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程由委員洪文凱等二三人提出質詢"},{"start":1834.442,"end":1852.357,"text":"軍醫教育部部長鄭英耀、衛生福利部郭明、健康署副署長賈淑麗、法務部檢察司司長郭永發、數位發展部資源管理司司長劉信仁、內政部警政署刑事警察局副局長陳永旭、財政部官務署副署長陳世豐及相關人員及喜達夫說明。"},{"start":1852.837,"end":1867.604,"text":"六、委員另一届等4委員提出書面諮詢．決定一、報告及詢討完畢．二、委員所提書面諮詢或相關資料列入紀錄並刊登公報．三、隊委員諮詢要求提供相關資料或未及答覆部分．且相關精神技術與書面答覆．通過臨時提案三項．訓導完畢。"},{"start":1871.742,"end":1874.344,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案。"},{"start":1894.204,"end":1900.788,"text":"二年度中央政府總預算決議檢証第二幕一般學術研究及評議預算繼續凍結一百萬元書面報告請查照案"},{"start":1916.823,"end":1941.732,"text":"第五、審查中央研究院函．為113年度中央政府總預算決議．自然及人文社會科學研究．預算凍結100萬元書面報告．請查照案第二案及第三案僅進行詢答首先我們介紹在場委員目前沒有委員在場其次我們介紹與會官員"},{"start":1944.953,"end":1963.717,"text":"中央研究院廖俊智院長歡迎院長副院長周美銀副院長唐唐副院長彭信坤這邊好幾位都是新上任的歡迎秘書長陳軍浩副秘書長林怡君執行秘書邱繼輝"},{"start":1972.792,"end":1999.254,"text":"副執行秘書張典顯副執行秘書兼主任副執行秘書兼關鍵議題研究中心主任李超黃學術諮詢總會副執行秘書呂妙芬數學研究所所長李元斌物理研究所研究員李尚帆化學研究所所長吳台偉"},{"start":2001.755,"end":2030.612,"text":"地球科學研究所所長鍾孫玲資訊科學研究所所長廖鴻元統計科學研究所副所長黃信成原子與分子科學研究所所長魏晶明天文及天文物理研究所所長彭威理應用科學研究中心主任魏培昆"},{"start":2032.928,"end":2035.373,"text":"環境變遷研究中心主任陳於高。"},{"start":2038.36,"end":2045.203,"text":"新聞科技創新研究中心主任．植物及維生物研究所所長吳素心．細胞與個體生物學研究所所長李齊鴻．"},{"start":2063.371,"end":2086.072,"text":"生物化學研究所所長呂同瑞生物醫學科學研究所所長陳怡莊生物醫學科學研究所研究員烏哲元基因體研究中心主任李志浩分子生物研究所所長陳懷榮"},{"start":2093.966,"end":2106.256,"text":"農業生物科技研究中心副主任葉信宏生物多樣性研究中心主任陳國清生醫轉譯研究中心執行長楊瑞兵"},{"start":2107.797,"end":2120.011,"text":"台灣人體生物資料庫代表人楊淮一﹑歷史語言研究所所長李貞德﹑近代史研究所所長雷祥林﹑"},{"start":2122.093,"end":2148.49,"text":"經濟研究所副所長楊淑君﹖你好。歐美研究所副所長王志明﹖你好。我待過的社會學研究所所長陳志柔﹖你好。中國文哲研究所副所長何建興﹖你好。臺灣史研究所副所長林文凱﹖你好。語言學研究所所長林若旺﹖你好。"},{"start":2149.81,"end":2173.34,"text":"政治學研究所所長吳崇禮法律學研究所所長李建良人文社會科學研究中心副主任詹大謙數位文化中心召集人陳希遠院本部秘書處處長曾國祥院本部總務處兼男院服務處處長兼代處長張剛偉"},{"start":2177.625,"end":2198.394,"text":"院本部法治處處長劉秉興。你好。院本部學術及儀器事務處處長陳建章。你好。院本部國際事務處處長孟子清。你好。院本部資訊服務處處長陳林志。你好。院本部制裁計轉處處長邱文聰。你好。"},{"start":2201.855,"end":2216.234,"text":"院本部主計室主任羅友聰,您好。院本部人事室主任周佩芳,您好。院本部政風室主任洪信志,您好。行政院主計總處公務預算處專門委員李培元。"},{"start":2221.26,"end":2223.563,"text":"行政院主計總處基金預算處專門委員黃厚吉現在請廖院長進行報告,院長有10分鐘請"},{"start":2243.975,"end":2256.333,"text":"感謝大院邀請我們來這邊做業務報告並解凍預算及預算報告下一頁我們針就我們簡單的願務運作跟大家做個報告詳細內容請參照書面報告"},{"start":2259.557,"end":2284.578,"text":"我們在今年7月舉辦了第35次院士會議那這是在新冠疫情後再次以全體全實體方式召開共有近200位院士參與其中我們選出了第34屆院士暨名譽院士新科院士26名人數為有史以來最高名譽院士2名下一頁"},{"start":2286.158,"end":2313.917,"text":"我們最近也成立AI推動辦公室推動跨域創新整合其中包括幾個大項AI for PI、AI for全部的中央醫院的同仁我們進行多場研討會近期重要的成果包括緣分所利用短波紅外螢光開發了次世代用於螢光標定細胞的分析技術"},{"start":2315.339,"end":2333.126,"text":"地球科學所與德國地球科學研究中心合作研究了蛇紋石的非均向性影響中層地震之分布應科中心與輔仁大學國泰醫院等團隊合作"},{"start":2334.175,"end":2336.096,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案有關中央研究院函．為11"},{"start":2355.686,"end":2375.538,"text":"生物多樣性中心與國立臺灣大學國立成功大學法國國家科學研究中心組成的跨域研究團隊首創山區氣候變化速度計算的模式破解了氣候的一個很重要的問題生物化學研究所"},{"start":2377.447,"end":2393.897,"text":"結合低溫電極顯微鏡直譜小角度X光散射提供關鍵的實驗找出了Clio Shield一個方法來量化、來描述蛋白質糖一的遮蔽效應與生物的意義。"},{"start":2397.121,"end":2413.521,"text":"分子生物研究所首度發現活性氧化物所造成的鐵死亡觸發波解密了大規模細胞死亡之謎找到了胚胎發育的新線索。在人文組方面"},{"start":2414.534,"end":2425.767,"text":"民主所副研究員郭佩瑜、鄭偉寧兩人出版了《邁向治理與世界構作的人類學,比較難導觀點的專書》。"},{"start":2429.701,"end":2456.152,"text":"獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲"},{"start":2458.666,"end":2467.956,"text":"在原住民研究方面我們極力推動原住民族研究培訓計畫培育具原住民身份之學術研究人才"},{"start":2469.062,"end":2490.453,"text":"今年在講注4名博碩生中已經有2名碩士生為原住民籍此外我們也持續推動部落工作策展透過特展與部落齊老部落工作者進行文物資訊之刊物補充及利用特殊工法文物修復讓珍貴的歷史文物得以再現"},{"start":2498.021,"end":2523.018,"text":"我們的很多同仁也得到重要的學術獎項比如說王德威院士及人設中心的陳祖維特聘研究員雙雙獲得英國國家學術院的國際院士的榮賢生醫所謝清河特聘研究員榮獲永信李天德醫藥科技獎緣分所謝家龍副研究員"},{"start":2524.295,"end":2528.557,"text":"審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關"},{"start":2541.141,"end":2555.128,"text":"也推出博士生獎勵調生方案。繼1至112年起辦理博一至博二生現在平均4萬元每個月4萬元博三至博五的研究生平均5萬元。"},{"start":2556.55,"end":2578.844,"text":"我們也開辦了TIGBX來延攬國際的研究生及研究人員並且推動國際合作經過幾個月的努力我們已經有來自美國、英國、日本、法國、波蘭等國的26位優秀博士生來院進行研究"},{"start":2581.638,"end":2596.725,"text":"此外我們也推出人文社會科學博士菁英獎學金在12年推出113年實行今年選出了得獎共16名包括臺灣大學政治大學臺灣師範大學及台南藝術大學的博士生"},{"start":2599.127,"end":2618.187,"text":"我們也推出中研學者計畫在國內大學副教授以上55歲以下中生代優秀學者可以給予穩定充沛的經費在原單位執行具有原創性的研究計畫執行期間以中研學者名義合併至本院與本院展開合作"},{"start":2621.209,"end":2645.947,"text":"我們持續與大學合作學分學程栽培科技人才這包括辦理國際研究生學程包括開設國內博士班學位學程及在人文社會科學領域我們有與國立清華大學合作推出的中國研究學程與台灣大學、政治大學、清華大學合作推動的公共議題與社會學的學程"},{"start":2650.424,"end":2666.614,"text":"我們人文講座也舉辦了10年至2014年起陸續與國內生醫專業為組織大專院校合作基金已有10年替這些以生醫專業的大專院校開設人文講座"},{"start":2667.608,"end":2678.385,"text":"我們也舉辦暑期研習營實習活動在各研究所中心每年舉辦暑期研究營提供全國大專院校學生學習與參與學術研究的機會"},{"start":2684.467,"end":2699.777,"text":"兩部院區也在幾個禮拜前正式開幕那因應是社會科學及世界的快速變遷與各項難題我們期待從基礎研究開始整合"},{"start":2700.658,"end":2713.788,"text":"各研究所中心的能量有重要的突破。我們已經選定數個關鍵議題並且期待以科學到行動的精神把研究落實到社會的應用。"},{"start":2719.079,"end":2740.789,"text":"此外我們也建置了南部院區的人文社會研究基地設立數位圖書檔案室共享本院學術及研究資源那有了這個檔案室在南台灣的相關研究團隊就能夠到南部院區不需要舟車勞頓到北部院區來查看我們的檔案"},{"start":2742.441,"end":2751.435,"text":"台思索也舉辦了南方島嶼人文的檔案特展在南部院區已經盛大展開"},{"start":2754.412,"end":2772.068,"text":"國家申請研究委員區持續舉辦兩屆的Pitch Day及Demo Day聚焦以科技驅動的精準醫療應用與照護並且打造新創生醫生態系與學術研發成果的這兩個創主題"},{"start":2776.445,"end":2803.664,"text":"我們持續進行跨國合作的學術研究比如說我們參與巨型麥哲倫望遠鏡的計畫與比利時列日大學演化與移動多樣性實驗室合作並且參與德國波洪魯爾大學跨國研究我們也積極推展國際交流前瞻全球學術動態出訪了很多國家下一頁"},{"start":2805.75,"end":2833.83,"text":"除息了中座科學院的全體大會下一頁那我們也在研究之餘期待能夠替社會解決關鍵議題下一頁我們也多方傳播科普知識譬如說我們連續五年響應國際博物館日開放博物館而且中研講堂今年於苗栗高中舉辦"},{"start":2836.628,"end":2851.065,"text":"閱區開放連續27年吸引了很多觀眾今年特別又在南部院區舉辦這個院區開放在上個禮拜五盛大舉行最後我們簡單報告預算編列的行情"},{"start":2854.938,"end":2881.394,"text":"本年、今年的預算143億元左右預算重點在量子科技、AI與各領域的研究近鄰科技研發、資安整備及危老建築整修。下一頁本面科研基金預算收入主要為勞務收入及政府撥補。下一頁支出部分主要為研發能量提升計劃及科研環境領航計劃。"},{"start":2883.269,"end":2903.787,"text":"解凍預算暨兩案．包括一般學術研究及評議繼續凍結100萬．及自然及人文社會科學研究凍結100萬．兩案書面報告資料已依規定函送大院。謝謝。好,謝謝院長精彩的報告。院長請回。好,OK。"},{"start":2909.883,"end":2916.468,"text":"現在我們進行綜合詢答每位初席委員質詢7分鐘必要時延長2分鐘列席委員質詢時間為4分鐘如果沒有異議的話那我們發言登記截止時間為上午10點30分"},{"start":2929.979,"end":2950.229,"text":"委員如有臨時提案,請於上午10點30分前提出,並於本會委員范雲質詢結束後進行解凍案及臨時提案處理。處理提案時,若提案委員及聯署委員均不在場,原例不予處理。首先,我們請發言登記第一位洪孟楷委員質詢。"},{"start":2958.393,"end":2961.497,"text":"主席謝謝阿芬請廖院長好有請院長"},{"start":2966.668,"end":2987.568,"text":"院長好,院長是這個會期第一次見到您,台灣最強大腦都在這邊,非常好。我想院長我們還是就較相對專業的問題,因為我認為是說中研院就是本於科學本於專業來去做一些判斷。那最近國際很關心剛當選的美國總統川普,"},{"start":2989.83,"end":3014.159,"text":"他其實在競選期間有可能都一直強調是所謂淨零碳排等等的相關議題他有他自己的獨特的見解包括說明年1月就任之後他可能又要再退出巴黎氣候協定那院長您認為現在大家都關心2050淨零碳排以及我們相關的這一些方向川普的上任會不會對於全球的這個淨零碳排的一些政策有什麼樣的一個影響"},{"start":3015.457,"end":3038.617,"text":"我想這個這全世界非常關注的問題假如依川普所言他要再度退出巴黎協定的話那確實會對2050年這個敬禮的目標有一些衝擊那國際上也必須為這樣的一個狀況做出相對的反應那這是全世界所有學研界包括政治界人物都在"},{"start":3039.958,"end":3043.101,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關"},{"start":3060.197,"end":3085.428,"text":"甚至有沒有可能連帶的我們台灣自己的一些能源政策也有受到一些波及尤其是美國在10月15號的時候他們曾經又在講到是說其實他們也對於針對淨零碳排有針對蠻多的努力包括說他們要重啟關閉的核電廠因為要因應電力需求快速成長並且減少碳排放那來院長您自己怎麼看"},{"start":3086.377,"end":3108.533,"text":"我覺得這是美國多方面想解決這個淨零碳排的問題但是以川普的角度他又不希望說影響美國的經濟他們所做的努力所以經濟也好或者是碳排的能源提供也好其實都是一個人類需求要尋求一個平衡點對不對是的好"},{"start":3109.353,"end":3126.774,"text":"現在國內我們在兩個禮拜前也有看到就像中火的一個事件中火二期的環評案民進黨過去是承諾說要關一個燃煤廠增加一個燃氣廠但是現在說增加燃氣廠可是燃煤廠還沒有要廢除"},{"start":3130.037,"end":3156.775,"text":"直到卓龍泰院長現在才承諾講說2032年等四部燃氣廠機組完成之後才來檢討燃煤廠要不要存廢。那麼某種程度上燃煤也好燃氣也好其實都是火力發電。院長我覺得能源議題是沒有任何政治立場而是都是需求因為大家都要用電。那我們現在核三廠二號機稅休的情況全台現在已經實質進入非核家園。"},{"start":3157.515,"end":3175.871,"text":"而看到數據來講日常的時間火力發電高達八成以上因為我們現在在這裡面還沒有20%嘛而如果說到夜晚期間太陽能沒有發電風力又減弱的時候更是有高達九成甚至九成五都是火力發電火力全開"},{"start":3177.63,"end":3205.868,"text":"您之前2022年中研院也有提供相關的淨零碳排的一個資料我們講說全台的碳排有80%、90%來自能源部門也就是所謂的火力發電那你這樣子台灣不就是在跟世界潮流走倒退路嗎我們這樣子怎麼有辦法能夠說2050越來越近每過一天就離2050更近一天我們希望淨零碳排但實際上我們的能源政策卻是背道而馳"},{"start":3207.21,"end":3230.698,"text":"我解釋一下,這個火力發電燃煤燃氣雖然都排碳可是燃煤的排碳量比燃氣高出兩倍,約兩倍所以在現階段把燃煤轉成燃氣仍然是全世界各國盡力努力的一個目標就像我們在大海中航行沒有辦法"},{"start":3231.118,"end":3258.643,"text":"獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲"},{"start":3259.532,"end":3275.706,"text":"院長你突然搖身一變變航海專家了本席我以為我們在討論的是能源政策不過院長本席就想要好奇的請教就連賴總統都召開國家氣候變遷對策火源會並且說第一波也要把中研院納入所謂的節電指標是的"},{"start":3277.227,"end":3279.728,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案有關中央研究院函．為11"},{"start":3297.489,"end":3312.647,"text":"那我想請教現在氣候變遷對策委員會也已經快一個月了嘛那中研院這邊有收到指示我們明年的KPI還是明年的指標到底中研院我們給的具體是要節電多少"},{"start":3315.929,"end":3334.058,"text":"我們是沒有受到具體的指標不過我們已經主動在做了兩三年了我們每年都有節電比賽沒錯 院長你講到重點啊節電是大家過去五年十年都一直宣傳隨手關店隨手關店根本不需要總統開一個國家氣候變遷對策委員會告訴我們這些聰明的台灣最強大腦"},{"start":3341.012,"end":3367.552,"text":"總統根本不需要做這件事情你已經承認了過去兩三年大家都在做那為什麼我們的氣候變遷對策委員會煞有其事總統主持所有部會首長一次排開到最後得出的結論不是減少火力發電不是減少你們報告裡面講的最大宗的排碳來源而是大家在節點電啊隨手關燈啊不要浪費能源啊"},{"start":3368.837,"end":3392.149,"text":"會不會覺得總統用這樣子煞有其事的事情沒有對症下藥我想這應該是先從這個全民意志開始然後漸漸的就會觸及到一些所以您覺得過去到現在我們還沒有全民意志大家都還不知道節電的重要性倒不是就是說還有加強的空間我這樣質詢其實凸顯什麼我想您是聰明人"},{"start":3395.302,"end":3403.005,"text":"通顯科學方法做實驗也好或是任何你沒有看到問題不去解決問題面對問題你只想著旁支錯節我沒有說這兩個是衝突的喔減碳不要火力發電減少火力發電跟節電完全不衝突就如同我們過去一直強調核能只是一個選擇"},{"start":3417.31,"end":3435.137,"text":"而核能絕對不是取代再生能源核能是要取代火力發電讓排碳大的降低一點再生能源持續成長所以發展核能也好或是美國現在重啓核能跟他們再生能源是完全不衝突的核能是要降低碳排多的火力發電是吧是的"},{"start":3438.379,"end":3465.677,"text":"您是院長,我期待的是最強大腦是提供科學專業的數據以及判斷。如果連總統都沒有辦法獲得這種專業的數據跟判斷,只是死抱政治意識形態的話,我覺得台灣會很危險。跟委員報告,這些都在委員會裡面就開始陸續討論。我也分了七組,現在這個分組開始討論。院長,因為我時間有限,我再另外一個問題。"},{"start":3466.798,"end":3493.734,"text":"今天我看到是說我們的院士到目前為止有298位那研究員的部分就是就我的資料是1015位但是其中研究人員過去到現在大家一直強調是說研究人員好像沒有法制化會讓大家覺得不夠透明為什麼這樣講呢?因為研究員有分副研究員、研究員、特聘研究員"},{"start":3494.494,"end":3508.07,"text":"那請教到目前為止1015研究人員裡面我們特聘研究員的人數有幾位?請人事主任回答。我們特聘研究員有九十幾位。九十幾位。九十幾位是幾位?"},{"start":3509.512,"end":3536.103,"text":"連主任來都沒有辦法精確的回答是99位好 院長本時候怎麼突然問這個問題從過去立法院在105年106年都有曾經關心過就是因為我們當然人才要馬而好一定要馬而吃草這個我完全同意我們一定要尊重人才的招聘我們也希望給更好的待遇那但是你們在給我們的這個人事費用裡面"},{"start":3536.883,"end":3562.475,"text":"你只有人事維持的人事費總共一大筆28億27億28億的經費連同你另外一個學術研究跟人才培育46億你光中研院一年100多億的預算你有一半都是用在人才相關我覺得人才相關沒有問題但重點在於是人才的給予有沒有一致的公平性以及法制化以及標準"},{"start":3563.295,"end":3591.244,"text":"我們院裡面的深等考核都有非常完整的一個制度在各級都有很嚴格的審查所以這個我們已經行之有年了是但是到目前為止外界之前因為有一些比較眾所矚目的人才去變成是我們的特聘研究員的時候大家就會懷疑說他的月薪是不是一個月50萬60萬等等的那我們大家外界就會好奇啊"},{"start":3592.109,"end":3609.075,"text":"我們院裡面的所有的這個升等考核陳若剛才講的所以特聘研究員的待遇都是一致嗎?不是是啊本期現在在講就是說99位的特聘研究員裡面待遇有高有低而我們沒有辦法從預算書裡面看到"},{"start":3609.815,"end":3633.766,"text":"那這樣子會不會就讓外界因為過去其實不是我第一次講我相信之前105年106年就已經有委員在教育委員會裡面有提相關的提案認為是說應該要透明化法治化那這是有一定的標準這是誠如剛才這個委員講的就是人才我們要跟國際競爭那國際上這個高階人才的待遇也都是每一個人不一樣"},{"start":3634.286,"end":3651.3,"text":"不可能說所有的大學教授都一樣的金稅。但是我的意思是說還是要有標準啊,否則的話這樣子我們怎麼能夠認定是說到底你今天,你看剛剛99位特聘研究員裡面,你也講了每一個特聘研究員的待遇都不一樣。"},{"start":3652.2,"end":3669.996,"text":"到底為什麼特聘研究員A可以拿到這樣的一個薪資特聘研究員B拿到這樣的薪資你的標準還是沒有啊這也是過去讓外界還是持續覺得說沒有透明的主要原因啊院長過去有提過說希望能夠法治化這有沒有可能法治化"},{"start":3676.562,"end":3677.123,"text":"二、審查114年度中央研究院函．為11"},{"start":3693.645,"end":3717.896,"text":"人種的專業家計表9的規定單位。沒關係你相關的資料可以給本席我不是要探索哪一個研究員的薪資我現在只是要確認過去因為一直有提法治化的部分以及讓外界覺得是說你一筆28億人事費用一千多人但是他到底的一個這個薪資大約是怎麼樣這一定要釐清好不好謝謝洪孟凱委員的質詢院長請回好謝謝"},{"start":3722.223,"end":3733.834,"text":"我們現在有現場有三位委員,我們確定一下上次會議議事錄有無錯誤或遺漏之處。沒有。沒有,那議事錄確定。我們現在請柯智恩委員質詢。謝謝莊委,我們是不是請院長。好,有請院長。"},{"start":3744.751,"end":3759.556,"text":"科學院長早 院長早我想我延續洪孟凱委員的一個能源的問題因為你目前是國家氣候變遷對策委員會那大家都其實非常期望這個我們全國學術的良心其實在能源的政策上面是應該給我們當權者一些最"},{"start":3762.617,"end":3764.418,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院科學研究基金附屬單位預算案。��"},{"start":3781.727,"end":3783.769,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案"},{"start":3803.667,"end":3807.389,"text":"但是呢不管是怎麼樣你看這將以天然氣為原料勢必我們未來要更仰賴我們的天然氣但是呢我們增加更多的天然氣我們就要問了我們還有更多的空間可以來新建天然氣接收站跟儲存槽嗎這會不會跟我們減碳的這樣的目標會有所抵觸呢"},{"start":3822.355,"end":3822.575,"text":"二、審查11"},{"start":3843.697,"end":3844.677,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案。��"},{"start":3870.689,"end":3871.029,"text":"adequation to"},{"start":3901.21,"end":3907.954,"text":"但是其中大部分是用來購置5M的發電設備。購置設備,它不是用來研發技術,它的設備只是用來做一個demo。"},{"start":3920.724,"end":3942.537,"text":"但是你特別也特別提到的你還是目前還是很希望說這樣的一個投資技術跟未來我們的這樣整個能源的趨勢是可以吻合的那你也希望有更加的民間的投資能夠進來那目前民間的投資的進步狀況到底是如何那這個10億跟委員報告裡面只有這個不到一半甚至不到4成3成是用來做研發"},{"start":3943.678,"end":3944.378,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關"},{"start":3964.648,"end":3980.514,"text":"如果有這麼好的興趣的話為什麼到目前為止都還沒有人有進一步的投資的一個動作如果這是未來的一個趨勢表示目前為止問題還是非常的多院長這是我說的這個務實比理想還要更重要特別是我們的資源我們的經費而且你看到時候你們還要建制時間越過可能要到3到4年的時間了你看比那更長"},{"start":3986.636,"end":3987.997,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央科學研究基金附屬單位預算案"},{"start":4009.888,"end":4010.969,"text":"三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關"},{"start":4034.804,"end":4050.213,"text":"議員議員議員議員議員"},{"start":4050.353,"end":4067.672,"text":"事必要考慮核能未來可能佔據新科技的一個核能可是我要問的就是請問當局者到底聽進去的多少同董事長他覺得是有點受挫這個廖院長你身為在一個重要的一個角色你對於目前的"},{"start":4068.453,"end":4072.594,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案。netesi,您也秀出來,我們目前用電量是2800億度。目前假如說核二、核三再重啟的話,發電最多300億度,離2800億度很大的距離。除此之外,我們再生能源也"},{"start":4091.141,"end":4092.522,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關"},{"start":4112.811,"end":4127.967,"text":"新的核能的問題他連討論在問到裡面前後都是非常的不一致所以我們才是希望你們這些的建言用科學的證據能夠來說服我們現在的職長你像魏徵一樣你是像魏徵對不對這個技術面的討論事實上已經開始了那這個我們的角色這中央研究院的角色是提供技術科學層面的建言"},{"start":4136.536,"end":4142.617,"text":"但是那院長你會看到執行的成本你會發現你的建言很顯然是被當成耳邊風而且我還要特別提出來好吧那我們就看看下次我看到你的時候那個討論到底到了個什麼樣的程度就譯入我上次問你的時候你告訴我民間的單位可能也會想要來投入我們這個巨蛋燃金的這個部分但是"},{"start":4162.981,"end":4170.883,"text":"但是還是有很大的距離我還是要因為時間的關係我們還是要問一下這是跟中研院有關聯的因為有關於對不起我們看一下就是你們特別提到的這個風電的部分為什麼要特別提出這個問題呢因為你們在這個有個非常著名的natural portfolio裡面特別提到風電會帶這是在一個非常好的一個一個所謂的科學研究的期刊裡面特別提到我們的風電是對我們的人體會造成非常大的一個影響嘛那目前為止即使有這麼好的研究出來"},{"start":4191.73,"end":4211.625,"text":"可是很顯然我們到目前為止只是研究發現但是我們在我們整個環境的改造上面並沒有做出任何的一個改善這是我覺得最遺憾的地方中研院不缺所謂的研究成果但是研究成果已經告知了我們的政府之後其實並沒有被好好的採用好我們先來看看下面一個有關AI的浪潮這個中研院也釋出這個AI的一個模型但是過去呢曾經有點出錯因為你們用了太多的database裡面都是來自於中國的"},{"start":4221.613,"end":4224.274,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究基金附屬單位預算案"},{"start":4240.643,"end":4245.546,"text":"有了我們再看一下因為時間只剩下我現在我們主席非常重視時間你看因為我個人覺得啦我們應該這也都可以同意來回答我們應該來建造更多的這個中文資料這個database我們都認為比這個模型彼此之間不互相違背但是這個database如果不進入的話你看看全球最大的語言模型的bloom裡面中文訓練資料比繁體中文只佔0.05欸簡體中文佔16%欸"},{"start":4269.739,"end":4270.54,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案。��"},{"start":4291.603,"end":4304.836,"text":"三萬這個部分如果你只是在發展這個語言的模型跟優化的話我覺得對於所謂的資料的一個建構如果沒有同等量的來去做的話你看目前為止只有0.05這樣如何能夠讓全世界能夠再一輸進去即使有這麼好的一個模型輸進去的話你呈現出來的沒有足夠的我們台灣的這個的語言這是一個非常遺憾的事情"},{"start":4315.606,"end":4316.407,"text":"elcome to the"},{"start":4333.106,"end":4333.566,"text":"院長請回,謝謝柯志恩委員的質詢。我們再來請葉元之委員質詢。"},{"start":4364.573,"end":4364.695,"text":"麻煩請院長謝謝。"},{"start":4371.044,"end":4392.338,"text":"院長好,我們先來看一下中研院最近編的那個國外的旅費有發現就是它有大幅的成長,譬如說你看明年的預算跟今年的就成長非常多今年是9969萬,明年是已經到了算是1億6697萬,這麼多啦請問一下這個預算為什麼會膨脹到這麼多"},{"start":4400.395,"end":4421.228,"text":"這個有很多理由那主要我們分兩部分一部分是研究人員的需要由於疫情結束所以全世界這個很多研究人員都必須要到世界各地去跟合作夥伴繼續進行研究那彌補過去4年來的研究的空缺另外一方面國際間對跟台灣"},{"start":4423.71,"end":4450.374,"text":"科學研究的合作興趣也大為提高所以這兩個因素加起來我們的國外旅費的需求就增加我們請主記來講一下跟委員報告一下就是在編列的時候114是參考12年的執行情況那12的時候是剛好因為111的時候疫情結束12就恢復到正常的水準所以在編列的時候就參照1、2的執行數來做編列以上"},{"start":4451.696,"end":4465.717,"text":"好,所以你講說膨脹那麼多是因為國外研究的需求是不是,然後跟去國外的交流嘛,但是這個部分你看那個大陸的旅費就很少,你去大陸大概是450萬左右,這個比率非常低啊?"},{"start":4466.516,"end":4489.641,"text":"那現在到底是因為什麼原因?是大陸比較沒有什麼學術的?倒不是倒不是那還是說兩岸的氛圍不好還是抗中的原因怎樣?這些我們的經費編列都是由下而上根據研究人員研究的需求所以可見就是說你們現在對於研究大陸兩岸的這部分其實是沒有什麼興趣的"},{"start":4490.481,"end":4491.983,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關"},{"start":4509.591,"end":4511.754,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案。"},{"start":4530.821,"end":4549.435,"text":"業委員好,那個寫的是我們最初簽約的時間,所以其實我們一直都還有在簽約。就沒有簽新的約了嘛。最近還跟北京大學的那個歷史系序約,還沒有寫上去,剛剛已經簽訂了。我們了解好像2018年還有一個跟法國的有簽約,也沒有寫上去。"},{"start":4550.155,"end":4567.357,"text":"所以這個網站是內部參考還是不好意思我們應該要跟著你的但不管怎麼樣啦就算把2018年那個法國寫上去或者是您剛講跟北京簽約但我們看起來就是從2016年之後新簽約的就是比較少嘛"},{"start":4567.797,"end":4586.163,"text":"還有新的都沒放上去日本的中央文庫也剛剛清理了都沒有放上去很抱歉我覺得因為大家都知道中研院的近代史研究所其實在研究中國近代史還包括像228清代史其實都非常有名而且是很有成就"},{"start":4586.903,"end":4613.885,"text":"那我是其實希望說可以增加這方面的研究啦特別是可以兩岸多一點交流像剛剛那個旅費450萬其實就太少了對不對應該多交流嘛因為現在當然也不用怕政治性的干擾啦因為我們的總統已經宣誓了嘛中華民國就是113年嘛這跟過去民進黨比較認為中華民國只有75年的歷史關係不一樣那既然已經113年我們應該要把失去的那40幾年把它補回來到底這40幾年"},{"start":4615.126,"end":4633.545,"text":"到底發生什麼事中央院也可以透過研究去告訴大家我們也要建立我們中華民國的正統否則的話現在中華民國前40幾年的權勢權全部在中國大陸那邊那萬一他的權勢權他去跟國外做研究講說都是他們在對日抗戰然後都是他們"},{"start":4634.229,"end":4658.156,"text":"的表現怎樣怎樣怎樣其實對台灣對我們中華民國也不利嗎委員我非常贊成您說您說的非常的好其實也是他們有點不願意跟我們交流的原因他不希望這個近代史史觀受到我們研究的影響是啦那你也可以那你也可以研究完之後你也可以研究完之後去跟他們以外的國家去做交流嘛讓其他國家知道說完全同意委員說的謝謝您說的"},{"start":4660.517,"end":4689.016,"text":"為什麼說你看到說我們加強對國際的合作的這個的原因很大一部分就是這個但是問題是問題是你們你們現在我不知道你們研究在這一塊還有沒有深入啦有沒有去對國外做交流不知道啦非常深入的研究所曾經我剛才講的最近幾年國際上特別是跟台灣在文史方面特別近代史這一塊跟台灣的合作興趣是非常高就像剛剛雷首長講的"},{"start":4690.377,"end":4711.956,"text":"我覺得因為之前大家都好像講到中國大陸好像就很害怕啦那既然賴總統已經講中華民國113年我覺得你們就放手去研究去告訴人家過去40幾年對不對我們對抗戰或我們做了多少這個對世界有貢獻的事情嘛宣揚中華民國的價值這塊可以多做啦然後再來齁"},{"start":4713.577,"end":4728.264,"text":"因為中央研究院生育卓著所以經常被冒名像這個新聞就是有人冒用中央研究院的名號就是說治療糖尿病新發現然後就說這個是中央研究院研究的然後讓大家去買他的藥那這個"},{"start":4730.285,"end":4758.362,"text":"其實是個詐騙可是你看喔這臉書上這個詐騙它的效果宣傳效果非常好幾乎都比那個台灣plus貼文多非常多了像這個按讚數有7745個讚然後分享有1195個分享這種詐騙但是效果這麼好我不知道說中研院看到類似這種詐騙你們的處置方式是怎樣好我們有這個請法治處跟這個制裁處做這個很完整的處理請市長說明"},{"start":4762.99,"end":4778.775,"text":"是委員好我是治療局處長那針對這一類型的詐騙會有的處理方式除了直接到我們零件派出所做通報之外我們也在我們自己的網站上做公告希望能夠讓受害有可能潛在受害的民眾知道說這是一種詐騙但這種情況確實是這個層出不窮"},{"start":4784.158,"end":4806.921,"text":"大概平均一個月會幾件?倒沒有到一個月幾件我講了因為中央有很多新的技術他都有可能變成是有一年幾件?一年我們大概會遇到3、4、5件那除了報案之外還只會在網站上公告?那我就請問一下像這個案子後來處理的方式是怎樣?"},{"start":4807.481,"end":4826.46,"text":"我們的方式是在我們...報警之後因為被害人並不是中研院是被害人是這個民眾所以我們也有跟民眾聯繫請他們提供詳細的被詐騙的資料因為被詐騙資料並不在中研院的手中研院是當然啦你中研院沒被詐騙是說中研院沒有去買這個藥啦"},{"start":4827.461,"end":4855.979,"text":"但是中央研究院的名號、商標被冒用當然也是受害者啊是,這部分我們就有處理包括我們會跟公平會來做這個舉發就是他有可能會產生這個不是我告的問題因為像類似這種案子只會越來越多啦其實我是建議法治這邊應該要擬定一個SOP的啊然後看怎麼樣至少要你們也應該要對外宣傳除了放在網站上之外"},{"start":4857.32,"end":4885.032,"text":"你們的網站可能看人不多啦然後也會疏漏嘛剛剛那個近代史就是這樣所以是不是可以用更積極的方式讓大家不要受騙我們一收到民眾的來電來詢問我覺得你再研究一下啦因為有些會先來詢問我們然後我們都會做非常第一時間就告訴說這可能是詐騙提醒他們謝謝委員長然後上次你來的時候我有問你那個陳建仁院長嘛現在在中研院他還開心嗎最近"},{"start":4887.434,"end":4893.249,"text":"因為我最近看到他本來要去ECFA當特使後來又不能去有沒有?心情有受影響嗎?"},{"start":4894.582,"end":4920.57,"text":"我相信有遇到他嗎?這個偶爾在院裡面會看到他的背影,他通常都很忙,這個跑來跑去,所以我想他應該是生活非常愉快,就做研究,因為研究是他最想要做的工作,他這個也一直再三重生,他是一個研究員。那那個ECFA沒辦法去有沒有心情受到影響?那我不清楚了。你沒問他喔?沒有。OK好好謝謝。"},{"start":4924.905,"end":4938.412,"text":"謝謝...欸?結束了齁?還沒...你還沒嗎?欸你今天怎麼對我那麼好?我一向都對大家很一致喔謝謝葉元智委員的質詢,院長請回再來我們請陳秀寶委員質詢謝謝主席請廖院長,有請廖院長"},{"start":4954.555,"end":4960.66,"text":"陳委員早院長早安院長我這邊請教您中研院南部院區在10月15日舉行開幕儀式賴總統在致辭的時候表示說希望未來更能夠發揮平衡南北均衡台灣發展這個成效當然南部的院區是從2012年開始籌備以台南高鐵特定區為基地規劃的是農業生性量子科技技能永續人文社會等這些特色的領域研究"},{"start":4982.999,"end":5011.736,"text":"這個部分我想請教院長我們有沒有規劃在2027年南部院區全部完工之後我們會不會可以考慮來設立中章頭的中部院區這個是一個很好的主意我們目前確實沒有想到到中部院區這個議題不過委員建議我們可以因為除了南北均衡發展之外其實我們中部也很需要就有這樣子的量能來我們希望全台灣遍地都能夠"},{"start":5012.196,"end":5012.296,"text":"二、審查11"},{"start":5034.515,"end":5040.638,"text":"這邊再請教南部院區最後的第三個階段是量子科技實驗大樓這個部分110年合定的總經費是17.88億在112年的時候增調了2.73億在今年的4月又增調5.22億總計已經累計增加7.95億來到了25.83億"},{"start":5058.067,"end":5074.484,"text":"但是呢公期要往後延一年這個部分是因為執行力不好還是說我們有去檢討是什麼原因造成的好這原因非常複雜請總務處長解釋委員好因為是整個南部的工程的量能"},{"start":5075.145,"end":5078.806,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關"},{"start":5104.151,"end":5130.96,"text":"是的,決表已經公告了在11月21號按照契約就會開工所以今年年底是真的確定可以開工是的,11月21號有沒有把握可以如期如值而且不會再追加預算的把這個工程來完成目前我們的預算爭取的部分在安排上面已經有一些準備金未來這個環境如果變化的時候我們覺得應該是可以在這個預算裡面順利的執行"},{"start":5131.36,"end":5158.827,"text":"好謝謝是希望說一切可以很順利因為我們在等中部院區所以南部這邊要趕快做一個段落可以如期如止的完工好那接下來我想請教院長您在報告中有提到113年度有編列預算協助政府來辦理台灣人體生物資料庫的這個計畫總經費是兩億兩千多萬那請問院長到九月底我們執行數是多少執行率有多少請那個生物資料庫執行長"},{"start":5160.532,"end":5177.172,"text":"是,報告委員我是臺灣人體生物資料庫的這個代表人楊懷一那目前為止很不好意思我沒有辦法很確切跟委員報告說這個到目前為止的資金率是有多少但是我可以回去跟同仁們把"},{"start":5177.612,"end":5199.213,"text":"資料調清楚之後給你報告那你會後把資料送到我辦公室喔我們台灣人體生物資料庫的計畫每年會進行兩次的這個退出個案檢體及資料銷毀作業那今年是在5月及9月喔那因為你現在可能也沒有數據對不對我要問你說今年退出的個案檢體的資料及銷毀資料的這個數幾件數你也不知道那請你這邊你掌握了這個數據之後再給我"},{"start":5202.476,"end":5209.959,"text":"其實你們在網站上面有一些資料顯示了在10月31號受案數是203,026那完成第一輪最終的是73,640第二輪最終的是6535但是去年的量去年有20萬人那今年到目前只增加了3000多3026案那你們自己覺得說你們在這個募集的成效"},{"start":5225.704,"end":5249.212,"text":"我講我們現在主要的工作並不是在增加收案數而是在追蹤訪問這部分也請楊懷毅來解釋是,呃,誠如剛剛院長所解釋的齁我們這個網站的資料可能我們還要再去看一下就我所知我們每一年的追蹤個案數會達到3萬人以上所以這個事後我也會跟在請同仁準備好確切的資料跟委員報告"},{"start":5250.232,"end":5269.566,"text":"這個對於每個個案的你們持續追蹤應該大部分都是2到4年不等的這個追蹤的時間。但是講到這個我特別要分享一下我個人的經驗。我也是去做健檢的時候護理師問我說願不願意多抽兩管血來參加一個這樣子長期追蹤研究的一個專案。我覺得說這應該是很重要我就答應了。"},{"start":5270.287,"end":5297.69,"text":"那我在抽的時候抽血的時候我有問護理師我說那這樣子抽血之後有沒有什麼影響他看一看我的血管說你這條血管有比較細那你抽了之後你抽多抽這兩管之後你的血管可能水不夠的話會扁掉我嚇了一跳我心裡想好我鼓足勇氣我已經答應你要抽我就抽了結果我抽到第二管的時候我抽到第二管就是多增加了這兩管我已經抽了一管抽第二管的時候護理師跟我說啊你的血不太夠那我看你不要參加好了"},{"start":5297.91,"end":5317.5,"text":"議員議員"},{"start":5317.58,"end":5339.619,"text":"但是如果是護理師是這樣的態度來對這些民眾對病人他在收集的時候這種態度我會覺得說這給他推廣有點難吧因為我自己遇到了這樣的狀況我就覺得你第一個已經被你嚇過一次他跟我說血管會扁掉當然是會恢復啦但是你說當下你就覺得說欸是有被嚇到然後抽了一管之後他跟我說血不夠那我們不要抽了是你放棄不是我放棄欸"},{"start":5340.646,"end":5369.148,"text":"我覺得這樣子的態度對我們的推廣而且對民眾對這些研究個案的認知我覺得是很不利的所以我們針對我這樣的經驗分享您覺得可以怎樣來加強是,謝謝委員首先要謝謝委員願意參加這樣子非常重要的一個這個抽血的活動那不曉得委員是不是參加台灣報告會但是我們一定會去檢討就我所知我們的委員在我們的這個同仁在收案是有非常嚴謹的標準的包括他們事先要去簽這個所謂的"},{"start":5371.149,"end":5375.113,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關"},{"start":5393.848,"end":5394.488,"text":"我希望可以提供一個檢討的方向。"},{"start":5421.085,"end":5442.023,"text":"好 謝謝院長再請教報道者是在1月訪問中研院的研究團隊的時候有說中研院跟合作醫院來做台灣精準醫療計畫TPMI聯盟有預計在2024年會發表4篇的主論文到國際期刊那我們是把目標放在自然系列的期刊"},{"start":5443.684,"end":5467.98,"text":"我們的研究團隊是希望說能夠努力的讓世界看到臺灣對精準醫療這個研究的成果那我想請教說到目前為止我們發表哪些論文到國際期刊據我了解已經神秘出去4篇那現在正在審查當中那結果會怎麼樣我們現在還不得而知但是期待會有這個令人振奮的消息所以已經照我們原來的計畫我們已經發表了4篇不是發表"},{"start":5471.823,"end":5473.444,"text":"兩邊不同的方式希望能夠整合學術處處長陳建昌"},{"start":5497.944,"end":5515.384,"text":"議員議員議員議員議員議員議員議員議員議員議員議員議員議員議員議員議員"},{"start":5515.704,"end":5534.461,"text":"現在在等到衛福部的修法如果通過中央研究院也在努力想辦法要把這個TPMI的資料可能所以是可以來合作一起合作的現在在往這個方向努力因為我時間到了我快速的講一下我們的學術研究與人才培育向下我們也有聘僱助理人員211人其實我們這些薪資相關以及勞健保合計我們的經費是2億13萬"},{"start":5541.087,"end":5544.109,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院函．為11二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院函．為11"},{"start":5567.092,"end":5584.412,"text":"謝謝陳秀寶委員的質詢,院長請回再來我們請葛如君委員質詢好,謝謝主席,有請中研院廖院長辯詢有請廖院長"},{"start":5587.706,"end":5603.014,"text":"各位委員早好早啊院長好我想今天我們是做非常學術的討論我們也非常感謝立院這個教文委員會多了一幅美麗的話我想希望可以為我們的委員會增添一點理直氣和的氛圍"},{"start":5605.451,"end":5621.214,"text":"我想有一個地方想要先詢問一下院長中央醫院歐美研究所2021年發起美國肖像的研究計畫一共調查10年2024年5月23號到28號用四話手機抽樣電訪了1200多位中華民國成年的民眾要探討對於美國的印象其中有一題很微妙這一題"},{"start":5631.556,"end":5644.376,"text":"他是要問說假設川普於2024年勝選成為美國總統且中國大陸攻打台灣您認為美國出兵幫助台灣的可能性是減少還增加?請教一下院長知道調查結果嗎?"},{"start":5646.982,"end":5664.14,"text":"我看過這個報告那詳細的數字我現在這個不記得好我先提醒院長7月多的時候呢其實美國選舉已經開跑很長時間而且在非常炙熱的狀態告訴院長答案貴院今年在7月18號高調公布調查結果說川普勝選總統呢"},{"start":5666.463,"end":5688.303,"text":"會對臺灣安全的連結造成一些影響．37.5%的受訪者相信川普當選總統會提升美國出兵幫助臺灣的可能性但是46.2%認為會減少。針對川普院最新的調查結果近半數的民眾認為他可能幫助臺灣的可能性降低院長認同這樣的看法嗎?"},{"start":5689.911,"end":5711.29,"text":"這個是非常專業的問題那也非常複雜並不是簡單說這個會不會出兵而且這個的前提是中國大陸會攻打台灣那這個也是一個很這個假設性的問題所以在這個問題這個假設存在下那他的回答那就每一個人的依據就不一樣所以這個要怎麼解讀變得說要很"},{"start":5713.472,"end":5722.515,"text":"閱長的回答有院長的高度真的很好但是呢這個研究也應該要有中研院跟院長一樣的高度嘛那為什麼我們會有這樣偏頗的提問呢這個問題其實是非常複雜的媒體呢不斷就報導中研院7月高調公布的這個新聞稿"},{"start":5732.159,"end":5734.32,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案"},{"start":5757.376,"end":5782.346,"text":"或者拜登沒有問到民主黨為什麼會有這種情況呢?同時又去問這種很明確很可能有這種影響疑義的事情還高調發布現在賴政府跟中研院壓作保壓作鞭中研院是不是應該要秉持著不只是行政中立啊也應該要是學術中立是不是要重新做一些相關研究去給賴總統一些新的建議啊?"},{"start":5783.627,"end":5804.297,"text":"我想這個中委員一向是尊重學術自由這個調查是研究人員這個由下而上的一個訪問那我們一切尊重當然委員的提醒我們也會交給研究人員去做參考那這個歐北省的副所長是不是也可以這個稍微解釋一下"},{"start":5805.675,"end":5805.775,"text":"第二點"},{"start":5831.98,"end":5856.873,"text":"然後第二個就是說在這個關於所有的調查這個設定來講我想從這個學術的這個角度我們是在探討各種的可能性那麼是不是有偏頗我想這個可以有謝謝我們尊重學術自由但也請尊重行政中立跟學術中立各種各樣的研究都要有才能夠提供給我們的政府一個相關的參考跟依循希望院長回去了解一下這個研究或者相類似的研究"},{"start":5857.273,"end":5885.688,"text":"能不能平衡一下會有需要重新依據選舉的結果做研究也希望能夠提供學者作為參考再來我想和院長討論另外一個也是非常重要的問題每天都應該關注就是我們的能源問題中研院2022年提出淨零科技研發政策建議書建議使用包含前兩名就是去碳燃氫跟地熱能但是呢過了幾年我們到現在還在光電還在這個相關的這個這等同於是跟你們的想法跟建議是不一樣的"},{"start":5886.568,"end":5892.011,"text":"除碳燃氫是用非常先進的技術讓它燃燒的時候不會產生二氧化碳對環境永續是比較有幫助的對於台灣現在都是用氣發電減碳是極有幫助的中央院在去年2023年11月14號跟台電共同發布除碳燃氫的技術的一個小型商用的發電基礎這個當然是給予鼓勵"},{"start":5910.882,"end":5912.043,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案有關中央研究院函．為11"},{"start":5928.456,"end":5952.818,"text":"我前兩天在週末的時間參訪了新加坡他們已經在做30%了甚至呢德國公司、日本公司、美國公司都先後表態2025年就可以做到100%的氫能發電的機組我們的速度為什麼這麼的慢我們能不能再更提升一些我們能不能再更快一些中央院有沒有在做更多這方面的研究去響應你們自己的建議啊"},{"start":5953.519,"end":5981.941,"text":"好跟委員這個說明一下首先您說我們剛才提的那五項緊迅推動並不是表示說只推動這五項其他都不做了而是說這五項在目前社會上政府是推動比較少那我們希望說政府能夠推動這些那其他我們也支持譬如說剛才您看到我們也是擴大推動加速推動等等的並不是說這些其他都不做了因為我們檢探需要但是我們的速度太慢了"},{"start":5982.301,"end":5988.565,"text":"別人都已經到20%、30%2025要100%了我們不能只是為了10%就很高興嗎?跟委員報告所謂10%、20%那是生產機組的公司並不是他們實際用來發電的這不一樣喔譬如說這個西門子他說它有50%他說有30%或是100%日本也有號稱100%那是他們生產的機組他們可以提供給客戶台電是一個客戶"},{"start":6011.379,"end":6038.685,"text":"所以這兩者是不一樣的那我們的學術量能不用跟上別人商業的技術嗎?所以說我們積極要發展去氮燃氫因為到目前為止國際上仍然是用電解水來產氫那這個在綠電充足的國家是可行在台灣綠電缺乏用電解水產氫是比較困難所以我們積極要發展其他的方法所以我們的18是用其他的方法?是的"},{"start":6040.845,"end":6067.264,"text":"我們一起來了解一下希望能夠拔得頭籌用新的技術也要繼續領先那地熱能的部分也其實很重要因為地熱能也是一個非常有用的做法但是我們現在10月21號跟中油合作在宜蘭開採了這個所謂的深層地熱探測井那未來有沒有可能申請相關的執照直接在當地建立電廠中原業有沒有"},{"start":6068.184,"end":6089.094,"text":"這方面的資訊這個警目前是定位為研究警那還有很多法規的的變更法規的調適才能夠在那邊開發地熱那這部分我們也這個密集的跟經濟部行政院商量那假如我們真的探測到下一步要怎麼做那目前為止是這個研究警"},{"start":6089.454,"end":6091.596,"text":"保持聯繫喔那您在受訪的時候也表示2026上半年希望可以有更多的報告那因為我們明年很可能要這個進入這個新的能源的時代不管怎麼樣的一個情況啦應該有確熱遞熱的話我們應該要盡速的發展"},{"start":6107.153,"end":6119.547,"text":"另外有沒有其他的地方可以再多做?中央有沒有一些相關的研究?也許不只是宜蘭嘛。因為日本菲律賓已經大量佈建許久。甚至呢菲律賓跟我們的這個比例有100倍。那為什麼我們最近10月才開採第一座?我們是什麼樣的原因delay這麼久?"},{"start":6126.135,"end":6140.764,"text":"二、跟委員報告這個我們這這這一次並不是第一座這臺灣也有開展很多地熱但是都淺沉 中研院的第一座嗎這個不是不是中研院跟中油的這是深層地熱中研院事實上跟地熱是沒有相關的只是我們有"},{"start":6141.584,"end":6143.825,"text":"公里半的部分打到地熱,這個在台灣過去是沒有做的。"},{"start":6159.735,"end":6186.493,"text":"獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲"},{"start":6186.593,"end":6215.367,"text":"希望中央院作為這個能源探勘或能源研究的領頭羊啦能夠替台灣找到更多可以用的電啦否則的話我們現在的這個光電其實日本已經做出警告有非常多的廢棄物因為太陽能板每20年就要做廢棄會有很多廢料的問題那地熱其實台灣非常淺沉非常有機會可以來做發電的這個條件那我想不管是政治的研究還是能源的研究"},{"start":6216.087,"end":6239.738,"text":"希望中央院都可以發揮學者的風骨,包括我們剛剛提到的雙重中立,持續地來作為這個領頭羊,來帶領或者是讓我們看見未來發展的各種可能性,並且落實下來。謝謝。好,謝謝。院長請回,謝謝葛如君委員的質詢。再來我們請林一金委員質詢,然後郭育晴委員質詢完,我們會休息五分鐘。"},{"start":6246.039,"end":6248.522,"text":"謝主席有請院長林委員早院長早"},{"start":6254.966,"end":6282.118,"text":"中央研究院南部院區在上個月正式開幕那在上週六南部院區也有舉辦院區開放日那身為台南的立委大大的肯定這樣的一個舉辦那當然之前台北舉辦的活動也可以在南部舉行真的是讓南部的民眾不用在大老遠跑到台北那可以同樣可以這個探訪最高學術殿堂的機會"},{"start":6283.319,"end":6302.756,"text":"獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲"},{"start":6302.756,"end":6320.418,"text":"議員議員議員議員議員議員議員"},{"start":6320.418,"end":6346.647,"text":"獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲"},{"start":6346.827,"end":6369.284,"text":"至少在這個院區開放日這個比較軟性的細節開始我們是不是可以用這個來作為一些連結這個拉近南北差距然後隨著這個南部院區的運行也更上軌道我們是不是在南部院區這種開放日有更多更多的活動能追上北部院區的腳步"},{"start":6370.365,"end":6371.306,"text":"議員議員的誇獎我們確實是希望說在南部能夠打造一個"},{"start":6392.419,"end":6395.36,"text":"議員提醒,南部院區的腹地是北部的四分之一,我們沒有辦法容納這麼多場次。"},{"start":6417.253,"end":6425.096,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院科學研究基金附屬單位預算案。netesi,您的想法是說,倒不一定是要分開,而是分開哪一些場次,我們標注是給兒童的,哪一些是給高中以上的學生。"},{"start":6439.821,"end":6441.803,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院函．為11"},{"start":6457.074,"end":6483.161,"text":"台南是臺灣最早開發的地區所以我們因為府城的經貿發達所以我們其實發展出很多的人文特色本席要很肯定我們在南部縣區我們有設置人文社會的研究基地所以要帶動南臺灣的人文研究風氣本席認為說南部的縣區現在可以以南方島嶼人文的展覽為基礎"},{"start":6485.402,"end":6502.758,"text":"未來的這個南院的開放活動可以衍生出更多視角的南台灣的人文領域的研究座談跟互動體驗等等那例如台南的希拉雅文化這個還有它的語言研究跟保存這個議題等等"},{"start":6504.019,"end":6507.741,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院函．為11二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院函．為11"},{"start":6526.754,"end":6540.989,"text":"陳大有這個所謂的航太相關的科系那台南的大內也有著南營天文館那太空中心未來又要進駐沙倫那我們可能還要在台南部署所謂的火箭組裝基地等等"},{"start":6541.75,"end":6542.351,"text":"adequate to the"},{"start":6557.022,"end":6584.787,"text":"獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲"},{"start":6586.179,"end":6613.336,"text":"謝謝委員誇獎天文我們會回去跟我們的同仁去鼓勵在南部明年辦一個展覽好 謝謝再來本席想要跟院長探討就是說其實我們台灣有許多優秀的研究人才那我們當然還需要更多有潛力的優秀的學生來投入學術這個研究領域"},{"start":6614.637,"end":6634.144,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院計劃及項目中有就非常著重在這一塊那特別在人才培育中跟大學來共同培育卓越人才方面那所以我們長年有辦理這個國際研究生的學程TIGP那希望延攬國內外具有潛力的學生"},{"start":6636.365,"end":6656.15,"text":"近6年這個申請的人數都破千人不過本時有注意到就是說在2002開辦至今除了前5年的報道率維持在7、8成外那其他很多的那個年度的報道率好像都落在6成左右"},{"start":6656.59,"end":6677.39,"text":"可是在2023年報道率也只有6乘7有1382人報名可是錄取155個人可是實際報道是104所以我想要請教是說這個國際研究生的學程錄取學生的報道率不太高的原因是什麼不曉得你們有探討"},{"start":6678.45,"end":6694.399,"text":"是這樣子因為我們現在的越辦越好我們開始能夠跟國際間的名校競爭同一批學生所以同一個學生他可能被我們TIGP入取同時他也可能申請到日本、美國、香港的大學"},{"start":6695.94,"end":6715.078,"text":"當然我們要跟這些國際名校競爭難免會失去一些報道率上面的一些表現所以這是我們努力的目標我們希望說學證越來越好報道率也越來越高但這兩者不見得說可以同時成長"},{"start":6716.259,"end":6727.871,"text":"整體的數字委員報告我們每年申請的人數都逐年上升特別是去年開始我們增加獎助金之後我們申請的人數成長了幾乎變成原來的兩倍"},{"start":6732.076,"end":6734.159,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案。"},{"start":6748.979,"end":6767.651,"text":"最後我想跟您談談就是說美國大選後這個的台灣挑戰美國大選其實這次川普贏得選戰那長期研究台灣的日本學者小麗元星星他就有分析說川普的當選有可能是台灣噩夢的這個危險徵兆那局勢恐有利於中國"},{"start":6771.633,"end":6800.138,"text":"可是他也有提到有評論認為說可能因為美中這個貿易戰會加劇所以反而成為台灣的機會所以就是兩種說法都不一可是院長您應該也跟長期一些相關的研究單位的所長那我想也都有做一些分析那不曉得您怎麼樣看就是說川普從長白宮的整個全球局勢那台灣的影響跟挑戰是什麼可不可以簡單講一下"},{"start":6801.178,"end":6825.411,"text":"我想在非常複雜、瞬息萬變的國際環境當中台灣一定要審慎以對一定要強化自己各方面的能力這個才是台灣安全最重要的保障詳細我們有很多學者專家從政治、經濟、法律各層面來做探討我們是不是請這些專家來分享一下"},{"start":6828.423,"end":6846.96,"text":"委員好我是經濟所副所長楊淑君有關於關稅的部分呢你有提到說這個我們也許會從中得利因為他們針對大陸的產品科稅的比例是比較高的但是這個要從這個商品到底是跟台灣的這個產品產業到底是互衝"},{"start":6847.66,"end":6852.361,"text":"三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院函．為11三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院函．為11三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院函．為11"},{"start":6867.785,"end":6876.307,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關"},{"start":6897.711,"end":6908.136,"text":"可是這一次好像又要回到台灣來,不曉得這個考量在哪裡?那未來有沒有機會再去歐洲或大洋洲去舉辦這個大會呢?有,我們都會考量,那請那個主辦單位來做個說明。"},{"start":6911.115,"end":6931.455,"text":"議員好我是政治所所長負責這次臺灣研究世界大會原來預期論文大概是250篇那目前進來大概才有500篇那我們本來它就是每三年在臺灣跟國外輪流拜下一屆會是在美國UCSD來舉行就像簡單說所以就是每三年一次是的那有可能縮減到兩年或一年一次嗎"},{"start":6934.771,"end":6945.958,"text":"三年在臺灣辦一次每三年辦一次然後到國外去輪流辦理那是不是後續再書面或者是口頭跟林委員報告好謝謝謝謝院長謝謝主席謝謝林議員的質詢院長請回再來我們請郭益勤委員質詢郭益勤委員質詢完我們休息五分鐘"},{"start":6960.496,"end":6962.858,"text":"謝謝主席,有請院長。好,有請廖院長。好,郭委員早。"},{"start":6969.011,"end":6994.794,"text":"院長早安我想這個中研院院區開放參觀這個open house這個活動其實在我們的北院的部分其實受到非常多的這個迴響那這個效果其實也非常的好那我知道其實在去年10月14號首度專門為6到12歲的孩子舉辦這個兒童科普日那七十場的一個活動也吸引了將近快要五萬人的參與"},{"start":6995.715,"end":6997.396,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究基金附屬單位預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關"},{"start":7016.184,"end":7041.452,"text":"那我們知道其實10月15號我們的中央研究院的南部的院區開幕那一直到上個禮拜其實我們也推出了第一次的這個上禮拜六的一個open house的一個活動那當天有35場科普相關的一個活動那我不曉得這個活動大家的反應如何然後後續我們有沒有可能也比照這個北院的部分也這樣子持續的算是固定的時間來辦理"},{"start":7043.586,"end":7070.216,"text":"這據我們了解反應是非常非常好有點出乎我們的意料那當然我們明年是一定會再度辦理這南部院區的開放那至於是否會分兒童版的科普日跟一般這個院區開放那我們明年可能會先從分零分流開始而不是不同天同一天有一些活動是可以說標註給"},{"start":7072.117,"end":7089.83,"text":"學生和大人來參加,用這種方式能夠廣邀全家大小一起到中央醫院南部醫院去享受愉快又有知識性的一天。"},{"start":7090.931,"end":7111.284,"text":"因為我們知道其實這個南院的這樣子的一個院區或者是南院的這樣子的一個園區應該是說它其實也帶動了這個南北科技產業非常重要的一個發展的一個指標那我想這個從我們北部的一些成功的複製那可以往南我們真的就把這個科普的部分往下扎根"},{"start":7112.664,"end":7116.026,"text":"另外我想討論一下關於人才培育跟延攬的一個計畫。剛剛其實有聽到我們在延攬國外的一些優秀的人才來台灣做一些交流。包含TIGP我們的成效的確也是不錯。"},{"start":7131.904,"end":7153.483,"text":"但是我要來討論的是另外一個部分就是在113年度我們看到延攬資深學人我們目標延攬是10位但是最後只有一位這個等於是達成率有點低只有10%另外我們可以看到在這4年來當中好像這個數字好像都是一直在往下盪第二塊的部分是國內外學術研究機構合辦的學程跟進修的計畫"},{"start":7158.908,"end":7188.135,"text":"那預計招生的總人數是65名那實際的是47名大概差不多七成多那另外在博士後研究學者的培育計畫那目標是100名那實際到的人數是79名那這三項的指標明顯可能跟剛剛我們包含這個移經委員有特別提到的TIGP的這個延攬人才的部分好像那個成效是有一點落差這個部分是"},{"start":7190.677,"end":7206.895,"text":"首先跟委員報告這個延攬資深學人的部分假如說我們延攬成功這位資深學人來本院專職擔任本院的研究人員就不需要用這個計畫來支付他的費用"},{"start":7207.455,"end":7211.518,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案。"},{"start":7229.512,"end":7255.294,"text":"那所謂的目標值是我們編列預算那這個以備萬一這個這個延攬的對象沒有辦法馬上回來擔任專職我們用動用這部分的經費那目前從113年度來看只有一位是需要用這樣子的經費是這個狀況所以是沒有把它納入納入進去就是在經費預算的部分對對他假如是回來我們延攬了很成功就不需要這個"},{"start":7256.135,"end":7271.489,"text":"好那另外就是剛剛有特別提到這個TIGP的一個計畫就是我們其實目標是15位但是實際招募到有30位那當然其實好像這個實際上報到的人數其實我也想要了解一下"},{"start":7271.989,"end":7291.234,"text":"就算剛剛其實這個院長有特別說明因為這些人才其實他同樣的他可能也在申請其他的一些我們可能等於要跟其他的國際要來做競爭然後再把人才能夠能夠帶進台灣那這個部分有沒有預計就是因為有這樣子的一個狀況我們可能將來會把這個目標的人數再往上調"},{"start":7292.803,"end":7304.629,"text":"我想我們要思考說為什麼人家這個去選擇國際先這個更知名的學術單位我們要盡量提升我們的研究水準並且要這個滾動式調整"},{"start":7308.251,"end":7324.177,"text":"學生和博士生的薪資待遇能夠跟上國際的腳步。我們去年雖然已經有調整,但是過幾年之後我們可能也需要再重新檢視,看是否跟國外的落差有沒有擴大。"},{"start":7325.157,"end":7352.998,"text":"好,那另外一塊我比較想要了解就是2010年我們開始實施這個國際研究生的這個學程招收包含暑期生的一個計劃了那14年來其實我們招收了大概607位那後續有再投入相關的這個就是我們的人員的研究或者是說後續他們在發展的狀況有沒有就是中研院這邊有沒有做一些比較實際上的一個追蹤"},{"start":7353.678,"end":7378.516,"text":"有,我們請國際處長來回答。報告國會議員,國際處處長孟子欣回答。我們每年大概招生60位、50、60位的這個實習生。那目標只是希望他們至少有10%可以留在本院來銜接國際研究生的博士班。那目前看起來疫情前後其實大致上都有達到這個目標。那疫情後我們會更希望能夠把10%是不是看是不是可以提升到20%。這是目前的規劃,謝謝。"},{"start":7381.859,"end":7394.451,"text":"另外我想要了解一下就是中央研究院在114年度的預算案當中其實我們的學術研究跟人才培育底下有一個基本行政工作的一個維持我們大概也編列了將近快要有12億左右的這樣子的一個經費"},{"start":7398.455,"end":7411.909,"text":"當然這些經費其實也會投入在比方說像知識饗宴或者是中研獎堂相關的一些費用上面那我比較好奇的就是中研獎堂的部分那過去這個七年其實每年我們大概都會辦將近快要兩場"},{"start":7414.412,"end":7431.247,"text":"但是今年好像到目前為止只辦了一場而且是在苗栗的學校來做這樣子的一個推廣當然我們知道其實要辦一次的這個講堂我們要耗費很多的人力啦然後還很多的這個資料然後包含一些就是我們整個所有的這個進程上面的一些規劃啦"},{"start":7432.228,"end":7433.97,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案。"},{"start":7451.011,"end":7473.419,"text":"在南部院區好那明年之後呢有沒有可能會比較我們在檢討看看說我們的量能啊怎麼樣在在做啊還要看相對的效益是啊那中研講堂因為我們在院區開放裡面就有30幾場的類似這樣的演講活動啊所以我們要再評估一下哪一個效益比較高好"},{"start":7474.289,"end":7488.949,"text":"那之前其實我們知道還有這個言之有物就是我們特別把一些比較艱澀跟科學科技相關的部分我們是有配合用一些比較圖文有趣的一個方式來做這樣子的一個出版這樣子的刊物"},{"start":7489.389,"end":7512.341,"text":"adequa部分我不曉得這個推廣有沒有就是延伸到國中小甚至到我們的高中是不是有另外一個更進程的一個跟跨部會教育部這邊來做一個合作然後把這樣子的一個科普的刊物能夠往下扎根的一個計畫目前我們是以出版為主那第三本的顏值有誤也即將出版"},{"start":7513.021,"end":7518.485,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府函．為11二、審查114年度中央政府函．為11二、審查114年度中央政府函．為11二、審查114年度中央政府函．為11"},{"start":7542.262,"end":7547.264,"text":"院長請回。謝謝郭育群委員的質詢。那我們現在休息五分鐘。"},{"start":7870.196,"end":7872.318,"text":"我們繼續開會,現在我們請萬美玲委員質詢。好,謝謝主席,我們有請廖院長。有請廖院長。"},{"start":7888.577,"end":7914.95,"text":"院長早好院長早好院長我想您是身兼我們總統府國家氣候變遷對策委員會的副召集人那這個是關乎這個我們國家能源二次轉型跟達成2050淨零碳排目標非常的重要那所以呢我想站在中研院的立場我們這除了在研究上面我們要不斷的精進之外我們是不是也會提供一些正確的建議給各部會是的"},{"start":7915.45,"end":7931.668,"text":"我們從科技的角度提示。我想在今年的8月跟10月份的時候,我們兩次國家氣候變遷對策的會議都有提到一個就是在明年1月要提出台灣2032年的減碳新目標。院長您都有出席,對嗎?是的。"},{"start":7933.309,"end":7950.349,"text":"根據會議的資料您當時有說要利用新科技提升核能安全性或補強位於地震帶的核電廠我想這一些言論是否代表您對於國家能源的發展是不排除核電的從技術上來講這些是可行的"},{"start":7951.03,"end":7957.435,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案有關中央研究院函．為11二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院函．為11二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院函．為11二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關"},{"start":7978.873,"end":8003.783,"text":"合電的研究分很多層面那從基礎研究的角度它需要投入非常大的資源幾乎全世界只有少數的國家可以獨立投入比如說美國比如說中國那其他都是跨國合作那合電的研究大部分都是在商業化及它安全性的研究方面比較多"},{"start":8005.384,"end":8018.836,"text":"院長,現在中央研究院有進行新核能技術的研發嗎?比如說我們剛剛提到的其中像SMR或者核融合這些技術研究有嗎?沒有,因為這方面有幾個原因。第一個最主要就是這裡面的技術研究"},{"start":8019.377,"end":8019.997,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關"},{"start":8037.005,"end":8057.005,"text":"獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲"},{"start":8057.025,"end":8059.186,"text":"對,第一部分主要是在實際建設的階段每一個核電廠、每一個SMR都有它設計的方式,別人無從置諱"},{"start":8083.637,"end":8109.533,"text":"需要設計工程公司自己去做那學研單位最多只能從比較廣泛的一個角度提供一些這個比較general的一些問題那這個在國際上也有一些研究但是由於過去幾年全世界核能的研究這前景不明所以這方面前景不明"},{"start":8110.973,"end":8132.998,"text":"議員長我想目前就我們自己的狀況來看我們知道核三廠二號機組在明年的五月就要除役了那我們現在看到再生能源的這個發電進展其實是遲緩的那麼我們不管是提高燃氣燃煤發電的比例都其實都會增加碳排所以現在我們看到中火這個二期增加的這個燃氣機組的爭議等等如果"},{"start":8135.478,"end":8141.655,"text":"我們政府堅持要排除掉零碳排的核電您個人認為在2050近零碳排的目標會不會達成?"},{"start":8144.251,"end":8164.619,"text":"競靈我們沒有放棄任何乾淨能源的本錢所以我們要達成競靈一定要想盡辦法用所有可以用的技術那剛才委員提到說我們這個天然氣廠雖然排炭但是他所這個替代的燃煤電廠他"},{"start":8166.4,"end":8168.882,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案"},{"start":8196.323,"end":8197.164,"text":"三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案。"},{"start":8212.628,"end":8234.193,"text":"不是不能這樣講是說我們這個研究繼續進行但這個計劃是在這個14年的預算裡面是明年1月才會開始我想院長其實您真的是很實事求是啦那其實我們有看到其實在112年在就是65千瓦等級的小型商用發電機組那我們以混淨10%的濃度有發電成功那我本期有看到這個部分"},{"start":8238.274,"end":8239.855,"text":"二、審查114年度中央研究院單位預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案"},{"start":8259.821,"end":8261.823,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究基金附屬單位預算案有關中央研究院函．為11"},{"start":8281.34,"end":8309.6,"text":"那剛才您有提到就是說這個預算嘛那我看到中研院在明年的這個預算當中我們也編列了4年10億的這個相關的這個經費明年先編了2億那這個中研院預計在什麼時候我們會開始進行百萬瓦級的相關的混清測試有沒有信心可以做這是我們的規劃是兩年後就是台電由台電購置5M的機組那我們的巨蛋燃氣的反應器跟台電機組做串聯"},{"start":8311.181,"end":8318.547,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案。netesi,這計劃是中研院跟台電來合作,那這個經費是雙方來平攤嗎?然後如果將來這個技術研發成功之後,我們是無償提供給台電,還是我們會向台電來收取部分計轉的費用?至於計轉,我們將來在另外還要談,現在是共同開發的階段。"},{"start":8334.859,"end":8341.882,"text":"我們會跟他平攤費用嗎?不一定是平攤,但是會有一個制裁的一個...所以這個還沒有談出來?這個現在還為時尚早,因為將來還要技術發展的狀況還不確定。"},{"start":8350.265,"end":8380.265,"text":"議員議員"},{"start":8380.425,"end":8382.227,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關"},{"start":8397.583,"end":8399.023,"text":"對中央研究院非常有信心"},{"start":8425.129,"end":8429.25,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關"},{"start":8458.103,"end":8461.782,"text":"好謝謝主席我請中央研究院院長有請院長"},{"start":8465.565,"end":8489.711,"text":"務委員好院長好首先要恭喜院長今年獲選了歐洲分子生物組織也就是EMBO的外籍院士謝謝不只您本人獲選以外我們也代表台灣跟EMBO簽訂了準會員的協定台灣是不是繼亞洲在亞洲是繼新加坡印度之後我們是第三個準會員是的"},{"start":8490.811,"end":8516.323,"text":"獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲"},{"start":8516.403,"end":8520.648,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院函．為11二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關"},{"start":8531.34,"end":8549.821,"text":" ﹏﹏﹏"},{"start":8549.926,"end":8552.369,"text":"國際交流非常重要我們也非常期待除了歐洲以外我也看到一個訊息是9月底的時候院長您是不是跟陳建仁院士也是前副總統一起出席了在教廷的中座科學學院會議"},{"start":8565.662,"end":8566.763,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關"},{"start":8594.503,"end":8599.847,"text":"科學院的院長也可以來到台灣訪問,這個有沒有後續進一步的討論?他們去年已經來了,但是我們當然也歡迎他們繼續來訪問。我想剛才您提到這位應該是另外一個社會科學院的院長,應該社會科學院,但還沒有來過。"},{"start":8618.142,"end":8638.221,"text":"這位科學院的還沒有來過那這個中座科學院的來過跟這位書記主教這兩位來過是我想這些國際交流都非常的重要那陳建仁院士是台灣在教廷中座科學院的第二位院士我們前面還有李遠哲院士"},{"start":8638.541,"end":8639.742,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案。��"},{"start":8653.658,"end":8655.72,"text":"adequate to the budget, of course."},{"start":8675.678,"end":8701.977,"text":"那旅費我想也要提醒其他委員因為我們過去在市議會這幾年期間疫情期間所有所有的公務部門的這個旅費因為沒辦法出國嘛實際上用不到所以我們都是統三但是保留科目因為我們知道等到疫情過後絕對是要趕快來進行國際的交流的所以在疫情之後國際交流的旅費就恢復到我們原先的計劃比前幾年增加這是這是當然的"},{"start":8703.398,"end":8707.7,"text":"我們覺得還不夠我覺得國際的交流對台灣來講不管是學術上實質的進步或者是讓台灣被世界更多的學術社群看見我覺得這兩者我們都非常的希望可以給予你們支持第二個剛剛前面議員自委員也在說怎麼中研院跟中國的學術單位的交流計畫變少了"},{"start":8726.328,"end":8750.54,"text":"是不是代表台灣不重視中國研究?因為我自己碩士是在清大社會所就讀我們所上就有中國研究學程組所以我很多同學他們每一年都是可能要到中國甚至要做田野調查的那台灣的中國研究其實發展多年了不只是清大這個政大東洋所啊、台大啊、國發所啊、淡大等等其實中國研究是我們的強項所以我覺得要理清一件事情"},{"start":8751.48,"end":8758.283,"text":"對中國研究的重視不代表就是要跟中國的這個政府單位做學術交流活動舉例我在清大念書的時候我也代表我們社會所到北京的清華做學術論文的發表交流可是我的論文主題不是中國研究"},{"start":8767.407,"end":8767.727,"text":"兩件事我認為都同等重要。"},{"start":8783.08,"end":8786.404,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案．為11二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關"},{"start":8801.86,"end":8821.318,"text":"科學的進展。所以2021年的時候由國科會、中研院、經濟部我們啟動了一個跨部會的量子國家隊計劃由以5年的時間80億元的預算來投入那非常的高興我們去年底看到中研院我們成功的研發台灣自研自製的超導量子電腦"},{"start":8823.072,"end":8828.519,"text":"當然我們還要進展的空間還有很大可是現在全世界是不是只有6個國家包含美國、中國、日本、芬蘭、荷蘭跟台灣能夠自演自治這樣子的用多一個德國了用多一個德國了總共7個國家但是我覺得"},{"start":8838.371,"end":8848.144,"text":"每個月都會增加每個月都會增加所以大家都在努力大家都在努力進步但是我覺得台灣這個表現已經讓我們非常的期待但是呢我看了一下預算我們5年台灣是80億換算美元的話大概2.5億美國的話這個"},{"start":8853.772,"end":8855.573,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究基金附屬單位預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案"},{"start":8874.026,"end":8889.786,"text":"以中央來講我們特別專注在這個超早量子電腦的研發跟它的製程的開發這兩個方面當然我們有量子光電還有量子密碼但是最燒錢的大概就是超早量子電腦"},{"start":8891.347,"end":8892.768,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關"},{"start":8908.064,"end":8918.913,"text":"是,這個因為我看到我們電子電腦如果我們的成功然後算力就會變成超強嘛也會提供AI的模型應用但是它是不是會有一個狀況這是很長期的沒錯,它是不是會有一個狀況是它的進展也會帶來風險也就是會不會未來網路上面的密碼"},{"start":8926.8,"end":8930.861,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院函．為11二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院函．為11二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院函．為11二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關"},{"start":8954.008,"end":8978.368,"text":"對,因為我看到世界上很多國家,所以我們中研院也開始投入後量子密碼圈。投入很久了,而且發展得相當不錯。好,那這個很重要。接下來最後一點時間想跟院長關心的就是我們對於博士生的講座的提升,因為台灣的博士生招生越來越困難。我在中研院當過三年的研究助理,我那個研究室裡面我記得就有兩位是博士後"},{"start":8979.289,"end":8990.771,"text":"的學長姐那他們在一邊努力做研究也一邊希望說未來是不是能夠繼續擔任研究員或者是可以投入教職所以除了這個供給量以外其實會發現對博士生來說很大一個困難是他可能念博士的時間較長那這個當中那個生活上面如何去支撐他可以全職的來投入博士生的這個學程所以我們中研院也是有博士生講述提升方案目前我們的計畫是怎麼樣來提升"},{"start":9009.535,"end":9011.977,"text":"委員會委員會委員會委員會委員會委員會"},{"start":9027.886,"end":9052.804,"text":"分別是臺大、清大、師大、臺師大還有這個臺南藝術大學、四所大學總共16名博士生我們給予5年的獎助金這些人在大學裡面做研究我們希望說他能夠免除這個您剛才所說的這個生活的困境能夠專心做研究"},{"start":9053.644,"end":9057.727,"text":"所以這個獎注金是每個月提供然後並且是會永續性的讓他能夠把他博士生就讀完成但每年你們會進行一個檢視跟審查嗎?對好這個名額啊我們這個預算在編列的時候名額總共是多少?因為我看你說每年級獎勵的名額最多可以到15名但是我們這一次全國只選了16名"},{"start":9076.982,"end":9100.432,"text":"未來這個名額是不是有提升的空間呢?我們今年有200多位人申請那經過很嚴格的這個考核最後有16位通過作選那明年我們當然希望有更多人來申請那因為是精英獎學金所以我們其實這個標準還是在的但是我們希望很多優秀的學生來申請明年有更多人可以拿到這個獎學金"},{"start":9101.212,"end":9116.961,"text":"是,標準審查嚴格是必須的。那也許是我們在這個計畫的說明上面也讓這個博士生知道要來申請的話他要具備怎麼樣的能力,好不好?是的,我們的評審委員第一次全部是特聘研究員跟院士來當評審委員,所以是非常嚴謹的標準。好,謝謝院長,謝謝主席。謝謝吳佩儀委員的質詢,院長請回。再來我們請林倩琦委員質詢。"},{"start":9136.101,"end":9144.056,"text":"好,謝謝主席,我們立院同仁,還有我們這個中研院的同仁,大家早安,大家好。那我們先請院長。好,有請院長。"},{"start":9147.737,"end":9172.617,"text":"林委員好院長好中研院是我們國家最高的研究機構我們在整個的研究的還有科技創新的部分是我們很重要的一環資源的配置還有資源配置的精準跟成效的方向是我們努力的目標今天我針對三個主題來進行一些質詢希望能夠有一些明確的回應"},{"start":9173.758,"end":9192.382,"text":"當然我們今年在談在這邊談那個113年的跟114年的這個相關的這個預算那我想先請教一個不免俗的先問一下一個預算執行的問題那我們目前執行率是84.42那這個部分是在我們以往的這個時間序是正常的嗎?"},{"start":9195.253,"end":9205.347,"text":"到年底可能還會增加因為有一些這個預算正在執行當中所以這個年度上這樣子是是這個應該是正常的請主席來說明一下"},{"start":9208.724,"end":9234.253,"text":"跟委員報告一下目前因為執行只算到9月底那到年底的時候執行率會再提高那預計每年大概都會執行到9乘5以上好的好謝謝所以我這邊是做一個提醒所以在這邊也會反映到114年度是不是能夠整個順利的推動那這個就請相關的主管來做一下留意那另外一個是原住民族知識的這我就進入今天的這個主題原住民族知識的這個推廣"},{"start":9236.655,"end":9260.454,"text":"上次我對於在院內做原住民族相關的主題有一些了解那你們跟學校的結合我這邊也做了比較深入的參與所以我想了解一下在這個知識體系的建設你們其實做了不少的貢獻但是在知識體系的運用不知道院內在這個部分有沒有去了解一下你們的結構比或者是實際的狀況"},{"start":9262.716,"end":9288.009,"text":"目前進行主要是兩個面向一個是在文化人文方面有民族所另外原住民族有很多固有的一些醫療上的一些應用好謝謝那如果說醫療我想跟你請教一下你們這個整個數據比例在這裡面的一個整理請問營生就是你們所謂的醫療嗎還是營生這個詞"},{"start":9291.43,"end":9315.758,"text":"在你們的報告裡面我現在一下子沒有辦法把應該你們報告裡面你們去看你們整理出來的原住民的相關的那個數據好我直接講了那個在這個原住民的知識推廣的這個部分我先講一下你們的比例大部分你們都集中在民族跟社會所那人文社會的這個研究你們大概在院裡面的比例佔了6.73%"},{"start":9317.538,"end":9338.576,"text":"相較於其他的生科跟那個數科大概11.75跟11.81其實有很大的一個落差那如果原住民的部分都還集中在人文社會裡面的話你們可能要去計算一下這裡面的差異這個是我要很深刻的提醒因為我覺得常常在研究單位、教育單位那因為你們是研究單位所以我就就內容的部分深談"},{"start":9339.076,"end":9339.916,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案。��"},{"start":9366.451,"end":9391.161,"text":"很少去做這個連結我想我現在問這個數據搞不好一都沒有但是當我們講到計轉後面要講但我擔心時間不夠所以前面先跟你們講計轉這樣一個概念在原住民的主題上你們去怎麼思考的那這其實跟我講的應用層面也有關係那我可能沒有辦法聽你們太多的這個回應但是如果待會有空你們就跟我談談計轉的部分你們有做到些什麼"},{"start":9394.923,"end":9413.392,"text":"我一個概念一直是不希望原住民族成為現代的博物館那現在有的時候看起來也只是一個活生生的博物館而已所以我們講一下你們可能要去確認一下讓我來請問一下所以在這個中研院裡面原住民籍的研究員大概有多少專任兼任"},{"start":9417.043,"end":9443.824,"text":"嗯...這個...哇,等你們跑完,都來不及了。民主所報告在我們所是正式的有一位,那那個...堅韌的有兩位嗎?然後博士生有很多位,是吧?反正剛才我聽到有其他委員對你們這個博士生的鼓勵、獎勵,我這邊也是支持啦,就希望你們能夠在這個部分能夠再多強化一些,因為我們講上次我聽到原住民的學生,我們大部分在東部的也蠻多的,"},{"start":9444.244,"end":9447.928,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院函．為11二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關"},{"start":9466.906,"end":9487.218,"text":"那我就直接從原住民這邊再接續到接下來這個主題不過如果問原住民籍的院士有幾個我想可能有我相信未來都會有我們就朝這個目標去邁進所以第二個部分我們來談一下剛才有委員提到你們量子的部分是做得還蠻不錯的"},{"start":9489.219,"end":9496.263,"text":"在院內是不是做過這個無失在我們應該是民主所嘛做過無失的這個研究嘛對吧那你們曾經想過當然"},{"start":9499.805,"end":9528.424,"text":"簡單整理啦我們在台灣的研究的這個部分齁占很大經費的都是所謂的硬體但是我覺得這個缺口經常是軟體做了一些但是軟體的應用跟處理我們做的好像也稍微有點比較欠缺這怎麼說呢請問你們在做這個量子的這個區塊齁我們講說你們有思考過量子的糾結或量子的疊加跟巫師這個系統在現代性的一個呈現有可能有什麼連結嗎"},{"start":9529.445,"end":9531.386,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案。��"},{"start":9551.597,"end":9577.078,"text":"主題上當然我們可能在太空時間是不太可能有這個位置去談的但是在我們所謂原住民的區塊或傳統的區塊有沒有可能在現代性的實質科學研究去處理到這個未來搞不好可以走出一條很有趣的路的主題院長您的看法呢可以思考看看這部分確實我們努力的比較少但是確實可以思考看看"},{"start":9578.29,"end":9604.333,"text":"當然這個是內容的這個部分啦所以我丟給你們一些可能性好那科研的應用跟這個跟社會的連結除了在原住民的部分那上回我有跟你們提出一個問題AI對我而言其實大家都會跟著一些口號講但是對我們曾經投入過的人其實那個問題就是說請問他跟非常強大的電腦計算的差異在哪裡"},{"start":9605.943,"end":9634.324,"text":"當然你們現在可能也沒有機會回答這個問題可是我當然一直很希望我的問題能夠被回應因為它不是一言兩語可以講完的所以除了在硬體的部分占很大的經費但在軟體跟應用跟傳統的連結上我覺得院裡面作為最高的研究單位是不是有機會雖然我們一天到晚談整合一天到晚談跨域那到底我們整合了多少跨域了多少"},{"start":9636.285,"end":9655.893,"text":"所以院長好這個就簡單說明這確實這是一個非常重要但是有非常複雜的問題那我們院裡面做所有的這方面的AI的工作幾乎所有都是跨域所有都是整合所以他是無形的進行當中而不是特別說有一個幾個跨域的計劃幾個整合的計劃"},{"start":9659.595,"end":9680.708,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案。netesi,我剛才一開始就提醒了所以在原住民的領域你就可以看到很多我剛才提的不是只有原住民領域而是在我們人文"},{"start":9681.581,"end":9683.982,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院科學研究院函．為11"},{"start":9703.187,"end":9726.462,"text":"確實正如委員講的我們在計轉的考量並不是以計轉金的高低作為唯一的標準而是希望說這個技術能夠貢獻於社會那怎麼樣讓更多人能夠更有效率的用到這個技術這是我們最主要的考量而不是像一般公司行號是以他的這個計轉金作為唯一的考量"},{"start":9727.122,"end":9741.611,"text":"好的謝謝院長最後一個提醒就是那對於人才回流跟人才培育跟人才工作的平台我希望中央院這邊能夠再多加考量好謝謝好院長請回謝謝林倩琪委員的質詢我們現在請張雅玲委員質詢OK好"},{"start":9764.394,"end":9792.056,"text":"議員議員議員議員"},{"start":9810.879,"end":9816.886,"text":"議員議員議員"},{"start":9819.481,"end":9847.892,"text":"張委員好謝謝院長就是說其實院長應該也非常了解我非常關注兒童所以上次我其實在兒童科普日還有院區開放日的時候不管是我或是我們的助理其實都有去在現場其實我可以感受到我們的研究團我們的研究人員我們這些院士對小孩的那個熱情跟傳授知識的那一種積極的態度還有幫孩子去規劃整個空間的那一種"},{"start":9849.178,"end":9854.66,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府函．為11二、審查114年度中央政府函．為11二、審查114年度中央政府函．為11二、審查114年度中央政府函．為11"},{"start":9871.848,"end":9872.329,"text":" bicyclone"},{"start":9887.819,"end":9889.06,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究基金附屬單位預算案。"},{"start":9906.509,"end":9924.267,"text":"數理科學組生命科學組跟人文社會組那目前看起來人文社會組的場次呢我還是希望說我們是不是可以有一點點的增加因為我們現在可能都比較偏向科技類的東西我們是不是可以再微調多一點點的人文科技的人文的這個社會學的這個領域"},{"start":9927.211,"end":9948.904,"text":"我也看到了一下就是說其實大家當天的滿意度也都是非常高就是大概有96成的民眾是滿意這次的活動那有97%的民眾都是表達我明年有意願再來參與這樣子的一個活動形式不過我還是想從這幾個數據來跟院長再多做一些討論就是說我們的人次雖然增加了很多但是我們的參與"},{"start":9949.784,"end":9953.625,"text":"度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關"},{"start":9979.373,"end":10003.204,"text":"報告委員我這邊已經有初步的資料那南部呢南部的調查結果滿意度如何呢對我們的滿意度也是高達98%那有96%表示願意明年再來那麼我們這個以這個人次而言呢今年的人次也超過了兩萬五千人次以上兩萬五千人次那今年有多少場次呢在南部在南部有35個場次"},{"start":10005.385,"end":10031.034,"text":"我覺得從這個數據可以看到你看喔你35場次你吸引了兩萬五千人可是我們兩萬五千人次嘛對不對那我們北部是一萬一百個場次吸引了五萬多人表示南部的吸引力非常大對不對更多人來嘛對不對你辦35場就來兩萬五千人所以我也希望明年這個需求很大市場需求蓬勃發展啦好不好我們一起來努力明年開南部更多的場次"},{"start":10033.035,"end":10054.492,"text":"再來就是說我們在這個我希望明年做的問卷調查我們可以再更詳盡的看到縣市的差異我們就可以了解到說是不是都非常集中在雙北我們是不是可以要多做一點宣傳在新竹那南部市只有集中在台南我們要怎麼樣拓展到高雄讓這個涵蓋率可以再更大一點不過我還有一件事情想要跟院長再來繼續討論就是說"},{"start":10056.053,"end":10056.434,"text":"adequ."},{"start":10077.074,"end":10103.892,"text":"那我也在想說我們戶外的空間是不是也可以做一些規劃因為小孩子在裡面等久了他想要出去跑一跑玩一玩我們是不是也有一些活動的規劃在外面讓小孩子可以短暫的去休息一下而不是站在那邊一直等這是不是也可以一併的來調整那這些精進的方案是不是有可能在多久一個月時間呢提供給我還是兩個月報告員秘書處長曾國祥可以在一個月以內提供給你"},{"start":10104.534,"end":10120.004,"text":"好 謝謝那再來我還有一點也是想要再做討論的就是說我們其實有希望可以了解兒童的聲音因為這是第一次做6到12歲的部分嘛那但是我看了一下問卷回收只有17%是由兒童來填答的那我在想我們是不是因為我自己其實看了這個內容齁"},{"start":10121.505,"end":10149.706,"text":"坦白說齁我覺得要6到12歲的小孩來填答難度似乎有點太高了齁我想現場大家也都了解我們是不是可以再依據兒童友善的方式來去設計問卷呢因為現場我們的手冊都做得很可愛啊有注音啊所以我們填答的東西全部都是很尖色的文字他可能根本也搞不懂我到底我剛剛參加的那一場到底跟你看生物化學研究室跟生物醫學科學研究室跟"},{"start":10150.126,"end":10164.935,"text":"分子生物研究室小孩子的理解就是欸都有生物那到底我剛參加的是哪一場可能會搞不清楚我們是不是可以根據兒童的理解他們的視角來重新設計這份問卷明年才能夠去收集更多兒童真實的心聲呢"},{"start":10165.794,"end":10187.947,"text":"好,這個我們會再多做討論,並且請一些專家來幫忙,這可能不是我們的專業。好,沒關係,這個部分的話我也非常願意來跟中研院一起來討論,因為這剛好是我過去的專業,然後我最近的,剛好我去年做的一個案例呢,今年也剛好最近要頒獎,得到一個影響力對話獎,所以我非常願意來協助中研院。"},{"start":10188.967,"end":10214.12,"text":"謝謝委員再來就是說我們的科普日再進一步的在這個部分我們除了做問卷之外我們是不是可以這一次針對今年已經參加過的小孩我們可以來招募他們一起來做一個小型的執畫研究或是focus group的部分來了解明年我們可以怎麼樣更精進搞不好他們的意見就可以反映在我們的問卷裡面這部分我們是不是也可以一起來討論看起來我覺得院長都笑得很開心現場也都笑得很開心應該是沒有問題吧"},{"start":10215.506,"end":10239.179,"text":"這是看我們人力的規劃狀況我們當然很希望說能夠盡量投注但畢竟我們人力有限我們主要的工作仍然是在研究同仁都已經很有熱忱的撥出時間來做這方面我們要看說我們怎麼樣把這個做得不再不影響研究的狀況之下把這做得更好"},{"start":10240.151,"end":10266.771,"text":"好喔 因為我想中研院一定也有做很多人文科學研究的專家啦那也許我們也可以在這個一個月一併討論的剛剛是說一個月之內提供給我一些精進的方案嘛我們是不是也可以把這件事情納入來或者是說約我們辦公室我們再來詳細的討論看我們可以怎麼樣子的來做在不影響大家的工作的狀況之下好嗎那再來就是說最後再來我想要跟我先跳舞一下好了因為我時間可能不太夠"},{"start":10268.939,"end":10295.14,"text":"就是說針對還是人文科學這個領域就是說我們現在在中研院其實是之前在受訪的時候有提到說因為這個AI會這個我們這個中研院有豐富的人文社會資料庫我們應該重視人文AI在人文社會科學領域的應用並反思AI對人類社會的衝擊那您也有提到說大量使用AI會牽扯到法律倫理道德等等的問題所以這就是為什麼我們要辦"},{"start":10295.981,"end":10321.749,"text":"獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲"},{"start":10321.989,"end":10351.125,"text":"我想問一下您目前對這個辦公室的規劃是什麼樣?可不可以簡單說明一下?我們這個辦公室有很多個區塊那比如AI合作社幫現在已經有的團隊來解決AI上的問題同時我們也積極規劃很多的訓練課程來訓練我們的研究人員及所有中央研究院的同仁包括行政同仁跟研究助理都一起來了解AI怎麼樣把AI用在實際的工作上面。報告時候院長我想要針對在人設領域的部分"},{"start":10352.446,"end":10371.401,"text":"我們也規劃一些專題的專案的研究把我們現有的資料庫怎麼樣AI化在AI化之前一定要有一個能夠用AI來自動辨識一些古籍能夠做這個字體的辨識這個是非常困難但是非常重要的一件事情"},{"start":10371.681,"end":10373.042,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關"},{"start":10389.841,"end":10410.394,"text":"資料庫裡面所以我覺得這一點其實是我們最能夠凸顯所有跟華文世界裡面最重要的相關的研究應該都在我們這裡所以這一點我想要了解我們相關的時程那希望事後也可以提供我們這個相關的計畫到我們辦公室我們一起來努力啦讓台灣成為AI的民主文化中心謝謝院長請回喔謝謝張雅玲委員的質詢我們再來請陳培宇委員質詢"},{"start":10427.577,"end":10430.161,"text":"謝謝主席那有請院長謝謝好有請院長"},{"start":10434.085,"end":10456.837,"text":"陳委員好好 院長好謝謝剛剛雅玲委員幫忙開了頭關於兒童科普日喔院長應該每次看到我就會想到我是在立法院第一個要求我們的open house要針對孩子們的設計喔那孩子們的定義呢現在在聯合國定義是0到18歲那今年我也再次去參加了兒童科普日喔我印象非常深刻"},{"start":10457.617,"end":10463.807,"text":"在我們玩完某一個站點之後到了某一個站玩了完全忘記某一個站但我記得那個站的老師說"},{"start":10465.572,"end":10489.155,"text":"獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲"},{"start":10489.816,"end":10503.73,"text":"參與這個活動的老師們還有研究室還有他們的研究助理甚至我們還看到現場非常多的高中志工大學志工因為這確實不在原本中研院的業務當中但是老師們助理們還有志工願意用假日的時間"},{"start":10505.051,"end":10527.919,"text":"先用上班的時間設計課程內容然後再用其他額外的時間參與了活動所以我要再次感謝所有中研院的老師但我也想要問我從去年5月18提出那院長你們很快在去年的10月14號就有兒童科普日那中研院南部院區的部分的open house現在活動也舉辦完然後看起來回應非常的好"},{"start":10528.539,"end":10546.288,"text":"如果我再進一步許願有機會我們在人力可行經費可及的情況下有沒有機會在南院也推行兒童科普日機會是有但是我個人目前的想法是先從這個分零標示同一天"},{"start":10547.108,"end":10566.271,"text":"議員議員議員議員"},{"start":10566.391,"end":10568.574,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院函．為11二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院函．為11"},{"start":10582.671,"end":10591.053,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案。二、處理中央研究院單位預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案。二、處理中央研究院單位預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案有關"},{"start":10606.297,"end":10630.868,"text":"好那如果有這個部分的活動我再往下看其實中研院還有人文講座今天也有委員提到不管是過去只有今年只有一場在苗栗或者是後續還有其他的規劃如果把我剛剛講的這麼多科普活動我們再複習一下有所謂的open house後來在我去年提出增加了兒童科普日之後我們還有兒童科普日接下來還有南院的open house"},{"start":10631.288,"end":10632.388,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府函．為11"},{"start":10647.313,"end":10669.822,"text":"這些工作流程當中我想問一下目前的預算當然立法院不能主動增加預算但是我真的很好奇目前的人力配置或者是預算的配置在這麼多委員都強烈要求科普跟民眾對話的情況下目前的狀況是很辛苦還是很有餘裕還是說其實你們還有更多的想像但是需要立法院更多的支持"},{"start":10671.002,"end":10693.007,"text":"我們很辛苦,因為這些工作不在我們法定任務裡面。所以我們原來的預算是不會編很多在這邊,必須要想辦法。那假如說這方面要加強的話,可能我們明年的經費要編列的時候需要考量這方面。"},{"start":10693.553,"end":10722.864,"text":"所以院長我想問一下你目前送進立法院的預算有把這麼多的科普的預算都編足編好編滿嗎?我們請秘書處長回答好謝謝是的謝謝委員我們目前的沒有特別把這一項特別的增加那我們明年呢會再神聖的評估是否要在這一塊增加那特別是在人力的部分因為隨著活動量的增加那自然這個人力的需求也會提升好"},{"start":10723.484,"end":10752.796,"text":"我非常樂意聽到這個非常務實的回答也就是說當有更多的民眾的需求被看見當有更多立法委員對於科普的要求的品質更高數量更多的時候如果都丟有秘書處好像只是一檔一檔一檔活動策劃沒有整體的視野沒有整體的預算規劃其實我相信對秘書處或是公關處應該都相對辛苦所以這個部分要拜託院長了明年也就是說你們現在送進立法院的明年的預算沒有辦法"},{"start":10753.396,"end":10771.733,"text":"但是明年在編後年的預算的時候你們會謹慎的考慮把相關的預算編足編好編滿讓更多的科普活動的需求可以被滿足我可以這樣說嗎?好,我們會朝這方向努力好,謝謝喔所以包含我再一次跟院長您強調就是open house的部分還有出版品"},{"start":10772.313,"end":10801.173,"text":"零到18歲的可能性因為目前這些書當然都很好看我自己讀起來可能都還是有一些門檻當然我自己會努力這是我們當然自己要做的努力但是有沒有機會跟相關的專家學者做成更適合小孩閱讀因為現在108課綱裡面強調非常多素養而閱讀的能力或者是學科以外的知識生活中可以用的這些普及性其實也很需要相關的專家學者來協助還有關於人文講座的部分這個就要持續拜託中研院"},{"start":10801.913,"end":10819.492,"text":"最後我想要談一下就是關於博士生獎助金調生的方案一樣在你們的預算書當中你們提到預算增列2.02億我想要知道一下目前是不是全部都用於博士生獎助金的調生那院長您運估會有多少人受惠"},{"start":10821.134,"end":10839.107,"text":"這個數字我請國際處長來回答。好,謝謝。報告委員,現在2.2億是我們總共的預算。那裡面有8千萬,所以在今年有8千萬是用來,專門是放在這個獎學金調升方案上面。那所以這個8千萬已經受惠在700多位的博士生。"},{"start":10839.687,"end":10868.301,"text":"好,700多位我覺得這已經是我們目前還蠻覺得還蠻可以接受的一個數字不過我們希望如果有機會它當然可以更好讓更多的有學術潛力的博士生願意投入研究的行列可是我們也想要知道相關的預算調升方案有沒有機會帶動其他大專院校調升當然我知道大專院校有他們自己的預算規劃但是中研院作為很重要的政策領頭羊院長你在這個部分有沒有什麼看法"},{"start":10868.781,"end":10889.682,"text":"我想我們最主要目的正如委員講的我們是要帶動全國的這個博士生的獎助金提升所以我們的這個實行這個政策之後國科會跟教育部都也推出各自的計畫那我想各校也都有自己這個提升獎助金的計畫"},{"start":10891.648,"end":10908.038,"text":"但是我覺得這個獎助金的計畫當然確實希望可以幫助到更多人投入研究的場域當中然後提升台灣的研究實力不過我認為如果有機會透過跨部會的討論就是由中研院這邊去跟國科會跟教育部就是如同院長您剛剛說的"},{"start":10909.139,"end":10925.014,"text":"他們也都提出相關計畫但是各部會之間的跨平台對話或者是你們在執行當中所遇到的一些可能性的問題或者是好的經驗作為彼此分享不知道有沒有機會在未來可以看見這個可能性過去就有過去我們提供我們的意見給相關部會參考"},{"start":10927.176,"end":10949.882,"text":"獲得的回應是……我想相當正面的我們也期待看到後續更多的可能性可以讓更多的人受惠於這個政策最後我也是要再次強調科普的部分要請中研院多多幫忙相關的預算也請積極的編入來年的預算當中讓更多的科普教育可以面對更多的民眾不管是大人還是小孩"},{"start":10950.462,"end":10973.485,"text":"那出版品的部分也是我希望後續有機會可以跟中研院討論這麼好看的顏值有物有沒有機會透過跟專家學者的合作或是出版專業的團體轉換成0到18歲的孩子也可以讀的內容然後open house的部分把兒童科普入的部分加進去讓他更有可能面對更多孩子讓他們在看手機之外參加這些好玩的活動也真的可以邊玩邊學好嗎"},{"start":10975.766,"end":10984.251,"text":"再一次謝謝院長帶領所有老師的努力那我要再一次謝謝所有老師在Open House兒童科普日對我們孩子的協助謝謝謝謝主席謝謝院長院長請回喔謝謝陳培育委員的質詢再來我們請吳春成委員質詢"},{"start":11008.054,"end":11009.824,"text":"有請那個廖院長有請院長"},{"start":11014.671,"end":11039.903,"text":"午委員好院長好好久不見好像要見你一次很困難一個會期見一次OK好那個中央研究院呢是我非常羨慕的單位但是我們都沒資格進中央研究院所以呢對中央研究院就有非常多的想像跟期待那因為啊這一個"},{"start":11042.313,"end":11064.106,"text":"這個就像立法院我雖然很想跟你們說辛苦了但是立法院實在更辛苦更辛苦對不對每天這個陳出不窮的議題陳出不窮的事情我們都必須要立即的回應但是老實講有些呢我覺得太皮毛了"},{"start":11065.421,"end":11068.522,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院函．為11二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院函．為11"},{"start":11086.135,"end":11107.398,"text":"獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲"},{"start":11108.607,"end":11117.327,"text":"這些專家學者能夠好好的用心善於用自己的長處來努力但是"},{"start":11118.667,"end":11143.615,"text":"還是要解決這個我們社會的問題像比如說最近川普狂勝叫狂勝大家都被驚嚇所有的預測都失靈民調機構預測失靈很多研究機構很多包括什麼都是馬後炮開始提出各種的解釋我想要請問院長為什麼"},{"start":11147.755,"end":11175.972,"text":"這麼多的研究單位看不到這樣的事情通常研究單位是什麼樣的這麼大的一個風潮這麼大的改變大型的社會結構在轉變民意在改變的時候大家都為什麼方法都為什麼會這個判斷都沒辦法抓得準這是非常好的問題我個人不是這方面的專家我們是不是請這個比較投入的專家來"},{"start":11178.225,"end":11189.83,"text":"來回應一下問題為什麼一定要施准先不要好了因為這不是我今天問的重點我只是要導出一個問題就是我們"},{"start":11191.345,"end":11209.478,"text":"我們在這樣子的一個研究單位裡面顯然常常會見數不見影太專注了看到大型那個超大的東西的時候就看不到了大家可能因為講究專業嘛就專在一個事情上面那我還是要回來關心的是"},{"start":11210.751,"end":11235.924,"text":"我上次就我關心人口的問題就是在立法院在推動的就是超高齡那10月17號我們國發會也公布的最新人口數據整個的看得出來是更加的險峻更加的嚴重那我還是我上次在3月20號有詢問過這個院長在請問中央研究院有在關注這件事情嗎"},{"start":11237.351,"end":11245.678,"text":"我們在這個人文社會領域有學者專家在這方面進行一些研討我們是不是請專家來"},{"start":11249.037,"end":11275.663,"text":"報告委員我們是人社中心張大謙那我們今年在這個五月之後經過委員的這個建議之後我們有開始盤點我們人社方面在這方面的人口老化的議題那我們現在目前有舉辦了三次的演講包括聚焦在勞動力參與包括在經濟的改革包括在這個健康方面的問題所以我們現在陸續還有三場部分然後後續會提出一些比較具體的一些方案在做建議這樣子OK很好謝謝"},{"start":11278.204,"end":11292.277,"text":"對,這非常期待啦,非常期待就是其實這個問題的嚴重各位專家應該都比我更加的了解我們的65歲老人人口比例各位可以看目前下面這個藍色的部分"},{"start":11293.058,"end":11295.119,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案。��"},{"start":11317.816,"end":11342.355,"text":"那這個天翻地覆的問題我們顯然我們國內經常會講說欸全世界都沒有在重視啊我們台灣習慣走在全世界的後面尾隨人家但是這件事情我們是要走在全世界的最前面這需要我們的學者也要有這種觀念然後世界上我們要比個因為我們的問題最嚴重那工作人口也是一樣"},{"start":11344.317,"end":11369.013,"text":"這一頁是工作人口工作人口所佔的比例藍色的部分是2024年我們現在是有69.1但是到了2027年會只剩下46.6我們看到歐美各國大概都已經五、六十我們的競爭力又會更低一樣的都比日本還要五十幾"},{"start":11370.758,"end":11377.044,"text":"我們的扶養比,大家也看到目前是3.6,未來下一代一定會被我們壓垮。"},{"start":11380.588,"end":11400.178,"text":"這個問題被稱為是教育問題、國防的問題、社福問題、經濟問題、全面性的崩潰的問題。甚至有人會說有三分之一的台灣的鄉鎮會變鬼城,會變消滅。這一些都是很大的問題,我覺得行政部門眼光沒有那麼圓。"},{"start":11401.459,"end":11404.761,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院函．為11二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院函．為11"},{"start":11427.092,"end":11445.759,"text":"對,也覺得這個不重要的話那我們整個大家都在睡覺少子化的問題這一次調查出來提早的15年本來估計是2054年這一次預估到2040年就會跌破10萬人然後我們每年投入的1200億"},{"start":11447.813,"end":11467.034,"text":"要想要翻轉少子化但是呢我們的少子化還提早15年顯見是什麼政策方向錯誤對策方向錯誤但是到底要怎麼做我們現在大概都是補助用補助的方法你們請學術單位也提出提出你們的研究的觀察"},{"start":11467.975,"end":11492.726,"text":"第二就是我們的社會高齡化已經定型了已經定型的就是這個問題不可逆轉未來我們的工作人口會消失將近千萬人、八百多萬人這影響的是市場、企業、稅賦、撫養跟消退這全面性這麼大的影響所以是不是可以請問院長在這個問題上面可不可以請院長就這三方面"},{"start":11493.846,"end":11510.798,"text":"當然雖說是自由了,但是可以引導大家來關注從教育的層面、從經濟的層面、從勞工的層面來那因為這個是中央研究院我向這個最重要的宗旨這是善盡社會關鍵的責任這問題絕對是關鍵的,也只有智庫有辦法解決這種問題"},{"start":11515.922,"end":11532.238,"text":"因爲在我們現在的行政單位是沒辦法眼光看超過10年的事情的這麼大的一個天翻地覆的危機我就怎麼樣都喚不醒這個社會大家每天吵的都是眼前的事情那麼是不是能夠請"},{"start":11533.649,"end":11548.903,"text":"中央學術那好接下來我最後是不是要有這樣的期待是不是可以請中央研究院在三個月之內針對這樣子的超高齡少子超高齡社會來有提出一個"},{"start":11549.984,"end":11564.14,"text":"國家級的研究計畫這個計畫你能做到什麼地步我沒有意見但是總是要啟動要把這問題當作一個核心的問題來啟動請大家可不可以在三個月之內給我一份報告你們的構想"},{"start":11564.964,"end":11591.267,"text":"我們可以在三位內跟委員提出我們的構想規定能夠開始計畫但提出的構想或許可以這問題確實是我個人跟眾議院都很關心但是這方面國內的專家學者恐怕人數也不多所以有點實際的困難但是我們仍然會朝這方向等高一呼可能可以要各社會各方面來關注這個議題"},{"start":11592.848,"end":11604.1,"text":"那三個月就拜託院長了,謝謝。好,院長請回,謝謝吳春成委員的質詢。再來是范雲委員質詢,我們請陳秀寶代主席。"},{"start":11617.739,"end":11623.029,"text":"議員議員議員"},{"start":11625.584,"end":11648.31,"text":"院長辛苦了那也謝謝院長在我之前質詢的那個院士國籍的案有非常詳細的說明我們今天解凍報告裡面就說明的很清楚那我知道這個非常的艱困那謝謝院長那今天其實是要針對另外一個問題想請教院長那想請問院長如果有一群人定定一個自律規範"},{"start":11649.77,"end":11651.994,"text":"可是訂定的時候卻沒有訂定違反規定的時候的處理機制。那你覺得這個規範會有用嗎?"},{"start":11658.717,"end":11682.971,"text":"我想這個主要是靠個人的自我約束。靠個人自我約束。對。就有用了。當然不保證說百分之百,但是這是第一步。畢竟這是一個透過一個民主的機制制定出來的。那這個沒有辦法這個用其他方法來輕易來改變。"},{"start":11683.971,"end":11703.773,"text":"按照院長這樣的說法的話那中研院對於員工的性騷、權勢等等就只要訂規範都不用訂申訴跟處理機制?那不是,因為這種是可以從行政面來處理的那我們有不同的法規就可以來"},{"start":11704.113,"end":11722.091,"text":"所以您覺得我們對院士跟對研究員可以用不同的標準對院士的話大家訂了規範就會自己遵行可是對研究員的話因為他們的層級比較低所以就必須訂令處理機制嗎不是因為大部分的院士不在本院任職"},{"start":11722.972,"end":11750.469,"text":"它講院士在本院任職仍然是受我們所有院裡面的規範來限制所以不需要用這個所以因為院士大部分不在本院任職沒錯所以我們的規範因為它是一個榮譽它並不是在本院的人員我們沒辦法約束不在本院之心不在本院工作不是本院人員所以院長認為我們無法約束中華民國院士的行為是這樣嗎"},{"start":11752.15,"end":11758.795,"text":"是要靠這個院士會議自己的運作、程序的運作。好,那其實今天就是想跟院長溝通這個問題啦。我想我們有不同的意見沒關係喔,就可以來處理喔。那院長應該有記得喔,其實不是只有今年3月喔。那我從2021年就針對這一題質詢。然後2023年用預算追蹤喔。那今年3月我一直在問說,欸?"},{"start":11779.989,"end":11799.47,"text":"其他國家的院士都有行為倫理準則也有相關規定包含揭露財產來源利益迴避不得歧視騷擾霸凌等還有傷害學術自由等部分希望中研院也能夠有這種倫理行為準則就是英文講的code of conduct"},{"start":11800.01,"end":11814.008,"text":"我還是要謝謝院長有推動這個部分因為你們給我的回覆就是終於之前因為疫情嘛終於就是在今年7月修改那修改前你們有告訴我們說你們的相關的委員會裡面"},{"start":11815.51,"end":11824.833,"text":"然後因為會中意見多元尚未獲得共識所以顯然裡面是有一些爭吵不同的意見我覺得是好事後來決定要擴大參與繼續研議那最後呢你們參考了國內外學術研究機構那列出來就兩個美國國家科學院"},{"start":11833.816,"end":11862.295,"text":"與聯合國教科文組織的相關的ethics：然後你們會納入人工智慧、生物科技等倫理規範。還有揭露研究結果可能涉及的個人利益關係跟財務得失。我對照一下你們今年7月修過的,的確第一條增加了除了學術自由之精神,還增加了增進人類福祉,確保永續環境。第三條寫到研究成果有利益衝突的時候,應該揭露可能涉及的相關資訊。"},{"start":11865.899,"end":11880.994,"text":"第7條寫說院士應遵守自身聘僱機關及研究贊助單位對研究相關行為規範與預算時的處置辦法。我是覺得最可惜的就是第7條因為前面都是一個進步可是第7條好像把這個責任"},{"start":11882.295,"end":11882.595,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關"},{"start":11912.94,"end":11913.102,"text":"院長覺得"},{"start":11914.435,"end":11942.169,"text":"跟委員報告一下中研院有兩個部分一個是我們實體的研究單位我是院長來負責中理所有的院務另外一個是院士會議我當主席那裡面的所有機制跟我們院務事實上是分開的所以裡面的條文不是中研院定的"},{"start":11942.669,"end":11951.377,"text":"而是院士透過院士會議的基金。我知道,院長剛剛一直說,院士是榮譽職。我們知道他是終身榮譽職。可是這個行為準則出來之後,我還有看到新聞有舉例說,你們的新聞處對外說他跟諾貝爾講一樣,所以沒有這種取消的事。那我覺得這個比喻以我來看好像不太對啦。"},{"start":11966.371,"end":11985.31,"text":"因為你們第8條就講中央研究院院士職權如下一、選舉院士及名譽院士二、選舉評議會這個評議會就是您剛講的中研院非常重要的學術評議會它幾乎是很多事情除了你們的所長在座都是的話那其實院士有這個職權"},{"start":11986.471,"end":12011.925,"text":"還可以籌議國家學術研究方針第四個委託案可能有或沒有我想舉的例子就是右邊這邊舉一些例子讓大家感受院士會不會沒有爭議我們想像院士應該多數沒有爭議因為我們有298位可是不排除過去真的有爭議郭惠在2019年香港城市大學擔任校長的學生被港警濫射濫捕關鍵時刻神隱"},{"start":12014.346,"end":12039.82,"text":"我覺得看起來神隱還算是有一些道德良知啦那張翔從2019年到2021年他也是我們的院士在港大校長任內打壓大學自主學生自治涉及他收回了學生會的辦公室還有不承認學生會的地位所以港大因此就沒有學生會那我們不用講他發生學生抗議的時候的一些衝突"},{"start":12040.74,"end":12044.062,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關"},{"start":12057.472,"end":12061.477,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關"},{"start":12075.416,"end":12076.037,"text":" bicy,您覺得這個自律有用嗎?"},{"start":12105.097,"end":12130.489,"text":"我想這個院士雖然有這個職權說籌議國家學術研究方針可是大部分我們國家的學術研究方針不是靠院士來籌議那中研院的方針跟評議員有沒有關係沒有直接的關係他們是選評議員他不是來制定中研院的政策中研院政策在場的所有人負責"},{"start":12131.229,"end":12139.464,"text":"在場的向立法院負責,不是院士來負責。所以您的意思是說院士沒有什麼功能嗎?"},{"start":12140.848,"end":12144.669,"text":"不能這樣講就是這樣說的他有這些這個職權他可以提出他的想法我們可以適當的尊重他至少對選舉未來的院士很有影響力嘛對這點您不否認沒錯那院士的組成也會影響院長是誰嗎您也不否認對不一定不一定我知道那個總統也有一定的權責不是這樣說"},{"start":12167.113,"end":12179.799,"text":"院士不是直接選舉院長是評議員透過一個領選小組來選不是院士是評議員裡面選出來的領選小組到底中研院院士有沒有實質的影響力我覺得這是一個社會科學的問題那我跟院長的意見並不一樣但是我尊重您那我今天只要求一個就是社會科學的一個思辨過程是不是"},{"start":12194.667,"end":12211.51,"text":"獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲獲"},{"start":12211.63,"end":12235.182,"text":"小組接受申訴那如果違反像剛剛講的你們這寫得非常漂亮的規定的時候他有調查機制有處理輕則要求道歉然後書面聲明警告重則就是暫時除名一段時間到完全除名那我想也許你會說我們的制度跟英國國家學術院澳洲科學院美國"},{"start":12236.263,"end":12261.23,"text":"相關的就是科學院不完全一樣但是我想我們是中央研究院嘛那我也待過中研院我們是不是請院長承諾你們選五個民主國家相近的院士制度分析一下他們相關的違反倫理的時候的處理機制給本席一個報告好嗎我們分析當然可以但是很重要一點跟委員提醒"},{"start":12262.071,"end":12286.613,"text":"這些都是他們透過他們民主的機制自己定出來的,不是他們院長定的。我知道不是院長您。國籍案我們也做了兩三年,我知道院長有很多的難為之處。您畢竟是院士,就是說出身的。但我想就是說,中央研究院如果不需要有外部監督,您今天就不用來立法院嗎?"},{"start":12289.136,"end":12298.471,"text":"一個是院士一個是中央研究院的研究單位院士並沒有領薪水他也沒有預算要立法院通過他只是有開會的預算"},{"start":12303.617,"end":12320.965,"text":"眾議院每年會審的預算是在做研究的這一部分跟院士的關係是非常微弱只有建議性院士提供一些學術上的資訊只有院士能夠自律就像之前我主張眾議院的院士國籍違反眾議院組織法第8條我們大概"},{"start":12323.866,"end":12349.605,"text":"做了四年的時間我一個任期四年才完成這件事我知道院長也非常的辛苦很多院士拒絕改變可是我們依法論法好不好所以我現在要做的事情只是說那中研院宣稱說別的國家跟我們不一樣那是不是選擇五個民主國家相關的院士制度那給本席一個他們怎麼去處理違反相關倫理的時候的機制好嗎"},{"start":12350.245,"end":12358.007,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府函．為11二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府函．為11二、審查114年度中央政府函．為11"},{"start":12379.266,"end":12399.994,"text":"二、處理中央研究院函，為112年度中央政府總預算決議．送第2目一般學術研究及評議預算繼續凍結100萬元．書面報告請查詔案。二、審查中央研究院函．為113年度中央政府總預算決議．送自然及人文社會科學研究預算凍結100萬元．書面報告請查詔案。宣告完畢。"},{"start":12402.673,"end":12418.275,"text":"謝謝所以我們現在處理中央研究院願函就是1、2年度中央政府總預算決議檢送第二幕一般學術研究及評議預算繼續凍結100萬元的書面報告請查照那這個案子我們在場的委員有沒有任何的意見"},{"start":12419.804,"end":12423.007,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關"},{"start":12445.376,"end":12463.504,"text":"不對我念錯了對沒錯那我們檢動案第一案就是審查完畢那我們現在審查第二案第二案是113年度中央政府總預算決議檢送決議一自然及人文社會科學研究預算凍結100萬元書面報告請查照案"},{"start":12469.238,"end":12481.31,"text":"那有沒有任何的委員有任何的意見?沒有那謝謝那我們這兩案都審查完畢准以動之提報院會那再來我們請羅志強委員質詢"},{"start":12493.981,"end":12498.931,"text":"主席我剛剛其實還蠻特別關心你的質詢因為你質詢完以後發現你預時了2分32秒"},{"start":12504.578,"end":12506.32,"text":"我們先請我們的院長,廖院長有請廖院長"},{"start":12530.363,"end":12547.456,"text":"羅委員好院長好那我當然是一直對中研院是非常推崇尊敬但是我們立法委員審查預算其實中研院預算我也看得蠻仔細的我看到蠻多問題但因為時間有限我先對幾個問題來就教那錢當然是要用在刀口上"},{"start":12547.776,"end":12571.201,"text":"雖然中央研究院是一個很重要的單位,但還是要好好地來去使用預算,對不對?是的。好,那我想請教你,中央研究院為了要提高國際傑出人才來台的意願,從2002年起就辦理國際研究生學程,那採全英文教學,那跟十所大學合作十三項學程,這也就是所謂的TIGP的一個計畫,是不是?"},{"start":12571.681,"end":12571.821,"text":"是的請國際處長"},{"start":12595.568,"end":12622.293,"text":"近5年每年招生的人數大概120左右沒什麼大變化就對了那我先提醒一下因為我找不到這個資料我只看到你們給了總數啦那總數的話我就沒辦法對應說今天每年的預算的狀況那我再想請教一下你就說大概每年都120沒什麼變動嘛對不對那可是我看你們的這個所謂的這個TIGP的這個計畫裡面有一個招生宣傳廣告"},{"start":12624.153,"end":12652.23,"text":"那我想請教113年度你編的廣告費是多少?113年度是編20萬那114年度編多少?那邊編了200萬但是有180萬是保留給我們所中心其他的單位使用的那我就要問這件事情你為什麼是把這個計畫保留給所中心其他的單位那你在預算表呈現出來我就看到增加10倍啊院長你不覺得如果我今天立法院審預算我看到一個廣告預算"},{"start":12653.01,"end":12680.098,"text":"你基本上過去的5年人數沒增長突然增加變10倍院長你會不會覺得有點奇怪啊對啊所以我請你把細部報告給我到底為什麼今天要把別的單位的預算放在這個地方來擴編你變成10倍這看起來數字就很奇怪嘛對不對是報告委員因為這個預算是管制項目那在所中心他們在編列的時候過去沒有這樣子的一個做法"},{"start":12680.778,"end":12683.58,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案。"},{"start":12698.187,"end":12698.347,"text":"二、審查11"},{"start":12718.085,"end":12725.568,"text":"我看到預算書中研院的科學研究基金這個113年度跟114年這個大幅的增加那其中我覺得幾個關鍵就是說這個國外旅運費114年度跟去年比增加將近七成這是國外的部分可是就有一個特別的地方就是"},{"start":12744.474,"end":12752.099,"text":"大陸的旅費也增加了多少倍?請問一下,院長知道嗎?我直接講啦,大陸旅費增加5倍嘛,對不對?沒錯吧?"},{"start":12761.607,"end":12784.36,"text":"業務的需要我念一段話給您聽因為聽起來就非常的矛盾我不是說不支持而是你到底為什麼今天突然增加5倍以前沒有今年6月行政院才說復入旅遊警示升級為橙色國人要慎重考慮必要性9月的時候海基會副秘書長羅文嘉也說到大陸風險日增"},{"start":12789.022,"end":12813.1,"text":"除非有不得不去的必要性減少前往大陸可是中研院的科研基金你光大陸運費又增加五倍我想要澄清一下這個是不是跟回到疫情前的狀況疫情去年就結束了去年你的經費跟今年經費就差五倍還有我們的經費都是由下而上編列就是看研究人員的需求"},{"start":12813.22,"end":12814.62,"text":"為什麼增加5倍?這個事後給我一個報告好嗎?"},{"start":12832.626,"end":12835.288,"text":"主席好,有請院長有請院長"},{"start":12858.733,"end":12878.207,"text":"翁委員好是廖院長您好我想這個廖院長大概知道本席基本上也是來自於學界所以呢其實我一直都很關心而且也很尊敬就是中研院的這個相關的研究但是呢其實我之前我並不知道中研院的研究經費的狀況是如何"},{"start":12880.288,"end":12905.864,"text":"所以在我這一次我也仔細看了與本席這個專業領域比較相關的人文社會科學領域的這個各所的研究經費之後呢我嚇一跳為什麼因為這個中研院人文社會科學領域的各個所我相信絕對不只是人文社會這些研究所的經費遠比大學的經費要多得多"},{"start":12907.674,"end":12926.945,"text":"獎勵在自然領域的情況也是一樣的。那麼以我現在在圖表上面這裡所列舉的這個大概屬於社會領域的有6個研究單位裡面他們平均的每一個研究員的可以分配到的研究經費都是200多萬"},{"start":12929.386,"end":12952.199,"text":"一年一個人200多萬這個數字基本上是比我們在大學裡面可能有一個單位比如說法學院可能他一年的業務費都才只有200萬然後給下面非常多的不同的老師們去使用而中研院的每一個研究員的平均的能夠得到的經費就差不多就200多萬這其實是非常高的"},{"start":12954.46,"end":12956.281,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院函．為11"},{"start":12977.812,"end":13004.311,"text":"所以絕對不是兩百多萬那個要跟院長報告您講的我都了解因為呢確實所謂的研究業務經費裡面可能還包含這些不同的項目但是同樣的在大學裡面的狀況也是如此的那當然我現在要講的就是說是中研院你今天編了這麼多的錢那當然我們就要看就是到底研究員的表現如何這個所他的表現的研究成果如何那本席是從"},{"start":13005.732,"end":13007.894,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院函．為11"},{"start":13028.655,"end":13032.416,"text":"中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關"},{"start":13057.942,"end":13061.827,"text":"這個很多學程跟課程其實坦白說那效果很差"},{"start":13063.103,"end":13064.084,"text":"二、處理中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關"},{"start":13087.905,"end":13102.566,"text":"的研究我認為中研院他作為國家最高的研究機構我覺得你的目標要清楚有時候不應該跟大學去競爭去搶資源在很多的項目上面應該要更清楚你的定位"},{"start":13103.308,"end":13118.009,"text":"議員最後講的那句話我們非常認同但是我們不是搶資源我們是幫助大學比如說委員舉的這些例子跟大學合開學程但是我們是採精英主義所以我們不跟大學競爭大學是以量取勝"},{"start":13119.531,"end":13120.191,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院函．為11"},{"start":13147.24,"end":13163.316,"text":"這是本席給您的建議就是說你們可以再去思考看看這個採基因主義固然沒有錯但是就大學裡面通識課程是不是就已經可以滿足了那麼更何況確實在實際的成效裡面是很差的選修人數也非常的少這個之後的話以後有機會再跟院長這裡再溝通相關的問題謝謝院長請回"},{"start":13170.682,"end":13175.044,"text":"要提供相關的分析報告謝謝翁曉琳委員的質詢再來是麥玉珍委員質詢謝謝主席 有請院長麥委員好"},{"start":13197.082,"end":13218.457,"text":"院長好。想要請教一下天然氣去碳燃氫的MW級混氫發電系統建置及試驗計畫。中科院一年前就公布淨零科技政策建議書,強調創造足夠的零碳電力為我國淨零"},{"start":13225.301,"end":13241.075,"text":"計劃策略的重中置重提供出包含就是氣碳燃氫的五大優先推動新科技台灣約七成碳排來自"},{"start":13243.997,"end":13264.651,"text":"發電．為推動2050近年排放的目標．發展低碳電力很重要．在中研院114年的預算中．有看到的天然氣．氣碳、燃氫的MW級的混氫發電．系統自治的"},{"start":13266.012,"end":13270.394,"text":"試驗計畫請教院長現在這個混清的發電系統建制進度如何?我們現在在做規模放大我們第一個目標是要在新打廠在兩年後跟他MW的機組做串接那目標是到10%到20%的混清發電"},{"start":13292.483,"end":13311.613,"text":"議員議員議員"},{"start":13312.834,"end":13330.186,"text":"院長知道今年台中火力發電廠即將在4個燃氣發電機組沒有考慮來台中跟台電合作,把台中的火力發電廠作為示範點,改善台中火力發電廠的碳排的問題。"},{"start":13334.889,"end":13356.254,"text":"議員議員議員議員議員議員議員議員"},{"start":13357.278,"end":13373.548,"text":"請教院長為何選定就是高雄的新打電廠而不是台中即將要新設燃氣機組作為示範基地呢?因為它的現有場域還有看這場域的有沒有足夠的空間能夠建置這個設備所以主要是靠這個實際的限制"},{"start":13379.551,"end":13397.705,"text":"但是我們認為不要只把高雄的的那個信達電廠就是為混沁的發展示範基地因為台中現在要建新的機組所以直接在建新的機組的話納入規劃不只是改善還可以促進經濟的效益而且台中是全國來自世界上的"},{"start":13407.192,"end":13411.895,"text":"的全民火力排碳發電電廠所以不管現在的條件還是改善的排碳的急迫性臺中是最佳的選擇也是請我們的院長可以在為我們臺中這邊就是發展的事辦的可能性嗎?"},{"start":13426.604,"end":13446.449,"text":"好,這部分我們會跟台電商量,因為畢竟這是台電的場域,台電必須要做決定。那我們可以建議,但是實際很多困難是我們沒辦法參與。是是是,但是我們是認為,我們是不管是車子還是科技,我們都以先進的來說,我們重新有一個台車子裡面需要的設備,就以先進的先做。"},{"start":13452.09,"end":13480.879,"text":"議員議員議員議員議員議員議員議員議員議員議員議員議員議員議員議員議員"},{"start":13480.899,"end":13485.481,"text":"我們會跟台電整合商量。謝謝。謝謝主席。那我們麻煩院長。好,有請院長。"},{"start":13505.13,"end":13529.803,"text":"院長午安我想請教院長的是就是有位院長有提到說我們人工智慧的發展這部分是要以人為本的精神去發展這院長在之前9月份的時候演講有提到那我想請問一下你知不知道我們立法案其實已經有提出這個人工智慧的基本法我們有提這個草案出來"},{"start":13531.763,"end":13545.028,"text":"我知道這個新聞但是內容並不了解很清楚因為我自己我自己有提出了這個草案那當然這個就要看之後的審查的速度了那當然我還是一個是一個以人為本的這個觀念"},{"start":13545.828,"end":13563.865,"text":"議員議員議員議員議員議員"},{"start":13563.945,"end":13568.128,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院函．為11二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關"},{"start":13589.653,"end":13592.902,"text":"的一些報告。我想請問一下目前台灣發展能夠面臨最大問題是什麼?"},{"start":13595.783,"end":13621.389,"text":"最大問題可能第一關是資料我們需要很多的資料的問題特別是跟台灣相關的資料包括台灣的社會政治經濟那個軟體部分硬體部分最大需求是什麼當然算力硬體部分最大需求是算力我們現在算力這個遠遠落後於我們實際的需要沒關係那我跟你先說好了其實我們現在還是能源的問題"},{"start":13622.749,"end":13637.687,"text":"因為那個人工智慧的演算機它需要大量的能源沒錯那我也有看到你們也有因為你們是算是像幕僚單位嘛那你們也有提供一些資料我們是研究單位我們不是幕僚政府OK那個研究單位那我想請問一下"},{"start":13639.194,"end":13659.632,"text":"中央研究院上個會期就是你們有提出一個在2050年的時候其實我們需要的這個電力的需求到5000億度電但是目前只有2800億度這個沒有錯吧是的那你有沒有想過就是說那我們如果說要去推動人工智慧的話那我們的電力需求跟得上嗎"},{"start":13660.802,"end":13670.171,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案。 bicyn 經濟部在2022年曾經發過一個新聞稿,曾經說2025年希望太陽能光電的發電量是到200萬千瓦,但是到現在你知道多少嗎?"},{"start":13683.384,"end":13707.642,"text":"到8月今年8月我們講實際發電度數不是裝置容量的話大概今年8月大概280多億度而已對大概是說我們用電量的10%左右甚至可能更少我們講的是不是這個這個像這邊是裝置容量不是不是綠能欸我說太陽能太陽能欸那更少沒關係啦那我這些數據告訴你好了不然這樣繞來繞去我跟你講啦就是說"},{"start":13709.142,"end":13735.311,"text":"經濟部說2025年要到200萬千瓦但是到現在今天為止到8月為止才136遠遠差很多而且太陽能建置的話一開始是最簡單之後會越來越難因為土地取得的問題所以即使到現在已經到136即使經濟部說還要再延後到2026才達成200萬但是我跟你講我個人這樣看覺得可能性太低了因為"},{"start":13735.911,"end":13741.354,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院函．為11二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院函．為11二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關"},{"start":13760.163,"end":13760.263,"text":"二、審查11"},{"start":13779.722,"end":13800.771,"text":"我這邊就補充一個就是說因為這些東西不管太陽能風能它都是靠天吃飯它有沒有辦法去彌補這個發電的缺口這是一個很大的問題而且現在民眾抗爭很嚴重土地取得比以前更加困難所以你將來這些綠能的你的發展一定會比之前的速度更慢"},{"start":13801.451,"end":13804.733,"text":"政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央"},{"start":13830.365,"end":13858.778,"text":"你如果說基金附屬要推遲到2026那你們要去評估說這個到底有沒有可能性因為你們是技術單位嘛那是不是說能夠給我們一個就你們自己當初提出來的再生能源的報告能夠更具體的把這個期程目標給我們一下跟委員請教一下我們6月沒有提報告啊我手上有一個2024年6月14日的再生能源說明報告那個不是我們喔"},{"start":13859.338,"end":13874.609,"text":"OK好沒關係那這個部分我會再去理解一下看是我的資料錯誤還怎麼樣但是呢如果說有相關的資料的話有相關的你們有提相關我們看一下PPT好了是"},{"start":13877.762,"end":13883.665,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案．為11二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院函．為11"},{"start":13893.969,"end":13916.922,"text":"還有一些基礎的一些建設包括儲能設備等等這個有什麼樣的問題就是你們你們有提過的這個就麻煩一下能夠更具體的給我們那我們想要研究一下麻煩三個月內給我們好謝謝謝謝院長院長請回謝謝吳宗憲委員的質詢徐欣盈委員徐欣盈委員徐欣盈委員羅廷偉委員請質詢最後一位"},{"start":13922.452,"end":13949.899,"text":"好謝謝昭緯有請院長有請院長羅委員好好院長好院長上次拜訪我的時候啊當時你有跟我提到天然氣啊去碳藍金的這一項技術是那當時我想大家都很關心我們的社會啊到底現在面對能源的危機有什麼樣的因應措施我想對這個天然氣啊去碳藍金呢我們有這樣子的一個混金發電勢必"},{"start":13951.639,"end":13965.991,"text":"在過程當中有一些研究我想要就幾個問題跟你請教一下天然氣發電會不會造成空汙天然氣發電的造成空汙遠比這個煤要少很多沒有錯我們但是這個是比較問題但我現在問你就單純"},{"start":13970.049,"end":13987.098,"text":"我們請教天然氣發電有沒有造成空污那它仍然是會排二氧化碳從廣義角度仍然是會有這個二氧化碳的排放但是排放已經很少那我們用去碳燃金就是希望說進一步再降低它的排碳"},{"start":13987.958,"end":13988.999,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關"},{"start":14003.335,"end":14027.071,"text":"所以為什麼中研院會去研究這一項技術就是我們個人有認為天然氣在燃燒的過程有所謂的排碳的問題所以我們希望能夠達到好還要更好還要再追求完美所以中研院研究這樣的技術我們認同啊所以今天我們看到天然氣發電是會造成少數的空污可以這樣子去形容對吧就是說它會排碳"},{"start":14027.751,"end":14028.972,"text":"三、處理中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案。"},{"start":14042.844,"end":14043.484,"text":"好,那今天問題又來啦。"},{"start":14071.317,"end":14097.55,"text":"你們這個所謂的新的技術天然氣氣炭燃清吶這個混金的一個發電你們最後選在興達嘛也就是高雄那你跟我講說欸這個是你們是計劃性那最重要的是台電在合作執行面在台電那台電選擇了興達高雄廠那有沒有這個機會中研院去做高度的建議其實台中也可以做一個參考這個部分"},{"start":14097.89,"end":14098.471,"text":"我坦白跟你講怎麼可能會沒有?"},{"start":14116.65,"end":14133.38,"text":"中火作為世界前幾大火力發電台灣第一大火力發電現在正在做所謂的蒸汽的一個工程他當然可以把天然氣機組改成所謂的混金發電阿"},{"start":14134.321,"end":14156.432,"text":"但是那個大型基礎我們現在基礎還沒有辦法到那個階段很抱歉我們希望示範基地台中也有這樣子的機會嘛再來把所謂的藍莓基礎拆除掉藍莓基礎拆除掉一定會有更大的空間來做混金發電嘛這是可以討論的這個都可以討論但是事實上中研院有沒有強力的建議我希望雖然我們因為我曾經許諾過"},{"start":14157.512,"end":14182.953,"text":"不排除任何形式的來想辦法讓中央對台中好一點我也希望在這個場域上能夠建議你拜託你能夠跟台電來建議混金發電示範基地能夠選擇在台中這個部分您可以幫我們發聲嗎我想我們不只在台中不只在興達我們希望在全國各地都能夠做從小規模開始漸漸的擴散到我們持續關注這一項技術的發展也希望您能夠幫台中人說話好不好"},{"start":14184.014,"end":14198.619,"text":"好謝謝那再來我想請問一下因為中央院算是總統府直屬的那在這幾個月當中我們看到賴清德總統上任至今有沒有跟你開會討論或者是探討未來性有沒有什麼研究計畫這個部分可以分享嗎"},{"start":14199.521,"end":14226.916,"text":"主要是談能源的問題跟南部園區的發展能源有沒有任性社會這部分倒比較少都是能源為主能源跟南部園區的發展我希望就剛剛還是延伸剛剛的問題既然他有討論到能源是不是所謂的混金發電能夠建議他中火不乏是一個選項我想有這個機會從你的口中講出對台中人有利的話或許總統他也可能會採納這部分可以嗎"},{"start":14228.516,"end":14230.597,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案"},{"start":14251.004,"end":14265.88,"text":"我不知道,但是這個中央研究院被人家比喻成漢林院只是一個比喻。沒關係沒關係,這個我們沒有要救教,這是網路上的一個探討。我們沒有要做任何的批評。我只是跟你說救教這樣子的一個前言。"},{"start":14266.36,"end":14285.095,"text":"哦,那這個部分我不了解。好,沒關係,有機會網路上翻一翻漢林學士跟漢林供奉的一個差別。我想我們要正視的是一些問題。我們現在看到,老師講中研院的一個社會科學的研究,實際上是某些部分是有在退步的。你有發現嗎?"},{"start":14286.758,"end":14312.363,"text":"社會科學研究我想經濟的空間是有但是我恐怕不見得說是那你聽聽看我說退步的地方在哪裡好不好當然我不會去否認某些人正在努力而是外部的一些因素也造成了這個社會科學的研究上造成一些斷層比如說台灣的學生願意在教育上投資自己的意願是越來越少"},{"start":14313.143,"end":14324.571,"text":"好那再來台灣社會科學學生出國深造的我們看到比例也逐漸降低這都會影響到我們在社會科學研究產生一些斷層"},{"start":14326.196,"end":14353.583,"text":"這部分事實上問題相當複雜因為台灣現在大力要發展社會科學特別在大學也發展社會科學的研究所那假如我們已經很少的學生我們又鼓勵他到國外去念書那我們收到什麼樣的學生就這兩件事情是互斥的所以您當然會看到說我們出國人少那可能是因為我們在國內希望也大力發展"},{"start":14354.663,"end":14383.253,"text":"社會科學研究所的學程所以是這樣子的狀況當然我們仍然可以多鼓勵學生投入社會科學因為畢竟社會科學是非常重要的所以我們也推出了中央研究院人文社會科學精英獎學金博士生的精英獎學金一次給他五年的獎助金讓他沒有生活的憂慮能夠前兩年拿四萬後三年拿五萬"},{"start":14384.433,"end":14407.793,"text":"所以我們透過這樣子的方案來講註國內的社會科學當然我們不是說一昧的鼓勵我們這些學生一定要出國但是我想就像你說的雖然是互斥但是我們也不能夠排除出國深造他所學到的知識不一定我想這個部分你可以認同吧在台灣有台灣深造的一些好處在國外也有國外的好處"},{"start":14408.353,"end":14409.934,"text":"閱讀中央研究院單位預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案"},{"start":14431.549,"end":14452.598,"text":"當時當每當國內外發生種種的與經濟直接或間接的相關議題在各類媒體和訊息管道都可以看到這兩個財團法人提出種種的分析那我想這兩個財團法人就像我之前有跟你講過的台灣綜合研究院以及財團法人中華經濟研究院那這兩個財團法人提出的種種分析跟看法"},{"start":14453.098,"end":14463.554,"text":"而中央研究院幾乎沒有只會寫期刊文章當時你也有給我一些回應說會請經濟所可以思考朝這個方向來做稍微的調整請問後續呢我們請經濟所副總長"},{"start":14466.947,"end":14495.416,"text":"委員好經濟所現在陳林所說我們大部分同仁從事的是基礎科學的經濟研究但是慢慢的也在像我們每半年有一次的這個經濟預測它的這個運作也慢慢擴充了包括我們已經開始從事一個台灣消費者預期跟政策反應調查另外也有越來越多同仁開始從事政策研究包括勞工改革勞保的改革"},{"start":14495.996,"end":14510.228,"text":"包括這個這個長照健保的部分所以我們也未來也在12月要開一個研討會那有改進都好但是我想國際上跟國內有許多重要的議題比如川普2.0的一個局勢發展"},{"start":14511.909,"end":14512.169,"text":"院長您覺得呢?"},{"start":14534.437,"end":14560.188,"text":"我覺得朝這方向努力是對的因為我們的三大這個院警目標之中其中是是善盡社會關鍵責任就是這一項我想我們投入這麼多筆的預算在中研院符合社會的期待當然你們有很多的重擔跟眾所的期盼責任重大但是我們都希望中研院可以更好符合社會的一個期待那我想另外再請問一下風機研究這個部分"},{"start":14561.128,"end":14585.006,"text":"風機研究我們都看到風能發電機是嗎?風機對,風機研究我們沒有做這方面的研究有啦在這就一位同仁2016年你上任的時候2018年有做這樣中央醫院環境變遷中心有進行一項研究去了解風機低頻噪音對心臟的不利影響不好意思我標題講的比較短那你等我敘述內容嘛好不好"},{"start":14585.686,"end":14601.135,"text":"好那都有做這個民眾啊居民經過兩年的監測紀錄長期接收低頻噪音後居民心率的變異顯著增加心率變異可能會引起頭痛難以集中注意力"},{"start":14601.815,"end":14628.572,"text":"疫怒、疲勞、頭暈相關的研究指出。好那最後我要想的是你們有這樣的研究那最後我預計大概是10月左右才出來的這份研究那政府你們有沒有去建議他們會不會採納他後續有沒有什麼一樣的一個具體的作為我們希望會後能夠提供給我你們的研究很好但政府有沒有採納政府有沒有實際去做這些事情我們要後續來追蹤這個部分麻煩你好謝謝"},{"start":14630.646,"end":14658.26,"text":"那就請院長後續再跟羅委員報告。謝謝羅廷偉委員的質詢。那院長請回。關於我們的質詢都已經結束。關於今天的會議做如下決議。第一,報告及詢答完畢。二、委員所提書面質詢或相關資料列入記錄並刊登公報。三、對於委員質詢要求提供相關資料或未及答覆部分。"},{"start":14659.02,"end":14685.216,"text":"請相關機關競訴以書面答覆。第四、一二年度及一一三年度中央政府總預算有關中央研究院主管預算解凍案兩案,業宜審查完均,準以動之提報院會。第五、一一四年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院單位預算案、中央研究院科學研究基金附屬單位預算案。"},{"start":14685.896,"end":14697.783,"text":"相關提案請於11月18日下午2點前提出,令定期繼續審查。報告委員會今天議程處理完畢,現在休息。謝謝各位。"},{"start":14716.243,"end":14727.093,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院函，為11二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央研究院函，為11二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關中央政府總預算案。"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}