{"error":false,"id":["158904"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":158904,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/158904","日期":"2025-01-16","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"委員會-11-2-35-27","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第2會期外交及國防委員會第27次全體委員會議","屆":11,"會期":2,"會次":27,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"委員會","委員會代碼":[35],"委員會代碼:str":["外交及國防委員會"],"標題":"第11屆第2會期外交及國防委員會第27次全體委員會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2025-01-16T09:52:18+08:00","結束時間":"2025-01-16T10:04:27+08:00","影片長度":"00:12:09","支援功能":["ai-transcript"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/e6909b4ca57c061283972665fe135ae129ae781c7e1649b4e1c9837952b46cc3d5025eb6a0fa74945ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"黃仁","委員發言時間":"09:52:18 - 10:04:27","會議時間":"2025-01-16T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第2會期外交及國防委員會第27次全體委員會議（事由：邀請國家安全局局長、國防部部長、大陸委員會、國家通訊傳播委員會、交通部、經濟部、數位發展部、海洋委員會海巡署報告「針對海底電纜係國家對外重要通訊手段，為避免中共利用各種灰色地帶手段測試我國網路及電網韌性情事發生，如何建立有效備援系統以支援軍事作戰並支撐基礎建設防護韌性」，並備質詢。）","transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":4.199093749999999,"end":4.232843750000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":4.232843750000001,"end":5.042843750000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":5.042843750000001,"end":11.505968750000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":11.72534375,"end":30.051593750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":30.625343750000003,"end":41.56034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":42.049718750000004,"end":44.884718750000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":45.002843750000004,"end":51.58409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":52.596593750000004,"end":104.68971875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":55.094093750000006,"end":55.127843750000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":104.90909375000001,"end":124.07909375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":124.36596875000001,"end":130.25534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":131.09909375,"end":132.92159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":133.46159375000002,"end":142.82721875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":143.04659375,"end":169.92846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":171.00846875000002,"end":187.84971875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":187.84971875000002,"end":203.44221875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":203.52659375000002,"end":221.53221875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":221.53221875000003,"end":221.78534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":221.78534375,"end":221.97096875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":221.97096875000003,"end":221.98784375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":221.98784375000002,"end":282.60284375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":283.48034375000003,"end":325.83659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":325.83659375,"end":325.87034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":326.49471875,"end":334.22346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":329.93721875,"end":330.25784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":333.97034375000004,"end":334.89846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":334.89846875,"end":334.96596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":334.96596875,"end":335.06721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":335.06721875,"end":335.11784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":335.11784375,"end":338.79659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":339.38721875000005,"end":347.74034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":348.17909375000005,"end":370.08284375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":369.22221875,"end":371.11221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":373.55909375000005,"end":374.68971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":375.34784375000004,"end":378.13221875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":379.27971875000003,"end":383.43096875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":382.89096875,"end":383.76846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":383.80221875,"end":384.76409375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":387.97034375000004,"end":388.57784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":388.10534375000003,"end":388.34159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":388.64534375000005,"end":390.90659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":391.64909375,"end":391.66596875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":391.66596875000005,"end":395.66534375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":394.45034375,"end":394.46721875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":394.46721875000003,"end":395.63159375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":395.66534375000003,"end":395.76659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":395.76659375,"end":397.87596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":397.87596875,"end":397.89284375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":400.05284375,"end":412.72596875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":412.08471875000004,"end":420.03284375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":413.95784375000005,"end":414.21096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":420.03284375000004,"end":433.97159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":433.97159375,"end":434.27534375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":434.27534375000005,"end":434.34284375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":434.34284375000004,"end":438.02159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":438.64596875,"end":440.58659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":441.10971875,"end":442.84784375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":443.32034375,"end":458.74409375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":459.01409375000003,"end":459.57096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":460.43159375000005,"end":461.14034375000006},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":461.54534375000003,"end":461.96721875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":462.28784375000004,"end":463.01346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":463.77284375000005,"end":482.48721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":482.77409375,"end":487.26284375000006},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":487.87034375,"end":504.39096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":504.57659375000003,"end":511.32659375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":512.0690937500001,"end":513.0815937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":513.7734687500001,"end":515.69721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":516.10221875,"end":523.42596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":523.7803437499999,"end":532.65659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":532.65659375,"end":532.69034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":533.6015937500001,"end":533.63534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":533.63534375,"end":534.63096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":535.18784375,"end":536.4365937499999},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":537.04409375,"end":551.82659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":552.2990937500001,"end":573.47721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":573.91596875,"end":603.10971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":603.10971875,"end":614.9897187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":615.64784375,"end":623.7309687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":624.23721875,"end":624.67596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":625.4015937500001,"end":626.86971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":627.29159375,"end":628.5065937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":629.26596875,"end":631.2065937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":631.4765937500001,"end":634.80096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":635.17221875,"end":638.2097187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":639.0534687500001,"end":639.71159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":640.1840937500001,"end":641.51721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":641.93909375,"end":648.8915937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":649.8703437500001,"end":651.7097187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":652.90784375,"end":672.73596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":672.88784375,"end":674.9465937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":675.3515937500001,"end":697.93034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":698.63909375,"end":716.77971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":718.19721875,"end":719.1928437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":720.2390937499999,"end":721.3359687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":722.51721875,"end":723.3103437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":726.73596875,"end":729.16596875}],"whisperx":[{"start":4.572,"end":27.61,"text":"謝謝主席 黃委員早早 這個有關於這個電纜級節點的安全的問題為了維護國家單位是否能夠取得相關資訊及保護的海欄這個部分我想你都知道我們的海欄的國際海欄包含我們國內的海欄大概4次有14個"},{"start":30.752,"end":51.034,"text":"在我們國內,就是在淡水、巴黎、投誠、仿山、金門。我想請教一下,我們現在的海南遭損壞之後,回頭去查可疑的船隻,國安局的情緒蒐集有沒有辦法事先發現外國或中共破壞的海南的意圖。"},{"start":53.288,"end":67.696,"text":"對,這部分跟委員做個說明,事實上國安局這邊跟海巡署這邊,我們本來就建立起即時通報的機制,特別是針對中共級的船舶,中共級的船舶有包括到他們的海洋調查船、科研船、貨船、滾裝貨輪或是相關的這種其他的公務船舶。"},{"start":72.478,"end":87.061,"text":"那只要進階到我們的水域我們都會即時的進行通報因為這是國家法律規定依照兩岸人民關係條例我們是不允許中共船舶進階到我們的近縣制水域所以這個機制已經有了那委員可能會比較關注的是在於說像第三國籍的權宜輪"},{"start":87.822,"end":110.794,"text":"那因為第三國籍的權力輪在過去的管制機制裡面確實在受到關注的程度沒有那麼高那在這個案例之後我們會針對這個部分來建立起中國第三國籍船舶輪相關的船籍資料以及他們過去活動的軌跡樣態來跟海巡署做更進一步的情質分享不管是國安局是否能夠釋前獲知外國或中共破壞的海南的意圖"},{"start":111.621,"end":129.614,"text":"那國防部也要如何保護海岸不受破壞國安局更要先前的都知道這個狀況那今年的元月十三十四因為我是住東海岸在台東這一帶那我們在成功鎮"},{"start":131.876,"end":148.588,"text":"那個新港新港的外海就有將近百艘所以海裡的話將近20海裡內而已都一直在那個地方後來很多的百姓一看"},{"start":149.144,"end":169.657,"text":"不是我們國內的船隻 也不是遺傳確實一看是好幾百條的遺傳裡面就在那個地方 有來有去這就是中共在對我們的國內進行了什麼樣的一個狀況或者是意圖就是要破壞我們的海南"},{"start":171.255,"end":187.598,"text":"對一般來講委員舉的時間點我們可以來再做進一步的查證那假如有大批的中共的漁船在周邊水域活動的話一定會預警的那即使他關閉AIS我們還是有其他的收集的情資的能力來掌握他們的位置"},{"start":187.898,"end":216.514,"text":"因為我們百姓在十三、十四清晨就看到了後來他有截圖給我那今天又是來不及了剛剛才傳到給我了我就問他在哪個地點就是在我們的成功外海那邊成功鎮的新港有一個漁港的外海整個都在那個地方十三、十四凌晨還沒天亮之前的時候就已經有了"},{"start":217.074,"end":235.331,"text":"所以這個就是你們的情緒在外海裡面本來就是應該要注意到對 我們會要注意的注意到為什麼我們的海南會被破壞而且破壞的程度如果按照我們2019到2023我國海南發生的外力破壞或受損"},{"start":236.391,"end":254.08,"text":"總共有36件每年每條海瀾平均0.5的損害那如果按照全球450條的海瀾一年發生大約100件海瀾損害的事件換算全球平均一條海瀾每年發生才0.2而我們國內發生從2019到"},{"start":260.683,"end":282.216,"text":"二三年平均來講的話每年每條海欄就超出了0.5而且是比全球還要高所以原因在哪裡所以我們在防疫防範或者是在勤制的部分是不是我們要更加嚴謹而且你們要發揮到你們的更大的效能啊局長"},{"start":283.887,"end":310.555,"text":"對這部分事實上委員的數據大致的趨勢是沒有錯的也就是國內的海嵐在過去這幾年確實遭到損害鉤損的狀況有比較嚴重那大概每年有七次到八次遭到的損害那我們也把我們的國際海嵐跟國內海嵐遭到損害的相關的可能的查證的情資來做研判的話大多數都是受到中共國籍的海嵐來造成破壞小部分是受到部分原因而造成破壞"},{"start":311.095,"end":338.61,"text":"那這部分的整體的趨勢我們會特別來註一下剛剛有跟我們提到的中共級的船舶以及可能中共的船舶掛到第三國權宜輪的這種民意到周邊海運活動的狀況這部分是我們接下來主要查處跟收集情資的重點好 你們肯定就是大部分都是中共進行破壞有沒有其他的外力國際的破壞有沒有少數 非常少數那大部分是外力或不明原因的這部分比例比較低"},{"start":339.434,"end":347.203,"text":"那海瀾戰的破壞更容易但是我現在請教一下我國的5座國際海瀾戰的安全木城是由誰負責"},{"start":348.643,"end":370.917,"text":"國際海岸部分主要在我們的那個國土安全的機制裡面那行政院這邊都列為關鍵基礎設施那由行政院在政策指導部分有行政院的國土安全政策匯報邀集各部會來進行政策的討論那在執行面有國土安全辦他會來規劃相關的防護演練的措施邀集各單位來加強相關的防護演練那你來說明一下你說哪個單位"},{"start":375.687,"end":395.441,"text":"這行政院的單位,但今天應該不在現場國防部也有涉及到相關的關鍵設施的防護那國防部專責單位?沒有齁?喔好好,請你回座"},{"start":400.32,"end":424.062,"text":"委員好,我是國防部的座機室的次長有關於關鍵基礎設施的防護,我們國防部是依照國土辦所提供的這些各部會所提立的等於是有國土辦再來跟你們做橫向聯繫,作為你們也要相關的一些執行對不對是,我們評估了之後,我們就會有相關的兵力編組"},{"start":425.123,"end":442.021,"text":"然後納入如果在平時的話他會以區域聯防的這個機制來做一個相互的聯繫跟兵力的應援好你回座那我想請教一下我們國防部長有關於國金的能力現在每礦業下"},{"start":443.427,"end":447.149,"text":"我們從過去裡面的2020年的時候我們400人有401人暴增401人不願意持續的在當兵在最近"},{"start":463.837,"end":476.391,"text":"我們的媒體報導裡面就有說國慶臨宴賠錢也要提前退伍的人數增加為1565個人比去年的2020年的401人的暴增將近4倍"},{"start":481.816,"end":510.788,"text":"四倍所以我們要去思考今天不是少子化的問題今天是既然他們已經進入到這個軍人的職業的職場裡面已經到這個裡面了怎麼會變成變成他們又不願意再繼續的繼續的當兵又寧可賠錢原因是什麼不是因為不是因為"},{"start":512.208,"end":531.986,"text":"薪資的問題也不是因為少子化的問題是國軍裡面的管理還是對我們國軍的這個訓練包含整個的一個管理制度是不是已經失去了信心了部長你來回答這個問題好不好"},{"start":534.126,"end":545.514,"text":"跟委員報告,就這個您講的這個趨勢,它人數是有逐漸增加是沒有錯,不過112年當然就已經到1544,那113年到1565,那我想這個"},{"start":552.758,"end":572.276,"text":"這樣子的一個趨勢,我們根據這個提前退伍的人員來調查的話還是說薪資待遇較低,佔了63.9%為最高所以我們也在眼裡提高人員薪資待遇這個部分,已經要再跟行政院來做一個協調"},{"start":574.057,"end":602.497,"text":"那另外就是說為了這個穩固部隊的基層能力我們也朝這個提高流營意願的方向來努力我們會持續來推動這個有關你講的這種管理方式的一個精進這一個部分確實是我們應該要注意的一個重要的層面這樣子那包括採取一個應該要有我一直提倡的一個檢法的思維人性化的管理這樣子"},{"start":603.217,"end":622.205,"text":"今天會有這樣的一個顯示的數據的人數不斷的增加而且還不斷的會有很多的退伍潮原因在哪裡今天他們當了進入到軍人的職場應該就是拋熱血而且他們是"},{"start":629.315,"end":651.246,"text":"服從命令要在他的磁場裡面是他們的天子當然當兵就是他們榮耀可是因為我們的金公教人員的這一些退休鳳後面不斷地被砍"},{"start":652.967,"end":665.153,"text":"今天他們會進入到這個磁場裡面因為國金一定有一個相對的保障他們的薪資另外他們的退休退伍之後有退休奉"},{"start":666.291,"end":691.526,"text":"這就是他們要進入到這個磁場裡面的最佳的條件可是為什麼到最後要被砍原因就是我沒有保障了嘛我在軍中裡面就算是我奉獻後面我老了我退休了沒有用後面的保障當然他們不願意再繼續待在這個軍中裡面所以這個就是部長你們要思考的地方今天我們要招"},{"start":692.206,"end":715.379,"text":"招這些軍人能夠再提升我們的國力國備當然我們要給他更好的薪資保障跟他的退休保障這才是軍人他願意在我們在國防裡面願意奉獻但是我們有沒有給他保障所以部長你們要思考這個問題以上 謝謝好 謝謝威爾"},{"start":720.732,"end":723.079,"text":"謝謝黃仁委員部長請回接下來我們請林楚穎委員上台質詢"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}