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我們現在開始開會 請主任報告書面人數報告全體會 初期委員14人 已足法定人數好 我們現在開始開會 進行報告事項 請宣讀商事會議事錄"},{"start":1778.336,"end":1783.198,"text":"立法院第11屆第2會期經濟委員會第10次全體委員會議之路時間113年11月6日星期三9時至12時5分14時30分至14時45分地點紅樓101會議室出席委員陳廷輝委員等14人立席委員謝龍介委員等18人立席委員經濟部部長"},{"start":1799.184,"end":1816.444,"text":"部長郭志輝、國發會主委劉靜卿、主計總處普查處處長潘寧欣、勞動部中規司司長王厚誠、教育部清發署署長陳雪玉、財政部副署長倪立新及其各單位相關人員、主席邱昭紀委、志偉"},{"start":1817.105,"end":1835.488,"text":"報告事項一宣讀上次會議事錄決定確定二,邀請經濟部部長、國家發展委員會主任委員、行政院主計總署首長、勞動部首長、教育部首長、財政部首長就我國青年低薪成因檢討及因應對策,即如何促進企業提升青年及基層員工薪資水準"},{"start":1836.068,"end":1849.76,"text":"進行報告並備質詢三、邀請經濟部長、國家發展委員會主任委員就我國傳統產業及中小企業發展困境探討應應對策及相關振興方案進行報告並備質詢報告四、向合併巡查經濟部部長、國發會劉祖偉報告後委員陳聽飛等20人提出質詢"},{"start":1855.024,"end":1877.89,"text":"經由經濟部副部長、國發會劉淑偉、勞動部王司長及財政部倪副署長及相關人及其答覆決定一、登記發言委員處不在場者外區域禁語發言完畢、詢答結束二、羅志強、劉許廷及王宏維所提順便質詢列入紀錄刊登公報三、順便質詢和未及答覆部分請相關單位一週內以順便答覆並赴資本會上會宣讀完畢"},{"start":1881.331,"end":1887.433,"text":"好,關於伊斯魯,市長委員人數不足,伊斯魯我們暫不處理我們繼續進行報告事項,請卷讀"},{"start":1888.8,"end":1889.36,"text":"推動機制進行報告並被質詢 宣讀完畢"},{"start":1919.167,"end":1945.004,"text":"今天的專案報有兩項第一項是針對我國當前經貿情勢的分析以及如何有效拓展國際經貿空間的戰略規劃以相關政策作為第二項是申請加入CPTPP的相關進度的說明及CPTPP成員國目前立場的分析以及行政院跨部會的推動機制這兩項做報告並備諮詢"},{"start":1949.382,"end":1962.809,"text":"在今天列席的部會很多在請部會在做報告之前我很快的介紹今天列席的各部會國外會的部會由高先貴副主委跟經發處跟人發處、重規處、產發處、設發處相關處長列席"},{"start":1972.395,"end":1998.942,"text":"國發基金是師傅執行秘書經濟部由郭部長親自出席謝謝郭部長以及國貿署、商發署、產業園區管理局局長出席農業部的部分由杜文貞次長列席謝謝還有國際事務司跟畜牧師、林保署、房檢署、農糧署、漁業署相關的同仁"},{"start":1999.861,"end":2018.345,"text":"另外,行政院經貿談判辦公室由副總談判代表嚴慧欣副總談判代表列席外交部由吳志忠次長列席謝謝還有國經司的副次長陸委會也有列席陸委會有李立貞副主委列席謝謝另外還有經濟處好那"},{"start":2024.476,"end":2037.304,"text":"現在先進行這個報告首先先請國發會由高先貴副主委來做報告請折要"},{"start":2040.152,"end":2054.031,"text":"主席、各位委員、先進、大家早安今天邀請委員會所提的議題進行報告本會請就業管的部分針對當前經濟情勢分析及政府政策作為說明無下"},{"start":2055.012,"end":2069.655,"text":"那其實全球經濟在今年兩年都渴望溫和的成長那國內景氣在AI的新興科技的帶動之下我們出口、生產跟投資都會相當的創旺根據國內外經濟機構的預測我國2024年經濟成長率都可以達到3.5%以上主力總數估計到3.9那國際貨幣基金IMF估計今年兩年全球經濟成長也可以達到3.2%"},{"start":2083.198,"end":2110.452,"text":"那主要是全球通貨已經明顯下降那商品貿易由衰退轉成擴張那各國的央行也陸續調整它的利益政策可是各國的經濟表現不一我想美國在薪資成長跟財富的支應之下它可以維持2.8的強勁成長但是歐元跟日本則相對疲弱那新興市場表現也相當分歧然後中國持續低迷印度則持續扮演新興市場成長動力的來源"},{"start":2112.633,"end":2135.006,"text":"雖然國際的景氣持續的溫和成長全球通膨也是呈現回落的局面但是國際風險因素淺存包括在中東地區以色列跟巴基斯坦跟伊朗的緊張情勢仍然衝擊原油市場二部戰爭也持續進行近期的北韓加入俄羅斯的陣營戰爭的格局持續的複雜化對於全球經濟穩定成長帶來更多的挑戰"},{"start":2140.269,"end":2159.702,"text":"此外,美中的角力也會加大地緣政治的風險各國基於經濟安全的目標分辨推動產業回流、有岸外包而且採取各種保護政策來提升本土產業的競爭力美國大選更是大家最重視的經濟風險我想現在選舉結果已經出來了勢必美國的經貿政策會轉向"},{"start":2165.526,"end":2188.161,"text":"的確一定會升高貿易保護的風險加劇全球經濟的零碎化天動全球供應鏈版圖的加速重整我想這不利於全球中長期的經濟成長的動人我想中國大陸內需不振、持續低迷加上美中的對峙加深以後我想中國大陸產能過剩透過貿易來對全球產生的連鎖衝擊應該會持續的擴大"},{"start":2193.704,"end":2212.35,"text":"那面對鬼訣多變的國際經貿情勢跟地緣政治風險我想政府必須因勢力導才可以續保我們的優勢那第一個我們想我們的做法就是協助企業可以立足臺灣佈局全球跟行銷全世界也就是說政府將積極的發展五大信賴產業推動臺灣成為人工智慧之島"},{"start":2215.331,"end":2219.915,"text":"藉由AI產業化、產業AA化帶動百工百業的創新發展強化國內產業競爭優勢政府除了持續希望引導境外資金及台商回流以外我們也會結合外交、產業經貿政策及科技創新等積極推動雙邊及多邊合作來擴展我國的國際經貿發展空間"},{"start":2241.913,"end":2263.553,"text":"第二、我們會鏈結理念相同的國家打造具有韌性的國際供應鏈我們會持續跟民主陣營深化合作包括拱部、友邦還有臺美、臺歐、臺日等關係而且擴大西南向國家的交流合作我們希望扮演民主供應鏈的關鍵角色在策略方面"},{"start":2267.336,"end":2272.859,"text":"經貿夥伴國與理念相同的國家依照產業優勢與供應鏈上下游的關係採取運用跨部會的政策工具創造與這些國家雙邊供應鏈的優勢與韌性包括半導體、5G、綠能等關鍵產業"},{"start":2286.787,"end":2300.242,"text":"的歐等國家會持續深化科技交流跟人才合作推動牆牆協作那中東歐等領域相同的國家我們也會依據產業工業上下游合作的利基關係達到互利共贏的縱向"},{"start":2301.724,"end":2320.41,"text":"最後我們再次重申臺灣是全球供應鏈很重要的一環然後本會將持續會跟外交部、經濟部、國科會還有經貿談判辦公室等密切合作然後積極的擴展臺灣的國際空間打造臺灣具有韌性的供應鏈來確保國家臺灣的經濟安全然後維持臺灣產業的競爭優勢以上報告 敬請指教 謝謝好 謝謝國安會高副主委報告"},{"start":2331.235,"end":2355.837,"text":"今天報告的單位很多我們下一個報告請經濟部郭部長報告主席、各位委員大家好今天承蒙貴委員會邀請就這個主題來做一個進行報告進行各位委員不吝示教"},{"start":2357.095,"end":2368.645,"text":"儘管全球經濟面臨俄烏戰爭、中東地緣政治緊張以及歐美對中國採取關稅措施等挑戰不過今年以來經濟情勢延續正向趨勢國際機構S&P Global預測"},{"start":2372.848,"end":2381.613,"text":"今年全球經濟成長率為2.7%OECD上修經濟成長預測到3.2%經貿付出動能非常平穩今年臺灣半導體以及資訊供應鏈的成熟發展科技大廠加大投資資金、技術研發持續帶動我供應鏈出口的動能主力總數最新預測經濟成長會高達3.9%"},{"start":2398.982,"end":2411.584,"text":"另一方面：美中衝突加劇以及各國保護意識抬頭使企業更重視經營環境穩定和安全國際新變局凸顯找尋可信賴夥伴的重要性"},{"start":2413.223,"end":2429.179,"text":"在拓展國際經貿空間經濟部運用既有的交流管道與歐美及新南向國家強化關鍵供應鏈連結產業交流合作更提出境外關內與境內關外創新經濟模式進一步突破經貿格局"},{"start":2430.66,"end":2457.692,"text":"那麼在境外關內的策略做法經濟部協助企業海外佈局延伸我國產業實力並融入全球供應鏈其中包括以大帶小的模式協助中小企業海外佈局以爭取租稅優惠營造有利於台商的經營環境在行商方面我們以共同品牌方式協助企業進行海外行銷例如今年8月在馬來西亞超市設置"},{"start":2459.053,"end":2479.468,"text":"臺灣CELEC專區展示來自臺灣超過150項特色產品臺灣CELEC接下來有規劃在美國、加拿大推廣以提高我國食品餐飲國際能見度以及市場接受推動加入CPTPP的作為以及進展"},{"start":2480.799,"end":2493.15,"text":"那麼報告如下推動的進度我國於114年9月22日正式遞出申請加入CPTPP相關入會推動方案即由行政院經貿談判辦公室統籌規劃經濟部及相關部會積極的配合辦理"},{"start":2499.153,"end":2518.062,"text":"CPTPP部長及執委會於去年聲明將以奧克蘭原則審視申請案有意加入CPTPP組織的經濟體必須符合協定高標準具備遵守貿易承諾的良好紀錄並由全體成員依據共識決作出決定"},{"start":2519.142,"end":2545.169,"text":"今年5月CPTPP部長聯合聲明再次強調將根據奧克蘭原則討論入會申請案為符合CPTPP高標準規範我政府已全面完成相關修法並且經過多方管道對外進行遊說目前CPTPP成員相當清楚我經貿體制現況及加入CPTPP的決心"},{"start":2547.006,"end":2572.459,"text":"對成員國的立場、臺灣高標準的經貿體制及遵守國際承諾或世界肯定CPTPP成員國明確表示歡迎符合高標準的經濟體加入我國將持續透過各種管道爭取CPTPP成員國的支持盼盡速成立我國入會工作小組經濟部的推案做法經濟部在國際多邊場域透過經貿對話管道"},{"start":2576.061,"end":2583.928,"text":"例如出席APEC、WTO等會議向CPTPP成員國說明我國之準備情況並爭取認同經濟部強化駐外單位專業能量"},{"start":2589.857,"end":2596.461,"text":"協助邀訪CPTPP成員國意見領袖、經貿團體來臺在國際雙邊場域深化CPTPP會員雙邊關係藉互訪機會加強雙方在經貿投資及產業技術合作、人員交流等實質往來"},{"start":2609.725,"end":2624.395,"text":"繼我國成為WTO成員之後加入CPTPP將是再一次提升我經貿體制與高標準國際規範接軌的契機目前我政府與主要的貿易夥伴之各項經貿談判包含美國臺美21世紀貿易倡議以及臺美經濟繁榮夥伴對話"},{"start":2631.581,"end":2659.779,"text":"EPPT對話平台與加拿大投資促進與保障協議以及英國的提升貿易夥伴關係協議等均展現我簽訂高水準經貿協定的能力行政、立法攜手共同努力匯聚我國推換能量在爭取各國認同的過程中立法部門的國際遊說也扮演了相當重要的角色"},{"start":2661.175,"end":2683.696,"text":"建於我國特殊環境．立法院組成推動臺灣加入CPTPP測定會協助推動我國入會藉國會外交之力當可開啟與部會會員國更多的互動經濟部也將持續深化與成員合作關係營造有利環境配合OTN共同推案"},{"start":2685.493,"end":2702.45,"text":"雖然現今國際經貿局勢複雜但臺灣產業有充分信心走向全球市場經濟部將持續努力與各國建立多項經貿對話機制深化交流合作並爭取加入區域經濟整合強化對外貿易關係"},{"start":2704.147,"end":2733.187,"text":"加入CPTPP是繼我國成為WTO成員國再一次提升我經貿體制與高標準國際規範接軌的契機經濟部履歷配合OTN統籌規劃深化與成員合作關係營造對我岸有利之環境同時協助國內產業調整及轉型促進產業持續發展以上報告進行指教最後祝各位委員身體健康萬事主義謝謝"},{"start":2735.56,"end":2738.242,"text":"主席、各位委員、各位女士、先生、大家早安"},{"start":2755.592,"end":2776.989,"text":"感謝貴委員會邀請本部就我國經貿情勢分析及如何有效拓展國際經貿空間戰略規劃之相關政策作為：暨申請加入跨太平洋夥伴全面進步協定CPTPP進度說明、成員國立場分析與跨部會推動機制進行報告並"},{"start":2779.753,"end":2805.712,"text":"並備詢以下僅提出本部的說明進行指教今年來因為地緣政治變化等因素歐美等國家開始強調供應鏈多元化再加上威權國家企圖以經濟脅迫來達到其政治目的已經損害到以規則為基礎之全球經貿秩序更使建構經濟安全及"},{"start":2807.458,"end":2835.18,"text":"任性、衛違、G7等理念相近國家當前政策的重心之一在全球供應鏈重組局勢之下為增加臺灣在全球供應鏈的重要性外交部的重要工作之一便在於與政府各部會配合、積極與理念相近國家共同打造安全、信任、具任性的供應鏈體系使臺灣成為民主陣營不可或缺的合作夥伴"},{"start":2836.26,"end":2855.843,"text":"本部因此將透過行政院經濟外交工作小組作為跨部會協作平台並透過臺灣優勢領域的知識服務智慧解決方案釋出加入CPTPP協助我國產業佈局全球"},{"start":2857.728,"end":2880.638,"text":"目前CPTPP成員國均已了解我國作為入會所做的準備也認為臺灣符合CPTPP高標準並願意完全遵守協定義務日本對我表示歡迎其餘各國也均表示歡迎符合協定高標準的國家入會"},{"start":2881.704,"end":2906.36,"text":"本部一向配合行政院經貿談判辦公室統籌、指揮相關駐外管處並與經濟部共同推案再次感謝貴委員會及各位委員對本部的支持與鼓勵也請各位委員繼續指教及協助謝謝來謝謝外交部吳市長報告現在請農業部由杜文貞常務市長報告"},{"start":2914.438,"end":2934.986,"text":"主席、各位委員、各位女士先生本人今天很榮幸代表農業部列席就大願今天這個專題進行報告那以下就加入CPTPP農業部門準備的情形報告如下一、我國跟CPTPP各國的農產貿易的關係那在跟12個CPTPP成員國裡面"},{"start":2937.047,"end":2943.932,"text":"國家的農產品出口至這12個國家的金額在2023年是16.3億美元那佔我國出口農產品總額的33.3%那我國從這12個CPTPP成員國2023年進口的農產品總共有57.8億美元"},{"start":2957.64,"end":2983.692,"text":"所有農產品進口總額的30.6%所以表示我國跟這12個會員國其實是非常重要的農業貿易夥伴那其中最大的3個外銷的主要的貿易國是日本、越南跟澳大利亞那主要的品項請各位自行參閱那我們從這12個CPTPP的夥伴國進口最主要的3大國家是日本、紐西蘭跟澳大利亞"},{"start":2984.432,"end":3013.207,"text":"那主要的品項也如列如報告請各位自行參閱那加入CPTPP對農業部門當然有一些注意也有一些挑戰那就效益的部分一共主要有三個那就像剛剛講的其實在12個CPTPP的成員國裡面他們的總農產品進口貿易額是2800億美元而我國出口到那些國家的只有16.3所以表示這當中其實還有很大的空間是可以讓我國農產品可以去"},{"start":3014.387,"end":3042.902,"text":"出口到那些國家去的那其中如果加入CPTPP特別是在關稅裡面有一些減讓的時候我相信這對我們的優良農產品的出口確實是有幫助的那第二個效益是在於說在加入之後其實有很多原料的進口的多樣化也對於我國農產品的加工確實是有可以有一些幫助因為臺灣的農產品加工確實有獨特之處那另外第三個就是加入CPTPP之後其實不我們跟成員國的部分農產品有互補"},{"start":3043.602,"end":3065.495,"text":"也有一些那個互相可以補充的效應﹐比方說像進口的中旅遊大豆小麥這些牛肉其實是我們國家相對是需要但是自己生產不足的﹐所以可以從這些國家以較好的價格跟品質進來那對於臺灣比較強項的﹐比方說這代水果、漁產品跟花卉也是我們是可以出口去到這些CPTPP成員國的一些品項"},{"start":3066.275,"end":3080.442,"text":"所以以上一共有三個效益但是也有三個挑戰那最大挑戰其實是在於關稅的部分那因為CPTPP他們這些成員國加入之後他們的關稅有大量的自由化其中的整個平均大概是96.2%"},{"start":3082.583,"end":3083.123,"text":"主任委員會主席"},{"start":3104.471,"end":3128.425,"text":"關稅配額跟特別防衛措施的品項有20項請各位委員參閱所以我想加入CPTPP對農業部來講其實希望能夠在談判過程當中可以爭取到有特別一些敏感品項能夠排除降稅如果是爭取比較長的降稅期以避免對我國農業造成的影響所以我想在接下來的過程當中不管是基於談判"},{"start":3129.406,"end":3145.621,"text":"互相友好或是在科學透明的原則之下我想這都是我們在加入CPTPP的過程當中其實要努力來爭取的那農業部門的因應呢?農業部門其實是針對不管是有沒有加入CPTPP對於農業的永續經營對於農產品的穩定對於我國農業農民的收入或是對於整體的"},{"start":3153.208,"end":3168.203,"text":"產業來講其實都是長期要做的那因應加入CPTPP的農業的重要政策一共有7項那第一個就是希望我們的農業是一個進攻型的而不是只是守在我們自己的國內市場對於能夠多元加工對於能夠突破防疫檢疫障礙對於我們能夠"},{"start":3170.585,"end":3189.137,"text":"建立國家品牌形象對主動出擊的這個在歷年來都有很好的成績我想主動開發國際市場這是我們第一個策略第二個策略是推動地產地銷做市場區隔臺灣農產品是非常好的我們也希望透過我們各項的措施讓國人或是到臺灣旅遊人知道說臺灣的農產品的好"},{"start":3191.138,"end":3205.188,"text":"臺灣農產品的優良跟美所以我想推動地產地消這是我們第二個策略第三個是建構完整的冷鏈不管是從國內的生產從到過程的運輸到國外這個冷鏈要不中斷才能讓我們的產品能夠"},{"start":3206.409,"end":3223.084,"text":"到達對方的消費市場能夠保持一定的良好品質所以在建構冷鏈還有供應鏈的穩定這塊是我們第三個策略第四個是發展的六級產業提高農業的加值型所以不是只有生產在加工、在行銷在到當地的休閒旅遊"},{"start":3224.325,"end":3239.043,"text":"這整串的作為都是在農業希望能夠提高本身的農業價值跟增進農業對於貼近我們國人生活或是貼近整個文化的一些價值那第五個策略是加強這個綠色環境的給付"},{"start":3241.608,"end":3266.773,"text":"以把這個整個生產的結構鏈做調整那農業不只是生產農業還有許多的對於環境對於永續對於整體經營的一些需要在持續發展的所以在這綠色幾乎這塊我們會持續加強來做那第6項的策略是加強檢疫跟檢驗維持農業的生產環境那不論是國內疾病的清除或是在邊境防疫的檢疫那對於能夠維持我們國內生產環境的安全"},{"start":3268.735,"end":3283.434,"text":"提供健康的產品我想還可以突破我們的外銷檢疫障礙這是我們第6個策略第7個策略是加強農業保險維持我們的農業收入那我想積極拓展農產品的外銷新興市場這幾年一直有新的"},{"start":3284.255,"end":3304.625,"text":"成果出來請大家自行參與這過去幾年的成果那我想這樣的成果應該是所有的農民跟所有的行政部門大家一起的努力我們會繼續來做那結語就是CPTPP其實是重要的區域貿易夥伴那為了加入CPTPP我想農業部門會持續提升我們的轉型跟競爭力以上報告請各位進行指教謝謝"},{"start":3310.029,"end":3332.717,"text":"好,謝謝農業部杜文貞市長報告最後請行政院經貿談判辦公室副總談判代表嚴慧琴報告主席主席、各位委員大家好"},{"start":3334.087,"end":3356.217,"text":"稱謀貴委員會的這個邀請就讓本辦公室可以來就今天的主題來進行說明那以下二要的這個說明敬請各位委員不吝指教首先我們在現在臺灣所面對的國際情勢上面當然看到全球經貿的情勢面對了這些地緣政治的影響不論從5218戰爭到美中的這些戰略性的"},{"start":3357.364,"end":3372.632,"text":"這個競爭都衝擊到了全球化以及供應鏈那特別是中國的產能過剩、經濟脅迫都影響了市場的公平也傷害到了這個多邊的貿易體系所以各國將經濟安全跟供應鏈的韌性列為優先的政策"},{"start":3373.392,"end":3401.378,"text":"對於我們這個全球的分工確實造成一些衝擊但是此外我們也觀察到氣候變遷以及科技發展實際上又促進了各國必須要做跨國合作的這個需求這些國際經貿的情勢使得現在的整個國際經貿體系產生的區域化集團化的一個發展理念相近的國家紛紛以區域貿易協定來強化夥伴之間的關係但是也對區域外的國家形成了壓力"},{"start":3402.398,"end":3409.884,"text":"所以在面對這樣的一個情勢之下我們的國際經貿的這個策略推動上面政府除了持續推動多邊來參與這個新的規範的制定"},{"start":3413.908,"end":3441.392,"text":"捍衛以及保護我們的經貿利益之外我們也透過新南向政策來深化我們跟東南亞國家的全方面的交流此外我們當然透過積極加入CPTPP以及與主要的貿易國家例如美國、英國、加拿大以及東南亞國家來洽結雙邊協定或投資協定來深化台灣跟這些國家的雙邊夥伴的關係至於在我們推動"},{"start":3442.652,"end":3470.158,"text":"加入CPTPP的面向上面CPTPP對我國來強化區域經濟體系的地位跟拓展國際經貿空間的意義非常重大所以目前我們確認了CPTPP的成員會依據奧克蘭三原則來處理新會員的加入也就是新會員必須要符合協定高標準、專守貿易承諾以及由全體成員以共識來決定"},{"start":3471.738,"end":3484.986,"text":"我國已經全面修法符合了CPTPP的規範而且我們向來都遵守國際貿易的承諾目前為止CPTPP的成員都沒有異議但是有特別請我們要加強"},{"start":3485.834,"end":3504.464,"text":"跟這些區域個別火彈之間的溝通以力達成共識政府各機關也全力合作持續透過各種的官方管道來洽請CPTPP的成員支持也擴大跟CPTPP的各個國內的各界"},{"start":3505.264,"end":3524.158,"text":"來形塑正面的輿論我們同時也藉由去推動洽簽雙邊協定來強化我們跟這些CPTPP國家的實質關係希望能夠打造我們加入CPTPP的一個有利讓我國的入會案可以取得共識的條件"},{"start":3525.441,"end":3536.685,"text":"未來政府各機關會持續各項工作希望可以爭取成員早日達到展開我國入會程序的共識以上報告 敬請主席及各位委員指教謝謝"},{"start":3557.046,"end":3571.704,"text":"主席、各位委員、各位女士、各位先生承蒙各位委員會的邀請就今天的主題來做報告僅就本會設計本會業務的部分來向各位委員說明請各位委員指教那"},{"start":3573.285,"end":3595.537,"text":"近年兩岸的經貿情勢受到地緣政治、美中貿易及科技衝突、歐美等對大陸去風險化還有中國大陸經濟下行、投資環境惡化以及中共對台灣的經濟脅迫等影響當前的兩岸經貿交流已經出現了結構性的改變"},{"start":3596.879,"end":3602.879,"text":"這個改變包括了,第一個,臺灣對中國大陸的貿易依賴在降低當中"},{"start":3604.144,"end":3623.721,"text":"今年的1到9月我們對大陸的貿易金額佔我們對外貿易總額的比重已經下降到26.3%這是從2006年以來最低對大陸的出口比重今年的1到9月也下滑至20.3%"},{"start":3626.704,"end":3645.569,"text":"第2個改變是我們臺灣赴中國大陸的投資也在遞減當中2020年開始就開始在往下下降赴陸的投資從2010年最高峰的83.8%到今年1到9月只剩下7.4%"},{"start":3649.209,"end":3668.303,"text":"因應整個區域情勢與兩岸經貿關係的變化我想陸委會是協同經濟部還有剛剛這個各單位等政府機關已經持續的來做一些因應那包括了我們協助台商多元佈局也妥善因應中共對我們的經濟脅迫跟統戰作為"},{"start":3671.525,"end":3687.327,"text":"那這些還有包括中共對我們的一些所謂兩手策略對臺灣有所謂的兩岸融合發展措施吸引我們的企業、人才還有資金到大陸去發展那整個這個因應的作為我們"},{"start":3688.949,"end":3703.719,"text":"相關單位已經成立一個專案小職來做處理此外在拓展國際經貿空間部分各相關單位剛剛已經有做了很多說明那落會的資料就順便提供給各位委員來做參考"},{"start":3705.32,"end":3716.324,"text":"後續政府將持續關注中國大陸以及國際經貿發展的情勢妥善因應中國對於台灣經濟脅迫和統戰融合的作為最主要我們會在維護台灣經濟安全的前提下並持對等互利的原則持續推動兩岸經貿、健康有序的交流"},{"start":3727.248,"end":3755.515,"text":"也要積極協助臺商多元佈局提升臺灣的經濟自主性、安全和韌性以上報告敬請各委員指教謝謝謝謝陸委會李副主委報告好,我們要進行了詢問委員主席原例做以下的宣告每日委員發言時間本會委員6分鐘必須延長2分鐘對本會委員4分鐘上午10點即時發言登記"},{"start":3757.065,"end":3785.918,"text":"那也還是要跟大家說明一下為了讓會議能夠順利進行以及讓每位委員發言時間的公平性能夠兼顧也不要影響到下一位委員發言的權益在委員諮詢時間到之後結束之後主席會立即請諮詢委員聽諮詢請各位諮詢委員能夠配合感謝好那先確定一下議事錄請問在場委員對上次會議事錄有無錯誤"},{"start":3787.83,"end":3803.369,"text":"沒有,我們就確定,上次已釋入確定好,第一位諮詢請林黛華委員有請經濟部部長跟經貿談判辦公室談判辦公室嚴副總談判代表"},{"start":3812.438,"end":3828.221,"text":"第一個本席想了解現在政府的看分析跟因應美國川普總統當選之後對產業有哪些影響你們的觀察跟因應是什麼來部長跟經貿辦公室各自回答我不知道對不起你剛才講川普總統當選之後對產業有什麼可能的影響"},{"start":3840.637,"end":3854.173,"text":"跟委員報告對產業的影響是這樣子因為川普總統主張一向主張美國優先的單邊主義所以對全球的自由貿易的發展將會有影響"},{"start":3855.489,"end":3874.405,"text":"那主要他想他對中國的產品加徵60%的關稅那麼對台灣或者是其他的國家大概就是10%到20%的這個關稅所以我認為應該是對我們在中國的台商影響會比較大"},{"start":3876.345,"end":3891.665,"text":"那其他的國家呢應該大家都一樣因為所有要賣到美國的東西啊課的稅金如果是一樣的話其實是不會太大的影響那部長您的這個觀察相對應我們國的產業政策上是不是應該還有哪些重點的加強呢"},{"start":3892.833,"end":3921.17,"text":"我們在產業上我們當時扶植主要是這個出口的產業我們要讓它趁著這個機會趁這個機會這個市場上面的改變我們要強化它的競爭力好 那經貿辦公室您的看法我們跟美國之間在長年以來已經建立了很多很良好的經貿互動的基礎所以包括我們台灣跟美國的21世紀倡議的談判"},{"start":3923.101,"end":3949.841,"text":"還有包括了我們的TTIC跟EPPD這些雙邊的合作平臺那我們接下來會持續的跟川普新政府希望可以維持這些在新這些平臺既有平臺上面的互動這個副總談判代表您剛才講到臺美21世紀貿易倡議你這個會本席很高興你有提到這一點因為這個是被視為臺美的自由貿易協定"},{"start":3952.723,"end":3974.476,"text":"今天的主題都是講多邊但是這個臺美四季貿易倡議談判其實在我們本國來講是認為我們跟臺美的自由貿易協定所以你認為會不會有受影響以及你們與你的因應對策那本席最在意的在去年6月簽署之後那執行的效果又是如何謝謝委員的詮詢"},{"start":3977.099,"end":3988.651,"text":"那就這個議題呢我們就是會持續跟現在的在川普上任川普政府上任之後的新的經貿團隊持續維持聯繫來確認他們接下來的這個經貿談判的這個策略那當然我們會盡可能的努力去朝向繼續維持在臺美倡議之下那我們有請國部長"},{"start":3999.963,"end":4018.702,"text":"部長剛才你兩項分析啊那美國對中國課60%所以迫使供應鏈一定重整產品更會重視供應鏈的去紅化所以本期就是要講到說好我們國內的所有產業政策您所督導的這個技術過往的技術現在技術師那還有產發署"},{"start":4023.787,"end":4039.597,"text":"那還有工業區等在整個去紅化我們的相關的預算跟的補助跟這個政策的導向上那就是應該要更聚焦了這是本席的一個呼應你也希望政策上能夠聚焦在此去紅化"},{"start":4041.459,"end":4064.833,"text":"其他國家課證10%和20%的關稅美國製造也就一定會成為趨勢了所以臺積電到半導體等半導體廠繼續在美投資這也勢必勢必的趨勢好本席關心的在川普的選舉過程當中他講保付費這三個字他對關稅他對晶片補助很有意見"},{"start":4070.316,"end":4073.259,"text":"尤其臺灣對美國的順差是這麼的大昨天臺積電ADR的月盤跌1.3%川普對於晶片政策顯示一定會帶來衝擊所以臺灣既有的晶片設廠計畫尤其我高雄廠"},{"start":4090.72,"end":4110.457,"text":"是否會受到影響?而且這個台積電確定也一定會至少在他任內一定會深耕美國我的就業機會、我的人才會不會因為而流失?全球供應業也因為川普的當選我相信又有一波的重整潮"},{"start":4111.258,"end":4134.873,"text":"所以我們經濟部又做了哪些準備所以因為順差大會不會取消我們的關稅跟晶片的補助部長你怎麼因應以及我高雄廠的晶片設廠會不會受到影響第三全球供應的再次重整經濟部如何因應報告委員這個台積電他赴美投資我想這個是從川普政府開始"},{"start":4136.241,"end":4139.526,"text":"臺積電赴美投資社長加上供應商將為美國帶來數以萬計的工作機會美國政府對臺積電的重視與支持應該不會改變"},{"start":4150.836,"end":4168.598,"text":"那麼因為他有很多的是法令晶片法是法令所以他也不會那麼那他會取消這個晶片的補助啊這是他所謂的保護費啊他會取消臺灣對一些相關的關稅啊這個部分我們都有一些因應的辦法"},{"start":4169.417,"end":4188.874,"text":"那本席最在意的是我高雄廠的社長會被影響那沒關係部長我做一個提點我們意向就是希望他上任之後至少他內閣團隊也我相信還有一段時間的就職那我想我們要積極的因應好那另外一個議題就是針對我國要加入國際經貿合作"},{"start":4190.475,"end":4218.36,"text":"本席就一直很認為是要務實所以我對現在外交部的工作我非常非常的肯認他把臺灣的經濟的軟實力如何來加惠我們的邦交國甚至潛力的非邦交國他們的做法那當然我也知道我們經濟部也參與其中所以這個部分我非常非常肯定所以在另外一個議題就是如何讓高雄成為南進呂宋島經濟難帶的基地"},{"start":4220.02,"end":4244.261,"text":"好 那這個每日非三國領袖在今年4月的時候聯合聲明了這個全球基建夥伴的投資夥伴關係這也就是我們俗稱的這個呃呃呂宋島的經濟那因為時間的關係我聚焦石化產業經濟部是否現在還在評估石化業參與呂宋島經濟走廊的合作範疇"},{"start":4248.565,"end":4273.525,"text":"現在行政院已經核定的新市經是否還要繼續執行?部長您回答這兩個問題報告委員我想這個區域經濟的發展是近期在國際上不斷地在討論的那麼全球自由化已經滅亡這個我想前幾天張忠謀董事長也有在呼應這個命題所以我們關心鄰近的區域的國家的發展"},{"start":4274.417,"end":4299.467,"text":"那麼至於您剛剛所關心的石油化是不是外移我想這一個應該不是在我們討論的這個面子之內好 非常好那我想這個整我至少我高雄整個石化業全台灣40萬的從業人口我想因為你這句話他們放120個心好 那現在核定的新事情要不要繼續進行呢因為行政院核定之後中油馬上第一件工作就是環評環評在國內沒有一年以上它不叫環評"},{"start":4304.309,"end":4314.229,"text":"所以他需要時間他馬上是要核定的那現在董事長、總經理也都在經濟部核定之下上任了所以新事情要不要如期的進行了"},{"start":4315.712,"end":4342.508,"text":"這個我想要這個院裡面來做決定那院已經合訂了部長這是上次在陳建仁院長的時候他合訂的那現在已經合訂之後到你到你這個經濟部了那經濟部下中遊也接到指令了所以部長新世青是不是按照我們既定的既然石化會沒有外移就當然就是照既定的計畫去執行啊部長那你支不支持新世青現在馬上繼續按計畫執行呢"},{"start":4344.853,"end":4346.765,"text":"這個我想我們還需要跟高雄市政府來討論"},{"start":4348.16,"end":4372.181,"text":"市政府當然我們已經行政院合併的事情部長我們是不是讓新市經繼續因為這個跟市政府沒有關係了環評當然會有這相關的環保相關的這個流程需要市政府的環保局提供意見需要經發局相關的提供意見當然他們一定得提供意見那部長是不是您要支持新市經繼續按計畫執行呢"},{"start":4375.851,"end":4378.386,"text":"我這個回去跟經濟部的同仁討論"},{"start":4379.892,"end":4406.093,"text":"好 部長好 那你就繼續討論我還會繼續問你這個沒有進入狀況喔 部長好 新世青這個是已經爭取了多久然後呢 這個合併了那因為你的一句話好 那我們說要外移大家這個簡直就是炸鍋了然後現在新世青是有關我的環保、公安、智慧管理導入我的這個石化產業整個高質化的全面提升啦"},{"start":4406.613,"end":4435.007,"text":"部長我再問一次新市經是不是按照行政院合併的計畫去執行現在趕快進入到環評的程序好謝謝謝謝委員這個我們就是執行單位嘛已經通過的我們當然會進行好謝謝謝謝部長好謝謝林大華委員部長請回座相關列席官請回座好謝謝消費資金請邱毅英委員"},{"start":4443.018,"end":4453.267,"text":"好 謝謝主席我請一下這個外交部次長請外交部副次長次長很難得到經濟委員會來那個經貿辦經貿辦嚴副總裁是不是也準備一下"},{"start":4466.566,"end":4490.487,"text":"市長早市長我想這個從昨天到現在大概全球都在關注美國的大選那川普先生再度當選美國的總統而他的參眾兩院看起來目前看起來也會是共和黨來掌握所以他應該是久違了所謂的全面執政"},{"start":4491.548,"end":4517.666,"text":"那全球關注川普的當選我想台灣當然也不能置身事外我比較想聽一下到底外交部的分析就是說現在這樣的一個新的局面對於台灣的具體影響是什麼你們外交部現在能不能分析到或者是掌握到川普當選之後在台美關係的進展上面包括我們過去在談的幾項經貿協議上面"},{"start":4522.008,"end":4534.134,"text":"會不會有更進一步的發展還是說會停滯不前?我想聽一下外交部的意見報告委員我想美國是我們最重要的盟邦那外交部"},{"start":4535.038,"end":4560.305,"text":"及我們政府重要工作就是與新當選的美國政府來進行最密切的合作所以現在川普政府新當選我想外交部以及我們政府現在已經積極開始跟川普總統的團隊在進行溝通然後看未來如何合作我基本上以外交部的立場來看"},{"start":4562.267,"end":4568.903,"text":"一個民主、繁榮、擁有高科技半導體科技的台灣"},{"start":4570.869,"end":4595.382,"text":"我剛才講說民主繁榮、自由和平這個絕對是美國兩黨的重大的國家利益我想這個是一個非常清楚的那臺灣也是世界根據各項的指示十大科技國之一美國現在世界上各國都是在爭取作為科技領導國像AI所以我想一個"},{"start":4596.623,"end":4625.248,"text":"願意跟美國合作一個穩定、一個民主、一個自由的台灣絕對是新的美國政府的重大利益所以我簡單請教一下您認為未來台美關係會不會更好我認為基本上可是說這樣子問會速度太快但是您如果我換個角度問你啦您對於未來台美關係是抱持什麼樣的態度是樂觀呢還是悲觀呢還是"},{"start":4626.141,"end":4648.479,"text":"我基本上是對於不僅僅是臺美、臺歐關係我是持樂觀的態度就是我們現在看整體的地緣政治環境的變遷所以你認為未來的臺灣在這個國際的這個戰略地位上面其實我相當樂觀就根據我在六年在法國擔任大使我看到是這樣的一個趨勢好 社長謝謝來我請一下那個經貿辦"},{"start":4653.362,"end":4660.808,"text":"如果說剛剛外交部的整體評估包括次長的認為未來的這個關係是樂觀的臺美關係是樂觀的我想進一步請教經貿辦在我們臺美21世紀的這個貿易倡議協定裡頭在8月的時候其實這個"},{"start":4672.857,"end":4697.99,"text":"在8月的時候美國政府已經把它放進去要進一步來核定了包括戴琪也在進一步的這個發展請一下經貿辦現在的進度到哪裡就是說我們第一批可以什麼時候可以真正開始落實真的開始可以開始執行好謝謝委員的追尋針對我們臺美的21世紀貿易倡議首先要先說明的是這個倡議本身的推動"},{"start":4698.755,"end":4727.582,"text":"以及美國必須制定一個國內法的相應執行法這都是美國跨黨派的共識現在未來他如果是完全執政的話你們推估這個進度會不會加速到底什麼時候可以完成第一批首先第一批協定我們也持續跟現在的貿易團隊在進行溝通他們的基本上給我們的是一個非常樂觀看待的一個進展"},{"start":4728.072,"end":4755.049,"text":"那現在基本上已經在跟國會溝通的過程當中首批協議國會沒有其他的意見那所以接下來可能只剩下行政程序就是我們雙方原來說的行政程序大概是60天完成所以原來推估大概是11月可以完成這些行政程序但可能美國大選時程上是會有一些delay這個部分我是不是也要請經貿辦你們可能還需要確實去掌握一下包括21世紀的貿易倡議協議"},{"start":4756.79,"end":4773.305,"text":"第一批執行的日期跟第二批持續後續的談判的日期接下來是這個全面的租稅協議的部分這個可能也都是經貿辦很重要的一個工作所以這一些進度上面的掌握包括未來跟新政府之間的溝通"},{"start":4775.147,"end":4789.957,"text":"這個可能也要請經貿辦多花一點心思可以嗎?那接下來要請教跟這個今天這個我們主席排定的主題是比較有相關的對於CPTPP我想主責單位也是在經貿辦那台灣其實在過去的幾年我們把"},{"start":4795.382,"end":4808.375,"text":"相關的法令都把它修改了因為我們已經準備好要加入CPTPP但是我想請問經貿辦到底我們現在在推動的進展如何"},{"start":4810,"end":4827.651,"text":"我看這個這個會員國啊CPTPP的會員國在去年他們有一個所謂的奧克蘭三原則就是說要有高標準要有遵守貿易承諾然後呢是要共識絕對於新加入的會員國是要有所謂的這個所謂的奧克蘭三標準"},{"start":4829.972,"end":4850.132,"text":"那看起來包括澳洲的貿易部跟日本多次都是表達中國可能是沒有達到CPTPP的標準那我不知道就你們的掌握台灣有沒有那台灣在這個布局上面在這個推動的時程上面台灣還缺了什麼東西"},{"start":4852.278,"end":4864.515,"text":"謝謝委員的吹薰確實現在的CPTPP針對新申請國確實按照奧克蘭三原則也就是要符合高標準要有過去有良好的貿易承諾的紀錄以及共識訣我們現在已經透過任何各種的"},{"start":4868.721,"end":4883.687,"text":"多邊雙邊的這些架構跟CPTPP的成員國做過接觸那我們所得到的訊息是這些國家對於臺灣的高標準以及符合貿易承諾這些良好紀錄完全沒有任何的意見他們覺得臺灣都可以達到"},{"start":4884.383,"end":4909.608,"text":"那當然他們有請我們共識覺這一個是大家需要共同努力的所以還有特別請我們辦公室以及請我們臺灣要所以你們有沒有進行過任何的遊說包括這個很快的在27號可能會在加拿大要開的所謂的執行委員會包括明年在澳洲那我不知道經貿辦你們有沒有在這個過程裡頭或者是在這個期間去進行任何的遊說"},{"start":4910.788,"end":4919.676,"text":"我國當前經貿情勢分析及如何有效拓展國際經貿空間戰略規劃之相關政策作為：暨申請加入CPTPP進度說明、成員國立場分析與跨部會主任委員會首長、農業部部長、經濟部部長、行政院經貿分析與跨部會主任委員會首長、農業部長、行政院經貿分析與跨部會主任委員會首長、農業部長、行政院經貿分析與跨部會主任委員會首長、農業部長、行政院經貿分析與跨部會主任委員會首長、農業部長、行政院經貿分析與跨部會主任委員"},{"start":4930.905,"end":4957.499,"text":"這些會員國一直不敢對於台灣的入會審查表達任何的意見主要的壓力來源會在哪裡如果照您剛剛講的包括我們這幾個會員國對於台灣都是高度肯定的那我們一直沒有辦法得到首肯入會您覺得壓力來源會是在哪裡會是在中國嗎會不會是中國的施壓所以讓這些會員國不敢在這個時候或者是不敢這麼貿然的表態來支持台灣加入CPTPP"},{"start":4958.559,"end":4983.907,"text":"我覺得CPTPP因為他們尊重他們的共識覺的過程所以基本上他們希望是透過內部已經有達到一致性的一個看法他們才會對外去表示他們的意見OK 好 謝謝好 謝謝邱委員委員來 請官員請回座先為質詢請楊瓊英委員"},{"start":4994.359,"end":4998.635,"text":"謝謝主席 本席邀請我們郭部長請經濟部郭部長"},{"start":5006.618,"end":5034.873,"text":"委員長部長好昨天大家非常關注全球2024年美國大選結果是川普當選第47屆那大家都很清楚川普的經濟政策他的核心是要創造就業那所以我們也看到在今年的這個7月份的時候呢他接受了彭博商業週刊的訪問當中他也提出了首次提出主張"},{"start":5035.834,"end":5058.911,"text":"他說臺灣已經從美國搶走了幾乎百分之一百晶片的產業那我們可以預見也就是川普政府他會要求臺積電更多的生產線拉回美國讓美國有更多的就業機會那我們也看到了我們的臺晶院預測中心的舜敏德主任"},{"start":5060.631,"end":5074.497,"text":"他也預測他說2奈米會提前赴美那在這樣的一個情況之下想請教部長如果是這種情況的時候他不只是影響到臺積電工程師跟相關供應的產業的這個廠商的人才會被美國這個奪走那也會造成我國就業機會"},{"start":5085.902,"end":5102.615,"text":"的一個剝奪在這樣的一個情況之下尤其我們記得在前年那台積電要赴美的時候就有用專機載了我國人這些的工程人才過去所以在這樣的背景之下請教部長如果這些都屬實我們怎麼應對"},{"start":5107.213,"end":5135.351,"text":"報告委員我想這個川普先前宣稱將這個台積電偷走美國半導體的工作機會是我想這個是他可能還是有一些誤解那對他是誤解我認為他是誤解是那事實上也有很多的專家學者都在談論這個議題是就是說臺美雙方在經濟特別是這個半導體供應鏈上面其實是互補的"},{"start":5136.633,"end":5160.74,"text":"那麼沒有台積電美國的大型科技無法取得這個具有價格競爭力的先進半導體晶片所以他想要說2奈米提早進行這個是一個趨勢是一個趨勢但是會提早什麼時候進行是這個必須要美國的這個客戶他們的需求因為什麼"},{"start":5161.567,"end":5178.533,"text":"因為臺灣做製造的然後送到美國就10%的稅金所以這個只是增加他們的成本但是在美國製造它也只有降10%"},{"start":5179.893,"end":5198.705,"text":"所以對這個高科技的東西動輒像這個幾個大型的這個公司他們的獲利不是說幾十%是幾倍的所以他們是沒差,他們是要穩的在台灣製造是比較穩,良率比較高本來就是有這樣的條件"},{"start":5200.726,"end":5218.399,"text":"是那如果照剛剛部長您所說的也就是我們還是樂觀以對但是部長因為換了總統他的作為不是我們可以預估當然我們有我們自己觀察的一個管道跟我們的方向但是我還是要建議我們務必要怎麼樣讓我國的就業率"},{"start":5222.782,"end":5239.654,"text":"可以得到保障同時也讓協助我們的廠商可以讓臺灣這個產業界能夠來穩定我想這個是我們現在所必須要去謹慎的去觀察之而且必須要有超前部署的應對方式"},{"start":5241.332,"end":5268.686,"text":"謝謝委員的這個指教我在上任以後我有提出這個境外關內的這個做法也就是說碰到像川普總統這樣的一個作為的話那麼我們在供應鏈上面就會移動到這個美國去那幫助他們我們這個商務組會幫助他們來談更優惠的這個條件因為是落實他的這個讓美國更偉大的這樣的一個策略"},{"start":5268.746,"end":5288.223,"text":"我們要達到雙贏的這個政策嗎?對,我們是朝這個方向在努力朝什麼方向?朝雙贏的方向雙贏的方向嗎?好,我們繼續努力那接下來本校要請教,他曾經說了,川普先生也說了說你台灣要保護可以啊,你叫保護會啊那你應該要找更多的保護會啊甚至他提出必須要我們GDP的10%"},{"start":5290.285,"end":5302.137,"text":"那如果依照我們2025年的這個預算來看呢我們的國防預算是6470億那等於是增加比2024年增加的7.7%那等於是佔我們GDP的2.45%那如果陳路達所說的要增加到10%那等於是要多少是要2.6兆請教部長可能嗎我方可能會如此嗎"},{"start":5315.261,"end":5337.889,"text":"我想這個是國防部跟外交部他們可以一起努力的部分部長你這麼回答我給你應許也讚許就是說你朝著你的本位也就是他們未來會怎麼樣但是重點在這裡會不會衝擊到我們對經濟的一個發展的影響這個是我們必須要努力"},{"start":5338.729,"end":5355.741,"text":"去站在我們經濟的角度好好的去保護我們的這個產業對不對是朝這個方向嘛那接下來本席要請教也就是說川普先生呢他主要他就是低稅率低利率以及高關稅的這個情況"},{"start":5357.782,"end":5385.8,"text":"他也說囉他說呢這個大家都把便宜的東西呢傾銷到他們那邊去所以在這種情況之下他的一個決策也就是增高關稅增高關稅呢所以我們是以出國為傾向喔那對於出國為導向的國家那勢必會有所影響如果美元貶台幣升那在這樣的情況之下我首先要請教請教主委請教部長"},{"start":5386.801,"end":5414.477,"text":"我們要怎麼樣去保護我們的產業你所當其中的會有哪些產業請教我們大概現在蘇美的這個部分蘇美國的部分因為他是科技國家所以大概科技商品會比較多那我們盡量把這個我剛才有跟委員報告我這個境外關內的這個措施協助我們台灣的這個產業移到"},{"start":5420.791,"end":5439.687,"text":"移到美國去生產但是這個也會衝擊到我國國內的就業率應該是不會因為我們那些產業基本上都在不在國內生產都已經在海外其他的國家上你把我國境外的產業移到美國去生產異地去生產就解除了它的高關稅是"},{"start":5440.928,"end":5455.04,"text":"你是不是如此但是方向是這樣方向是這樣但是部長我要告訴你臺灣的中小企業占了98%如果你競爭優勢強的當然如你所說的你的政策它可以安穩過關"},{"start":5456.221,"end":5473.602,"text":"但是如果它的競爭力弱它也走不了的那這些產業佔我國國內非常重大的一個比例那怎麼辦呢?這個部分我們大概會透過數位化跟低碳化的兩個措施來協助"},{"start":5474.603,"end":5488.954,"text":"這一些比較艱苦的傳統產業讓它能夠升級讓它具有低成本然後可以有高值化的這個這樣的努力我想這樣來協助他們讓他可以堅強自己的這個腳步啊這個方向是對"},{"start":5492.156,"end":5517.495,"text":"但是委員跟你討論的就是說這個腳步你一定要加強是的你的預算也要增加因為我們已經可以預測到我們如果比較競爭力弱而且它是整個它要轉換成本低的它有困難的我們必須要去協助它這是政府非常重要的一個角色扮演務必要達成成功是請委員支持這個預算當中 對不對"},{"start":5518.997,"end":5529.506,"text":"這一定要好好努力好不好謝謝謝謝楊瓊怡委員部長請回座楊委員事先掌握諸位楷模謝謝謝偉智欣請陳廷飛委員謝謝張偉我們是不是請部長請經濟部郭部長"},{"start":5550.495,"end":5578.724,"text":"委員長部長我昨天已經針對所謂的要課保護稅這個部分因為現在已經確定了川普當選那課保護費的部分昨天部長你們講很清楚跟國發會主委說你們不認為這會發生因為這後面所影響的層面太大了因為又有在整個市場面的問題然後甚至是在未來的所有晶片產業的發展"},{"start":5580.504,"end":5597.195,"text":"保護費這個部分可能是一個選舉時候的語言所以我相信很清楚但是現在我們想要了解的是川普當選之後在經貿情勢的改變你們有掌握嗎"},{"start":5598.857,"end":5627.318,"text":"是有的有掌握掌握的程度如何報告委員這個川普主張的是美國優先對那這個單邊主義我想他上任以後會有底下幾個影響我跟委員報告第一個對全球自由貿易的發展將會有一些影響那麼台美產業供應鏈關係因為是屬於互補互利那麼預期雙方仍將會維持穩定的貿易關係那麼川普也曾經"},{"start":5628.539,"end":5648.897,"text":"表示將對中國的產品加徵60%的關稅所以這個我國的業者因應全球供應鏈的移轉已經降低對中國貿易的依賴以及投資那麼我們對美出口的中間財提升美國的生產效率對美國的投資可以創造美國就業的這個機會那麼強化臺美供應鏈的體系"},{"start":5653.962,"end":5682.433,"text":"那如果說他加徵了10%的關稅我沒有什麼影響這個他可能會墊高美國的進口成本美國的經濟受負面的影響導致美國的消費需求下降那麼會影響全球產品對美的出口那經濟部會做什麼事情第一持續的推動境外關內透過以大帶小的方式協助臺灣產業供應鏈到美國拓展商機"},{"start":5683.996,"end":5712.916,"text":"建立強韌供應鏈及擴大合作二、持續與川普政府溝通讓美國瞭解臺灣是美國最重要的夥伴第三、我們會密切關注川普就任後的經貿政策以上報告部長我從這裡面你所講的我想臺美之間從現在已經在協談的這些穩定的經貿關係我想不會改變"},{"start":5714.057,"end":5735.555,"text":"因為川普從過去擔任總統的時候跟台灣基本上就是友好那當然美國優先他們會以美國優先的利益考量但是因為台灣是一個很重要的一個貿易夥伴所以在這個貿易夥伴的潛力之下他也不可能隨意去放棄"},{"start":5736.596,"end":5759.855,"text":"所以這個部分穩定的狀態我覺得我不擔心但是現在大家所擔心的就是說他可能對於全球去課徵這所謂的10%的一個關稅那這個部分我們部長剛剛有說我們會來協助可是如果依照全面性的一個思考也就是說"},{"start":5761.757,"end":5784.328,"text":"如果要課徵這10%他其實還有很多的關卡沒錯現在在整個眾議院的一個結果參眾的部分好像也是川普會佔的比較優勢所以在這樣的前提他提出來有可能參眾這個部分會比較容易通過但是這是事關體大"},{"start":5786.395,"end":5799.447,"text":"這並不是他們決定的他們必須面對他們國內的產業而且關稅提高未必對美國是有利的所以當然要對全球關稅提高10%我相信這一個壓力會出現"},{"start":5805.816,"end":5828.268,"text":"不會是這麼容易但是另外一個區塊是在中國產業加徵60%我反而覺得這個部分依照川普過去的態度擔任總統那四年的態度這是極有可能馬上會發生的那這極有可能馬上發生那這些產業"},{"start":5830.257,"end":5837.024,"text":"這些產業部長你們有去掌控他要加徵60%的關稅的這些產業跟臺灣的關係我們可不可以利用這個區塊這個空窗去增加我們廠商的競爭力"},{"start":5846.914,"end":5866.799,"text":"謝謝委員指教我這部分我們會趕快回去就這個命題就做深入的研究然後我們應該會很快的提出一些協助我們臺商如何轉移他的生產基地如何讓他不會說因為他是made in China所以造成60%的關稅的需要"},{"start":5870.373,"end":5883.624,"text":"而且部長今天吃了兩個區塊一個當然我們要保護可能因為在中國生產而美國在中國產業增加60%關稅而受到影響這是一個區塊第二個區塊是我們台灣的產業怎麼乘勝追擊"},{"start":5892.811,"end":5895.839,"text":"也就是因為它對中國產業增加了60%關稅之後我們怎麼協助我們台灣的產業趕快搶攻這個區塊"},{"start":5902.165,"end":5929.674,"text":"我認為我們應該是要將臺灣的產業高質化沒錯避開中國的這個競爭我們現在就在做啦是我們現在其實因為我們慢慢的已經希望臺灣產業是脫離中國的陰影嘛我們過去是綁在一起的還好我們從蔡英文政府上任之後我們慢慢在做一個切割的動作我們也提醒我們的產業"},{"start":5931.374,"end":5952.265,"text":"也就是事實度依照整個全球的一個氛圍已經不再是一個依賴中國的時代了而是我們要走出自己的一條路所以在這段時間確實我們所有的產業已經都慢慢轉型可是轉型的沒有那麼快那我們甚至可以利用這個區段"},{"start":5954.366,"end":5982.649,"text":"我們趕快把所謂轉型的一個量能提高是量能提高之後讓他們能夠進入到這一個增加所謂的訂單的區塊美國訂單的區塊因為你中國產業增加60%一定會有一個空窗期出現嘛是那我們怎麼去抓住這個時機點這個很重要所以我們要拜託部長是不是可以幫我們盤整到底"},{"start":5983.51,"end":5985.718,"text":"美國有可能在第一波"},{"start":5987.157,"end":6008.643,"text":"對中國產業課徵增加60%關稅的產業是哪些?」現在他沒講嘛現在川普並沒有講沒有講是哪些產業他只有說我會對中國的產業增加課徵60%關稅那麼我們要密切去注意到底哪些那我們要針對這些產業怎麼跟台灣來做一個相對應"},{"start":6014.978,"end":6029.628,"text":"不論是它的量能提高、它的轉型然後進而去搶得這個訂單部長這多久可以把它稍微把這個區塊能夠有一些樣化"},{"start":6030.885,"end":6046.622,"text":"我們會觀察然後我們的智庫會再快速的收集資料然後來整理我認為一個月之內應該可以得到這個部長一個月一個月我們希望這一個月把這些資料很完整的提供給"},{"start":6047.683,"end":6060.216,"text":"本辦公室,然後讓我們如何來協助我們的相關產業搶得這一波可能川普上任之後所面臨的整個經貿的改變。」"},{"start":6070.785,"end":6084.799,"text":"部長請回座不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢不敢"},{"start":6099.22,"end":6127.997,"text":"請郭部長叫外交部的吳次長謝謝經濟部的郭部長、外交部的吳次長委員長保定你先休息一下,我先請教吳次長委員好川普動算當然要先恭喜啦先恭喜,希望台美關係也是越來越好你講話一向也是很精準不過最近有引起一個風暴我們來今天把它講清楚好不好我們今天來講個情緒"},{"start":6130.109,"end":6157.903,"text":"你後來有解釋好像不是接受媒體訪問可是當初的這個媒體是這樣講等於說你接受美國這個國會三報的這個訪問的時候提到兩個然後講引起爭議是兩個你說對美國這個選情選舉這個一方面在觀察嘛一方面非常的擔心very very early 對不對這個引起一個討論這是一個點那我今天要跟你進一步討論更重要的這個報導裡面講到說吳志忠說要是川普放棄台灣"},{"start":6159.417,"end":6161.499,"text":"那我很納悶他還能怎樣讓美國再次偉大因為他將在亞太失去友邦對美國的支持跟威信"},{"start":6176.482,"end":6205.865,"text":"一個一個來這次對你提出主意的是共和黨前亞太主席國際政治貫徹汪耿應該也熟嘛對不對他很有代表性他說你這個講話非常失禮不恰當你怎麼解釋好 那個委員你可以再回到The Hill那個報紙你可以看到他已經把那個拿掉了他已經把它拿掉了下架了是吧你說把他拿掉了是吧不是我 我沒有辦法拿掉是他把那個拿掉就是說"},{"start":6206.803,"end":6220.751,"text":"他代表他承認他聽錯了我在講那是一個禮拜就是在11月2號前一個在10月底的時候我們外交部國傳司通常會請各國記者大概有20個然後我們說我們來閒聊一下"},{"start":6222.096,"end":6249.917,"text":"那個接受訪問跟閒聊是兩個不一樣的事情接受訪問我用字當然會很精準不是接受訪問是聊天有十幾個國家的記者在嗎記者對閒聊而且有那個錄音記錄我們在撥給阿丁他自己承認他聽錯了所以你可以看到那些不存在那至於委員講的方案格律他是根據一個錯誤的報導做出一個這樣的回應所以我就不曉得怎麼去說因為這一句話是不存在的嘛"},{"start":6250.856,"end":6260.087,"text":"市長所以你有沒有講你對這個美國這個選舉是非常非常擔心這個事業有沒有講有吧是有講不是正式嗎不是我是對就是說"},{"start":6261.061,"end":6283.309,"text":"我是對於那個uncertainty very very worried那這個而且我講的是怎麼樣我剛才講提到說我是講歐洲人是因為我回答我當然知道他要問我是台灣的概念對不對那我就跟他講你可以把原文再找回來我說我剛從歐洲回來所以我可以跟那個記者說明說其實歐洲國家是比我們更加擔心的所以我們有擔心"},{"start":6283.829,"end":6311.49,"text":"歐洲比我們更擔心,是不是?那我相信,如果說那個意思在我想每一個國家尤其是美國是我們最重要的盟邦我們當然會對於他們的一個選舉的發展我們會關心,應該是關心不是憂心我是基於我的國家利益我大概要回答出我們非常關心這樣的一個選舉結果對,所以是關心不是憂心,對不對?第二個更重要要問你那句話,你有講說"},{"start":6312.432,"end":6315.468,"text":"要是川普放棄台灣嗎?應該他不至於放棄台灣吧?"},{"start":6316.601,"end":6343.702,"text":"那時候應該是在聊天談到某些狀況對不對放棄台灣是記者提的然後我把他句子再repeat一次對 因為我基本上認為我剛才其實前面我有被接受剛才是回答諮詢我基本上認為一個民主自由擁有高科技台灣是被認為世界上第七大高科技國這樣的國家中華民國穩定存在是符合美國的利益所以他的提問我不認為會成立的"},{"start":6345.26,"end":6352.624,"text":"所以第一個是關心不是憂心第二個你不認為川普會放棄臺灣我們就兩個定論好不好我們請部長來我們來談產業的發展川普動算對臺灣的經濟影響至少有這幾個層面"},{"start":6362.466,"end":6390.453,"text":"這個剛剛有在談了他說進口的商品關稅要提高18%以上大部分是10%到20%是他還要施壓貿易夥伴貨幣要升值美元是要貶值的另外施壓貿易夥伴要提高環保跟勞工的待遇我們的臺美21世紀貿易倡議就是三大面向農業、環保跟勞工待遇這個影響也會很大事實上那影響最大的會是什麼這是我現在要跟你談的"},{"start":6392.553,"end":6413.328,"text":"調查對美貿易順差擴大的國家我另外講一個重要的事情我們去年對美國出口762億美元美國現在是我們最大的前三季今年的前三季美國也是我們單一最大的出口國了我們賺人家的錢去年就賺美國355億美元然後他現在"},{"start":6418.817,"end":6445.983,"text":"他的政見裡面很重要就是要去追查這個嘛然後追查以後他的連帶就是要調高關稅嘛那你怎麼因應我們對委員報告在之前我們想我們過去到美國去輸出到美國去大概是高科技產品比較多啦那這個另一個就是因為台積電到美國去投資所以那個相對的會變成金額會比較高"},{"start":6447.13,"end":6452.656,"text":"那麼在未來我想臺積電會持續在美國再擴大他的投資這個也是一個趨勢"},{"start":6454.588,"end":6476.68,"text":"那我們要讓美國的這一些能夠了解這個是過去我們粗糙到美國是幫助美國建立他的這個產業基礎所以並不是說我賺他很多錢而是去幫助美國建立他的產業基礎所以我想這個要多溝通啦現在最明顯的影響是這樣"},{"start":6479.414,"end":6488.58,"text":"他對大陸要、中國大陸要60%嘛對不對對我們應該是10到20嘛對不對然後事實上大家沒有注意到更嚴重的是更重要的是什麼美國他就沒有關稅問題他是0嘛"},{"start":6490.02,"end":6514.525,"text":"所以剛剛講我們的台商如果是在大陸的他一定從60%那邊他可能就往美國跑或者是回來這是一個點嘛 對不對那第二個對我們來講對我們台灣的台商來講一方面是在中國大陸的一方面如果在台灣的關稅要提高那這個我們要趕快注意好不好所以你剛剛有答應你一個月一個月內你把哪些產業會受到影響更重要的更重要的要怎麼幫他們一個月內要提出來好不好因為現在民眾最關心的我要講是台積電"},{"start":6516.994,"end":6534.389,"text":"台積...因為他已經講說你搶了他的...我們搶了他的台積...那個晶片的生意嘛你也應該很清楚嘛這...這...不是我們搶他的...我們是替他...替美國人心善的啦這會賺錢啦對啦對啦 但是他...事實上川普的美國優先裡面可能是他就是希望...他就是希望美國有製造業"},{"start":6535.029,"end":6552.98,"text":"他們能夠工廠 有工廠能夠重新再開工 讓他們的人民有工作嘛所以這個我老講我們是要小心啦他說的提高關稅的最終目的應該是車啦 美國人有工作機會所以我們第一個人才會不會流過去應該是車啦 車的問題會比較大 電動車啦因為這部分中國去輸出的嘛所以美國應該是都汽車的王國啊"},{"start":6558.723,"end":6559.804,"text":"我昨天問你臺電的這個員工非常辛苦"},{"start":6576.377,"end":6604.962,"text":"他們大台一封天然後去搶修為了我們人民去搶修這個停電那昨天我特別要求特別要求說有兩個事情你們後來做的回覆我們今天把它定下來好不好第一個昨天有提到危險津貼的事情我今天很明確跟葛珀丁說你知道嗎他們冒著生命危險冒著生命危險他們的危險津貼一個小時只有105塊好不好你回去研究把它提高好不好這是第一個第二個有超時工作的問題"},{"start":6606.089,"end":6624.022,"text":"有超時工作的問題有員工跟我講有些超時工作不是就兩天從7-11早上7點到晚上11點有些人連續工作4天這太危險了好不好所以這部分超時工作問題也同時來處理好不好好主席已經站起來了我不要再講話了謝謝委員謝謝張新凱委員部長請回座"},{"start":6631.767,"end":6651.934,"text":"待會鄭正前委員執行之後我們會休息下一位執行請鄭正前委員主席好我想先請一下經濟部郭智輝郭部長經濟部郭部長"},{"start":6653.886,"end":6663.818,"text":"還有我們行政院經貿談判辦公室的副總談判代表嚴惠欣嚴副總談判代表然後還有我們陸委會的副主委陸委會副主委"},{"start":6665.543,"end":6679.451,"text":"委員長部長好那個很感謝主席今天特別安排了就是CPTPP相關的一個主題的議題那我想說經濟部在9月份的時候公布了一個狀態就是說我們9月份的外銷訂單高達538億美元那年增率4.6%"},{"start":6684.133,"end":6710.548,"text":"那基本上是熱的連續7個月都正成長那國發會在9月底也發布了經濟景氣燈號是紅燈表示台灣目前的經濟熱度其實是很好的可是我們在這裡面也看到了幾個點就是說在整個資通訊產業當中ICT其實都很不錯可是在傳產的部分的時候感覺就不是這麼一回事像包括那個化學品的部分負8.5%相較於去年"},{"start":6713.47,"end":6732.164,"text":"的同時間然後那個整個塑膠橡膠製品也負1.1%那我們如果看到整個那個整個傳統工業的部分的時候我們中國的傳產指標基本金屬工業基本金屬的部分相較於2021年基期的時候只剩下74.9%"},{"start":6734.125,"end":6760.805,"text":"那化學材料及肥料只有佔74.6那機械設備是86.9汽車及零件到89.4那我為什麼講這個部分就是說除了ICT高科技產業當中的時候一支獨秀其他傳產部分其實坦白說我覺得是衰退感覺有一點明顯那為什麼提到這個部分是因為以目前來說因為我們的整個高科技產業的部分的時候因為有資訊科技協定"},{"start":6762.586,"end":6786.513,"text":"所以它讓臺灣在相關的高科技產業當中的走遍全球大概都還算是可以的雖然川普說要科增大陸關稅60%可能會影響到臺灣相關的產業可是對高科技來說可能還是相當比較穩健的部分那傳產部分可能就會比較吃力那因為今天我們特別提到CPTPP這部分的時候它對於整個傳產的部分我們希望它能夠有一些比較"},{"start":6787.273,"end":6810.768,"text":"更大的一個保障所以我們很希望知道說整個這CPTPP目前整個的進度到底是怎麼一回事那我想說針對這經濟部因為經濟部這件報告裡面很直接講說針對CPTPP的一個統籌的單位是經貿談判辦公室那我們經濟部對於CPTPP這個部分的時候目前有沒有做一個怎麼樣的努力然後有沒有什麼一個分析報告出來"},{"start":6812.897,"end":6838.399,"text":"這個部分我能不能夠請我的國貿署署長跟您報告可以謝謝謝謝委員首先我們有做國內法規的相關的檢視為了要符合CPTPP的高標準所以目前國內的法規都已經符合這個高標準的要求你們覺得現在台灣要加入CPTPP最大的阻力在什麼地方"},{"start":6839.791,"end":6868.041,"text":"因為奧克蘭原則有三大有三個要求第一個就是要我們要符合這個良好的貿易的這個承諾這個部分我們確實都有做到而且最大的困難點在哪裡我想我們要積極的去尋求所有成員對於我們的支持如果而且呢必須來儘速的來成立我們入會的工作OK來這個部分最大的困難點在什麼地方你們經濟部這邊有沒有評估"},{"start":6870.047,"end":6895.219,"text":"有些國家他有他自己的考量所以我們也特別針對這些國家去強化跟他們的互動甚至有做相關的邀訪我想問一下經貿談判辦公室因為我看經貿談判辦公室當中的一個書面資料當中直接表示因為奧克蘭三原則當中的時候針對我們的高標準還有一個表述貿易承諾的部分"},{"start":6895.959,"end":6910.38,"text":"你直接提到的字眼其實是就是所有的那個與會的國家大概都均無一役表示台灣做得很好那既然是這樣的情況之下的時候你覺得我們現在台灣要加入CPTPP最大的阻力在哪裡"},{"start":6911.869,"end":6939.029,"text":"好 謝謝委員的推詢針對這個我們在透過各種方式去接觸的過程確實大家對於我們符合高標準以及有良好的貿易記錄沒有任何的異議沒有任何的異議嗎沒有任何的問題那當然那我們應該走得很順可是我們從2021年申請9月到現在已經進入第4個年頭了因為前半段他們都是在處理英國的入會問題直到今年他們才開始有時間去處理新的成員國"},{"start":6939.87,"end":6960.392,"text":"那新的成員國他們就是在針對這用奧克蘭三原則來做審視那我們結束的過程呢他們特別提到共識絕這個是希望臺灣要特別去努力的部分理解喔因為我在想說臺灣其實也不是第一次加入國際組織包括APEC、WTO都有加入可是當時的時候很多學者專家都覺得當時有一個很大的"},{"start":6962.148,"end":6968.96,"text":"必須要被考慮的點就在中國大陸的一個態度跟角色在CPTPP當中的時候我們是不是也面臨這樣的問題"},{"start":6971.016,"end":6995.997,"text":"我們在接觸的過程當中並沒有任何一個國家特別跟我們提到這樣子的一個概念沒有任何一個國家提到中國大陸的因素是我們現在還進不來的原因是這個樣子嗎因為他們現在也不是成員國阿對就是因為他們不是成員國所以確實沒有國家跟我們提到這個原因而且他們特別還是集中在就是要符合三原則而希望我們特別在共識局這邊加以努力"},{"start":6996.477,"end":7025.004,"text":"可是當然就我們的瞭解當然有些國家跟中國的經貿往來上面確實是互動比較密切可是這些國家不會單純只有因為這個因素在評估這些新成員的入會因為我在想說從過去APEC跟WTO的經驗過程當中的時候大陸的態度確實是影響到我們是不是能夠順利進去的一個很重要的一個點就是副代表對這部分有沒有什麼反對的看法"},{"start":7026.723,"end":7043.591,"text":"我們必須要講說中國確實是現在第二大的世界經濟體所以它跟很多國家有緊密的互動往來但是畢竟現在的國際形勢的狀況是跟以前是不同的所以我們現在所接觸的往來跟這些CPTPP國家"},{"start":7044.711,"end":7072.534,"text":"告訴我們的反應就是希望我們可以透過各種的方式包括我們的實質的經貿交流展現臺灣可以對CPTPP國家的供應鏈上面的貢獻因為你們現在是整個我們在要加入CPTPP當中的一個統籌的一個單位那很多的單位其實都要參與在這當中對於陸委會這邊你有沒有什麼特別的期待就陸委會應該要怎麼去做能夠會有助於我們加入CPTPP"},{"start":7074.518,"end":7098.841,"text":"因為我們現在都是個別在申請的新成員國所以我們基本上新申請國不會去跟其他國家做進一步的溝通這個是大家基本上面的運作規則所以入委會我們當然基本上不會特別去請入委會來協助但是我們當然在過程的專業意見我們也會遵行入委會的意見"},{"start":7099.58,"end":7114.451,"text":"所以你們沒有特別請陸委會在這個部分就兩岸溝通當中的時候能夠有更積極的一個做法基本上是沒有的目前我們沒有特別請陸委會來針對CPTPP的案件來表示意見"},{"start":7115.25,"end":7144.77,"text":"OK 那我會這邊有沒有要特別做一個說明因為我看到我們所有的書面報告當中的時候對於這部分著墨也都很少那副主委這邊可以稍微講一下謝謝委員關注到這個議題那其實我們的立場很明確因為我們一直都是參與國際經貿組織已經有好幾次像剛剛委員講到APEC跟WTO在這個過程當中我們就是看每一個人的條件"},{"start":7145.29,"end":7161.821,"text":"符合條件的話就應該是可以參與那對於中國如果對這個部分有些政治框架的話我們是要表示要據理力爭的OK 那個我這邊特別補充一下就是經貿談判辦公室這邊因為我們要加入CPTPP這個過程當中因為我們在WTO當中其實是雙軌性的一個方式在做處理比方說我們對大陸這邊的一個貿易的一個條件跟其他國家有一些差異"},{"start":7173.288,"end":7197.641,"text":"我們見到CPTPP可能必須要一致化去處理所以對於這樣的問題我們要怎麼去因應請麥唐先生這邊之後再給我一個很詳細的資料然後對於我們過去這幾年我們做了哪些努力也請給我一個書面的資料好 謝謝好 謝謝政經經濟委員請立行官員請回座現在休息6分鐘必要時延長1分鐘"},{"start":7212.639,"end":7214.1,"text":"我國當前經貿情勢分析與跨部會"},{"start":7235.399,"end":7262.101,"text":"不是中華經濟研究院,是國外領域研究院,是兩界研究院,是兩界研究院,是兩界研究院,是兩界研究院,是兩界研究院,是兩界研究院,是兩界研究院,是兩界研究院,是兩界研究院,是兩界研究院,是兩界研究院,是兩界研究院,是兩界研究院,是兩界研究院,是兩界研究院,是兩界研究院,是兩界研究院,是兩界研究院,是兩界研究院,是兩界研究院,是兩界研究院,是兩界研究院,是兩界研究院,是兩界研究院,是兩界研究院,是"},{"start":7262.261,"end":7276.493,"text":"對,對,對,對,對"},{"start":7280.346,"end":7298.406,"text":"就是你現在所採訪的有限公司的經濟規劃之相關政策作為．暨申請加入CPTPP進度說明、成員國立場分析與跨部會的經濟規劃之相關政策作為．暨申請加入CPTPP進度說明、成員國立場分析與跨部會的經濟規劃之相關政策作為．暨申請加入CPTPP進度說明、成員國立場分析與跨部會的經濟規劃之相關政策"},{"start":7299.307,"end":7308.854,"text":"我國當前經貿情勢分析及如何有效拓展國際經貿空間戰略規劃之相關政策作為．暨申請加入CPTPP進度說明．暨申請加入CPTPP進度說明．暨申請加入CPTPP進度"},{"start":7324.825,"end":7330.988,"text":"就是透過那些政策這樣做的這個默想實施的規劃對,所以對,那但是我們國際的規劃就是它已經所謂的一種規劃了現在的國際經貿分析"},{"start":7342.672,"end":7354.406,"text":"所以接下來就只有完成項目﹚所以現在還沒有報告﹚就是USK要完成一個純粹的認證﹚動作﹚國內法的認證程序﹚那這些動作﹚這一個數據顯示就不剩下"},{"start":7359.452,"end":7368.274,"text":"也就是他可能會在農藥災後上會設一些這個營養的陣容上就是這個程序去發展他對雙邊的問題目前目前還不確定"},{"start":7381.358,"end":7394.644,"text":"我國當前經貿情勢分析及如何有效拓展國際經貿空間戰略規劃之相關政策作為．暨申請加入CPTPP進度說明．暨申請加入CPTPP進度說明．暨申請加入CPTPP進度說明"},{"start":7402.488,"end":7430.734,"text":"有一些管道是在穿梭之路的事實所傾縱的那我們就是希望這些多餘的管道都能實現因為我們經濟CPTPP的規定實際上是在穿梭當地人的中華和社所前面的雙邊的其他兩個是拜登政府的其他的是在拜登政府的但是我們覺得他們的政策上雖然是很順暢的但是他們對於海外土的態度不太一樣要增強更多的雙邊的"},{"start":7431.914,"end":7459.849,"text":"例如農業部我覺得這個營養應該看起來是有高度的供補性所以我們就是會持續透過這些多元的管道希望維持跟傳統的行政院的協議那CPTPP的步驟呢就是你剛剛提到的進步程度部分那我們整立公務小組的這個部分好像是有意義的就是說現在CEP的時間沒有人有人開始整立公務小組嗎"},{"start":7461.77,"end":7482.221,"text":"我們到目前接觸的資訊是好像還沒有提到他們有三個原則他們對每一個新成員都是用這三個原則來審視所以當然每一個國家可能有犧牲經過可能有一些不一而出的這些條件都沒有辦法滿足"},{"start":7482.381,"end":7487.825,"text":"所以我們到目前為止是還沒想像到有哪一個國家已經完全滿足這三個規定"},{"start":7513.302,"end":7528.039,"text":"所以他們會看這些那幾個事情我們有些台商是不是能夠在這三個領域去的他出口大家的貨幣他出口的CPTPP他不是每一個單獨的財源它是他標準的貨幣通常的管理全部都要這樣"},{"start":7625.461,"end":7648.829,"text":"好,請列席官就座好,我們繼續開會,下位執行請鄭天才委員主席、各位委員有請"},{"start":7650.543,"end":7673.57,"text":"我們經濟部部長請經濟部部長還有國發會國發會高副主委部長好那今天這對加入CPTPP這個外交部的報告裡面提到2021年"},{"start":7675.289,"end":7698.244,"text":"9月22號就提出了加入CPTPP的申請已經好幾年了這裡面也提到臺灣必須要符合CPTPP高標準相關的這些規定但是如果我們從這個"},{"start":7704.013,"end":7733.05,"text":"如果我們從這個現行已經在CPTPP主要成員國裡面這些國家我們這樣看的話我不願意念我就不念哪些國家但是那些高標準難道我們不如他們嗎所以這個絕對不是外交部這樣的一個輕描淡寫的"},{"start":7734.489,"end":7759.314,"text":"的一個說法所以這是一個另外一個一定有政治的問題當然這個到底CPTPP我們加入到底對我們有效是好絕對最好的利益還是什麼也有什麼不利的地方以美國川普總統昨天當選的"},{"start":7762.329,"end":7786.444,"text":"他當初就退出啊對不對他有他的考量他有他的一個企業的的一個出身的這個部長你也是企業出身的所以這個我們都必須要去有了這個議題就應該要審慎的去考量當然也許是最好的我不知道好"},{"start":7787.899,"end":7816.71,"text":"國外會的報告裡面提到面對軌跡多變的國際經貿前景及地緣政治風險持續提升確實是應該要去考量然後經濟部的報告裡面也提到這個全球面臨這個惡霧戰爭、中東地緣政治歐美對中國採取關稅措施等挑戰當然你提的是我們沒有不利都很好"},{"start":7818.183,"end":7846.834,"text":"但是因為今天昨天川普當選了這個當你們在寫報告的時候還不知道誰當選也不好寫這個是難免的所以川普在這個選舉期間在7月份提到台灣要付保護費除了現在已經在充夠還要再增加的意思"},{"start":7848.627,"end":7874.917,"text":"他在任內四年他當過總統那年四年我們就美元兩百多億的美元比那個馬政府的八年還多多一倍是這樣的一個四年就兩百多億的美元所以這樣的一個也會造成我們的整個台灣在整個"},{"start":7877.326,"end":7901.825,"text":"有限的這個稅出還要做一些更多的一個調整都會影響都會影響尤其是他在這個訪談裡面特別在專訪裡面還提到晶片還提到晶片部長是不是這樣是的所以這個部分在這樣的一個情勢之下"},{"start":7904.69,"end":7924.363,"text":"因為這是昨天他切實當選了,我們是需要面對這樣的一個問題部長還有國發會都必須要有因應的這些怎麼樣去做一個更宏觀的而且更細緻的去檢討去因應當然了"},{"start":7931.695,"end":7951.94,"text":"最主要的其實就是要兩岸和平兩岸和平的話自然保護會的理由就會減少這是必然的所以部長有時候要勇於"},{"start":7954.946,"end":7983.289,"text":"跟這個決策者當然不是你可以決策的有機會見到賴總統的時候還是要提醒他兩岸的和平所以這個部分部長你的意見如何報告委員這個川普上台以後會不會影響台灣這個申請加入CPTPP沒有沒有不是要問這個不是這個他自己都退出了"},{"start":7984.209,"end":7984.99,"text":"美國對台灣的支持是跨黨派的共識"},{"start":8013.803,"end":8041.595,"text":"美國對台灣的支持支持有很多方式、很多方法但是支持是有沒有這個交換的多還是交換的少這個是一個我們會去努力啦我們會去努力對現有的政府跟未來他川普新組成的這個政府我們會跟他們多溝通部長這很難只有我們"},{"start":8043.027,"end":8064.397,"text":"只有我們怎麼樣去促進兩岸和平他自然那個保護會的時候自然就會就沒有籌碼去講這些所以這個部分這個還是要我們一向是主張兩岸和平我想我們賴總統大概也沒有講說兩岸要去對抗這個"},{"start":8066.53,"end":8086.322,"text":"主張兩岸和平一項就是總統他的這個主張我們也一直在落實這樣子的一個做法這個目前沒有這個方向了這個用詞有時候他的用詞很重要所以這個部分是要去請你去簽的是好這個部長你就還有副主委請回座那個農業部農業部部長這個次長"},{"start":8094.342,"end":8120.088,"text":"這個你的報告裡面也提到這個加入這個CPTPP的話也會有一些影響現在沒有加入就以目前的狀況你也做了分析嘛做了分析而切實加入之後可能將對部分農產品造成影響所以這個部分你也必須要跟把怎麼樣的影響到底多嚴重"},{"start":8121.755,"end":8147.353,"text":"也要跟這個外交部跟相關的部門提到像行政院也要做做這一審詳細的一個說明所以這個部分是一個那川普他都不要加入他已經退出主動退出一定他有他的考量到底是怎麼樣當然不一定跟他一樣我們要以我們自己這個尤其是農業我們畢竟是以農為主"},{"start":8150.615,"end":8176.985,"text":"那另外就是最後主席已經站起來了就是農業部謝謝農業部公告成功長濱漁港後來東和鄉還有這邊的那個花蓮的也公告了漁港的部分但是這個經費那個經費真的是因為整個你們可能還是用以前的那個數額啦能不能再檢討因為現在地方都在反映太少啦"},{"start":8178.289,"end":8192.694,"text":"太少了 趕快檢討好不好是不是能夠再調整好 謝謝委員支持我想所有的農業的議題都謝謝有委員支持那救助的部分我們每年都會來檢討我們會來保持這次就要檢討了我們會納入檢討 謝謝還沒有發嘛 還可以檢討我們會納入檢討 謝謝好 謝謝政經財委員 官員請回座下一位質詢請謝一鳳委員"},{"start":8218.636,"end":8231.403,"text":"謝謝主席我想要請我們經貿辦公室的顏慧欣顏副總在那邊還有我們郭部長經濟部郭部長主席好郭部長你認不認識你旁邊這個美女我今天看到我們經委會來了一個新的美女"},{"start":8249.887,"end":8260,"text":"嚴副總代表我不太認識你不太認識我相信大家都不認識所以特別請他來副總代表我想請問一下現在"},{"start":8267.372,"end":8290.731,"text":"川普總統已經當選了所以這已經不是scenario這是一個事實而川普總統他所說的就是他反對在拜登總統時候所建立的這個印太經濟的架構那如果印太經濟架構未來會不會廢除你覺得有沒有這樣可能性好 謝謝委員的推訊"},{"start":8294.152,"end":8316.537,"text":"就印太經濟架構我們確實有看到川普總統在競選的時候有提到印太經濟架構可能不是他當初所設想的一個政策方向那所以呢如果要依據過去川普總統在第一任的這個經驗他上任之後因為他就對於TPP他確實他就退出了TPP的這樣子的一個"},{"start":8317.436,"end":8340.838,"text":"做法的話當然可能對於印太經濟架構我們不排除或許他會再評估那這個是我們所看到的但是我也要補充的就是實際上印太框架就是Quad這個活動是在川普第一任當總統的時候把它提升到總統層級所以也代表川普總統他是一樣對於印太的這個合作"},{"start":8341.198,"end":8351.048,"text":"是相當重視的所以我相信他對於印太區域的推動不論透過哪一個方面的面向的強化所以你認為他不會廢除這個嗎他當初說要廢除對就是說印太經濟架構本身的內容或許他會再做進一步的檢討那WTO呢他會不會廢除"},{"start":8361.75,"end":8372.039,"text":"就WTO的部分我必須要講的實際上川普總統在第一任的時候也是批評WTO非常多但是WTO他實際上涉及到的現在的會員已經有166個會員所以對美國來說如果他要去"},{"start":8377.123,"end":8395.973,"text":"所謂的對川普總統的意思他要廢除應該他只是在指的是美國是不是要評估退出WTO但是說實在的如果美國退出WTO的話反而是讓其他剩下的其他國家對美國本身是不用遵守WTO承諾未必對美國是最好的一個方向"},{"start":8396.753,"end":8424.582,"text":"所以如果川普他不支持WTO那對於藉由WTO所形成的這個ITA的相關的這樣子的協定會不會有影響經濟部長這就是你的議題了對不對ITA對啊會不會有影響我們請我想是這樣子就是說其實這個全球自由貿易啊"},{"start":8425.427,"end":8441.854,"text":"以此這個是張忠謀董事長在前幾天所講的那是之前就已經倡議這樣事實上我們看到當這個川普上來以後因為他的政策就是讓美國更偉大所以過去的一些思維應該確實是會改變但是國際的狀況我想未來會趨於區域經濟化"},{"start":8450.635,"end":8470.814,"text":"所以區域經濟化我們可以看到像過去幾個地方我們可以明顯的看到歐盟可以看到東南亞國協這些都是屬於區域經濟的部分我個人認為就我所學的我認為未來會走向區域經濟更能夠代替這個所謂的全球自由貿易化"},{"start":8471.656,"end":8497.834,"text":"目前我們出口到美國的現在佔的比重是22%那有很多的部分是在高科技的部分那這個部分未來在川普總統上任之後會不會對於相關的關稅會有所改變這個關稅應該是都會改變但是我們的對策就我剛才也報告過就是說我們的對策其實是利用"},{"start":8498.891,"end":8524.977,"text":"境外、關內這樣子的一個措施我把臺灣的一部分的供應鏈帶到美國去落地生產因為供應鏈集中落地生產它有一個優勢就是說它在logistics上面的cost完全降低彼此供應鏈之間的資源可以快速所以對我們在美國的廠商有非常重大的優勢"},{"start":8526.457,"end":8542.99,"text":"所以是不是未來臺灣的半導體的供應鏈必須變成你整條都要帶到美國去生產是不是也不是說只有必須到美國因為市場在哪裡我們的供應鏈就應該到哪裡去美國、去歐洲"},{"start":8544.582,"end":8569.345,"text":"就要走出去是不是因為這個全球已經沒有辦法因為這個已經打破那個因為這個區域的經濟共盟這個一定會形成的那因為這個地緣政治的關係嘛那包括這個極端氣候的影響所以這個市場已經完全改變所以張忠謀董事長非常的厲害他有先見之明他可以推論到說這個自由貿易已經死了"},{"start":8570.171,"end":8598.697,"text":"所以我個人是遵從這樣的所以臺積電必須要出走這個是市場在哪裡我們就接近市場所以這樣的一個做法我個人認為是正確的所以如果臺積電出走那剛才也有委員問到的就是兩奈米的會不會移到美國去我們有國內有一些科技的管制兩奈米要去的時候最起碼我們1.4奈米要在國內已經是落地生產"},{"start":8599.946,"end":8626.998,"text":"那我們現在1.4奈米有沒有辦法現在還在那個所以沒辦法2奈米我們都還沒生產啊所以2奈米是沒有辦法去不是現在不是現在那Eventually一定會去嘛當然啦那要等到1.4奈米出來的時候才會去這個是我們國家的規定不會去那未來會我要再問一下那個副總代表"},{"start":8632.247,"end":8649.314,"text":"我想要請問喔如果就是說川普上來了他重視的是就是雙邊的這個貿易的這個談判嘛是不是那有沒有可能臺美的FTA有沒有辦法啟動我們會看到確實川普政府比較喜歡走雙邊的路線那目前我們臺灣跟美國之間已經有啟動很多的雙邊的其實這幾年來都已經建立"},{"start":8661.417,"end":8678.186,"text":"所以包括我們的臺美的21世紀倡議EPPD到TTIC都是我們運作良好的雙邊管道那我們會在這個既有的基礎之下希望尋求可以跟川普新政府有更多的往來互動的空間當然我們也不排除有機會如果"},{"start":8681.516,"end":8698.124,"text":"如果我們要重啓FTA的時候他會不會要求台積電的2奈米必須要到美國去生產他可以藉由這個框架是不是在FTA的這個談判的時候會不會有這樣的可能性"},{"start":8699.355,"end":8722.97,"text":"通常如果談FTA的話只會談到關稅、投資保護類這樣的一個概念那所以對於這些產業要如何去移動然後或者要分散他們的布局這個不一定會是在既有的FTA架構之下去談論的意義所以也不會要求台灣改變我們既原有的法令是不是"},{"start":8724.264,"end":8749.598,"text":"改變法令這個當然是雙邊如果有共識的標準之下那會去改變法令但是不必然一定會去改變我們在科技方面的這個法令的要求所以他不一定會但是有可能會去改變是不是就如果是我們雙方講好的特別是按照國際標準所應該要遵循的國內法規的話這個部分當然就會討論是會有檢討的空間好 謝謝"},{"start":8763.186,"end":8763.927,"text":"請李玉玲委員"},{"start":8783.744,"end":8792.191,"text":"謝謝主席請郭部長跟經貿談判代表的嚴副總請嚴副總代表副總談判代表委員好部長我們臺灣是出口導向的這個貿易的這個經濟的模式尤其是我們的GDP有6成都是來自於出口貿易所以我們現在要談的"},{"start":8813.753,"end":8837.368,"text":"這個CPTPP就是非常的重要尤其是我們看到我們妥協了很多的他們的要求像美國我們開放了萊豬的進口也解禁了日本福島的食品就是希望我們的CPTPP能夠更進一步但是現在我們看到了我們提出了申請現在已經幾年了 部長"},{"start":8840.81,"end":8850.101,"text":"應該是三年三年了還沒有正式的進入也沒辦法做一個工作小組那這個原因你知道嗎"},{"start":8851.311,"end":8876.297,"text":"因為他們之前都在審議這個因素審議了3年啦對部長12個會員國我們是屬於共識決的嘛對不對他要不要共識12個會員國都要同意啦那現在的話我們看到3年過去了我們還是沒有那但是我們是出國導向的經濟模式那現在我們碰到了瓶頸就是未來我們要如何去解決我們這個經濟全球經濟的這個模式呢"},{"start":8880.441,"end":8885.287,"text":"我們能積極地我想再努力談判辦公室主導這一個"},{"start":8887.917,"end":8913.189,"text":"這件任務那其他的包括我們經濟部包括其他相關部門外交部等等都很努力在跟這個所謂的會員國因為是共識決所以我們都跟會員國在利用各種國際的這個場域那大家彼此在能夠是部長你講的我們都做了我們經貿代表在那邊我們都做了做了三年了"},{"start":8913.971,"end":8928.407,"text":"哪裏不足哪個國家反對沒有只要聽你講話大家都非常歡迎我們進入在非常歡迎沒有阻礙沒有困難的情況之下三年又過去了你有看到我們的前途光景嗎"},{"start":8929.588,"end":8954.308,"text":"未來大概什麼時候會被審核正式進入呢?至少讓我們可以工作小組有的話工作小組就會組成啊還是沒有那尤其日本你看我們開放了那個福島核災的食品進來了我們也都都已經妥協了讓國人的健康的疑慮我們也都做到了這些我們都吃了"},{"start":8955.561,"end":8983.251,"text":"國人不該吃的也都吃了這種情況之下難道美國沒有幫我們背書一下嗎?像日本也可以幫我們背書一下嗎?都沒有嗎?雖然說我們當時的這個TPP是美國它現在不是CPTPP的會員國但是有美國的背書也就不一樣啦所以你看來自於進口啦我們還要怎麼做才能夠順利進入報告委員這個可能跟美國沒有關係因為美國已經退出了"},{"start":8984.091,"end":8992.739,"text":"推出拜登的時候他也沒有加入現在又是川普上來我想美國會進入CPTPP應該是"},{"start":8996.96,"end":9019.893,"text":"不會了啦 因為他退出的他是我們全球的大國他有跟很多國家有一些貿易的協議嘛所以他如果跟我們背書對我們是有幫助的 對不對那好 那部長沒關係 我就請我們原副總他以為他退出的國家幫我們背書這個在邏輯上面可能會有一點比較勉強啦多多幫我們疏通啦 把我們的障礙給移除掉他都退出了 他不可以幫我們疏通對 也給我們幫忙啊"},{"start":9023.015,"end":9025.619,"text":"我們是不是我們12國叫我們都尋求幫忙阿那好那我請教一下那日本為什麼還沒有跟我們這個非正式的幫我們簽訂這個談這個貿易協定的協商呢"},{"start":9036.431,"end":9053.569,"text":"日本我們都有在努力啦那為什麼還沒有日本是一個比較韓他跟我們關係不是很好嗎為什麼還沒有因為我們通過就像剛才委員你所垂詢的這個福島的這個海產我們也是最近才開放的"},{"start":9054.742,"end":9074.648,"text":"開放很久了沒有今年喔今年開放 今天已經11月了但是我們三年過程都沒有過日本跟我們非常友好嘛所以我們是不是要準備跟他來做這個貿易的協商我們跟日本的貿易也是非常穩健的在進行有進行有談嗎我們的副總代表"},{"start":9083.088,"end":9102.7,"text":"謝謝委員我們實際上跟所有的CPTPP的國家都有透過多邊、雙邊我請問日本有沒有進行非正式的貿易協商我們要講的所謂的非正式貿易協商對日本有沒有我們當然有有那現在為什麼還沒進行"},{"start":9106.465,"end":9132.141,"text":"我們有進行跟他們做在其他的管道上面的一個...為什麼其他管道?不能正式嗎?非正式嗎?的貿易協商?所有的現代的接觸都是非正式的所以跟日本有談?談好了嗎?我們跟所有的CPTPP國家...日本有沒有?你不要...我在問你日本日本是CPTPP國家其中一位,對所以有非正式的貿易協商了?談好了?有接觸過那談了怎麼樣?"},{"start":9134.74,"end":9156.625,"text":"基本上這個就是在增進他們對我們的瞭解然後確保我們確實有我跟日本人這麼友好這麼熟了這個他們的福島核災食品我們也吃了那還有什麼沒有做到的還要怎麼樣還有什麼困難你談的結果有什麼困難在這一點有什麼困難還要我們做什麼還要我們妥協什麼"},{"start":9158.802,"end":9184.054,"text":"跟委員報告就是這些議題基本上日本他完全認為我們是符合高標準也是有良好記錄的都符合對都符合了現在有什麼困難我想我們的唯一的挑戰只是共識決這個部分他請我們要去努力跟各個會員國溝通所以我的意思說要先進行非正式貿易協商嘛對不對所以好部長"},{"start":9185.273,"end":9210.926,"text":"我們現在看到的就是我們都做了一些努力那但是大家都想目前我們跟大陸的關係不太好那所有當然會員國對大陸有所忌憚所以這個雙邊關係之下就沒有辦法來支持我們台灣但是只要一個會員國反對我們就沒辦法進入那我們跟大陸一起申請這個CPTPP是差不多的時間"},{"start":9214.066,"end":9219.491,"text":"如果說大陸這邊還一直有打壓的情況之下我們就會很困難是不是應該是這樣的吧"},{"start":9223.201,"end":9246.743,"text":"應該就如同委員所垂詢的這個狀況是 如果是這種狀況的話我們為了要讓經濟的體制跟我們這個整個市場開放的這個挑戰我們自己要有開創我們的新的經濟貿易的這條路嘛那所以說這個雙邊的FTA我們就必須要積極的來談論是的那這方面我們有努力哪些國家嗎我們都一直在努力哪些國家已經在做的"},{"start":9247.56,"end":9261.601,"text":"我們現在這個在進行的部分那個委員這個部分我在這裡不太好發表了我們是不是簽一個這個MDA然後再來跟你報告對 可以到辦公室報告是嗎"},{"start":9262.335,"end":9280.988,"text":"我可以到辦公室跟你報告那還是要我們抬機密報告如果牽扯到國安的部分就是要機密報告我們部長有慢慢進入狀況了可是我們看到現在連加拿大我們的全鄰的牛肉我們都進口了"},{"start":9281.548,"end":9305.534,"text":"所以加拿大也是我們都可以去談所以本席在這邊希望我們很多的顧忌跟我們的困難點我們必須要想辦法去突破尤其是FTA我們要去努力讓我們在大陸的打壓情況下又沒辦法進入CPTPP的情況之下我們在區域經濟當中的整合部分我們就要找出一個突破點"},{"start":9306.334,"end":9312.536,"text":"不要讓我們成為經濟的一個孤立好不好謝謝 謝謝委員追尋 我們會努力謝謝林議員委員部長 請回座來 下一位質詢請陳昌明委員"},{"start":9343.373,"end":9368.402,"text":"謝謝主席首先有請我們經濟部的郭部長還有我們那個經貿談判公室委員副總委員副總委員好部長好那過去針對台灣加入CPTPP這個議題"},{"start":9370.322,"end":9394.709,"text":"我一共總執行問過5次在委會執行問過14次那加入CPTPP及掐尖之語貿易協定對臺灣尤其傳統產業的影響非常大所有非常關心那本期在108年剛好再有一個聚會"},{"start":9396.667,"end":9418.488,"text":"得到一個消息日本邀請中國大陸加入CPTPP但是那時候跟執政黨也就是民進黨執政的政府報告他們言者沉沉、聽者渺渺我發覺行政部門都沒有放在心上"},{"start":9419.745,"end":9439.852,"text":"結果真的在110年9月16日中國大陸提出申請假日CPTPP我們臺灣在9月20日才馬上更進提出申請我還要特別說一下"},{"start":9442.045,"end":9460.766,"text":"因為我是非常關注CPTPP,但是我是收貸戶。這個情形是怎樣?當時新加坡有人來請託一件事情,剛好裡面有一個成員是新加坡貿易談判的副代表"},{"start":9462.025,"end":9481.818,"text":"他來選我的話是關於收購案、公司法我那個第幾條條我從來沒有噴出來請我開委員會的公聽會我也記者了但是我記者該跟他聊天的話那一年剛好是新加坡當輪值時期我就問他"},{"start":9483.849,"end":9497.083,"text":"說我們台灣加入CPTPP到底怎麼樣他說日本在邀請中國大陸來參加我說沒有邀請台灣他跟我講你們台灣是不是要武力"},{"start":9498.444,"end":9515.593,"text":"我就是因為欠了這個人情我打了一次來拜託一個公聽會我只打三分鐘給部長沒接也沒聽我打給你們府會、國會聯絡組一下我就覺得是這樣的事情結果我被關了45"},{"start":9518.755,"end":9538.408,"text":"四個班內所以這個司法制度完全亂人我都不認識所以我是真的是受災戶所以我今天為什麼對CPTPP我大概都能了解這樣但是我剛剛看到你們在執行的回答的時候那個人"},{"start":9540.666,"end":9562.258,"text":"那個副總談判代表你口才很好邏輯也非常好但是我發覺你地位很顯赫外交部臺灣美國事務委員會的執政委員喔這很大捏是行政院經貿談判的代表但是我覺得你在講話沒實在"},{"start":9564.494,"end":9581.883,"text":"如果我們要加入CPTPP第一個要有公司權才能進入它那個工作小組但是你台灣有成立工作小組有沒有幾個單位有沒有常常開會你告訴我我就知道有沒有"},{"start":9584.841,"end":9607.536,"text":"我現在跟你講那裏面好幾個國家你要去分析我是不要別人啦我看你在說的吞吞吐吐我看你的眼神我有跟他們聯絡就有聯絡連日本說盤肉堅實的友邦我們就沒辦法人說新加坡你也沒辦法人說澳洲也沒辦法人說馬來西亞你也沒辦法人說"},{"start":9609.947,"end":9624.388,"text":"那個比較那邊的國家我就不講了所以你們要他進來不進來我實在講你們一鼓起人會進來遙遙無期因為這裡面有很多政治的角力你們都不敢講"},{"start":9626.489,"end":9649.589,"text":"愛跟義中的政策都有關心你們真的是官員的話有擔當把這個困難講出來讓大家曉得嗎大家在某某乎乎我曉得你們這樣的態度我就不要那麼激進我也不會被關也不會被起訴真的是無妄自在連網我先跟你們提了這一點第二點關於川普當選"},{"start":9652.765,"end":9669.419,"text":"你要記得張忠謀在他運動大會講了兩句一句話自由貿易已死自由貿易已死地緣政治很重要那現在官貿帝國的川普商業要全部加稅我覺得對台灣我們實在應該處變不清"},{"start":9673.649,"end":9692.667,"text":"兵來將擋,誰來處冤?在於那裡但是你要發覺到現在的選舉有兩派的實力跟臺灣高科技有關係一個是比爾蓋茲的勢力一個是馬斯克的實力我不知道你怎麼看,稍去研究一下那整個策略戰法"},{"start":9693.948,"end":9714.882,"text":"我是覺得臺灣有它本身的條件羊毛吃在羊身上只要我們實力夠堅強我們的高科技裡面沒有關係你要怎麼來怎麼來但是那個那個元夫啊我們部長有一個他常常在講的政內關外關外政內你解釋一下"},{"start":9719.127,"end":9740.63,"text":"你要瞭解臺灣的經濟政策你才能講出來不是我看他有瞭解你嗎他的將內將外你跟我解釋一下你不懂好那個謝謝委員的問題我試著來說明我的理解試著不是馬上就解釋"},{"start":9743.425,"end":9768.273,"text":"經內關外我們就是希望我們可以把我們就是前幾百大的這些產業可以拉進來台灣那基本上我們不會去限定他一定要有特別的關稅區而是希望這些強大的投資的產業會進到台灣來跟台灣互相的交流部長我覺得你的idea理想很豐滿現實很骨感"},{"start":9771.107,"end":9782.762,"text":"你要知道你經濟部投資臺灣方案什麼回來方案三大方案裡面南臺灣、臺灣在裡面那我剛剛聽了一個質詢我覺得很重要勢必要講"},{"start":9787.108,"end":9807.126,"text":"我以為你是把臺灣這些關於高科技企業產業放在台積電的附近你要把它工廠過去任何一個產品我跟你講你有拉了整個台積電還有KOWAS的封裝跟測試其他的產業你要拉過去"},{"start":9808.206,"end":9824.89,"text":"那生產的效率沒有?你把台灣的產業拉過去,台灣這邊空這樣我這邊要台灣開一家工廠,日本要開一家工廠,歐洲要開一家工廠,美國要開一家工廠不能這樣招臺、臺灣的,這要企業、工廠企業出來,我想說你這個倉庫,原來你要開工廠"},{"start":9832.469,"end":9859.202,"text":"不要這樣,我告訴你生產規模要大才有競爭力啦到時開工廠到時虧錢啦到國外沒有保障的啦報告委員,你所這個指導的是非常正確我們企不會一下就開工廠沒有經濟規模絕對不會出我們的企業、企業料資我告訴你你有經濟規模我出處理的都一定會參與你如果開了台灣的"},{"start":9861.697,"end":9888.887,"text":"IG產業、電子產業整個帶過去的話我跟你講是一個風險地緣政治我保護我保護澳門誰來保護我們台灣變成什麼人家餐桌上的菜單我跟你說我發覺台灣一點自主能力沒有怎麼不會搖擺一下等一下我靠大陸等一下我靠美國你台灣就有對話我不曉得這個政治這個樣子的話"},{"start":9893.118,"end":9913.332,"text":"實在很感嘆,不要把臺灣玩完,臺灣人真的很努力,有情務的精神。而關於川普當選,免驚免驚,反正肚臟都膝蓋一樣的情形,我們只要存走應對就好,就看你了。"},{"start":9915.939,"end":9944.313,"text":"我覺得多邊貿易很難了啦你要雙邊貿易趕快去完成啦尤其在東南亞我們只要的主力在這個地方啦好不好謝謝謝謝委員來 官員請回座謝謝陳昌明委員語重心長發人 我要跟你語重心長發人深省令人敬佩現在為質詢"},{"start":9949.321,"end":9955.631,"text":"請賴瑞榮委員好謝謝主席先請國部長請經濟部國部長"},{"start":9963.527,"end":9985.81,"text":"部長辛苦了部長我首先先請教一個問題其實綠電是我們未來的重要的一個方向對不對這個經濟部絕對是全力的發展綠電這也是未來的趨勢對不對是我看到最近有一篇報導其實也是跟我這幾年的感觸相當的就是說在發展綠電過程中的時候其實國家的政策"},{"start":9986.571,"end":10014.733,"text":"鼓勵的政策包括甚至短購費率政策其實這個都是正確的在那邊加速但是也很多投入進來可是到了地方執行的時候遇到了很多的問題我看到現在很多的弊案都是幾乎是在地方執行上出了問題甚至遇到很多的綠店的蟑螂他要你就是你要取得土地你要取得所有這些的時候地方政府甚至有說地方的一些議會甚至有一些的黑道人士就介入部長這樣的問題要怎麼做解決"},{"start":10016.909,"end":10034.583,"text":"報告委員我們在這個應該是在10月份的時候這個院長我們行政院院長那就針對這個議題他直接到我們台南那在台南對這個所有的這個媒體都宣布"},{"start":10036.119,"end":10056.209,"text":"未來對綠電的問題他絕不會允許任何的綠電蟑螂或者這些不法的廠商在臺灣再做下去所以他帶著經濟部、法務部、農業部直接到臺南去就這個命題公開的講"},{"start":10058.47,"end":10082.375,"text":"不允許任何不法的行徑再繼續進行下去所以我們建立了一個平台經濟部、法務部跟地方政府我們希望大家可以在這個平台上面任何的不法都請檢舉任何在溝通上的困難透過這個平台大家來解決所以"},{"start":10083.789,"end":10104.121,"text":"也許現在這個外商控訴臺灣發電這個困境我講是昨天的這個媒體在這個報導經濟部也有提出一個非常完整的這個說明這個是所以部長經濟部知道這件事情嘛對不對這樣的狀況在地方上在發生你知道嘛對不對但是我們"},{"start":10106.3,"end":10120.629,"text":"認為只要有不法我們絕對嚴懲我要講的是這個裡面有許多部分確實是現在遇到的一些問題當然有些弊案也已經被抓出來那我希望經濟部站在前端就是應該在制度面上怎麼去做好"},{"start":10121.129,"end":10137.681,"text":"不要讓那個弊端持續的發生因為一來是傷害到了臺灣的綠電的形象國家的整體形象政府的整體形象二方面也是讓這些不孝的人在地方上不斷地用這樣的方式他提到了什麼機關說卡就卡"},{"start":10138.722,"end":10166.128,"text":"講到了什麼毫無道理的所求這是不是事實在我地方上我聽到有許多確實有這樣的狀況每個地方的狀況不一樣但是我認為其實經濟部跟法務部要找到一套制度面去做這個解決把這些阻斷掉之後你才能夠讓有心來推動綠電的這些業者能夠持續的投入在台灣不然往往最後會變成是劣幣組良幣而且往往會讓整個綠電的發展將來遇到很大的一個困境"},{"start":10166.713,"end":10184.595,"text":"是的 謝謝委員的垂詢這一部分我們都在討論那已經設置的辦法我們在這個綠電平台上面都有一些辦法讓業者可以這個非常穩健部長 什麼樣的辦法也不知道再講得更具體一點那我是不是可以請市長跟你報告"},{"start":10186.065,"end":10213.338,"text":"各位報告第一個就是剛提到的所有的程序讓它公開透明化所以要把所有的這些標準定出來所以行政院也要求經濟部跟農業部相關訂定這第一個第二個所有的大型的投資個案我們經濟部成立單一窗口來受理有任何的遇到任何投資的障礙或是投資的困難由我們單一窗口來受理第三個就是打擊綠能蟑螂的犯罪由經濟部跟法務部任何的這些情資我們就送到這個平台裡面去做相關的一個"},{"start":10214.218,"end":10234.987,"text":"偵查、調查、偵查跟處理如果所有的業者的部分在投入這些裡面的他們所遇到的一些困難的時候我認為其實經濟部跟法務部要去介入去了解他們遇到的困難是什麼樣的問題如果他們遇到的困難是遇到這種綠電的蟑螂刻意的惡意去阻撓甚至於恐嚇甚至於去這種威脅的方式的話"},{"start":10237.248,"end":10256.148,"text":"這個經濟部門法務就應該要採取行動我們認為應該主動因為所有有信號投資要做的其實你們也都清楚也都掌握到應該用這種單一窗口方式直接去協助才能夠嚇阻掉這些當這樣的方式更強力嚇阻這些人就不會去利用這個去賺取這些非法的利益這樣才有辦法讓"},{"start":10257.289,"end":10279.771,"text":"整個投資恢復信心同時間讓所有願意來投資這個綠電的人有信心好不好希望部長跟署長持綠我也希望每個月你們的執行狀況也一份報告給我這邊知道好嗎我也希望在綠電上面我們是持續有所進展來讓全世界知道台灣在支持在推動綠電上的一個決心的好不好部長每個月把你們的推行狀況給我一份報告"},{"start":10281.064,"end":10288.743,"text":"是的我們會把這些這個管制考核的這個部分送給這個再來我上不小心先請教一下江署長好不好"},{"start":10293.085,"end":10317.604,"text":"來部長你先休息了謝謝首長我先請教其實我知道因為你過去長期也在美國待了一段時間包括加拿大然後長期在國貿我想問一下這一次的川普的當選對台灣真理上會不會有什麼樣的影響是謝謝委員的垂詢首先因為川普他是比較主張單邊的這個主義所以在貿易的部分應該會對全球都會有受影響"},{"start":10318.445,"end":10330.814,"text":"那另外呢因為他有說之前在競選的期間有表達可能會對全世界的出口到美國的產品會加徵關稅10%的關稅所以如果萬一他實現了他的這個競選的這個這個政見的話其實會對全球出口"},{"start":10341.209,"end":10348.171,"text":"美國都會有受到影響自然也會影響到美國境內相關產品的售價第三點因為他有表達說可能會對中國的產品課徵60%的關稅這個部分我們也在密切的關切當中我們認為說因為現在川普他才宣布當選"},{"start":10365.58,"end":10385.974,"text":"那據這個他實際上任的時候還有一段時間所以我們會利用這個時間積極的來密切的注意川普他新政府他所採取的相關的經貿的政策那台灣有沒有什麼因應之道在面對他過去提出來的這些他的那個萬一他落實了他的那些想法的時候"},{"start":10386.363,"end":10406.418,"text":"我想很重要的話是我們必須強化對美的貿易論述讓美國知道台灣是美國非常重要的供應鏈來源而且台灣跟美國在經貿部分其實在供應鏈部分是互補互利的"},{"start":10406.818,"end":10418.388,"text":"尤其我們出口美國的大部分產品其實都是中間材這些中間材也是給美國的客戶來使用來運用來繼續的製造相關的這個終端產品所以我們必須積極的來強化我們相關的論述首長那這樣"},{"start":10426.474,"end":10448.509,"text":"臺美貿易倡議的部分協定的簽訂的話有沒有辦法在年底前來做生效我們首批協定已經完成在國內的部分我們的法律程序已經完成現在最主要是要看美國的部分對 那美國的部分會在年底前簽署嗎還是會等到美國他必須要提出一個向國會提出報告"},{"start":10449.349,"end":10476.997,"text":"那我們預計在提出報告之後必須要有一段時間來生效所以有可能會到明年嗎這個部分可能要看美國他國內的情形好我們希望持續努力好不好是請持續再努力好謝謝好謝謝代理人委員請回座代理人委員難得那麼準時啊好下位執行請林楚瑩委員"},{"start":10487.134,"end":10490.779,"text":"謝謝主席主席有請經濟部郭部長以及我們陸委會的李副主委"},{"start":10499.127,"end":10522.663,"text":"委員好部長早安你們看午安了好我今天要問的題目因為時間有限我先快速的講完之後再請經濟部跟陸委會來做回應今天是11月7號那麼中國的淘寶以雙11為名義其實在台灣可以說是鋪天蓋地的灑下了廣告那就是淘寶免運但是昨天我在外交委員會之"},{"start":10524.445,"end":10543.463,"text":"質詢國安局的時候就已經講了其實這可能是另外一個會台政策而且是一個養套殺國安局說他會跟經濟部跟相關單位來做聯繫但是我希望在這裡好好的跟經濟部還有陸委會來做一個瞭解到底是撿到便宜還是免費的最貴中國現在因為產能過剩包括他們的經濟下行"},{"start":10547.867,"end":10566.592,"text":"所以很多東西都用補貼的方式送到國外去包括我相信部長非常清楚電動車的議題但是這種養是不是把淘寶的消費者養大然後用降價的策略的方式其實是要打擊國內的其他電商"},{"start":10567.532,"end":10591.741,"text":"淘寶現在在台灣有落地嗎?我們在管理上面經濟部有沒有注意到?那為什麼說是套?因為他可以要我們的個資要我們的交易的所有的資訊還有就是包括我們的信用的相關的付款的資訊所以這是套出我們的個資再加上中國的商品如果一旦進來台灣之後如果有一些爭議沒有落地的話"},{"start":10592.421,"end":10606.002,"text":"到底要如何來保護真正的臺灣消費者的權益最後一個是殺我希望部長還有陸委會注意看現在淘寶按照它的流量來講臺灣是淘寶的第二大市場"},{"start":10607.792,"end":10632.623,"text":"過去中國最喜歡用的方式就是先補貼把所有他們的競爭對手殺光之後再把價格往上拉抬這就是中國慣用的伎倆養套殺而在台灣如果面對中國一直用這種方式做商品的傾銷然後用這種所謂給予恩惠的方式先把台灣"},{"start":10634.939,"end":10649.807,"text":"進內的這些電商打趴之後未來你就變成什麼東西都要仰賴中國所以我們的中小企業有沒有受到影響中小電商有沒有受到影響我希望經濟部跟陸委會能夠研究這個問題好嗎部長報告委員我想您的這個槌尋非常的正確"},{"start":10656.038,"end":10671.877,"text":"那對於這個部分我想這個電商的部分是屬於這個我們會跟這個數位部來合作針對這個命題我想數位部也在強化我國的這個電商的能力了"},{"start":10672.558,"end":10699.164,"text":"那對於這個我們會有什麼樣的影響我想中國東西大概都是價格因為您剛才在講他有補助所以價格上面會相對的低我們當然是幫助台灣的這個廠商提升他的競爭優勢第二個我們來看他有沒有違反我們的這個商業的這個規範如果有的話我們就禁止他在台灣做這個promotion"},{"start":10699.304,"end":10714.639,"text":"包括他在現在的捷運啊在公車站啊或者是其他的這種交通大叔運輸工具上面的廣告那這個部分到底這種跨境電商沒有落地台灣可不可以這樣打廣告我也希望經濟部跟陸委會去查好嗎然後給我一份報告因為"},{"start":10717.682,"end":10734.063,"text":"外委會的委員時間比較有限那我也不期待說部長現在馬上但是我希望這樣的問題能夠成為包括拓寶要不然你就落地阿他為什麼不能落地因為他有中資的成分在裡面嘛因為他有黨政軍在裡面嘛對不對來陸委會"},{"start":10737.386,"end":10754.978,"text":"委員我們也有注意到這個問題那這個也涉及到我們對陸資的管理那我們會會同相關單位來積極處理這件事情好可不可以給我一個時間點主席是不是可以請就是他們給我一個報告好請提供報告看委員需要多久時間你們多久時間可以出來"},{"start":10756.854,"end":10757.554,"text":"下位執行請陳培宇委員"},{"start":10782.756,"end":10795.271,"text":"好謝謝主席那有請經貿談判辦公室還有經濟部經貿辦經濟部還有外交部經濟部來郭部長外交部吳次長好謝謝主席"},{"start":10800.458,"end":10800.698,"text":"委員會主席"},{"start":10819.278,"end":10831.657,"text":"可以讓我們相關產業界的朋友們不要那麼害怕跟擔心那我們知道其實CPTPP這件事情可能有另外一個變數是來自於中國想要更積極的加入CPTPP就你們目前掌握到的訊息跟資訊"},{"start":10834.008,"end":10855.801,"text":"中國加入這個CPTPP我想他應該是不會很快因為這裡面有一些有三大原則在那三大原則裡面大概他有兩個原則是不是符合高標準這些他都應該沒有一致的看法所以我判斷他是沒有那麼快"},{"start":10856.201,"end":10878.556,"text":"部長你講這一段我覺得大家會比較有信心因為你剛剛的表情非常有信心而且你來自業界所以我們目前就先相信你的判斷可是我覺得因為其實在野黨的委員都一直說我們不能只有靠近美國不能只有跟美國友好好像提醒我們雞蛋不要都放在同一個籃子裡這個論述我相信來自產業界的你也可以理解那我們回過來看"},{"start":10879.937,"end":10901.405,"text":"因為川普的當選對大家的那個擔心我想我就不再多說時間有限可是我們看到因為英國如果期盼英國完成加入CPTPP之後可以有更具體的行動支持台灣那你怎麼看你剛剛點評了關於中國的部分那部長你怎麼看英國的部分讓我們台灣的產業界會相信自己會有另外的好朋友繼續支持我們"},{"start":10902.318,"end":10929.265,"text":"我相信英國應該會繼續支持我們臺灣你也很有信心因為歐洲的這個他們的思維剛才我想那個吳次長他也有說過沒錯沒錯所以他們應該會支持臺灣所以你一樣充滿了信心然後會以這個信心帶領臺灣的產業界往這裡走去我們一定增強我們臺灣這個產業的競爭力我相信有非常多人需要部長您這樣的承諾"},{"start":10930.365,"end":10953.912,"text":"把這樣的承諾轉換在政策作為上我相信會讓國人更有信心因為不是只有老闆們要擔心所有領薪水的員工們其實更擔心我相信部長你一定非常的清楚謝謝委員是我們來看一下最後CPTPP這個協定如果我們回到馬來西亞來看關於我們台灣跟東南亞的合作目前我們看到你們相關的報告裡面談到教育服務業、健康相關服務業"},{"start":10955.513,"end":10979.335,"text":"視聽服務業還有電子商務服務業上面這個發展這幾項服務業目前都跟馬來西亞還有文萊的市場准入有關那先不管臺灣什麼時候可以順入加入CPTPP目前我們在這幾項服務上跟東南亞國家推動的投資保障方面目前有沒有您認為可以更多加強合作的力道或者是方法我們想要聽聽看部長您的意見"},{"start":10981.396,"end":10997.523,"text":"我看了這個四個項目我想這個對台灣來講都是非常有能力來協助然後進入這個馬來西亞的這個領域畢竟這個譬如說教育服務業台灣的教育服務是做得非常好台灣有160幾家大學"},{"start":10998.183,"end":11022.554,"text":"所以我們都歡迎世界的人到臺灣來念這個大學包括馬來西亞的僑外生都來臺灣念大學部長您剛這個舉例非常的貼切而且可能也可以幫忙協助臺灣的公私立大學解決少子女化的困境但是經濟部的角色這樣的承諾很棒但有沒有機會經濟部更主動的跟教育部展開跨部會的溝通協助這些"},{"start":11023.815,"end":11034.61,"text":"我們跟那個委員報告我們經濟部有一個二加四計畫也就是說來台灣念兩年的書在台灣工作四年念兩年的書是不用錢的這個是由國家給這個學雜費但是他的這個生活費是由經濟部給的"},{"start":11039.517,"end":11062.905,"text":"我覺得這個部分我們聽到部長相關的承諾我們辦公室也會針對相關教育或者是我今天舉的這些例子積極再跟經濟部討論也希望後續可以看到更多協助國內產業發展突破這個困境好 謝謝部長 謝謝主席謝謝委員謝謝陳培文議員精準掌握發言時間謝謝主席謝謝 非常感謝好 部長請回座下一位質詢請黃仁委員"},{"start":11074.437,"end":11075.579,"text":"有請經濟部部長及農業部次長"},{"start":11086.464,"end":11109.534,"text":"委員好你好錫光三人要三把火要新的政策新的改革那這一次我們康瑞這個強力的颱風造成了我們花東地區第一個受害者就是臺東長濱因為他的颱風眼剛好就在那個地方那造成了農漁船、農漁業"},{"start":11113.456,"end":11137.803,"text":"的災害那我第一時間也有打電話跟農業部那第一時間農業部也馬上行文到了我們這個東海岸能夠趕快搶救補助那這個方案當然是好事這個讓他們安定也放心所以你們從11月5號到11月13號這麼短的時間的申請案"},{"start":11143.103,"end":11166.415,"text":"那第二個所申請的補助你們引用了舊法所以造成我們很多的農損包含漁船的損害我們應該先改革制定一個新的方案第一個如果辦損要如何的給他們給予他們的一些損害的賠償這個補助第二個全損"},{"start":11167.768,"end":11188.789,"text":"所以現在你們引用舊法所以也造成我們移民對政府的憤怒為什麼?物價指數都上漲了物價指數上漲結果卻沒有給他們予以調整補助的方案造成民怨第二個我們講一個台電"},{"start":11190.856,"end":11201.363,"text":"臺電我們動用了430名全力投入搶修有關於在全臺裡面臺電統計截至12月2號的下午全臺呈停電負有95萬點7其中92.9萬戶已修復但修復亦9乘7當然剩下的2.7萬尚未復電"},{"start":11217.812,"end":11238.209,"text":"是主要集中在花林、花東地區的這個部分縣市山區本席感謝我們臺電在第一線搶修的作業人員的辛勞但請問為什麼花東地區及部分山區這麼久都無法復的原因所以根據在"},{"start":11239.47,"end":11256.875,"text":"十二月二號下午三點造成全台停電負由九四五萬七千零六十一負其中九四二萬九千兩百八十負已修復但修復九成七兩萬另外兩萬七千負尚未負電是在"},{"start":11257.845,"end":11283.67,"text":"前幾天的事情不是現在的數據是在前三天以前的數據主要集中就在花蓮、臺東這個地方但是為什麼臺電在搶修的過程裡面是否考慮結合民間的力量一起搶修這樣的話才會負電力才會提高這是一個本席的建議那第二個我們農業部"},{"start":11285.55,"end":11304.74,"text":"你們過去引用的這一些補助的辦法造成我們很多現在的農損的農民包含漁船的漁民對你們農業部的不滿而且經過了幾年你們的舊法到現在都還沒有做一個修正"},{"start":11306.676,"end":11334.691,"text":"請問一下經濟部還有我們農業部你們有什麼改進的方法、方案報告委員你剛才講那個臺電的事情我們臺電大概這一次因為花蓮臺東在山區的部分因為那個道路那個我們的那個車上不去那有一些樹倒塌了所以我們的救災人員沒有辦法馬上很快的時間到達不過我們所有山區的這個電都在48小時裡面"},{"start":11336.272,"end":11360.484,"text":"主席給我一分鐘最後我請農業部農業部發農業部的部分我跟委員報告我跟總統一起去勘栽總統有講這些都要改進好謝謝希望盡速改進以能夠讓我們的農人得到更多的這樣的一個保障讓他們的損失降低到最低好不好這是最明確的好謝謝謝謝黃總委員謝謝"},{"start":11363.746,"end":11368.811,"text":"謝謝黃委員,我是一視同仁好,請官員請回座下一位執行請馬文君委員謝謝主席,麻煩請經濟部國部長還有國發會副主委國發會高副主委"},{"start":11394.444,"end":11416.522,"text":"首先我是不是先請教國發會副主委我們在嘉義無人機園區的部分我們大概要購地還有包括相關的經費有編了68億多因為我們在國防的預算上面有看到那這個部分是不是由國發會出的錢然後給軍備局然後再交給中科院執行是嗎"},{"start":11417.442,"end":11440.747,"text":"對 我跟委員報告是嗎 回答這個這個案子是由經濟部來主責那有分軍用的跟那個沒關係 你告訴我現在68億多是不是由國發會出的錢應該是 基本上它要不是公建就是科技預算不會由國發會來出看有什麼預算是有什麼預算不好意思 我不知道因為是經濟部好 那不然請部長好了好 謝謝"},{"start":11443.408,"end":11448.992,"text":"報告委員我們現在這個無人機的部分嘛是不是對無人機的部分大概是分…園區、嘉義園區就是我們現在有變我們現在有一個部分要買地然後還有包括廠房什麼這些的經費有編了一筆68億多因為就國防部他們給我們的資訊是說有國發會出的錢那剛剛顯然國發會也不知道這個部分那這一筆錢是哪裡出的這一筆錢是因為我們在這個嘉義啊"},{"start":11473.251,"end":11482.311,"text":"要設置兩個我知道我知道部長我說的是誰出的錢可能是公建的預算公共建設的預算公共建設由哪裡出來"},{"start":11483.632,"end":11499.321,"text":"就是公共建設的部分出的錢我們經濟部跟國科會吧一起出的錢68億多這個我還要再了解一下那麻煩確認以後再給本席相關的資料那我接下來請部長請教部長因為您來自業界就我們臺灣整體的包括產業園區、科學園區或者其他發展的各種園區"},{"start":11508.687,"end":11516.274,"text":"有沒有哪一個部分這些園區是由政府出錢買地、出錢蓋廠房、出錢蓋廠棚甚至出錢蓋測試的廠房還有出錢去買測試的儀器跟裝備台灣目前有沒有哪一個產業園區是這樣子就我所了解的科學園區"},{"start":11533.757,"end":11554.543,"text":"就是地不能賣就是政府的地對那是租的有些啦廠房標準廠房也是政府蓋的哪裡標準的廠房哪裡比如說哪一個新竹科學院新竹科學院所有的廠房所有的廠房不是所有的廠房標準廠房所以你現在這一個是所有的都是政府要把它蓋好喔"},{"start":11555.143,"end":11557.704,"text":"我現在講的是說有沒有哪一個是所有都是政府出錢幫他買地蓋廠房有沒有沒有沒有嘛好那因為就這個部分嘉義無人機本席要在這裡強調其實非常認同我們這一次可以藉由去紅色供應鏈可以參與這個包括美國或者其他世界國家的接軌去發展無人機的產業鏈本席非常認同可是"},{"start":11583.993,"end":11601.719,"text":"我們很擔心在這個過程當中我們的做法會是亞苗助長或者就是他已經奠定了未來可能不太會成功的一個這樣子的因子所以我特別提出來因為你來自業界如果用這樣的方法時間的關係像我舉一個今天農業部也在場農業部過去曾經為了要讓我們的青農可以有發展的機會"},{"start":11609.741,"end":11621.492,"text":"他在整個台塘的園區租了大概將近百公頃的土地那時候種植香蕉請了專業的人士有很多的植物醫生也好很多專業的人去教他們種香蕉那時候每個月還給他薪資"},{"start":11626.357,"end":11630.178,"text":"賺的錢是歸他們可是賠錢就太農發去吸收到最後不但血本無歸而且賠了很多錢甚至還毀了我們的整個農業包括那幾年香蕉的收入還有它的產值都非常非常的差因為它不用承擔責任今天如果我們台灣要發展這樣子的一個無人機的產業"},{"start":11650.163,"end":11669.213,"text":"部長您是來自業界我相信您大概也知道說我們會擔心的是什麼我們贊成可是你不要用政府的錢讓大家這些對象會是誰所有人都可以來參與嗎那這樣子會不會對我們的這個整個產業造成影響這個部分部長你有什麼看法我們會記取那個委員槌尋的這個經驗"},{"start":11672.615,"end":11692.207,"text":"就這個部分因為包括那時候香蕉很多它大概都是變成甚至是垃圾它不是當飼料而已所以我們希望它要成功的話可以讓它有機會可以做到最好的程度就這個部分是不是部長可以提供給本席一個相關的資料"},{"start":11695.029,"end":11710.942,"text":"主席讓我講完好不好主席你讓我講完我請他提供資料而已部長麻煩你提供相關的資料給本席就你們的分析為什麼這樣做是可行的還有他的利弊得失好不好好謝謝好請回座本席主持會一向公正一視同仁而且請你尊重主席尊重本委會"},{"start":11730.981,"end":11751.879,"text":"來 現位委員應當是會很準時的這位委員是非常模範的來 請戴思寶委員謝謝主席 各位先進有請經貿辦的副總代表閻副總代表還有經濟部的郭部長還有農業部的杜次長國會的副組委好不好 幾位掌管理層"},{"start":11760.916,"end":11761.679,"text":"我先請教經貿辦的了"},{"start":11764.738,"end":11792.055,"text":"這個現在CPTPP啊我們每天在講甚至於在上一次這個萊豬的公投的時候還有我們的外交部的長官啊還說啊加入CPTPP這個吃了萊豬可以加入CPTPP啊這個吃了日本核食可以加入CPTPP啊結果都吃了都喝了結果什麼都沒有你們跟我們講現在進度怎麼樣有沒有工作小組請問你有沒有工作小組"},{"start":11793.587,"end":11798.55,"text":"為什麼英國跟我們同時間申請英國已經加入啦阿台灣咕咕咕阿 什麼都沒有阿 公批幾波"},{"start":11821.418,"end":11842.133,"text":"這個講起來是很讓人生氣阿阿現在來說也是說CPTPP多重要就多重要阿結果什麼進度都沒有前面的兩年實際上CPTPP的成員都在處理英國的入會阿對英國為什麼就可以呢我們同時間送件的呢請問你是不是中國大陸的台阿 有嗎"},{"start":11844.07,"end":11860.228,"text":"現在這些成員他們只是在用三個原則在判斷所以都沒有嘛那川普當選以後大家都知道啦那更困難啦因為他原來TPP的時候他說要退出啦我們都很清楚啊來我請教部長啊請教部長啊是"},{"start":11865.72,"end":11894.691,"text":"你是說中國的問題?先請教那個副總代表好了加入CPTPP我們的整個關稅可以省多少?關稅可以省多少?如果加入的話我們的關稅?對,不是到會員國、其他國家關稅可以省多少?你也不知道,來這裡都沒準備好不好請這部長來,先你才知道,省力人"},{"start":11897.078,"end":11913.89,"text":"關稅可以省多少?關稅應該不是這個最主要的目的啦當然是主要目的阿 怎麼不是呢?如果是CPTPP應該就是最惠國的關稅嘛對阿 就是最惠國關稅 彼此之間省阿我就很具體的問你一個東西啦請問你現在我們的進口車的關稅多少?幾%?請問 部長 國務部長進口車的關稅多少?"},{"start":11921.297,"end":11944.74,"text":"我們大概CPTPP的國家現在有15%的產品需要繳納關稅目前大概都是在石化、鋼鐵、金屬、紡織等產業那這些大部分都是在越南、日本跟墨西哥的市場我時間因為馬上被主席控制了你跟我講一個東西現在的進口車的關稅多少"},{"start":11947.484,"end":11956.166,"text":"進口車的關稅是17%日本零關稅美國2.5%我就問部長為了要我們這個能夠來拖一把加入CPTPP請問加入CPTPP是好的嗎對不對好不好我沒有這方面的專業"},{"start":11977.469,"end":12000.296,"text":"好不好這個經濟部長這樣那我就問你你要不要主張我們降進口車的關稅來幫忙幫一把可以讓我們國家比較順利的加入CPTPP可以這樣講嗎任何幫助國家加入CPTPP的產業我們都盡全力來協助"},{"start":12001.676,"end":12029.686,"text":"就包括進口車的所有的產業只要能夠讓我們加入CPTPP我們都盡全力來扶持好啦主席站起來我不要浪費他時間謝謝委員謝謝大使法委員精準的發言謝謝啊那官員請回座所以我自己一直認為啊遵守會議發言時間是國會議員基本的素養主持會議公正也是主席該做的事情"},{"start":12030.97,"end":12046.104,"text":"我一向貫徹我希望說各位同仁能夠尊重主席尊重其他八月委員的權益也讓會議能夠順利來進行好 我們繼續質詢李昆辰李昆辰李昆辰不在現在會質詢請麥玉珍委員"},{"start":12064.319,"end":12089.421,"text":"謝謝主席有請部長請郭部長委員好部長好再請教部長一下現在我們新住民跟移工也是成為我們臺灣經濟的一部分所以說是無法"},{"start":12091.487,"end":12116.888,"text":"缺失的知識請問部長新住民移工的族群合作發展還有就是具有外國的特色還有就是結合在地發展的產業還有經濟所以有沒有什麼經費或者補助或者協助這樣子的增加地方的產業的規劃嗎"},{"start":12119.721,"end":12134.473,"text":"報告委員我們現在經濟部有推動很多的計畫在幫助這個地方的產業包括中小微的企業那我們在推動的過程裡面包括我們推動數位化"},{"start":12136.57,"end":12150.724,"text":"推動AI、推動低碳化這些都是有經費在輔助這些中小微的企業那麼對於這個您所垂詢的這個新住民的這部分我們都是一視同仁"},{"start":12151.618,"end":12170.776,"text":"那另外一個就是說我們協助這個是文化上面的這個溝通跟差異的時候經濟部現在因為在推動剛才所講的這個AI的人員的訓練所以我們現在引進在所有世界上所有的橋外生"},{"start":12171.94,"end":12192.575,"text":"就是新住民將來的新住民的這些來頭橋外生來台灣讀書兩年工作四年那麼讀書的這個兩年呢這個費用由國家來支出這包括學費雜費生活的費用生活的費用由經濟部來承攬"},{"start":12194.865,"end":12214.241,"text":"經濟部來承攬所以他來讀書其實是不用花自己的錢這個是我們部長就講的是進階的啦但是針對就是在地創生在地創生的話我們也希望說沒有限任何的族群不會"},{"start":12215.182,"end":12226.273,"text":"但是你知道我們台灣在就是不要說其他國家東南亞在台灣不管是新住民或者投資移民有多少人嗎"},{"start":12229.685,"end":12246.774,"text":"這一部分我沒有研究對 所以這個部分的話我們有沒有要重視剛才你說中小企業輔導但是中小企業輔導有沒有包含就是新住民在台灣登記營業的輔導目前為止是沒有"},{"start":12251.676,"end":12256.299,"text":"針對就是在這邊的他們有登記營業他們有在台灣已經創業的輔導這個部分我們希望我們經濟部這邊是不是可以建立一個新住民中小企業的輔導針對他們在台灣創業不容易所以我們希望說經濟部這邊是不是有一個方案"},{"start":12274.588,"end":12300.996,"text":"有一個團隊針對就是新住民或來台灣就是他們來去創業因為現在以前是有身份證他們才能登記營業但是現在呢只要拿到台灣居留證他們都可以去登記營業因為在疫情過後我們政府很有善希望他們是合法合規所以針對這一塊的話"},{"start":12303.138,"end":12313.61,"text":"以臺中來說就有超過300多家但是呢創業不容易但是經營更難所以我們希望我們經濟部這邊是不是有一個團隊有一個規劃有一筆經費為了他們來去輔導對新住民在臺灣創業更有幫助"},{"start":12322.52,"end":12349.291,"text":"好的 我們回去會參考 謝謝部長希望部長往這個方面就幫助到跟不同族群的人 好的謝謝麥玉珍委員精準的諮詢 謝謝好 請官員請回座離會議還有三分多鐘啊我左判右判 一判再判還判不到人但會議還是要走到12點"},{"start":12352.062,"end":12379.019,"text":"忠孝斌、忠孝斌、忠孝斌不在洪洪海、洪洪海、洪洪海不在邱志偉在蔡宇、蔡宇、蔡宇不在蘇曉慧、蘇曉慧、蘇曉慧不在林大甫、林大甫、林大甫不在陳冠霖、陳冠霖、陳冠霖不在賴慧媛、賴慧媛、賴慧媛不在黃建斌、黃建斌、黃建斌不在"},{"start":12381.089,"end":12409.412,"text":"岳英之岳英之不在林倩琦林倩琦林倩琦不在主席在但是沒有人當主席也沒辦法質詢啊這個部長我這個一堆資料各位歷史官不用了我準備了一大堆資料想要質詢但是按於一次規則你沒有主席啊我不能上來質詢所以今天質詢改為素面"},{"start":12412.591,"end":12435.644,"text":"任期發言委員除不在場之外,區域發言完畢,訓導結束委員張家俊、林德福以及主席所提書面質詢我們列入紀錄刊登公報書面質詢及位及答案部分請相關單位一周內以書面答案並複製本位本日議程處理完畢,現在上位"},{"start":12445.402,"end":12446.522,"text":"需要跟上尉討論我一直在問你說"},{"start":12469.873,"end":12474.076,"text":"所以他是侯孟楷後面嗎?我聽到侯孟楷我就一直懷疑他"},{"start":12501.701,"end":12504.87,"text":"本期視頻到此為止,感謝收看。"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}