{"error":false,"id":["162633"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":162633,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/162633","日期":"2025-06-18","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"委員會-11-3-15-26","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第3會期內政委員會第26次全體委員會議","屆":11,"會期":3,"會次":26,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"委員會","委員會代碼":[15],"委員會代碼:str":["內政委員會"],"標題":"第11屆第3會期內政委員會第26次全體委員會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2025-06-18T12:08:49+08:00","結束時間":"2025-06-18T12:19:20+08:00","影片長度":"00:10:31","支援功能":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/5617cf280bc2552a1572e71ee47ecff20c7c4ba622572b97a48dd392130a673683776d75a58566785ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"謝龍介","委員發言時間":"12:08:49 - 12:19:20","會議時間":"2025-06-18T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第3會期內政委員會第26次全體委員會議（事由：一、邀請內政部部長、行政院消費者保護處處長就「公寓大廈公設點交爭議及其處理與預防作為」進行專題報告，並備質詢。二、審查「住宅法」修正草案等38案，詳見議事日程。【進行專題報告及詢答，並宣讀住宅法第(二十一)案至第(三十八)案提案條文，第(三十八)案如經院會復議則不予審查。】【6月18日及19日二天一次會】）","transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":6.105968750000001,"end":6.42659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":7.64159375,"end":11.539718750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":13.767218750000001,"end":14.62784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":15.79221875,"end":16.652843750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":18.559718750000002,"end":19.01534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":19.36971875,"end":20.078468750000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":20.93909375,"end":23.04846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":24.92159375,"end":28.39784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":29.47784375,"end":31.469093750000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":32.751593750000005,"end":33.88221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":34.455968750000004,"end":35.43471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":36.17721875,"end":37.72971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":37.84784375,"end":39.079718750000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":39.90659375,"end":45.930968750000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":41.610968750000005,"end":43.095968750000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":43.75409375,"end":53.37284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":47.34846875,"end":48.02346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":53.05221875,"end":56.579093750000006},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":57.28784375,"end":68.47596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":69.38721875,"end":71.26034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":71.80034375000001,"end":75.66471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":76.47471875000001,"end":79.84971875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":80.87909375000001,"end":84.42284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":81.46971875,"end":88.10159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":85.09784375000001,"end":89.67096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":90.37971875000001,"end":92.08409375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":92.47221875000001,"end":97.61909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":98.12534375,"end":100.82534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":101.61846875,"end":103.69409375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":104.41971875,"end":111.01784375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":110.03909375,"end":124.65284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":113.29596875,"end":116.45159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":121.48034375,"end":127.48784375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":128.66909375,"end":135.67221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":136.19534375,"end":139.75596875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":141.02159375000002,"end":143.46846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":144.22784375,"end":145.30784375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":146.92784375000002,"end":148.81784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":149.59409375,"end":149.96534375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":150.94409375,"end":152.02409375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":153.17159375,"end":153.88034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":154.40346875,"end":155.12909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":156.15846875,"end":156.59721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":158.33534375000002,"end":159.22971875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":159.41534375,"end":161.71034375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":162.31784375,"end":162.85784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":162.97596875000002,"end":165.11909375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":165.74346875,"end":169.62471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":170.41784375,"end":170.78909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":171.31221875,"end":174.24846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":174.50159375,"end":177.82596875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":178.58534375000002,"end":179.80034375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":180.42471875,"end":181.04909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":181.50471875000002,"end":181.80846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":182.46659375000002,"end":182.90534375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":183.32721875000001,"end":183.85034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":184.22159375,"end":185.18346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":186.22971875000002,"end":188.67659375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":189.19971875000002,"end":190.17846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":190.73534375,"end":191.27534375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":192.08534375000002,"end":193.40159375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":193.65471875,"end":195.00471875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":195.84846875000002,"end":197.21534375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":198.44721875000002,"end":201.04596875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":201.90659375,"end":202.83471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":203.57721875000001,"end":206.31096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":207.55971875,"end":209.48346875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":209.95596875,"end":215.98034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":216.58784375000002,"end":218.46096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":218.69721875000002,"end":223.23659375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":225.43034375000002,"end":226.35846875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":227.65784375,"end":228.13034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":228.41721875000002,"end":228.99096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":229.49721875,"end":232.29846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":232.68659375000001,"end":233.22659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":233.63159375,"end":235.48784375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":235.90971875000002,"end":236.28096875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":237.98534375000003,"end":239.97659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":240.80346875,"end":241.14096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":241.51221875000002,"end":242.40659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":242.67659375000002,"end":243.65534375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":244.21221875,"end":245.95034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":247.41846875000002,"end":249.24096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":249.79784375000003,"end":262.87596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":253.07159375,"end":253.12221875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":255.13034375,"end":255.31596875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":257.42534375,"end":257.66159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":262.90971875,"end":264.90096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":265.82909375,"end":272.59596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":273.22034375000004,"end":276.12284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":276.57846875,"end":280.29096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":281.08409375,"end":281.96159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":282.88971875000004,"end":283.42971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":284.00346875,"end":284.71221875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":284.91471875,"end":288.15471875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":288.18846875,"end":291.05721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":292.00221875,"end":293.30159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":293.90909375,"end":297.55409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":298.60034375000004,"end":303.46034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":303.52784375000005,"end":304.69221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":305.21534375000005,"end":306.22784375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":306.93659375000004,"end":308.18534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":308.97846875000005,"end":310.58159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":310.95284375,"end":312.28596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":312.75846875,"end":314.32784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":315.18846875,"end":330.42659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":321.11159375,"end":323.01846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":328.08096875,"end":330.17346875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":330.61221875,"end":331.13534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":331.57409375000003,"end":335.11784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":335.35409375,"end":339.50534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":335.96159375,"end":336.13034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":339.96096875,"end":344.02784375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":344.26409375000003,"end":345.73221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":345.95159375000003,"end":348.55034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":349.09034375000005,"end":352.44846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":353.00534375,"end":356.75159375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":357.39284375,"end":358.89471875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":359.63721875000005,"end":361.10534375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":362.15159375,"end":364.21034375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":366.55596875000003,"end":380.86596875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":369.94784375,"end":370.03221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":377.79471875,"end":378.70596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":378.77346875,"end":380.12346875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":380.89971875000003,"end":385.81034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":381.49034375,"end":382.72221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":385.99596875000003,"end":389.64096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":390.23159375,"end":391.58159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":392.66159375,"end":405.04784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":397.62284375,"end":399.68159375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":406.02659375,"end":410.29596875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":410.98784375,"end":411.83159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":412.32096875,"end":417.56909375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":416.08409375,"end":416.26971875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":417.82221875000005,"end":421.07909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":421.53471875,"end":425.73659375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":427.06971875000005,"end":432.30096875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":432.84096875,"end":434.83221875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":436.30034375,"end":438.13971875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":438.64596875,"end":439.86096875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":440.31659375000004,"end":440.58659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":440.92409375000005,"end":445.91909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":446.12159375000005,"end":446.47596875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":446.47596875000005,"end":453.17534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":453.56346875,"end":455.55471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":455.55471875,"end":455.95971875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":456.36471875,"end":459.40221875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":459.73971875,"end":461.59596875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":461.95034375,"end":465.30846875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":465.89909375,"end":467.75534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":468.04221875,"end":483.04409375000006},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":471.01221875000005,"end":473.88096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":477.34034375000005,"end":479.82096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":483.28034375000004,"end":483.66846875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":485.22096875000005,"end":486.40221875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":487.24596875000003,"end":487.58346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":488.29221875,"end":490.26659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":490.78971875,"end":491.95409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":492.61221875,"end":496.10534375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":494.21534375000005,"end":495.39659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":496.49346875000003,"end":499.41284375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":499.78409375,"end":504.10409375000006},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":501.37034375,"end":502.06221875000006},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":502.90596875000006,"end":504.07034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":504.67784375,"end":506.56784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":504.72846875000005,"end":505.72409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":507.19221875000005,"end":508.52534375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":508.99784375,"end":511.02284375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":511.56284375,"end":514.93784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":515.64659375,"end":517.7222187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":518.22846875,"end":520.43909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":520.6922187499999,"end":522.44721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":522.85221875,"end":525.8390937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":526.49721875,"end":530.86784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":531.3234687500001,"end":535.47471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":535.8290937500001,"end":537.1115937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":537.2803437499999,"end":546.74721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":547.4053437499999,"end":559.6397187499999},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":547.55721875,"end":547.6415937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":551.0672187499999,"end":552.1640937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":553.22721875,"end":554.32409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":555.2522187500001,"end":558.15471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":560.5847187500001,"end":564.43221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":564.9384687500001,"end":566.2378437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":566.7609687500001,"end":566.99721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":568.65096875,"end":570.9797187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":571.9584687500001,"end":575.1984687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":575.43471875,"end":580.36221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":580.48034375,"end":591.8372187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":590.9428437500001,"end":592.42784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":592.9172187500001,"end":595.0772187499999},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":595.53284375,"end":598.36784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":598.92471875,"end":603.00846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":603.00846875,"end":614.7197187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":604.0378437500001,"end":605.37096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":611.96909375,"end":612.4922187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":614.07846875,"end":616.1540937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":616.66034375,"end":624.37221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":622.7859687499999,"end":627.6965937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":625.75596875,"end":626.7178437499999},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":628.00034375,"end":630.16034375}],"whisperx":[{"start":7.696,"end":11.298,"text":"我請部長跟吳署長部長署長有請部長你好我來看你感謝委員稍後來看你在這個你有去河雄去選港的時候"},{"start":32.856,"end":38.126,"text":"有去講到 劉安英把你抬兩百多個 把你凍結起來"},{"start":40.203,"end":50.069,"text":"這道理應該是不對的啦當然在政敵演講我不會跟你計較我相信蔣委員你要聽我解釋兩百億就是我剛才所說的行政院要撥補給我們的住宅基金的兩百億沒有啦 你不是這樣說嘛我們那沒關係啦 就是說在這個租金的補貼到那個 你有說到這個兩百億 整個就凍起來啦所以喔沒辦法 那沒關係 因為那是政敵"},{"start":69.414,"end":84.05,"text":"你是政府官嘛 這點我不會介意啦就是說 政府官有政府官的公法但是跟實際的數字是差百五倍的這就是說 我也是跟委員講兩百億這就是行政院要判斷總配給金的兩百億"},{"start":90.441,"end":100.025,"text":"在方園不會去刪這個籍嘛一般做小人做主啊 一般做主的人我們怎麼會去刪這個籍我們都算一億四千六百萬那麼統計的部分有四十億億"},{"start":104.565,"end":123.798,"text":"這動機也都改動了,所以這兩百億就變成一百五百億兩百億真的是行政院要撥補給我們住宅基金的兩百億,希望委員不要有不同的意見因為我們現在也是根據行政院給我們的資料跟大家報告的"},{"start":128.735,"end":144.962,"text":"你何用去做政府官 怎麼說我都把你捧到了 你餓了你捍衛你的政權 那不要緊但是來這裡我們就九孫輪孫嘛 我們現在說實際的這個財政修繕委訓法 調整了後啊你們就是這樣 要吃雞尾魚你發一張公文 叫地方要來吸收 其實"},{"start":158.376,"end":177.11,"text":"你當兵做 你抬不下行政議長來跟在野黨跟日本人報告說 啊 林鄭月娥的財政收支會分割 本意接受啊所以 這樣就好了 這樣你現在落下這個公文 我沒有意見就變成國保委要來跟地方政府討論啊 我過去的步驟 多少錢那麼 高雄 這高中期"},{"start":186.28,"end":196.066,"text":"都想變國立的 因為你財政不好 中央把你吸收現在 財務法通過之後 你要吸收多少錢這麼簡單的問題 你這樣倒兵走 武家魯昌昌沒必要 我跟你講 這租金補助 是一個敵情"},{"start":207.588,"end":223.056,"text":"有70%以上的滿意度啊在你們的執政裡面可以有這麼高的滿意度啊 獨獨多一條而已實在是這麼簡單啊你現在好好的把他抬到四樓不給大家啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊啊"},{"start":238.015,"end":239.957,"text":"你這樣說,在惹麻啦你這麼來行,你老公這樣說所前創造銀行的時候那麼81年以前,我們都在補助過10萬戶而已嘛13萬戶好,13萬戶,你現在75萬戶你阿三、李大鋒、青人家、中央貿都你掛了,全課程都你收了你現在叫地方給你分攤"},{"start":265.865,"end":271.61,"text":"電風托機是統一分寸的10萬至15萬號我知道我要負擔多少錢嘛結果你們不是嘛,你們一般用的75萬號你們單電電的叫電風托機,你扭一根頭給電風托機這是不通啦背後你們今天這個議題最後就突然說你們已經接受在野黨通過的財政修繕委分法這我給你們簽訂啦"},{"start":293.936,"end":297.379,"text":"這3,753億沒辦法,你叫地方是要怎樣?一隻牛放兩隻肥,鄉頭沒錢啊,沒那種事情啊你中央政府,說你還要頂,還要頂,還要大碗又軟硬,世間有這個事情"},{"start":315.997,"end":327.449,"text":"我們要向委員報告啦,電影政府其實大家都有需要,行政黨員都有需要互相來運營啦沒有啦,你這個公文我沒意見啦,因為這就是美女,你提早補償,但是這個事情受到委員會的影響"},{"start":331.633,"end":355.579,"text":"中央行政院或是部長 這裡的一個卿庭每年這三千七百五十三億大概你們地方多少錢這麼簡單的事情你們今天倒兵走 走向社會動亂一個美好的政策 中央美策 抵抗這些人的殭屍結果呢 來不及這樣 炒狗狗 沒意思啦所以我給主席做一段時間 我說這個社會主席主席 你在台南的時候 老總統這個起點"},{"start":362.196,"end":383.81,"text":"台南市的社會主席都去過了他的任內就是發佈我們這個宜居小棟沒有啦,一戶就沒有啦,你怎麼敢說他的任內,一戶就沒有啦沒有啦,我的報告,因為那個土地是我來,去請署的我知道你的請署,那個一戶就沒有,你還說不然這樣我後禮拜邀請黃偉哲起來,黃偉哲說什麼台南市的社會主席是對我做始終的開始做的我現在這樣是怎樣"},{"start":392.694,"end":401.84,"text":"我的報告是他的人來有四天但是土地的出席幾位是我們來控制的我們現在來說但是說明清楚社會主席啊在你做書中起來這麼多年來的啊他保守習慣所有開發出來給所有人"},{"start":411.195,"end":424.52,"text":"寶座大館 到目前為止已經是八萬五千幾戶跟你說去啦齁 但是速度有比較慢了因為怎樣 要政府去投資 去興建坦白說 興奮最大 啊你們每天在那邊摸著燒未來的二十年啦齁 咱台灣主連希望的人 威流下來會不動善的負數有幾戶你知不知道你知不知道 請委員指教最快七十萬戶 是"},{"start":440.987,"end":465.064,"text":"七十萬戶啦 屆成年 屆成有繼續使用的 大概只有三十五萬戶所以在未來的二十年內 自然希望臨時所威流下來的不動善有最快三十五萬戶啊要怎麼把它優好運用 化為寶座代冠我告訴你 比你政府在那裡找土地 建設發包"},{"start":465.947,"end":478.639,"text":"坦白說 效率很好我現在要跟你報告這就是寶座台觀正常我現在要跟你報告這就是寶座台觀正常我現在要跟你報告這就是寶座台觀正常我現在要跟你報告這就是寶座台觀正常我現在要跟你報告這就是寶座台觀正常我現在要跟你報告這就是寶座台觀正常"},{"start":488.339,"end":503.688,"text":"社會主席是三百多有壓力啦台南高雄哪有壓力所以你就不會變好你說如果成就做總統的時候做市長的時候台南市沒有社會主席的壓力你要這樣贏但是以前來因為網絡的擴散跟在生活方式、工業方式、商業方式的不同所以社會主席已經不是只有三百有壓力啦"},{"start":515.975,"end":531.748,"text":"變成全台灣大家都有壓力但是這個補償優廉是因為我們南部的發票會更多所以在北部的壓力會比我們南部大所以你做一個中央的內政部的通調單位要怎麼解決這個問題做一個友好組員的分配"},{"start":535.891,"end":542.035,"text":"跟對地方幫你執行寶座大館這個管理政府要怎麼用將來方式讓他們幫你達成這個高階段的目標這是本縣對你的建議啊感謝委員我對你覺得這樣有通嗎我對你說我對你做政策嘛 我覺得你"},{"start":560.629,"end":563.395,"text":"你對頂頭蓋保證箱要更深 你比保證箱更通 給保證箱講啦不是很專業的 我說他蓋內座比較好"},{"start":571.994,"end":579.719,"text":"謝謝委員的關心 委員提供兩項很好的意見第一項就是說 現在針對很多的樹林 空屋的部分啦沒有人大空屋的部分啦 事實上我們如果可以把這裡做統計之後 提出更好的方式讓他們釋放出來 變成是社會上...政府出來承擔這個所有環境 它就不會怕啦"},{"start":595.578,"end":605.686,"text":"不是透過民間 政府承擔 政府幫他做然後透過運作的人 經營的人 去做給需要的人這是最重要的所以我認為全體的房屋的售房不要改變的情形之下因為這是要負責某些資源我們來處理這個"},{"start":616.998,"end":626.446,"text":"感謝您,好的意見說,要做就是正確,不做就放我後悔了我們多元取得社會住宅是我們未來的方向,謝謝委員謝謝謝榮介委員"}]},"gazette":{"lineno":849,"blocks":[["謝委員龍介：（12時8分）請部長和吳署長。"],["主席：有請部長。"],["謝委員龍介：部長好，我來看你了。"],["劉部長世芳：委員好，感謝委員。"],["謝委員龍介：你下鄉宣講的時候提到立法院砍了你200億元，凍結起來，這個數字應該是錯的，當然，這是政治演講，我不跟你計較。"],["劉部長世芳：謝委員要聽我解釋，200億元就是我剛才所講的，行政院要撥補給住宅基金的200億元。"],["謝委員龍介：沒有啦！你不是這樣講，沒關係，在租金的補貼部分，你講到200億元全部凍結了，這沒有關係，因為是政治演講，你是政務官，這一點我不會介意，政務官有政務官的講法，但是跟實際的數字差了150倍。"],["劉部長世芳：我也要跟委員講，200億元真的是行政院要撥補給住宅基金的200億元。"],["謝委員龍介：針對行政院的400億元租金補貼，立法院不會刪這筆錢，補助年青人租屋也好、一般租屋也好，我們怎麼會去刪這筆錢？我們總共刪減1億4,600萬元，凍結的部分41億元，凍結的也都解凍了，所以講200億元大概是膨脹了150倍。"],["劉部長世芳：我也要再跟謝委員報告，200億元真的就是行政院要撥補給住宅基金的200億元，希望委員不要有不同的意見，因為我們現在也是根據行政院給我們的資料跟大家報告。"],["謝委員龍介：在立法院不需要用政治的態度，你身為政務官下鄉怎麼宣講，我都捧場、稱讚你，你捍衛你的政權沒有關係，但是來這裡就要就事論事。現在講實際的，財政收支劃分法調整以後，你們就是「愛食假細膩」，你發一張公文要地方自己吸收，你其實可以反過來，你怎麼不先叫行政院長來向在野黨和立法院報告：你們通過的財政收支劃分法，本院接受了。這樣你發這個公文，我都沒有意見，變成各部會要跟地方政府討論過去的補助多少錢，教育的部分，高中職都變成國立的，因為財政不好，所以中央全部吸收，但現在財劃法通過之後，你們要吸收多少錢。這麼簡單的問題，你顛倒過來做，搞得亂七八糟，沒有必要啦！我跟你講，租金補助是一個德政，有70%以上的滿意度，在你們執政上能有這麼高的滿意度就只有這一項而已，真的不簡單。你現在何必搞到血流成河，很多人看到我就問：龍介兄，我租屋還能不能補助？真的很困擾。署長，你說要恢復到111年以前75%對25%，對不對？你這樣講就是在「抓鰻魚」，你這麼內行卻故意這樣講，蘇貞昌當院長的時候，111年以前總共補助10萬戶而已。"],["吳署長欣修：13萬戶。"],["謝委員龍介：現在是75萬戶，你們「阿莎力」大方請客，稻尾都收割走了，現在叫地方分攤，地方當時同意分攤是10萬至15萬戶，我可以知道我要負擔多少錢，結果你們不是，現在一次補貼75萬戶，你們撿石頭讓地方擔，這說不通。不過今天這個議題顯示你們已經接受在野黨通過的財政收支劃分法，這點我肯定你們，不要在那邊「假無意」，那條不講、現在講這個，這3,753億元如果沒有撥下去，地方要怎麼辦？一條牛剝兩層皮，沒有那種事！署長，你「要甜又要滿、大碗閣滿墘」，世間有這種事！"],["吳署長欣修：地方政府、行政單位都有需要互相因應。"],["謝委員龍介：這個公文下去我沒意見，這是你們明年提早部署。"],["吳署長欣修：這是地方要求的。"],["謝委員龍介：但是依財政收支劃分法，中央行政院或部長要肯定明年這3,753億元大概地方分配多少錢，這麼簡單的事情，你們今天顛倒來做，造成社會動亂，一個美好的政策、良方美策得到這麼多掌聲，結果搞到這樣「臭烘烘」，沒有意思啦！","最後，我跟主席借一點時間講社會住宅，署長，你在臺南的時候，賴總統當市長，臺南市的社會住宅總共蓋幾戶？"],["吳署長欣修：他任內發包「宜居小東」，還有……"],["謝委員龍介：他任內一戶都沒有啦！"],["吳署長欣修：不是啦！我跟你報告，因為那個土地是我去爭取的。"],["謝委員龍介：我知道你爭取的，但是一戶都沒有，不然我下禮拜邀請黃偉哲上來，黃偉哲說臺南市的社會住宅都是從他當市長才開始做的，現在是怎樣？"],["吳署長欣修：在他任內施工，但是土地的取得、規劃是我那時候開始做的，這要說明清楚。"],["謝委員龍介：社會住宅從你上任當署長這麼多年來，包租代管所開發出來的戶數有多少？"],["吳署長欣修：到目前為止有八萬五千多戶。"],["謝委員龍介：恭喜你，但是速度有比較慢，因為要政府投資興建成本太高，你們每天「頭殼抱著燒」，未來20年臺灣自然死亡的人遺留下來的不動產有幾戶，你知道嗎？"],["吳署長欣修：請委員指教。"],["謝委員龍介：將近70萬戶，繼承人繼續使用的大概只有35萬戶，所以未來20年內自然死亡的人所遺留下來的不動產將近35萬戶，要怎樣有效運用化為包租代管，比政府到處找土地、建設、發包，坦白講效率好很多。"],["吳署長欣修：這就是包租代管政策未來要提高的用意，包租代管也很重要，但是沒有那麼快。"],["謝委員龍介：我知道，你如果知道，剛剛應該回應我。我現在跟你說一個概念，我們在這裡不用討論細節，10年前社會住宅的需求是雙北比較有壓力，臺南、高雄哪有壓力！所以你就不會辯護，你應該說賴清德當市長的時候，臺南市沒有社會住宅壓力，你要這樣回應。"],["吳署長欣修：一定都有，本來就有。"],["謝委員龍介：這10年來，因為網路的擴散和生活方式、工業方式、商業方式的不同，所以社會住宅已經不只是雙北有壓力，變成全臺灣都有壓力。因為南部北漂的比較多，所以北部的壓力會比南部大，你身為中央內政部的統籌單位，要怎樣針對這個問題做好資源的有效分配，以及地方縣市政府幫你執行包租代管，要怎樣用獎勵方式讓它們幫你達成各階段的目標，這是本席對你的建議，你覺得有沒有道理？"],["吳署長欣修：感謝委員，我們目前也是用這樣的方式進行，所以包租代管的標準有提高。"],["謝委員龍介：部長說說看，部長要做政策決定。我覺得你比部長還了解，讓部長講。"],["劉部長世芳：他本來就很專業。"],["謝委員龍介：不是他專業，我覺得他跟高層比較好。"],["劉部長世芳：謝謝委員的關心，委員提供兩點很好的意見，第一，針對目前很多私人沒人住的空屋，我們可以統計之後提出比較好的方式，讓它們釋放出來成為社會住宅的一種。"],["謝委員龍介：政府出來承擔，所有權人就不會怕，而不是透過民間，政府承擔、政府跟他租，然後透過運作的人、經營的人租給需要的人，這是最重要的。"],["劉部長世芳：我了解委員的意思，所以在整體房屋數量不變的情況下，因為這是浪費一些資源，我們會來處理。"],["謝委員龍介：我就講到這裡，感謝你們。好的意見講了，要做就變成政策，不做就放著讓它飛就好了……"],["劉部長世芳：多元取得社會住宅是我們未來努力的方向。"],["謝委員龍介：謝謝你。"],["劉部長世芳：謝謝委員。"],["主席：謝謝謝龍介委員。","下一位請黃國昌委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":466,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-15-26","speakers":["牛煦庭","蘇巧慧","張智倫","張宏陸","王美惠","黃捷","麥玉珍","黃建賓","李柏毅","吳琪銘","丁學忠","徐欣瑩","許宇甄","李坤城","謝龍介","黃國昌","王育敏","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","黃健豪","高金素梅","楊瓊瓔"],"page_start":371,"meetingDate":["2025-06-18"],"gazette_id":"1146201","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1146201_00014"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期內政委員會第26次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、邀請內政部部長、行政院消費者保護處處長就「公寓大廈公設點交爭議及其處理與預防作\n為」進行專題報告，並備質詢；二、「住宅法」：(一)繼續審查委員郭昱晴等17人擬具「住宅法\n第四條條文修正草案」案、(二)繼續審查委員黃健豪等16人擬具「住宅法第四條條文修正草案」\n案、(三)繼續審查委員徐巧芯等20人擬具「住宅法第二十三條條文修正草案」案、(四)繼續審查\n委員林岱樺等17人擬具「住宅法第二十五條條文修正草案」案、(五)繼續審查委員賴士葆等17人\n擬具「住宅法第十五條及第二十三條條文修正草案」案、( 六) 繼續審查委員牛煦庭等16 人擬具\n「住宅法第十條及第五十七條之一條文修正草案」案、(七)繼續審查委員翁曉玲等16人擬具「住\n宅法第四條條文修正草案」案、(八)繼續審查委員李彥秀等17人擬具「住宅法第十五條及第二十\n三條條文修正草案」案、 ( 九) 繼續審查委員羅智強等16 人擬具「住宅法第二十五條條文修正草\n案」案、(十)繼續審查台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「住宅法部分條文修正草案」案、(十一)繼續審查委\n員蘇巧慧等17人擬具「住宅法第四條條文修正草案」案、(十二)繼續審查委員牛煦庭等17人擬具\n「住宅法增訂第二十一條之一條文草案」案、(十三)繼續審查委員林思銘等21人擬具「住宅法部\n分條文修正草案」案、( 十四) 繼續審查委員李坤城等24 人擬具「住宅法第四條條文修正草案」\n案、(十五)繼續審查委員徐欣瑩等26人擬具「住宅法部分條文修正草案」案、(十六)繼續審查委\n員馬文君等19人擬具「住宅法第四條條文修正草案」案、(十七)繼續審查委員高金素梅等27人擬\n具「住宅法部分條文修正草案」案、(十八)繼續審查委員鄭天財 Sra Kacaw 等18人擬具「住宅法\n第二條條文修正草案」案、(十九)繼續審查委員吳沛憶等17人擬具「住宅法第二十二條及第二十\n三條條文修正草案」案、 ( 二十) 繼續審查委員林倩綺等23 人擬具「住宅法部分條文修正草案」\n案、(二十一)審查委員王鴻薇等20人擬具「住宅法第四條條文修正草案」案、(二十二)審查委員\n陳素月等17人擬具「住宅法第四條條文修正草案」案、(二十三)審查委員陳菁徽等18人擬具「住\n宅法第四條條文修正草案」案、( 二十四) 審查委員許宇甄等20 人擬具「住宅法部分條文修正草\n案」案、(二十五)審查委員范雲等17人擬具「住宅法部分條文修正草案」案、(二十六)審查委員\n林月琴等19人擬具「住宅法部分條文修正草案」案、(二十七)審查委員楊曜等22人擬具「住宅法\n第二十五條條文修正草案」案、(二十八)審查委員羅廷瑋等17人擬具「住宅法第四條、第十五條\n及第二十三條條文修正草案」案、(二十九)審查委員王美惠等17人擬具「住宅法第四條條文修正\n草案」案、(三十)審查委員邱鎮軍等19人擬具「住宅法第四條條文修正草案」案、(三十一)審查\n委員蘇巧慧等17 人擬具「住宅法部分條文修正草案」案、 ( 三十二) 審查委員羅明才等16 人擬具\n「住宅法第四條條文修正草案」案、(三十三)審查委員李柏毅等16人擬具「住宅法增訂第四條之\n一條文草案」案、(三十四)審查委員王育敏等17人擬具「住宅法第四條、第十九條及第二十條條\n文修正草案」案、(三十五)審查委員楊瓊瓔等21人擬具「住宅法第四條條文修正草案」案、(三\n十六)審查委員游顥等17人擬具「住宅法第四條條文修正草案」案、(三十七)審查委員羅智強等\n16人擬具「住宅法第四十條及第四十三條條文修正草案」案、(三十八)審查委員葉元之等19人擬\n具「住宅法第四條條文修正草案」案【進行專題報告及詢答，並宣讀住宅法第 ( 二十一) 案至第\n(三十八)案提案條文】","agenda_id":"1146201_00015"}}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}