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本席邀請我們交通部陳部長還有我們觀光署周署長部長我先提一個問題給部長參考一下我們觀光署在推鐵道觀光其實我看起來有一點成效"},{"start":28.564,"end":47.27,"text":"而且應該會越來越好因為這是一個新型態的旅遊那台灣其實鐵道的歷史非常悠久那也有很多的鐵道迷那你現在玩這種鐵道我看有幾條路線開出來去年一年"},{"start":48.564,"end":73.34,"text":"因為目前大概我覺得應該有破20萬人因為山南號就最後一個花蓮漢池上我沒有寫上人數是這個統計數字還沒有給我所以大概一年已經有超過20萬人今年應該會更好吧今年一定會更好而且我看公共組很像有一個案子在主推鐵道旅遊節今年會推鐵道旅遊節那可不可以拜託推一下台南"},{"start":76.913,"end":86.768,"text":"署長 這裡鐵道啊這裡環島之心啊 什麼明日號啦 藍皮節優號 海豐號 福生號 三藍號沒有一條線有停台纜"},{"start":90.103,"end":116.41,"text":"針對這種觀光列車的部分大概台鐵他們有一個一套計畫那但是如果說觀光的部分的話我們會扛鐵跟那個沿鐵啊我覺得那個部分應該很有鐵道迷對台南是台灣鐵道文化的歷史重鎮是包括那個車站也是很重要是台灣最古老的火車站嘛那台南的鐵路啊就台鐵在台南一共有14個車站"},{"start":118.307,"end":135.764,"text":"像後壁、新林、善化、永康、台南等等保安啦國定古蹟就是台南火車站,台南車站市定古蹟就是剛那個保安車站那總經理嘛,感謝總經理那歷史建築物就是後壁還有林鳳營車站"},{"start":138.064,"end":163.871,"text":"那另外再加上一些支線好像台塘的五分車路線新營道柳營的八翁線後壁歐秋南的新港東線那麼多的鐵道觀光資源台鐵為什麼把台南挑過去報告委員我們了解台南地區周邊地區很多相關的文化觀光旅遊的一個豐富的資產"},{"start":164.671,"end":185.723,"text":"所以我們明日號還有明日廚房跟我們的三藍海豐號每半年我們都會檢討行程都沒有檢討到台南為什麼不停不要挑怪我的問題你知道我要問什麼嘛拜託一下輔導或者推廣推動一下保護員"},{"start":186.744,"end":205.079,"text":"介紹來台南庭我們結合六七八月觀光署有一個鐵道旅遊節那台鐵這邊其實已經有規劃了就是明日號在六月份會走台南明日號六月份可以停台南了喔對 停台南只有一條明日號啊真的沒辦法 要記住了"},{"start":206.36,"end":234.74,"text":"後續我們還有山南海豐我們都會動態來做一個檢討因為把台南地區把它納入我們你說什麼號 山南號山南跟海豐讓台南豐富的鐵道歷史應該 我相信這個我們好好來推廣 這個絕對有吸引力好不好而且台南還有唐鐵對 我們還有唐鐵啊就我剛剛跟部長分享嘛整體的鐵道旅遊節也會結合唐鐵的部分"},{"start":235.14,"end":263.205,"text":"湯田那五文車喔,你如果營業多一點台灣現在很少了啦台湯那五文車喔,就是新娘到女娘的八王線啦另外後面那新港東線,就非常有趣啦好不好,是不是大家來結合一下打造我們台南的古都觀光列車裡面那個鐵道把它拉進來另外啊,不是只有陸地的鐵道啦"},{"start":264.138,"end":288.873,"text":"海上也一樣我們看一下我們台南的現在郵輪我已經在這邊喊話很多次了現在大概郵輪去年停靠台南的是零今年好像預估也是零那你國際郵輪不來就算了現在連國內的航線台南也是零為什麼會這樣"},{"start":291.862,"end":313.943,"text":"在今年啦 今年有一個觀光會議這個不錯啦至少我們好像觀光署有召開一個全國的觀光會議嘛讓各縣市政府把他們的觀光的需求提出來這個我要肯定周署長我們去辦這樣的一個全國觀光大會上台南市政府就特別提出國內的航線是不是請觀光"},{"start":315.124,"end":335.398,"text":"交通部來幫忙再恢復台南馬宮航線台南到馬宮委員在說是台南到馬宮的部分啦這個是台南市政府在觀光會議上我們請航港局來協助這個部分大家來溝通一下那目前是布袋啦布袋走馬宮這條航線是有的那我們來思考一下台南的部分怎麼來增加因為"},{"start":337.052,"end":356.059,"text":"現在國際郵輪人數大概恢復到疫前的就是COVID-19前的85%了就是坐國際郵輪來台灣的旅客但國內航線的旅客數已經超越疫情之前了那台南都還零"},{"start":356.599,"end":381.536,"text":"保護員其實我剛剛聽署長在說很像台南市政府也願意幫忙出一些錢讓我們一起結合起來來爭取這個航線因為他們希望能夠567配合那個花火節所以他們希望能夠加大力道來把台南跟馬宮這個航線把它串起來我覺得這個計畫還不錯重要就對就是一個定期航線嘛"},{"start":382.296,"end":384.458,"text":"另外港務公司去年也說過去國際郵輪展在推銷台灣的時候應該要把台南納進來"},{"start":404.532,"end":433.355,"text":"尤其那個國際的那個大展像那個邁阿密的遊輪展要積極去招商啦那你是有跟台南...我跟委員報告邁阿密現在在...正在那個邁阿密遊輪展我們有派員去全球的遊輪展正在邁阿密那去...往年的話就是我們找那個民政世界啦有跟台南市政府談就是我們也推銷就是美食還有就是一些它的古蹟啦"},{"start":434.116,"end":452.55,"text":"但是他們評估以後就沒有下文但是我們還持續在努力那今年的話我們大概五六月那個我們總經理他會到日本去希望能夠因為日本對台南這邊也有一些親切感希望能夠拉一些那我們所有的場戰我們都準備好了"},{"start":453.24,"end":480.796,"text":"好 這個基本上在這種行銷的推廣上那我們地方政府也需要中央的一個幫忙因為同時我們也看到說鄒書長前幾天有一個新聞就是公安署有統計到國內旅遊天數就國人啊國人在排國內旅遊的平均天數大概只有一點不到一天半那幾乎國內旅遊都是當天往返"},{"start":482.036,"end":502.41,"text":"所以到後來就說那我們是不是應該要推動啊讓國人旅遊可以有留宿至少要住一個晚上嘛那如果來推動這個當然我看這個問題很久但是都沒有人去碰觸啦有的人不願意再過夜是因為覺得第一他國人旅遊排的大部分都是假日"},{"start":504.213,"end":522.927,"text":"當他在假日的時候在台灣國內旅遊偏偏假日的住宿 那個金額都嚇死人比較貴 假日比較貴 平日其實蠻便宜的都是很貴 很可怕的貴這些都是以倍數 甚至好幾倍這種不合理的一種狀態像這種狀況 你不解決 就會惡性循環"},{"start":526.465,"end":543.325,"text":"大家就國內旅遊都一天就趕快解決就當天去當天回來那這樣就失去了國內旅遊推動它最重要的嘛你當然你在那邊住一晚你一定是多消費這必然那為什麼這個問題講了那麼久都沒辦法解決呢"},{"start":545.585,"end":567.76,"text":"報告委員有沒有什麼方式台灣目前的交通的狀況尤其是高鐵大家很習慣搭之後很多人確實是習慣一日遊那一日遊已經佔了百分之七十幾的比例其實很高那我們觀光署也在努力希望大家能夠留宿那也就是我們未來辦的活動我們會希望盡量辦在晚上讓大家例如說我從台北到了台南"},{"start":568.18,"end":584.501,"text":"那因為要參加活動是晚上你就一定會留宿嘛或者是像一些演唱會經濟也是這個概念它是晚上的活動那你必然要在那個都市裡面留宿一晚那我們會來調整這個活動的時間過去就是早上比較多那未來我們希望夜間的這個活動要多一些"},{"start":584.901,"end":604.49,"text":"但是你那個台灣住宿價格那麼高的問題這個這個確實也是個現象啊你不覺得嗎 署長是是是你不會覺得我們的價值是怎樣其實這個跟那個地價稅 房屋稅都有關係因為我們那個地方政府是不是啦 它是平日假日的價差啦對對 他們那次還是用這個什麼地價稅 你現在在說什麼啦"},{"start":605.831,"end":630.521,"text":"假日的部分是比較高 對因為它有一個大概我們算起來大概百分之三十啦當然就旅館業者說因為我平常碰到這裡沒人客沒有可能我整個就是禮拜五禮拜六啊但是有時候你就是殺雞取卵啦你價格 價格飆那麼高那根本沒有人去啊那你不能太不合理啦這實際上有沒有有沒有那個價格定價"},{"start":632.603,"end":646.4,"text":"確實有那個烘台價格的那個狀況還是要注意一下還是要補導業者對那個因為一般旅館他在掛牌上市那我再請問一下有沒有因為價格太高到目前為止受處罰的案例"},{"start":647.602,"end":668.653,"text":"他們都沒有超過他的標價他們都是用標價來降低來販售平日打折的折數比較多平日就是照標價平東就有個案例啊平常800後來賣了7000多10倍那個直接取締了那直接取締我覺得跟你說像這種狀況你還是要有一定的資本有有那直接取締而且我們重罰平東縣政府直接重罰15萬"},{"start":670.024,"end":673.146,"text":"如果國內旅遊都是一天玩板 那國內觀光怎麼擠得來來匆匆 去匆匆啊好不好喔 謝謝部長 謝謝署長"}]},"gazette":{"lineno":476,"blocks":[["林委員俊憲：（10時18分）感謝主席，本席邀請交通部陳部長。"],["主席：請部長。"],["林委員俊憲：還有觀光署的周署長。"],["陳部長世凱：委員好。"],["林委員俊憲：部長好。部長，我今天要提幾個問題給部長參考一下。"],["陳部長世凱：好。"],["林委員俊憲：就提觀光署在推鐵道觀光，其實我看起來有一點成效，而且應該會越來越好，因為這是一個新型態的旅遊。臺灣其實鐵道的歷史非常悠久，也有很多的鐵道迷，像現在玩這種鐵道，我看有幾條路線開出來了，去年一整年我覺得應該有破20萬人，我在最後山嵐號花蓮到池上這個部分沒有寫上人數，主要是因為還沒有給我這個統計數字，所以大概一年已經有超過20萬人，今年應該會更好吧？"],["陳部長世凱：今年一定會更好，而且我看觀光署有一個案子在主推，就是鐵道旅遊節，在今年會推鐵道旅遊節。"],["林委員俊憲：署長，那可不可以拜託推一下臺南？"],["周署長永暉：有啦！"],["林委員俊憲：像環島之星、鳴日號、藍皮解憂號、海風號、福森號、山嵐號，沒有一條線有停臺南，為什麼？"],["周署長永暉：針對這種觀光列車的部分，臺鐵他們有一套計畫，但是如果是觀光的部分，我們有糖鐵和鹽鐵，我覺得那個部分應該很有鐵道迷的……"],["林委員俊憲：這個計畫沒有臺南嗎？因為臺南是臺灣鐵道文化的歷史重鎮。"],["周署長永暉：是，包括那個車站也是很重要。"],["林委員俊憲：臺南火車站是臺灣最古老的火車站嘛！"],["周署長永暉：是。"],["林委員俊憲：臺鐵在臺南段一共有14個車站，像後壁、新營、善化、永康、臺南等等，還有保安，國定古蹟就是臺南車站，市定古蹟就是保安車站。你是臺鐵的總經理嗎？"],["馮總經理輝昇：對。"],["林委員俊憲：那歷史建築物就是後壁還有林鳳營車站，另外再加上一些支線，像台糖的五分車路線，從新營到柳營的八翁線，還有後壁到烏樹林的新港東線，有那麼多的鐵道觀光資源，那臺鐵為什麼把臺南跳過去？"],["馮總經理輝昇：報告委員，我們了解臺南周邊地區有很多相關的文化，有豐富的觀光旅遊資產，所以我們對鳴日號、鳴日廚房、山嵐號跟海風號每半年都會檢討行程……"],["林委員俊憲：都沒有檢討為什麼沒有停臺南嗎？不要跳過我的問題啦！"],["馮總經理輝昇：我們在6月……"],["林委員俊憲：你知道我要問什麼嘛！"],["馮總經理輝昇：知道。"],["林委員俊憲：拜託你們輔導、推廣或推動一下，介紹然後讓這些路線能夠停臺南。"],["陳部長世凱：報告委員，我們結合6、7、8月觀光署的鐵道旅遊節，那臺鐵這邊其實已經有規劃了，就是鳴日號在6月會走臺南。"],["林委員俊憲：好，鳴日號6月份可以停臺南了。"],["陳部長世凱：對。"],["馮總經理輝昇：停臺南站。"],["林委員俊憲：只有一條鳴日號嗎？不能多幾條路線嗎？"],["馮總經理輝昇：後續還有山嵐號、海風號，我們都會動態來做一個檢討，一定會把臺南地區納入。"],["林委員俊憲：你說什麼號？是山嵐號嗎？"],["陳部長世凱：山嵐號跟海風號。"],["林委員俊憲：好，臺南有豐富的鐵道歷史，我們要好好來推廣，這個絕對有吸引力，好不好？"],["馮總經理輝昇：好。"],["陳部長世凱：而且臺南還有糖鐵。"],["林委員俊憲：對，我們還有糖鐵，就是我剛剛跟部長分享的。"],["陳部長世凱：所以整體的鐵道旅遊節也會結合糖鐵的部分。"],["林委員俊憲：你有空的可以去坐糖鐵的五分車，現在在臺灣已經很少了，我們說的台糖五分車就是從新營到柳營的八翁線，另外就是後壁到烏樹林的新港東線，都非常有趣，是不是請大家來結合一下打造我們臺南的古都觀光列車，把這個鐵道納進來？"],["陳部長世凱：好。"],["林委員俊憲：另外，不是只有陸地的鐵道，海上也一樣，我們看一下臺南現在的郵輪，我已經在這邊喊話很多次了，去年停靠臺南的郵輪航次是零，今年的預估好像也是零，國際郵輪不來就算了，現在連國內航線臺南也是零，為什麼會這樣？今年有一個觀光會議，這個不錯，至少觀光署有召開一個全國的觀光會議，讓各縣市政府把他們的觀光需求提出來，我要肯定周署長辦理這樣一個全國觀光大會，臺南市政府就特別提出國內航線，是不是請交通部來幫忙恢復臺南馬公航線？"],["陳部長世凱：委員在說的是臺南到馬公的部分。"],["林委員俊憲：這是臺南市政府在觀光會議上……"],["陳部長世凱：我們請航港局來協助這個部分，大家來溝通一下，目前布袋走馬公這條航線是有的，我們來思考一下臺南的部分怎麼增加。"],["林委員俊憲：因為現在國際郵輪人數大概恢復到疫前、COVID-19前的85%，就是坐國際郵輪來臺灣的旅客，但國內航線的旅客數已經超越疫情之前，臺南都還是零。"],["陳部長世凱：報告委員，其實我剛剛聽署長說好像臺南市政府也願意幫忙出一些錢，我們一起結合起來爭取這個航線。"],["周署長永暉：對，他們希望能夠5、6、7月配合花火節，所以他們希望能夠加大力道來把臺南跟馬公這條航線串起來，我覺得這個計畫還不錯。"],["林委員俊憲：重要的就是一個定期航線，部長，是不是也請航港局、觀光署幫忙推動一下？"],["陳部長世凱：我來跟航港局這邊溝通一下，目前航港局好像還沒同意，我來跟他們溝通。"],["林委員俊憲：另外，去年也說過了，港務公司去參加國際郵輪展在推銷臺灣的時候，應該要把臺南納進來，尤其是國際大展，像邁阿密郵輪展，你們要積極去招商，你有沒有把我們臺南納進去宣傳一下？"],["李董事長賢義：跟委員報告，現在正在舉行邁阿密郵輪展，我們有派員去。"],["陳部長世凱：全球的郵輪展正在邁阿密。"],["李董事長賢義：往年我們是有找名勝世界跟臺南市政府談，我們也推銷美食還有一些古蹟，但是他們評估以後就沒有下文，我們還持續在努力。今年5、6月我們的王總經理會到日本去，因為日本對臺南這邊也有一些親切感，希望能夠拉一些，我們所有的場站都準備好了。"],["林委員俊憲：基本上，在行銷推廣上，地方政府也需要中央的幫忙，同時我也看到前幾天的一個新聞，觀光署有統計國內旅遊天數，國人安排國內旅遊的平均天數大概只有一點多天，不到一天半，國內旅遊幾乎都是當天往返，後來有說我們是不是應該要推動讓國人旅遊可以有留宿的機會，至少要住一個晚上，如何來推動，我看這個問題很久了，但是都沒有人去碰觸。有的人不願意過夜是因為覺得國內旅遊大部分都是安排在假日，當他假日在臺灣國內旅遊的時候，偏偏假日的住宿金額都嚇死人。"],["陳部長世凱：假日比較貴，平日其實滿便宜。"],["林委員俊憲：假日都很貴，很可怕的貴，甚至都是好幾倍這種不合理的狀態，像這種狀況不解決就會惡性循環，造成大家在國內旅遊都一天就趕快解決，當天去、當天回來，這樣就失去了推動國內旅遊最重要的目的，你在那邊住一晚一定是多消費，這是必然的，為什麼這個問題講了那麼久都沒辦法解決呢？有沒有什麼方式？"],["陳部長世凱：報告委員，臺灣目前的交通狀況，尤其是高鐵，大家很習慣搭乘之後，很多人確實是習慣一日遊，一日遊已經占了百分之七十幾的比例，其實很高，觀光署也在努力，希望大家能夠留宿。所以我們會希望未來辦的活動儘量辦在晚上，例如大家從臺北到臺南因為要參加的活動是晚上，你就一定會留宿，或是像一些演唱會經濟也是這個概念，它是晚上的活動，所以你必然要在那個都市裡面留宿一晚，我們會調整活動的時間，過去都是早上比較多，未來我們希望夜間的活動要多一些。"],["林委員俊憲：但是臺灣住宿價格那麼高的問題，這個確實也是個現象，你不覺得嗎？"],["陳部長世凱：是。"],["林委員俊憲：署長，你不覺得假日住宿價格有問題？"],["周署長永暉：其實這個跟地價稅、房屋稅都有關係，因為地方政府……"],["林委員俊憲：不是啦！這是平日假日的價差。"],["周署長永暉：對。"],["林委員俊憲：什麼地價稅，你現在在說什麼？"],["周署長永暉：假日的部分是比較高，我們算起來大概是30%。"],["林委員俊憲：這個太不合理了吧！當然有旅館業者說因為他們平常沒有客人。"],["陳部長世凱：是，這是成本和供需的問題。"],["林委員俊憲：平日沒有客人，他只能做禮拜五、禮拜六，但是有時候就是殺雞取卵，你的價格在假日飆那麼高，根本就沒有人去，所以你不能太不合理，實際上有沒有價格定價確實有哄抬價格的狀況，還是要注意一下，還是要輔導業者。"],["陳部長世凱：好。"],["周署長永暉：因為一般旅館在掛牌上都是地方政府在處理。"],["林委員俊憲：我再請教到目前為止，有沒有因為價格太高受處罰的案例？"],["周署長永暉：他們都沒有超過它的標價，他們都是用標價來降低販售。"],["陳部長世凱：平日打折的折數比較多，假日就是照標價。"],["林委員俊憲：你亂講！屏東就有個案例，平常800，後來賣到七千多，是10倍。"],["周署長永暉：那個直接取締了。"],["林委員俊憲：對，我就是要跟你說，像這種狀況你還是要有一定的執法。"],["周署長永暉：有，那個直接取締，而且屏東縣政府直接重罰15萬。"],["林委員俊憲：如果國內旅遊都是一天往返，國內觀光怎麼振興得起來，大家都來匆匆、去匆匆，對不對？謝謝部長、謝謝署長。"],["陳部長世凱：謝謝委員。"],["主席：等一下廖先翔委員發言完休息10分鐘。","現在請魯明哲委員。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":160,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-23-6","speakers":["許智傑","洪孟楷","李昆澤","何欣純","黃健豪","林俊憲","魯明哲","廖先翔","陳素月","林國成","陳雪生","徐富癸","邱若華","蔡其昌","游顥","楊瓊瓔","黃建賓","莊瑞雄","盧縣一","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","王育敏","陳冠廷","劉建國","王義川","林倩綺"],"page_start":61,"meetingDate":["2025-04-09"],"gazette_id":"1143601","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1143601_00003"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期交通委員會第6次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、邀請交通部部長陳世凱就「如何推動國際旅客來台觀光」及「提升國際機場量能與服務品質\n及增闢國際線航點航班之作為」進行專題報告，並備質詢；二、處理113年度中央政府總預算附\n屬單位預算關於交通部主管預算凍結案計46案；三、審查人民請願文書共12案","agenda_id":"1143601_00002"}}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}