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半導體15班 總共目前已經有2300多學生 合作的企業將近有200家那在高等教育深耕的主策的部分 特別也透過這樣的一個系統 面對未來臺灣各大學校院越來越多的國際學生 能夠以提供最好的支持跟服務"},{"start":2474.456,"end":2474.896,"text":"臺灣優華語計畫以美歐紐澳為主要地區透過"},{"start":2493.623,"end":2518.71,"text":"我國華語文教學能量的大學跟美歐地區優質的大學來合作那目前112學年度已促成我國21所的大學跟上述這些國家68所的國外大學建立了合作關係那詳細的內容請委員來參閱那麼感謝委員關注高等教育的議題面對內外環境的迅速變化及國際人才的競爭那麼教育部會持續"},{"start":2521.291,"end":2536.679,"text":"透過放寬招生規定推動各項國際招生計畫來協助大學能夠營造國際化的環境也能夠招收更多的國際學生來臺充實產業所需人才並藉由跨部會的合作跟國際合作促進華語文教育的推廣"},{"start":2537.739,"end":2549.169,"text":"這部份教育部也會持續以這樣的基礎來滾動修正作為未來政策的評估 敬請委員能夠持續給予這樣的國際招生的發展的議題還有教育的相關議題來支持跟指教 謝謝好 謝謝潘部長 然後我們補充介紹在場的委員 有無配意委員"},{"start":2559.984,"end":2577.874,"text":"還有洪孟凱委員那請問對於上次會議議事錄大家有沒有任何的意見沒有意見的話那我們就是議事錄就確定那接下來呢我們就要進行詢答每位初期委員質詢時間是8分鐘必要時間延長2分鐘列席委員質詢的時間是4分鐘發言登記截止的時間是10點30分"},{"start":2586.538,"end":2603.707,"text":"委員如果有臨時提案．請在上午10點30分前提出．在本委委員會臨歉期委員質詢後．我們就立即進行處理．處理提案的時候若提案委員及聯署委員均不在場．我們原力不予處理．我們首先就請發言登記第一位的陳培雲委員質詢謝謝主席．有請潘部長來 潘部長 謝謝"},{"start":2615.2,"end":2618.585,"text":"委員早部長早安在520以前我想應該這是最後一次跟您在質詢台上對話那我想首先我要以家長的身份感謝部長這幾年的辛勞怎麼說因為在很多過往的經驗當中很多人都會說潘部長是最懂國教的部長"},{"start":2630.982,"end":2653.339,"text":"那也因為這樣所以在很多的國教議題上確實看到潘部長有非常非常多非常積極的作為例如說我從去年地補到現在在國教法特教法霸凌防制準則還有三聘辦法還有性平教育法其實都可以看得見部長對於國教的關懷那我很好奇部長您在這一段工作時間當中你自己覺得最有成就感的事情是什麼"},{"start":2654.884,"end":2667.31,"text":"謝謝委員剛才的鼓勵我想在這將近7年多我剛剛算過了到520是2645天因為其實在過去這段時間也正是面對我們非常多項的衝擊那108課綱是這些年一個比較重大的對於尤其剛才委員談到高中以下的這些課程改革要面對未來"},{"start":2682.557,"end":2682.817,"text":"維也根委員報告：最大的挑戰："},{"start":2701.556,"end":2730.341,"text":"其實是這三年的疫情真的是看到全世界在面對疫情後很多學校學生這個學習中斷的情形尤其最嚴肅的是入學的部分來中斷但臺灣這些年因為中央地方政府還有學校大家一起努力我們幾乎沒有讓孩子的學習中斷尤其是各項重大的入學考試克服各項的困難也能夠讓他執行因為這對孩子未來的升學發展對家長"},{"start":2731.181,"end":2745.038,"text":"那都是很重大的事但是那個因為疫情的變化千變萬化每一次我們都謹慎以待還有跟指揮中心能夠有特別的方案保障到每一位孩子不因為疫情甚至他確診了最後還是能夠讓"},{"start":2746.92,"end":2747.04,"text":"臺灣走過來了"},{"start":2762.534,"end":2787.297,"text":"好 謝謝部長我自己的小孩確實也是在疫情那一年正要考試我印象非常深刻那一天我們考完第一天會考決定到底第二天能不能考還好教育部跟當時的蘇院長決定讓我們繼續考完所以我也印象非常深刻這是部長您剛剛說你覺得最有成就感的事情但是我們另外要問有沒有在您任內覺得很遺憾沒有辦法完成但是你會願意放在交接清單的前三名跟下一位部長溝通"},{"start":2788.078,"end":2804.251,"text":"我覺得這也是國人非常好奇跟關心的我跟委員報告因為這些年我們雖然大家都很努力包含大院我們教育會的委員一直在關心學校這些校安霸凌等等包含一些歧視的問題因為我覺得"},{"start":2806.012,"end":2826.089,"text":"校園實在是一個支持孩子學習的地方那經常有一些個案影響的發生所以在這方面加上我覺得整個社會環境大幅的變化對孩子在心理情緒學習上確實有相當的影響那也有一些在校園自傷自殺的這些個案"},{"start":2827.71,"end":2855.862,"text":"這部分我一直覺得一定要再持續的努力那學生輔導法雖然教育部已經做相關草案的整理但是在大家意見的整合這方面看起來還需要再做努力學生輔導法我覺得務必一定要能夠來就目前我們所遭遇的面向來多加協助我想未來也要麻煩委員這邊我們大家再做努力雖然儘管像大學校院"},{"start":2856.522,"end":2858.824,"text":"我相信是比較能夠齊心協力支持孩子在未來這些發展上的需求"},{"start":2885.342,"end":2899.775,"text":"非常謝謝部長的回覆其實我還蠻驚訝部長提到學輔法因為我心裡面幫你放的也是學輔法因為我想說這件事情確實是很多而且最近也才發生桃園的霸凌事件我相信部長您都知道好 那這個部分就先謝謝部長的回應等一下我準備了一本繪本要送給部長我剛剛說你是最懂國教的部長"},{"start":2905.2,"end":2930.569,"text":"這本書呢在過去我跟部長討論很多議題的時候我發現你對國家階段的孩子真的有滿滿的耐心跟愛心這本書我自己非常喜歡這個作家今年也要到國際書展來書名就叫做飛一下休息一下再想一下我覺得很適合部長也許接下來休息但是休息完不要都沒有再往下做我相信部長在教育議題教育領域一定還有東西可以發揮那這個書等一下就送給部長好那接下來回到今天的主題來下一個謝謝"},{"start":2932.851,"end":2949.891,"text":"今天雖然在台的國際招生教育部的業務報告也提了非常多跟企業合作或是學校的設立可是我想問一下我們其實關心的是無國籍者是否可以來台就讀我們往下看下一頁去年某北部大學他們招收了一個無國籍藏人學生後來行政院跟教育部有介入相關的協調"},{"start":2952.093,"end":2970.527,"text":"後續也發函告訴北部的大學不要再收相關的學生可是今年這個學校又再次收到來自西藏學生的申請四名藏人學生再被校方以教育部的指導下以無國籍為由拒絕相關申請但是我想部長您一定非常熟悉相關議題我就不再多說下一頁我們有沒有機會請部長來想一想或是跟下一屆的部長再交接這個議題"},{"start":2974.15,"end":2992.051,"text":"修正外國學生來臺就學辦法因為其實在無國籍學生就讀國民小學及國民中學辦法在依照大學法25條另訂關於無國籍學生來臺就學辦法跟要點我覺得這個事情我們在看國際人才的時候其實很多人都知道很多藏人學生是來自於印度對那印度"},{"start":2994.574,"end":3018.119,"text":"那如果我們在很多南向政策上必須要跟這些國家有接軌的經驗那也許這些學生就是我們非常好的新南向的好幫手那相關辦法修訂之前有沒有機會藉由過去的相關經驗面對無國籍藏人的求學申請服以達賴老媽基金會作為保證機構的配套這個部分我想也許今天部長來不及回應但是後續是不是可以跟新部長有交接的機會"},{"start":3019.159,"end":3038.153,"text":"是,謝謝委員,因為這些年,就像委員提到的,我們在國中小其實也有突破大院這邊也支持,那過往香港政治比較危急的階段其實也有一個比較具有彈性的措施,對港生要來我想這部分我會請國際事這邊持續來跟外交部就這方面的議題,因為確實已經也陸陸續續這種情況了"},{"start":3044.838,"end":3045.258,"text":"這跨部會我相信應該可以找到應應的措施"},{"start":3057.722,"end":3068.11,"text":"好 謝謝署長 謝謝主席署長520之後我猜想您會繼續留任喔那所以有很多事情要持續跟部長拜託跟討論這個是全大運的開幕現場署長您有在現場在畫面中其中有一個可憐的選手他的心情非常的錯綜複雜可是他還是乖乖地把聖火這個工作完成發生了什麼事情呢他其實被取消了資格其中有一個選手他曾經在過往"},{"start":3081.22,"end":3083.161,"text":"我曉得這部分有經過我們主委會開會決議還是必須依照競賽規程取消他的資格"},{"start":3102.352,"end":3125.976,"text":"目前看起來辦法是這樣可是我們來看一下可是這個一刀兩斷的切法真的合理嗎再跟署長分享另外一個案例一日體資生中日體資生這件事情我覺得也是相關類似的爭議所以目前這個事情我剛剛說那兩個選手其中一個選手他們也很願意接受目前的仲裁結果可是這樣的限制是不是合理我們來看一下今天他不是透過單項協會的選拔也不是體育署的審查報名"},{"start":3129.577,"end":3129.757,"text":"主席"},{"start":3144.534,"end":3159.367,"text":"是不是可以跟署長討論其實通盤檢討相關的規程分級制度的合理性檢視目的跟手段的一致性這件事情還有認真思考第三方公正第三方仲裁作為救濟的可能性我相信署長從上院到現在一直很致力想要解決整體制度結構面的問題系統性的問題非常的困難可是有沒有機會從一個一個這些案例來看相關的事情"},{"start":3167.728,"end":3177.573,"text":"報告委員我想這個資格的部分的確這可能在我們的體育紛爭仲裁方面我們想接下來再跟委員一起來討論一下他的確在當時在訂那個法的時候針對這個比賽現場的資格的問題的確沒有辦法像國際的仲裁"},{"start":3187.157,"end":3192.26,"text":"關於國家代表隊的風紀的問題其實相關的新聞我相信署長你一定都有印象那到底國家隊集訓期間跟比賽期間教練跟球員是不是都不可以喝酒這部分我想先請署長說說看"},{"start":3207.429,"end":3223.715,"text":"報告委員其實我們大部分的國家隊隊員都非常的自律那好那教練的部分呢在集訓期間教練可以喝酒嗎教練的部分基本上他們外出我們基本上不會做太多的限制但是他們其實還是會自律絕對不會有太誇張的行為出現那你認為可不可以喝酒"},{"start":3224.295,"end":3227.018,"text":"維持清醒跟你剛剛一直不說死到底可不可以喝酒對你說他有他個人的實踐可是我們來看往下一頁"},{"start":3241.155,"end":3268.166,"text":"我們其實收到相關投訴那個前一天那個4月25號男足U20教練團跟廠商喝酒然後還拍照上傳到社群媒體可是剛剛署長你一直不肯說他到底可不可以喝酒你只說他保持清醒可是我還是要說這件事情其實真的有觀感的問題那當然很多球員都非常的自律很多選手都已經很自律可是教練這個狀態真的可以嗎那因為可是我剛剛問了三次署長你都沒有說實我想相關的看法我們都還需要討論署長你覺得呢"},{"start":3269.867,"end":3270.147,"text":"黃孟楷委員"},{"start":3306.567,"end":3329.592,"text":"主席 謝謝 麻煩請潘部長來 部長 謝謝委員長部長 在進入今天的專案報告之前我先請教時事問題上禮拜又看到說桃園某高中有女學生被霸凌的一個事件影片瘋傳 請教有沒有看到這個影片這部分 同仁有跟我特別提到"},{"start":3330.919,"end":3355.781,"text":"到目前為止今天居然講到的是說這一個加害者他還有假道歉在上禮拜這個事情發生之後假道歉然後居然是再去提告這一個被害者說被害者公然侮辱他就是說事實可以這樣子黑白顛倒嗎?看到那個影片裡面加害者是直接拿利檢來對於這個被害者頭髮"},{"start":3358.163,"end":3378.693,"text":"衣物來去做攻擊、撿毀那校方第一時間居然還講是說他們原本是好朋友因為網路的言論所以不和那馬上又被大家就是砲轟啊就覺得是說難道社會安全網、教育安全網是魚死網破嗎那誰敢再去讓學生去這個學校"},{"start":3380.288,"end":3380.328,"text":"委員報告"},{"start":3410.128,"end":3416.993,"text":"所以學校調查小組到底調查出結果沒有?委員還沒那如果沒有的話學校憑什麼先發這個聲明?沒有這個我認為一切都應該以調查結果來做說明再好就像今天我回覆委員你就是說他們明明就還在調查的過程可能不能說這個時候憑哪一個人所知道的資訊就去做這個事件可能是什麼我覺得是不理所以說校方還講校方的聲明"},{"start":3439.071,"end":3467.392,"text":"甚至讓大家就覺得說真的是校方的聲明在網路上大家都看得到講說有關大家關心的事情然後謝謝大家關心跟協助然後通知了家長原本雙方是好友因為與網路語言造成糾紛後續校方將協助處理跟持續追蹤輔導輕描淡寫說實在話我覺得這對於第一線不管說你是什麼樣的教育環境"},{"start":3468.601,"end":3469.702,"text":"教育部長潘文忠列席"},{"start":3484.972,"end":3486.474,"text":"你訂出多少準則 如果說第一線的教育工作環境沒有辦法依照這個準則來做"},{"start":3501.836,"end":3515.098,"text":"委員這個也正是說所以人家才會講是說難道非要出人命才會重視嗎今天他是拿力檢去剪頭髮如果說那一天力檢沒有剪到頭髮而是往他身上臉部五官"},{"start":3516.549,"end":3535.175,"text":"沖去其實就一線之隔那是不是就可能造成永久性的傷害那即便不是他今天這個影片出來我覺得對於那個被害者的心理層面我覺得那也是一輩子的傷害那也需要後續的輔導那再者有沒有去掌握這個加害者他到底有沒有相關的幫派背景"},{"start":3535.995,"end":3558.974,"text":"委員這部分可能目前為止因為我就說他正在依照準則來調查的過程我想相信這方面的內容出來之後什麼時間點會出來調查這個我們來督促桃園市政府教育局跟學校因為原來在準則本來就有一個期限所以我想一定要在期限裡面完成而且更重要的是他可能不是"},{"start":3559.775,"end":3563.117,"text":"委員這部分我會請國教署跟桃園市政府交一句我想對這個案子我們必須因為就像委員剛才講到我早上也看到這一則新聞就是這個加害行為人突然又有另外一個想法了"},{"start":3586.189,"end":3586.89,"text":"促進國際生來臺及留臺實施計畫"},{"start":3605.326,"end":3622.097,"text":"其中有講到說會有國發基金提供產學獎助金還有企業提供生活跟實習津貼目前看起來是一個月一萬元左右來吸引這個優秀的國際生來臺就讀跟留臺但是很多外界關心我覺得"},{"start":3623.098,"end":3651.521,"text":"本期還是再次強調國際生願意來臺灣來就讀並且能夠發揮所長我覺得這是好事過去以來我覺得這個政策的宗旨跟出發點是好的但是有一些不孝的不管是學校或是不管是企業他就變成是變價的廉價勞工奴工來造成是說很多人甚至之前媒體有講是說新南向產學專班的亂象跟人口販運一線之隔"},{"start":3653.282,"end":3674.341,"text":"這個標題很重喔那我們現在又在看到是說有這樣的一個生活津貼每個月一萬但是他要有兩年的這個後續有兩年的就業義務那我想請教在這個過程裡面我們教育部有什麼樣新的方式來確實督導不要讓過去的黑工亂象"},{"start":3675.949,"end":3700.507,"text":"委員所指導這部分我跟委員報告新南向產西國際專班確實當時在開始啟動我發現我們也面對這些部分的學校在招收學生上確實有這種便宜形式可能可以透過當地的這些人力、仲介等等的所以我也知道在有一段時間教育部是使出非常強力的要求"},{"start":3701.989,"end":3702.149,"text":"中文字幕提供"},{"start":3720.071,"end":3736.974,"text":"那時候甚至還有傳出來說明明當地國的學生要的報考的是觀光科系結果來台灣之後才知道說觀光科系根本沒了然後他要去做餐飲科系然後就完全跟他的想像不同然後人力仲介就說你已經收了這個人力費用你還是要來唸"},{"start":3738.155,"end":3741.758,"text":"所以這個委員知道前面這幾年為什麼有好多的學校在處理這些很不當我想這個不只是影響臺灣在國際高校的聲譽所以幾所的學校教育部是採取非常重的懲罰甚至有幾所已經退場了"},{"start":3760.712,"end":3779.251,"text":"這個也是要 我們希望政府全力 包含企業這一次願意共同來支持那學校招生這是它基本的義務啦如果只是為了招生根本連學生在哪裡學生要讀的什麼都不所以這一次在不管相關的這些辦法裡面都非常清楚的包含最新的促進國際招生的這些作業很多的這個規範"},{"start":3782.734,"end":3804.708,"text":"是把過去遭遇的這些學校疏忽甚至是不當的措施做了這方面的規範部長我們來講一下怎麼樣落實這個督導好不好好你這邊之前有提到是講學金榜學生恐違反勞基法所以教育部你研擬契約範本對不對有什麼時候會出來"},{"start":3806.254,"end":3809.515,"text":"這個已經完成了這部分我們再詳細給委員參考因為我剛才跟委員報告的是說新南向國際產系專班的一些我們說不好的現象其實都是作為我們後續這幾項修正的規範包含實習因為實習還有兩種一種是校內一種還有學生還有打工依照勞基法的規範他有打工的規範像這些我們在相關的實施規範裡面都給學校非常的明確的要求就不會有那種"},{"start":3835.779,"end":3837.881,"text":"第一,絕對不會再出現明明是打工但是他把它算入說他的一個學科,是不是?"},{"start":3851.636,"end":3861.242,"text":"這個已經有前車致電的學校我想學校之間也知道教育部所採取的態度幾乎是沒有什麼打折的機會所以這部分我相信在未來我們面對國際招生跟把這些國際學生能夠有機會留下來臺灣工作等等的我相信大學是非常的清楚我也在大學校長會議讓大學校長們知道"},{"start":3875.351,"end":3897.681,"text":"目的面對生源的困窘情況大家是要全力以赴不要再像過往所出現一些不好的案例對 絕對不要劣幣驅逐良幣其實本席也知道很多的學校他也願意來做比較好的一個人才培養但是就是因為過去有這樣子劣幣驅逐良幣的狀況而造成說他們其實要再招收也不一定那麼的容易是 是"},{"start":3898.701,"end":3905.465,"text":"最後部長你剛剛提到那個契約範本你再提供給本席最後我想確認一下啦因為到目前為止我們講是說5年要投入52億的經費來跟國際生來招收而且現在講說2030年預計國際生可能累積到32萬人但陸生的部分"},{"start":3918.692,"end":3926.042,"text":"到目前為止對 被質疑說沒有善待陸生馬上教育部員拿出來沒有啊陸生在臺灣的就業滿意有高達七成啊就學啦"},{"start":3937.396,"end":3948.705,"text":"對,就學滿意,也高達七成啊那一樣的道理啊,到目前為止難道陸生的部分還是將在這邊嗎觀光客將在那邊,那陸生也要將在這邊我們沒有辦法有更純潤花開的時候比較遺憾的是過去這幾年我們說大學學位生的這部分但是112學年度我看到疫情過後現在研修生的部分又開始恢復當然還不到當時最多三萬兩千多位啦大概目前已經有逐漸"},{"start":3966.98,"end":3967.18,"text":"部長 我這樣請教啦"},{"start":3989.729,"end":4010.231,"text":"因為520下禮拜新政府即將上任新的部長即將上任就你的觀察跟了解到底我們對陸生這一塊學術交流的部分有沒有契機能夠更往前更開放還是說新政府的部分就是會越緊縮兩岸到底有沒有機會透過學術交流或是這個陸生的來台就學"},{"start":4011.112,"end":4012.533,"text":"而有更進一步的一個方向"},{"start":4036.893,"end":4037.213,"text":"接下來我們請萬美玲委員"},{"start":4069.995,"end":4070.275,"text":"潘文忠議員"},{"start":4091.85,"end":4097.714,"text":"大家很關注的從這個把管案然後少子化的衝擊到108課綱的爭議私校退場條例等等那歷經過這些爭議同時呢我們也一起完成過國教法特教法這幾部大法的一個修法我想這個七年多來應該功勞苦勞都有了那所以是不是給你個30秒來談一下你的心得這個一個臨別感言好不好"},{"start":4116.956,"end":4143.615,"text":"謝謝委員因為委員對教育也都很深入所以我們有好多的對話不管在詢答或私下的過程那我也跟委員報告因為教育真的是盤根錯節各方的期待也有很大的差異所以在遂行教育公共政策我自己很堅持的是希望能夠多溝通然後在整個政策的推動各方面也不要太單一一言化這個我一直認為因為你是學生家長的你更知道家長們的期許其實差異也大"},{"start":4146.437,"end":4160.973,"text":"有沒有什麼遺憾我跟委員報告因為教育一棒接一棒我認為這7年多來謝謝大院也給我很大的支持教育部的同仁全力做能做的包括剛才委員講我們去年的兩部大法這個60幾項的執法我也在"},{"start":4164.817,"end":4186.483,"text":"上個禮拜通通把它完成了那當然後續我相信以教育的議題還是不斷我早上我有跟陳培文在講我說學生輔導法這是一個關係到孩子未來在校園內能不能更好的友善互動避免這種遭受人身各方面的攻擊這個我還在努力"},{"start":4187.583,"end":4209.274,"text":"謝謝我想部長一定別有很多話說但是我相信以後您應該還是在教育的領域裡面那很多事情還可以繼續來關心但今天針對招委牌的議題我想來請教一下我們過去有新南向專班對不對現在我們又再增加了一個新型專班這個新型專班大家也是希望能夠擴大國際生來臺留臺的一個計畫我們看到在113年到116年"},{"start":4214.876,"end":4227.791,"text":"總共我們大概預計編列52億的預算那要這個做10個海外招生基地目前也已經有了3個招生基地在做大概我看到您報告上是越南印尼跟菲律賓然後我們預估要招收的人數是1200人"},{"start":4231.795,"end":4237.101,"text":"不過部長我看到您的報告裡面現在合訂了35校123班所以整個人數上是2301人比預估的還要多出了1101人可以說達成率是192%怎麼會這麼多 這個數字是正確的嗎"},{"start":4251.89,"end":4257.772,"text":"跟我們報告這個是正確的數字這個數字是正確的因為這一次在進行專班這部分跟過往國際學生招生有比較大的不同的地方這一次是企業充分的參與因為也是我們國內企業企業充分參與一定是好的因為他還會給他們每個月有像類似生活津貼的這種費用"},{"start":4275.296,"end":4275.796,"text":"委員那個過程還在修正計畫有些學校他們其實已經申請了"},{"start":4294.089,"end":4318.389,"text":"後來計畫修正也確定了所以現在委員這個數據應該是目前為止最新的數據那再來我們看到在過去新南向專班的時候我們畢業留台的就業率那也按照教育部的報告大概64%左右的一個留台就業率那我們現在看到我們現在這個新的計畫是4年希望額外增加來台就學人數是18568人"},{"start":4321.491,"end":4326.473,"text":"那希望留臺就業率是19777人這個數字蠻奇怪的也就是說來臺就學沒有這麼多人為什麼留臺就業可以比來臺就學人更多那甚至於留臺就業率會超過100%"},{"start":4337.158,"end":4366.139,"text":"這個數字是怎麼回事我跟委員報告因為在這個報告裡面教育部有把最近從新南向產息專班到擴大重點領域到現在所提的這一些還有我們的高教生跟他其實是一個能夠以一定的基礎之下再來不斷的來擴充那所以增加出來的這個部分的就業即使包含我們前面的一些他其實會有這樣的外溢的效果你是說包含什麼因為這個數字有一個很大的落差嘛"},{"start":4366.999,"end":4386.324,"text":"因為過往根文報告現在我們在過去的相關的措施國際學生、境外學生留下來在臺灣工作大概4成不是,那個部長我曉得嘛但現在因為你來台的學生數就沒有這麼多那你怎麼會留台的學生數可以超過來台的學生數本席的問題是這一個"},{"start":4387.324,"end":4411.863,"text":"沒有 委員這部分為什麼當時在呈現這個也是要讓委員知道說這幾個措施即使它是增加了我們講的叫外溢的效益那這部分我也跟委員報告因為從哪裡的外溢沒有 它本來也有很多的境外的外籍學生在臺灣所以我們在生根計畫裡面有設了一個非常重要的措施希望學校要成立專責的人員因為以前國際學生畢業以後就回去了"},{"start":4414.085,"end":4428.816,"text":"好部長這樣子本能了解但是我希望你以後報告或計畫要再寫清楚一點因為你專程否這個計畫來一萬八千多個人然後流台要一萬九這就不對了嘛如果你是有外業還有其他的加進來我們當然希望這個人數是可以多的但你不能給這個其實是錯誤的一個資訊好不好這個我們做檢討就正以後我們計畫跟報告數字要詳細"},{"start":4437.102,"end":4455.115,"text":"那接下來部長我還是要請教您一下我想您在任這麼多年其實也非常重視校園霸凌但是早上您也說了我們在桃園的這所私立高中有一部霸凌的影片流出來您也看過了就您看完了以後覺得這算不算霸凌"},{"start":4455.711,"end":4470.803,"text":"委員 這個當然實質我們但如果從影像所看到的當然是霸凌對 從影像上看到是霸凌喔那但是呢 我覺得我們其實在4月16號的時候才新 教育部才新修訂了校園霸凌防制準則嘛 對不對"},{"start":4471.724,"end":4487.292,"text":"我們希望去補所有校園霸凌的一個漏洞盡量把它補這個破網補起來可是才沒隔多久就發生了我們桃園私立高中這個霸凌的案件而且在這中間的處理這個學校可以說是荒腔走板了"},{"start":4488.332,"end":4499.363,"text":"當然我相信沒有一個學校會惡意的刻意的要把這個霸凌案件去壓下來但處理過程的粗糙以及可能沒有按照這個準則去做那就會引起很多的問題好 那我們來看這個霸凌準則下去了以後本身發現其實很多的學校還不太清楚這個準則的這個內容是什麼"},{"start":4510.214,"end":4518.417,"text":"所以我想是不是我們教育部在各個教育局或者是各學校的宣導上面是不是要加強這第一個第二個我們來看這個學校現在大家都在講說在第一時間學校就說家長之間和解了那結果呢更離譜是他說我沒有想說是和解而是我請他們來"},{"start":4534.002,"end":4558.014,"text":"了解教育部就說這個是希望能調解那最後呢其實是大家根本不了解不知道無解你知道嗎那你看喔這個準則弄得亂七八糟以後光一個名詞可以弄到這個事件更複雜所以呢我們看到根據這個準則案件發生24小時之內要通報主管機關嘛對不對那接下來的這個準則部長知道嗎"},{"start":4559.493,"end":4584.309,"text":"這個準的你都了解嗎?你都了解,好那所以呢也要審議小組來認定是不是霸凌五日之內要組成有一半外部委員的處理小組然後才能進入雙方是不是能夠調和、調解或者調查嘛那最短一週、最長不可以超過四個月要把這件事情去結案喔所以我們看到這所私立高中其實都沒有按照這樣的一個步驟在走"},{"start":4585.089,"end":4587.711,"text":"謝謝委員指教這個確實我們這次整個修訂後一個比較大的措施把師對就教職員工對於生拉開來"},{"start":4604.324,"end":4610.848,"text":"那在目前校園霸凌準則就以生對生的來做一個處理所以在機制上讓學校不會混淆但是我應該所提醒的因為霸凌準則花了滿場時間溝通對話我講的是當然在延商這個過程所提出來的那發布到現在時間還算比較短那我應該提醒的雖然過去我們已經辦了幾場的這些宣導說明但我覺得這個部分還要持續的做我們希望還要再加強了好不好對對尤其有個案的"},{"start":4631.399,"end":4647.567,"text":"學校發聲後我們可能更可以用這個機會去了解那學校在執行霸凌準則相關的作業程序有什麼地方是被誤解的部長我們再來看一下有兩個表格第一個就是我本期整理一下108年到112年我們生對生校園霸凌的這個通報跟確認的這個件數我們看那個總計的地方就好108年的時候767件到112年的時候2502件"},{"start":4660.433,"end":4660.553,"text":"第二張表"},{"start":4679.588,"end":4707.205,"text":"是這個各級暴力事件跟偏差行為的一個這個通報的案件數我們也可以看到從108年的9385件一直到112年的26171件也成長了近三倍所以其實部長這一次我們看到這所私立高中的這個霸凌的影片其實真的讓我們非常心痛不要說我也是一個為人母的角色去看任何人看到其實都覺得太離譜太誇張"},{"start":4708.746,"end":4728.101,"text":"那麼先是打巴掌呼頭那麼接下來其實用剪刀去剪頭髮這一幕其實我相信大家看的那不是剪那個孩子的頭髮而是剪得每一個人的心都碎了因為我們要知道其實這個就是一種接近是毀容的行為了身體髮膚受之父母尤其是女孩子最在乎了這個頭髮就像他第二生命一樣所以我想這個事件其實是還蠻嚴重的但是呢我們看到這幾年我們不斷地在做不斷地在關注但是呢"},{"start":4736.707,"end":4736.767,"text":"最後﹖"},{"start":4758.65,"end":4780.967,"text":"在這個案件當中出現一個問題我們都知道現在要求教官退出校園所以不足的人力我們用學務創新人力去代替但是以這個學校本來應該有四名教官缺但因為預缺不補所以只有兩個教官那麼這兩個教官要負責全校一千將近四百個學生所以校安其實有漏洞那你說另外補那兩個缺"},{"start":4782.188,"end":4782.488,"text":"主席主席主席"},{"start":4803.362,"end":4831.921,"text":"那都是由這個教育局去做統一甄選但是一旦在第一時間甄選完畢沒有人要來的時候這個專案結束掉這個學校就繼續空缺了我們是不是能夠因為桃園市教育局其實也有發文到教育部去能不能讓這一些透過統一甄選但是補不到人的學校可以用專案的方式再自行去聘足這個校安人力否則這樣的人力真的不足以支應現在節節高升的校園霸凌跟這個行為偏差事件部長可以嗎"},{"start":4832.605,"end":4859.466,"text":"好,各位報告,我想在人力的徵選補充這方面我請國教署跟學特師再做一個研組因為人還是要到位,因為教官是換成1.5位聘不到人就是0的意思這點我想我請我們兩個單位在這方面來做一個研組因應我想這個您臨別最後給您的一個任務能不能一個月內請他們把這個協議的結果告訴我們可以好,謝謝好,謝謝委員"},{"start":4861.961,"end":4863.122,"text":"主席潘文忠列席"},{"start":4880.284,"end":4904.72,"text":"張維豪部長這是你最後一次以教育部長的身份站在這邊來備詢我想我是第9任的立委我看著你這樣上來然後呢在第11屆的時候呢也要歡送你離去對我來說對你來說應該是感慨非常的多我想這7年多大概是創下我們教育部長這個任內就是留任最大的一個記錄我說實在的部長在這個過程當中當然有8月1月時間你因為卡管案而離開我想卡管不管是對你或是對我"},{"start":4908.743,"end":4911.865,"text":"當時身為一個在野黨委員來說都是一個非常大的傷痕而且呢因為卡管案我們換掉了吳茂坤部長我們換掉了葉俊榮部長然後8個月之後呢你又重新再來我想那個時候因為整個教育部真的是風聲鶴唳我想沒有人敢來接教育部長所以你又再一次的被請求我為什麼講這些的歷史是要告訴你說其實你是深受高層的信任"},{"start":4933.115,"end":4940.177,"text":"所以說呢今天大概七年半的時間當中本席對你是給予無限的祝福希望你未來能夠一切非常的平安順心也能夠繼續發揮你的專業在我們的國教特別是在國教這一塊裡面能夠造福我們更多的學子給予滿滿的一個祝福了沒有功勞也有非常大的苦勞但是話鋒一轉各位我們還是來看我們今天的書面報告"},{"start":4956.121,"end":4965.546,"text":"因為我們今天我們如果只看教育部的規劃或數字你會覺得好像預期非常的政策很成功但是部長我要看到的是一個檢討這部分報告的檢討到底在哪裡來我告訴你有哪些地方我很希望能夠看到的你們告訴我就說穩定成長總數大概11萬6千但是呢我要問"},{"start":4979.133,"end":4999.451,"text":"到底我們國際招生的方式到底是如何是自行申請的多呢還是透過仲介仲介費到底收了多少申選的機制在哪裡還有呢你們每一次的這個獎學金吸引國際學生的方式跟比例到底是如何然後有沒有掌握留在臺灣工作超過一年的一個比例還有在學校裡面的成金獎懲到底是不是我們列為在臺灣工作的條件還有"},{"start":5004.656,"end":5004.756,"text":"委員會主席"},{"start":5024.724,"end":5029.186,"text":"問題是你們現在所看到的我沒有看到這些檢討報告我可以一一來跟部長討論但是本席所條列的而且我用這個特別框出來的我麻煩部長一個月之內給我一個正確的數字這是非常重要這是我認為的這才叫做檢討那我們就一一來去看一下到底哪些部分可以就教育部長的你看"},{"start":5044.532,"end":5047.995,"text":"我們從P9月你第9月就開始說要擴大招生國際的這個學生然後呢113到145年當中的每年投入5000萬表示5年要投租了2.5億喔那我們國發基金會還要給這個新型專班的學生每人每年10萬總共最多可以補助兩年企業界每個月至少1萬生活津貼所以因為國際學生兩年獲得44萬的補助"},{"start":5075.336,"end":5091.184,"text":"2030年你要給我32萬人請問這32萬人他們的獎助先生跟生活津貼到底是怎麼樣來分配的否則加起來照你們的數據來看起來大概就有1000多萬了應該不是吧那請問有多少人是可以獲得這些補助"},{"start":5092.648,"end":5093.768,"text":"部長現在有掌握這些數字嗎?部長你有沒有考慮過我們台灣年輕人的感受?"},{"start":5112.994,"end":5135.423,"text":"這是一個相對剝奪感我同意一定要招收所有的國際的學生但是你也很清楚最優秀的國際學生不會來臺灣我必須大膽的這樣去講我在大學任教這麼多很多學生很認真但是最優秀的學生是在歐美所以我們要很多很多的學生過來我們要寄出非常多的獎助學金所以我今天是來就教育來討論這樣的狀況所以有多少學生是0可以領到我剛剛說的最高額"},{"start":5141.038,"end":5145.241,"text":"那個學生的人數昨年有一個統計表再請召委來指教就是這個對象的學生那這個國發基金所協助的主要是單程的這個機票的這個費用反過來應該是企業 企業要做的這方面是因為他們要旅行到這個企業裡面去服務的"},{"start":5164.753,"end":5171.856,"text":"很好,那部長接下來就是我的問題了嗎?你要旅行,你要期盼要兩年,請問他如果沒有到兩年拒絕呢?他怎麼辦呢?他如果做半年就離開了,你有充分掌握嗎?為什麼我要特別提出這個問題?因為我們國科會在106到109也提出了海外國人的歸國的計畫,也希望你回來能夠至少留啊,結果你看"},{"start":5184.821,"end":5188.326,"text":"回來了人不多 留下人更少四年我們花了四億多結果回台131只留下97人我們每天要做這樣的事情所以說企業界希望我們留下來你有掌握他們到底有多少人留下來嗎"},{"start":5196.585,"end":5211.515,"text":"跟委員報告當然這個委員剛才一開始只叫那個檢討這個為什麼會有提出後續的這幾個方案其實就是檢討前面像新南向專班這個我想委員最了解的當時有些學校實在是做得非常過頭非常非常離譜當時也聽到很多那時候楊司長都還在啊"},{"start":5217.199,"end":5217.219,"text":"好!"},{"start":5233.628,"end":5235.189,"text":"臺灣已經變成工作的快速通關管道了部長你來看一下我們先從數據來看起104的時候呢其實最多是馬來西亞"},{"start":5256.264,"end":5256.444,"text":"委員會主席"},{"start":5278.524,"end":5293.212,"text":"增加的快12.5倍了所以我只要問他們到底是來臺灣工作還是來念書的部長你讓我看完這個部分我在學校裡面我徵求非常多大學老師的一個想法專科學校老師很多人拿獎學金不去上課在外面打工"},{"start":5293.832,"end":5297.255,"text":"有良心的老師把關,把他給當掉,他就轉系。那樣的轉系呢,他會失去全額的獎金,他就繼續不上課,就繼續給你打工。然後呢,他就可以混畢業留下來。很容易,像我目前臺北發生的這個寶林茶室的那位月籍的代班廚師,他就是畢業留下來的。"},{"start":5313.55,"end":5326.433,"text":"因為現在的證照你們所謂的這個四證合一的你們的就業金卡連網紅隨便都可以拿到就業金卡你看移民署發具的工作許可居留簽證外僑居留證還有從入國許這個從入國的許可證四勝合一你不覺得現在有人這樣的一個證發的太過於腐爛了嗎"},{"start":5336.294,"end":5359.506,"text":"非常多我沒有說外國學生留下來不可以可是你過去還有一個機制過去你還會要求你要留下來薪資起碼要三萬塊錢以上還有一些可以卡關的一個機制因為要保護所以你現在為了要讓這麼多人你要衝到這麼多的人數所以我才說嘛你的新能向意義到底在哪裡我們會非常的歡迎但是呢就我們以前來最嚴肅的來說外籍學生如果詐騙酒駕打架"},{"start":5363.288,"end":5367.914,"text":"我們沒有辦法給他退學臺灣學生可以退學我當學務長的時候退學的一些的學生經過一些程序可是外籍學生到我們這邊來我們沒有這樣子的一個部分我們到底收的這些學生納稅人的錢我只是說這是一個比例的原則我目前在你的檢討報告當中我沒有看到"},{"start":5382.952,"end":5394.1,"text":"所以為什麼我要需要這些數字我需要這些錢還有我告訴你目前為止我剛所說的都是教育的reality都是現況部長面對這麼多你今天這份檢討報告我說實在的我不覺得你的南向你出來告訴我你有很多的學生但是對我來說那整個實質對臺灣產業對於我們的國際交流來說我覺得還是對我來說還是要畫上一個非常大的問號"},{"start":5406.989,"end":5407.69,"text":"教育部部長潘文忠列席"},{"start":5424.232,"end":5451.111,"text":"他其實是願意留下來再繼續工作這個是一個已經這個佔比率大概66%那委員剛才提到的現在為什麼我們要求學校你要負責招生你必須負有相當的義務這個對學校採取一個很嚴格的處分但我要跟委員報告的是這幾所甚至委員之前你提到的那些學校退場為什麼會退場因為教育部很清楚的"},{"start":5451.491,"end":5454.352,"text":"因為那些學校做得太過分了但是我剛所調列的這些狀況包括外籍學生你很難給他退學包括外籍學生他們幾乎把打工比念書來得更重要"},{"start":5466.977,"end":5489.505,"text":"那幾乎對於很多東南亞的學生來說都認為臺灣就是個打工的天堂因為而且打完工之後呢學校如果說標準又很低他又可以得到一些的獎助學金即使沒有獎助學金他繼續打工的賺錢的方法然後你要把他發放這個所謂借用金卡這在很多東南亞國家都已經變成是他們的利多可對我們來說的話"},{"start":5490.765,"end":5493.646,"text":"我們花了這麼多錢給予他們過來 給予獎勵學生 給予生活補助他們的對待跟我們本國學生又不一樣你對我的本國學生到底公平在哪裡我跟趙薇報告因為趙薇在我們開始推動新南向這個產息初期確實有遭遇到好多學校在處理不當的包含學生也有這方面的"},{"start":5511.275,"end":5511.655,"text":"教育部本身就有一個陳情專案"},{"start":5531.241,"end":5556.673,"text":"因為我們說從源頭我們已經做了好多的要求這個要求是你看你那個入學通知等等的部分啊是必須要到你的學生再來實習打工分得清清楚楚好部長如果說分得清楚的話因為他們不到你教育部陳請他們到我本席辦公室來陳請好不好所以無論如何把我剛剛所提到的那幾個綠色框出來的不管是數據還有是人數還有一些的做法我覺得這對我個人來說才是今天我們安排這次所謂的"},{"start":5560.435,"end":5560.815,"text":"請教育部長潘文忠列席"},{"start":5584.277,"end":5585.058,"text":"謝謝柯子恩委員的發言"},{"start":5618.839,"end":5618.859,"text":"羅廷偉議員"},{"start":5634.52,"end":5659.976,"text":"好部長謝謝大學推動國際招生台灣優華我們計畫的執行跟成效跟檢討其實在這個專題我們還有很多想要跟大家就教育部長但是部長我想還是延續我們剛剛柯委員所說的這是最後一次在委員會的一個場合見面那擔任部長7年多我想這是中華民國行線以來任期最長的教育部長"},{"start":5661.016,"end":5664.998,"text":"潘文忠部長的障礙高掛即將卸任,各界對部長的表現也非常肯定。回顧7年多,有沒有什麼感言?"},{"start":5678.06,"end":5703.941,"text":"委員我自己一向就是從事教育工作從當小學老師到行政工作我一直覺得事情可能做不完但是看到的問題真的要逐一的去面對這幾年也確實我跟我們部裡頭的同仁大家就很多多年來可以解決該解決了但需要做處理的包含像去年國教法特教法"},{"start":5704.862,"end":5724.384,"text":"關於全面學校相關的運作等等的 光執法就60幾步了像這些我都很謝謝同仁也看到現象能夠逐一的去做處理所以這部分我想教育一棒接一棒後續我相信新的團隊也會跟同仁這邊繼續在努力"},{"start":5725.745,"end":5752.311,"text":"好我想原本要再問你有什麼未經之夜但我想很多事情都還有待我們再努力當然沒辦法一次把所有的一處集成所有的事情都完成但我想謝部長在本席初就任立委之際第一場的委員會質詢向部長爭取葉光天使延伸到寒暑假國中生的一個試班計畫獲得部長的認同當場允諾推動如同國教署署長所說試班計畫8月就要上路"},{"start":5752.551,"end":5764.338,"text":"到時候我想有機會邀請部長一起到台中到學校一起瞭解事辦計畫的一個情況順便給夜光天使的學生打氣鼓勵不知道未來有機會可以邀請你嗎"},{"start":5765.455,"end":5769.736,"text":"謝謝委員為這些需求家庭的孩子所爭取這個事辦當然國中的這部分在過往我覺得因為孩子比較大但委員這個提議當時我覺得因為夜光天使的情況我非常的了解確實幫到很多家庭比較沒辦法那麼可以支撐孩子的一個措施"},{"start":5788.68,"end":5792.024,"text":"時間因為未定只是我希望這個方案國教署跟委員這邊我們能夠就原來預定8月新的學年的示範能夠順利的展開委員在地方也能夠來持續的關注這是一個好的方案了照顧到很多學生"},{"start":5805.457,"end":5824.346,"text":"謝謝 我常常一直在講這個計畫也是希望我們在跟某些特定的團體甚至是黑道組織在搶孩子我們希望能夠更認真用心的有這個機會場域去關心每個孩子讓孩子不要學壞讓孩子能夠在這個學業的過程當中或者是非學業的過程當中能夠感受到我們有其他的資源在挹注他們"},{"start":5826.047,"end":5849.022,"text":"但是講到這個我就還是要再提到其實剛剛的立法委員也都有提到包括紅夢凱委員萬美玲委員他們都有在講就是桃園這一個霸凌案件那當然眾說紛紜有人說這個孩子霸凌者的這個背景是可能有黑道組織的背景家境這樣的環境我們不確定"},{"start":5850.103,"end":5867.734,"text":"但我們非常關心我想還是再一次拿出這樣的數據108年到112年我們的暴力事件跟偏差行為的通報從不管是國小國中高中我們可以看到可以說是至少都2.3倍到4倍以上的一個成長"},{"start":5869.055,"end":5888.684,"text":"這不敢說是一定是教育有問題因為整個不管是我們的社會風氣以及我們的電影文化還有一些藝術去影響到他們會有這樣子的一個偏差行為都有可能可是我們看到在剪頭髮這個部分在這一次的案件令許多的家長觸目驚心一直紛紛的傳這些影片給我們"},{"start":5890.325,"end":5910.25,"text":"讓我們沒辦法在這一次委員會就主題上我們很想討論但是在這一次的事件的突發性讓我們必須慎重我們還是希望在校園的霸凌事件我們該如何防範剛剛有人講到所謂的校安問題我們可能要用到的是可能是這些教官可是現在我們也在努力心理輔導法"},{"start":5911.05,"end":5931.416,"text":"我們希望在這個部分各個部分都應該要去著重如何去防範這部分後續的一些心理輔導不管是霸凌者跟被霸凌者我們要去關心那學校有沒有去做相關的人等的一個調查以及他的背景調查這部分有掌握嗎是 謝謝委員委員就一點點時間我來報告一下"},{"start":5933.337,"end":5958.172,"text":"通報數字這個在我自己這麼這些年來不管在性平事件等等的我強烈的要求一定要那不是鼓勵那叫克責克責的意思是發現了就要通報不管先判斷它是真與否這個是我認為過去多年大家常常會說這裡頭有好多好多的黑數所以我剛才提到說成長幾倍這個本來政策就是克責"},{"start":5959.513,"end":5981.507,"text":"對 當然我沒有批評啊我相信就是把黑素找出來也是一件好事啊第二個我也跟委員報告這一次長達一年左右的時間去對於校園霸凌防制準則做修改這當中也確實做到非常多第一個就是說師對生的部分我們認為不要一直在這個裡頭他放在教師解聘不續聘的辦法當中來處理那生對生這一次在剛才委員說的嘛"},{"start":5985.689,"end":5985.809,"text":"委員會主席"},{"start":6004.562,"end":6012.068,"text":"一定要有一個非常清楚的調查小組去做事項的釐清跟做後續的組織那第三點我跟委員補充那我也知道學校因為在地方也知道學校其實要面對這些調查等等在人力資源各方面其實常常是比較困窘的所以在今年我也特別針對霸凌事件針對性平等等的事件讓學校不要說資源不足就比較"},{"start":6030.162,"end":6057.005,"text":"臺灣優華語計畫"},{"start":6057.265,"end":6080.05,"text":"是落單的我希望他是有更多的支持不管是網路事件的一個延燒到其實我的選區其實也蠻多有這樣子言語被霸凌進而選擇休學我們都很擔心這樣子孩子他落單了在這個休學的過程當中他可能會覺得沒有就放棄學業了甚至他不願意去學習一個人才的培育真的不易"},{"start":6080.53,"end":6109.842,"text":"那當然我們再回到剛剛所說的就像柯志文委員在說的我看到這些數據其實我們也擔憂國際生還有國內生的一個關注我們當然知道要延攬人才的一個重要性我們支持但是我們希望在合理的一個前提下以及剛剛所提出的這些數據上我們一定要去好好瞭解到底誰是人才誰是單純來打工用著打工的名義來行使勞工這樣子的一個政策"},{"start":6110.642,"end":6135.216,"text":"並不是來真正讓我們來做一個教育培育人才的一個政策我想這個部分是可以有待我們做檢討的那再來我想就簡單的就叫世界上這麼多的國家臺灣有哪些優勢來推動國際招生其實我們大概也都知道我們是劣勢啦畢竟在這個部分上我們提供這麼多的一些資金就是希望能夠延攬人才的意願但是國際的趨勢還有國家"},{"start":6137.537,"end":6152.303,"text":"各個國家有各個國家他們可能有自己先天的產業優勢都有可能影響到國際生他的一個選擇但我想問一下最近我們有沒有什麼碰壁的地方現在跟部長在討論的是香港的招生5月9號的新聞美國的媒體報導"},{"start":6156.286,"end":6168.386,"text":"說這個臺灣大專院校被中聯辦打壓取消在香港的招生活動5月11的新聞港府憂慮賴政府兩岸論述暫停我大學赴港招生宣傳有這一類情勢嗎"},{"start":6169.949,"end":6170.089,"text":"委員會主席"},{"start":6191.149,"end":6203.779,"text":"最近這兩年我有觀察港澳的招生確實我們有面對一些可能來自於對岸政治上的一些措施因為原本我們的人數像香港這個人數其實是一直在成長但尤其從去年111我就發現有降那這個現象我覺得跟香港這些年已經在中國這邊的政治相關的我覺得受到影響"},{"start":6219.571,"end":6245.115,"text":"我想就教育家的觀點當然我們希望教育不要扯上政治但是兩岸是否和平共存才是學生以及家長選擇的重點我想這個部分當然有多方的考量但是我們看到實際的數據110年到111年我們的香港的學生大概9000多位112年7800多位所以在這個部分我想部長在即將卸任前就教育工作的一個領航者"},{"start":6245.435,"end":6271.938,"text":"建議未來內閣應該如何解決有沒有什麼因應知道委員這個因為港澳跟中國的關係委員這個很了解所以他們直接被影響的是很直接那對於兩岸青年學生的這個交流我想教育部本來就一直都持開放的尤其疫情過後像他們學生有所限制中國這邊直接就限制但是研修生在112學年度又開始出現"},{"start":6273.539,"end":6274.379,"text":"大陸學生到臺灣來求學的滿意度很高"},{"start":6291.735,"end":6319.057,"text":"我想人才大家都在搶人才我們一起來為臺灣努力那我想催伐天然資源的臺灣最重要的資產我們就是要培育人才但是我們也希望就像剛剛科委員所提供的這些數據其實我們聽到以後我們也很擔憂國際生國內生我們也希望不要造成整個資源的偏差我們當然支持臺灣要搶人才但是我們也希望重視國內生的一些發展以及很多人都學貸啦"},{"start":6319.717,"end":6320.878,"text":"對國內學生減輕負擔這絕對是我們的政策"},{"start":6353.002,"end":6355.303,"text":"好 謝謝兩位接下來我們請葉元之委員我請部長 謝謝來 部長 謝謝"},{"start":6371.609,"end":6391.498,"text":"今天我們是在討論就是說我們的大學怎麼去國際招生主要是因應少子化甚至於就是說可以招攬一些外籍生然後未來可以輔導他在臺灣就業補充我們勞動市場應該主題是這個沒錯那我想問一下我們教育部在推動這相關計畫的時候KPI是什麼是以人數當作KPI嗎"},{"start":6393.399,"end":6397.82,"text":"跟委員報告人數只是其中之一其實我們為什麼到後續在大學的發展體制裡面高教生跟計畫的二期會把國際化作為一個很重要學校去做的是因為有越來越多的國際學生到臺灣來那些的服務措施包含怎麼樣去做才會好的品質"},{"start":6417.167,"end":6418.309,"text":"人數越多越好還是人數有總和限制?"},{"start":6425.117,"end":6449.306,"text":"委員 這個年數其實每一個計畫裡面都有一個規範所以是沒有說越多越好所以像新南向產息專班照為最了解的你會控制在一定的名額以內我們是要嚴格審查計畫對 嚴格審查但是是多多益善所以不是在求量如果說有越多很優質的學生願意來我們就盡量開放他是真的來臺灣求學而不是螢幕粉珠來打工等等的"},{"start":6450.446,"end":6478.598,"text":"如果他是來求學之後去做勞基法所允許的公讀這當然不是問題了解,謝謝部長因為我非常很高興聽到你講說會嚴格把關不是以人數濫於充數但我知道說我們教育部補充就是說補助給一些很多新南向的學生非常多的錢但你們實際上有沒有去追蹤他們來之後到底對於臺灣教育甚至於對我們就業市場有多大幫助我不知道到底有沒有做這樣審核"},{"start":6479.478,"end":6505.616,"text":"然後再來齁實際上我發現就是我們以我們數據來看好像我們多版新南向國家非常多啦我知道新南向是蔡政府的政績嘛就主要都一直在講新南向但新南向也有很多國家那實際上好像特別重視越南印尼跟馬來西亞光是這三個國家的學生呢就佔了將近六成不知道為什麼其他國家不能不能積極去去招生呢"},{"start":6506.227,"end":6518.53,"text":"為了我們會積極那為什麼那個鼓勵失衡那麼多不是不是這是因為他們第一個他們也要有意願來啦那為什麼只有他們有意願招生本來意願本來就是看你怎麼招嘛"},{"start":6519.925,"end":6535.315,"text":"委員我們有一個十個招生基地目前這三個我點出問題啦我們希望說既然你希望透過這個方式國際化國際化當然國家多多益善不要太只重視幾個國家然後再來就是既然我們"},{"start":6536.636,"end":6557.237,"text":"想要推動這種大學的跟國外的交流當然是想要補充國際市場我不知道說陸森為什麼老師被排斥是為什麼沒有啊那是中國排斥不是我們沒有沒有沒有去年侯友宜侯友宜新北市長在選總統的時候也有提出說希望有陸森來台就學嘛然後可以留下來工作啊就被民進黨罵爆啦說這些陸森會大量搶臺灣的年輕人的工作"},{"start":6560.64,"end":6578.042,"text":"但我覺得很奇怪我們教育部不是對於陸生留下來工作有相關的管制嗎那為什麼這些民進黨立委會提出這樣的質疑呢然後再來就是我們找那麼多越南印尼馬來西亞人來這邊讀書就業就不怕他們搶我們年輕人的工作嗎差別在哪"},{"start":6579.011,"end":6580.272,"text":"所以你也很怕說開放陸森來會搶我們年輕人的工作?"},{"start":6600.981,"end":6626.988,"text":"韓議員長韓議員長韓議員長"},{"start":6627.328,"end":6653.227,"text":"聯誼活動的時候有提到嘛就是說希望英國一些名校可以來臺灣設分部那他主要是認為所假設英國的名校在臺灣設分部我們周邊的國家其他國家學生也可以來就學可以增加一些國際學生交流的機會部長你知道這事嗎?那個跟委員報告如果依照私校法的部分是合作開班嗎?不是他是希望能夠設臺灣分校啦你知道這事嗎?"},{"start":6654.841,"end":6670.73,"text":"你不知道?沒關係啦沒關係啦因為這個部長日理萬機啦也不見得知道院長講過什麼但是有一個人講過你不知道就有點誇張那個賴清德在2017年的時候他也說希望外國名校可以來台設分校而且他還講喔他說來台設分校"},{"start":6671.31,"end":6671.55,"text":"李卓人議員"},{"start":6689.275,"end":6706.158,"text":"北大復旦來他都沒有設限那我現在不是說要針對北大復旦我現在只是想問韓院長講了你說你不知道但是賴清德前行政院長2017年講過然後去年的政見他也主張這件事情那教育部到底有沒有接受這個訊息有沒有著手去推動這個方案"},{"start":6707.608,"end":6718.466,"text":"跟委員報告 現在如果依照私校 他們來以私校法的規範他必須遵循 這個可能就需要再做一些突破了不是啊 那在京的講話你都沒有在聽 這他講的捏"},{"start":6722.312,"end":6723.213,"text":"這個部分要修施效法 謝謝"},{"start":6746.967,"end":6770.544,"text":"不是你告訴我要怎麼困難我是說你有沒有要做這個事情啊這是賴清德準總統獎你有沒有要做沒有哇塞這個司長很大尾捏居然打臉那個賴清德準總統我覺得不是我故意的找你麻煩我是用那個賴清德講話一個字一個字唸出來的所以你們不曉得這個事情還是賴清德開巴拉票"},{"start":6773.479,"end":6801.422,"text":"沒有,委員這個部分在目前來講,我想後續,如果是私校法可以在大會討論嗎?不是我們在大會討論,是你們準總統說要推的東西什麼我們大會討論你們開的證件可以隨便講講,面對學生的時候講一套然後現在我們在立法院問的時候就說立法委員你們要推你們自己大會討論,這太奇怪了吧然後高校師長說要修私校法,變立法委員的事那賴清德以後什麼事都不用開支票了嘛"},{"start":6802.342,"end":6822.711,"text":"進選連任的時候也不用講這些有的沒的反正也沒有要落實最後我來問一個問題最近大家非常關心行政機關到底可不可以隨便把一些公文或一些文件列密等因為我想請教一下既然高校師長朱師長在現場請教一下我們蔡英文總統的論文深等論文是不是現在是密等"},{"start":6823.319,"end":6823.499,"text":"請市長回答好不好"},{"start":6844.782,"end":6861.509,"text":"根據什麼法律?你不能自己說要列就列嗎?臺灣是依法行政還是依你朱司長的命令?什麼辦法?什麼法律?請問一下行政機關處理文書守則哪一條說深等論文要列密等?"},{"start":6868.871,"end":6888.772,"text":"請問一下升等論文為什麼是各自我問過非常多的大學教授他說升等論文哪有是密等這種事大家都是根據已經公開的論文或公開的文章拿去升等這些都公開的為什麼只有我們蔡英文總統升等要列為密等密等年限多久"},{"start":6890.437,"end":6897.594,"text":"論文本身並沒有好啊 那你就把他的論文公開啊論文已經公開了不是 深等的內容"},{"start":6898.777,"end":6922.058,"text":"深等論文的內容是公開的是申請的那申請表跟我們教師資格審查的那個過程那個是秘密等所以他的深等論文有公開?公開在哪裡?目前國圖國圖那個是學位論文嘛國圖中政大跟中原大學的圖書館都可以知道你講的是學位論文還是深等論文?"},{"start":6923.188,"end":6946.48,"text":"深等的論文深等的論文在國圖跟政大政大我們有去查過圖書我們會後可以好那學位論文你說你有看過在英國的倫敦學位政經學院有看過我本人我本人沒有到英國看過你沒有看過那為什麼你當時可以出來講說那個論文是真的那請問一下那個論文是當初蔡英文總統她在英國畢業的時候交給圖書館的還是後來才補交的"},{"start":6950.806,"end":6958.932,"text":"我問的問題你就直接回答我那個是他畢業之後拿去的還是後來大家在質疑他沒論文的時候拿去的是哪一個時間點"},{"start":6961.139,"end":6978.007,"text":"這個部分有沒有透過駐英代表跟你回答我問題什麼透過駐英代表問你是時間點是哪一個嘛不要在國會殿堂在那邊耍嘴皮子哪一個時間點委員這個部分在國會一點都沒有例外我問師長包含所有的教授的論文一致的規範部長不好意思部長我現在的問題是說"},{"start":6980.888,"end":6986.813,"text":"你們的司長公開講過蔡英文總統的學位論文在英國讀書館上班在問你是說是他畢業交過去還是後來遺失被補教的嗎?你回答我這個問題嗎?不是我剛剛對你很客氣啦我現在就是論事了你怎麼那麼急著出來問話呢?"},{"start":7001.364,"end":7006.388,"text":"當你出來插話的時候我就知道你心虛了啦委員你問得過頭了我當然要說明我問哪裡過頭不是他不是英國圖書館的館員嗎市長之前講說他看過嘛我現在問說看過的那一份是之前說醫師後來補教的還是畢業之後就教的嘛因為現在大家質疑的是說所有的畢業生通常畢業都要繳論文給圖書館那為什麼蔡總統沒有嘛那今天市長出來講說有啊"},{"start":7026.823,"end":7027.304,"text":"這個論文是公開的 委員"},{"start":7045.682,"end":7066.088,"text":"誰問你是不是公開的我當然知道他有公開嘛他後來2019年有個白手套記者會有公開我現在問的是說你們看過那一本是他畢業教的還是後來白手套公開之後再補過去的嘛這問題很難回答嗎不會難回答為什麼市長可以在不了解狀況的情況之下直接出來認證說那個論文是真的"},{"start":7067.37,"end":7092.482,"text":"那個是租賓的代表裡面已經確認了他只是轉達這個概念所以你們教育部可以隨便租賓代表講了一個東西之後然後就沒有查證就隨便出來背書教育單位是這樣搞的那些都是經過公家單位的確認你確認你也知道細節我現在問你說那本的年限到底是畢業之後繳的還是後來大家發現都找不到之後補的"},{"start":7094.855,"end":7095.395,"text":"這問題很難回答嗎"},{"start":7125.175,"end":7125.595,"text":"接下來我們請葛如君委員"},{"start":7165.214,"end":7174.346,"text":"謝謝主席我講慢一點讓這個部長喘口氣感謝主席有請教育部潘文忠部長"},{"start":7174.997,"end":7197.25,"text":"我們請潘部長各位好謝謝部長您好我想還是要非常肯定您八年來對於教育政策的推行所做的各種努力我想今天機會還是很難得也謝謝您還是來到這邊跟我們進行互動那我們今天的這個題目是大學國際招生跟優華語的計畫"},{"start":7200.372,"end":7206.776,"text":"優華語計畫其實從110年以後就開始推動但是本席辦公室請教育部提供優華語分年的執行成效"},{"start":7208.021,"end":7229.437,"text":"我們卻沒有辦法拿到我們只能拿到112年度的成果那我們從今天的書面報告當中也可以看到112年度的成果當中只提到了設置4所海外教學中心建立校際合作選送人員海外任教補助外國學生來臺學習華語等等"},{"start":7231.67,"end":7257.953,"text":"在這邊我必須要說完全沒有提到任何數位教學或是數位學習系統及平台的建制我們是真的活在2024年嗎我們現在是113年民國113年我們與各大學的這個華語推廣活動竟然還限於實體的交流我們好像回到這個明朝的時代鄭和下西洋不上船就沒有辦法跟人家交流"},{"start":7258.934,"end":7282.194,"text":"我們居然捨棄了全球42億的人口隨時可以上網學華語行動的上網用戶去年花了1.4億去設置這些實體的這些互動真的是優華語是不是要變成優華語這個優心的優想請教一下部長我們優華語計畫有沒有運用數位工具來推廣華語教學如果有可不可以稍微說明一下情況跟成效"},{"start":7283.755,"end":7310.337,"text":"那個優華語計畫是繼過去華語教育推動當中再次提啦那事實上它也有一定的基礎那麼在這個階段比較多的著力的比較深的是優華語計畫對不起部長我必須打斷你是比較多還是全部到底有沒有數位目前是提供數位課程有數位課程嗎有在報告裡面嗎我們好像都沒有看到喔那報告是不是有數位課程嗎"},{"start":7311.58,"end":7326.685,"text":"我想我們非常重視虛實的整合尤其在疫情之後我們現在這個世界衛生組織還說未來可能還有新的傳染病當然我們都不希望有它是代號叫X疾病"},{"start":7327.725,"end":7343.963,"text":"所以我們的各個境外學生的人數會隨著疫情的浮動但是我們現在已經進入數位的時代真的很難想像我們的全球推廣計畫沒有更多啦但你說有我就相信你說有雖然我們裡面沒看到 真的沒看到"},{"start":7345.044,"end":7362.955,"text":"說有就有啊,但是我們沒有更多人來使用,我們覺得這是需要檢討的希望部長回去以後跟同仁一起用這最後非常非常寶貴的時間重新檢視優華語的計畫內容做一些合適的資源配置那接下來我們不只華語,我們還要來請教您關於雙語教育的問題"},{"start":7365.511,"end":7381.75,"text":"107年12月當時準總統賴清德先生是任行政院長發表了《2030年為目標打造臺灣成為雙語國家的願景》要求全面啟動這樣的計畫想請教一下部長賴準總統所謂的雙語國家政策指的是哪雙語?"},{"start":7383.496,"end":7398.684,"text":"跟委員報告這個計畫的名稱後來應該說正確的再做一些調整不是用雙語國家是國家雙語政策所以這個新聞應該要下架要改是不是我不知道這個可能是新聞就是說目前是國家雙語政策因為這個確實有一個比較討論後所訂出來的沒有關係"},{"start":7406.889,"end":7411.434,"text":"我想我們的這個當時行政院長接下來要變總統希望我們所有的政策喊出來都是有憑有據不要改來改去我們來看這個實際上有很多這種打臉的現象我們就不多說啦其實所謂雙語指的是華語或英語這一種說法是完全與法無拒的"},{"start":7426.189,"end":7444.667,"text":"事實上我們完全沒有在法律中明定所謂的官方語言依據國家語言發展法我們的語言指的是臺灣固有族群使用的自然語言及臺灣手語而且要做很多的多語言之間的平衡做一個多元的平衡今天我們做這樣的一個說法"},{"start":7447.249,"end":7462.5,"text":"說要雙語啊、要英語啊、難保會不會未來又有新的院長一聲令下我們的雙語或多語的政策,又要換一個名字,又要360度的大轉彎。我們來看一下,自從我們先不管,就說好,那既然已經執行了,107年宣布執行,"},{"start":7465.842,"end":7473.789,"text":"到現在6年7年6、7年我們為了達成雙語國家目標已經投入多少錢我覺得這個真的是不只是指數成長這是十倍百倍的增長從幾千萬到幾十億我們來看一下我們已經投入了100億我們來看看現場的反應如何根據《親子天下》的雜誌全台有高達4成的公立國中小尚未實施雙語課程22個縣市當中有8成的縣市認為本國資質不足"},{"start":7496.046,"end":7521.295,"text":"31%的縣市認為中央經費補助不足22%的人說第一線教師反對這個政策當時賴清德院長的一句話讓教育部6年狠砸超過百億來推行雙語政策但是我們來看再看這個我們的全球英語能力指標只是略高於全球平均但是在111個國家及地區當中屬於中間偏後我們再看"},{"start":7522.609,"end":7536.937,"text":"這是你們的報告2030雙語政策計畫教育部推出的可量化的經濟效應我們那時候是擦亮眼睛說我是不是看錯了創造工作機會0帶動公民企業投資0"},{"start":7539.526,"end":7563.791,"text":"這還不是全部不只英語成績不見起色根據去年公布的應該說去年公布2021的臺灣參加第4屆的這個國際閱讀數量調查首度出現小四學生中文閱讀能力下滑的現象這個真的是我們要看到的嗎我們再來看金魚已經現在變成我們這種交作業的這個常見的狀況了再來還有"},{"start":7568.573,"end":7582.953,"text":"這個過去9年的國中會考每年都有近3000到7000名考生放棄寫國語的作文考0分的人數遠遠超過滿級分的人數我這樣講完還有啦但我們就不多說我們花了6年100多億"},{"start":7583.974,"end":7606.334,"text":"結果師資不足經費不足第一線教師反對學生不僅英文能力不好中文能力也下降最糟糕的經濟效益是零前兩天賴準總統甚至直指雙語政策負評如潮是執行出問題完全甩鍋教育部現在在這邊給您一個機會您認為雙語政策的失敗教育部要負最大的責任嗎這個說法是不是有點不太公平您可以回應一下"},{"start":7606.954,"end":7622.649,"text":"委員現在都還在持續進行的過程那剛才我要跟委員報告的是我要講到一個很關鍵的剛才委員引雜誌的報導裡面其實我對外也都說這樣說明教育部是穩健的在往前不是讓縣市動輒包含我們說六都"},{"start":7626.032,"end":7626.913,"text":"我幫你總結啦就是說才沒成功之前都說時間還不夠長"},{"start":7650.948,"end":7667.39,"text":"然後有人說有問題就是說指標不對啦如果是媒體報導就是說媒體的報導沒關係我問你下一題部長您要卸任排除政治壓力單純從您的良心從一個教育工作者的心態角度來看你認為政府的雙贏政策還要繼續推行嗎"},{"start":7668.351,"end":7670.773,"text":"委員要穩健推行不是照鏡啦我講的是這個一百億還不夠照還不還是穩健是吧從三千萬四千萬直接跳十億以上再來三四十億喔不是委員我一向務實推動教育工作你經費照鏡阿成果怎麼沒有照鏡呢"},{"start":7686.368,"end":7691.63,"text":"那經費也是後面因為有前瞻計畫能夠讓一些師資我講的是外籍的師資能夠補充這個部分並不是8年10年通通以這個經費好 謝謝謝謝部長我為什麼現在要跟您做這樣的互動是說這個交換的這個時期很重要如果您真的覺得哪裡做得不夠好哪裡需要檢討或雙語政策真的應該要調整"},{"start":7715.06,"end":7733.97,"text":"真的希望您可以來了解一下我們來看一下接下來我們給您看一個影片七年前的政策現在真的不一定要照樣推行請您重新考慮這今年3月18號我們在談校園霸凌的議題的時候部長您的回應我們來看第一段影片部長用流利的英語來回應"},{"start":7735.111,"end":7743.573,"text":"這完全是AI直接將您講的話用您的聲音翻成英文而且還對上了嘴形這個現在還需要幾秒鐘的時間運算接下來可以完全的即時運作大林如果從國際的來講他有他的定義但孩子感受到的"},{"start":7762.938,"end":7775.164,"text":"我想大家可能中文聽很多我們來看一次英文感覺一下我想連部長自己可能都會很難相信這個背景的音樂都還可以合成一句我們來看一下這還不是全部現在META剛發表的SIMLESS COMMUNICATION完全可以RULE TIME"},{"start":7785.729,"end":7786.289,"text":"我誠心的建議齁"},{"start":7802.981,"end":7818.437,"text":"未來在教導學生多種語言的時候不要再侷限於英語甚至應該要討論包含學習如何跟AI對話用AI來說出100國以上的語言同時我們也要呼籲繁中語料要全面開放為什麼"},{"start":7819.238,"end":7827.7,"text":"AI可以幫助我們的學生去講出一百國的語言我可以讓全球46億人口透過AI來學華語但是我們的華語的資料完全不足母湯聽不懂然後我們講什麼視頻、音頻這些用語可能也都不是台灣認定的華語希望未來可以有更多的資料全面開放給國會會、台德來使用我們才能夠讓AI有完整的繁體的中文化"},{"start":7845.703,"end":7860.728,"text":"用數位的工具讓華語在全球發揚光大最後謝謝主席給我時間AI能夠帶來幫助但是也有可能侵害學生的權益請教一下部長目前教育部對於高中生使用AI工具製作學習歷程檔案或者備審資料的態度和立場是什麼"},{"start":7865.709,"end":7883.639,"text":"現在大家可能有很多的升學升請的過程在進行老師在看資料學生有沒有責任在底下標註我有使用AI還是可以不用我們的老師是不是就要全盤盡信呢是完全禁止使用還是一定要進行揭露"},{"start":7884.139,"end":7895.912,"text":"有沒有什麼前提有沒有什麼條件您是不是現在趕快來提出說明一下是有條件的接受還是絕對不接受學生使用AI工具製作學習歷程檔案或備成資料我等一下說明一下"},{"start":7899.176,"end":7904.198,"text":"委員剛才講到以AI或數位科技學足語言的學習我非常贊同在上個禮拜我組織我們一個本國語言推動會那個裡頭各項足語課於中文的轉換因為現在也就是在請剛才委員所提到的幾個話部會"},{"start":7918.405,"end":7919.225,"text":"要不要揭露?很重要但可以不要揭露嗎?"},{"start":7943.294,"end":7967.16,"text":"要揭露是一件重要的事目前在大學我相信我們幾個大學柯昭偉在大學當時大家知道那個本來就是一個輔助的工具但是這個揭露本身來講對於老師要去評價要去做什麼我認為是有預計我看各大學目前朝這個方式這個問題很重要不然變成老師只是在評哪一個學生比較有錢可以用比較厲害的AI來做內容"},{"start":7967.64,"end":7967.66,"text":"謝謝 謝謝兩位"},{"start":7997.526,"end":7998.507,"text":"謝謝主席有請潘部長是部長"},{"start":8018.903,"end":8039.99,"text":"委員好部長這應該是520之前我們的最後一次見面是是謝謝委員好那不管怎麼樣其實還是要說一下關於那個TVBS民調其實蔡總統的執政滿意度還是高達42%那我想這個論文應該也是只有很少數人還想要再知道再追問的這個部分"},{"start":8041.61,"end":8068.789,"text":"好那今天其實我們針對所謂的這個優華語計畫的一個部分我想這個臺灣優華語的一個計畫主要還是以歐美紐澳這樣子的一個計畫為主那當初其實我們知道在中國他們在各個不同的國家設立很多的所謂的孔子學院但是也有很多的西方國家或者很多的國家也意識到這個孔子學院可能會有所謂的滲透的一些問題"},{"start":8069.649,"end":8070.45,"text":"中文字幕提供"},{"start":8099.329,"end":8099.669,"text":"新南向政策"},{"start":8129.749,"end":8143.173,"text":"委員報告在今天跟委員提出來的這些內容裡面其實我們國際招生的相關措施 包含一般性大學的招收國際生那不是招生對對 站上優華語計畫我說這幾個是相輔相成"},{"start":8147.734,"end":8173.211,"text":"因為當時華語教育在推動的過程後來我們做了一些改變希望能夠更深化所以才採取校對校就是U2U的這種模式所以這個確實在美國這方面因為跟大學原來的互動基礎比較多但是在華語教育的推動尤其新南向國家如果我有留意到我們在一些新南向國家這些相關的方案裡面採取兩個非常重要的"},{"start":8176.033,"end":8176.113,"text":"這是來到臺灣嗎?"},{"start":8203.553,"end":8218.345,"text":"但我講的是我們要去所謂的優華語的外到就是我們要派我們這邊的華語的老師是到所謂的亞洲的部分這邊是掛零嗎我們再補充不好意思可能報告沒有寫得那麼完整像現在新型專班我們會到這些當地國設相關的基地"},{"start":8225.05,"end":8234.673,"text":"名稱或許有不同像這個攬財的基地裡面有一項很重要的任務就是推廣華語教育那如果說這些學生有意要過來他也會在這個基地裡面先行做這些先修的華文所以未來在新南向國家應該會有十個基地會再設十個基地現在目前已經設了三個"},{"start":8251.297,"end":8251.697,"text":"合作的學校當然有這麼多"},{"start":8268.303,"end":8281.567,"text":"但是我發現有一個比較有趣的問題是包含在澳洲跟紐西蘭我們是有合作的學校但是卻沒有老師啊這個部分是因為我們每年還是編了大概1.41億的"},{"start":8284.088,"end":8285.75,"text":"國內21所對應合作的68所他們會去從校際彼此之間的需求去訂定"},{"start":8306.99,"end":8326.297,"text":"有些他就希望我們有華語教師到他當地的學校裡面來協助做華語教育目前委員所提到的澳大利跟紐西蘭這部分目前對方的學校是沒有跟我們合作的學校提出如果他們在發展過程有需要我們都會支援他合作不是只有單一這個項目"},{"start":8330.979,"end":8332.68,"text":"華語教育是一個很好的橋樑是我們華語的老師師資不足因為這部分只要對方的學校有需求"},{"start":8351.387,"end":8379.184,"text":"所以他們現在是沒有這方面的需求對這兩所學校就同仁跟我提到是說在合作裡面他們並沒有提出華語師資啦如果他們在推廣推動的過程有需要就會跟我們再提出來了解好那我想這個優華語的部分當然我們也看到就是這些報告可能還必須要再有一些更進進的一些這個還要持續滾動對對對就像剛剛所說的如果新南向的一些國家可能還會有10個不同的據點那如果有最新的報告再提供給我們這樣子好"},{"start":8381.285,"end":8388.313,"text":"接下來我想要請教一下部長的部分就是說現在我們其實有很多的私校開始慢慢的退場了這還是2023年的新聞台灣確定有"},{"start":8398.864,"end":8416.816,"text":"大學的部分是確定要停招13所的私校可能在今年可能就要熄燈了我想其實在這個部分在私校退場不是只有私立大學的部分另外還包含所謂的像是高中職的部分"},{"start":8417.716,"end":8436.985,"text":"職校即職學校也是一樣的一個道理當然一方面是因為少子化那二方面其實也是因為相對應的所謂的學校的經費的部分他沒有辦法用更好的一個經費去請到更好的師資那也有可能變成這樣雖然我們的基本的這個條幅學察費的部分條幅有0.61%"},{"start":8440.286,"end":8467.695,"text":"但就某一個私校的這個大學的校長說這0.61%好像吃了兩個漢堡都沒了所以其實這個部分因為有可能會讓很多的教育資源開始變成所謂的弱化我們講教育資源會變成所謂的M型化私校辦的好的私校或者是有口碑的一些私校還是一堆家長想要把孩子送進去私校但是我們相對來講又有一堆的私校其實就因為招不到學生也面臨要退場"},{"start":8468.715,"end":8469.636,"text":"蘇國庚文報告這幾年對私校確實讓學生的這部分為了減輕他們的學貸負擔"},{"start":8490.177,"end":8496.721,"text":"有推出拉近學費差距的補助這個是對學生包含就學貸款的延長等等的措施對學校的部分像最近這幾年因為政府也有不斷的調薪所以我也跟委員報告對私校我們也針對這部分有補助他7成因為這個都是學校實質人事費的一些負擔"},{"start":8514.531,"end":8514.631,"text":"教育部部長"},{"start":8531.36,"end":8531.48,"text":"委員會主席"},{"start":8551.829,"end":8553.57,"text":"施教退場接著下來要接手的還有就是學生安置的一些問題都是非常大的問題可能也要再跟地方政府的教育局"},{"start":8572.619,"end":8572.719,"text":"主席"},{"start":8588.757,"end":8589.157,"text":"4月10日我針對了所謂的凱凱案"},{"start":8613.103,"end":8635.12,"text":"而福聯盟針對教育部是主管機關我做了一個臨時的提案那當時其實教育部也特別提到將在一個月之內就是向我們教育文化委員會來提出一個報告但是到目前為止今天已經是5月超過10號了但我今天都還沒有收到這個部分我們是不是也請教育部這個部分"},{"start":8636.121,"end":8637.742,"text":"委員當時提案的時候在會場我也跟委員報告了謝謝委員就是一個月這個過程一定會去啟動處理有關未來相關業務歸屬的今天下午我們就會開會"},{"start":8652.967,"end":8654.848,"text":"主管機關的教育部是針對財團法人法公告所謂的捐款人他們也依據所謂的財團法人法但是我們看到在110年的時候其實這是111年度跟110年度"},{"start":8674.735,"end":8674.775,"text":"全體委員會"},{"start":8694.202,"end":8715.641,"text":"只有一筆是公開捐募是2700多萬另外其他的運用全部都是民眾的捐款那時候其實我提問教育部好多次了包含他們在109年的時候買了所謂的內湖的這塊地這個不動產的部分那個時候其實教育部也多次回答我"},{"start":8716.061,"end":8719.182,"text":"那這個部分我不知道教育部要在這邊要做有沒有一個解釋啊"},{"start":8742.911,"end":8749.535,"text":"跟委員報告因為之前我們跟委員部去做專案的查核當時也邀請幾位會計師一起去進行這個因為這個收支到底合不合相關的會計規範那個相關的法規那我想這個有詳細的查核報告是不是我再請司理頭把那個查核的情形讓委員了解好不好"},{"start":8767.827,"end":8768.207,"text":"接下來我們請林一錦委員"},{"start":8797.325,"end":8797.605,"text":"臺灣的文攻武嚇"},{"start":8822.781,"end":8836.979,"text":"國際上戰狼的形象受到很多質疑所以他們的孔子學院名義上是在推廣語言跟文化可是他卻接連爆出說很多限制學術自由的這種"},{"start":8842.387,"end":8850.219,"text":"臺灣的華語教學,我覺得勢必要趁這個時候用我們最美麗的繁體字用我們的自由民主的文化來搶下華語的這個優勢那我想成為"},{"start":8855.166,"end":8883.707,"text":"外國人學習華語的首選這個時候正是時候所以我們要用最堅強的軟實力替台灣外交增益口氣所以這個時候華語的教學人員就變得相對的重要他成為我們搶到華語教學這個版圖很重要的角色那我們來談到華語教學人員的待遇其實非常的不一致我們先看國內的華語中心很多都是兼任的那三個月一聘"},{"start":8884.147,"end":8884.167,"text":"〔記者訪問〕"},{"start":8908.001,"end":8936.924,"text":"收入真的很不穩定好 那我們再看外派到海外的這個華語教學人員的待遇好了因為教育部因為每個月有補助一千二到一千九的美元的生活補助再加上當地學校給的薪資所以差不多能符合他們的在當地的這個需求開銷好一點的還可以存到一點錢齁那可是不過補助的期間只有一年為限那一年為原則啦齁那當然有貨到"},{"start":8937.665,"end":8957.307,"text":"如果接到國外學校的續聘者當然可以續約我們也可以延長補助可是那也要獲得學校的續聘那如果說好的就是教學人員如果跟學校談條心的話那學校可能就會再請教育部再多聘這個華語教學人員來就好"},{"start":8958.248,"end":8958.408,"text":"上述我剛提的"},{"start":8979.735,"end":8980.075,"text":"中文字幕提供"},{"start":8996.327,"end":8998.108,"text":"臺灣若想要發展華語,我們對於華語的教學人員的保障就應該要特別的重視。"},{"start":9017.441,"end":9017.461,"text":"部長．"},{"start":9042.048,"end":9045.852,"text":"謝謝張偉對於華語教育、華語師資的議題的關注我也跟張偉報告確實華語教師尤其是派外到學校去做這方面的教學的資源當然挑戰也會比較大所以剛才張偉所提到的這個在有關"},{"start":9063.808,"end":9068.232,"text":"相關聘任還有這個規範我先看我也請國進司這邊可能要把幾個制度能夠再更把它完整化因為這才能夠穩定師資所以不管在包含我們自己在國內我們有幾所大學也都有設這個華語中心的這個就是國內外的這部分我想這個制度要把它包含那個薪資因為確實也必須要與時俱進"},{"start":9095.05,"end":9109.101,"text":"這方面應該做後續的處理就目前因為也比較希望更穩定的拓展我們在國外的這些剛才談到像優華語教育就是用學校對學校大學對大學這個其實在穩定上會更好讓學校這邊可以有一個比較穩定"},{"start":9116.647,"end":9116.787,"text":"委員會主席"},{"start":9139.608,"end":9142.81,"text":"臺灣推華語教育不會像中國的孔子學院因為那個太強烈的引發很多國家的這些反彈因為確實我們在這樣做的過程當中我想今天的書面報告也看得出來我們的學習華語的華語生其實人數是一直在增加"},{"start":9168.362,"end":9171.223,"text":"目前112學年度的統計已經到36000多這是來臺灣的表示說他們對臺灣在華語的學習上應該有相當的吸引力這個我們會持續來強化"},{"start":9183.787,"end":9197.319,"text":"希望未來真的成為所謂的外國人來學習華語的首選台灣是首選再來本席要跟您談談公費留學生的問題我們現在很積極在招攬國際留學生來台灣念書那台灣有人才的缺口部分我們也希望這些國際生念完書可以留下來來填補我們人力缺口那國際生的交流是雙向的所以我們的學生也會到國外去"},{"start":9211.03,"end":9211.05,"text":"部長．"},{"start":9227.269,"end":9250.789,"text":"跟委員報告,確實我們在名額上一直在增加那從報名就如委員所說的確實看起來不想過往這個我想政策上我們會持續來推那也跟趙委這邊報告因為現在很多學生他未必是用公費留學取得學位"},{"start":9251.309,"end":9263.82,"text":"他有蠻多是用比較交換學生因為現在很多學校也有這種交換學生他可以有一段時間仍然有到國外去接觸的但不是說像公費學生一綁就要多少年我覺得這個形式我覺得也應該是跟過往比較有不同的地方那另外我也跟趙偉報告我們其實也推一些叫專案"},{"start":9277.893,"end":9285.959,"text":"我發現他的效果是蠻好的像我們有一些叫做設計比如像設計人才的這種蹲點的計畫比如一個學生我們他申請合訂以後這個當然還蠻嚴格的他比如說他是以服裝時尚為主的真的他選擇的地點就是法國巴黎那去一年他發現這種回來因為我也好幾次都有機會聽他們分享其實他們得到的成長"},{"start":9305.453,"end":9305.713,"text":"中文字幕提供"},{"start":9322.307,"end":9322.407,"text":"李卓人議員"},{"start":9341.468,"end":9342.809,"text":"教育部從2017年就有推動新南向國家公費留學"},{"start":9361.007,"end":9380.979,"text":"這部分每年都開設10個名額可是報名人數也都是十幾二十人那2022年度甚至只有7個人報名那2023也只有11個人報名所以這兩年的錄取人數其實也只有5個人就是也不到足額那我想當然啦這個有學生反應是說"},{"start":9382.26,"end":9397.71,"text":"除了疫情的關係以外可能就是說教育部好像也沒有太積極在宣傳就是說這部分可能要更積極宣傳來吸引學生報名當然我想這個可能還有一些教養觀念的問題所以除了就是說後面認為說大家都希望往歐美或東亞"},{"start":9401.772,"end":9402.112,"text":"不曉得部長你怎麼看"},{"start":9422.981,"end":9428.623,"text":"這個確實從比較長時段來看,臺灣孩子當時在如果說留學或公費留學,確實歐美是他們比較感興趣的,應該可以看得出來。但是新南向這些國家,其實在這些年的我們跟他們的互動,我覺得真的其實是跟相較過往是有很大的開展。"},{"start":9447.931,"end":9448.291,"text":"新南向國家互動"},{"start":9466.966,"end":9473.873,"text":"新南向國家到臺灣來的學生尤其也越來越多是相當優秀的學生這個人數也在增加所以我想這個雙向互動我們要再加強宣導所以再花30秒就是說關心說之前有發現說新南向產學合作專班的學生來臺違法打工的這個事情那現在教育部在推新型專班很多都擔心說這個會不會有漏洞就是說"},{"start":9492.17,"end":9498.215,"text":"在發生所謂打黑工的事件那外國學生來臺就學辦法的規定招生事務就說除了宣傳推廣跟協助學生辦理來臺的相關的必要程序外不得為由校外的機構法人團體或個人來辦理可是真的就沒有發生過仲介透過各種名目把手伸進去這個招生事務嗎"},{"start":9513.847,"end":9532.319,"text":"教育部推動國際專修部讓外籍生可以先休息華語一年有確實打擊到仲介生態嗎?專科以上學校維護外國學生的授教權權益專案審查結果有多少比例不符合規定?這部分是哪些違規比較多?"},{"start":9534.08,"end":9537.124,"text":"提供詳細報告新南向產西國際專班確實招生初期我們有看到國內的學校真的在這個方面的準備跟心態我覺得是不足的"},{"start":9549.177,"end":9577.208,"text":"發現了幾個這個嚴重的我們講的真的叫做嚴重的現象教育部是採取非常嚴厲的處置也跟學校非常嚴格的要求後來我們修了幾個包含現在這些辦法都是以那個為基礎是很重要的讓學校知道絕對不得透過仲介人力那這個辦法除了宣誓以外其實是要我們發的學生入學通知適用一定要給當事學生"},{"start":9577.948,"end":9590.26,"text":"學生愛用他的語言比如來自越南的孩子來自印尼的孩子你給他的入學說明他的科系全力以赴是以這個方式所以這個像過去學校見不到更不知道他招的是什麼學生學生也不知道他要到臺灣的什麼學校讀什麼科系這個確實改變"},{"start":9596.365,"end":9597.445,"text":"接下來我們請吳佩奕委員吳佩奕委員舉行完畢之後我們就休息5分鐘"},{"start":9630.095,"end":9632.816,"text":"謝謝主席,我請潘文忠部長潘部長委員好部長好剛剛我坐在台下聽前面的委員質詢其中葉元之委員質詢他來詢問教育部說蔡英文總統當年在政大副教授升等的論文為什麼要加密為什麼不能看為什麼不見"},{"start":9657.043,"end":9664.309,"text":"我認為這個很可能涉及到立法委員在立法院裡面公然的造謠所以我認為事實的釐清相當的重要我想請問蔡英文總統當年在政大副教授升等的這個論文有加密嗎?"},{"start":9673.624,"end":9676.947,"text":"這個當年的論文是叫做期刊論文對吧?發表在哪裡?發表在政大的法學評論這個問題我覺得非常的可笑因為任何對學術有一點基本常識的人都知道"},{"start":9693.863,"end":9717.214,"text":"論文這個叫做發表這是公開出版已經出版的文件和來加密就出版了嘛再來這兩篇論文一篇是國際貿易中國內市場之保護另外一篇是國際貿易法術原則在經濟結構轉型及蕭條及之運用及演變這個論文出版的年份是民國72年"},{"start":9722.429,"end":9743.906,"text":"當時這個出版的論文現在我們在什麼地方可以看到點藏在哪裡跟委員報告政大本身學校一定圖書館一定保存我們的國圖也都會保存所有相關的出版品而且這一些你只要去越南都可以看到論文的在我們的國家圖書館還有保存"},{"start":9748.75,"end":9750.731,"text":"請問教育部有沒有對外的公開澄清過?"},{"start":9763.38,"end":9766.764,"text":"教育部在2019年就是5年前其實網頁上就公開的發布過澄清的資訊了所以呢我想那這其實就是我們公務部門我們其實就是還是富有跟社會隨時"},{"start":9778.257,"end":9778.317,"text":"立法委員．"},{"start":9800.365,"end":9800.525,"text":"請繼續努力"},{"start":9820.426,"end":9842.82,"text":"今天的報告裡面很重要的一部分是我們的臺美教育倡議因為我想這是從很早的美國在開始國內美國的議員們提出的決議案跨黨派的議員希望政府要來去重視在美國過去中國政府在美國推動的孔子學院"},{"start":9844.501,"end":9851.964,"text":"初中一開始也是要推動華語教育但是有很多的學校陸續舉報認為孔子學院有侵害學術自由這樣的行為例如說有學校受到壓力必須要去取消巴賴喇嘛的演講"},{"start":9861.508,"end":9865.691,"text":"有些學校邀請來自臺灣的演講者演說必須公開的資訊要移除掉的演講者是來自於臺灣的背景所以美國國內包括他們的這個國會也開始在討論說如果我們要推廣華語教育也可以來跟臺灣進行合作所以我們從2020年開始有臺美教育的倡議也簽署了很多的備忘錄今年"},{"start":9886.887,"end":9898.476,"text":"從美國的學生來到臺灣竟協助這個華語的人數也破了3000人是創下史上的新高我們目前簽的這些備忘錄目前推行的成效如何?"},{"start":9899.292,"end":9902.834,"text":"謝謝委員因為臺美倡議從2020起動後其實是真的非常密集的臺灣跨部會跟美國的延續臺美倡議後光這樣的會議就召開過14次每一次都有很具體的"},{"start":9918.484,"end":9921.185,"text":"委員提到美國在112年的華語學生已經是創立年的新高已經到了3000位以上那這當中還有跟委員報告是很多推的方式是已經深化到"},{"start":9943.67,"end":9945.971,"text":"以華語教育推廣來看 確實相較過往是有很大的突破"},{"start":9970.816,"end":9993.195,"text":"是 我覺得這計畫重要性除了在於外交意涵除了在於我們到美國去推廣華語也在於例如說美方透過了Fort Bright的計畫他們也有英語的教學人員來到臺灣協助我們進行英語的教育也跟我們的中小學來進行合作所以說美國有一個ETL美籍英語協同教學助理計畫每年都有人員來臺灣協助教學目前美國"},{"start":9997.739,"end":10008.425,"text":"台灣是不是美國投入最高程度的國家之一呢?是 目前確實如此剛才委員提到華語這是一個重點那台灣這段時間所推動國家雙語政策當中其實相當多的外師包含教學助理就是剛才委員提到的這部分其實也是透過這樣的平台他們來做這方面的"},{"start":10023.833,"end":10026.696,"text":"在AIT的臺美教育倡議事實清單裡面去年透過ETA計畫來臺灣的有152名的美國學生但是從臺灣我們透過優華語計畫送到美國去從事華語教學的我看一下人數"},{"start":10051.977,"end":10062.423,"text":"我們的教師是39名那我們的教學助理是5名也有一些是透過其他計畫選送去美國但是這個數字比起來因為這其實是互惠計畫嘛我們也要選送人到美國去推行華語教育我認為我們這個人數還可以再努力的來增加我們在這個選訓我們的華語師資的時候遇到什麼樣的困難嗎是補助的問題還是說意願其實不高有沒有遇到什麼樣的困難"},{"start":10079.713,"end":10100.139,"text":"跟委員報告確實在目前這樣的擴展如果以跟美國合作為例跟以往的這個需求啦我講需求就是因為大家很願意往這個方向走那對於華語師資的幫剛才林錦昭委也特別提到一些待遇跟相關聘任等等的做法"},{"start":10100.519,"end":10105.542,"text":"我覺得教育部是應該有再做一個檢視因為等於說現在機構在美國這邊所設置的或其他國家所設置的更穩定那這種情況之下未來在需求上可以看得出來會越來越擴增但是對於人員這方面的一些生活協助或我們說對於一些精緻待遇等等的"},{"start":10127.176,"end":10140.345,"text":"台灣是做協助的這部分當地學校會給這位老師薪資我想在協助的這部分我覺得是國家可以再多更大的力道是 我認為華語教學會是我們台灣未來我們非常強的優勢隨著台灣的外交的關係世界上很多國家都開始重視台灣也有學習華語的需求所以我們這幾年的優華語計畫我覺得我們應該進行一個盤正"},{"start":10155.034,"end":10159.857,"text":"因為有外交部有教育部也有僑委會嘛對不對優華語計畫事實上我們不只是要跟美國合作我們是美歐紐澳我們都有相關的計畫在推行但是我看一下我們目前的成果以校際合作來說總共合作的美歐紐澳是68所學校對不對但是你裡面你有八成56所都是在美國"},{"start":10178.971,"end":10188.039,"text":"其他的英國6所法國1所捷克波蘭紐澳各1所但因為我也是立法院歐洲議會友好促進會的會長其實歐洲的國家尤其是歐洲議會今年訪團來好幾團他們都告訴我們說歐洲在近5年對於臺灣的重視是提升了非常之多"},{"start":10199.648,"end":10210.656,"text":"包括了歐洲的國會議員都時常在他們自己國會裡面去提出要促進跟臺灣不管是經濟教育相關交流的議案所以我認為我們要去加強相關的推動目前為止你這個計畫優華語計畫一年的預算1.41億"},{"start":10219.295,"end":10224.52,"text":"跟歐洲國家的交流合作我剛講這個校際合作是不到兩成我覺得這個數字絕對要再來提升加強那包括了我們選送華語教學人員到海外任教你的教師45名裡面八成以上也都是到美國任教你這個其他英國有三位法國一位波蘭捷克各一位"},{"start":10238.993,"end":10242.515,"text":"這個數字我覺得都要來努力提升謝謝委員 這個優華語計畫在整個盤整之後再走其實目前是走的穩定 看起來也深入但是委員提到的 在擴展這面向上是應該用這樣的基礎在擴大"},{"start":10255.16,"end":10280.951,"text":"剛才委員提到我們在美國這邊人數有突破3000那其實整體來自全球到臺灣學華語的總人數已經到了36000最新的統計顯然在這方面我們是有被各地各國所喜歡所以在這方面謝謝委員剛才的指教我想在優華語計畫的基礎上我們可能還會再拓展其他的這些包含"},{"start":10281.811,"end":10294.117,"text":"東歐其實也是一個非常重要的開發的據點我們過去歐洲大概比較多的是跟英國這方面的合作居多如果說在這方面我想會在這個基礎上再來擴展"},{"start":10295.313,"end":10316.745,"text":"是那最後呢部長你是中華民國史上任期最長的部長小英總統任期8年你就擔任部長7年多的時間但更重要的是任內推動了幾項我認為是很重要的基礎教育的修法我們有偏鄉教育條例實驗三法特教法性便教育平等法等重要法案更加重要的也是我們108年課綱的推動你可能是第一個"},{"start":10321.388,"end":10326.411,"text":"透過公開的直播直接跟學生進行對談來討論課綱的部長那你認為108課綱在推動的過程當中最困難的一點是什麼?剛剛委員報告因為108課綱是一個很龐雜的那也是把過去我們比較片段就是說國中小是一個課綱技術高中是一個課綱高中是一個課綱那橫向之間"},{"start":10348.326,"end":10374.538,"text":"也比較沒有辦法領域之間那這部課綱是把縱向跟橫向做一個縱整但這樣的過程確實在包含研發跟審議尤其我們邀請要讓它更透明透明的意思是這些審議的過程是完全公開那包含也有學生代表來參與那學生也從他們學習者的角度來看過程確實有很多很多的意見那縱整這樣的意見最後把它確定花了兩年九個月"},{"start":10378.219,"end":10402.567,"text":"因為當時這個議題我認為是重要而且也考慮到未來推行要配套所以我也幾乎親自主持每一場的審議的會議主要的目的也是希望在課綱發展完成之後的推行那才是挑戰之所在所以我也花很多時間跟學生聽他們在這一方面的一些心得在做一些滾動的修正我想下一步的課綱也應該以這樣的基礎一定會讓台灣在課程發展上更好"},{"start":10405.788,"end":10406.288,"text":"我們先休息五分鐘好嗎?謝謝"},{"start":10448.747,"end":10460.591,"text":"法定人數不足"},{"start":10480.895,"end":10487.977,"text":"委員會主席"},{"start":10504.944,"end":10523.062,"text":"委員會主席"},{"start":10535.418,"end":10535.718,"text":"委員會主席響鐘"},{"start":10564.292,"end":10573.115,"text":"臺灣文化委員會主席"},{"start":10739.228,"end":10739.448,"text":"張雅琳委員"},{"start":10757.934,"end":10786.258,"text":"委員好部長好那剛剛在前面的質詢有聽到說一個訊息就是部長說他昨天召開的一個本土語言的會議有提到說上個禮拜上個禮拜就是有這個裡面有提到說未來可能也會結合這個AI的運用在語言的學習那這個部分其實聽起來我在那個我聽到的時候覺得非常的振奮那也期待說接下來如果相關的執行計畫的話也可以提供到我們辦公室對那再來就是說因為剛剛也有委員提到就是有關於雙語國家的一個政策"},{"start":10786.878,"end":10811.698,"text":"這部分雖然說我覺得可以跟AI來做一起學習的這個AI雖然未來可以幫助大家做這些語言的學習但是我覺得這個雙語國家這個政策還是要持續的推動下去因為我覺得像我自己過去在外鄉工作這麼多年其實在社交場合怎麼去理解他們的文化跟他們做很多的所謂的small talk這件事情還是需要透過學習來做一個辦法做到這件事情所以"},{"start":10812.97,"end":10833.229,"text":"我想可能是未來我們在做一些雙語的政策上面可能是要加強其他的部分的面向學習配合了AI的運用所以這點我還是相當肯定那接下來就是說回到我們今天的主題就是說我們現在在去年有一個促進國際生來臺即留臺的實施計畫那目前就是說透過進行專班來給予獎學金來希望強化他們"},{"start":10837.113,"end":10841.176,"text":"主要與歐美國家做學術交流,產學教育合作聯盟以新南向國家為主,開設新型專班及"},{"start":10858.027,"end":10863.972,"text":"推動師生交換那我自己在索資的時候我發現就是說我們在新型專班裡面現在是教育部合訂了35個學校班數123班人數是2301人但是去年實際上招收人數是1200人"},{"start":10874.499,"end":10891.187,"text":"人數的部分可能涉及經費補助機票行政費學費等等等有預算的問題那我想知道說新型專班第一個還在招生中嗎招生的情況如何如果今天超過1200人那超過的經費要如何來指引"},{"start":10892.897,"end":10909.049,"text":"謝謝委員 這個確實在我們整個針對國際招生這部分那兩大聯盟的意義跟過往其實是一個很大的突破以往大學都是各自到各別自己想要去招生的地方有點比較單打"},{"start":10911.03,"end":10911.25,"text":"新興國際專班197企業"},{"start":10931.089,"end":10931.129,"text":"主席"},{"start":10952.802,"end":10968.753,"text":"還有企業的贊助的這部分本來就有這樣的一個彈性空間因為當時我們在做計畫所以我們經費沒有問題嘛對不對那我們現在最新的人數是多少呢那個最新的人數還沒到最後的核定還在持續還在持續是不是大概什麼時候會停因為目前還是會分班如果說8月應該會告個段落"},{"start":10975.077,"end":10976.118,"text":"我們在境外生的部分在107年達到最高分有來到了將近13萬人"},{"start":10996.138,"end":11019.289,"text":"但是呢這個人數上可能中間涉及到了一個疫情啦或是終生不來所以人數持續的減緩到這兩年才又重新回升到回升但是呢我自己有發現到就是說我們的學衛生人數沒有明顯的減少但是境外並沒有明顯的減少反而是逐年微幅的成長變動較大反而是非學衛生也就是短期交流"},{"start":11020.825,"end":11041.6,"text":"我想知道說因為我知道我們在那個2030年其實有個計畫是希望可以突破累積招募的是32萬人可是我們現在大概只有1萬人這個目標似乎以這樣子的成長幅度來說每年大概只有1萬人要到2030年累積到32萬人這個目標是不是現在有點挑戰呢"},{"start":11042.28,"end":11062.182,"text":"我跟委員報告 確實在 剛才委員這個數字看得非常清楚 這當中有三年的疫情我們的學位生還是持續增加 學位生那研修生因為當時都是疫情 國際之間都會管制了所以才 當時我們非學位生大概 本來一般大概也占一半"},{"start":11062.722,"end":11062.882,"text":"我跟委員報告"},{"start":11078.922,"end":11080.824,"text":"因為這裡面結構上還有一個很大的改變原來當然臺灣我們本來就持開放的態度來歡迎那入生的這部分這幾年學位生就幾乎已經歸零了研修生本來大概他們到3萬2那現在112學年度也只剩2600多"},{"start":11100.685,"end":11107.648,"text":"這個概念也表示說因為兩岸的這些限制這個數字這個結構改變之後112學年度國外進外生的大一新生是將近兩萬人這個數字是很不一樣也就是說目前的幾個招生政策加上華語推動的政策我們看起來大一表示是新生嘛進來的速度是幅度是增加的"},{"start":11129.097,"end":11154.154,"text":"沒關係 因為那個部長 因為其實我最主要想要問的是這個就是說因為我們畢竟還是要去招募足夠的學生啦但是我自己有點擔心就是我們現在集中在這個越南印尼跟馬來西亞就將近佔了四成多那我會擔心的是說我們把雞蛋放在同一顆籃子裡面似乎有點風險那我們對於就像泰國跟菲律賓它的非學衛生都遠多於學衛生"},{"start":11154.814,"end":11181.884,"text":"在這一點上面我們有沒有一些更積極的做法來去讓其他的國家新南向的國家可以來我們臺灣學習是 各位報告我們那個兩個聯盟總共會設10個攬財的基地尤其是這個產學國際聯盟這部分主要目標也會以新南向國家為主所以這10個基地目前設了3個"},{"start":11183.004,"end":11183.204,"text":"主席主席"},{"start":11200.319,"end":11224.521,"text":"好 那我們來瞭解一下那再來就是說下一個部分就是優華語計畫那因為就是說我們在11年開始推動這個計畫到現在呢已經有63個學校那美國占了最多數那我們在紐澳相對來說是比較少那我認為這是一個很好的國際交流讓世界看見臺灣那我也看見就是說這幾年也有去年也有新聞就是講哈佛來臺灣辦這個臺北書院"},{"start":11227.023,"end":11229.385,"text":"這部分是目前有一些詳細的計畫或宣傳的活動嗎?"},{"start":11250.6,"end":11254.103,"text":"跟委員報告優華語計畫是我們盤整過去執行以比較更深化從大學對大學的模式來進行那當然因為臺美倡議確實在這上面有很大的推進因為美國政府的力量暴墜政府所以可以看得出來68校當中美國佔了八成那但是我們不以此為限目前還會持續的擴展"},{"start":11277.941,"end":11281.564,"text":"因為我也關心這個新南向國家的部分也許我們不是用那個教學中心模式事實上在基地裡面在做的也是當中有一個重要任務也是華語教育的推廣所以我想未來我們還是會全面的來展開包含優華語計畫的這個做法"},{"start":11299.241,"end":11299.401,"text":"主要是說兩個問題"},{"start":11321.861,"end":11349.786,"text":"第一個就是體操協會我們在4月的時候舉辦一個亞洲體操青年錦標賽但是我們的代表隊卻有兩個人因為年齡不足雖然上場但不算成績這件事情也不是發生第一次在之前排球協會也有同樣的狀況體操協會其實說今年2月因為過去的一個團體運作不佳所以已經全部換了團隊新的團隊3月上任可是"},{"start":11350.406,"end":11359.093,"text":"這整個中間應該有交接是有一個月的時間上任其實是有一個月的時間但卻沒有注意到這件事情我們現在要如何避免類似發生這樣子的情況"},{"start":11360.758,"end":11388.648,"text":"報告委員我想這個大概是我們在協會裡面的國際組的人才這部分我們大概接下來有一些方案可能要協助協會在國際事務這一塊能夠再強化那這一塊主要是他們在去年國際總會那邊發布青少年的年齡層做了修改變成14到15歲但是上一任的協會他們在參加這個物質別科的賽事的時候一般主辦國會把年齡放在競賽規程可是這一次這個國家沒有放進去他們認為說"},{"start":11389.648,"end":11406.683,"text":"昨年總會已經對全世界公告了所以就不需要放進去因為這樣造成一些困擾那這個錯誤在上一任其實他們協會運作其實非常的不理想所以我們才會在今年的2月要求他們限期改善或撤款對但是我想因為這個東西也不是第一個協會發生掉這個狀況所以我想在國際事務人才這部分我們會強調"},{"start":11407.684,"end":11422.61,"text":"這部分要持續的強化不然其實坦白說對選手來說其實是很傷那再來還有最後一個也是跟這個有連續性的就是說我們去上個禮拜有一個叫做上上禮拜安聯小小世界被花蓮預賽的時候發生一個暴力事件是"},{"start":11423.59,"end":11423.63,"text":"這件事﹖"},{"start":11446.511,"end":11464.194,"text":"他鬆上去打球員這件事情我覺得這是非常不合理的第二個是因為這種體罰事件在前陣子也有一個北市羽球國小的教練也是持續有這樣子的狀況那我想知道說就是在我們現在這個體育署是有叫做這個教練陣的訓練課程有納入而上訓練可是只有一個小時"},{"start":11465.155,"end":11482.864,"text":"這個小時的時數是不是太少了因為他根本沒有辦法讓教練了解我如何對一個小球員去做一些訓練而且了解說他的身心靈的一些知能而且要讓他知道說你今天做了哪些事情其實是觸犯了相對的一些法律絕對不可以執行的我們現在這個課程是不是還可以做一些重新的盤點跟規劃呢"},{"start":11485.125,"end":11508.117,"text":"報告委員這個分為兩個部分第一個部分雖然這個賽事不是體育署跟足球協會的賽事但是我們一樣通報足球協會必須送紀律委員會出於競賽第二個方面的面程是我們在兒少的課程目前取證的部分的確是只有限制一個小時那是也因為協會他們後來抱怨說在短短的時間之內又要上通識課程又要上專業課程有它的困難度所以這部分我們在"},{"start":11508.897,"end":11509.277,"text":"謝謝主席"},{"start":11538.359,"end":11538.799,"text":"吳村城委員"},{"start":11552.472,"end":11569.877,"text":"部長好部長好這個我到立法院來第一次的質詢就是獻給你今天可能是最後一次在教育委員會希望你跟上一層樓剛才有提到這個"},{"start":11571.678,"end":11593.4,"text":"看到部長這幾年來歷經滄桑所以我要想問一下部長有沒有發表一下臨北感言你覺得你最大的遺憾是什麼只能講一點不能變成你的你覺得真的要講最重要的一個關鍵字"},{"start":11595.162,"end":11595.442,"text":"最大的遺憾"},{"start":11621.536,"end":11624.477,"text":"整個教育部很多僵化的體制那些體制是從哪裡來的那就是捆捆綁綁"},{"start":11644.448,"end":11654.224,"text":"非常多的綑綁但是這些可能也是受政治的影響有一個政治的風向往哪邊吹那邊就會打開一扇門往那邊就會關上一扇門"},{"start":11658.934,"end":11679.841,"text":"整個的教育部可能就在這一個當中遇到很多的困難就像這一個我會談的今天叫做一國兩制看到這表也蠻奇怪的就是今天的我們的主題就是在國際招生的這一部分我們可以看到這一個"},{"start":11681.441,"end":11703.306,"text":"平均大概都有10萬名以上這幾年這10年來不斷的在推展但後面這3年可能受疫情的影響還有兩岸陸生的問題但是同時我們也看到我們近10年來的留學生赴海外的留學生也不斷的在成長"},{"start":11704.69,"end":11726.5,"text":"不斷地成長讓我們了解一邊因為我們少子化大學對不對我們不斷地吸引外來的但是我們又不斷地把我們自己的學生往外推那可以看得出來我就今天在談的一個就是我們在思維上面這個是什麼策略部長"},{"start":11728.17,"end":11750.821,"text":"我跟委員報告這個當然時代環境有很大的變化對於學生培養國際移動的這種能力我想各國皆然大概像早期我們大部分的學生都在國內然後比較少數的像公費留學等等的我也覺得這個在教育部的政策上也一直比較希望"},{"start":11751.421,"end":11751.621,"text":"委員會主席"},{"start":11781.051,"end":11803.746,"text":"臺灣現在的教育非常進步以前是因為臺灣跟國際的落差很大所以臺灣現在教育非常好那應該有很多的吸引力我們可以在臺灣自己本身就可以培養出國際頂端的人才來了像新加坡小小一個地方就亞洲前一二名的大學"},{"start":11805.748,"end":11819.125,"text":"他們當然也會出國不過全世界都自然會吸引過來辦好我們國內的教育這可能還是第一要務了但是另外一個談的我剛才談的就是我們這裡有開一扇門"},{"start":11821.188,"end":11838.263,"text":"對國內有對國外我們是大開門戶啦所以十幾萬人可以進來但是我們對國內的很多教育體制是非常的嚴格把關困難重重那好不容易開了一扇門實驗三法推動了實驗教育從這張"},{"start":11840.385,"end":11862.392,"text":"圖表可以看得出來粉紅色就是這種實驗的每年不斷地在成長可以看得出需求很多我們希望這個更多自主更多開放的甚至有一點類似國外的這種實驗跟國內體制不太一樣的這個的需求非常的大"},{"start":11864.417,"end":11892.988,"text":"但部長有看到這個問題嗎?是,這部分我跟委員報告,這些年因為從教育基本法後,即使臺灣的教育也不斷地在讓家長有更多教育選擇權,但是這裡我要提的一個就是說,但是這裡只有到高中,大學高等教育就沒有了,高等教育沒有以後,現在這裡有4萬多人,4萬在就學的這種非正式教育,實驗教育當中,他到這裡,"},{"start":11894.269,"end":11902.87,"text":"幾乎只有一條路非出國不行因為跟我們的教育體制沒有銜接因為我們沒有實驗型的大學"},{"start":11903.982,"end":11907.145,"text":"這一點我跟委員報告當然要到完全一個機構現在教育部也核定了一所高校的實驗的這個部分是以人文藝術為主也會展開但是現在"},{"start":11929.326,"end":11957.493,"text":"對現在我跟委員報告的是現在大學的入學當中有一個特殊選材的這樣的機制這個機制他也不是會去參考一定要參加入學的學測測驗等等的而這個機制目前也有比較多的學校已經展開這個概念因為委員我現在有看到部長我現在看到有五所大學提出申請只有一所大學現在不只啦委員特殊選材的大學不只五所不只"},{"start":11957.833,"end":11964.715,"text":"但是目前只有一所那所是實驗型的大學對實驗型我現在講的是實驗型大學因為現在國小國中到高中後面他們因為關鍵一個他們是不是沒有其他的路徑那剛才報告那個特殊選材的做法其實將近有40校"},{"start":11979.18,"end":11990.391,"text":"現在有幾所學校啊 像清華啦 交大啦 逢甲但是呢 這一個喔 生多 周少嘛 就是錄取名額只有30名聽說報名都到達500人 錄取率只有6%我應該這樣說啦 因為臺灣的大學就不像高中以下 那大學本來就是比較多樣"},{"start":12000.099,"end":12014.703,"text":"多樣態等於說多科系那學生在入學上為什麼會有這個特殊選材就是認為他們高中以下也許不是用學科考試等等的方式但是有特殊選材這一條管道我覺得這裡我們既然對國外可以有這麼開放的顯然這個教育體制的配合是沒有問題的我們的執行都沒有問題的只是我們的思維當中對於國內"},{"start":12029.048,"end":12048.524,"text":"就嚴審把關考慮了很多所以都困難重重那這個實驗大學這個要銜接因為我們現在這個到高中以下有4萬名了這麼多的需求讓他不能選擇出國這個是一個很大的問題另外一個也就是我一直在提的"},{"start":12049.244,"end":12066.837,"text":"跟部長來提的第三人生的另外一個就是我們對於高齡社會提到的要第三人生大學可以看得出這一方面我們的高教師都沒有一直覺得大學就是給18歲的人來念的60歲以後的人"},{"start":12069.139,"end":12089.302,"text":"目前這方面的思維部長算是第一個先驅但是要把這樣的思想啟蒙下去你看這一個前幾天的新聞我們中醫藥師的師長去考北藝大圓他的夢然後他還必須要循正規的"},{"start":12090.882,"end":12094.064,"text":"那為什麼要這麼的辛苦我們的教育為什麼要擋住 擋這個門"},{"start":12109.255,"end":12137.713,"text":"那OK當然這個所以我再提到了既然我們有一扇門就是教育有實驗教育的這樣的體制他可以排除了各種教育的法規幾乎都可以排除只看你要不要做而已那所以呢我也認為不要用這種教育法規因為再循那條路線去想我相信一定想不出來的啦是不是可以用這樣的方式來解開第三人生大學的一個"},{"start":12138.533,"end":12139.253,"text":"法規的限制"},{"start":12166.698,"end":12167.558,"text":"因為現在有個小組在進行"},{"start":12185.643,"end":12186.083,"text":"謝謝兩位 接下來我們請范雲委員"},{"start":12217.165,"end":12217.806,"text":"有請教育部長"},{"start":12225.82,"end":12246.519,"text":"委員好部長午安今天真的是您擔任教育部長應該就是最後一次來備詢了我想您真的是我們從基層出身擔任過教師而且擔任過地方的教育局長然後到教育部長又是教育學的博士我想您在理論實務上真的是我們少見常任的部長所以想跟您對話"},{"start":12251.283,"end":12279.201,"text":"教育的一些議題那當然也非常謝謝您這7年來之事每一天都非常的認真工作那我想問您的第一個問題就是剛剛您其實有講過心得對不對也有講到您比較就是覺得做得很好比如108課綱這個改革那我想換個方式問您就是您任內你覺得最重要的相關的法案的成就那您覺得您最"},{"start":12280.121,"end":12305.793,"text":"嬌傲的是哪三個法案不管是修法或者是執行根本報告因為教育部涉及的法案真的多了對您最有感的如果覺得這個在我提出來新設的法案跟修訂的法案那第一個我想偏遠學校發展條例因為那是長期教育非常根本當然現在還需要再不斷的滾動做修正"},{"start":12306.593,"end":12324.807,"text":"那另外一個當然很難但是我覺得對臺灣未來長期發展是必要的是私校退場條例因為那個議題假如如果沒有往下進行我們現在所看到的可能私生的權益等等這些大概在處理上會是更難"},{"start":12327.549,"end":12349.728,"text":"第三個當然我自己長期在國教階段上個會期因為我也有參與國教法跟特教法雖然超出一個啦我要這樣講國教法跟特教法這兩個法是一個非常重要的根本大法那個所涉及到的都是數十年教育現場所需要建立一個制度來做依循"},{"start":12350.248,"end":12350.308,"text":"委員會主席"},{"start":12371.071,"end":12375.732,"text":"在我們委員會的大力支持下所以我也用最快的速度在上個禮拜把所涉及到的60幾個執法也都完成這個過程還是有好多的溝通這個當然我覺得如果以我自己從事教育這麼長時間尤其在國教領域我覺得有幾項非常重要但不容易的法規也都在大院"},{"start":12397.276,"end":12402.279,"text":"這是我認為雖然辛苦了但是是必要也值得所以潘部長剛其實講了四個法就偏鄉的大學的私校退場條例然後國教法跟特教法都是非常大規模的一個修訂跟改革其實我個人看到的跟你有點不一樣但有點相關第一個我看到您在代理教師權益的保障上的努力"},{"start":12423.832,"end":12439.438,"text":"解決了十多年的問題而且我們在修法上確保這些成果不會隨著不同的人做而改變這是我看到的第一個第二個我覺得性別平等教育法雖然不是您任內出現的但是您立場堅定遇到困難尤其是勇於溝通譬如說你們的教育部的粉專那個小編"},{"start":12449.361,"end":12472.171,"text":"就真的讓大家非常的激賞不會遇到反對的聲浪那反而是積極主動溝通我覺得是政務官表率在這部分最近母親節的我都有看到從西程器是不是好的給媽媽的禮物做性平教育我覺得非常的用心所以性平教育就是這個部分您做得非常好而且主動溝通的部分我非常的肯定"},{"start":12472.771,"end":12482.053,"text":"國際招生及文化委員會第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第1會期教育及文化委員會第1會期教育及文化委員會第1會期教育及文化委員會第1會期教育及文化委員會第1會期教育及文化委員會第1會期教育及文化委員會第1會期教育及文化委員會第1會期教育及文化委員會第1會期教育及文化委員會第1會期教育及文化委員會第1會期教育及文化委員會第1會期教育及文化委員會第1會期教育及文化委員會第1會期教育及文化委員會第1會期教育及文化委員會第"},{"start":12502.558,"end":12528.378,"text":"再來哪三步是最該修訂的法如果要您來選的話您會選哪三步我跟委員報告如果就後續當然有再持續進行學生輔導法學夫法雖然大家現在還有一些期限但是我認為那個是維持支持學生在心理健康學校在做輔導上面"},{"start":12529.699,"end":12529.839,"text":"午餐條例"},{"start":12545.647,"end":12549.408,"text":"目前行政院正在做這個審議因為這個學校午餐條例我也是跟大院我們委員這邊的報告我說那個過程雖然還有很多不同的意見但前面因為做了很多必要的行政的措施包含偏嚴學校午餐廚房還有我們所政治的這些相關那個條件已經比較記足那最後一個我也知道委員關心"},{"start":12571.476,"end":12571.836,"text":"大學法"},{"start":12588.121,"end":12588.441,"text":"大學自主、大學自校"},{"start":12607.391,"end":12626.247,"text":"謝謝部長沒有跟您對過但是我們認為這三個最該修的法很高興我們看法一致那我想我認為的就是說第一個就是您剛講的大學法因為高教治理真的是需要要不然教育部沒有辦法去規範大學因為大學自主第一個是該修的是大學法那第二個學夫法"},{"start":12627.688,"end":12628.128,"text":"二千三百多少天?"},{"start":12657.637,"end":12674.904,"text":"兩千六百四十五天是算到520前還是算到今天算到519那您這個七年多的任期那我擔任的立委四年半算是超過一半的時間有看到您的認真努力那也要跟您講就過去其實我並不太溫暖"},{"start":12677.665,"end":12705.904,"text":"那但是就是在今天這個質詢前我的助理主動說要應該要送一張卡片給您我就欣然接受所以我們辦公室寫了一張卡片要送給潘老師聽說你最喜歡這個稱呼比部長還要好那真的非常的感謝這個教育路上有您真好您真的都非常的認真努力回應然後對相關的政策非常的謹慎而且也非常的熟悉那我就把我的最後時間"},{"start":12706.544,"end":12706.564,"text":"謝謝委員 謝謝"},{"start":12731.806,"end":12746.676,"text":"好 非常謝謝范老師送給潘老師那柯老師接下來宣布好 那下一個質詢的人是鄭天才委員鄭天才委員 鄭天才委員好 麥玉珍委員質詢時間4分鐘 謝謝謝謝主席 有請教育部部長好 潘部長 謝謝"},{"start":12764.004,"end":12764.392,"text":"麥委員好"},{"start":12765.526,"end":12793.731,"text":"部長好,要請教你一下因為為了深化南線政策的交流在教育部106年開始推動南線政策的計畫開始產學合作的國際專班並提供長學金鼓勵優秀的青年來臺研習所以當我們在106年到112年的學年"},{"start":12794.491,"end":12822.498,"text":"共栽培兩萬多的國際青年但五屆畢業生總共就是有4963位等於說平均一年招收了2900位的學生但每年畢業平均只有990位左右招收學生跟畢業生比例不正比例所以畢業偏低的原因是什麼"},{"start":12823.038,"end":12846.29,"text":"未來如何提高這樣子的畢業生還有就是他們如何順利就業是 謝謝委員那跟委員報告因為新南向產西國際專班的這部分因為他的協志有好幾個不同的學制那所以總共到目前是兩萬多一點的學生那畢業的部分目前是五屆因為他陸陸續續還會在"},{"start":12850.052,"end":12852.313,"text":"新南向產系專班推動初期,學校在招生過程中"},{"start":12873.666,"end":12873.846,"text":"教育部長潘文忠"},{"start":12900.954,"end":12910.82,"text":"如果在學校做實習或是勞基法所同意的打工是非常清楚的規範也就比較不會有過去那一種是假求學之民可能來臺灣他就一直在努力工作要去償還他來臺灣的那些經費所以我想這一部分目前看起來我們所掌握到的包含照後面的這幾個計畫"},{"start":12924.207,"end":12926.969,"text":"謝謝部長,因為我本身就來自越南,所以我們就歡心說最多的就是越南學生來台南"},{"start":12949.804,"end":12978.643,"text":"是,所以我們希望說他們在這邊來到這邊不容易啦畢業後就是看起來比較少所以我們覺得說比例在比較低所以比較關心還有說他們畢業在這邊的就業所以說有一些多元的選擇的話也是更好的啦所以在我就是在世界總會回到越南有跟去拜訪外交部外交部也是覺得是說剛才我們部長有講說"},{"start":12979.784,"end":12991.57,"text":"因為之前都是因為學校都通過仲介來去招生導致很多就是剝削嘛讓學生沒辦法專心就業又沒辦法有錢連吃飯都沒有都吃泡麵很多都是這樣子所以到現在我們也說我們的教育部也有說未來要設一個就是我們的"},{"start":13004.457,"end":13004.577,"text":"因為時間的關係"},{"start":13023.424,"end":13027.449,"text":"主要學校一定要有這個責任把學生從越南找到我們台灣來求學對於這些學生的狀況要充分的掌握這部分也是我們課以學校責任的"},{"start":13038.842,"end":13039.583,"text":"委員會主席"},{"start":13068.181,"end":13069.942,"text":"這個制度其實是已經把它比較好的建構起來了"},{"start":13095.915,"end":13097.236,"text":"接下來我們請林倩琦委員"},{"start":13126.869,"end":13126.909,"text":"謝謝趙偉請潘部長"},{"start":13142.24,"end":13160.695,"text":"委員好潘部長好我們知道今天應該是您在519之前最後一次來所以本席今天大概在進入主題之前有一些感觸跟心情要跟您分享一下當然也跟部裡面藉這個機會也做一個溝通"},{"start":13162.737,"end":13162.757,"text":"謝謝委員 謝謝"},{"start":13188.174,"end":13201.699,"text":"當然部裡面的同仁也是不管我們有什麼看法上的差異我們也是有很多大家可以一起繼續在努力的地方我這邊要回顧一下在本席從詢答"},{"start":13204.44,"end":13210.046,"text":"以後所碰到的一些狀況跟建議那我就發現在每一項的主題問答那我們這邊都會碰到這個有關於組織或是法案這個專案或者是計畫預算等等"},{"start":13219.797,"end":13242.429,"text":"過去的詢答包括各部會相關組織的調整或計畫的施行我這邊整理了一下發現截至目前為止都不太長這些相關的主題不僅時間不太長以外還有一個很重要的我覺得應該做的事情就是"},{"start":13243.666,"end":13260.045,"text":"都沒有進行定期的檢視、檢討跟修正那有一些其實包括剛才好幾位委員講的主題有一些好像事實上應該煞車重新省思或者是可以繼續在配套上做一些整理"},{"start":13260.606,"end":13278.619,"text":"在進行下去的部分好像大家都沒有時間在好好的做整理所以我在這邊呼應幾件很嚴重的也是我主題所講的就是在私校退場條例到今天我也提過很多次看起來就只有清算停辦接管接下來我們大家不知道何去何從"},{"start":13281.322,"end":13305.783,"text":"施肖要不要是要繼續就讓他這樣子結束細節我其實已經提了一些那未來還會再提那究竟他們要怎麼辦我們不知道怎麼辦我們沒有任何的預設立場那你要他往哪個方向去你總要告訴他們那怎麼走或者是能怎麼走好那再來呢是這兩年我們不管這個政策上是不是有什麼問題啦那感覺上很多量化的數字"},{"start":13306.744,"end":13333.258,"text":"好像很美可是看起來我們也不知道接續下去裡面的質量是如何剛才麥委員所講的東西本席在教學的第一線現場甚至在教育部裡面有記錄我就已經有經歷過很多的問題那上次次長又被我講了一圈我告訴他在這個國際生現場會碰到什麼樣的問題那你們男相事實上要注意到這些國家其實每一個國家的差異性非常的高"},{"start":13334.578,"end":13363.224,"text":"待會我當然再講一些細項不過在這邊我先提出一個最基本的一個建議最近許多的教團很期待我們應該舉辦一個全國的教育會議這個部分本席絕對呼應因為從2010年召開之後現在很久了雖然我們召委說教育是至少10年我們也知道百年的一個百年的一個時間但是14年沒有檢討你不覺得我們在現場"},{"start":13364.244,"end":13379.598,"text":"我相信行政教學等等都會有很大的問題所以因應社會的變遷跟這幾年的狀況跟問題我們是不是應該好好地檢討一下在各個層級所以我呼應正式舉辦全國教育會議來處理這件事情"},{"start":13380.299,"end":13380.539,"text":"大學推動國際招生並流用"},{"start":13399.15,"end":13423.515,"text":"但是基本上本席認為這就是2013年雙語計畫所延伸出來的子計畫早上有委員提醒你們哪雙語那本席作為一個原住民我也可不可以建議那原住民裡面就地區那這個雙語可不可以那個華語如果是大家現在都會講的那其他一個語言也可以選擇原住民的其中一個語言要不然我們原住民的孩子呢可能有的時候都要學三到四種"},{"start":13425.476,"end":13430.698,"text":"阿美族也要學到泰雅族的音樂師資的關係還有一些師資經費的不平等的問題還要學英語還要學自己的母語我們的負擔也很重我簡單提一下因為本人對語言很有興趣接觸的也很多也實地參與我可以提很細的建議但是我們今天不在這邊講細的東西"},{"start":13450.509,"end":13460.154,"text":"那所以呢我們談到這個很短的這個時間就連許多現在雙語成就很好的國家他也花了比我們預定的時間還長的時間而且基礎我們要來談論好究竟這樣子我們就會國家富強"},{"start":13467.458,"end":13467.478,"text":"好﹗"},{"start":13482.695,"end":13510.711,"text":"接下來這張牌子又出來了那如果這個問題沒解決絕對是幾年來都一定會繼續本席會一直念一直念那請原諒本席我也不喜歡一天到晚聽到某一些標語一直在那邊念啊念啊喊著喊著但是當然截至目前為止都沒有解決更何況今天是這個國際生的問題那我這邊要喊就是未來我們在2030年也要留用6萬多個人"},{"start":13511.832,"end":13539.753,"text":"那你們有跟我們現在在在學的學生的狀況跟未來他們在職場的狀況還有未來你這些外籍生對整個人口結構還有學生部分的就業就學的衝擊嗎那這個部分如果教育部還沒做因為常常本席提出來的問題教育部都說要不然去跟別人拿要不然就是你們沒有那如果沒有做本席在這邊提醒我剛才講的問題如果你們沒有聽懂那可以私下再跟本席確認好"},{"start":13541.59,"end":13569.828,"text":"所以本席在第一次也是提到了可不可以給我們原住民一個機會有學習到你們所謂的STEM我還要再念一次嗎Science, Technology, Engineering, Mathematics然後你們講的金融半導體Finance 跟 Semiconductor可不可以給我們一個機會不要把我們一直鎖在某一些原住民所謂相關的不管在原住民專班或產技2.0本席也比較過了謝謝會裡面有提供這個資訊不過會裡面跟我們說某些東西是機密"},{"start":13571.229,"end":13588.406,"text":"結果有的我們也在網路上查到怎麼辦你們機密不小心露出來了那你們要小心喔所以這些機密請會理對不起部裡面再好好的請示一下是不是要某種程度的提供給本席結果因為你們是機密所以本席很認真的查才查出天啊這個產績2.0是給"},{"start":13590.928,"end":13618.16,"text":"不僅是原住民的學生還給臺灣的學生然後國際專班呢依照你們都跟我們講說這應該是南向政策的什麼什麼各位一般民眾不會管我們什麼這個政策下面的哪一個經費請各位我們有責任把民眾的問題聽懂他說他不會管我們什麼南向政策下面的這一些配套那重點就是我很簡單的講就是每個月臺灣學生能夠拿到的資源跟補助"},{"start":13619.906,"end":13647.483,"text":"比國際專班的學生來得低很多這是第一個第二個未來他們的職場比我們能夠做的高端科技跟臺灣的主要科技的機會來得多很多所以我為什麼中華民國的納稅錢你照顧不了臺灣的原住民跟臺灣的學生所以本席本來只幫原住民爭取現在所有你們認為非國際生的人臺灣的學生本席都要爭取"},{"start":13648.664,"end":13652.028,"text":"接下來,臺灣優華語計畫的失之不足我先請教一下,我先問一下,我們現在認證考試是什麼樣子的狀況?就是,華語的認證考試"},{"start":13665.629,"end":13689.965,"text":"我們有 可以回應我一下我們懷疑認證考試的狀況嗎那剛才委員提一個我可能要跟委員補充說明一下我們的教育不過那個部長不好意思你一說明會有點久我要說明一下台灣的教育資源絕對大比例都是投資在我們自己國內的學生當然一定要啦因為我們的人數比例這個數據各位再算一下我們再來彼此的對一下啦我應該提到原住民的學生從學費的補助"},{"start":13693.587,"end":13694.268,"text":"如果在永住民族學生在後續"},{"start":13716.605,"end":13731.015,"text":"專案上可以再怎麼協助我想這個教育部跟委員這邊再交換一下意見部長我知道我是要跟您談的這個部分你也是很支持而且也投入不少也就是這個部分我要跟您肯定一下也希望部裡面的同仁也許有一些可以再聚焦再擴大這應該是什麼概念我是要看那個五專展示計畫因為大部分我們現在的專科學五專"},{"start":13741.803,"end":13742.584,"text":"邀請教育部長潘文忠列席就:「大學推動國際招生及臺灣優華語計畫之執行成效及檢討．並備質詢。．並備質詢。"},{"start":13767.826,"end":13781.755,"text":"跟委員報告我直接這樣講好了本人在學法語、西班牙語其他的語言那他都有第一、第一、二、三、四那請問我們的華語計畫是什麼我想了解一下我們的那個"},{"start":13782.78,"end":13801.788,"text":"有華語能力測驗檢測也有分級啊所以我們在各國都實行這個計畫嗎?對不對?是啊 因為如果他當事人希望大家要考過什麼東西?那個詳細的資料再給委員啊名字是什麼?我想那個主辦單位應該知道吧?我都唸得出來叫DELE A DELE UNO你們應該唸得出來吧?"},{"start":13805.009,"end":13806.49,"text":"對外華語的能力測驗叫華語文能力測驗英文簡稱TALK4"},{"start":13821.054,"end":13843.361,"text":"時間有點窘迫我這邊最後提一下剛才我呼應葛委員這邊所講的他剛才給你那個Very glad to see you這邊應該是Encantada que estes aquí那現在他講的這個AI很多東西都可以實踐是不是可以好好的研究一下他所講的東西因為本席有很深的語言學習經驗沒這個環境"},{"start":13844.821,"end":13844.901,"text":"主席"},{"start":13863.486,"end":13882.367,"text":"對好2023年4月公共政策網路平台全國教總的提議請我們好好檢討這個雙語包括早上有些委員講了什麼雙語我們當然知道大家在推行的是什麼回歸教育的正軌那本人第一線真的遇到很多困難那再來你們國發會的回應讓人家不知所措好接下來最後"},{"start":13883.888,"end":13900.807,"text":"如果有一些政策真的要煞車不要一意孤行按下暫停鍵讓我們都有機會喘氣好嗎那本人是第一線很認真的想要做好這件事情可是如果連我有時候都很無力的不知道能夠怎麼下去那"},{"start":13902.355,"end":13918.662,"text":"我們在這邊喊的再多大家都只有徒增困擾基層就只有越來越無力請不要讓我們的教育從我們所謂偉大的政策而消失好嗎謝謝部裡面謝謝潘部長好謝謝兩位接下來我們請邱志偉委員執行時間4分鐘謝謝"},{"start":13932.672,"end":13947.765,"text":"請教育部潘部長休息一下休息一下那個中生教育師李市長國際師廖代理市長學特師林市長吳市長好 請這三位市長表現一下我們整天都在補修在講要讓市長表現一下 來三位市長 謝謝這個"},{"start":13957.671,"end":13976.463,"text":"松城教育師我先問一下這個在職專班的這個入學人數跟在學人數是跟10年前比較是減少還是增加就是各大學院校的碩士班或者是學士班在職專班這是你的應該是你的業務吧"},{"start":13977.522,"end":14004.27,"text":"報告委員 那個學校的那個大學的在職專班是高教師跟教師主管 高教師來 高教師來來 主事長 時間跟時間以前比較這個在職專班不管是學士或者碩士 他的在學人數多還是少學士班的部分是往下降 那碩班的人數事實上也是微幅在往下降都這樣降 降了多少"},{"start":14006.544,"end":14034.257,"text":"就是說你會這樣代表說你的幼嬰不夠對不對你幼嬰不夠生源不足當然會影響這個大學的發展嘛所以你要想辦法說你在職專班他要提升他的專業很重要你要提升他的幼嬰在職進修那在職進修有幾個他在考量是不是工作可以許可是不是幼嬰這個足夠幼嬰足夠他的學位比較貴那你是不是在租稅上有一些幼嬰讓他願意花更多的錢去這個在職專班學習"},{"start":14036.842,"end":14037.262,"text":"重點產業領域擴大招生"},{"start":14064.517,"end":14076.854,"text":"包括這個重點產業的招生跟設立國際專業部這也是你啊好啦你繼續回答你覺得你滿意嗎這個成果你滿意嗎"},{"start":14081.946,"end":14098.114,"text":"國際專修部事實上在過去兩年的推動已經有三四千位的學生進來你覺得這符合產業界的需求嗎你進來就是說除了他這個專業領域能夠提升之外他能夠留在臺灣這個協助我們產業的發展嗎對不對那你聲援國很重要啊港澳東南亞"},{"start":14105.157,"end":14127.486,"text":"公文報我們主要是說他不會華語的學生來臺灣先修一年的華語我當然知道我剛剛講的港澳沒有算其他的東南亞印度這個歐洲國家都可以那你的誘因夠不夠如果兩年來三四千位我覺得是不夠的你第一個宣傳不夠第二個誘因不夠他沒有這個意願來"},{"start":14130.697,"end":14136.851,"text":"你如果能夠兩年這個吸引到兩萬人是不是可以提供我們這個產業的人才需求"},{"start":14138.086,"end":14138.246,"text":"另外這個華語："},{"start":14168.041,"end":14190.907,"text":"優華語計畫應該不是你吧優華語這個是屬於國際師那你覺得這個全部68所集中在美國啊你歐洲大概只有英國法國捷克波蘭歐洲國家那麼多我們代表處都有很多啊你要給他責任額啊"},{"start":14192.501,"end":14214.187,"text":"各位委員報告因為剛出這個優華語計畫是配合臺美教育倡議在109年的時候推出來的所以當時的一些重點學校會是以美國為主那我們現在也配合全球的布局不要太保守你既然是優華語計畫是針對全球嘛對不對你不要帳面數字然後你帳面數字攤出來哇都是美國是"},{"start":14215.547,"end":14224.956,"text":"美國學華語的機會也很多啊就是華語資源、華語教學比較不足的地方特別是歐洲國家歐洲國家近年來友好的氛圍非常強啊所以你應當是要選擇歐盟所以我們住處有住處的你要給他責任額你一年要遷幾個學校要做多少生源"},{"start":14236.487,"end":14258.469,"text":"我們這個優華語計畫主要是透過學校對學校的一個合作模式,那我們助主也會來協助,謝謝你要有這個宏觀,這個是放眼全球,不是只有美國而已另外這個學特師,目前教官在高中時跟大學的在職教官有幾位?"},{"start":14259.898,"end":14287.487,"text":"教官目前高中還有900多大專還有500多總共1400多1400多對那他們主要的工作內容是什麼維護校園安全包括房子要濫用交通安全 鄰居安全等等還有包括學生生活他們的這個官階大概是中校以上嗎高中的話 少校 中校對啊 你少校是中階的軍官中間軍官你叫他去維護交通"},{"start":14289.882,"end":14313.15,"text":"是注意不是 他所做的事 他所做的就是軍事訓練嘛那你慢慢的這個校園安全包括這個安全相關的宣導並不是他們所學的專業嘛所以你未來要慢慢用專業的人去取代這個校園安全的這個人員嘛而不是說為了填補他們的工作中間你就找一個工作給他做"},{"start":14315.165,"end":14316.426,"text":"教育部長潘文忠列席"},{"start":14337.5,"end":14337.52,"text":"好 謝謝"},{"start":14364.511,"end":14364.711,"text":"徐新穎委員"},{"start":14381.295,"end":14407.876,"text":"徐委員好部長好雖然今天是您519以前最後一次來這裡但是因為您是政務官很多政策的問題本席還是要請教您當然也是同步希望我們教育部的同仁能夠重視我們地方的聲音首先第一個本席想請教您您知道軍公教從西元2000年以來到現在調興過幾次軍公教"},{"start":14410.978,"end":14413.64,"text":"但是我們的本土語文教學支援人員從2006年到現在調過幾次?"},{"start":14435.393,"end":14441.661,"text":"跟委員報告我比較掌握到的是110年那時候調整過一次所以2022條過一次所以這個部分會讓我們的語文教學資源人員會覺得說是不是"},{"start":14453.815,"end":14470.923,"text":"沒有制度化缺乏制度化等於是十幾年都沒有調心那我們看到就是2022年的時候因為有人在喊所以才調心所以這一塊是不是有可能制度化法制化"},{"start":14471.789,"end":14477.955,"text":"跟委員報告這個當然：尤其他們是屬於終點 他們領終點特別辛苦在目前公教條新的這個機制裡面他也確實有一些涵蓋的範圍跟對象我現在針對本土語言的教學資源"},{"start":14489.847,"end":14490.328,"text":"是不是可以制度化?"},{"start":14514.369,"end":14518.311,"text":"本土支援人力很辛苦,所以在一些配套的機制上,我們希望能夠制度化,但不能完全說比照,因為那個是有一個範圍﹖不一定比照,但是你要制度化,讓他才知道他有保障"},{"start":14535.68,"end":14560.054,"text":"接著本席想請教說我們臺灣都一直以來少子化可是為什麼呢都少子化了可是我們的教育資源好像還是越來越缺乏例如我們中央在本席第8屆擔任立委的時候那時候當然是馬英九總統執政的時候我們中央對地方很多很多的"},{"start":14561.114,"end":14587.786,"text":"金費的資源包括運動設備包括操場跑道包括音響設備資訊教學設備甚至當然我想您也知道校舍改建圖書館風雨球場還有這個活動中心等等到現在還是非常非常的缺乏那我們中央到底給地方的資源你們的準則是什麼"},{"start":14588.507,"end":14590.307,"text":"三千三百多億我現在想知道你們到底給地方的準則是什麼?"},{"start":14607.214,"end":14631.232,"text":"委員 這個在經費的補助都有各項的要點我剛才要講的是說 那個標準的作業要點我就不多說像學校操場 風雨圈 委員剛才你念的那一些幾乎都是這一年外加債 不是我們的教育預算這一年是哪一年 去年還是今年我說這幾年 委員知道嗎中小學的操場 我自己這幾年整修了將近一千所"},{"start":14632.313,"end":14648.479,"text":"那個概念都不是地方政府因為地方政府我知道財政也很有限像那個風雨球場這些我想這幾年改善非常多尤其委員知道那個斑斑有冷氣那幾十年都裝不來的也是在這幾年把它裝起來的所以"},{"start":14650.52,"end":14678.635,"text":"這些我自己在國教上也知道地方政府財政的限制所以跟行政院額外爭取的很多都是認為如果按照他們的資源可能再多少年都做不來連那個廁所啦那個孩子最在意的但是現在你沒有回答回答我的問題我時間已經沒有了就是你到底怎麼給的嗎沒有當他們你說你有一些要點對不對對啊那所以非常真的非常困難非常缺乏的都爭取得到嗎"},{"start":14679.255,"end":14687.546,"text":"委員如果以操場損壞程度越嚴重的只要限時列出來一定最優先活動中心這個議題我要比較嚴肅的說因為都是非常大的量體在整個補助上教育部不是以那個為優先"},{"start":14696.113,"end":14704.497,"text":"那資訊教學設備跟相關的一些運動設備呢這些當然都是優先方向目的都優先方向所以希望能夠重視地方的聲音那最後最後你說了斑斑有冷氣可是你們民進黨漲電價讓斑斑不敢開冷氣這一塊你這個斑斑有冷氣你電價漲成這樣讓學校斑斑不敢開冷氣所以呢我們希望不要我們希望動漲"},{"start":14725.808,"end":14731.99,"text":"這次的電費是我們一般性補償的指定項目如果電費有所調漲這個額度也會增加它只要在我們上課時間所規範的這個電費不會由家長學生出對 絕對不要讓我們的學子少子化 我們好好的教育給我們這麼少的這些幼苗給他們最好的教育環境"},{"start":14755.975,"end":14767.331,"text":"蘇清泉委員 蘇清泉委員 蘇清泉委員鄭振前委員 鄭振前委員 鄭振前委員林楚英委員 林楚英委員 林楚英委員"},{"start":14768.472,"end":14782.485,"text":"賴仕寶委員：好那今天登記質詢的委員均已發言完畢另外有陳秀寶委員提出書面質詢關於今天的會議呢本席做以下的決定報告質詢導完畢"},{"start":14784.807,"end":14800.985,"text":"委員所提的書面質詢或是相關的資料都要列入記錄並且刊登公報那對於委員質詢要求提供相關資料或是未及答覆的部分請相關機關盡數以書面來答覆另外本席額外增加一個決定我們現在為我們潘部長大家拍手來謝謝他"},{"start":14802.406,"end":14818.81,"text":"多的一個努力謝謝部長謝謝希望未來還有機會不是在這個地方而是在很多我們臺灣的很多教育的現場能夠再看到你的現身影謝謝報告委員會我們今天議程處理完畢現在散會謝謝各位"},{"start":14835.359,"end":14835.539,"text":"主席"},{"start":14848.729,"end":14849.149,"text":"委員會主席響鐘"},{"start":14871.988,"end":14899.974,"text":"1、2、3、4、5、6、7、8、9、10"},{"start":14937.698,"end":14938.479,"text":"委員會主席"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}