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護國產業的因應辦公室，由我們的國發會、經濟部、財政部共同成立一個跨部會的護國產業因應辦公室，來協助我們的廠商因應海外關稅與地緣政治的風險，推動供應鏈的雙軸部署，提升臺灣研發能量與留才的政策。對於這些建議，政府是否會虛心的採納，讓民眾對於這一次，我們看到民調是如此的不具信心，來從拾民眾對於政府面對這次關稅的處理政策的信心，你要不要虛心接納？不要還在那邊自己完全就是悶著頭在做。"],["莊部長翠雲：傾聽民意一直是政府都在做的，對於民眾的建議，我們也都會納入參考。"],["林委員思銘：是。"],["莊部長翠雲：剛剛委員也提到許多產業策略或布局等等，經濟部一定也會在這方面去做一些考量，就財政部的部分……"],["林委員思銘：是，我想我們財經部會都要做充分的……"],["莊部長翠雲：對，我想財政部的部分，您剛剛也提到有關產業的升級跟轉型，在產創條例裡面，這一次行政院也提出了修法版本，感謝立法院三讀通過，在那裡面對於相關的一些政府的投資，譬如說……"],["林委員思銘：部長，這個我們都了解。"],["莊部長翠雲：項目增加、期限加長、金額也增高，我想這個部分……"],["林委員思銘：現在因為民眾的信心是如此的低，所以各部會其實應該虛心檢討，為什麼民意的支持度會那麼低？為什麼那麼沒有信心？要如何做檢討、改進、調整？這是你們要做的，不是還在講以前的東西。"],["莊部長翠雲：不是，這是這次新的作為。"],["林委員思銘：你要重拾民眾的信心，部長請回。"],["莊部長翠雲：謝謝委員。"],["林委員思銘：請主計長。"],["陳主計長淑姿：委員好。"],["林委員思銘：主計長，主計總處前天表示，針對行政院因應國際情勢強化經濟社會及國土安全韌性特別條例所編列的4,100億特別預算，為能及時推動執行，部分財源須先行舉借債務，因為目前政府的債務距離我們的舉債上限40.6%的規定尚有13.7個百分點，大概有3兆元的舉債空間，而前天也公布114年3月底工業及服務業受僱人數為848萬9,000人，經常性薪資平均數為4萬7,525元，但其中月薪不及平均月薪者占受僱總數的69.77%，也就是說，近七成領不到平均月薪，這個也是再創新高。本席查詢我們國庫署的國債鐘資料，最新的平均每人負擔債務，截至114年4月30日是26.5萬，跟歷年最高的27.4萬已相差不遠，也是近一年的新高，所以請問主計長，你是否聽得出來剛剛本席所提到這三項資訊有什麼矛盾之處？"],["陳主計長淑姿：請指教。"],["林委員思銘：你聽得出來嗎？"],["陳主計長淑姿：請委員指教。"],["林委員思銘：就是當有七成的民眾領不到我們平均月薪的時候，背負巨大的生活經濟壓力，我們在野黨提出普發全民1萬元現金協助國人生活時，政府一來是全力的反對，二來卻對外表示，4,100億特別預算的部分財源，因為還有舉債空間，所以可先行編列舉借的債務，等於說繼續提高人民債務的負擔，所以主計長，這是不是很荒謬？"],["陳主計長淑姿：報告委員，這個部分是113年度有賸餘1,641億，但是他必須在7月的時候才做審定的確定，所以這個時間慢一點點，因此如果我在這之前要先做那個就必須先舉債，但是我實際上是不用舉債，是這樣子。"],["林委員思銘：實際上不用舉債？但是你告訴我們這個舉債空間還有那麼高、還有那麼大、空間還有那麼大，還可以借3兆，所以可能你未來要舉債？"],["陳主計長淑姿：不是，我不需要……"],["林委員思銘：你現在肯定告訴我們不會舉債？"],["陳主計長淑姿：是，實際上不會舉債。"],["林委員思銘：實際上這4,100億都不用舉債？"],["陳主計長淑姿：不會舉債，因為目前來講我們就有四千多億的累積賸餘，只是說1,641億是113年度的決算數字，目前決算數字我們已經送審計部，審計部要7月才審定。"],["林委員思銘：好，沒有關係，你說反正就不會舉債嘛。"],["陳主計長淑姿：是。"],["林委員思銘：但是我想這一次我比較驚訝的，民眾也很驚訝的是，我們這一次的4,100億，其中要補助給台電1,000億，而這1,000億，我們看到過去我們本來是要追加預算，113年度用追加預算，114年度用公務預算，但是這一次卻是「明」渡陳倉，不是「暗」渡陳倉，要在這一次的特別條例4,100億裡面補助台電1,000億，這樣一個預算的編列準則到底是什麼？我看不懂耶！"],["陳主計長淑姿：我再跟……"],["林委員思銘：這次的4,100億不是為了針對美國的關稅政策，而去提出這樣一個特別預算的編列嗎？這跟補助台電有什麼關聯？"],["陳主計長淑姿：這很有關聯，跟委員報告，這次關稅的結果，造成人心浮動，所以物價的部分會有所波動，我們如果能夠補助台電的話，然後能夠不調升電價這個部分，那我們在整個穩定物價上就很好。"],["林委員思銘：主計長，我的時間也差不多了，最後，關於補助台電這件事情，因為我昨天在經濟委員會有問台電，如果這1,000億補助到位，台電可不可以承諾未來不漲電價？可不可以承諾未來不需要再靠政府補助，自己賺就可以了，他可以承諾嗎？他不敢承諾嘛！"],["陳主計長淑姿：這我也沒辦法承諾。"],["林委員思銘：不敢承諾嘛！但是在不敢承諾的情況之下，我們看到過去我們有3次補助給台電，補助了3,000億，但是電價仍然調漲。"],["陳主計長淑姿：那是增資啦，不一樣。"],["林委員思銘：他還是在調漲電價嘛，為什麼會造成這樣一個結果？就是他的能源政策可能需要調整，否則買1度綠電，台電就虧損，這不是無底洞嗎？怎麼可能台電以後不靠補助呢？每次都要靠政府補助，補助之後又要調電價，這樣對嗎？所以我還是認為台電這一次的預算編列在這4,100億裡面，真的討論的空間很大，看怎麼樣來說服我們所有的立法委員，以上，謝謝。"],["主席（李委員坤城代）：謝謝林思銘委員。","下一位請羅明才委員。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":588,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-20-12","speakers":["賴惠員","吳秉叡","林德福","賴士葆","郭國文","顏寬恒","李彥秀","李坤城","林思銘","羅明才","鍾佳濱","黃珊珊","黃國昌","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","葉元之","王世堅","陳玉珍"],"page_start":521,"meetingDate":["2025-05-15"],"gazette_id":"1144901","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1144901_00008"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期財政委員會第12次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、處理中華民國114年度中央政府總預算決議有關財政部主管預算凍結書面報告案 62案、有關\n審計部主管預算凍結書面報告案4案及有關行政院主計總處預算凍結書面報告案18案；二、處理\n中華民國114年度中央政府總預算決議有關財政部主管預算凍結專案報告案 17案及有關行政院主\n計總處預算凍結專案報告案1案","agenda_id":"1144901_00007"}}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}