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Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":2189.465,"end":2212.279,"text":"第一年是兩萬塊,然後接下來就是三萬塊,那目前來講總共有7.2萬公頃,然後領取到原住民補償金的大概是22億左右。然後108年我們再一次修法,然後也把長期以來原住民的竹林的更新也納進來了。"},{"start":2213.76,"end":2236.295,"text":"及第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留及第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留及第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留及第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留及第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留及第六條條文修正"},{"start":2239.588,"end":2253.185,"text":"為了要配合也跟其他的政府機關的政策一致,所以本席也提出了原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第六條的修正草案,將現在補償金額調高到五萬塊,並且"},{"start":2259.072,"end":2275.868,"text":"因應消費者物價指數來做調整,以示公平。」最後我要強調的是,中華民國的憲法是保障人民的私有財產。長期以來,原住民的私有財產限制利用,"},{"start":2277.069,"end":2294.132,"text":"為了配合政府的法令然後我們沒有領到任何的補償104年才剛剛開始是土地正義的開始而104年到現在也將近10年了物價也不斷的飆升"},{"start":2295.473,"end":2323.23,"text":"電費也要漲價油費也要漲價所有的萬物起漲的狀況之下原住民的私有財產禁伐補償不應該只停留到104年通過的一公頃三萬塊我覺得這是平等公平正義也希望我們的政府有關單位以及在場的所有委員們也能夠支持以上謝謝"},{"start":2326.894,"end":2354.182,"text":"審查委員高金素梅等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案案。七、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案案。八、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案案。九、審查委員鄭天財Sra K"},{"start":2355.154,"end":2382.012,"text":"在事實上法例是104年開始但是臺灣省政府的時代就開始了只不過他限收在水庫的還有集水區的一定的周邊的範圍那時候因為考慮到經費、預算各方面以及隨著但是現在隨著"},{"start":2383.818,"end":2410.364,"text":"這個很多的法例不斷的禁止我們原住民的土地在某些範圍比如說林業用地或是在其他的國土保安用地限制了使用所以只能造林而造林就又沒有辦法去砍伐所以開始有開始法律的一個提案的修正為什麼我要特別提到民國82年"},{"start":2412.284,"end":2431.987,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留第12條條文修正草案案。二、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留第12條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留第12條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留第12條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留第12條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員"},{"start":2440.834,"end":2467.502,"text":"到底增加這個經費合不合理?當然合理,為什麼?民國82年就2萬塊了呢?82年距離現在多久啊?所以我要請這個各部會要請我們所有的委員能夠支持我只談這個部分以上,謝謝好,謝謝鄭天財委員的提案說明繼續我們請盧縣英委員提案說明"},{"start":2476.076,"end":2482.587,"text":"主席、各位官員、各位委員、各位在場的媒體記者大家好。我是針對"},{"start":2485.373,"end":2505.174,"text":"禁伐補償條例第3條及第6條條文修正草案。」案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第6條條文修正草案。」案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第6條條文修正草案。」案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第6條條條文修正草案。」案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁�"},{"start":2508.177,"end":2525.925,"text":"很多礙於地形地貌難以開發跟進行墾值,應該要包括在裡面。另外第六條就是跟我們的召委一樣,就是要調高,可是我大概金額是調高到6萬元,所以也希望在他的"},{"start":2527.185,"end":2553.274,"text":"後款增略說114年每兩年配合消費者物價指數的漲幅有中央主管機關參照中央主計機關發布最近一年消費者物價指數較前次調整之前一年消費者物價指數成長率公告調整之其後每兩年調整一次如果最近一年消費物價指數較前次前一年消費物價指數成長率為零或負數的時候就不予調整這兩個法案的說明謝謝"},{"start":2556.156,"end":2558.424,"text":"好,非常謝謝盧縣一委員的提案說明。繼續我們請吳立華委員提案說明。"},{"start":2572.884,"end":2588.058,"text":"主席、各位委員、各位部會官員,大家早安。吳立華做提案說明。有關本席所提出的禁法補償條例修正草案內容,前已經在去年2023年9月26日以及今年2024年3月1日於院會質詢的時候質詢過行政院長。"},{"start":2595.044,"end":2614.6,"text":"提出了根據《氣候變遷因應法》的修法、未來碳費碳匯的交易政策以及目前已經完成預告的《蔣府造林辦法》的修正草案,都是針對民眾新殖林的造林措施有更優惠的獎勵措施。如果禁法補償條例的補償金發放標準"},{"start":2617.162,"end":2643.172,"text":"沒有因應提升,恐怕會造成大家砍樹造林、圈地造林的亂象,對國家想要做國土保育、水質涵養都有不利的影響。」原此,行政院陳建仁院長責成原民會要研議提高補償金的標準。主計總署也表示,只要由明確的法源依據,將會配合編列公務預算。"},{"start":2643.852,"end":2666.351,"text":"在這樣的前提下,本席的提案版本,參考過去的立法修法歷程的討論,修正兩個條文,三個修正。關於修正草案第六條,本席參考探泉交易市場的定價以及抓探量,平均每公頃8萬元的市價,以及水利署水源保育與回饋費的獎勵,針對私人土地的植樹保齡,每公頃6萬元的標準,"},{"start":2671.195,"end":2689.766,"text":"希望將禁伐補償金提高到每公頃6萬。此外,禁伐補償條例是基於國土保安、涵養水資源、綠化環境、自然生態保育以及因應氣候變遷、減輕天然災害為目標,對於原住民受到土地利用限制的補償,因此,補償金應該要參酌物價水準。"},{"start":2694.368,"end":2710.653,"text":"與本條第三項特別增訂兩年需參考消費者物價指數的成長率調整,避免後續動輒修法、準決立法修法的成本。另外,關於修正草案的第三條,禁法補償條例從108年的12月三讀通過之後,"},{"start":2714.674,"end":2734.67,"text":"已經在第五條將林業用地、保護區、水源特定區、國家公園區納為禁伐區域,並於同條的第一項第五款授權主管機關得認定有實施禁伐之必要土地納入禁伐範圍,但是許多民眾陳情反應,"},{"start":2735.39,"end":2760.586,"text":"部分的都市計劃區,因為它的都市計劃將用地編定為特殊目的事業用地、國防用地,因此無法農耕,但是它的土地現況確實是為了維持自然林木或植生覆蓋,應該要按照它禁法的事實,也納為禁法補償條例的適用範圍。以上的修正,懇請立院同仁以及行政部門予以支持。"},{"start":2762.352,"end":2763.414,"text":"地禁補償條例第六條條文修正草案。四、審查委員鄭天財"},{"start":2779.946,"end":2800.335,"text":"主席、各位委員、大家早。今天應邀列席貴委員會就審查大院委員高金素梅等鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員等盧縣一委員等吳立華、塞奈委員等擬具了原住民保留地禁伐補償條例修正草案"},{"start":2801.431,"end":2821.948,"text":"原意提高禁伐補償金以及擴大禁伐區域的範圍以下僅就原民會辦理的情形說明如下:「原住民保留地禁伐補償有賴於大院原住民委員以及各黨團共同協商取得共識,在104年12月18日三讀通過並在105年1月16日公佈施行。"},{"start":2827.99,"end":2850.467,"text":"自105年7月1日上路之後,透過地方政府的意見反饋,本會注意到部分的土地仍受到限制而且未能獲得補償,申請條件以及檢測標準仍能精進。原於108年6月27日主動提出修法,經大院各委員以及各黨團在108年12月10日完成三讀,"},{"start":2855.41,"end":2868.297,"text":"並於同年12月31日公布施行至今。原住民保留地禁伐補償執行以來,合格面積以及補償經費逐年递增,從105年合格面積2.4萬公頃補償金額5億元,截至112年合格面積已達7.2萬公頃,"},{"start":2881.264,"end":2901.57,"text":"補償金約22億,經費來源從105年起由公務預算以及原住民族綜合發展基金各辦編列方式來辦理,至113年以由全數公務預算來支應。未來,倘提高禁法補償金,每年所需要的補償金約38.5億至46.2億元,"},{"start":2906.721,"end":2924.831,"text":"因涉及國家整體預算之籌編,建議待新內閣審慎評估並通盤考量,為本案若經大院完成修法並刪除通過,本會將依法持續推動原住民保留地禁法補償等相關工作。」以上報告敬請各位委員指教。"},{"start":2929.154,"end":2945.058,"text":"其他單位的報告請委員自行參閱並且刊登公報我們現在進行詢答委員質詢前我們原例做幾點宣告本聯席會及原住民委員發言時間是4分鐘必要的時候可以延長2分鐘"},{"start":2946.678,"end":2957.897,"text":"非本聯席會委員發言時間4分鐘上午10點半截止發言登記因為今天法案處理本次的會議就不處理臨時提案請問各位委員有沒有意見?"},{"start":2961.801,"end":2962.441,"text":"審查委員曼玉珍委員"},{"start":2992.159,"end":2997.66,"text":"地禁補償條例第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。七、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬"},{"start":3022.234,"end":3025.918,"text":"這個地震我們是全台都有感因為還有就是不斷的一陣但是我們大大小小的災情其中哈連在這裡我也很感謝大家這一次的救災大家都"},{"start":3035.814,"end":3054.882,"text":"第1次聯席會議第1次聯席會議第2次聯席會議第3次聯席會議第4次聯席會議第5次聯席會議第6次聯席會議第7次聯席會議第8次聯席會議第9次聯席會議第10次聯席會議第11次聯席會議第12次聯席會議第12次聯席會議第13次聯席會議第14次聯席會議第14次聯席會議第15次聯席會議第15次聯席會議第16次聯席會議第17次聯席會議第18次聯席會議第18次聯席會議第19次聯席會議第19次聯席會議第20次聯席會議第21次聯席會議第22次聯席會議"},{"start":3063.045,"end":3074.87,"text":"地禁伐補償條例第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案案。七、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":3090.638,"end":3104.387,"text":"災害的損失還有說我們的補助有沒有在各個地區有沒有受到的幫助而且就是看公告僅剩災區是原住民才能申請是跟委員報告這是04、03當以花蓮為主那相關的救災跟整個調查的工作"},{"start":3113.547,"end":3124.653,"text":"及第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":3136.596,"end":3165.451,"text":"好這樣在各縣市原鄉的災情都有傳出嗎有一些就是落石啊還有就是說還有崩塌就阻斷生活的急迫的短缺這樣子的的隨時就是這樣子的落石還有就是教室受到嚴重的損壞這個是應該一般補助應該不夠的話這樣子也沒有會有沒有具體的原鄉部落的災情的情形"},{"start":3166.024,"end":3167.245,"text":"就宰禁渡如何?"},{"start":3182.061,"end":3211.037,"text":"全國原住民的地區都有嗎?目前在地震過後我們原鄉的旅遊有許多觀光景點都封閉同時也受到我們原鄉的禁忌是否我們跨部會、交通部、觀光署研議說如何增新的方案具體的方案有哪一些?"},{"start":3211.825,"end":3225.471,"text":"立法院第1次聯席會議第1次聯席會議第2次聯席會議第3次聯席會議第4次聯席會議第5次聯席會議第6次聯席會議第7次聯席會議第8次聯席會議第8次聯席會議第9次聯席會議第10次聯席會議第11次聯席會議第12次聯席會議第12次聯席會議第13次聯席會議第14次聯席會議第14次聯席會議第15次聯席會議第16次聯席會議第17次聯席會議第18次聯席會議第18次聯席會議第19次聯席會議第19次聯席會議第20次聯席會議第21次聯席會議第22次聯�"},{"start":3240.743,"end":3248.37,"text":"這個部分明天行政會議也會召開一個會議所以現在你們要具體的就是另外一個副主委不能一直在說延後延後比較細的部分我可能不太了解一天一天我們就是一天的不乾脆不得了所以這個就是要要延續還有剛才我們我們召委有提的說197年我們的"},{"start":3267.257,"end":3272.845,"text":"全國陸續有使用一些分化地,分為十種區、十八種用地。"},{"start":3285.663,"end":3288.845,"text":"只有補助每公頸補助只有2萬,還有106的時候再補助3萬,但是到這10年來都沒有去調整,但是我們物質一直在調,"},{"start":3302.153,"end":3311.3,"text":"條例第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。七、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":3328.133,"end":3342.883,"text":"怎麼樣去調整跟物質一直調整的機制,您有沒有什麼的建議?是,包括因為有關補助的金額是明定在這個條文法律上,所以我們也是依據這個條文的法律來做一個定額的補助。"},{"start":3344.383,"end":3371.339,"text":"在修法的過程如果通過的話,我們還是會依這個法的明定來做一個處理。所以說你沒有說要有多少,你覺得比較合理。因為我們是要修法,以你在就是我們原委會的部分你服務那麼久,你覺得是多少才是公平,對我們的朋友,我們的原住民的朋友是最有幫助的。"},{"start":3372.176,"end":3401.652,"text":"我覺得我想說尊重目前的各委的版本提出的草案你沒有任何想法你沒有覺得說我們在山上這原住民的朋友需要比我們的委員提的要更高還是更低沒有任何想法嗎我們尊重大院的決定所以你們都沒有任何建議也沒有任何的機制是這樣嗎因為現在正在修法討論我想"},{"start":3405.397,"end":3423.931,"text":"將來經費提高也會涉及到整體預算的部分當然我們對這個預算的籌編涉及到國家整體的考量所以這個部分我們可能也要所以我們委員提的是合理的提修正就是補助是合理的你認同我想我們會通盤考量"},{"start":3430.408,"end":3451.052,"text":"及第6條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。七、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":3460.39,"end":3474.29,"text":"全部去看了就是看到的就是這個畫面整個我們的山坡還有我們的林葉都去挖還有去把這樣子的去崩塌所以我們臺灣的白魚在那一邊的話就面臨滅種"},{"start":3477.054,"end":3480.156,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第1條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第1條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":3493.328,"end":3513.627,"text":"地禁償條例第六條及第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁償條例第六條及第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁償條例第六條及第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁償條例第六條及第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁償條例第六條及第"},{"start":3519.592,"end":3524.775,"text":"以上報告,希望我們在橫向的一起來去協助,好嗎?是,好,謝謝副市長,謝謝,謝謝麥真委員。繼續我們請張宏洛委員質詢。"},{"start":3541.949,"end":3552.717,"text":"我請這個原民會的副組委,然後還有環境部的組長還有農業部的林業自然保育署的副組長。"},{"start":3563.153,"end":3586.58,"text":"副主委今天其實我們在討論這個禁法的這個那當然啦其實原住民這個他們的所有的這個保護區的地不能開發什麼的我覺得受到這個影響對他們經濟是有影響那今天大家有這個說要再來擴大再來提高其實我"},{"start":3587.04,"end":3611.66,"text":"认为都是可以值得讨论的不过我从另外一个面向来跟您讨论一下其实我们原住民主保留地里面或我们现在说禁伐里面有很多的地区其实是竹林对不对像北部竹林比较多竹林竹子几年"},{"start":3613.12,"end":3630.611,"text":"大約就會死掉吧,對不對?你反而如果不去砍伐他,這個林鄉會變得不好,也會變成大量的竹子的枯死,而且這個啊,你枯死你又不能去處理,會更混亂,對不對?必須要抒罰,必須要抒罰。對不對嘛?對啦齁。所以啊,其實我"},{"start":3635.66,"end":3654.43,"text":"要補助這個這是一個面向我都可以討論我也不反對但我們不能積極一點的嗎這是可以創造經濟價值的東西我們難道就一個禁伐然後就這補助啊然後你不能替他們開另外一條路這個阻止可以創造很多的產值欸"},{"start":3656.554,"end":3681.391,"text":"這個我們可以朝這個方向我們可以讓我們的原住民有這些他有創造比你領這些補償金更多的價值那我們的農業部、我們環境部、我們原委會、原民會我們應該要朝這個方向去輔導他創造更多的經濟價值才對啊你們覺得要不要這樣做"},{"start":3682.472,"end":3703.858,"text":"有跟委員報告,這個部分我們也在配合農業部,針對竹林更新獎勵的作業規範,來配合這個工作的推動。阿你們的成交呢?這個部分當然我們也是協助農業部來做一個宣傳,讓族人能夠對於執行竹林的採伐、梳伐等相關工作。我跟你講啦吼。"},{"start":3707.93,"end":3729.884,"text":"很多的地主他會認為啊如果他去抒發竹林啊可能就沒有滿足我們條例的這個竹林覆蓋率七成或什麼的那大家都知道竹林就是要抒發而且創造經濟價值我們台灣啊以前產量一年是320萬隻的國產竹子喔那一路下滑到不到100萬隻喔那這些的經濟價值損失了多少"},{"start":3735.708,"end":3759.226,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第12條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第12條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第12條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第12條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第12條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第12條條文修正草案案。三"},{"start":3764.696,"end":3788.04,"text":"非竹林的部分我們如何去補助但如果是竹林的部分我們應該反而要去輔導他們可以賺得到更多錢啊是不是應該這樣是嘛齁所以我覺得雲民會跟這個農業部啊你們應該要去好好思考這個問題啊好好的輔導他們啊可不可以"},{"start":3795.06,"end":3803.332,"text":"對,這個就是如果竹林的抒發這個部分我們會跟這個原民會互相配合來做一些配套的措施。要多久啊?"},{"start":3806.039,"end":3825.297,"text":"現在是就有一個我們已經有一個竹林更新獎勵的這樣子的一個辦法出來了那112年2月1號已經推動了那去年度因為只是在行銷宣導期所以那個件數比較少面積比較少那所以這個部分我們還是會持續持續推動"},{"start":3827.446,"end":3845.515,"text":"我為什麼要問你們這個我去問啦很少人知道你們有這些這些獎勵這些什麼而且你們還要宣導這個跟禁法或什麼或是你們要去把它法令弄清楚這個跟禁法阿其實有沒有衝突有沒有什麼你要讓他們知道我可以選擇最高的你們應該讓他們知道這個啊對不對"},{"start":3851.835,"end":3871.07,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第6條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留第11屆第6條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留第11屆第6條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留第11屆第6條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住"},{"start":3880.538,"end":3899.147,"text":"審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。七、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":3910.333,"end":3912.234,"text":"及第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財"},{"start":3935.418,"end":3942.361,"text":"及第6條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":3967.72,"end":3992.549,"text":"中副主委今天我們要審查的是高金委員盧縣一委員跟鄭天財委員的有關原住民保留地禁伐補償條例那主要當然就是想要剛剛有提案說明了嘛就是希望能夠把補償的金額從現行的每公頃補償3萬元提高到5萬或6萬我個人是非常支持根據行政院主計總署的統計"},{"start":3994.11,"end":3997.672,"text":"2023年全體受僱員工的經常性薪資為45496元,年增2.43%,但受到通膨和全球經濟疲弱的影響,使得經常性薪資調到41334元,創下連續三年薪資的負成長。"},{"start":4015.303,"end":4040.017,"text":"地禁伐補償條例第六條條文修正草案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具:「原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第六條條文修正草案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具:「原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第六條條文修正草案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具:「原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第六條條文修正草案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具:「原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第六條條文"},{"start":4041.678,"end":4063.649,"text":"非常不公平。」請問副主委,你認為原住民保留禁伐補償的經費該不該提高?是,各位報告,是可以調整不過因為這個是涉及到整體預算的籌編那我們的預算從今年開始才納入公預算已經是22億那如果再增加的話可能會增加到38億到46億之間"},{"start":4066.834,"end":4076.218,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案。"},{"start":4095.287,"end":4103.252,"text":"禁伐補償條例第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":4125.247,"end":4149.738,"text":"那剛剛您提到經費的問題嗎?不過我們這兩年國家的稅收都超徵4000億以上也就是換言之禁伐補償金額所需的經費應該不會是問題啦所以本席認為應該要修法調整才符合公平的原則請問主席總署的廖專偉請問有沒有根據委員所提的版本估算若修法通過之後所需要的經費"},{"start":4152.365,"end":4160.256,"text":"跟委員報告,按照剛剛原民會副主委所提供的資料,就是修法通過以後每年禁法補償的經費會增加為38.5億元至46.2億元。"},{"start":4165.27,"end":4187.945,"text":"那既然剛剛已經提到最近這兩年的稅收都超徵4千億,所以我想補助這個是不會有問題的,而且剛剛高金照委也提到,休耕有補助、照林有補助,現在只有我們的這個禁伐的補償,可以說是金額偏低。所以說現在討論的是提案委員所提的金額5萬或6萬,請問你們接不接受?"},{"start":4189.918,"end":4213.742,"text":"根文報告就是關於補償金額的調整以及委員修法要調整就是禁法補償的範圍這個部分涉及到主管機關、原民會的權責以及一些跨部會的協商那基本上主席總署這邊是尊重大院修法的結果那修法通過以後法律通過本總處就會依法來編列相關的預算"},{"start":4213.962,"end":4234.491,"text":"所以說主席總署也認為只要是經過我們大院的結果你們就會依法來行政嘛那另外再請教一個問題就是為了符合實際的狀況參酌國民民經法的第54條之一及老年農民福利津貼暫行條例第四條第一項的規定對於原住民禁法補償的金額應該每兩年隨物價消費者物價指數與時的調整以貫徹原住民"},{"start":4243.735,"end":4269.641,"text":"除了基本法第21條第二項政府應寬裂預算補償之規定。請問兩位是否同意?根委報告,這個物價指數的調整按照國民年金法跟老人年金,它是四年條一次,那我們這邊修法是兩年,當然我們尊重大院決定。那,廖專委?"},{"start":4271.784,"end":4298.247,"text":"跟委員報告本質上老農津貼跟國民年金其實在性質上也許跟禁法補償金有一些不同因為老農津貼跟國民津貼其實是針對一些符合特殊身份的對象來發育津貼那可能跟禁法補償是屬於政府為了禁法所提供的額外的政策性獎勵性質上也許有一些不同"},{"start":4298.707,"end":4302.129,"text":"大院修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":4311.308,"end":4315.189,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財"},{"start":4336.378,"end":4339.441,"text":"非常謝謝徐培臻委員、謝謝眾副主委、謝謝主席處。謝謝。繼續我們請鄭天財委員質詢。主席、各位委員。我們請鍾新華副主委。請鍾新華副主委。"},{"start":4378.405,"end":4394.591,"text":"大雁原住民委員及各黨團自101年提案原住民保留地禁伐補償及照齡回饋條例草案。請問一下,這個,原民會的同仁也可以協助。"},{"start":4396.636,"end":4419.73,"text":"本院委員、原住民委員是誰?當時是簡東明委員跟高金素梅委員在101年的時候要寫出來啊,尤其是簡東明委員他已經到天上了我們要感謝他、感恩他、要紀念他。好,各黨團是誰?哪個黨團?"},{"start":4423.175,"end":4446.824,"text":"第六條條文修正草案案案件第十四條文修正草案案件第十五條文修正草案案件第十六條文修正草案案件第十八條文修正草案案件第十八條文修正草案案件第十八條文修正草案案件第十八條文修正草案案件第十八條文修正草案案件第十八條文修正草案案件第十八條文修正草案案件第十八條文修正草案案件第十八條文修正草案案件第十八條文修正草案案件"},{"start":4452.932,"end":4476.566,"text":"就只有簡東明立委提案然後經濟委員會廖國棟主持了很多的會議、協商本席現在還在場的在位的本席尤其是高金素梅召委當時在104年的時候關鍵不好形容就關鍵用關鍵兩個字關鍵的"},{"start":4483.263,"end":4509.662,"text":"去因應,然後就不得不三讀通過。」這樣比較貼切。好,這個,園民會的報告裡面,這個真的要修,我是建議召委,他們要修正。園民108年6月27號主動提出,原住民保留地也行政院,園民會主動提出,事實上不是這樣,"},{"start":4511.568,"end":4532.118,"text":"及第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。七、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。八、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":4540.729,"end":4559.08,"text":"請你們解釋,你們都不願意解釋,後來才提了這個草案。當時本席、高金素梅、簡東明、孔文吉都要提草案,共提這個草案。你看這個,這個是立法院的議事錄,立法院的議事錄就好幾個版本,"},{"start":4560.302,"end":4573.835,"text":"及第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":4585.438,"end":4614.142,"text":"本席跟其他提案的委員一樣就是要提高這個禁伐補償的金額本席提的是從114年因為還要編列預算所以114年每年每公頃新台幣5萬元然後未來要隨著物價指數當然到底是5萬還是3萬大家可以討論我來說剛才我在提案說明的時候有特別提到"},{"start":4616.032,"end":4639.423,"text":"82年原住民保留地以前是要點臺灣省政府的時候透過一個要點正對水庫集水期因為經費有限所以只限收在那個地方後來法律通過了之後那時候82年就是每公頃2萬塊82年到現在多久了好104年通過之後"},{"start":4646.017,"end":4659.948,"text":"第104年通過之後,台灣桃園所創加碼補助原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第十五年,桃園所創加碼補助原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第十五年,桃園所創加碼補助原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第十五年,桃園所創加碼補助原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第十五年,桃園所創加碼補助原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第十五年,桃園所創加碼補助原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第十五年,桃園所創加碼�"},{"start":4674.984,"end":4678.965,"text":"為什麼只有桃園加嗎?他當副院長應該全體適用啊!四分塊!只有桃園!其他縣市都沒有!所以要統一啊!所以我們要修法啊!要把它一致性啊!何況從82年到現在,台灣省政府時代82年到現在,"},{"start":4700.35,"end":4702.052,"text":"二、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":4725.914,"end":4754.817,"text":"及第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。七、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。八、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":4755.953,"end":4780.067,"text":"人民會的報告裏面﹚我這錢已經沒有錢可以編了﹚七號變遷因應法第五條規定﹚該期內新增碳匯值相關協議應與原住民族共享。稍微為什麼要請這個環境部也要來就是他們也要去支出你們要去跟他要這個經費因為我們"},{"start":4783.442,"end":4801.961,"text":"台灣的原住民族在台灣這塊土地上,森林都是我們保護的,所以法律、氣候變遷因應法也明定,所以這些碳費所說的這些費用也要納入到原住民保留的禁伐補償。"},{"start":4802.844,"end":4825.983,"text":"不要擔心這個經費就原住民主委員會而言所以這個部分這裡面都有條文你們就要仔細的去看然後去好好的去協調相關的這些尤其是環境部尤其是主計總署各位爸爸這個目前還在跨部會協商當中對所以嘛不要直接說沒有錢好不好加油"},{"start":4827.323,"end":4839.953,"text":"非常謝謝鄭天財委員的質詢也謝謝中副主委謝謝希望環境部也能夠參考然後組織總署也能夠參考一下剛剛鄭天財委員所提到的部分謝謝你們謝謝繼續我們請容許庭委員質詢"},{"start":4852.159,"end":4859.341,"text":"立法院第11會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":4870.439,"end":4896.39,"text":"副主委早安好今天我們當然就討論這個山林的部分第一個部分第一個題目是這個原住民的禁伐補償條例那本期的主張是這樣我們的禁伐補償條例跟獎勵造林辦法當然應該要同步來做修正因為當初森林法就有規定林業用地不能跟其他用途使用那其實原民保留地中的74%是林業用地其實有高度的一個重疊性所以說換言之我們如果要這個"},{"start":4898.032,"end":4906.831,"text":"進行保護國土環境保育的政策目標相對來講當然就是犧牲原住民族的權益所以這件事情要妥善的來求取平衡"},{"start":4907.614,"end":4934.978,"text":"那過去為了平衡這個經濟跟生活然後也讓政策可以推動所以推出了禁法補償跟照領獎勵兩種措施兩個制度互相配合但是這個任何的政策都有與時俱進的必要這段時間我們的照領補助從20年每公頃獎勵金60萬元提高到照領6年每公頃60萬元等於大概是增加了三倍的量因為本來20年領到變6年領到其實是差三倍的量"},{"start":4935.658,"end":4953.706,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留第12條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留第12條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留第12條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留第12條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留第12條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員"},{"start":4961.63,"end":4963.392,"text":"禁伐補償條例第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":4979.571,"end":5005.967,"text":"讓這個額度可以明確而且速度要加快這個事情不能再拖加上通貨膨脹還有原住民主的公平正義這些東西我想都構成了這一次修正原民禁法補償條例的這個正當性這個副主委到目前為止同意我的說法嗎?是也謝謝委員剛剛的一個說明那的確這個部分我們因為將來如果提高的話會涉及到整個預算的編列啦那個這個可能要做整體考量"},{"start":5006.775,"end":5008.495,"text":"地禁償條例第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":5028.86,"end":5044.879,"text":"碳稀存、碳捕捉的複合式功能。」所以換言之未來的林地的價值是有上升的空間跟可能性的嘛對不對那這件事情難道不應該被彰顯嗎這件事情難道不能構成政府未來的裁員嗎其實是可以的嘛"},{"start":5045.299,"end":5069.421,"text":"未來我們環境部剛剛陸陸續續有碳費等等相關的機制上路之後其實林地的這個價值就會提升相對來講你對這個保護林地相對的這個財源跟預算他應該是會越來越充足的他也應該越來越充足啦所以我想財務壓力雖然政府有義務把它講出來但不構成就是說因為財務壓力所以我們要在修法的方面阻卻不淺啦所以我還是希望"},{"start":5070.262,"end":5087.647,"text":"考量未來的碳稀存跟碳補償的技術,還是要先做修正,也不用太擔心未來的財源。」另外在這個場合我要特別提醒,既然有減碳政策,未來林業的價值可能會提升。我們除了講說你用觀光的角度來活化林業發展之外,"},{"start":5088.047,"end":5109.982,"text":"未來在這些碳吸存、碳捕捉這些技術他如何變成也許是一個商業化的模式也許他出現了一定的商業機制跟利潤的時候我們法條明定要跟原住民族共享可是我們的政府在溝通的過程中沒有辦法注意到這個原民族群跟一般的所謂的數位落差跟資訊的落差的時候那終究這個利潤是沒有辦法被共享的"},{"start":5110.262,"end":5113.604,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":5125.453,"end":5148.568,"text":"政府要有設計機制尤其是原住民組委員會你要有一個機制確保原住民的好朋友可以優先知道可以第一時間的了解說這塊林業用地怎麼樣來做活用也來促進這個國家的這個淨零碳排量的工作這樣才能夠真正落實這個所謂的利潤共享好不好這個我先提醒在前那進今天的第二個題目換林務署跟國家公園署"},{"start":5150.547,"end":5151.748,"text":"三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":5172.338,"end":5198.611,"text":"這個我們近年都提倡所謂的無痕山林就希望說大家登山或是觀光的時候不要把垃圾留在山林裡面可是我們看了法條之後發現很荒唐的事情我們根據廢棄物清理法第12條也就是我們在城市或是在一般的地方亂丟垃圾的時候至少被人家倆包的時候大概就是罰1200塊以上可是後來我們看了一下這個罰款這個罰款你在非國家公園的森林"},{"start":5199.511,"end":5217.666,"text":"如果亂丟垃圾的話法1000到6萬當然這個上限比較高可是下限也比較低更好笑的是國家公園的森林用地根據國家公園法第13條你亂丟垃圾的時候罰1000塊以下這是不是有失比例原則這個法條有沒有要檢討改進的空間你要不要回答一下"},{"start":5220.526,"end":5234.27,"text":"條例第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。七、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。八、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。八、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文�"},{"start":5247.854,"end":5254.476,"text":"未來透過修法程序,會就有關委員所關心的部分,會依照審議結果以後提高相關法則。"},{"start":5275.39,"end":5280.393,"text":"非常謝謝林學廷委員質詢。謝謝。繼續我們請蘇巧慧委員質詢。好,謝謝主席。我們請周副主委。有請周副主委。"},{"start":5299.813,"end":5317.305,"text":"地禁伐補償條例第六條條文修正草案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案。七、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案。八、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條"},{"start":5326.972,"end":5334.979,"text":"那接下來的話就是那到底有多少的範圍能夠適用這個條例還有適用這個條例之後的這些土地能夠得到補償的金額應該要怎麼計算那我也認為應該是多多益善想必原民會作為這個主管機關你的態度應該也是如此吧"},{"start":5352.79,"end":5358.835,"text":"第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第12條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第12條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第12條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":5368.803,"end":5372.625,"text":"也一樣提出了版本甚至是在相同的條文內他提高的他所提到的數字本席和其他諸多委員我們也有連署我們的版本其實是在第六條我們甚至認為自民國114年起每年每工企是要補償條的數額調整為每工企新台幣6萬元坦白講比主席還高"},{"start":5398.078,"end":5399.779,"text":"主席主席主席主席主席主席主席"},{"start":5421.653,"end":5427.824,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具"},{"start":5433.7,"end":5454.668,"text":"你應該要在這裡要告訴我們的是基於行政機關行政的立場來講編列預算其實坦白講是行政部門的權限我們立法委員當然有立法的權限我也支持啊我甚至還連署表達了我的態度今天在質詢台上我就告訴你我支持國家對權益受損的原住民族人給予更多的補償給予他們最好的權益"},{"start":5458.809,"end":5484.987,"text":"但我想知道編列預算的國家行政權你能不能同意在我們國家的整體預算中能夠編列這樣的一筆預算讓我知道我今天通過這個法案下去之後在條文上面寫出來每年每公頃新台幣6萬元的補償金到底政府可不可以負擔啊我也不想做這個歷史的罪人啊我支持除人爭取權益啊但國家預算到底怎麼編列你要告訴我啊"},{"start":5489.189,"end":5500.273,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":5512.017,"end":5518.205,"text":"第一個就是馬上提出了原住民保留地禁伐補償實施辦法真正的實施了這件事情然後在蘇貞昌院長的時代兩度公告擴大適用這個條例的範圍"},{"start":5527.976,"end":5540.587,"text":"所以從108年擴大111年再次擴大的範圍你做最實際的例子好了啦你說如果是全國是從105年的24780公頃到111年的67661公頃今我從5億到20億那我的新北市我的新北市本來可以適用這個條例的是零欸是零欸但是我們現在有563公頃"},{"start":5554.358,"end":5560.103,"text":"的土地可以適用這個補償範圍,可以適用這個補償條例,我們有沒有拿到錢?有!我們開始拿到錢了!所以,能夠為族人爭取權益,不是只有從數額的部分而已,是從適用範圍的部分嘛!那這個公告誰是可以適用範圍?是櫃園會的權益、權力嘛!"},{"start":5577.256,"end":5586.078,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第1條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第1條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":5601.821,"end":5628.033,"text":"補償金額是不是可以增加五立法院委員?五立法院委員在他的總質詢裡面也兩度問陳建仁院長,陳建仁院長也支持這個方向啊,應該要調整,我們支不支持?我們也支持啊,但我現在要問的就是,那編這個錢到底OK嗎?是,跟委員包括,因為這個是涉及到國家整體預算的編,所以我們是建議如果新內閣產生以後可以審慎評估在意這樣的一個建議。"},{"start":5629.076,"end":5631.745,"text":"及第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":5636.935,"end":5641.577,"text":"對阿,因為那你現在有沒有建議版本,你也要拿出來讓我們知道阿,如果你有建議版本的話,那我們也覺得說啊,那這個不錯,但是因為基於尊重這幾天就要上任的新內閣了,那確實我們也覺得沒有錯,我們每年都討論這個問題,但今年的時間很特別,今年的時間就是一個新舊內閣正要交接的時候,"},{"start":5659.983,"end":5662.224,"text":"及第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":5675.669,"end":5686.251,"text":"第16條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案。"},{"start":5705.578,"end":5708.92,"text":"主席、我們家副主委有請曾副主委主委、各位本席在這裏來請教一下你坐在這位的機間這樣有多久12年12年嘛來本席跟你談一下"},{"start":5729.67,"end":5743.157,"text":"不關什麼人有正經提出這個規案的草案時,你如何去結尾,去想要怎麼讓我們原住民、經濟委員不要亂扯手腕,會補償,會這幾天,你有什麼想法來?既然你已經坐12天了,你的保護,你給對原住民"},{"start":5758.644,"end":5772.33,"text":"內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案。七、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案。八、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案。"},{"start":5784.717,"end":5794.904,"text":"當時跟你說這個問題的時候,我看你都沒概念。你也沒想過要管住民,怎麼請出他的福利跟他的款項。說實在,每個做好人都可以做。要3萬也好,要5萬也好,要10萬也可以。檢督在那裡不是要拿菜吃這樣啦。"},{"start":5812.267,"end":5814.349,"text":"審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":5833.311,"end":5848.94,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":5860.37,"end":5866.396,"text":"第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":5886.125,"end":5910.194,"text":"土地的使用的確是受到限制,一般原住民保留地也沒有辦法被應用,所以才會有這個補償的辦法。當然是也改善了主委對於土地被限制使用,讓他們在經濟收益上有一些改善。主委、副主委,你這樣喔,我講實在,我從剛才講到現在,你沒了解說,我用心弄好了。"},{"start":5914.315,"end":5929.48,"text":"我雖然是台灣人,但我是把原住民騎走壞了。尤其阿里山我們的嘉義縣,很多原住民來嘉義市選我了。他們怎麼沒辦法選我?對你們對台的好利好什麼都沒救了。所以要來搞嘉義市做臨時工了。"},{"start":5942.028,"end":5943.473,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具"},{"start":5945.914,"end":5950.436,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":5974.589,"end":5991.624,"text":"像這位,她也是為原住民留下生,我認為沒有什麼人都有她的立場及她的看法。這是你們的單位,到現在完全看不出你們的做法。"},{"start":5997.532,"end":6014.26,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第12條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":6027.418,"end":6031.022,"text":"零四、零三、花蓮等時,您的文康站在所有全台灣15百多個,花蓮就18幾個,到現在為止,"},{"start":6044.554,"end":6059.711,"text":"還有在我們的花蓮的所在許多教會也是因為這件事來引起原住民許多人沒有辦法去到教會主席"},{"start":6060.592,"end":6073.877,"text":"審查委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留"},{"start":6081.38,"end":6098.211,"text":"根委員報告有關0403文件帳跟教會的部分都納入我們整體在協助規劃補助有關災區的部分那我們都有一些清澈在裡面也有同仁去做調查整理調查我來請教你告不清你們的規委是怎樣根委員報告因為詳細資料不是我在督導是另外一個副主委所以我們可以把相關的調查資料跟協助的情況跟我們做一個報告"},{"start":6108.376,"end":6121.562,"text":"副主委,在這裏我認為你來這裏也要了解你身為原住民的副主委,不是他怕本身發生這樣,你要比任何人還要了解啦,會後拜託主了給我,以上。好,謝謝,謝謝委員。謝謝美惠,謝謝副主委,謝謝,繼續我們請賴銳龍委員質詢,謝謝。"},{"start":6139.847,"end":6142.333,"text":"審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":6149.933,"end":6176.451,"text":"首先請教一下我們其實從這幾年來持續在增加不管是從禁伐補償的面積或者是金額那我想大家也全力的在支持也希望能夠給予更多合理的一些補償那我想問一下接下來這樣的一個方向今天要審查的方向行政院版本有出來嗎?沒有行政院版本為什麼沒有?沒有行政院版本目前有在研議嗎?有在研議嗎?"},{"start":6179.68,"end":6184.265,"text":"委員班門出現之後其實我們內部也有在討論有在討論那你們有提出來嗎?有在討論但是還沒提出來那你們的態度是什麼?"},{"start":6189.411,"end":6211.181,"text":"當然對於增加這個方向我們是樂觀其成樂觀其成那裁員的部分呢就增加裁員的裁員的部分因為涉及到整體預算如果說今年當然是沒有這個預算那明年開始當然這個部分是涉及到國家整體預算那變成新的那個來去做一個編列或者討論所以要由行政來支持編列"},{"start":6212.703,"end":6238.213,"text":"這個部分當然我們會報如果說法通過或我們按照法的部分來做一個要不要順利更清楚一點來同學有要補充嗎跟我們報告禁法補償104年通過的時候當時有做出附帶決議針對禁法補償增加預算必須以開增碳稅來支應那針對這個部分呢園民會後來我們就按照當時大院的決議來檢討那不過剛剛很多委員有提到這幾年我們也發現到"},{"start":6239.193,"end":6265.678,"text":"禁法的租賃受限制的土地的確是有當初在立法上沒有全部涵蓋當初只有林業用地所以行政院在108年提出的修法我們擴大了這樣的禁法補償的面具包括都市計劃區、水質水運保護區包括國土保安用地等所以行政院在過去8年內在2016年之後實際上我們也持續在推動也如委員簡報上所說我們現在大概這8年"},{"start":6267.358,"end":6288.787,"text":"補償金2.4公頃到7.2萬多銀行保證8年4.7億元已經是直接讓族人能夠受益那剛剛委員所提示的部分有關整體的預算部分目前我們本會內部有進行研議中不過因為這個預算的增加還涉及到整個國家預算的整體的配置那目前我們還在這個討論當中那財務的部分呢"},{"start":6295.573,"end":6314.549,"text":"跟委員報告本次修法涉及到調整禁法補償的金額以及擴大禁法補償的範圍涉及到原民會、環境部、農業部和大部會的協商。這個部分我們尊重主管機關的權責以及大院的最後審查的延後。"},{"start":6317.611,"end":6318.812,"text":"審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":6340.965,"end":6368.714,"text":"甚至於在減碳這一塊政策上怎麼達到最有效的一個工具。」剛剛也談到了碳費其實是一個重要的一個法醫依據包括新的內閣上任之後的整個我覺得對於基本新的內閣的因為各位當然很多都事務官政務官今天沒有來嘛很多政務官沒有來那我覺得對於既有的還是要有一些基本的尊重啦我覺得大方向上大家都支持但是該有的基本尊重我認為還是要有啦這個整個體制上是比較好的再來我請教一下主委副主委"},{"start":6370.673,"end":6397.933,"text":"竹林整個固碳的量是木材的三倍其實我們應該大量繼續推竹林讓更多竹林這個方向上應該也是一個民會應該也是林務署的一些方向是這樣的方向那我想了解的是那為什麼這國產林這段時間來增加雖然是減少甚至於有進半的林地是荒廢要不要先說明一下副署長"},{"start":6398.507,"end":6400.067,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留"},{"start":6415.292,"end":6432.401,"text":"及第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":6436.983,"end":6441.146,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留第1條條文修正草案。二、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":6455.617,"end":6469.675,"text":"對,那這個因為我們大概從112年開始推竹產業新興計畫那這個計畫裡面其實竹的材料的來源是非常重要的所以我們也就在去年的2月1號推動了一個竹林更新獎勵計畫"},{"start":6471.596,"end":6497.468,"text":"在禁伐補償的區域裡面,如果你要去做一些竹林的更新的時候,我們也是由林業署這邊提供也是跟禁伐補償一樣3萬塊的這些經費。所以未來如果在抒發竹林的部分一樣會有3萬的一個經費就是了?對。所以希望用這樣的方式給予更多的誘因,去讓整個竹林活化。"},{"start":6499.169,"end":6523.583,"text":"太久的竹林反倒沒有才反倒是對於那個對碳匯的反倒是對可惜的然後整個對水土保持等等的也是所以我也希望這個部分兩個部會今天要持續來合作好不好我一方面當我們對於補償這一塊持續來支持進行但是一方面對這一塊能夠讓碳的部分碳匯的部分的持續減碳的這一塊持續甚至未來跟我們的碳費都會有相關聯的嗎我們希望這塊持續來推動"},{"start":6524.964,"end":6529.228,"text":"審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":6551.265,"end":6564.134,"text":"特定的幾個地點大家都知道在哪邊,應該有一些作為,你只要有積極的作為之後,我相信對少數不消業者會有達到嚇阻的效果,我認為這也是保護三零個狀況的一環。好不好,期待你們的作為。好,非常謝謝賴銳龍委員的質詢,謝謝。也謝謝官員的回應,謝謝。繼續我們請黃建斌委員質詢"},{"start":6581.904,"end":6585.866,"text":"條例第6條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":6596.3,"end":6615.44,"text":"為我們今天討論的禁伐補償首先我們想要謝謝我們已故的簡東平委員的努力讓我們今天可以在這邊來討論關於我們主人的生計的問題當時我們立法的目的是為什麼當時立這個法的目的是為什麼"},{"start":6619.622,"end":6647.862,"text":"當然是他為了國土保安然後因為這個土地限制被使用所以也符合原基法21條因為限制利用而做一個補償的一個工作對因為原住民的土地為了要保護國土的安全所以受到限制使用所以他要補償他對不對所以當年禁法補償由簡東明委員提出的時候沒有行政院版本那今年有這麼多人提出依舊還是沒有行政院的版本"},{"start":6648.823,"end":6663.712,"text":"第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":6674.571,"end":6678.587,"text":"你要請這個林業級自然保育署的副署長副署長副署長"},{"start":6680.532,"end":6703.852,"text":"副市長,我們在詹姻補助裡面,我們是20年可以領到60萬的獎勵金對不對?就是第一年每公頃12萬,第二年到第六年每公頃4萬,第七年到20年每公頃2萬,那20年之後他可以進行書法來販售我們的這個區裡面的林產物是不是?所以我們一個林農他可以獲得的金額是應該是高於60萬的,就是補助60萬再加書法的產業對不對?"},{"start":6707.054,"end":6710.236,"text":"及第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員盧縣一等19人擬具"},{"start":6727.677,"end":6736.381,"text":"經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具"},{"start":6745.586,"end":6765.545,"text":"因為目前都有成立一個專案小組邀請相關部會在討論所以目前還在討論中還在討論喔對對對可是都要執行的還要討論不是之前我還不是說我新造零才有就零不包括嗎是這個因為正如剛剛所提到的目前有一個所謂的"},{"start":6766.132,"end":6767.213,"text":"森林經營攤會專案活動跨部會討論協商。"},{"start":6783.983,"end":6810.909,"text":"我們現在有幾個造林的方法學在環境部在做審查一個是新植造林的這個部分已經通過了那一個是森林經營的方法學還有竹林的經營的方法學正在那個環境部做審查那審查通過了以後其實就可以依照這個這些的規範做探險的申請跟我們再繼續報告那等整個相關攤位跟溫室氣體減量的方法學定案之後"},{"start":6811.448,"end":6812.574,"text":"移民會也會邀請相關部會針對"},{"start":6815.253,"end":6840.807,"text":"原住民主的森林碳會內容演繹。這沒有順便談到碳權,我們跟副主委來討論一下。副主委,你在現在網路上出現很多課程,就是可以碳減碳、碳淨零,這些相關課程上環可以成為碳交易師、碳會開發師、碳交易管理師,有這個事情嗎?環境部有在吧?環境部有這個課程。"},{"start":6842.134,"end":6866.471,"text":"來我們請環境部的組長氣候環境變遷署長組長來是委員好跟委員報告剛委員所提到的這些所謂的碳交易室、碳規劃室的部分那環境部在之前已經透過新聞卡跟圖卡跟大家說明是在法令就是氣候變遷因應法裡面並沒有這些職稱也沒有這些名字那所以有提醒到就是大家在選的時候可能要慎選這些課程內容"},{"start":6867.892,"end":6870.613,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留"},{"start":6895.926,"end":6917.772,"text":"最後我們一直在我剛剛聽到現在一直在講預算預算預算那回到一開始本席任務部主委的為什麼要禁法因為為了要保護山林保護山林是因為要保護國土保護國土是因為要保護這塊土地讓人民的生命才安全是不是是是所以我們一直到談到預算"},{"start":6920.216,"end":6929.301,"text":"因為新的閣款還沒上任所以預算沒有辦法編列請問副主委請問在場所有相關部會的官員你們會因為預算的問題而放棄國家安全嗎?"},{"start":6932.574,"end":6958.066,"text":"所以這件事情而且禁法這個案子不是今年才開始已經十幾年了這個事情本來就在討論應該預算要增加只不過到現在我們還是要用這些事在這邊做檢討所以這部分負罪我要拜託會裡面真的要加油各部位能夠來協助我相信本席也是來自於偏鄉的小孩"},{"start":6959.38,"end":6968.386,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第1條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第1條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第1條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":6980.053,"end":6992.522,"text":"非常謝謝監編委員質詢也謝謝官員的回應繼續我們請黃婕委員來質詢然後我們在許新穎委員質詢結束的時候我們休息五分鐘謝謝好謝謝主席我們請主委我們有請副主委、重副主委"},{"start":7010.128,"end":7010.589,"text":"立法院第11會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具"},{"start":7010.984,"end":7039.896,"text":"好副主委好首先我要講一下就是原民會其實還是很努力啦因為原民會在今年1月初的時候有發佈這個原住民保留地禁法補償實施辦法的修正案那修正案裡面其實也有看到已經有訂定這個補償的認定基準然後各權責辦理的期程也都有訂出來然後竹木覆蓋率的用詞還有申請人的救濟程序這些的規定其實也都有放在裡面"},{"start":7040.196,"end":7048.8,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第6條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具:「原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第6條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具:「原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第6條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具:「原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第6條條文修正草案案。三、審查"},{"start":7068.82,"end":7093.369,"text":"我會這樣問是因為其實是因為其實這次的403的地震啊因為各地的山地都還是有一些土石流或是坍塌的情況出現我擔心的是是不是會有因為這個天災然後樹木流失導致自己土地的竹木的覆蓋率不到你們規定的七成然後並就拿不到這個相應的補償會不會有這樣的情況"},{"start":7095.61,"end":7121.612,"text":"這會不會影響到一些族人在申請這些禁法補償的權益呢?根本包括竹木覆蓋率的確是要到達七成那現在我們在113年1月8號針對這個辦法有做第六條有做修訂除了既有的建築物還有道路跟農路已經是沒有被覆蓋的部分扣除掉之外其他的像崩塌地如果符合檢測它整體"},{"start":7123.208,"end":7138.003,"text":"整體來看如果還是滿7成的覆蓋率的話是照樣都補助那之前呢只要有一部分覆蓋率不到7成的話就完全就不給經費但現在是只要同整去算是一起的"},{"start":7138.684,"end":7140.246,"text":"審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":7154.241,"end":7166.164,"text":"地禁補償條例第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁補償條例第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁補償條例第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁補償條例第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁補償條例第六條條文修正草案"},{"start":7183.229,"end":7194.541,"text":"也就是說既然現在新的造齡政策已經把這個獎勵金提高而且提高蠻多倍的那我們禁伐的補償金如果沒有提高的話是不是很可能造成有些人未來會造樹砍樹來造齡這個是我擔心的"},{"start":7198.746,"end":7208.094,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第16條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第16條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第16條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第16條條文修正草案案。三、審查"},{"start":7224.147,"end":7229.59,"text":"那當然我很肯定就是從2016到2013你覺得說蔡政府這段時間從這個認定的面積2.4萬公頃到現在7.2萬公頃已經三倍了然後從當初的5億元的補償金到現在22億總共是124.7億那這個當然我們都逐步的在擴大範圍也擴大的金額可是現在我們"},{"start":7248.398,"end":7274.425,"text":"農業部新的政策下去之後,我們新的院版都沒有提出任何關於我們自己的禁伐補償的版本。副主委。是。目前沒有我們的版本,不過我們也當然就整個政策的發展上。那你們的態度跟立場是什麼?如果今天我們這四個版本就是要審了,結果院,你們都沒有版本也沒有立場,該怎麼辦?"},{"start":7276.383,"end":7280.368,"text":"我們也當然希望是秉持一致性跟公平性的原則去推"},{"start":7281.596,"end":7308.894,"text":"所以今天等一下我們就要進主條了那裡面四個委員的版本有三萬、有五萬、有六萬該怎麼辦?你們的態度是支持幾萬還是你們自己的版本希望什麼是橫平性、什麼是一致性你們的預算的規模到哪裡其實要讓大家知道啦不是說我們今天在這邊隨便喊價就好"},{"start":7309.454,"end":7316.338,"text":"你們預算的預期到底希望在這件事情上面播出多少來支持這件事情。"},{"start":7321.707,"end":7344.918,"text":"這個的確也涉及到整個籌變預算的部分那目前因為我們的禁法補償的金額是從金額已經是22億那從今年開始是列為公務預算那現在14年14年的部分如果說按照法如果修法通過之後當然我們會按照法的規定來做一個籌變所以你們也支持增加嗎?態度是這樣嗎?"},{"start":7349.775,"end":7375.031,"text":"副主委不敢講欸你們支不支持增加嘛支不支持支持樂觀其成勇敢一點啦這個不分黨派都在這邊好不好你們支不支持增加民進黨的立委都在這邊支持你了你還怕什麼是我想我們都樂觀其成勇敢一點啦"},{"start":7376.987,"end":7404.046,"text":"對阿,這件事其實不分黨派都也認為這是一個要一併檢討一併一併往前走啦好不好,我們就不分黨派往前努力的讓這件事,這個都是大家都想支持的,照顧主人的權益並且照顧這個山林來守護國土好不好,好啦等一下就要進主條了,副主委還是得答覆啦,謝謝"},{"start":7409.002,"end":7416.266,"text":"謝謝黃榮傑委員的質詢也謝謝中副主委那接下來我也請鄭正成委員質詢謝謝主席我想請一下中副主委請中副主委"},{"start":7433.407,"end":7441.899,"text":"中核發展基金中核發展基金中核發展基金中核發展基金中核發展基金"},{"start":7448.874,"end":7451.655,"text":"第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具"},{"start":7467.964,"end":7484.809,"text":"及第六條條文修正草案案。二、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。七、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具第六條條文修"},{"start":7497.694,"end":7503.499,"text":"禁伐補償條例第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":7522.737,"end":7532.324,"text":"立法院第1次聯席會議第2次聯席會議第3次聯席會議第4次聯席會議第5次聯席會議第6次聯席會議第7次聯席會議第8次聯席會議第9次聯席會議第10次聯席會議第11次聯席會議第12次聯席會議第13次聯席會議第14次聯席會議第14次聯席會議第15次聯席會議第16次聯席會議第17次聯席會議第18次聯席會議第18次聯席會議第19次聯席會議第19次聯席會議第20次聯席會議第21次聯席會議第22次聯席會議第22次聯席會議第23次聯席會議第24次聯�"},{"start":7548.497,"end":7567.867,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留第1條條文修正草案案。二、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具:「原住民保留第1條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具:「原住民保留第1條條文修正草案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具:「原住民保留第1條條文修正草案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具:「原住民保留第1條條文修正草案。六、審查委員鄭天"},{"start":7568.667,"end":7585.647,"text":"在我們人民會跟林業署這邊的一個回應當中的時候都提到了要將補償金區分為有撫育經營者6萬元跟沒有撫育經營者3萬元是這樣子的情況嗎?"},{"start":7587.174,"end":7592.278,"text":"立法院第11會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留"},{"start":7600.828,"end":7607.63,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":7621.415,"end":7639.543,"text":"禁伐補償條例,既然是禁伐,為什麼還會有有輔育者經營這個部分跟未輔育者經營?這個部分我們是先跟委員報告一下,因為這個部分您拿到的是我們第一版的一個"},{"start":7641.025,"end":7655.972,"text":"農業部的一個說明,那我們有做了一些修正。我們修正的情況就是剛剛我報告的部分,那我們是對這個部分是我們支持的,對於擴大範圍或是提升金額的部分。"},{"start":7656.312,"end":7665.496,"text":"禁伐補償條例第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具《原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第六條條文修正草案》案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具《原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第六條條文修正草案》案。"},{"start":7681.704,"end":7696.756,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第6條條文修正草案案。二、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第6條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第6條條文修正草案案。二、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第6條條文修正草案案。三、審查"},{"start":7708.513,"end":7713.577,"text":"地禁伐補償條例第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":7730.407,"end":7735.17,"text":"去年的數字得到補償的人是45700人面積6.7萬公頃6.7萬公頃跟7.2萬公頃只差0.5萬公頃還沒有拿到補償是這個意思嗎?抱歉我剛剛弄錯了"},{"start":7754.116,"end":7779.607,"text":"去年112年有補償的是7.2萬公頃。那整個禁法區的面積是多大?跟委員報告兩件事情。第一個禁法補償它是申請制的。所以它每一年的這個必須申請之後經檢測合格我們來再發放。那最主要是行政院在108年提出修法之後我們擴大禁法區域納入"},{"start":7780.347,"end":7795.04,"text":"都市計劃區水質水源保護區這部分。目前原住民保留地27萬公頃以林業用地16萬公頃,私有原住民保留地到今年為止提出申請的8.2萬公頃,不過還要經過檢測合格。"},{"start":7798.283,"end":7799.683,"text":"及第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財"},{"start":7824.19,"end":7826.632,"text":"立法院第11會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留第11會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留"},{"start":7840.845,"end":7851.51,"text":"第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":7866.956,"end":7885.594,"text":"立法院第1次聯席會議第1次聯席會議第2次聯席會議第3次聯席會議第4次聯席會議第5次聯席會議第6次聯席會議第7次聯席會議第8次聯席會議第9次聯席會議第10次聯席會議第11次聯席會議第12次聯席會議第12次聯席會議第13次聯席會議第14次聯席會議第14次聯席會議第15次聯席會議第16次聯席會議第17次聯席會議第18次聯席會議第18次聯席會議第19次聯席會議第19次聯席會議第19次聯席會議第20次聯席會議第21次聯席會議第22次聯�"},{"start":7890.923,"end":7918.879,"text":"謝謝主席,我們請中副組委林副署長,然後環境部的蘇組長。好,請上主委。在這裡先向在場的所有委員支持原住民族的公平正義,土地的公平正義這個禁法補償的這個修法的部分。然後另外呢,在審這個原住民保留地禁法補償條例之前,我也想先緬懷一下3月份盟主恩寵的簡東明委員。"},{"start":7920.06,"end":7924.781,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第6條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第6條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":7942.645,"end":7964.279,"text":"都是由原住民的委員在這裡奮鬥、努力、然後要求所以我特別懷念的是簡東明委員101年的時候我還有鄭天財委員還有簡東明委員我們不斷的協商經過了六次的黨團協商我今天講沒有行政院版本是原住民的版本"},{"start":7964.819,"end":7985.722,"text":"最后是在民进党委员田秋琴委员的支持之下民进党团最后签字让他三讀通过。然后108年也因为我的总质询要求有很多原住民族的范围里面被国家限制的并没有放在里头所以要求苏贞参委"},{"start":7987.324,"end":8008.501,"text":"行政院長能夠主動來提出行政院版本,因此108年也是我的總質詢,以後行政院長蘇院長也同意,所以因此有了修正第五條,這個第五條就是原住民保留地符合下列條件之一者有主管機關劃定為禁伐區域並且公告"},{"start":8009.241,"end":8035.913,"text":"是甚麼呢?第一個依照法規定的林業用地或適用林業用地的管制。第二個是依法劃設為原住民保護區或水源特定區。第三個就是在依法劃設在國家公園的區域,第四個其他經過主管機關熱定有實施禁法的必要。因此有了這個第五條的修正之後,我們原住民族的族人才會到現在有7點"},{"start":8037.133,"end":8059.783,"text":"2萬公頃的族人,將近4萬多人的族人領到了這個所謂的土地公平正義。」所以大家在這邊不要吵來吵去了。然後我們也看一下在今年我也最後對行政院長也就是陳建仁院長也經過我的總質詢。行政院長的回應是什麼?請大家聽好,尤其原民會。"},{"start":8061.587,"end":8065.511,"text":"及第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":8076.984,"end":8101.531,"text":"的政策應該是要一貫的,而不是按照現在有些立法委員說,或者是原民會你們說,我在這裡要特別譴責原民會。我雖然同意主委今天的請假,但是在禁法補償這種涉及到原住民族土地正義的法案上面,我們再回想一下,當初立法的時候,我們的民進黨的事務部移將主委,他還"},{"start":8101.971,"end":8126.699,"text":"及第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留及第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留及第六條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留及第六條條文修正草案案。七、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留及第六條條文修正草案案。八、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留及第六條條文修正"},{"start":8128.072,"end":8134.774,"text":"地禁補償條例第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":8148.917,"end":8153.101,"text":"我們可以看一下大家一直在講預算禁法補償目前7.2公頃補償金才23億如果我們按照我的提案增加2萬塊"},{"start":8162.082,"end":8177.31,"text":"增加14億左右而已耶!這14億真的會影響到我們國家的經濟的衰退?國家的經濟的整個預算嗎?然後會影響到國家的政策嗎?我們再來看一下書發佈一年預算149億啊!"},{"start":8181.292,"end":8195.796,"text":"他對國家、對我們這塊土地上有任何的貢獻嗎?而原住民的私人土地這是憲法被保障的,我們政府要配合政府這麼多的法規限制,我不能夠尊公眾。我們僅僅的要求,沒有過分的要求,按照林務局一樣6萬塊,按照平地休耕一樣5萬塊,我們錯在哪裡?"},{"start":8206.707,"end":8211.093,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":8216.414,"end":8245.771,"text":"我們再來看一下,104修法到現在已經快要十年了,物價不斷的飆升,修根補柱再講一次,已經到達五萬塊了。農業部報告也提到,人工林和竹林也撫育的是六萬塊,沒有撫育的三萬塊。我當然同意我們這個林業部的立場啊,在這裡要跟大家報告一下,禁法補償是必須要它的森林覆蓋率七成,"},{"start":8246.491,"end":8247.593,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具"},{"start":8261.853,"end":8264.534,"text":"農業部、林務局、我們的討論院跟非常多的專家學者討論為什麼要覆蓋率70%?就是因為不管是林地造林也好,不管是竹林也好,它是需要抒罰的啊。"},{"start":8277.561,"end":8280.604,"text":"所以今天林務局才會講,如果有抒罰的話,同意他提高6萬塊,如果沒有賦予的是3萬塊,就是要鼓勵大家去賦予抒罰嘛,不是這樣嗎?請問我們林務部的副署長,你們能回應一下,簡單回應一下,是不是?"},{"start":8299.892,"end":8310.86,"text":"及第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":8324.75,"end":8340.062,"text":"各黨團、民進黨黨團、民政黨黨團、國民黨團的委員們沒有意見的話,我們就可以宣讀通過。那如果大家有意見的話,我們就必須等到一個月後,我們在立法院來表決。」"},{"start":8341.638,"end":8362.791,"text":"一個月之後是520,也是賴清德總統就任的時候,到底我們的總統,我們中華民國的總統,我們的民進黨團在立法院的立法委員能不能支持,就要看大家對土地這件事情的看法。」"},{"start":8363.411,"end":8389.625,"text":"所以身為召委的我,待會會來審這幾條我希望這場的委員們能夠聽進去我今天的議席話也能夠符合中華民國憲法保障私人土地的這樣子的一個條文也保障原住民的土地的公平正義我再一次強調,我們這一次原住民的禁法補償是私人土地"},{"start":8390.325,"end":8409.72,"text":"不是所有的保留地而私人土地我當時計算過大概才8萬公頃現在被申請的只有7.2萬公頃所以他到底會造成我們國家到底多大的所謂的財政的困難請大家三思謝謝謝謝我們高金委員的質詢謝謝你也是一個所有的觀念"},{"start":8423.742,"end":8425.543,"text":"接下来有請李博弈委員有請中副主委"},{"start":8447.754,"end":8457.799,"text":"我們今天要審議原住民保留地禁伐條例那我們也很認真的去審視了一下從2015年開始這個條例通過之後2016年開始有編列預算開始支應這些相關的這些經費以後從2016年的"},{"start":8470.27,"end":8494.38,"text":"二點申請有2.4公頃裡面大概金額大概3億到2017年申請有3.8萬公頃那大概11億每年然後在逐年的增加到2023年也就是去年一共申請了7.2萬公頃那總金額是22億多"},{"start":8498.602,"end":8512.065,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案。七、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案。八、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案。九、審查委員"},{"start":8525.709,"end":8529.372,"text":"總面積80,000公頃,已經申請到7.2萬公頃,已經有45,700個受條例可以申請補償經費的原住民朋友,到"},{"start":8545.427,"end":8569.726,"text":"今年為止原民會所編列的這些補償的金額總計是124億。」我們在這裡表達因為我們也看了3月1號的時候當時還是陳建仁院長由吳立華委員他在總質詢的時候提出的這個質詢"},{"start":8572.789,"end":8586.49,"text":"針對這個條例來提出質詢的內容他當時是陳建仁院長也是朝正面的態度那我想我們當時的原住民的這個主委也是朝正面的態度但是就是要修法"},{"start":8587.071,"end":8612.308,"text":"我們現在遇到一個很尷尬的時間點我相信原民會在這邊也是支持我們的原住民的這些禁法條例的補償如果可以提高當然是對我們原民的一個照顧但是牽涉所有的修法如果牽涉到經費的話牽涉到預算的話它確實需要行政單位的一個一個整體的評估"},{"start":8614.589,"end":8629.624,"text":"還有更重要一點我們身為立法單位我們身為立法單位遇到這種預算的問題的話其實也必須要跟行政單位負責的來討論整體預算到底會增加多少"},{"start":8630.345,"end":8652.095,"text":"不是說增加十幾億會影響到國家財政而是必須要有這個討論跟過程所以在新政府520即將要上任在新內閣520即將要上任的時候之前我們來通過這個法案到底對於新政府是你必須要買單還是說我們可以再做進一步的溝通"},{"start":8652.975,"end":8658.958,"text":"及第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":8668.923,"end":8692.54,"text":"來一起來支持這個可以落實照顧原住民保留地的禁伐補償條例的這個措施讓草野共同來推動這個方案我覺得是我們期待的所以我們也期待如果等一下可以進來這個做逐條討論的時候也要尊重未來行政院未來新內閣對"},{"start":8694.921,"end":8717.646,"text":"我們原住民這些補償條例的一些想法跟看法這是我在這邊必須要提出我們正當新任的立法委員跟可能即將的新內閣必須要做這個新的這些預算的討論的時候必須要對於憲政上必須要負責一些責任跟分際在這邊表達民進黨團"},{"start":8721.007,"end":8748.732,"text":"在這邊表達個人以及民進黨其實五立法委員對於這個條例提高到6萬元的支持之外那也希望我們可以跟新內閣、新政府可以有這個憲政上的奮起的這個尊重那以上其實是副主委沒有辦法說出來的話你必須要表達支持但是你對於預算你沒有能力表達支持副主委是不是這樣子"},{"start":8751.725,"end":8780.225,"text":"對預算未來因為要整體要考量籌編所以可能可以加入我們未來去內部討論的部分。我也在其他政府單位草擬過預算每一個部會所提出來的預算大概是當年度的預算的三倍最後一定要經過行政院整體的評估考量再來做這個定案我們也期待520之後這個禁法條例的預算"},{"start":8781.56,"end":8791.119,"text":"額度可以增加落實到照顧我們的原住民朋友。」那也對於先前所有原住民委員對這個條例的努力表達尊敬感謝謝謝"},{"start":8795.816,"end":8818.808,"text":"非常謝謝博弈委員,謝謝。召委在這邊修正一下,不是照顧,因為這個是我們土地被限制,所以沒有照顧這樣的資源,好不好,謝謝。希望大家以後能修正一下,因為我們是配合政府,我們的私人土地被限制利用了,這叫做補償,不是照顧。謝謝,謝謝。好,繼續我們請張之倫、張之倫、張之倫委員提書面報告,繼續請吳祁銘召委,謝謝。"},{"start":8835.834,"end":8840.853,"text":"條例第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":8844.605,"end":8861.919,"text":"地禁伐補償條例第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案。七、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案。"},{"start":8868.404,"end":8869.445,"text":"禁伐補償上路105年面積2.4萬公頃113年面積7.2萬公頃禁伐保護條例補償條例禁伐沒有做任何開墾"},{"start":8897.605,"end":8916.178,"text":"及第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案。七、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案。八、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案。"},{"start":8927.526,"end":8951.744,"text":"第九條第一項有明定我們禁法補償的整個管理系統我們有建置一個系統出來所以去年建置的那對於誤差的部分我想應該會減少而且我們今年度開始我們做紙本以及電子方式的部分來做一個申請辦理所以這個部分的誤差應該我們會做一個先年度的一個檢討跟進進"},{"start":8953.936,"end":8977.785,"text":"第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案。七、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案。八、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案。"},{"start":8983.353,"end":8991.416,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":9007.382,"end":9019.688,"text":"審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。七、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":9036.016,"end":9047.963,"text":"及第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。七、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":9063.154,"end":9065.254,"text":"第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員盧縣一等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":9088.544,"end":9095.833,"text":"好,那我們就先休息一下好了。我們剛剛本來是說徐欣英委員休息五分鐘。好,現在請徐欣英委員來質詢,謝謝。"},{"start":9118.952,"end":9129.339,"text":"地禁補償條例第16條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁補條例第16條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁補條例第16條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁補條例第16條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁補條例第16條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天�"},{"start":9148.362,"end":9168.337,"text":"碳稀存的能力比木材還要強,在實現聯合國永續發展目標中可以扮演重要的角色,例如以竹代木、以竹代鋼、以竹代塑、甚至以竹剩木都是農業部和相關主管機關的努力課題。"},{"start":9173.889,"end":9198.754,"text":"但是我們發現,從民國97年到109年,國產的竹材生產量,比較表中我們可以看到,原住民保留地的竹材減產最為明顯。首先本席想請教主委,儀將主委,您知道...副主委,今天是副主委,對不起。"},{"start":9200.751,"end":9211.038,"text":"您知道原因嗎?我們秀出這個圖片,我們看到97年到現在,一直到109年的資料,整個的主財產量一直減產,這是什麼樣的因素?"},{"start":9219.964,"end":9237.172,"text":"對從數字上去看的確是有明顯的降低所以我們跟農業部都有一些合作針對竹林更新獎勵的規範希望主任能夠針對這裡員協助他們抒罰然後再做一個竹林的開採等相關的工作對本席主要請教是說那為什麼會這樣減少的這麼這麼明顯從2267千支到最後剩285"},{"start":9248.26,"end":9254.203,"text":"在做禁法補償之後可能也有一些影響。對,那有沒有什麼具體改進措施?這個部分我們是鼓勵族人抒罰。就用這樣的方式?是。好,希望能夠來加強。那再來就是說,"},{"start":9267.537,"end":9286.928,"text":"本席也想請教一下我們的副署長那從短期的多元利用技術整合開發到中期的提升品牌知名度阻止教育的建構等等再到長期的申請認證都涉及技術和法規的問題那有沒有相關具體方案可以來針對我們這個"},{"start":9291.33,"end":9294.291,"text":"新興竹產業發展計劃計劃執行進度是否如期?剩下的一年半期程還有哪些規劃?"},{"start":9311.818,"end":9330.304,"text":"這部分因為112年行政院合了一個新興族產業的一個計劃那目前來說的話我們是就依照我們整體的一個計劃就分幾個階段那尤其是產業端等等的這些本席最想問的是這個竹子是一個這麼好"},{"start":9334.585,"end":9358.073,"text":"而且我們可以好好的來發展的像本席所在的新竹縣我們竹東鎮以前早期有很多的特色產業竹席竹簾竹筷等等的那可是現在都慢慢的沒落所以我們主要就是希望這個我們這相關單位這裡是不是能夠有一些具體的做法"},{"start":9359.178,"end":9382.947,"text":"我們在去年的2月1號就訂定了一個原住民保留地竹林更新獎勵作業規範那這個作業規範獎勵的部分就是希望說原住民原住民族這些去做一個竹林的更新那這個部分如果你有依據我們這個作業規範的話我們也提供相關的大概3萬元的經費去做一些補助"},{"start":9383.387,"end":9384.408,"text":"審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":9401.063,"end":9423.415,"text":"大約29件提出獎勵更新,面積約27公頃,我們會慢慢推動,希望能夠去做更新作業。本席希望能夠看到成效。謝謝副主委跟副署長。也謝謝主席。本席想請環境部氣候變遷署的蘇營雲組長。"},{"start":9434.317,"end":9455.428,"text":"本席想請教有關淨零排放、淨零轉型是我們面對氣候變遷嚴峻的挑戰環境部也舉辦了一系列的淨零排放技術訓練課程本席也認為這個勢必是絕對要大力支持而且淨零議題也是我們全民共同努力的課題和目標"},{"start":9456.788,"end":9471.833,"text":"及第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。七、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。八、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具第六條條文修"},{"start":9485.717,"end":9496.566,"text":"立法院第11會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留第11會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留第11會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留第11會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留第11會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留第11會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「"},{"start":9514.08,"end":9532.345,"text":"第1年二期會提供比較正確而且比較第一手的資訊給大家。」那剛剛委員所提的部分我們會再做一個滾動的解答。對,因為越近鄰的一些觀念還有你們的推動都需要大量的讓我們國人來認識。但是好像我們如果有設置、我們有設定這樣的一個"},{"start":9534.749,"end":9555.44,"text":"年齡才免費,這樣推廣不易。其實不瞞你說本席對這一塊一直也在推動,可是我們感覺我們政府所做的宣導不夠落實。當然你現在如果又有一個費用的門檻,可能讓大家其實根本更不關心這個議題。"},{"start":9556.681,"end":9560.743,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":9585.124,"end":9589.508,"text":"非常謝謝徐新委員也謝謝組長我們休息五分鐘然後繼續開會謝謝"},{"start":9920.202,"end":9925.886,"text":"好,我們繼續開會請問一下我們的官員都到了嗎?幾個重要的都在了嗎?好,我們繼續請邱志偉委員來質詢"},{"start":9947.5,"end":9956.264,"text":"立法院第11會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。七、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。八、審查"},{"start":9975.253,"end":9994.279,"text":"第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正"},{"start":10005.297,"end":10022.723,"text":"國土保安、水土保持,那當然也是因為土地受到限制,按照原基法21條來做訂定一個補償的一個相關規定。所以也是對原住民生計做的所說的限制做補償嘛。那你的補償金額?目前補償金額到去年有22億多。對,補償是每公頃多少錢?每公頃3萬。你覺得這樣夠不夠?"},{"start":10036.241,"end":10045.074,"text":"當然以目前來講,很多意見是希望能夠調整。本會是說因為這個如果說要調帳,那是涉及到整個整體預算的籌編"},{"start":10051.035,"end":10070.78,"text":"目前每年大概變成多少預算?目前會裡面大概一年是111億、120億整個部分是22億我覺得你既然有補償那當然有補償相關的規定那金額你應該是要逐年做動態的檢討跟調整這部分請你們做參考"},{"start":10071.88,"end":10092.347,"text":"那這個如果地主因為害怕違反禁法的限制沒有針對這些貧老的竹林進行這個疏伏的疏伐的服役這個會不會違反當初保育的立法的原意這個副署長你了解嗎副署長副署長副署長給你表演一下"},{"start":10101.334,"end":10115.41,"text":"是那當然如果竹林都沒有去做一些經營整理的話那整體的竹林會敗壞那誰去檢討誰去勘驗誰去了解他是不是有符合進行相關的書法服務誰去驗證"},{"start":10119.116,"end":10142.669,"text":"這個部分大概就是各主管相關各主管機關各主管機關主管機關不是你們嗎對那當然在在那個原民在原住民保留地的這個部分是由縣市政府在做一些那你們要去你主管機關中央是你們啊你們去了解說是不是他有符合前面補償金的資格他有沒有達到這個保育的這個立法原意"},{"start":10144.684,"end":10158.917,"text":"那這個基本上那個補償金的部分是由相公所去做一些現場的認定那我們再若有什麼疑問的話我們再做協助如果竹木的覆蓋率的認定那個是誰在認定"},{"start":10160.646,"end":10180.143,"text":"基本上是基層的相公所的同仁。這個認定各機關要重新去協調,中央要有一個原則,然後各機關去做相關的討論跟原則,跟一些討論,覆蓋認定標準到底是怎麼樣?"},{"start":10184.404,"end":10200.149,"text":"這個部分我們可以從那個也可以用運用那個航拍的這個部分去做一些判斷為什麼覆蓋率覆蓋率是牽涉到有沒有有沒有請你的標準對不對是那零項零項是否符合這個規定標準零項"},{"start":10204.451,"end":10214.036,"text":"審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具第16條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具第16條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具第16條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":10230.674,"end":10245.087,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具《原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第6條條文修正草案》案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具《原住民保留第11屆第6條條文修正草案》案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具《原住民保留第11屆第6條條文修正草案》案。"},{"start":10255.983,"end":10274.797,"text":"有,我們是有一些規範,我們在今年的1月8號針對原住民保留地禁伐補償實施的辦法裡面,有一些規範,所以要覆蓋率七成才可以補償。那誰去驗證?相公所?相公所,對,是。還有縣府。"},{"start":10276.738,"end":10294.61,"text":"相公署有能力去驗證嗎?有,這個部分我們都有相關的工作人員,而且對於既有的建屋、道路跟農路要先扣除掉。好,謝謝兩位。主席是不是請環境部、氣候變遷署?我們有請這個蘇組長。這個蘇組長,我時間很長,你也...委員好。"},{"start":10304.079,"end":10329.231,"text":"有關於台灣碳費制度存在的幾個問題,我覺得衛福部有責任去做釐清或提出解決的方案。」我直接跳到這個問題,李教授你大家都知道,李建民教授你知道,他說制度上有幾個問題的存在,你們應該去了解,這個碳費用途非需求導向,"},{"start":10331.505,"end":10353.206,"text":"所以以至於碳費沒有辦法獲取共識,你對這一點有沒有看法?按照原本氣候法在立法跟我們在執行上的話,其實我們碳費其實不是以這個財政當作一個主要的目的,而是一個機制希望能夠讓push企業能夠因為這樣的機制而去減量。所以你應該用需求導向嘛,對不對?"},{"start":10355.321,"end":10372.587,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留第12條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留第12條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留第12條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留第12條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留第12條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員"},{"start":10381.784,"end":10392.634,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第12條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第12條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第12條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第12條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":10407.591,"end":10433.672,"text":"第三點,啟徵門檻有沒有依照產業的特性做一個差異化,這個會導致這個碳洩漏,你有沒有注意到這個問題?跟委員報告,針對這個啟徵門檻的部分,那目前我們在過去段時間已經跟企業還有跟經濟部整個有開很多密集的會議,我們有在做這個部分的一個討論,所以這個各界意見我們會把它納入做後續定點的一個參考。你有沒有注意到這個問題?是。"},{"start":10434.963,"end":10438.407,"text":"立法院第11會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第12條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財"},{"start":10444.705,"end":10473.911,"text":"這個部分有沒有什麼強化的效果?強化的規劃?目前探權的話分成兩個部分在目前資源減量的辦法跟後續的交易辦法我們都已經陸續立法或是已經在執行那希望能夠擴充這部分的量能力所以這個李建民教授這四大問題就是從制度面去去檢視所以我希望你們一個月之內針對台灣碳費制度所存在的四大問題你提出改善的規劃的書面報告是可以嗎?可以一個月?是OK"},{"start":10475.051,"end":10502.101,"text":"這個我要遵守諮詢時間,時間到我就不能佔用下一位諮詢時間。好,謝謝。好,謝謝邱志偉委員的質詢。謝謝,謝謝組長。謝謝。繼續我們請張家俊、張家俊、張家俊委員改書面報告。我們請楊瓊英、楊瓊英、楊瓊英委員改書面報告。謝一鳳、謝一鳳、謝一鳳委員不在。然後邱益穎、邱益穎、邱益穎委員不在。請陳亭飛委員質詢。"},{"start":10508.272,"end":10510.573,"text":"及第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財"},{"start":10526.164,"end":10551.416,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留第1條條文修正草案案。二、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具:「原住民保留第1條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具:「原住民保留第1條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具:「原住民保留第1條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具:「原住民保留第1條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員"},{"start":10553.737,"end":10562.181,"text":"連地方政府各縣市政府我相信你問了每一個縣市政府的承辦人員可能講的都不一樣現在面臨這個問題"},{"start":10566.175,"end":10590.748,"text":"立法院第11會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":10591.738,"end":10610.572,"text":"第16條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案案。七、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案案。八、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案案。九、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正"},{"start":10619.471,"end":10621.176,"text":"有22個直轄縣市,那請問總共我們現在有幾個縣市?"},{"start":10628.624,"end":10651.74,"text":"跟委員報告那目前22個縣市裡面把國土功能分區圖草案送到內政部來審議的有三個縣市那包括金門、連江跟花蓮縣政府那其他的縣市據我們的了解目前都在各個縣市的國審會在進行審議當中目前都在審議當中那請問越審民眾越擔憂為什麼"},{"start":10658.29,"end":10682.235,"text":"跟委員報告那據我們的了解那第一個就是民眾對於未來國土功能分區的一些使用目前大概不是那麼樣的一個了解那另外就是連地方政府縣市政府都不懂了都不了解了請問人民怎麼了解"},{"start":10684.458,"end":10696.341,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留第12條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具"},{"start":10702.97,"end":10706.632,"text":"及第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":10716.175,"end":10728.626,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案。"},{"start":10735.351,"end":10748.896,"text":"對阿所以你知道嗎現在網路上好多趕快趕快!你趕快申辦!你趕快送!現在不送來不及了!我們每天被追著跑!委員啦!快啦!我們的案件要快送啦!沒送的賣負啦!我說什麼賣負啦!"},{"start":10752.546,"end":10779.588,"text":"所以我覺得你們是不是應該做一個什麼樣的一個說明然後把這些疑義講得更清楚否則地方政府再審反而民眾更擔憂民眾更恐慌所以才會說你要演啊不要急速上路啊急速上路之後可能百姓沒有辦法接受之後會反射在我們執政團隊的支持度上"},{"start":10781.128,"end":10790.975,"text":"跟委員報告那我們大概有幾個方向在加強這樣的一個說明第一個在各個縣市政府在辦理國審會的審議的時候我們都國土署會派員到現場回應相關國審會委員的一些問題來主導我跟你說一個最關鍵的因為我時間有限"},{"start":10804.845,"end":10831.081,"text":"這次我們來自基層我直接跟你說問題在哪裡當你們在第一次做說明會的時候你們是誰去說明市政府市政府我告訴你市政府得到你們的所有訊息都這樣片段片段片段他都得到片段片段片段他怎麼去跟地方說明地方得到訊息又是更片段又更片段"},{"start":10832.31,"end":10855.019,"text":"所以你們要辦一次是你們中央所有的部會、懂的人、了解的人去做一次徹底的說明,這有沒有辦法?跟委員報告,其實我們是透過各種機制在跟不管是產官、學界都在加強說明。不用產官、學界,你跟百姓說明清楚就好了。"},{"start":10855.68,"end":10876.984,"text":"土地是他們的啦!產官學界是你們在這個高位當中你們在產官學界啦!百姓我的權益在哪裡我怎麼保護自己最重要啦!做一次徹底的說明啦!這個是我要求然後拜託林業級自然保育署副署長林班弟的問題怎麼解決?"},{"start":10885.589,"end":10902.818,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":10910.427,"end":10916.013,"text":"有專案申請的部分已經有重新簽訂合約,有簽訂合約的沒有問題嗎?對不對?那沒有簽訂合約的呢?"},{"start":10921.318,"end":10945.964,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留第1條條文修正草案案。二、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留第1條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留第1條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留第1條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留第1條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員"},{"start":10947.637,"end":10953.799,"text":"會嗎?會嗎?你們會尊重縣市政府的規劃嗎?這個部分麻煩一下您搬遞這個也造成地方很大的問題很困擾是請做一個說明給我們謝謝好謝謝好謝謝陳廷飛委員的質詢謝謝也謝謝林副署長謝謝繼續我們請吳麗華委員質詢"},{"start":10986.475,"end":10990.544,"text":"謝謝主席,有請今天參與的各部會可以嗎?"},{"start":10991.167,"end":10996.149,"text":"國土管理署都市計劃組組長、農業部林業和自然保育署法務部法務司、經濟部水利署保育事業組、環境部氣候變遷署組長、主計總署專務委員"},{"start":11018.786,"end":11037.056,"text":"以上請各部會宣讀的名字請上台,謝謝。好,謝謝主席。各位部會官員大家好。其實每一次談到原住民族的土地,我們都覺得心情非常的沉重。"},{"start":11038.257,"end":11064.746,"text":"我們看到以原住民保留地來講長期以來我們看到的就是它的限制處處動輒超限利用開發我們呢變得土地沒有價值人家常常笑我們原住民啊窮的只剩下土地原住民啊只能在自己的土地當別人的故宮"},{"start":11066.598,"end":11091.991,"text":"但是我們很了解政府對我們的期待就是原住民要守護山林為了國土保育為了水源的涵養但是有限制就應該要有補償所以長期在過去的立委一直在訴求能不能夠針對我們這些被限制利用的土地"},{"start":11093.186,"end":11110.635,"text":"你禁止我砍伐禁止我利用可不可以給我們補償金很高興終於在2016年原住民開始有了禁伐補償金那我在這邊也看到"},{"start":11111.775,"end":11120.8,"text":"立法院第11屆第1次聯席會議第1次聯席會議第2次聯席會議第3次聯席會議第4次聯席會議第5次聯席會議第6次聯席會議第7次聯席會議第8次聯席會議第8次聯席會議第9次聯席會議第10次聯席會議第11次聯席會議第12次聯席會議第12次聯席會議第13次聯席會議第14次聯席會議第14次聯席會議第15次聯席會議第16次聯席會議第17次聯席會議第18次聯席會議第18次聯席會議第19次聯席會議第19次聯席會議第19次聯席會議第20次聯席會議第"},{"start":11134.935,"end":11148.541,"text":"其實我們去爬梳過去的立法理由我們有看到那個時候大家對於每一年3萬的禁伐補償金是不滿意的喔其實最早的版本91年是一公頃10萬喔可是當年為什麼會有這樣的一年3萬我們來看一下當初有提"},{"start":11157.99,"end":11179.988,"text":"禁法補償條例第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。七、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。八、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。九、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬"},{"start":11187.737,"end":11214.226,"text":"是因為最後大家用林務局的蔣府造林20年60萬這樣的基準去所以大家就說好吧那就一公頃一年3萬塊可是我們來看一下現在今年即將要公佈施行的新的蔣府造林是來到6年最高60萬"},{"start":11215.782,"end":11233.777,"text":"第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。七、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":11244.25,"end":11250.536,"text":"總總我們看到的這些都告訴我們是該調整禁伐補償金是時候了"},{"start":11251.539,"end":11279.585,"text":"所以我也在去年特別在院會質詢陳建仁行政院長他很明快的講請原民會嚴議提高的一個草擬辦法過來我今年呢我再度在院會質詢行政院長跟主計長主計長的才事也很明快他說只要大家都認同他願意編列預算會來支持支應"},{"start":11281.383,"end":11305.708,"text":"所以今天我們來這個地方我們大家草野我們都有提案版本出來那我們的訴求其實就非常的明確我們都有提版本那以我版本來看我就是覺得碳費碳權的交易已經啟動了蔣府造林的金額提高了水質水量保護區的獎勵標準也跟我們相差一半"},{"start":11306.588,"end":11322.479,"text":"所以我在這個地方特別提禁法補償條例修法的第六條就是增加了一個第三款中華民國114年起每年每公頃新台幣6萬元當然這個可以交給大家一起來討論"},{"start":11323.973,"end":11330.035,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第12條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第12條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第12條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":11340.839,"end":11351.763,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留第1條條文修正草案案。二、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留第1條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留第1條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留第1條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留第1條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員"},{"start":11371.411,"end":11398.128,"text":"落實禁伐精神我也講了好幾年謝謝今年我也看到已經修正公告上路了就是你們第六條用負面表列只要不要有定著的這一些建築那只要不要鋪設水泥的這些道路你們是用負面表列只要不是你們就不會再東扣西扣因為這個民怨很深啊你們也常常知道天災一來崩塌地一堆"},{"start":11398.848,"end":11408.095,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":11423.652,"end":11447.097,"text":"我要確認,因為我一直要求訴求,我們這些崩塌地的面積不能扣在分子,要扣在分母,這個確認了。好,那謝謝。那另外一個小提醒就是,因為我們的申請是到4月底,可是我們也知道蔣府照齡要上路了。"},{"start":11448.312,"end":11457.88,"text":"這個中間會有空窗期因為以後滿6年不用再返還之前的照齡補償金所以我要確認一下因為他會轉禁法補償這個空窗期會讓他損失今年可以參與禁法補償所以我希望我們這個地方農業部保署跟我們的原民會一定要去注意這個問題像是可以延長我們的申請期限就等待新的蔣府照齡上路"},{"start":11477.156,"end":11480.441,"text":"條例第16條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":11504.615,"end":11524.236,"text":"謝謝主席我們是不是有請我們內政部國土計劃署我們請國土計劃署你是要組長嗎都市計劃還是綜合計劃綜合計劃國家公園署綜合計劃還有國土管理署的都市計劃署"},{"start":11525.865,"end":11551.068,"text":"還有國土計劃組組長、營建管理組的科長。」你們可能會有關於蔡委員想回答的問題。謝謝。好,組長。今天在討論這個原住民保留地禁伐的一個補償。那我想請教一下,因為這個當然是對於說原住民的土地嘛,他的土地受到"},{"start":11551.883,"end":11559.527,"text":"相關的土地利用的限制,那所以要給他一個補償。」那我想聽一下你們的看法是怎樣?現在看好了?"},{"start":11567.521,"end":11594.126,"text":"土地但受到限制的時候應該要給一個合理的補償條例的主管機關主要是原住民委員會內政部今天的書面報告我們是對於不管是擴大適用範圍我們也表達尊重大會委員的意見主要是補償的政策跟立法精神那我要講第二頁了那接下來就是你們的事國土計畫法"},{"start":11596.964,"end":11623.312,"text":"預計在明年的4月要上路。」那這個計劃法事實上就把土地就把它分做了四大類那這中間包括有所謂的農業發展地區那有所謂的國土保育地區以及海洋資源那針對農業發展地區所謂農一跟農二優良農地跟良好農地國土保育區那這樣算不算是對於土地利用的一個限制"},{"start":11625.141,"end":11650.86,"text":"跟委員報告因為農業發展地區他還是可以做他有一些做他原來既有合法的使用原來既有的合法使用有一些容許的使用對但是他的土地相對於其他城鄉發展區他的限制他就是有他的限制啊就是他不能說他沒有好你說他原來既有他原來既有這樣就有這樣的限制限制就是存在"},{"start":11651.681,"end":11667.288,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第1條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第1條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第1條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第1條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":11678.446,"end":11696.96,"text":"因為他現在的功能分區草案還沒有送到內政部來那據我們了解目前他目前的草案大概是不會劃農業發展地區沒有嘛對不對臺北市就沒有嘛所以這是一個很極端的臺北市享受的統籌分配款國家給資源的挹注應該是全國所有的都市最多吧"},{"start":11703.655,"end":11717.026,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第12條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第12條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第12條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第12條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":11731.21,"end":11736.772,"text":"公務員報告,因為這個農地發展的部分,那應該主管機關應該是農業部,那這個部分內政部也在...我知道,但是內政部你們在規劃國土計劃法嘛,所以我...對不對,所以...好,你剛剛繼續把它講完"},{"start":11747.535,"end":11761.332,"text":"我們內政部其實針對這個部分一直在跟農業部有一直在協調看看這個部分是不是對農業發展區的一些使用讓這些使用能再做一些放寬"},{"start":11764.52,"end":11782.174,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留第1條條文修正草案案。二、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具:「原住民保留第1條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具:「原住民保留第1條條文修正草案案。二、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具:「原住民保留第1條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具:「原住民保留第1條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員"},{"start":11795.492,"end":11800.015,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留地禁伐補償條例第6條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具"},{"start":11815.166,"end":11833.833,"text":"直接限制不能建築,那我們會把它編為國土保育用地,那這個用地我們就會來做一些補償。我們就依照他的損失,比如說土地我們就補償土地,上面有建築物我們就補償建築物。"},{"start":11835.388,"end":11838.793,"text":"等19人擬具等價補償條例第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":11847.623,"end":11858.01,"text":"立法院第11會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案。"},{"start":11879.644,"end":11906.139,"text":"國土計劃法要上路就是要搭配財政收支劃分法。」你財政收支劃分你一旦你從來沒有把所謂的一個統籌分配把它針對我這個縣市我既然負擔了多少的一個農一農二的一個負擔我負擔了多少保育地我為了保讓台灣的水源是可以保護的可是我沒有拿到統籌分配啊這樣對縣市怎麼會公平呢"},{"start":11909.572,"end":11911.354,"text":"三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":11935.971,"end":11936.151,"text":"審查委員鄭天財"},{"start":11960.055,"end":11969.123,"text":"非常謝謝蔡議員委員的質詢,謝謝,謝謝關於你們的回應,謝謝,繼續我們請侯孟凱侯孟凱,侯孟凱委員不在,請盧縣委員質詢主席,有請我們中副主委有請中副主委,謝謝"},{"start":11985.626,"end":11999.017,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留第1條條文修正草案案。二、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第1條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第1條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第1條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第1條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第1條條文修正"},{"start":12012.369,"end":12029.464,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案。"},{"start":12040.544,"end":12041.045,"text":"審查委員盧縣一等19人擬具"},{"start":12050.556,"end":12068.681,"text":"立法院第11會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留第12條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留第11會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留第12會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留第12會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留第12會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留第12會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留第12會期內"},{"start":12078.263,"end":12101.576,"text":"很多人幾乎都住在都會來上班可是他確實有這些禁房補償的地的時候他還要花時間請假回去做這些每次都在重複的事情跟委員報告我們希望能夠改善我們今年開始逐步在做處理那我想問一個問題就是目前我們受益的人數是多少?大概?五萬一千多到去年的人口數"},{"start":12102.742,"end":12118.795,"text":"禁伐補償條例第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人�"},{"start":12131.425,"end":12141.561,"text":"六萬提高到五萬這樣的一個需求是非常基本的一個要求,是不是?可以理解嗎?理解。好,那我們再看下一頁。"},{"start":12146.267,"end":12163.765,"text":"本席這次是針對我們一些地區可能還沒有化為我們禁法補償的做一些修正大概看一下在都市計劃區裡面自然林木或者是植生覆蓋不移耕種的地區能夠化入大概有看過嗎"},{"start":12166.067,"end":12183.913,"text":"第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正"},{"start":12196.697,"end":12206.184,"text":"所謂的一個基點,如果是6萬這樣的一個訴求,希望是大家都可以接受的。那請副主委這邊多多支持,謝謝。是,是,謝謝委員。"},{"start":12208.95,"end":12228.166,"text":"好謝謝盧縣英委員的資訊謝謝盧縣英謝謝繼續請游皓游皓游皓委員不在何新淳何新淳何新淳委員不在陳瑩陳瑩陳瑩委員不在鍾嘉斌鍾嘉斌鍾嘉斌委員不在林楚英林楚英林楚英委員不在丁學忠委員要資訊嗎好謝謝好"},{"start":12231.902,"end":12247.442,"text":"現在登記發言的委員除了不在場的之外都發言完畢結束了。那委員楊瓊英、林戴華、張志倫、張家俊、黃仁、謝一、鳳委員所提的書面質詢列入。"},{"start":12248.766,"end":12270.223,"text":"還有丁學中委員所提的書面質詢列入紀錄刊登公報。書面質詢和未及答覆的部分,請相關單位在一週內以書面答覆並複製本會。包委員會,我們現在就進行法案的審查,請宣讀討論事項,所有的條文。謝謝。我們宣讀完畢之後就進行協商了,謝謝。"},{"start":12272.868,"end":12298.083,"text":"地禁伐補償條例第十三條委員盧縣一等19人提案及委員吳立華等16人提案,增訂第一項第三款。三、位於都市計劃地區維持自然林木或植生覆蓋不移農耕之土地,其餘同線型條文。第五條委員鄭天財等18人提案,增訂第四款,四國土保安用地,原第四款一列第五款,其餘同線型條文。"},{"start":12300.39,"end":12315.916,"text":"第六條委員高金素梅等19人提案及委員鄭天財等18人提案。增訂第一項第三款。三、中華民國114年請每年每公頃新台幣5萬元。增訂第三項第一項之禁法補償金額度自中華民國114年請每兩年調整一次。"},{"start":12318.357,"end":12336.943,"text":"由中央主管機關參照中央主機器官發布至最近一年消費者物價指數,較前次調整之前一年消費者物價指數成長率公告調整之,但成長率為零或複數時不予調整,其餘同線型條文。」委員盧縣一等19人提案。增訂第一項第三款。三、中華民國114年起"},{"start":12338.604,"end":12362.585,"text":"每年每公請新台幣6萬元,其後每二年調整一次由中央主管機關參照,中央主計機關發布之最近一年消費者物價指數較前次調整之,前一年消費者物價指數成長率公告調整之,但成長率為零或複數時不予調整,其餘同線型條文。」委員吳麗華等16人提案。增訂第一項第三款。三、中華民國114年請每年每公請新台幣6萬元,"},{"start":12364.71,"end":12383.977,"text":"增訂第三項,第一項之禁伐補償金額度自中華民國114年起,每二年調整一次,由中央主管機關參照中央主計機關發布之最近一年消費者物價指數較前次調整之前一年消費者物價指數成長率公告調整之,其餘同現行條文。宣讀完畢"},{"start":12390.359,"end":12407.491,"text":"宣傳完畢,我們先來處理委員盧縣一等19人提案的第三條,還有委員吳麗華等16人提案的第三條。我們先看一下第三條,請問一下在座的委員或是我們所有在場的官員有沒有什麼意見?來,我們請這個人民會來說明一下。"},{"start":12415.359,"end":12440.242,"text":"你同意嗎?第三條這個盧縣一委員和吳立華委員也就是說在現行條文的第三條裡面他們加的第三款位於都市計畫地區維持自然禮募或直升覆蓋不營農耕的土地然後吳立華委員也是位於都市計畫地區維持自然禮募或直升覆蓋不營農耕的土地對這個他們新增的第三款有什麼意見?"},{"start":12442.122,"end":12467.208,"text":"委員包括因為這個部分其實在第五條第四款我們原民會可以認定有實施禁法是必要的就可以劃定公告所以這個部分應該都可以涵蓋在裡面所以你的意思是說從108年修訂的第五條裡面其實就已經把它涵蓋在裡面你確定嗎好請問一下在場的兩位委員對於原住民原民會的說法你們有什麼意見"},{"start":12470.216,"end":12493.347,"text":"第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具第六條條文修正草案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具第六條條文修正草案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具第六條條文修正草案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具第六條條文修正草案。七、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具第六條條文修正草案。"},{"start":12496.015,"end":12497.737,"text":"及第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":12511.215,"end":12517.08,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財"},{"start":12537.474,"end":12543.416,"text":"特定區外之區域應就受限制的情形,我們是不是就可以從個案來認定?很同意啊好,吳亦華委員同意,請問一下盧縣英委員好,那麼這一條的話"},{"start":12555.317,"end":12559.519,"text":"第三條維持縣刑條文。鄭天財委員第五條跟縣刑條文多增加第四項,國土保安用地。鄭天財委員"},{"start":12579.423,"end":12604.471,"text":"有關這個國土保安用地上次在這個修正的時候沒有納入那後來後來這個有透過解釋透過解釋為什麼因為國土保安用地的他的整個第一個他跟我們的第一條的立法部地是一樣的第二個他的管制其實是更嚴格的"},{"start":12605.271,"end":12619.197,"text":"所以後來人民會有透過解釋把國安國土保安用地納入監視。既然我們這次要修法就把它明確明定在這個條文裡面以上"},{"start":12621.047,"end":12642.352,"text":"所以鄭天財委員意思就是說必須要明定在上面請問委員會的意見現在已經在適用了現在已經在適用了現在因為114年我們在公告的時候就把國土保安納進來那目前已經私有地面積有414公頃有在申請所以實際上是已經納入了已經納入所以鄭天財委員意思說是把它明文化"},{"start":12644.052,"end":12663.3,"text":"請問一下那其實就跟剛剛盧委員跟吳委員的意思一樣都已經在用了你要不要再把他放進去就看你的看法啦我當然跟前案室一樣都有在公告的函式裡面來"},{"start":12672.577,"end":12679.143,"text":"政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":12694.298,"end":12709.391,"text":"根據內政部的意見,未來這個用詞也都會改了,所以我就不堅持了,因為這個用詞,林業用地的用詞,什麼國土保安用地的用詞,未來也都會改了,我們到時候再一併的來"},{"start":12711.483,"end":12731.627,"text":"非常謝謝鄭天財委員所以第五條我們也是維持現行條文我們再來看第六條遭委我19人的提案還有鄭天財等18人的提案我們其實大概都一樣大概在條文裡面請問一下園民會裡面有沒有什麼意見"},{"start":12740.987,"end":12759.68,"text":"對、還有這個盧縣一委員19人提案盧縣一委員的提案是6萬塊然後吳麗華委員16人提案的是6萬塊所以在第6條裡面比較不一樣的是金額的部分請原民會你們的態度"},{"start":12761.482,"end":12781.919,"text":"跟委員報告因為按照原計法因為土地受限制所以匡列預算本來是原民會應該做的工作那因為這個部分正在籌編預算的時候是不是榮原民會跟相關部會再做一個討論你們幾月幾號以前要把這個預算給籌編好請問一下依法你們是什麼時候要報院"},{"start":12790.253,"end":12819.455,"text":"五月底。五月底是這樣子我跟大家說明一下今天我們如果送草野協商的話那我們的議事處發行給各黨團的開始算起一個月之內就可以表決了那當然我身為召委的這是原住民非常重要的土地法案公平正義的法案我會請這個議事處發行給各黨團之後我馬上就要排草野協商"},{"start":12819.875,"end":12831.018,"text":"第16條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":12842,"end":12851.212,"text":"金額的部分還是就把他全部保這六條四位委員的我們就送草野協商好 請張慶祿委員啊 不是啦 張宏祿委員抱歉抱歉"},{"start":12858.268,"end":12861.131,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財"},{"start":12878.247,"end":12882.429,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第12條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員"},{"start":12899.52,"end":12900.82,"text":"三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":12921.048,"end":12923.429,"text":"及第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員盧縣一等19人擬具"},{"start":12937.518,"end":12956.909,"text":"所以我覺得來表決數字好像不是很好的狀況我覺得今天透過這一場會議其實尤其主席召集的這場會議應該是也讓大家讓社會各界都看出來其實我們這一屆的委員不分黨派好不好不分黨派我們其實都支持了這個方向了我覺得這個對社會各界應該是已經足夠清楚的狀況"},{"start":12960.211,"end":12968.314,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第6條條文修正草案。"},{"start":12981.418,"end":13001.085,"text":"有兩個有那個總統交接嘛行政團隊要交接的狀況所以未來要執行預算的部分是不是也讓他們應該表示一下意見那我覺得主席今天您排的時間點也是蠻巧妙的蠻好的如果他剛好是一個月的朝野協商的話其實跟新團隊提預算送進來"},{"start":13002.225,"end":13013.873,"text":"表示態度的時間也差不多差不多啊所以我是覺得可以這樣考慮會不會整個的狀況更圓滿反正我們全部都支持的態度也已經表達了大概是謝謝喬惠委員的支持我們請提案委員吳立華委員我們看一下齁這個除了6萬跟5萬的金額不一樣之外呢"},{"start":13023.56,"end":13049.393,"text":"對都差不多的話那還有就是這個第三第三項後面就是每我的部分是每兩年調整一次然後以最近一年消費物價指數叫前次調整的前一年物價者物價指數成長率公告調整成長率為零或複數時不予調整然後鄭天才委員的大概是"},{"start":13050.674,"end":13052.917,"text":"條例第6條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":13065.741,"end":13066.261,"text":"條例第6條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":13080.848,"end":13099.825,"text":"立法院第11會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留第11條條文修正草案案。二、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留第11條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留第11會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留第11會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留第11會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留第11會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人�"},{"start":13102.888,"end":13123.478,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具:「原住民保留第1條條文修正草案案。二、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留第1條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留第1條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留第1條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具:「原住民保留第1條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員"},{"start":13128.061,"end":13139.384,"text":"第16條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":13149.162,"end":13151.044,"text":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具"},{"start":13167.617,"end":13181.441,"text":"我們在場這個民進黨委員跟內政委員跟經濟委員會的如果都同意的話我想這個這個我們行政院就會照案通過他們就必須要去處理這個金額的部分以及籌措預算有啊"},{"start":13183.542,"end":13186.283,"text":"審查委員盧縣一等19人擬具:「原住民保留"},{"start":13209.014,"end":13209.856,"text":"這場的委員沒有意見嗎?來,女委員。沒有意見。"},{"start":13219.671,"end":13220.812,"text":"第一項禁伐金額度檢討"},{"start":13246.704,"end":13249.506,"text":"條例第6條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":13252.97,"end":13279.193,"text":"但是我真的要緩解一下為什麼要提六萬其實我在立法說明質詢的時候講得很清楚也讓大家了解事實上如果用現在的國際的探險是一公頃八萬如果用我們目前的蔣府照領是一公頃十萬所以我才會最後想說用六萬的版本那如果大家都同意的話就非常感謝大家謝謝"},{"start":13280.782,"end":13299.798,"text":"盧縣一等19人擬具盧縣一等19人擬具盧縣一等19人擬具盧縣一等19人擬具盧縣一等19人擬具盧縣一等19人擬具盧縣一等19人擬具盧縣一等19人擬具盧縣一等19人擬具盧縣一等19人擬具盧縣一等19人擬具盧縣一等19人擬具盧縣一等19人擬具盧縣一等19人擬具盧縣一等19人擬具盧縣一等19人擬具盧縣一等19人擬具盧縣一等19人擬具盧縣一等19人擬具盧縣一等19人擬具盧縣"},{"start":13309.406,"end":13329.134,"text":"也要等新的政府有新的主委來對這個預算來表達他的態度當然我們立法院我們提出來的我們方向上一致的支持之外那我們也支持最高的版本當然我們更可能期待新的主委會有更好的照顧啊一、剛剛吳立華委員講的現在國際探權一公"},{"start":13335.257,"end":13355.711,"text":"一公噸3500元的話他會有更高的標準出來那我們是不是保留這個朝這個方向只有在這個5萬6萬之間甚至可能更高啊我們會期待啊新的政府來提出來來做我們先保留這個協商的空間那期待520之後"},{"start":13356.972,"end":13380.899,"text":"有新的更好的方案來出來這個我們也是請他們要尊重我們立法院這一個方向的修正只是說我們在金額上面我們會期待更高但是在這幾個版本裡面並沒有期待更高的文字出現我們把它這樣子直接進去我覺得還是有點可惜啦因為今天提案的就是這幾個兩個金額而已沒有其他委員的提案謝謝博弈委員好我們請鄭天財委員好麥玉珍委員謝謝"},{"start":13385.027,"end":13411.783,"text":"剛的發言是說他希望新的主委會更多的期望這個是不影響不是不影響不影響因為第一個我們必須委員會先出委員會然後這個什麼時候要三讀通過等新520的時候新的主委我們來跟你們談如果他建議要更高那更好這第一個"},{"start":13412.469,"end":13432.278,"text":"第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案。"},{"start":13443.14,"end":13449.223,"text":"條例第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":13465.05,"end":13485.719,"text":"及第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具:「原住民保留及第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具:「原住民保留及第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具:「原住民保留及第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具:「原住民保留及第六條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":13488.168,"end":13490.47,"text":"三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具"},{"start":13511.301,"end":13515.526,"text":"財用高金委員版本及鄭天財委員版本及吳立華委員版本"},{"start":13521.138,"end":13544.532,"text":"政、經濟委員高金素梅等19人擬具第12條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第12條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第12條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第12條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第12條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第12條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財S"},{"start":13550.034,"end":13550.936,"text":"及第六條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":13565.657,"end":13579.733,"text":"請問各位委員,我們照剛才宣讀的結論通過,請問有沒有異議?好,本次會議的記錄還有審查通過的條文和相關的法制用語授權主席還有議事人員整理,請問各位委員有沒有意見?"},{"start":13582.022,"end":13583.103,"text":"第六條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財"},{"start":13608.477,"end":13627.144,"text":"是採用高金素梅委員鄭天財委員的部分來採取協商。我還是要強調一下,今天的協商謝謝大家不是以各委員的版本,而是大家綜合的版本。"},{"start":13628.064,"end":13629.326,"text":"審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":13643.868,"end":13646.872,"text":"地禁法補償條例第3條、第5條及第6條條文修正草案案。已經併案審查完畢,擬具審查報告提到院會討論。請問在場的委員。"},{"start":13658.928,"end":13672.994,"text":"需要黨壇協商綱 。本案在院會討論的時候由本席高金委員做補充說明。本次的議程處理完畢,我們現在散會。感謝,謝謝經濟委員會、內政委員會,謝謝你們。"},{"start":13691.367,"end":13701.18,"text":"第16條條文修正草案案。三、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第16條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具"},{"start":13707.458,"end":13735.608,"text":"禁伐補償條例第六條條文修正草案案。四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。五、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具第六條條文修正草案案。六、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人�"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}