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謝謝主席 本席邀請我們交通部陳部長請部長"},{"start":11.573,"end":36.641,"text":"董事長好部長好部長媒體報導交通部也已經同意開始要來推所謂的行人專用實相以及行人早開秒數這樣的一個設置這其實跟我在台南推動的非常吻合我也認為這個很重要為什麼呢因為路權不能用里讓的"},{"start":38.72,"end":45.932,"text":"路權不能靠你的道德自我訴求你看這國外的交通號誌沒有看到什麼禮讓行人"},{"start":47.438,"end":73.053,"text":"只有注意行人也就是這個時間秒數是屬於車輛的或者是屬於行人的你要分開啦例如在台南市的那個的那個永華路跟西門路口就台南的星光三越以前大愛麗智酒店前面那個路口那個路口車輛要左右轉都轉不過去為什麼 因為在百貨公司前面"},{"start":74.073,"end":87.029,"text":"那你要左轉右轉斑馬線都會有人在行走所以你就要等下來停下來 車輛要停下來 等行人走過去嘛對不對但是喔 開車一定會後悔整夜啦這人有危險啦"},{"start":88.702,"end":112.438,"text":"走路也會亂走 所以駕駛就心浮氣躁 是不是這樣所以我認為應該是要把路權分開車輛的時候歸車輛 行人的時候歸行人所以行人專用時向 甚至可以像就像日本這樣你可以走到對角線去因為行人在走路的時候 就沒有車輛在通行"},{"start":113.479,"end":139.866,"text":"那有車輛你在執行的時候你車輛通行的時候你斑馬線都沒有人這專用實相那另外一個你要推一個所謂的提早秒數那這個我認為當然專用實相效果最好那你行人提早專用秒數也可以解決一部分的這樣的一個問題只是交通部說有定一個目標那沒有達目標的縣市你要公佈"},{"start":141.243,"end":146.763,"text":"那如果有達目標的直轄市有獎金我看獎金只有15萬"},{"start":148.492,"end":149.172,"text":"直轄市15萬 其他我們還有分兩組15萬這樣這樣這樣這樣這樣這樣這樣這樣這樣這樣這樣這樣這樣這樣這樣這樣這樣這樣這樣這樣這樣這樣這樣這樣這樣這樣"},{"start":173.179,"end":184.561,"text":"更強有力一點你要要求縣市政府如果支持的話我們這個要求的力道會加強因為當然力道要加強因為這樣對改善交通非常有用"},{"start":185.673,"end":200.14,"text":"台北市也很嚴重啊你車輛要右轉都轉不過去啊寶馬縣都有人在走啊那行人走 行人也會怕啊會遇到不守規則的駕駛啊對不對 兩邊都不好啦專用石像是最好啦好 另外喔"},{"start":203.598,"end":219.972,"text":"我經常提到交通的三一你要推動一個交通政策以前第一個政府的部分有沒有做到第二個就是要求用路人第三才是處罰我們現在有訂一個行人專區行人專區"},{"start":230.518,"end":250.165,"text":"你的專用名詞叫什麼你這個專用名詞新人優先區你知道新人優先區吧報告委員這個我知道這個是國土署他們去設定國土署代表人在不在但這個母法是交通部跟內政部一起訂的"},{"start":252.011,"end":276.167,"text":"你的母法是高通鋪跟內政部一起訂只是你在市區內內政部你管那我跟主席建議一下像這個 因為你今天的主題是人本交通內政部應該要有相當層級的代表來出席才對"},{"start":277.612,"end":296.639,"text":"來啦 博鳥你們要做個看看 跟內政部的各方面看看第一個 什麼叫行人優先區在這個區段裡面 行人最大行人沒有造責 行人沒有責任行人可以走全路寬 幾條路行人都可以走 進民喇叭車輛前面有人 你不可以民喇叭第二個 速限只限20"},{"start":305.373,"end":325.8,"text":"第三 整條路都是他的 人最多只有車輛讓行人而且用一些 比如減速的減速的材質或路面鋪面全國只有一條路 現在事項你現在看到的 台北市啦 信義區啦部長你這樣 我們內政部的組長嘛 你看有這些什麼"},{"start":332.941,"end":341.966,"text":"第一個 你這樣的設計駕駛也不知道這裡是行人優先區走路的人 你走的放心嗎第一個 你那個鋪面也是柏油路我給你看一下你要訂這個法 當時交通部跟內政部合訂這個母法的時候你的立法的原由 理由你就說要二立本"},{"start":362.335,"end":389.839,"text":"那其實 韓國做得比日本還好我給你看韓國的韓國第一個 它的鋪面不會是柏油路啦駕駛到行人走到 走到這段路就知道說 欸 這裡的路面不是一般的路面大樹也會更知道不像台灣 台灣你現在 台北市事辦的第一條喔 它全部都是柏油路啦所以你開車的人喔 你不會知道你進入一個不一樣的路段"},{"start":391.274,"end":407.382,"text":"第二個 台北市就是在兩端 個化一個長條形的藍色你如果開過這個長條形的藍色你會知道 你會一直都知道你還在行人遊閒區嗎現在你告訴我 現在沒有這個代表說啦你如果要做得好 你也要這樣你試試看 我想問一件事喔你訂這個行人遊閒區幹嘛 對不對"},{"start":420.27,"end":442.76,"text":"第二你路面也沒有寫你要讓駕駛一直知道說他的行人都 雙方都知道我在行人優先區你怎麼會韓國這樣寫他路面標示很清楚對不對路面鋪設材質不一樣所以車輛跟人說知道我在特殊的地方特殊的路段第三 樹線標在地上樹線只有20甚至還有照明"},{"start":447.262,"end":471.064,"text":"這個照明這個看不清楚啦 它的路面是整個暗紅色的它不是像台灣只有頭尾兩端畫一個藍色的 中間過來就是柏油路它是整個路段 全部 韓國都鋪這種紅色的像磚面所以看到這個地方啊 駕駛行人都會知道所以你要嘛就不要設 要嘛你設了就很危險"},{"start":473.444,"end":485.231,"text":"所以這是我跟你說的喔 部長 回到我的觀念你政府要現在訂一個新的規定 沒關係但你政府的工程要先做你的硬體設計要設計好在你喔 你要把這個納入駕駛手冊甚至納入考試啊不然大家不知道 但是你不是喔我們現在馬上開始要調高罰則了喔就第三個才是處罰啦"},{"start":503.376,"end":531.398,"text":"交通部預告修正違反道路交通事件你現在要提高沒有禮讓行人的罰則6月就要實施了莫同你知不知道現在我們沒有禮讓行人是7200你要調高到18000了導致受傷的18000要到36000然後你如果輕傷 你如果肇事最少扣假照一年"},{"start":532.315,"end":561.109,"text":"比較嚴重的直接吊銷你如果要提高到這麼重的罰則可以但是我說的你該做的硬體工程中央跟地方政府該做的你應該做得好就像你部長我支持這也是我在北京推薦的一個觀念就是全時向的行人耗資你改全時向駕駛沒有讓行人這個很清楚你根本不能左右轉"},{"start":562.39,"end":575.416,"text":"這叫重罰 重罰駕駛嘛你不離讓行人因為我工程做好了對不對但是你現在啊準備要重罰未離讓行人但是在6月要開始實施以前"},{"start":576.684,"end":596.294,"text":"在你修改你的行政命令 到你開罰中間中央跟地方政府有去修 你有去做一些工程的改善嗎 交通路口的改善其實工程的改善 我們有一個四年四百億的計畫其實這些年 從去年到今年其實好過交通嗎 你數字會講話 你造勢建樹 受傷的人"},{"start":601.077,"end":620.049,"text":"都有在降低跟委員報告另外就是說您所提到的這個修更嚴的這個部分是針對行川線也就是斑馬線是針對斑馬線那其他的部分我們沒有改變只有斑馬線而且是撞傷人或者是撞死人沒有你沒有離讓你就中法了沒有離讓沒有離讓就是說你在6公尺內你如果車沒停這叫沒離讓是不是這樣子"},{"start":630.644,"end":653.089,"text":"這條適用的規定就是在入口就是在入口當然在入口啊那這個部分的話是在處罰條例現行的裁罰你把他加重嘛然後針對這個受傷跟智能撞傷的部分把他裁罰基準再拉高這個是針對已經撞到人"},{"start":655.578,"end":679.625,"text":"已經種到 你是一個分層級嘛 輕生跟重生嘛 好啊另外我剛剛提的 像你既然要推一個新的政策 新人專用區那就把它好好做好 工程面要做好 要做好另外你要對地方政府要求的新人全時向或者是新人早開利潤 這個要廣泛去推動了 好不好好 謝謝 謝謝委員"}]},"gazette":{"lineno":586,"blocks":[["林委員俊憲：（10時35分）謝謝主席。本席邀請交通部陳部長。"],["主席：請部長。"],["陳部長世凱：委員好。"],["林委員俊憲：部長好。媒體報導交通部已經同意開始推動行人專用時相以及行人早開時相秒數的設置。"],["陳部長世凱：對。"],["林委員俊憲：這其實跟我在臺南推動的非常吻合，我也認為這個很重要。為什麼呢？因為路權不能用禮讓的啦！路權不能靠道德自我約束，你看國外的交通號誌沒有什麼「禮讓行人」，只有「注意行人」，也就是這個時間、秒數是屬於車輛或者是屬於行人的，你要分開啦！例如臺南市的永華路跟西門路口，也就是臺南的新光三越（以前大億麗緻酒店）前面那個路口，那裡車輛要左、右轉都轉不過去，為什麼？因為在百貨公司前面，車輛要左轉、右轉時，斑馬線都會有人在行走，所以車輛要停下來，等行人走過去，對不對？"],["陳部長世凱：對。"],["林委員俊憲：但是開車一定有人亂開，所以行人有危險；走路也有人亂走，所以駕駛就心浮氣躁，是不是這樣？"],["陳部長世凱：是。"],["林委員俊憲：所以我認為應該要把路權分開，車輛的時候歸車輛，行人的時候歸行人，就是行人專用時相甚至可以像日本那樣，可以走到對角線去。"],["陳部長世凱：對。"],["林委員俊憲：行人在走路的時候，就沒有車輛在通行，車輛通行的時候，斑馬線都沒有人，這是專用時相。另外就是推動所謂的提早秒數，我認為這樣的專用時相效果最好。行人時相提早專用秒數也可以解決一部分這樣的問題，只是交通部說有訂一個目標，沒有達到目標的縣市要公布，如果有達到目標的，直轄市有獎金，我看獎金只有15萬，這樣誘因夠嗎？"],["陳部長世凱：直轄市15萬，其他我們還有分2組。"],["林委員俊憲：第一，15萬的獎勵夠嗎？第二，目標是什麼？沒有達到目標你要公布而已，那目標是什麼？"],["陳部長世凱：報告委員，我們有設定一個目標值，各縣市其實也滿配合、滿幫忙的，專用時相和早開時相我們過去已經完成了6,000處……"],["林委員俊憲：你應該要更強有力一點，要求縣市政府……"],["陳部長世凱：委員如果支持的話，我們要求的力道會加強。"],["林委員俊憲：力道當然要加強啊！"],["陳部長世凱：好。"],["林委員俊憲：這樣對改善交通非常有用。"],["陳部長世凱：是，我們……"],["林委員俊憲：臺北市也很嚴重啊！車輛要右轉根本轉不過去，斑馬線都有人在走啊！行人走，心裡也會怕遇到不守規則的駕駛，兩邊都不好啦！專用時相是最好的啦！","另外，我經常提到我們的「交通3 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