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這個我們在那可以協助啊因為農民他自己也用電不少種花的或者是有的他也很多都需要用電啊這一塊你們是不是應該要想一想"},{"start":145.591,"end":170.166,"text":"這個基本上我們是以農業輔導為主啦如果他有能源方面因為是農業為本綠能加值所以我們是在輔導他的生產你輔導他的生產但是他生產的過程他也會用電然後我看部長也很關心很仔細在聽我們這一題是因為能源的部分其實主管機關是經濟部能源局那我們是主要是輔導農業生產部長針對這個有"},{"start":172.467,"end":182.212,"text":"有補充意見是不是報告委員這個我想是市場機制市場的機制也就是說現在的農戶他用的電"},{"start":183.821,"end":210.171,"text":"比他發的電便宜啦所以他就不會自己去發電啦如果我們今天的電反映了所有的成本那這個農民呢他們就會自己發電但是問題是因為我們有成本很多所以他乾脆直接用電就好他也不需要進行這些了對 因為他用我們台電的電比較便宜啦然後他賣給我們台電的電可能就比較沒有辦法收割部長請回座 接著次長繼續"},{"start":211.511,"end":236.97,"text":"那有關智慧農業的部分我們農業部有沒有要導入所謂的AI或大數據我們一直都在做一直都在做好那我們從農民那邊聽到因為你們一直在做我也去問農民反應看不懂用不起維修難所以我不太知道現在智慧農業我們農業部有你實際導入成功的你到底有幾戶"},{"start":238.891,"end":266.839,"text":"因为这个设施农业方面在园艺方面设施农业方面用的很多你说在什么园艺啊园艺或者是设施农业就用的很多设施就是它有温室里面还有智慧智能型的这些自动喷洒所以已经用很多了那是不是所以对他们来说你们有没有专人辅导或者是有区域场域共用的服务平台"},{"start":267.199,"end":282.618,"text":"我們有試驗改良場所在全台灣各試驗改良場所我們都有推廣中心推廣人員還有我們的相關的農業研發技術的這些專家所以我們希望不是只有你說的那幾個面向"},{"start":282.998,"end":298.744,"text":"有導入智慧農業好不好你剛跟我講幾個面向但那些好像我們新竹縣都比較不是那方面的農業所以我們希望你們還可以繼續努力好不好是智慧農業那最後本席來自新竹縣"},{"start":299.744,"end":311.508,"text":"新竹縣過去是農業大縣但後來竹北發展你們知道竹北的高鐵區整個所以有都會有農業所以我們不僅有農業我們還領海所以我們農漁其實你應該了解都非常發展得很好所以"},{"start":318.331,"end":345.899,"text":"但是新竹縣這麼多年來沒有農漁產銷中心可不可以全力支持我們農漁產銷中心其實在新竹縣我們一直在輔導新農民市場我知道新農民市場有我們農會都做得很好但是我們需要一個農漁產銷中心包含帶動整個的我們西部的觀光因為我們整個農業大縣這個部分我們正在推動可不可以請我們農業部來支持好嗎"},{"start":346.579,"end":371.954,"text":"好 我們來跟縣政府一起來評估看看還有當地的農漁會支持啊 不是評估 我們已經在推動了 請你支持嘛我們是長期在輔導各個農會去成立農民指消站這新農民市場我們知道 但我們這個農漁產銷中心它還兼顧整個的產銷和觀光整個地方非常需要啊是 這個全力來支持一下好不好可以啦"},{"start":373.996,"end":377.747,"text":"好那OK那我们时间到谢谢"}]},"gazette":{"lineno":960,"blocks":[["徐委員欣瑩：（12時35分）謝謝主席，本席有請農業部胡次長。"],["主席：請胡次長。"],["胡次長忠一：委員好。"],["徐委員欣瑩：次長好。本席前面有兩題是針對今天的議題，針對國際能源價格上漲，農業部在今天的報告中提出要推綠能。"],["胡次長忠一：是。"],["徐委員欣瑩：但實際上我們地方上的農民申請設置太陽能或沼氣系統時，常遇到卡在法規或資金門檻的問題，所以本席想請教次長，目前農業部有沒有協助地方成立所謂的微電網或分散式能源區？你們有沒有在這樣做？"],["胡次長忠一：分散式能源區，其實我們是輔導這些光電業者來承租農地，他們用合法的方式。"],["徐委員欣瑩：所以你們是輔導光電業者？"],["胡次長忠一：農民他們出租出去的時候，跟他們說明要怎麼樣才能夠合法。"],["徐委員欣瑩：所以農民只是用出租的方式？"],["胡次長忠一：因為經費相當龐大……"],["徐委員欣瑩：可是有些農民可能不是只有出租，他農業的用電需求也不少，他也可以自己看怎麼樣架或怎麼樣採購之後，然後可以自給自足，多的他也可以看政府是不是可以有收購保證還有相關的貸款制度協助農民。"],["胡次長忠一：這個貸款有，那收購是我們台電公司收購的，所以一般有規定相關每一度要收多少錢，這個都是我們跟經濟部一起合作……"],["徐委員欣瑩：收購有，農民也是。那現在想請教，有沒有在推動協助農民，我現在的主體是農民，農村能源轉型的這種共同體，你們有沒有在推動？包含找農會、找在地的企業共同設置，然後……"],["胡次長忠一：沒有！沒有，這個我們……"],["徐委員欣瑩：那可以協助啊！因為農民自己也用電不少，種花的或者是有的他也……很多都需要用電，這一塊你們是不是應該要想一想？"],["胡次長忠一：基本上我們是以農業輔導為主，如果他有能源方面的，因為是農業為本、綠能加值，所以我們是在輔導他的生產，如果是……"],["徐委員欣瑩：對，你輔導他的生產，但是他生產的過程也會用電，我看部長也很關心、很仔細在聽我們這一題。"],["胡次長忠一：是，因為能源的部分，其實主管機關是經濟部能源局，那我們主要是輔導農業經濟。"],["徐委員欣瑩：部長針對這個有補充意見，是不是？"],["郭部長智輝：報告委員，這個我想是市場機制，也就是現在的農戶他用的電比他發的電便宜……"],["徐委員欣瑩：不需要他自己……"],["郭部長智輝：所以他就不會自己去發電。"],["徐委員欣瑩：好。"],["郭部長智輝：如果今天的電反映了所有的成本，那農民他們就會自己發電，但問題是現在這個成本很多……"],["徐委員欣瑩：所以他乾脆直接用電就好，他也不需要進行這些了？好。"],["郭部長智輝：對，因為他用我們台電的電比較便宜。"],["徐委員欣瑩：OK。"],["郭部長智輝：然後他賣給我們台電的電，可能就比較沒有辦法……"],["徐委員欣瑩：好，可以。謝謝，部長請回座。","接著次長就繼續，那有關智慧農業的部分，農業部有沒有要導入所謂的AI或大數據？"],["胡次長忠一：我們一直都在做。"],["徐委員欣瑩：一直都在做，好，那我們從農民那邊聽到，因為你們一直在做，我也去問，農民反映看不懂、用不起、維修難，所以我不太知道現在就智慧農業，農業部你實際導入成功的到底有幾戶？"],["胡次長忠一：因為這個……"],["徐委員欣瑩：有沒有？"],["胡次長忠一：有……"],["徐委員欣瑩：有沒有10件出來？"],["胡次長忠一：設施農業方面，在園藝方面、設施農業方面用得很多，是。"],["徐委員欣瑩：你說在什麼，園藝？"],["胡次長忠一：園藝或者是設施農業用得很多。"],["徐委員欣瑩：設施……"],["胡次長忠一：設施就是他有溫室，裡面還有智慧、智能型的這些自動噴灑。"],["徐委員欣瑩：所以已經用很多了。"],["胡次長忠一：是。"],["徐委員欣瑩：對他們來說，你們有沒有專人輔導，或者是有區域、場域共用的服務平臺？"],["胡次長忠一：我們有試驗改良場所，在全臺灣各試驗改良場所，我們都有推廣中心、推廣人員，還有我們相關的農業研發技術的這些專家，一直都在做。"],["徐委員欣瑩：好，我們希望不是只有你說的那幾個面向有導入智慧農業，好不好？你剛剛跟我講幾個面向，但好像我們新竹縣都比較不是那一方面的農業，所以我們希望你們還可以繼續努力，好不好？"],["胡次長忠一：是。"],["徐委員欣瑩：好，智慧農業。最後，本席來自新竹縣，新竹縣過去是農業大縣，當然後來竹北發展，你們知道竹北的高鐵區整個……所以有都會、有農業，我們不僅有農業，我們還臨海，因此我們農漁其實……"],["胡次長忠一：是。"],["徐委員欣瑩：您應該了解嘛！"],["胡次長忠一：也有新竹區漁會，對啊！"],["徐委員欣瑩：都發展得很好。"],["胡次長忠一：沒有錯。"],["徐委員欣瑩：但是新竹縣這麼多年來沒有農漁產銷中心，可不可以全力支持我們？"],["胡次長忠一：農漁產銷中心，其實在新竹縣，我們一直在輔導新農民市場。新農民市場……"],["徐委員欣瑩：我知道，新農民市場有……"],["胡次長忠一：幾乎每一個農會都有。"],["徐委員欣瑩：我們農會都做得很好。"],["胡次長忠一：是。"],["徐委員欣瑩：但是我們需要一個農漁產銷中心。"],["胡次長忠一：是。"],["徐委員欣瑩：包含帶動整個我們西部的觀光，因為我們整個農業大縣，這個部分我們正在推動，可不可以請農業部支持，好嗎？"],["胡次長忠一：好，我們跟縣政府一起來評估看看，還有當地的農漁會，我們一起來評估。"],["徐委員欣瑩：支持！不是評估，我們已經在推動了，請你支持嘛！"],["胡次長忠一：我們是長期在輔導各個農會去成立農民直銷站、新農民市場。"],["徐委員欣瑩：我們知道，我們這個農漁產銷中心它還兼顧整個產銷和觀光，地方非常需要。"],["胡次長忠一：是，這個……"],["徐委員欣瑩：全力來支持一下，好不好？"],["胡次長忠一：可以、可以、可以、可以。"],["徐委員欣瑩：可以嘛！"],["胡次長忠一：嗯。"],["徐委員欣瑩：好，那我們時間到了，謝謝。"],["胡次長忠一：謝謝委員。"],["主席：現在請葉元之委員做詢答。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":464,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-19-17","speakers":["謝衣鳯","鄭正鈐","林岱樺","張嘉郡","張啓楷","陳亭妃","賴瑞隆","鄭天財Sra 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