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謝謝主席有請我們副秘書長跟黃次長副秘書長 次長"},{"start":19.864,"end":38.638,"text":"早安今天我們所要討論的這個專題我想也是作為憲法憲訴法修法之後的一個延伸的討論自從憲訴法提出之後到委員會審議還有院會的表決受到社會"},{"start":39.558,"end":55.305,"text":"諸多的這個關注而行政院作為一個能夠提出復議的這個憲政機關在本月初正式復議之後那卻未能獲得這個邀請前來立法院做說明最終這個復議案也沒有通過"},{"start":56.065,"end":75.967,"text":"也是在我們意料之中那也看到上週在司法節學術研討會上我們這個謝明揚代理院長在致詞的時候也指出目前司法面臨許多挑戰包括限訴法的這個修法對憲法法庭運作會造成的相關問題"},{"start":77.208,"end":101.879,"text":"由於在去年的這個12月三讀通過的這個版本是在表決前所提出的再修正動議那跟我們10月份委員會所審查的這個版本有所不同也沒有徵詢過司法院的意見我想先就叫我們複密通過的這個新法對於憲法法庭造成的這種實務運作上會有什麼樣的困境"},{"start":104.147,"end":119.237,"text":"好 謝謝委員就是那個伊犁法院三讀通過的限訴法30條修正的這個條文呢那個憲法訴訟的案件類型就是除了87條的統一解釋法令還維持原來的平決門檻"},{"start":120.498,"end":133.461,"text":"也就是說大法官現有的那個總額過半數參與評議那參與評議的大法官過半數同意之外呢像是其他的案件類型裁判及法規範的那個憲法審查還有地方自治保障總統及副總統彈劾政黨違憲解散還有43條的那個暫時處分呢這一些它的那個門檻大法官參與評議的人數呢不可以低於10人"},{"start":148.724,"end":152.273,"text":"那同意違憲裁判人數呢不可以低於9人"},{"start":153.923,"end":178.936,"text":"那有關那個機關爭議的案件呢大法官參與評議的人數是不可以低於10人的所以呢目前就是我們現狀情況在任的大法官目前是8個人所以說有關案件就是有幾個類型一個是案件是否受理還有一個統一解釋法令等案件呢因為這一些就是"},{"start":179.756,"end":206.279,"text":"相關規定沒有修正所以目前都還是依現行的方式在處理至於說其他的這些案件類型它在新法公佈生效之後實務運作這個部分是屬於憲法法庭審判的事項我們司法行政也是維護大法官的獨立審判這個部分我們就不表示意見"},{"start":207.58,"end":232.039,"text":"好那我們規定這個參與評議和做成違憲的這個大法官人數然後剛剛複密有講了就算人數這個我們現在看人數是不夠就算民眾的陳情案子我們也沒辦法正常的去做這個審理以目前來看就是剛才講到那個上訴那個案件如果說是受理之後的裁判跟法規範那個憲法審查可是目前嗎還是說新法"},{"start":237.082,"end":263.908,"text":"新法制定之後對這個部分還是沒辦法那對於我們這個憲法法庭的這個運作會造成實質的這個自愛難行的困境甚至會完全癱瘓這個我想我們應該現在目前應該有感覺到了那不利於我們權力的這個保障那不過也有人持反對的這個立場認為說只要盡快的補滿大法官的這個缺口就能夠解決"},{"start":264.628,"end":278.152,"text":"那在這個設下如此高的這個門檻的情況之下是否在運作上仍有可能會導致我們相關的這個審議的效率會降低的情形這個部分我是不是能夠讓那個書記廳長回答"},{"start":281.737,"end":309.026,"text":"跟委員報告就是如果以新法將來這個制度來看的話那除了剛剛副秘書長說明的之外那因為有關於受理與否以及統一解釋法律命令這個部分的規定沒有修改那這個部分當然就這個部分我們可以持續的來運作那其實目前我們八位大法官也是分三個審查庭那分授原本應該有15個大法官所分授的一個全部的新案跟未結案來持續處理"},{"start":310.066,"end":319.725,"text":"那至於說其他類型的案件那因為新法上路之後他能不能運作如何運作那就是審判事項我們就不方便說明好"},{"start":320.575,"end":342.712,"text":"那由於我們這個立法院在週一的傍晚已經將復議案的結果支付我們總統還有韓副行政院了那根據憲法這個規定最晚必須在1月23日完成公佈尋求的這個救濟手段還尚待評估那我想請教我們副議員跟黃志就針對"},{"start":343.633,"end":359.546,"text":"你們的這個專案專業的判斷提出預防性的這個權力救濟是不是現階段最可行的一個途徑我想這個部分不是司法本院所能夠回答的謝謝委員"},{"start":362.152,"end":385.197,"text":"我想因為這個目前我們法務部並沒有接到行政院任何關於這個相關議題的研議的交辦所以我們也不方便表示意見那正如剛才司法院副委員所說的委員所提的問題事實上未來涉及審判的核心事項我們為尊重這個審判獨立我們也不便表示意見謝謝"},{"start":387.658,"end":409.213,"text":"既然憲法法庭的設置是為了維護人民的權利和憲政的秩序那就不能夠停擺最嚴重會被影響的會是人民和機關尋求救濟或是解決憲法爭議的權利不論是我們司法院、行政院還是立法院都必須去維護我們憲法法庭的"},{"start":410.334,"end":429.751,"text":"實質運作,我相信這是民眾所期待的另外一個議題我想請教兩位就是近年來國安洩密、共諜事件頻繁包括近期討論的富康聯盟黨涉嫌收受中共的金援作為解放軍的內應"},{"start":431.232,"end":450.621,"text":"那在去年以違反國安法被台中高分檢起訴那現在由這個台中高分院審理當中我們也看到國安局提出共諜案滲透手法的這個分析從2024年案件來分析主要是勾結黑幫來發展武裝內應開設地下錢莊來"},{"start":454.202,"end":481.583,"text":"引誘投共 滲透我們在地的宮廟還有成立統戰組織動員來介入選舉以及透過網路的平台來佈建組織等等的這些方式那中共的這個滲透目標 管道 守法還有墓地可以說是五花八門 無孔不入我們法務部調查局和我們的檢察署如何來因應"},{"start":483.101,"end":484.608,"text":"這個偵辦的量能是否充足"},{"start":485.325,"end":512.735,"text":"是 跟我們報告國安案件事實上當然我們非常的重視也列為全國檢查機關偵辦案件的重點所以目前我們動員偵查能量會全力投入相關案件的偵訪那麼由最高檢察署的檢察中長來統合所有案件的情資並由告點檢察署來督導執行會結合偵查保防跟情報系統來綜合研判之後投入偵辦"},{"start":514.035,"end":518.98,"text":"所以在這兩年來我們其實也辦了很多指標性的案件也會持續用最高的規格來辦理相關的業務"},{"start":526.22,"end":545.254,"text":"好 那由於我們這個國安的這個案件 具有機敏性和高度的專業性那會需要和國防還有國安單位來配合那針對重要的這些議題共同來討論 也需要提出對策來研議那來提升我們辦案的專業"},{"start":546.174,"end":559.09,"text":"國安局的報告有提及為了因應中共多元的這種滲透手法包括情報機關還有我們軍中的保防單位以及法務部的檢調部門已經都建立起協作的機制"},{"start":562.313,"end":577.803,"text":"就這一次這樣子我想請教次長您所了解的法務部是如何來協作所謂的國安共同威脅的圖像這個協作的這個機制未來應該要如何來精進以提高我們國安案件的這個辦案的成效"},{"start":578.143,"end":593.988,"text":"是跟委員報告陳柱剛所說的我們在最高檢察署跟台高檢署都有成立相關單位我們在各檢察機關也設國安的專組尤其對於國安法剛委員所提到這種發展組織的案件它是由高檢署來偵辦"},{"start":595.849,"end":613.865,"text":"台高檢署跟分署進來 辦案的績效也一直在提升事務外見發生的時候 剛剛委員所提到的跟相關的軍事單位的聯繫平台是由最高檢察署來統合所以我們會結合軍事的情緒來源充分跟軍事機關橫向溝通 徵詢意見來強化我們的偵辦效能"},{"start":617.386,"end":639.645,"text":"好,這我們期待那在上週這個陸委會的副主委提出呼籲要把這個國安的案件當作特殊的案件來處理那並提出應該設立專門的這種國安法庭但是在我們司法院後來的這個澄清資訊裡面看到我們112年當時配合國安法第19條的施行"},{"start":641.687,"end":670.488,"text":"司法院已經修正相關的辦法要求各地院還有高院及分院對國安法這個案件成立專案法庭或專股辦理因此想先就叫我們複密這個針對國安軍事專業的這個案件所含括的這個案件類型我們各地院高院和分院是否都已經成立這個國安專庭或是專股來承辦案件"},{"start":671.069,"end":696.354,"text":"好謝謝委員垂詢是的在那個112年12月就是本院因為那個國安法那個修正之後呢就是修正了我們的那個司法事務分配規範法那就目前所有的普通法院全部的各個法院全部都已經成立了那個專庭或者是專股來辦理已經都成立了對全部的法院"},{"start":697.363,"end":705.755,"text":"好 那我想再就教一下是否我們這個政府院長懸缺的導致設置進度停滯 跟這個有沒有關係"},{"start":709.577,"end":725.255,"text":"是沒有那個設置停滯的那個問題就是全部的法院每一個法院都已經有那個專庭了那他們那個專庭的那個法官呢他們也都要那個接受那個相當的那個專業訓練就是也有規定一年最少要12個小時的專業訓練"},{"start":729.019,"end":756.673,"text":"好 那我們這個國安的這個案件是很大的一個題目那尤其是在當前中共滲透變本加厲那更值得關注同時也是在院紀之間跨部會共同要來努力防堵的一個破口那以確保我們國家的安全礙於這個詢答時間有限那後續如果還有機會的話再跟我們相關部會做討論謝謝副秘密還有我們的次長謝謝委員"},{"start":758.194,"end":758.215,"text":"好 謝謝"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"陳委員俊宇","start":"2025-01-15T09:47:40.829000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:47:45.210000+08:00","text":"謝謝主席，有請副秘書長跟黃次長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2025-01-15T09:47:45.210000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:47:49.464000+08:00","text":"好，副秘書長、次長。早安。","quality":0.889},{"speaker":"陳委員俊宇","start":"2025-01-15T09:47:51.066000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:48:01.313000+08:00","text":"今天我們所要討論的這個專題，我想也是作為憲訴法修法之後的一個延伸討論。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳委員俊宇","start":"2025-01-15T09:48:01.313000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:48:26.827000+08:00","text":"自從憲訴法提出之後，從在委員會審議到院會的表決，都受到社會諸多的關注，而行政院作為一個能夠提出覆議的憲政機關，在本月初正式提出覆議之後，卻未能獲得邀請前來立法院做說明，最終這個覆議案也沒有通過，也是在我們的意料之中。","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"陳委員俊宇","start":"2025-01-15T09:48:27.868000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:49:02.755000+08:00","text":"我們也看到上週在司法節學術研討會上，謝銘洋代理院長在致詞的時候也指出，目前司法面臨許多挑戰，包括憲訴法修法對憲法法庭運作會造成的相關問題，由於去年12月三讀通過的這個版本是在表決前所提出的再修正動議，跟10月份委員會所審查的版本有所不同，也沒有徵詢過司法院的意見。","quality":0.959},{"speaker":"陳委員俊宇","start":"2025-01-15T09:49:02.755000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:49:10.859000+08:00","text":"我想先就教副秘，在實務運作上，通過的新法對於憲法法庭會造成什麼樣的困境？","quality":0.697},{"speaker":"王副秘書長梅英","start":"2025-01-15T09:49:13.627000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:50:09.446000+08:00","text":"謝謝委員，依立法院三讀通過的憲訴法第三十條修正條文，憲法訴訟的案件類型，除了第八十七條的統一解釋法令還維持原來的評決門檻，也就是說，大法官現有的總額過半數參與評議，參與評議的大法官過半數同意之外，像是其他的案件類型，裁判及法規範的憲法審查、地方自治保障、總統及副總統彈劾、政黨違憲解散以及第四十三條的暫時處分等這些門檻，大法官參與評議的人數不可以低於10人，同意違憲宣告的人數不可以低於9人；有關機關爭議案件，大法官參與評議的人數不可以低於10人。","quality":0.897},{"speaker":"王副秘書長梅英","start":"2025-01-15T09:50:10.527000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:50:34.601000+08:00","text":"因此以我們現狀的情況，在任的大法官目前是8個人，所以有關案件有幾個類型，一個是案件是否受理，還有統一解釋法令等案件，這些因為相關規定沒有修正，所以目前都還是依現行的方式處理。","quality":0.937},{"speaker":"王副秘書長梅英","start":"2025-01-15T09:50:35.582000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:50:55.279000+08:00","text":"至於其他案件類型在新法公布生效之後的實務運作，這個部分是屬於憲法法庭的審判事項，我們司法行政也是維護大法官的獨立審判，這個部分我們就不表示意見。","quality":0.956},{"speaker":"陳委員俊宇","start":"2025-01-15T09:50:56.580000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:51:11.231000+08:00","text":"好，規定參與評議及做成違憲的大法官人數剛剛副秘有講了，我們現在看人數是不夠的，就算民眾的陳情案件，以目前來看，也沒辦法正常的審理嘛！","quality":0.817},{"speaker":"王副秘書長梅英","start":"2025-01-15T09:51:14.334000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:51:20.919000+08:00","text":"就是剛才講到的上訴案件，如果是受理之後的裁判跟法規範的憲法審查，可是……目前嗎？","quality":0.943},{"speaker":"王副秘書長梅英","start":"2025-01-15T09:51:20.919000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:51:20.939000+08:00","text":"還是說新法？","quality":0.6},{"speaker":"陳委員俊宇","start":"2025-01-15T09:51:20.939000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:51:28.943000+08:00","text":"新法，新法制定之後。","quality":1},{"speaker":"王副秘書長梅英","start":"2025-01-15T09:51:29.183000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:51:29.383000+08:00","text":"對，這個部分……","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳委員俊宇","start":"2025-01-15T09:51:29.963000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:51:30.443000+08:00","text":"還是沒辦法嘛？是。","quality":0.714},{"speaker":"陳委員俊宇","start":"2025-01-15T09:51:31.883000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:51:45.866000+08:00","text":"對於憲法法庭的運作會造成實質窒礙難行的困境，甚至會完全癱瘓，我們現在應該有感覺到了，這不利於我們權利的保障。","quality":0.92},{"speaker":"陳委員俊宇","start":"2025-01-15T09:51:46.627000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:51:52.908000+08:00","text":"不過也有人持反對的立場，認為只要儘快地補滿大法官的缺額就能夠解決。","quality":0.903},{"speaker":"陳委員俊宇","start":"2025-01-15T09:51:53.808000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:52:04.431000+08:00","text":"在設下如此高的門檻情況之下，是否在運作上仍有可能導致相關審議的效率會有降低的情形？","quality":0.974},{"speaker":"王副秘書長梅英","start":"2025-01-15T09:52:06.192000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:52:07.132000+08:00","text":"這個部分，我是不是能夠讓書記廳長回答？","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳委員俊宇","start":"2025-01-15T09:52:07.132000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2025-01-15T09:52:10.737000+08:00","text":"好，請廳長。","quality":0},{"speaker":"楊廳長皓清","start":"2025-01-15T09:52:10.737000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:52:38.006000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，如果以新法將來的制度來看的話，除了剛剛副秘書長說明的之外，因為有關於受理與否及統一解釋法律命令這個部分的規定沒有修改，當然就這個部分，我們可以持續的來運作，其實目前8位大法官也是分成3個審查庭，分受原本應該有15個大法官所分受的全部新案跟未結案來持續處理。","quality":0.967},{"speaker":"楊廳長皓清","start":"2025-01-15T09:52:39.246000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:52:48.705000+08:00","text":"至於其他類型的案件，因為新法上路之後，它能不能運作、如何運作等就是審判事項，我們就不方便說明。好。","quality":0.953},{"speaker":"陳委員俊宇","start":"2025-01-15T09:52:50.135000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:53:23.302000+08:00","text":"由於立法院在週一傍晚已經將覆議案結果咨復總統，還有函復行政院了，根據憲法規定，最晚必須在1月23日完成公布，尋求的救濟手段還尚待評估，請教副秘跟黃次，針對你們的專業判斷，提出預防性權利救濟是不是現階段最可行的途徑？","quality":0.906},{"speaker":"王副秘書長梅英","start":"2025-01-15T09:53:23.302000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:53:28.546000+08:00","text":"我想這個部分不是本院所能夠回答的，謝謝委員。好。","quality":0.952},{"speaker":"黃次長世杰","start":"2025-01-15T09:53:31.552000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:53:54.197000+08:00","text":"因為目前法務部並沒有接到行政院任何關於相關議題研議的交辦，所以我們也不方便表示意見，誠如剛才司法院副秘書長所說的，委員所提的問題，事實上未來涉及審判的核心事項，為了尊重審判獨立，我們也不便表示意見，謝謝。","quality":0.947},{"speaker":"陳委員俊宇","start":"2025-01-15T09:53:56.658000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:54:21.756000+08:00","text":"既然憲法法庭的設置是為了維護人民的權利及憲政的秩序，就不能夠停擺，最嚴重會被影響的是人民和機關尋求救濟或是解決憲法爭議的權利，不論是司法院、行政院還是立法院，都必須去維護憲法法庭的實質運作，我相信這是民眾所期待的。","quality":0.99},{"speaker":"陳委員俊宇","start":"2025-01-15T09:54:22.556000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:54:48.696000+08:00","text":"另外一個議題請教兩位，近年來國安洩密共諜事件頻繁，包括近期討論的復康聯盟黨涉嫌收受中共金援，作為解放軍的內應，去年以違反國安法被臺中高分檢起訴，現在由臺中高分院審理當中。","quality":0.987},{"speaker":"陳委員俊宇","start":"2025-01-15T09:54:48.876000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:55:17.893000+08:00","text":"我們也看到國安局提出共諜案滲透手法分析，從2024年案件來分析，主要是勾結黑幫發展武裝內應，開設地下錢莊來引誘投共、滲透在地的宮廟，還有成立統戰組織動員介入選舉，以及透過網路平臺布建組織等等的這些方式。","quality":0.989},{"speaker":"陳委員俊宇","start":"2025-01-15T09:55:18.674000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:55:30.583000+08:00","text":"中共的滲透目標、管道、手法還有目的可以說是五花八門、無孔不入，法務部調查局和各檢察署如何來因應？","quality":0.907},{"speaker":"陳委員俊宇","start":"2025-01-15T09:55:32.101000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:55:33.588000+08:00","text":"偵辦的量能是否充足？","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃次長世杰","start":"2025-01-15T09:55:35.125000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:56:01.735000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，國安案件事實上當然我們非常重視，也列為全國檢察機關偵辦案件的重點，所以目前我們動員偵查能量會全力投入相關案件的偵防，由最高檢察署的檢察總長統合所有案件的情資，並由高等檢察署督導執行，結合偵查保防跟情報系統來綜合研判之後投入偵辦。","quality":0.938},{"speaker":"黃次長世杰","start":"2025-01-15T09:56:03.035000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:56:07.980000+08:00","text":"所以在這兩年來，我們其實辦了很多指標性的案件，也會持續用最高規格來辦理相關業務。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳委員俊宇","start":"2025-01-15T09:56:16.021000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:56:34.254000+08:00","text":"由於國安案件具有機敏性和高度專業性，會需要和國防還有國安單位配合，針對重要的這些議題共同來討論，也需要提出對策研議，以提升辦案的專業。","quality":0.984},{"speaker":"陳委員俊宇","start":"2025-01-15T09:56:35.174000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:56:48.069000+08:00","text":"國安局報告提及，為了因應中共多元的滲透手法，包括情報機關，還有軍中保防單位，以及法務部檢調部門，都已經建立協作機制。","quality":0.981},{"speaker":"陳委員俊宇","start":"2025-01-15T09:56:51.313000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:56:59.558000+08:00","text":"就這一次這樣子的情況，請教次長，您所了解的，法務部是如何來協作所謂的國安共同威脅圖像？","quality":0.923},{"speaker":"陳委員俊宇","start":"2025-01-15T09:57:01.219000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:57:06.783000+08:00","text":"這個協作機制未來應該要如何來精進，以提高國安案件的辦案成效？","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃次長世杰","start":"2025-01-15T09:57:07.363000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:57:28.833000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，誠如剛剛所說的，我們在最高檢察署跟臺高檢署都有成立相關單位，各檢察機關也有設國安專組，尤其對於國安法，剛剛委員所提到這種發展組織的案件，它是由高檢署來偵辦，臺高檢署及分署近來的辦案績效也一直在提升。","quality":0.918},{"speaker":"黃次長世杰","start":"2025-01-15T09:57:30.174000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:57:42.845000+08:00","text":"實務案件發生的時候，剛剛委員所提到的，跟相關軍事單位的聯繫平臺是由最高檢察署來統合，所以我們會結合軍事的情資來源，充分跟軍事機關橫向溝通，徵詢意見，來強化我們的偵辦效能。","quality":0.949},{"speaker":"陳委員俊宇","start":"2025-01-15T09:57:46.987000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:57:47.427000+08:00","text":"這我們期待。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳委員俊宇","start":"2025-01-15T09:57:48.588000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:58:00.318000+08:00","text":"上週陸委會副主委也提出，呼籲要把國安案件當作特殊案件處理，並提出應該設立專門的國安法庭。","quality":0.976},{"speaker":"陳委員俊宇","start":"2025-01-15T09:58:00.919000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:58:39.468000+08:00","text":"但是在司法院後來的澄清資訊裡面，看到112年當時配合國安法第十九條的施行，司法院已經修正相關辦法，要求各地院還有高院及分院對國安法案件成立專案法庭或專股辦理，因此想先就教副秘，針對國安、軍事專業的案件所含括的案件類型，各地院、高院及分院是否都已經成立國安專庭或是專股來承辦案件？","quality":0.953},{"speaker":"王副秘書長梅英","start":"2025-01-15T09:58:40.629000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:58:41.829000+08:00","text":"謝謝委員垂詢。","quality":1},{"speaker":"王副秘書長梅英","start":"2025-01-15T09:58:41.829000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:59:02.573000+08:00","text":"是的，在112年12月，本院因為國安法修正之後，修正了我們的司法事務分配辦法，就目前所有的普通法院，各個法院全部都已經成立了專庭或者是專股來辦理。","quality":0.984},{"speaker":"陳委員俊宇","start":"2025-01-15T09:59:03.354000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:59:04.034000+08:00","text":"已經都成立了？","quality":1},{"speaker":"王副秘書長梅英","start":"2025-01-15T09:59:04.734000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:59:05.334000+08:00","text":"對，全部的法院。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳委員俊宇","start":"2025-01-15T09:59:07.645000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:59:14.755000+08:00","text":"再就教一下，是否因正副院長懸缺導致設置進度停滯，跟這個有沒有關係？","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"王副秘書長梅英","start":"2025-01-15T09:59:18.577000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:59:34.255000+08:00","text":"報告委員，應該是沒有設置停滯的問題，就是全部的法院，每一個法院都已經有專庭了，專庭法官也都要接受相當的專業訓練，就是規定一年最少要12個小時的專業訓練，以上。","quality":0.886},{"speaker":"陳委員俊宇","start":"2025-01-15T09:59:40.220000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T09:59:56.769000+08:00","text":"國安案件是很大的題目，尤其是在當前中共滲透變本加厲，更值得關注，同時也是在院際之間，跨部會共同要來努力防堵的破口，以確保國家安全。","quality":0.983},{"speaker":"陳委員俊宇","start":"2025-01-15T09:59:58.109000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T10:00:03.592000+08:00","text":"礙於詢答時間有限，後續如果還有機會的話，再跟相關部會做討論。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳委員俊宇","start":"2025-01-15T10:00:03.592000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T10:00:05.653000+08:00","text":"謝謝副秘還有次長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"王副秘書長梅英","start":"2025-01-15T10:00:05.653000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T10:00:05.673000+08:00","text":"謝謝委員。謝謝。","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2025-01-15T10:00:05.673000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2025-01-15T10:00:06.673000+08:00","text":"下一位我們請羅智強委員。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2025-01-15T10:00:06.673000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2025-01-15T10:00:07.673000+08:00","text":"程序問題。","quality":0},{"speaker":"羅委員智強","start":"2025-01-15T10:00:07.673000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2025-01-15T10:00:08.673000+08:00","text":"主席，我先程序發言。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2025-01-15T10:00:08.673000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2025-01-15T10:00:09.673000+08:00","text":"是，請說。","quality":0},{"speaker":"羅委員智強","start":"2025-01-15T10:00:09.673000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2025-01-15T10:00:10.673000+08:00","text":"剛剛鍾佳濱委員在發言的時候，我幫他算了一下，逾時5分鐘左右，基本上我們也就是靜靜地聽他講，我也沒在他發言的時候干擾他。","quality":0},{"speaker":"羅委員智強","start":"2025-01-15T10:00:10.673000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2025-01-15T10:00:11.673000+08:00","text":"我在這邊要說一件事，剛剛黃國昌在質詢的時候，鍾佳濱在底下在那邊叫囂，如果今天民進黨的委員，你們都非常準時、都不逾時，過去你們如果時間到就下來，那羅智強沒有意見，但是這樣嗎？","quality":0},{"speaker":"羅委員智強","start":"2025-01-15T10:00:11.673000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2025-01-15T10:00:12.673000+08:00","text":"每次輪到柯建銘的時候，大家沒見到嗎？","quality":0},{"speaker":"羅委員智強","start":"2025-01-15T10:00:12.673000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2025-01-15T10:00:13.673000+08:00","text":"逾時從10分鐘、20分鐘、30分鐘、40分鐘起跳，民進黨的人有講一句話嗎？","quality":0},{"speaker":"羅委員智強","start":"2025-01-15T10:00:13.673000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2025-01-15T10:00:14.673000+08:00","text":"所以我要特別強調的是什麼？","quality":0},{"speaker":"羅委員智強","start":"2025-01-15T10:00:14.673000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2025-01-15T10:00:15.673000+08:00","text":"就是主席、召委在主持的時候，他自然會去做時間的控制，但每個召委的作法不一樣，像宗憲召委就很尊重大家的發言時間，基本上讓大家自己來控制自己的發言時間，這個標準不是只對黃國昌適用，也不是只對羅智強適用，也對鍾佳濱適用，那為什麼今天別人在發言的時候，在底下用叫囂的方式去干擾別人呢？","quality":0},{"speaker":"羅委員智強","start":"2025-01-15T10:00:15.673000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2025-01-15T10:00:16.673000+08:00","text":"所以在這邊，這個程序部分我還是要說明一下，剛剛鍾佳濱罵我說我在護航黃國昌，抱歉，我護航的是公平正義，不要雙標；如果今天民進黨做得到不逾時，那今天羅智強沒有話說，但是最愛逾時的就是民進黨，我也不懂為什麼鍾佳濱老是要把臉送上來讓大家打，就像前天安排那個什麼奇怪的報告，講現行犯，自己就是現行犯，還要弄一個什麼妨害司法公正現行犯的報告，真的不需要這樣子。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2025-01-15T10:00:07.194000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-01-15T10:00:07.215000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝羅委員。","quality":0.5},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2025-01-15T10:00:07.715000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2025-01-15T10:01:02.000714+08:00","text":"因為我主持會議到現在已經兩個會期了嘛，我主持的習慣大家應該看得很清楚，就是基本上我會尊重發言委員的發言，當然很多委員其實都逾時很久，甚至請他下來請不下來，幫他消音，他也還是繼續吼，所以我想我還是一樣，就是尊重每一位委員的發言，我們也希望發言委員在發言的時候，非發言委員就不要干擾發言委員的發言，如果有任何程序上面的問題，都可以在發言結束之後隨時提出來，由主席這邊來做決定，或是由主席這邊來回答，這個是沒有問題的。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2025-01-15T10:01:02.300714+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2025-01-15T10:01:06.300714+08:00","text":"接下來我們就請羅智強委員發言。","quality":0}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}