{"error":false,"id":["158771"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":158771,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/158771","日期":"2025-01-08","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"委員會-11-2-19-22","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第2會期經濟委員會第22次全體委員會議","屆":11,"會期":2,"會次":22,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"委員會","委員會代碼":[19],"委員會代碼:str":["經濟委員會"],"標題":"第11屆第2會期經濟委員會第22次全體委員會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2025-01-08T11:50:57+08:00","結束時間":"2025-01-08T11:56:52+08:00","影片長度":"00:05:55","支援功能":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/740a0dd0b202cb581e7016fd1b0f9d49a56fd3a12bc29fbbeefebb33f5927238d6197b49c015b13e5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"黃健豪","委員發言時間":"11:50:57 - 11:56:52","會議時間":"2025-01-08T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第2會期經濟委員會第22次全體委員會議（事由：一、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算非營業部分關於經濟部主管：經濟作業基金、水資源作業基金、經濟特別收入基金、核能發電後端營運基金。(詢答)\n二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算營業部分關於經濟部主管：台灣糖業股份有限公司、台灣中油股份有限公司。(詢答)\n【1月8日及9日兩天一次會】）","transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":0.03096875,"end":0.5372187500000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":9.970343750000001,"end":14.57721875,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":13.31159375,"end":14.290343750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":15.285968750000002,"end":15.52221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":28.414718750000002,"end":29.29221875,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":29.579093750000002,"end":29.950343750000002,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":30.355343750000003,"end":30.895343750000002,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":31.266593750000002,"end":46.62284375,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":46.74096875,"end":61.000343750000006,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":61.523468750000006,"end":62.65409375,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":63.649718750000005,"end":66.14721875000001,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":66.41721875,"end":67.04159375,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":67.37909375000001,"end":71.17596875000001,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":71.91846875,"end":78.39846875,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":78.97221875000001,"end":82.53284375000001,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":83.14034375,"end":84.25409375000001,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":84.55784375,"end":100.28534375000001,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":100.74096875000001,"end":101.19659375,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":101.39909375,"end":102.79971875000001,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":103.71096875,"end":106.90034375,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":107.15346875,"end":111.69284375000001,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":112.31721875000001,"end":117.05909375,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":118.18971875000001,"end":118.91534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":118.96596875,"end":118.99971875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":119.59034375,"end":166.87409375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":122.52659375,"end":123.64034375000001,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":136.87034375000002,"end":137.46096875,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":167.21159375000002,"end":176.25659375,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":176.49284375000002,"end":181.36971875,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":182.09534375,"end":186.85409375,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":187.24221875,"end":190.22909375,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":190.60034375,"end":193.31721875000002,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":193.40159375000002,"end":212.06534375,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":212.20034375,"end":214.73159375,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":215.08596875,"end":219.45659375000002,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":220.03034375000001,"end":243.23346875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":243.25034375,"end":252.16034375,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":252.66659375,"end":256.71659375,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":256.88534375,"end":260.12534375,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":260.59784375000004,"end":265.42409375,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":265.79534375000003,"end":272.71409375,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":272.91659375,"end":276.10596875000005,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":276.79784375,"end":290.41596875,"speaker_score":0.891},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"黃委員健豪","start":290.53409375,"end":293.74034375,"speaker_score":0.89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董事長在今天的這個經營概括跟營業預算報告裡面您提到說台糖會配合所謂的政府的這個社福的政策來提供相關的土地嘛那在過去這些年裡面不管是針對這個長照式的住宿式長照機構也好"},{"start":47.152,"end":62.314,"text":"還是針對這個社會住宅也好都有提供蠻多的土地那我想問一下董事長這個提供土地部分你們是配合呢還是你們會主動的釋出盤點出這個閒置用地給地方政府來或是給電子幕來使用以社宅為例的話"},{"start":64,"end":82.174,"text":"跟委員報告我們是盤點出來然後給那個地方政府或是中央政府需要的來篩選所以如果有在這個市中心精華區的部分你們提供了盤點出來的土地就讓可能內政部也好或地方政府來決定要怎麼樣來使用是不是這樣子"},{"start":83.368,"end":102.555,"text":"大概是這樣 對再來這個社福完之後你的這個報告裡面有提到說同時也會配合能源政策優先的以閒置土地活化跟複合式利用的方式來規劃太陽能板的光電設施那我要問的是說在公司經營策略上面提供社福土地"},{"start":103.735,"end":116.209,"text":"跟提供這個設宅的這個新辦基地還有跟這個提供能源政策的這個設置太陽光點板的這幾個順位上面在市中心的話請問一下台南公司的策略會以什麼樣的策略為主這個是不是"},{"start":121.894,"end":141.952,"text":"跟委員報告如果是社會住宅或是說社福的這個這個設施的話因為要考慮到整個人口還有整個交通的所以會集中在市中心那如果是這個再生能源的話那我們目前的做法就是說比如說"},{"start":142.552,"end":166.205,"text":"跟這個地方政府他有這個滯洪池的話我們就是水面的這個光電或是說我們各個建築物的這個屋頂型的這個太陽能板等等那個就不會比較會離開因為一部分的居民他還沒有辦法完全的這個接受這個就是會跟這個社宅或是說社福的設施會有一個地點的一個區隔"},{"start":167.281,"end":196.124,"text":"好 謝謝總經理那接下來因為你們剛剛提到政策當然如果是在為了提供可能社宅以後長照機可能要選擇市中心是交通比較方便的地方那就是因為你們有這個政策你們剛好這樣回應了所以我要提出一個個案當然台中這邊在這個台中的這個北屯區有一塊很完整的這個用地660多坪在市中心在捷運站旁邊那現階段你們是提供停車場來使用那後來最近有公告說要來蓋光電板"},{"start":196.924,"end":219.31,"text":"那這個土地分區呢它是第三種住宅區那我想我們都知道在市區的第三種住宅區啊它相對來講它的土地是比較利用價值比較高的那如果能夠來蓋社宅或是能夠來蓋這個社福機構我想對周邊的住戶來講它的使用會比較方便那如果你單純只使用這個用來只蓋光電板的話不覺得有點浪費嗎不知道台南的公司怎麼看待這個事情"},{"start":220.111,"end":243.644,"text":"我這邊跟委員報告一下我們那一塊地是因為那個地方有停車的這個需求非常的強烈那我們這個得標的業者他主要是要做這個停車場他只是就是說他的車棚上面他會去裝設太陽能板他並不是說是為了以太陽能板為主是以停車需求為主我知道"},{"start":244.484,"end":259.915,"text":"來 但是我現在還是要回到這公司今天你是這個公司的角度來看嘛到底是出租給停車場來使用來蓋供電板對公司的效益比較高呢還是說提供剛剛提到的不管是提供政府來提供社福土地或是來該社會住宅或是其他用途嘛因為今天"},{"start":260.655,"end":275.897,"text":"你如果蓋社福土地你去做長照機構也好或去做社會助長也好或做其他設施也好你的屋頂你一樣可以使用光電板了我沒有反對這件事情啊我今天講的是說今天這麼好的一個土地的區位它就在台中市的市中心結果呢"},{"start":276.818,"end":293.478,"text":"它是住宅用地喔 它也不是什麼農地 也不是什麼其他的用地它就是正住宅用地 而且在大馬路旁邊那結果你們攤販公司這塊用地的使用方式這麼多年下來就只提供停車場 然後接下來蓋光電板那不就浪費了 就是你們公司在資產運用上的這個效益了嗎"},{"start":294.119,"end":317.434,"text":"我想問的是說在蓋這個光電板之前我想地方上不管是地方政府也好或是說里長也好或周邊居民也好他們其實事前尤其是當地的這些居民他們覺得說這個土地我們希望說能夠有更有效的利用因為那是一個市中心難而有一個這麼完整空白的土地可以來使用結果如果你們只用來蓋光電板跟停車場不覺得很浪費嗎"},{"start":321.097,"end":333.802,"text":"所以我們在辦這塊土地的標諸的時候我們是採取一個短期的一個標諸的一個期間短期是多久?是五年五年後是不是優先承租權一樣同樣業者?"},{"start":337.211,"end":353.165,"text":"我們5年之後假設說這個有這個社宅或是說社福的需求的話我們就會收回來了好 那個時間也到了那我後續再請臺灣公司再跟我們辦公室來回報一下到底這後續要怎麼處理好不好好 謝謝委員"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2025-01-08T11:51:07.786000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:51:07.786000+08:00","text":"謝謝召委。","quality":0.5},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2025-01-08T11:51:08.726000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:51:25.771000+08:00","text":"請台糖公司吳明昌董事長。","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2025-01-08T11:51:25.771000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2025-01-08T11:51:26.771000+08:00","text":"請吳董事長。","quality":0},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2025-01-08T11:51:25.771000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:51:26.071000+08:00","text":"董事長好。","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳董事長明昌","start":"2025-01-08T11:51:27.410000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:51:27.630000+08:00","text":"委員好。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2025-01-08T11:51:28.592000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:51:37.764000+08:00","text":"在今天的經營概況跟營業預算報告裡面，您提到台糖會配合政府的社福政策提供相關的土地。","quality":0.949},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2025-01-08T11:51:38.445000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:51:47.337000+08:00","text":"那在過去這些年，不管是針對住宿式的長照機構也好，還是針對社會住宅也好，台糖都有提供蠻多的土地。","quality":0.93},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2025-01-08T11:51:47.978000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:51:57.792000+08:00","text":"我想問一下董事長，提供土地的部分，你們是配合，還是你們會主動釋出、盤點出閒置用地，給地方政府或是內政部來使用？","quality":0.918},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2025-01-08T11:51:58.593000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:51:59.314000+08:00","text":"以社宅為例的話。","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳董事長明昌","start":"2025-01-08T11:52:01.601000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:52:09.007000+08:00","text":"我們是盤點出來，然後給地方政府或是中央政府按需要來篩選。","quality":0.962},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2025-01-08T11:52:09.387000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:52:19.154000+08:00","text":"如果你們提供、盤點出來的土地有在市中心、精華區，可能就讓內政部或地方政府來決定要怎麼樣使用，是不是這樣？","quality":0.787},{"speaker":"吳董事長明昌","start":"2025-01-08T11:52:20.368000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:52:22.249000+08:00","text":"大概是這樣，對。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2025-01-08T11:52:22.249000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:52:33.893000+08:00","text":"再來，配合社福政策完之後，你的報告又提到，同時也會配合能源政策，優先以閒置土地活化跟複合式利用方式來規劃太陽能板的光電設施。","quality":0.912},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2025-01-08T11:52:34.713000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:52:52.928000+08:00","text":"我要問的是，在公司經營策略上，提供社福用的土地跟提供社宅的興辦基地，還有提供能源政策設置太陽光電板，這幾個在順位上，在市中心的話，請問一下，台糖公司會以什麼樣的策略為主？","quality":0.896},{"speaker":"吳董事長明昌","start":"2025-01-08T11:52:52.928000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2025-01-08T11:53:00.516000+08:00","text":"由總經理跟你報告一下。可以。","quality":0.25},{"speaker":"陳總經理立人","start":"2025-01-08T11:53:00.516000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:53:13.587000+08:00","text":"如果是社會住宅或是社福設施，因為要考慮到人口，還有交通，所以會集中在市中心。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳總經理立人","start":"2025-01-08T11:53:14.208000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:53:33.760000+08:00","text":"如果是再生能源，我們目前的作法就是，譬如地方政府有滯洪池就設置水面型光電，或是各個建築物裝置屋頂型的太陽能板等等，就比較會離開市中心。","quality":0.839},{"speaker":"陳總經理立人","start":"2025-01-08T11:53:33.760000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:53:43.185000+08:00","text":"因為一部分的居民還沒有辦法完全接受，就是跟社宅或是社福設施會有地點的區隔。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2025-01-08T11:53:44.942000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:53:44.942000+08:00","text":"謝謝總經理。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2025-01-08T11:53:46.703000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:53:53.028000+08:00","text":"因為你們剛剛提到政策，如果是為了提供社宅或長照機構，可能要選擇市中心、交通比較方便的地方。","quality":0.951},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2025-01-08T11:53:53.909000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:54:13.104000+08:00","text":"因為你們剛剛回應你們有這樣的政策了，所以我要提出一個個案，在臺中的北屯區有一塊很完整的用地有六百六十多坪，在市中心、在捷運站旁邊，現階段你們是提供停車場使用，後來最近有公告說要蓋光電板。","quality":0.849},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2025-01-08T11:54:14.104000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:54:28.788000+08:00","text":"這個土地的分區是第三種住宅區，我們都知道在市區的第三種住宅區，相對來講，它的土地利用價值是比較高的，如果能夠來蓋社宅或是社福機構，我想對周邊的住戶來講，使用會比較方便。","quality":0.974},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2025-01-08T11:54:29.528000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:54:34.729000+08:00","text":"如果單純只用來蓋光電板，你不覺得有點浪費嗎？","quality":0.95},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2025-01-08T11:54:34.729000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:54:36.290000+08:00","text":"不知道台糖公司怎麼看待這個事情？","quality":0.867},{"speaker":"陳總經理立人","start":"2025-01-08T11:54:39.792000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:54:59.963000+08:00","text":"因為那個地方有非常強烈的停車需求，而這個得標業者主要是做停車場，只是車棚上會裝設太陽能板，並不是以太陽能板為主，而是以停車需求為主。","quality":0.885},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2025-01-08T11:55:00.384000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:55:00.624000+08:00","text":"我知道。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2025-01-08T11:55:01.484000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:55:08.929000+08:00","text":"但我現在還是要回到公司的角度來看，到底是出租給停車場使用、蓋光電板，對公司效益比較高呢？","quality":0.975},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2025-01-08T11:55:09.890000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:55:16.034000+08:00","text":"還是剛剛提到的，不管是提供政府作為社福土地或是蓋社會住宅，又或是其他用用途？","quality":0.857},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2025-01-08T11:55:16.614000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:55:26.287000+08:00","text":"因為今天如果作為社福土地，蓋長照機構或社會住宅，或做其他設施也好，屋頂一樣可以使用光電板，我沒有反對這件事情。","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2025-01-08T11:55:26.608000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:55:50.478000+08:00","text":"我今天講的是，這麼好的土地區位就在臺中市的市中心，它是住宅用地，不是農地，也不是什麼其他用地，它就是正住宅用地，而且在大馬路旁邊，結果台糖公司這塊用地的使用方式，這麼多年下來就只提供作為停車場，接下來要蓋光電板，那不就浪費了你們公司在資產運用上的效益了嗎？","quality":0.957},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2025-01-08T11:55:52.840000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:56:14.434000+08:00","text":"而且在蓋光電板之前，我想地方上不管是地方政府也好，或是里長也好，或周邊居民也好，他們其實事前……尤其是當地的居民，他們希望這塊土地能夠有更有效的利用，因為市中心很難得有一塊這麼完整、空白的土地可以來使用，如果你們只用來蓋光電板跟停車場，不覺得有點浪費嗎？","quality":0.913},{"speaker":"陳總經理立人","start":"2025-01-08T11:56:18.097000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:56:26.600000+08:00","text":"誠如委員剛剛所指教的，所以我們在辦這一塊土地標租的時候，是採取短期的標租期間。","quality":0.639},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2025-01-08T11:56:26.600000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:56:28.141000+08:00","text":"短期是多久？5年。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2025-01-08T11:56:28.681000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:56:30.782000+08:00","text":"5年後是不是一樣優先承租給同樣的業者？","quality":0.765},{"speaker":"陳總經理立人","start":"2025-01-08T11:56:34.692000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:56:41.558000+08:00","text":"5年之後假設有社宅或是社福的需求，我們就會收回來了。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2025-01-08T11:56:43.760000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:56:49.565000+08:00","text":"時間到了，我後續再請台糖公司跟我辦公室回報一下，到底後續要怎麼處理，好不好？","quality":0.941},{"speaker":"陳總經理立人","start":"2025-01-08T11:56:49.965000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-08T11:56:50.165000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝委員。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2025-01-08T11:56:50.665000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2025-01-08T11:56:51.665000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2025-01-08T11:56:51.965000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2025-01-08T11:56:54.250714+08:00","text":"請邱志偉委員發言。","quality":0}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}