{"error":false,"id":["160431"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":160431,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/160431","日期":"2025-04-22","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"院會-11-3-8","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第3會期第8次會議","屆":11,"會期":3,"會次":8,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"院會","標題":"第11屆第3會期第8次會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2025-04-22T09:01:18+08:00","結束時間":"2025-04-22T09:17:35+08:00","影片長度":"00:16:17","支援功能":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/dfcb33c81b5f4f3f8708063d4aad743e75b01fba8380de05fb326c0d1c12ee0f4001ca9689ad817b5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"林國成","委員發言時間":"09:01:18 - 09:17:35","會議時間":"2025-04-22T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"第11屆第3會期第8次會議（事由：一、對行政院院長提出施政方針及施政報告繼續質詢。二、4月18日上午9時至10時為國是論壇時間。三、4月22日下午2時15分至2時30分為處理臨時提案時間。）","transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":19.16721875,"end":20.26409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":21.22596875,"end":23.58846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":24.02721875,"end":25.22534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":29.12346875,"end":31.317218750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":31.317218750000002,"end":32.51534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":35.36721875,"end":37.30784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":36.987218750000004,"end":38.134718750000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":37.34159375,"end":37.35846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":41.66159375,"end":52.44471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":52.799093750000004,"end":53.963468750000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":53.507843750000006,"end":54.09846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":54.368468750000005,"end":54.790343750000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":55.87034375,"end":59.27909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":60.190343750000004,"end":60.86534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":60.96659375,"end":62.62034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":63.227843750000005,"end":64.08846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":64.34159375,"end":68.32409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":68.79659375,"end":70.73721875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":70.93971875,"end":72.22221875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":73.38659375,"end":82.06034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":82.43159375,"end":82.93784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":83.62971875000001,"end":84.54096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":85.38471875,"end":87.71346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":88.40534375,"end":89.90721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":90.37971875000001,"end":91.81409375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":92.03346875000001,"end":93.31596875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":93.77159375000001,"end":95.37471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":95.93159375,"end":99.28971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":99.72846875,"end":104.03159375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":104.53784375000001,"end":105.46596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":106.20846875000001,"end":106.78221875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":107.27159375000001,"end":109.81971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":110.49471875,"end":111.16971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":111.49034375000001,"end":112.63784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":113.51534375000001,"end":116.43471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":117.70034375,"end":127.82534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":128.68596875,"end":130.44096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":131.11596875,"end":132.71909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":133.14096875,"end":133.81596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":134.50784375,"end":140.32971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":140.63346875000002,"end":145.35846875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":145.67909375000002,"end":146.92784375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":147.38346875000002,"end":148.56471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":148.75034375,"end":150.96096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":151.36596875,"end":152.51346875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":153.10409375,"end":157.72784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":158.08221875,"end":163.11096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":163.36409375000002,"end":167.17784375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":167.43096875,"end":175.54784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":175.96971875,"end":177.47159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":178.43346875,"end":179.22659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":179.85096875000002,"end":181.53846875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":182.44971875000002,"end":183.09096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":183.71534375000002,"end":185.52096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":185.87534375,"end":188.99721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":189.21659375000002,"end":191.39346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":191.68034375000002,"end":197.09721875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":198.61596875,"end":199.35846875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":199.69596875000002,"end":200.52284375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":200.87721875000003,"end":202.17659375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":202.83471875,"end":205.14659375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":205.65284375000002,"end":206.90159375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":207.28971875000002,"end":208.77471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":209.11221875,"end":210.09096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":210.19221875000002,"end":211.94721875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":212.33534375000002,"end":216.80721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":212.74034375000002,"end":213.56721875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":215.87909375,"end":216.87471875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":216.97596875000002,"end":217.00971875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":217.00971875000002,"end":218.15721875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":217.04346875000002,"end":220.75596875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":218.61284375000002,"end":218.78159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":221.24534375000002,"end":222.83159375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":223.21971875000003,"end":227.10096875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":227.42159375000003,"end":229.12596875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":229.46346875,"end":230.94846875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":230.99909375000001,"end":236.19659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":236.77034375000002,"end":239.33534375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":239.70659375000002,"end":241.42784375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":241.83284375000002,"end":243.79034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":244.26284375,"end":252.41346875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":252.76784375000003,"end":256.88534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":257.59409375,"end":259.73721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":259.93971875,"end":260.74971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":261.22221875,"end":261.66096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":262.18409375000005,"end":262.97721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":263.60159375,"end":265.12034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":265.42409375,"end":266.65596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":268.37721875,"end":268.93409375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":269.60909375,"end":271.07721875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":271.95471875000004,"end":272.91659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":273.30471875,"end":274.48596875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":275.44784375,"end":277.00034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":277.81034375,"end":287.22659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":288.22221875,"end":291.34409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":291.52971875000003,"end":292.03596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":292.72784375000003,"end":297.73971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":296.77784375000005,"end":302.07659375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":302.86971875,"end":303.56159375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":304.27034375,"end":305.77221875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":306.14346875,"end":313.87221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":314.07471875000005,"end":318.54659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":314.34471875,"end":314.90159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":318.85034375000004,"end":334.20659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":327.79409375,"end":328.53659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":329.38034375,"end":329.70096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":330.83159375,"end":332.19846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":333.73409375,"end":334.81409375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":335.37096875000003,"end":338.07096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":338.69534375,"end":352.09409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":352.58346875,"end":353.79846875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":353.89971875000003,"end":364.31159375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":364.59846875000005,"end":366.84284375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":367.07909375,"end":372.59721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":372.96846875,"end":374.40284375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":375.83721875000003,"end":376.57971875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":377.28846875000005,"end":378.65534375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":379.26284375,"end":380.32596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":380.98409375,"end":381.67596875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":382.18221875,"end":388.69596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":389.37096875000003,"end":397.47096875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":398.38221875000005,"end":401.45346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":402.36471875,"end":403.52909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":404.76096875,"end":407.03909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":407.27534375000005,"end":409.99221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":410.61659375000005,"end":412.33784375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":413.16471875,"end":414.10971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":414.66659375,"end":417.60284375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":418.04159375,"end":419.69534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":420.01596875,"end":424.90971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":425.46659375,"end":425.51721875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":425.51721875000004,"end":426.15846875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":427.01909375,"end":430.34346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":431.64284375000005,"end":435.33846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":435.89534375000005,"end":436.92471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":435.97971875,"end":438.42659375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":438.17346875000004,"end":438.44346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":438.89909375,"end":441.10971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":440.06346875,"end":440.77221875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":442.00409375000004,"end":442.51034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":442.71284375000005,"end":443.89409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":444.68721875000006,"end":446.57721875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":447.31971875000005,"end":449.46284375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":449.64846875,"end":451.77471875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":451.82534375,"end":453.44534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":453.73221875,"end":454.98096875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":455.84159375,"end":460.31346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":460.76909375,"end":466.10159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":466.30409375000005,"end":470.55659375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":470.87721875000005,"end":483.22971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":483.83721875000003,"end":486.77346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":487.12784375,"end":488.05596875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":488.46096875,"end":488.73096875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":489.25409375000004,"end":491.66721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":492.07221875000005,"end":492.83159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":493.38846875,"end":494.75534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":495.10971875,"end":496.07159375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":496.45971875000004,"end":497.33721875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":498.53534375000004,"end":499.41284375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":500.13846875,"end":501.62346875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":501.85971875,"end":503.09159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":503.27721875000003,"end":504.74534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":505.45409375,"end":505.75784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":506.98971875,"end":509.20034375000006},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":510.12846875,"end":512.03534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":512.6259687500001,"end":513.4697187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":513.6553437499999,"end":517.6884687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":518.22846875,"end":519.44346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":520.59096875,"end":523.9153437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":522.85221875,"end":526.07534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":524.0672187499999,"end":524.69159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":526.3959687500001,"end":530.1928437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":531.1884687500001,"end":537.02721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":537.02721875,"end":538.3603437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":538.88346875,"end":543.11909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":543.4734687499999,"end":547.15221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":548.2153437500001,"end":549.4978437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":551.52284375,"end":551.97846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":553.93596875,"end":557.4797187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":557.00721875,"end":559.43721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":559.97721875,"end":559.99409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":559.99409375,"end":560.78721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":560.4497187500001,"end":561.10784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":561.4284687500001,"end":564.02721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":564.5165937500001,"end":566.86221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":567.6047187500001,"end":569.8490937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":570.54096875,"end":576.5990937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":577.15596875,"end":588.96846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":577.3078437500001,"end":577.40909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":587.26409375,"end":588.20909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":589.47471875,"end":589.52534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":589.52534375,"end":589.6772187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":589.6772187500001,"end":589.9640937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":589.9640937500001,"end":592.42784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":590.1497187500001,"end":590.79096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":592.7822187500001,"end":594.3347187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":594.4697187500001,"end":598.18221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":597.65909375,"end":600.0047187499999},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":600.29159375,"end":600.44346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":600.47721875,"end":608.1553437499999},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":608.47596875,"end":609.33659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":609.58971875,"end":612.9140937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":613.53846875,"end":616.50846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":617.16659375,"end":621.53721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":621.9084687500001,"end":623.8490937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":624.1359687500001,"end":625.4353437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":625.9584687500001,"end":627.29159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":627.6965937500001,"end":631.7634687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":628.99596875,"end":635.32409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":632.5734687500001,"end":633.06284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":633.8728437500001,"end":634.5647187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":635.1384687500001,"end":642.5972187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":643.1203437500001,"end":644.50409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":644.62221875,"end":646.29284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":647.27159375,"end":648.68909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":649.0265937500001,"end":651.10221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":651.62534375,"end":652.8234687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":654.02159375,"end":654.8147187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":656.14784375,"end":656.7890937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":657.1940937500001,"end":659.6072187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":660.4340937500001,"end":661.22721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":661.37909375,"end":662.72909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":663.1172187500001,"end":665.7834687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":666.3740937500002,"end":673.14096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":673.3772187500001,"end":674.3390937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":674.55846875,"end":675.53721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":675.7903437500001,"end":677.24159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":677.51159375,"end":680.2790937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":680.8190937500001,"end":682.2365937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":683.26596875,"end":683.9578437499999},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":684.41346875,"end":686.97846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":686.97846875,"end":687.65346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":687.9909687500001,"end":692.42909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":692.69909375,"end":699.75284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":696.4622187500001,"end":699.07784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":699.3815937500001,"end":700.02284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":700.27596875,"end":712.37534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":712.40909375,"end":717.72471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":718.3997187500001,"end":720.0365937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":718.45034375,"end":719.9353437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":720.0365937500001,"end":720.0703437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":720.0703437500001,"end":720.6272187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":720.6272187500001,"end":720.6440937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":720.7959687500002,"end":721.2178437500002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":721.2178437500002,"end":721.96034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":721.25159375,"end":721.8759687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":722.2978437500001,"end":730.97159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":728.59221875,"end":729.16596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":730.97159375,"end":736.72596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":733.1653437500001,"end":741.5690937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":736.9284687500001,"end":737.29971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":740.0503437500001,"end":740.8772187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":741.78846875,"end":742.8347187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":742.93596875,"end":743.93159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":744.5390937500001,"end":745.3490937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":746.12534375,"end":748.0322187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":748.9265937499999,"end":749.83784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":750.8672187500001,"end":756.0984687499999},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":756.72284375,"end":758.4440937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":759.10221875,"end":759.65909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":760.48596875,"end":762.59534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":762.73034375,"end":771.03284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":763.7934687500001,"end":765.16034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":770.05409375,"end":773.73284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":771.5222187500001,"end":771.85971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":772.83846875,"end":773.6484687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":774.17159375,"end":779.74034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":778.06971875,"end":779.6728437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":779.74034375,"end":779.75721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":779.75721875,"end":779.87534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":779.87534375,"end":779.89221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":779.89221875,"end":779.90909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":779.90909375,"end":781.69784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":780.71909375,"end":785.56221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":786.0178437500001,"end":789.8147187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":790.30409375,"end":794.84346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":795.4678437500002,"end":797.4084687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":797.88096875,"end":800.2265937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":800.8172187500002,"end":802.42034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":803.66909375,"end":805.0190937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":805.39034375,"end":805.66034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":805.8290937500001,"end":807.73596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":809.45721875,"end":809.8115937500002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":810.7397187500001,"end":811.6003437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":812.07284375,"end":813.3215937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":813.52409375,"end":817.5403437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":818.26596875,"end":820.29096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":821.42159375,"end":824.03721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":824.45909375,"end":825.6572187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":826.3659687500001,"end":828.7790937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":828.98159375,"end":834.87096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":836.2040937500001,"end":840.4734687500002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":840.54096875,"end":847.10534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":847.6284687500001,"end":855.17159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":855.44159375,"end":868.78971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":869.3972187500001,"end":869.92034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":870.07221875,"end":870.8484687500002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":871.1184687500001,"end":873.66659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":874.1728437500001,"end":878.62784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":879.1172187500001,"end":879.7078437500002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":879.99471875,"end":892.56659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":893.49471875,"end":894.40596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":895.2834687500001,"end":902.9953437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":903.63659375,"end":909.12096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":909.27284375,"end":912.34409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":912.4453437500001,"end":920.8828437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":915.90471875,"end":916.42784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":917.5247187500001,"end":920.5959687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":921.0178437500001,"end":923.76846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":924.30846875,"end":926.18159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":926.3503437500001,"end":937.0828437500002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":937.84221875,"end":947.96721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":947.96721875,"end":953.4853437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":948.22034375,"end":949.48596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":953.5359687500002,"end":957.0290937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":963.01971875,"end":963.57659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":963.96471875,"end":967.4578437500002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":967.8797187500002,"end":968.1497187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":969.9553437500001,"end":974.2922187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":975.8615937500001,"end":976.21596875}],"whisperx":[{"start":19.192,"end":37.537,"text":"好謝謝院長請我們行政院卓院長麻煩請卓院長備詢另外請我們內政部麻煩請內政部備詢陸委會的邱主委麻煩請陸委會備詢"},{"start":42.147,"end":58.618,"text":"時間暫停 林委員那我們就是最多就是三位因為我們的硬體設備就是這樣 好嗎好 如果您想其他的部長我們再請這邊的部長下去換一個 好不好好 時間開始 麻煩請林委員林委員好好 院長 主委還有部長大家早"},{"start":60.253,"end":87.303,"text":"我想卓院長一向我個人跟你就任到現在520到現在我說實在我看得出來啦你是非常無奈以我了解過去的卓榮泰確確實實有所無奈的在做中華民國的行政院院長當然我們看得出來本黨一向包括我在內"},{"start":88.479,"end":116.192,"text":"理性務實科學我們絕對不會因為人而來拗任何事情有多少證據講多少話有什麼事情我們也會多體會執政者的苦處我也知道 院長你對最近的內政問題確實千頭萬細對於大罷免你也非常無奈"},{"start":117.745,"end":133.57,"text":"對於關稅的問題 當前現在所有的錢民 大家非常關注的關稅問題這也就是一句話 大國任性 小國忍受"},{"start":134.694,"end":151.45,"text":"這些東西本來就是很無奈所以我也知道你雖然做了中華民國的行政院長但是確實有很多無奈的事情但是院長我說實在的我特別還是要鼓勵和勉勵你"},{"start":153.172,"end":176.391,"text":"真的有些事情要面對問題解決問題真的因為你現在所有的行政院長當中我在做比較你的人品是好的很但是你現在做出來的事情確實是讓人民非常無奈我必須提供一個資訊給院長做參總因為這些關稅問題"},{"start":182.486,"end":192.931,"text":"你知道你的民調下7%嗎所以這個提供給你做參考那我在想我時間給院長30秒的時間針對這些你認同我這些說謊嗎確實無奈最大的無奈來自立法院的結構對行政院送出的種種的法案"},{"start":205.677,"end":231.893,"text":"都一概不予同意而且立法院通過的法案一再違背預算法跟憲法的規定好 超出預算超出設出從來沒有徵詢行政院這個無奈才讓我寸步難行院長 這個你已經講你已經講過很多次了你的無奈不是這個這些好不好 我特別要提醒你並不了解我的無奈你的無奈我都了解不然我不會開頭就讓你有這種說明的機會"},{"start":234.955,"end":256.563,"text":"我坦白跟你講啊 現在就是 賢己有政黨 執政無政黨這種心態 去執政 那就沒有問題可是你們現在不是啊所以 燕子啊 我不要跟你辯論這些我一定會尊重你 現在你的處境但是 我還是要呼籲"},{"start":257.643,"end":266.669,"text":"我今天特別的主題就是要你沒有問題但是你的格言是大大有問題為什麼不要再造謠不要再造謠我要請問劉部長3月29號"},{"start":277.847,"end":288.664,"text":"你在下鄉演講的時候請問一下你為什麼指責台灣民眾黨吃台灣米變成中國粿拜託你告訴我為什麼"},{"start":292.919,"end":313.433,"text":"報告委員,我這是以個人的身份到...你不要跟我講個人的身份,可是你為什麼要指名道姓台灣民眾黨呢?我跟你講,我膝掌你起碎,身在台灣,只為台灣鬼,那你為什麼要罵台灣民眾黨是中國鬼呢?你的定義是什麼?"},{"start":314.113,"end":337.261,"text":"因為在前一天啊 這個台灣民眾黨有到鳳山那鳳山那邊有人去抗議那抗議的時候舉的這個牌子我覺得這個牌子呢 我覺得對於有一些啊不是指貴長 有一些人呢 他們的一個請貢應該是要做出來說明你口才很好 但是你不要換位置 要換了腦袋"},{"start":339.235,"end":366.072,"text":"這幾天你為對集會遊行法你過去在立法委員的時候你什麼態度你現在當為一個主管的時候你什麼態度這個我也不要跟你辯論你有你的看法換一個位置換一個腦袋無所謂但是你是政黨的主管機關指名道姓個人我不批評但是你指名台灣民眾黨"},{"start":367.173,"end":388.521,"text":"那就包括我在內可是我告訴你我就是台灣人我就是台灣鬼你幹嘛罵我中國鬼什麼意思所以我跟你講部長我尊重你過去你在當立法委員你在當副市長你在當我們台北市的局長我都非常尊敬的"},{"start":389.417,"end":411.984,"text":"但是你講台灣民眾黨吃台灣米是中國鬼這基本上這是一個恥辱是一個政黨的主管機關應該這樣講嗎是應該這樣嗎所以我不服氣我要對你抗議所以照這種規則我告訴你就應該要下台 院長"},{"start":413.168,"end":429.8,"text":"我坦白跟你講沒有政黨的主管機關他是首長他是主管政黨那我們是中國鬼那你什麼鬼你告訴我你什麼鬼跟委員報告我跟你一樣吃台灣米做台灣粿"},{"start":431.727,"end":454.763,"text":"是啊 那你為什麼要講我們台灣民眾黨是中國鬼咧所以我告訴你前言跟後語要對齁什麼前言跟後語 你還要再變對不起不對就不對但是我坦白跟你講 我一向 卓院長你很清楚我是對任何事情 我不會對人尤其我尊敬的人 我是禮讓三分"},{"start":455.905,"end":482.642,"text":"那我也相信這不是卓院長要你講可是我也同意在這整個人潮洶湧的情況之下一定會有一種情緒高昂可是你是政黨的主管機關部長不可以這樣講你講個人是個人的事你不能現在又推你自己本身是代表個人不可以這樣"},{"start":483.883,"end":509.052,"text":"言論自由我們尊重可是你不能整個黨都給人家罵下去這樣不好啦說實在我的墳墓我已經看好了就在台灣不會在中國這我很大膽的告訴你我也很大膽的跟卓院長你來做報告好 邱主委來我請問一下"},{"start":510.168,"end":530.063,"text":"你有沒有發現台灣民眾黨在你們做兩岸政策的時候我們有阻擋你任何議案沒有 有沒有不要遺憾 有沒有台灣民眾黨有沒有阻擋你們任何的一個政策 有沒有"},{"start":531.763,"end":549.156,"text":"目前法律案是還沒有但是預算案卻蠻遺憾的你不要再給我扯預算案預算案是這種東西是另外一個我跟你談的是一個政黨的有沒有阻擋你兩岸的問題有沒有有就有沒有就沒有有沒有報告委員我們提了很多的國安法相關的法律國安法我在程序委員會啦"},{"start":560.471,"end":588.751,"text":"院長 我告訴你啦 你不要被底下的蒙騙啦我告訴你 提了只有兩案沒有通過 其他通通通過這兩案是到底立法委員跟村里長跟議員要到大陸去訪問的時候要跟主管機關報告 或者跟我立法院來報告只有黨這個我們希望是跟我立法院來報告立法委員跟立法院"},{"start":589.531,"end":612.163,"text":"院報告這是順理存章所以說有黨啊不管什麼理由就是有黨啊我們認為這樣才是國家安全所必須的但是就是有黨啊這不是黨這是戰反我曾經提案人我跟他溝通你就改跟立法院來報告我們沒意見你可以去看看主張有些無關緊要有促進"},{"start":614.075,"end":625.285,"text":"這國安的問題我跟你講我們都沒有黨喔我跟你講如果台灣民眾黨你們認為我們還是不理性的話我說實在的你找不到所以"},{"start":626.001,"end":654.651,"text":"那個 邱主委 有就有 沒有就沒有我們是希望像這個立法院的社密人員應該跟行政部門來做通報 我們來做審查你是一個 該你的事 有就有 沒有就沒有我坦白講啦 我坦白講你知不知道 台灣民眾黨的立委還是多數被中共季節進入中國的 你知道嗎你知不知道啊"},{"start":656.172,"end":683.454,"text":"我告訴你 我們跟民進黨的立法委員沒有兩樣還是被禁止進入中國所以我今天為什麼這麼氣概一定 將心比心啦 你會通過我了解但是我要分開 你也要了解你聽好不好 不能這樣亂講所以這一點 我坦白跟你講我要提供資訊給你我們還有很多人被禁止進入大陸連香港都不能去的所以這一點"},{"start":684.488,"end":687.326,"text":"我想邱主委你特別要去了解一下好不好"},{"start":688.069,"end":699.477,"text":"所以對於立法委員去到大陸 除了跟他院長了解之外主管機關才能夠掌握未來的人身安全這是一個非常普遍的要求而已啊"},{"start":718.472,"end":718.774,"text":"所以這點變了"},{"start":721.265,"end":749.578,"text":"沒有 院長 我不管是口誤或不管是細意那是另外一回事今天有機會跟你這樣對白我希望最政黨的價值性的批判當然要謹慎但是任何政黨對總統的批判也要非常的小心啊一定 你如果要去安撫那個領導的事情啦我特別跟你說來 接下來第二張請問一下嘛來 劉部長這些都是你們民進黨的人喔這些都是"},{"start":750.902,"end":759.519,"text":"都是被我們國安單位調查 司法單位調查這是 請問一下這是台灣鬼或中國鬼你告訴我"},{"start":760.523,"end":779.27,"text":"他已經接受了中國的價值觀所以他從...這個就是中國鬼啦沒有 他從最堅強的堡壘當中要來破壞這個堡壘這個就是他們的戰術所以他已經是台灣人接受了中國的價值觀我跟你講啦我尊重你 我不希望你一直去袒護這些我們要面對問題該辦就辦 而不要一辦數辦你恍而沒有去糾正你的格言"},{"start":785.993,"end":807.247,"text":"你隔眼做任何事情你要概括承受的因為你是中華民國行政院最高所長所以你的隔眼講出話來你是要概括承受本來就不可以這樣的台灣鬼就是台灣鬼像這些 好 進行下一張 來"},{"start":810.794,"end":833.473,"text":"好啦 一定 我不跟你吵架啦 時間有限我坦白跟你講 你們很奇怪這個主公會裡面 我跟你講這些警消主公會 我記得很清楚教師主公會也是這種想法但是最後教書沒有罷工錢 他只有勞動三權"},{"start":836.603,"end":852.7,"text":"過得很好啊 也沒有罷工啊所以這些東西說實在的不要把它看成洪水猛獸所以啊 我們柯總召又說這個主張組工會的人就是中共同路人"},{"start":853.28,"end":868.526,"text":"一定 這是我們獻華賦儀結社遣的一種但是至於錦霄因為他是公務人員要不要讓他們兼濟勞工之身份"},{"start":870.207,"end":893.962,"text":"這個可以談 但是你們反對 一定 我坦白跟你講因為公務人員兼具勞工身份在台灣非常之多所以 確確實實 這個是可以談但是如何把它研磨 不能去用醜化的動作喔 這些警校就是中共同路人支持的就是 你如果要這樣的話 我跟你講喔上一屆"},{"start":895.339,"end":919.075,"text":"二十幾個民進黨支持喔這一屆有十六個人喔裡面這種理論有七四十的理論說實在一定 這些人不就都要抓起來這不合理啦一句話 我們對警消同仁的尊敬跟支持跟我們對國軍弟兄的尊敬支持是一樣的只是警消人員對國家有特別權利義務關係我們必須要維持這種權利義務關係時間的問題啦 我要呼應你"},{"start":924.358,"end":945.967,"text":"對於打詐的問題不要開玩笑現在國外非常猖獗以前是針對年輕人現在是中高齡所以這個問題資訊現在你們報案的專線良又不起有時候真的他要報案真的要統一報案專線"},{"start":947.827,"end":972.279,"text":"這個才是真正要的一句話打詐確實要打但是打詐行為的結構已經在轉變大家最詬病的投資詐騙目前已經稍微有下降好 謝謝林郭辰維謝謝卓院長 各部會所長的備詢 謝謝"}]},"gazette":{"lineno":21,"blocks":[["林委員國成：（9時1分）謝謝院長，請行政院卓院長。"],["主席：麻煩請卓院長備詢。"],["林委員國成：另外請內政部。"],["主席：麻煩請內政部備詢。"],["林委員國成：陸委會邱主委。"],["主席：麻煩請陸委會備詢。","時間暫停，林委員，最多就是3位，因為我們的硬體設備就是這樣，好嗎？如果你想請其他的部長，我們請這邊的部長下去再換一個，好不好？好，時間開始，麻煩請林委員繼續。"],["卓院長榮泰：林委員好。"],["林委員國成：院長、主委及部長，大家早。卓院長520就任到現在，我說實在，我看得出來你是非常無奈，以我過去了解的卓榮泰，確確實實有所無奈地在做中華民國的行政院院長。當然我們看得出來，本黨一向理性、務實、科學，包括我在內，我們絕對不會因為人而來凹任何事情，有多少證據，講多少話；有什麼事情，我們也會多體會執政者的苦處。我也知道，院長對最近的內政問題確實千頭萬緒，對於大罷免，你也非常無奈；對於關稅的問題，當前所有全民大家非常關注的關稅問題，這也就是一句話：大國任性、小國忍受。這些東西本來就是很無奈，所以我也知道，你雖然做了中華民國的行政院長，但是確實有很多無奈的事情。可是院長，我說實在的，我特別還是要鼓勵跟勉勵你，真的有些事情要面對問題、解決問題，真的！因為你在所有的行政院長當中，我在做比較，你的人品是好得很，但是你現在做出來的事情，確實是讓人民非常無奈。","我必須提供一個資訊給院長做參酌，因為這些關稅問題，你知道你的民調下降7%嗎？這個提供給你做參考。我的時間給院長30秒的時間，針對這些，你認同我的這些說法嗎？"],["卓院長榮泰：確實無奈，最大的無奈來自立法院的結構，對行政院送出的種種法案，都一概不予同意，而且立法院通過的法案，一再違背預算法跟憲法的規定，超出預算、超出歲出，從來沒有徵詢行政院，這個無奈才讓我寸步難行。"],["林委員國成：院長，這個你已經講過很多次了，你的無奈不是只有這些，好不好？我特別要提醒……"],["卓院長榮泰：你並不了解我的無奈。"],["林委員國成：你的無奈我都了解，不然我不會開頭就讓你有說明的機會，我坦白跟你講，現在就是選舉有政黨，執政無政黨，以這種心態去執政就沒有問題，可是你們現在不是啊！院長，我不要跟你辯論這些，我一定會尊重你現在的處境，但是我還是要呼籲。","我今天特別的主題就是，你沒有問題，但是你的閣員是大大有問題，為什麼？不要再造謠！我要請問劉部長，3月29號你在下鄉演講的時候，為什麼指責台灣民眾黨「吃臺灣米變成中國鬼」？拜託，你告訴我，為什麼？"],["劉部長世芳：報告委員，我這是以個人的身分到……"],["林委員國成：你不要跟我講個人的身分，你為什麼要指名道姓台灣民眾黨呢？我跟你講，我虛長你幾歲，身在臺灣，死為臺灣鬼，你為什麼要罵台灣民眾黨是中國鬼？你的定義是什麼？告訴我。"],["劉部長世芳：因為在前一天台灣民眾黨有到鳳山，鳳山那邊有人去抗議，抗議的時候舉了這個牌子，我覺得這個牌子對於有一些……"],["林委員國成：劉部長……"],["劉部長世芳：不是指貴黨，有一些人他們的挺共傾向……"],["林委員國成：劉部長，你口才很好……"],["劉部長世芳：應該是要出來做說明。"],["林委員國成：但是你不要換了位置就換了腦袋，這幾天你對集會遊行法，你過去在當立法委員的時候是什麼態度，你現在作為主管的時候是什麼態度，這個我也不要跟你辯論，你有你的看法，換一個位置，換一個腦袋，無所謂，但是你是政黨的主管機關，指名道姓個人，我不批評，但是你指名台灣民眾黨，那就包括我在內，可是我告訴你，我就是臺灣人，我就是臺灣鬼，你幹嘛罵我是中國鬼，什麼意思？我跟你講，部長，我尊重你，過去你在當立法委員，你在當副市長，你在當我們臺北市的局長時我都非常尊敬的，但是你講台灣民眾黨「吃臺灣米做中國鬼」，基本上，這是一個恥辱，一個政黨的主管機關應該這樣講嗎？應該這樣嗎？所以我不服氣，我要對你抗議！所以照這種規則，我告訴你，就應該要下臺！院長，我坦白跟你講，沒有政黨的主管機關……他是首長欸！他是主管政黨，我們是中國鬼，那你是什麼鬼？你告訴我，你是什麼鬼？"],["劉部長世芳：跟委員報告，我跟你一樣「吃臺灣米做臺灣鬼」。"],["林委員國成：是啊！那你為什麼要講我們台灣民眾黨是中國鬼？所以我告訴你……"],["劉部長世芳：前言跟後語要對好。"],["林委員國成：什麼前言跟後語？"],["劉部長世芳：因為……"],["林委員國成：你還要再辯？"],["劉部長世芳：對不起。"],["林委員國成：不對就不對，但是我坦白跟你講，卓院長，你很清楚，我一向是對事情，我不會對人，尤其我尊敬的人，我是禮讓三分，我相信這不是卓院長要你講的，我也同意，在這整個人潮洶湧的情況之下，一定會有一種情緒高昂，可是你是政黨的主管機關，部長，不可以這樣講！你講個人是個人的事，你不能現在又推說你自己本身是代表個人，不可以這樣！言論自由我們尊重，可是你不能整個黨都給人家罵下去，這樣「無效」啦！說實在的，我的墳墓我已經看好了，就在臺灣，不會在中國，這我很大膽地告訴你，我也很大膽地跟卓院長做報告。","邱主委，我請問一下，你有沒有發現台灣民眾黨在你們做兩岸政策的時候，我們有阻擋任何議案？有沒有？"],["邱主任委員垂正：我們比較遺憾的是……"],["林委員國成：不要遺憾，有沒有？台灣民眾黨有沒有阻擋你們任何的一個政策，有沒有？"],["邱主任委員垂正：目前法律還沒有。"],["林委員國成：好。"],["邱主任委員垂正：但是預算案卻滿遺憾的。"],["林委員國成：你不要再給我扯預算案，預算案是另外一個，我跟你談的是台灣民眾黨有沒有阻擋兩岸的問題，有沒有？有就有，沒有就沒有，有沒有？"],["卓院長榮泰：報告委員，我們提了很多國安法相關的法律。"],["林委員國成：國安法，我在程序委員會啦！"],["卓院長榮泰：你們並沒有支持。"],["林委員國成：院長，我告訴你啦！你不要被底下的矇騙，提了只有兩案沒有通過，其他通通通過，這兩案是要求立法委員、村里長跟議員要到大陸訪問的時候，要向主管機關報告，或者向立法院報告，只有擋這個，我們希望是向立法院報告，立法委員向立法院報告，這是順理成章。"],["卓院長榮泰：所以是有擋啊！不管什麼理由就是有擋，我們認為這樣才是國家安全所必須的，但是就是有擋啊！"],["林委員國成：這不是擋，是暫緩。我曾經跟提案人溝通，改為向立法院報告，我們沒意見；你可以去了解看看，主張有些無關緊要，是有促進國安問題的法案，我們都沒有擋喔！如果你們認為台灣民眾黨還是不理性的話，說實在的你們找不到了，所以邱主委有就有，沒有就沒有。"],["邱主任委員垂正：我們希望立法院有涉密人員應該向行政部門做通報，我們來做審查。"],["林委員國成：主委該是你的事，有就有，沒有就沒有。你知不知道台灣民眾黨的立委還是多數被中共拒絕進入中國的，你知道嗎？知不知道啊？我們跟民進黨的立法委員沒有兩樣，還是被禁止進入中國，所以我今天為什麼這麼氣慨，院長將心比心啊！你的痛苦我了解，但是我的憤慨，你也要了解，你聽懂嗎？不能這樣亂說，這點坦白跟你講，我要提供資訊給你，我們還有很多人被禁止進入大陸的，連香港都不能去的，所以這部分請邱主委特別要去了解一下，好不好？"],["卓院長榮泰：所以對於立法委員去到大陸，除了讓韓院長了解之外，主管機關未來才能夠掌握委員的人身安全，這是一個非常普遍的要求而已。"],["林委員國成：坦白跟院長說，我是針對這句話，你把台灣民眾黨所有人概括，全部都打成中國鬼，這點我是抗議的，沒有這回事，臺灣就是臺灣，身在臺灣就是臺灣鬼，你幹嘛給我冠上中國鬼？"],["卓院長榮泰：這點對政黨的批判，當然要……"],["林委員國成：院長，我不管是口誤或不管是蓄意，那是另外一回事，今天有機會跟你這樣對白，我希望……"],["卓院長榮泰：對政黨價值性的批判當然要謹慎。"],["林委員國成：好了，院長。"],["卓院長榮泰：但是任何政黨對總統的批判，也要非常地小心。"],["林委員國成：院長如果你要去袒護，那是你家的事情。"],["卓院長榮泰：我沒有袒護。"],["林委員國成：接下來，請問劉部長，這些都是你們民進黨的人，都是被國安單位調查、司法單位調查，請問這些人是臺灣鬼還是中國鬼？你告訴我。"],["卓院長榮泰：他們已經接受了中國的價值觀，所以他們從民進黨……"],["林委員國成：這就是中國鬼啦！"],["卓院長榮泰：沒有，他們從最堅強的堡壘當中要破壞這個堡壘，這就是他們的戰術，所以他已經是臺灣人接受了中國的價值觀。"],["林委員國成：院長，我尊重你，我不希望你一直去袒護這些。"],["卓院長榮泰：我們沒有袒護，該辦就辦，而且要嚴辦速辦。"],["林委員國成：我們要面對問題，你反而沒有去糾正你的閣員，閣員做任何事情，你要概括承受的，因為你是中華民國行政院最高首長，所以你的閣員所講出話，你是要概括承受，本來就不可以這樣的，臺灣鬼就是臺灣鬼。好啦！院長，我不跟你吵架啦，時間有限！我坦白跟你講，你也很奇怪，關於這些警消組工會，我記得很清楚，教師組工會也是這種想法，但是最後教師沒有罷工權，他只有勞動三權，這過得很好，也沒有罷工，所以說實在的，這些東西不要把它看成洪水猛獸。我們柯總召又主張組工會的人就是中共同路人，院長，我們說實在的，這是我們憲法賦予結社權的一種，至於警消，因為他是公務人員，要不要讓他們兼具勞工之身分，這個可以談，但是你們反對。院長，我坦白跟你說，因為公務人員兼具勞工身分的在臺灣非常之多，所以確確實實這個是可以談，但是如何把它研擬，不能用醜化的動作說這些警消就是中共同路人，說支持的就是，你如果要這樣，我跟你說，上一屆有二十幾個民進黨委員支持，這一屆有16個人喔，如果以你們這種扭曲事實的理論，說實在的，院長，這些人不就都要抓起來？這不合理啦！"],["卓院長榮泰：一句話，我們對警消同仁的尊敬跟支持，跟我們對國軍弟兄的尊敬支持是一樣的，只是警消人員對國家有特別權利義務關係……"],["林委員國成：好啦，院長……"],["卓院長榮泰：我們必須要維持這種特別權利義務關係。"],["林委員國成：最後，時間的問題，我要呼籲你，對於打詐的問題不要開玩笑，現在國外非常猖獗，以前是針對年輕人，現在是中高齡，所以針對問題的資訊，現在你們報案的專線良莠不齊，他要報案時真的要有統一的報案專線，這個才是真正要……"],["卓院長榮泰：跟委員報告一句話，打詐確實要打，但是打詐行為的結構已經在轉變，大家最詬病的投資詐騙目前已經稍微有下降了，而其他新興的類型我們都有注意到。"],["林委員國成：好啦，院長，我是良心的建議啦！"],["卓院長榮泰：是，謝謝。"],["林委員國成：你要把以前卓榮泰的這種心態，放在臺灣人的心目中啦！這是最重要的啦！"],["卓院長榮泰：你以後還是會看得到，謝謝。"],["林委員國成：好。"],["主席：謝謝林國成委員質詢，謝謝卓院長、各部會首長的備詢。","接下來我們請麥玉珍委員質詢，翁曉玲委員請準備。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":324,"meet_id":"院會-11-3-8","speakers":["韓國瑜","江啟臣","林國成","麥玉珍","翁曉玲","林宜瑾","盧縣一","林月琴","高金素梅","李坤城","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","劉書彬","陳永康","林俊憲","徐巧芯"],"page_start":267,"meetingDate":["2025-04-22"],"gazette_id":"1143701","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1143701_00006"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期第8次會議紀錄","content":"施政質詢\n對行政院院長提出施政方針及施政報告繼續質詢─ 繼續質詢─","agenda_id":"1143701_00012"}}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}