start":90.476,"end":119.136,"text":"部長為什麼都不回答這是旁邊第三個人跟第二個人解釋然後你就躲在旁邊我現在是在質詢部長還是在質詢那個報委那個部長為什麼問這東西因為這個東西是你們事務發布當時一直在宣傳的嘛也被社會廣泛討論啊結果你對於這個業務完全一竅不通還要叫別人來提醒你然後提醒你的那個人自己也不清楚還要叫第三個人來提醒那當初你宣傳這個點線平台在宣傳假的喔"},{"start":119.716,"end":145.568,"text":"你有在追蹤這個後續的效果嗎那個雲世紀這個project我care是上面上層這個你們當時宣傳的就是這個點線面平台嗎社會大眾關心的是你們這個東西當初講了後續嘛沒關係啦你之後再補資料給我現在感覺是好像你完全沒有掌握狀況所以當時講了放一把火就沒事了還叫經濟部補助一堆錢然後有沒有效果你現在搞不清楚狀況"},{"start":148.611,"end":160.925,"text":"我講的是就是點線面平台這個我講就是我講的那麼具體不要跟我扯別的好不好第二個那個時候因為我們都知道隔幾天周杰倫演唱會就要開始了嘛"},{"start":161.345,"end":176.992,"text":"周杰倫演唱會黃牛票非常嚴重當時你們前部長唐鳳部長說只要數位簽章把過關的話有通過的話可以解決黃牛票的問題我想請教一下現在這個部分進度到哪裡了"},{"start":178.472,"end":195.559,"text":"指名制不是問題現在是說執行單位要不要用指名制沒有他不是這樣講的喔他的講法是說因為現在黃牛票很多人會用機器人掃票所以如果電子簽章法有過的話到時候這些機器人掃票他也必須要提供電子簽章所以會加強他就會"},{"start":196.599,"end":196.779,"text":"綜合委員會委員會委員會"},{"start":218.24,"end":234.619,"text":"拜託不要一直岔開話題唐鳳講的就是機器人掃票他講的是說如果你機器人掃票的話你如果不需要提供這些姓名沒有電子簽帳的話那他就可以隨便提供很多個資就可以去買了但是如果說有電子簽帳的話就會增加難度這唐鳳講的沒錯"},{"start":236.14,"end":263.317,"text":"對所以跟什麼你要不要進去那個無關我現在講的是第一階段機器人掃票的部分你不要一直扭曲我的問題好不好我的問題那麼簡單請問一下電子簽贓法如果現在已經通過了嘛那有一年的日落條款嘛那請教一下等可以做到唐鳳的那樣杜絕黃牛票要到什麼時候要到什麼時候但是那個就是賣票的單位不願意做不是對是這樣子就是確實這樣那所以現在立刻可以是不是現在立刻可以"},{"start":264.017,"end":277.853,"text":"現在那個技術現在只要現在只要你的意思是說現在只要賣票單位願意接受的話立刻可以做就可以執行不那跟電子簽商數位簽商法無關跟數位簽商法無關是這個意思很多技術不電子簽商可以是其中一個技術其中一個那當時唐鳳為什麼要這樣瞎掰我講的是他講的話欸"},{"start":280.436,"end":307.233,"text":"是他講說到時候數位簽證法過關的話黃牛票問題也可以透過這種方式解決而且他已經跟文化部在討論這他講的結果你現在打臉他你說跟那個沒關係其實有很多技術可以解決只要只要賣票單位可以接受話都給你們講就好了那個主要是看售票單位那他為什麼這樣講嗎技術是在我講的是唐鳳講的話唐鳳講的話你就不認了啦反正錢超現在你們都跟你們無關第三個問題"},{"start":308.734,"end":337.158,"text":"你們現在到底跟六大平台的關係怎麼樣現在就是有密切的密切合作那之前為什麼會出現很多財經的網紅他們被下架為什麼那個上次我已經解釋過那個是內部是FacebookMeta內部作業的問題所以跟我們數話部無關那有白名單這種事情嗎白名單也不是我們提供的那誰提供的這個不清楚不清楚對但是不是我們數話部提供的"},{"start":337.711,"end":337.971,"text":"委員會主席"},{"start":367.551,"end":368.729,"text":"謝謝。"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:00:43.483000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:00:44.744000+08:00","text":"（13時）麻煩請黃部長，謝謝。","quality":0.778},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-12-04T13:00:44.744000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:00:45.264000+08:00","text":"好，請黃部長。","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:00:45.264000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:01:02.115000+08:00","text":"部長，先請教一下，之前數發部大力宣傳的臺灣雲市集所謂的「點麵線」平臺，現在還存在嗎？","quality":0.944},{"speaker":"黃部長彥男","start":"2024-12-04T13:01:04.932000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:01:08.194000+08:00","text":"我們那個雲市集主要是給中小企業……","quality":0.867},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:01:08.194000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:01:12.816000+08:00","text":"我知道，我現在是問的「點麵線」平臺現在還存在嗎？","quality":0.95},{"speaker":"林代理署長俊秀","start":"2024-12-04T13:01:12.816000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:01:12.996000+08:00","text":"還存在，雲市集還存在。","quality":0.333},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:01:13.177000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:01:13.977000+08:00","text":"還存在，現在效果怎麼樣？效果……","quality":0.417},{"speaker":"林代理署長俊秀","start":"2024-12-04T13:01:13.977000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-12-04T13:01:15.678000+08:00","text":"效果還不錯。","quality":0},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:01:15.678000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:01:16.879000+08:00","text":"有多少店家加入？","quality":1},{"speaker":"林代理署長俊秀","start":"2024-12-04T13:01:21.301000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:01:21.501000+08:00","text":"6萬8,000家。","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:01:21.501000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-12-04T13:01:22.501000+08:00","text":"6萬8,000家？","quality":0},{"speaker":"林代理署長俊秀","start":"2024-12-04T13:01:22.501000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-12-04T13:01:23.501000+08:00","text":"嗯，小商號。","quality":0},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:01:23.122000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:01:31.947000+08:00","text":"這樣算有6萬8,000家加入這個外送平台，所以民眾可以透過LINE綁定，然後去跟這6萬8,000家訂餐，是嗎？","quality":0.902},{"speaker":"林代理署長俊秀","start":"2024-12-04T13:01:35.202000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:01:41.303000+08:00","text":"我們上架這個資服的系統，然後6萬8,000家的中小企業去用……","quality":0.826},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:01:42.123000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:01:42.363000+08:00","text":"不是啦！","quality":1},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:01:42.503000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:01:45.004000+08:00","text":"我在問「點麵線」平臺，你直接回應我好不好？","quality":0.941},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:01:45.044000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:01:53.846000+08:00","text":"因為那時候你們宣傳的是如果參加這個臺灣雲市集，一般的民眾叫外送的話可以用LINE綁定，不用排隊嘛！","quality":0.913},{"speaker":"林代理署長俊秀","start":"2024-12-04T13:01:53.846000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-12-04T13:01:55.207000+08:00","text":"是、是、是沒錯，掃QR Code都可以。","quality":0},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:01:55.207000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:02:00.168000+08:00","text":"而且經濟部還有補助，所以有多少家餐廳加入這個外送平臺服務？","quality":1},{"speaker":"林代理署長俊秀","start":"2024-12-04T13:02:00.988000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:02:01.209000+08:00","text":"就是6萬8,000家。","quality":0.6},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:02:01.209000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-12-04T13:02:02.209000+08:00","text":"6萬8,000家？是。","quality":0.25},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:02:01.349000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:02:03.695000+08:00","text":"那你覺得多還是少？","quality":1},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:02:03.775000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:02:03.955000+08:00","text":"這有達到你們預期的目標嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:02:12.476000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:02:13.457000+08:00","text":"部長為什麼都不回答？","quality":1},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:02:13.637000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:02:20.962000+08:00","text":"是旁邊第三個人跟第二個人在解釋，然後你就躲在旁邊，我現在是在質詢部長還是在質詢……","quality":0.973},{"speaker":"黃部長彥男","start":"2024-12-04T13:02:20.962000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-12-04T13:02:23.624000+08:00","text":"報告委員，那個因為……","quality":0.25},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:02:23.624000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:02:23.924000+08:00","text":"部長，為什麼問這個東西？","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:02:24.264000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:02:41.116000+08:00","text":"因為這個東西是你們數發部當時一直在宣傳的，也被社會廣泛討論，結果你對於這個業務完全一竅不通，還要叫別人來提醒你，然後提醒你的那個人自己也不清楚，還要叫第三個人來提醒，那當初你宣傳這個「點麵線」平臺是在宣傳假的喔！那個……","quality":0.939},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:02:41.716000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:02:44.677000+08:00","text":"你有在追蹤這個後續的效果嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃部長彥男","start":"2024-12-04T13:02:44.677000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:02:48.899000+08:00","text":"那個雲市集的project，我care的是上面上層這個project……","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:02:48.899000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:02:55.382000+08:00","text":"你們當時宣傳的就是這個「點麵線」平臺，社會大眾關心的是你們這個東西當初講了的後續。","quality":0.946},{"speaker":"黃部長彥男","start":"2024-12-04T13:02:55.382000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-12-04T13:02:56.382000+08:00","text":"那個是其中……","quality":0},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:02:56.143000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:02:58.203000+08:00","text":"好，沒關係啦，你事後再補資料給我。好。","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:02:58.384000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:03:00.304000+08:00","text":"現在感覺是好像你完全沒有掌握狀況……不是……","quality":0.889},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:03:00.304000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:03:07.568000+08:00","text":"所以當時講了、放一把火就沒事了，還叫經濟部補助一堆錢，然後有沒有效果你現在也搞不清楚狀況。","quality":0.976},{"speaker":"黃部長彥男","start":"2024-12-04T13:03:07.568000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-12-04T13:03:10.611000+08:00","text":"雲市集有好幾百個app，所以……","quality":0},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:03:10.611000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:03:18.079000+08:00","text":"我講的就是「點麵線」平臺，我講的那麼具體，你不要跟我扯別的好不好！那個……","quality":0.867},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:03:18.079000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-12-04T13:03:19.079000+08:00","text":"你再補資料給我。","quality":0},{"speaker":"黃部長彥男","start":"2024-12-04T13:03:19.079000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-12-04T13:03:20.079000+08:00","text":"好，我再補資料給你。","quality":0},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:03:18.279000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:03:38.972000+08:00","text":"第二個，我們都知道隔幾天周杰倫演唱會就要開始了，周杰倫演唱會黃牛票非常嚴重，你們前部長唐鳳說：只要電子簽章法過關、通過的話，可以解決黃牛票的問題，我想請教一下，現在這個部分的進度到哪裡？","quality":0.952},{"speaker":"黃部長彥男","start":"2024-12-04T13:03:41.032000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:03:43.853000+08:00","text":"報告委員，實名制不是問題，現在是執行單位要不要用實名制……","quality":0.76},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:03:44.314000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:03:55.678000+08:00","text":"沒有，他不是這樣講的喔，他的講法是因為現在黃牛票很多人會用機器人掃票，所以如果電子簽章法有過的話，到時候這些機器人掃票也必須要提供電子簽章。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃部長彥男","start":"2024-12-04T13:03:55.678000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-12-04T13:04:00.590400+08:00","text":"對，要實名。","quality":0},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:04:00.590400+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-12-04T13:04:05.502800+08:00","text":"所以會增加電子掃票的難度，這個是當時唐鳳講的。","quality":0.19},{"speaker":"黃部長彥男","start":"2024-12-04T13:04:05.502800+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-12-04T13:04:10.415200+08:00","text":"對，然後……","quality":0},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:04:10.415200+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-12-04T13:04:15.327600+08:00","text":"所以這個東西就是跟電子簽章法有關，我現在問你，如果要解決黃牛票問題，請問一下你們現在要推這個東西的進度到哪裡？","quality":0.02},{"speaker":"黃部長彥男","start":"2024-12-04T13:04:15.327600+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-12-04T13:04:20.240000+08:00","text":"報告委員，這個都可以執行，現在的問題是在於執行單位在收票，就是你進來要驗票會增加它的成本……","quality":0.073},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:04:20.240000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:04:22.322000+08:00","text":"我現在講的是機器人掃票，拜託一下不要一直岔開話題……","quality":0.435},{"speaker":"黃部長彥男","start":"2024-12-04T13:04:22.322000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-12-04T13:04:23.322000+08:00","text":"不是機器人掃票，機器人掃票……","quality":0},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:04:22.322000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:04:33.375000+08:00","text":"唐鳳講的就是機器人掃票，他講的是如果機器人掃票不需要提供這些姓名、沒有電子簽章的話，那他就可以隨便提供很多個資就可以去買了……","quality":0.983},{"speaker":"黃部長彥男","start":"2024-12-04T13:04:33.375000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-12-04T13:04:34.375000+08:00","text":"對，沒有錯，所以……","quality":0},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:04:33.796000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:04:36.519000+08:00","text":"但是如果有電子簽章的話就會增加難度，這是唐鳳講的。","quality":0.913},{"speaker":"黃部長彥男","start":"2024-12-04T13:04:36.599000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:04:36.619000+08:00","text":"對，沒錯，但是……","quality":0.4},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:04:38.140000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:04:45.004000+08:00","text":"所以跟什麼你要不要進去那個無關，我現在講的是第一階段機器人掃票的部分，你不要一直扭曲我的問題好不好？不是……","quality":0.959},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:04:45.325000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:04:45.805000+08:00","text":"我的問題那麼簡單！","quality":1},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:04:45.805000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:04:57.392000+08:00","text":"請問一下電子簽章法現在已經通過了，有一年的日落條款，請教一下可以做到唐鳳講的那樣杜絕黃牛票要到什麼時候？","quality":0.959},{"speaker":"黃部長彥男","start":"2024-12-04T13:04:57.392000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-12-04T13:04:58.392000+08:00","text":"可以做到，但是……","quality":0},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:04:58.052000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:04:58.713000+08:00","text":"要到什麼時候？","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃部長彥男","start":"2024-12-04T13:04:58.933000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:05:01.034000+08:00","text":"但是那個就是賣票單位不願意做。","quality":1},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:05:01.174000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:05:01.294000+08:00","text":"不是啦……","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"黃部長彥男","start":"2024-12-04T13:05:02.075000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:05:03.436000+08:00","text":"對，是這樣子，確實是這樣子。","quality":0.818},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:05:03.596000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:05:04.816000+08:00","text":"好，所以現在立刻可以是不是？","quality":0.917},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:05:04.836000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:05:05.297000+08:00","text":"現在立刻可以？","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃部長彥男","start":"2024-12-04T13:05:06.017000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:05:06.818000+08:00","text":"現在那個技術都在……","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:05:07.839000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:05:10.683000+08:00","text":"你的意思是現在只要賣票單位願意接受的話立刻就可以做？","quality":0.96},{"speaker":"黃部長彥男","start":"2024-12-04T13:05:11.043000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:05:11.504000+08:00","text":"就可以執行。","quality":1},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:05:12.024000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:05:14.247000+08:00","text":"跟電子簽章法無關？","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"黃部長彥男","start":"2024-12-04T13:05:15.789000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:05:18.251000+08:00","text":"它裡面有很多技術，電子簽章可以是其中一個技術。","quality":0.762},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:05:18.251000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:05:18.632000+08:00","text":"其中一個？","quality":1},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:05:19.052000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:05:19.633000+08:00","text":"當時唐鳳為什麼要這樣瞎掰？","quality":1},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:05:19.633000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:05:19.853000+08:00","text":"我講的是他講的話耶！不是……","quality":0.727},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:05:22.436000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:05:35.585000+08:00","text":"是他說到時候電子簽章法過關的話，黃牛票問題也可以透過這種方式解決，而且他已經跟文化部討論，這是他講的；結果你現在打臉他，你說跟那個沒關、其實有很多技術可以解決、只要賣票單位可以接受。","quality":0.952},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:05:36.225000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:05:37.226000+08:00","text":"話都給你們講就好了！","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃部長彥男","start":"2024-12-04T13:05:37.446000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:05:38.586000+08:00","text":"不是，那個主要是看售票單位要不要用。","quality":0.625},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:05:38.967000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:05:40.668000+08:00","text":"那他為什麼這樣講？","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃部長彥男","start":"2024-12-04T13:05:40.668000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:05:41.188000+08:00","text":"技術是在，但……","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:05:42.069000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:05:43.670000+08:00","text":"我講的是唐鳳講的話。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃部長彥男","start":"2024-12-04T13:05:43.670000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:05:45.311000+08:00","text":"唐鳳講的話……不過重點是……","quality":0.5},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:05:45.311000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:05:45.891000+08:00","text":"你就不認了啦！","quality":1},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:05:46.191000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:05:49.093000+08:00","text":"反正前朝的現在都跟你們無關。","quality":0.769},{"speaker":"黃部長彥男","start":"2024-12-04T13:05:49.093000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-12-04T13:05:50.093000+08:00","text":"報告委員，那個是……","quality":0},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:05:49.093000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:05:54.317000+08:00","text":"第三個問題，你們現在到底跟六大平台的關係怎麼樣？","quality":0.955},{"speaker":"黃部長彥男","start":"2024-12-04T13:05:54.317000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:05:55.598000+08:00","text":"現在就是有密切的……","quality":1},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:05:55.959000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:06:00.382000+08:00","text":"密切合作，之前為什麼會出現很多財經網紅被下架？","quality":1},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:06:01.643000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:06:02.864000+08:00","text":"為什麼？","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃部長彥男","start":"2024-12-04T13:06:02.864000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:06:10.511000+08:00","text":"那個上次我已經解釋過，那個是Facebook、Meta內部作業的問題，所以跟我們數發部一點關係都沒有。無關？","quality":0.837},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:06:10.511000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:06:12.132000+08:00","text":"那有白名單這種事情嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃部長彥男","start":"2024-12-04T13:06:12.132000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:06:13.713000+08:00","text":"白名單也不是我們提供的。","quality":1},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:06:13.773000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:06:14.354000+08:00","text":"那誰提供的？","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃部長彥男","start":"2024-12-04T13:06:15.535000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:06:15.795000+08:00","text":"這個不清楚。","quality":1},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:06:16.175000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:06:16.436000+08:00","text":"不清楚？","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃部長彥男","start":"2024-12-04T13:06:17.516000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:06:19.138000+08:00","text":"對，但不是我們數發部提供的。","quality":0.917},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:06:19.138000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-12-04T13:06:20.138000+08:00","text":"你們數發部平常跟他們都怎麼溝通？","quality":0},{"speaker":"黃部長彥男","start":"2024-12-04T13:06:20.138000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-12-04T13:06:21.138000+08:00","text":"我們都是叫它下……下架？","quality":0},{"speaker":"黃部長彥男","start":"2024-12-04T13:06:21.138000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-12-04T13:06:22.138000+08:00","text":"對，我們如果看到假廣告，被我們掃描出來或是民眾報案，我們就叫它下架，我們是叫它下架哪些廣告，但是上次那個事件是Meta內部在作業的，我的瞭解是他們內部作業的錯誤造成這些下架，但是這個跟數發部無關，我們沒有發任何文、沒有發任何訊息給他們，要求他們在這個事情上做任何事。","quality":0},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2024-12-04T13:06:22.138000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-12-04T13:06:23.138000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝。","quality":0},{"speaker":"黃部長彥男","start":"2024-12-04T13:06:23.138000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-12-04T13:06:24.138000+08:00","text":"這個已經在媒體上公布，謝謝。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-12-04T13:06:19.711000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-12-04T13:06:50.140000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝葉元之委員，謝謝部長。","quality":0.333},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-12-04T13:06:50.640000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-12-04T13:06:53.782857+08:00","text":"接下來請黃國昌委員發言。","quality":0}]},"gazette":{"lineno":1109,"blocks":[["葉委員元之：（13時）麻煩請黃部長，謝謝。"],["主席：好，請黃部長。"],["葉委員元之：部長，先請教一下，之前數發部大力宣傳的臺灣雲市集所謂的「點麵線」平臺，現在還存在嗎？"],["黃部長彥男：我們那個雲市集主要是給中小企業……"],["葉委員元之：我知道，我現在是問的「點麵線」平臺現在還存在嗎？"],["林代理署長俊秀：還存在，雲市集還存在。"],["葉委員元之：還存在，現在效果怎麼樣？"],["黃部長彥男：效果……"],["林代理署長俊秀：效果還不錯。"],["葉委員元之：有多少店家加入？"],["林代理署長俊秀：6萬8,000家。"],["葉委員元之：6萬8,000家？"],["林代理署長俊秀：嗯，小商號。"],["葉委員元之：這樣算有6萬8,000家加入這個外送平台，所以民眾可以透過LINE綁定，然後去跟這6萬8,000家訂餐，是嗎？"],["林代理署長俊秀：我們上架這個資服的系統，然後6萬8,000家的中小企業去用……"],["葉委員元之：不是啦！我在問「點麵線」平臺，你直接回應我好不好？因為那時候你們宣傳的是如果參加這個臺灣雲市集，一般的民眾叫外送的話可以用LINE綁定，不用排隊嘛！"],["林代理署長俊秀：是、是、是沒錯，掃QR Code都可以。"],["葉委員元之：而且經濟部還有補助，所以有多少家餐廳加入這個外送平臺服務？"],["林代理署長俊秀：就是6萬8,000家。"],["葉委員元之：6萬8,000家？"],["林代理署長俊秀：是。"],["葉委員元之：那你覺得多還是少？這有達到你們預期的目標嗎？部長為什麼都不回答？是旁邊第三個人跟第二個人在解釋，然後你就躲在旁邊，我現在是在質詢部長還是在質詢……"],["黃部長彥男：報告委員，那個因為……"],["葉委員元之：部長，為什麼問這個東西？因為這個東西是你們數發部當時一直在宣傳的，也被社會廣泛討論，結果你對於這個業務完全一竅不通，還要叫別人來提醒你，然後提醒你的那個人自己也不清楚，還要叫第三個人來提醒，那當初你宣傳這個「點麵線」平臺是在宣傳假的喔！"],["黃部長彥男：那個……"],["葉委員元之：你有在追蹤這個後續的效果嗎？"],["黃部長彥男：那個雲市集的project，我care的是上面上層這個project……"],["葉委員元之：你們當時宣傳的就是這個「點麵線」平臺，社會大眾關心的是你們這個東西當初講了的後續。"],["黃部長彥男：那個是其中……"],["葉委員元之：好，沒關係啦，你事後再補資料給我。"],["黃部長彥男：好。"],["葉委員元之：現在感覺是好像你完全沒有掌握狀況……"],["黃部長彥男：不是……"],["葉委員元之：所以當時講了、放一把火就沒事了，還叫經濟部補助一堆錢，然後有沒有效果你現在也搞不清楚狀況。"],["黃部長彥男：雲市集有好幾百個app，所以……"],["葉委員元之：我講的就是「點麵線」平臺，我講的那麼具體，你不要跟我扯別的好不好！"],["黃部長彥男：那個……"],["葉委員元之：你再補資料給我。"],["黃部長彥男：好，我再補資料給你。"],["葉委員元之：第二個，我們都知道隔幾天周杰倫演唱會就要開始了，周杰倫演唱會黃牛票非常嚴重，你們前部長唐鳳說：只要電子簽章法過關、通過的話，可以解決黃牛票的問題，我想請教一下，現在這個部分的進度到哪裡？"],["黃部長彥男：報告委員，實名制不是問題，現在是執行單位要不要用實名制……"],["葉委員元之：沒有，他不是這樣講的喔，他的講法是因為現在黃牛票很多人會用機器人掃票，所以如果電子簽章法有過的話，到時候這些機器人掃票也必須要提供電子簽章。"],["黃部長彥男：對，要實名。"],["葉委員元之：所以會增加電子掃票的難度，這個是當時唐鳳講的。"],["黃部長彥男：對，然後……"],["葉委員元之：所以這個東西就是跟電子簽章法有關，我現在問你，如果要解決黃牛票問題，請問一下你們現在要推這個東西的進度到哪裡？"],["黃部長彥男：報告委員，這個都可以執行，現在的問題是在於執行單位在收票，就是你進來要驗票會增加它的成本……"],["葉委員元之：我現在講的是機器人掃票，拜託一下不要一直岔開話題……"],["黃部長彥男：不是機器人掃票，機器人掃票……"],["葉委員元之：唐鳳講的就是機器人掃票，他講的是如果機器人掃票不需要提供這些姓名、沒有電子簽章的話，那他就可以隨便提供很多個資就可以去買了……"],["黃部長彥男：對，沒有錯，所以……"],["葉委員元之：但是如果有電子簽章的話就會增加難度，這是唐鳳講的。"],["黃部長彥男：對，沒錯，但是……"],["葉委員元之：所以跟什麼你要不要進去那個無關，我現在講的是第一階段機器人掃票的部分，你不要一直扭曲我的問題好不好？"],["黃部長彥男：不是……"],["葉委員元之：我的問題那麼簡單！請問一下電子簽章法現在已經通過了，有一年的日落條款，請教一下可以做到唐鳳講的那樣杜絕黃牛票要到什麼時候？"],["黃部長彥男：可以做到，但是……"],["葉委員元之：要到什麼時候？"],["黃部長彥男：但是那個就是賣票單位不願意做。"],["葉委員元之：不是啦……"],["黃部長彥男：對，是這樣子，確實是這樣子。"],["葉委員元之：好，所以現在立刻可以是不是？現在立刻可以？"],["黃部長彥男：現在那個技術都在……"],["葉委員元之：你的意思是現在只要賣票單位願意接受的話立刻就可以做？"],["黃部長彥男：就可以執行。"],["葉委員元之：跟電子簽章法無關？"],["黃部長彥男：它裡面有很多技術，電子簽章可以是其中一個技術。"],["葉委員元之：其中一個？當時唐鳳為什麼要這樣瞎掰？我講的是他講的話耶！"],["黃部長彥男：不是……"],["葉委員元之：是他說到時候電子簽章法過關的話，黃牛票問題也可以透過這種方式解決，而且他已經跟文化部討論，這是他講的；結果你現在打臉他，你說跟那個沒關、其實有很多技術可以解決、只要賣票單位可以接受。話都給你們講就好了！"],["黃部長彥男：不是，那個主要是看售票單位要不要用。"],["葉委員元之：那他為什麼這樣講？"],["黃部長彥男：技術是在，但……"],["葉委員元之：我講的是唐鳳講的話。"],["黃部長彥男：唐鳳講的話……不過重點是……"],["葉委員元之：你就不認了啦！反正前朝的現在都跟你們無關。"],["黃部長彥男：報告委員，那個是……"],["葉委員元之：第三個問題，你們現在到底跟六大平台的關係怎麼樣？"],["黃部長彥男：現在就是有密切的……"],["葉委員元之：密切合作，之前為什麼會出現很多財經網紅被下架？為什麼？"],["黃部長彥男：那個上次我已經解釋過，那個是Facebook、Meta內部作業的問題，所以跟我們數發部一點關係都沒有。"],["葉委員元之：無關？那有白名單這種事情嗎？"],["黃部長彥男：白名單也不是我們提供的。"],["葉委員元之：那誰提供的？"],["黃部長彥男：這個不清楚。"],["葉委員元之：不清楚？"],["黃部長彥男：對，但不是我們數發部提供的。"],["葉委員元之：你們數發部平常跟他們都怎麼溝通？"],["黃部長彥男：我們都是叫它下……"],["葉委員元之：下架？"],["黃部長彥男：對，我們如果看到假廣告，被我們掃描出來或是民眾報案，我們就叫它下架，我們是叫它下架哪些廣告，但是上次那個事件是Meta內部在作業的，我的瞭解是他們內部作業的錯誤造成這些下架，但是這個跟數發部無關，我們沒有發任何文、沒有發任何訊息給他們，要求他們在這個事情上做任何事。"],["葉委員元之：好，謝謝。"],["黃部長彥男：這個已經在媒體上公布，謝謝。"],["主席：好，謝謝葉元之委員，謝謝部長。","接下來請黃國昌委員發言。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":286,"meet_id":"委員會-11-2-23-13","speakers":["魯明哲","林沛祥","林國成","李昆澤","陳素月","林俊憲","何欣純","黃健豪","廖先翔","陳雪生","邱若華","徐富癸","蔡其昌","許智傑","游顥","鍾佳濱","楊瓊瓔","葛如鈞","洪孟楷","吳春城","葉元之","黃國昌","林楚茵","劉建國","羅美玲"],"page_start":211,"meetingDate":["2024-12-04"],"gazette_id":"11311001","agenda_lcidc_ids":["11311001_00006"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第2會期交通委員會第13次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、邀請數位發展部部長黃彥男列席報告業務概況及立法計畫，並備質詢；二、審查114年度中\n央政府總預算案關於數位發展部單位預算（僅進行詢答）","agenda_id":"11311001_00005"}}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}