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第幾章委員很抱歉我記不起那個數字不過那一整張是當時是我在的時候修的法關於就是刑訴訴訟法裡面關於限制出境還有出海這相關規定在刑訴訴訟法裡面的第幾邊 第幾章"},{"start":98.393,"end":127.622,"text":"就是數字我記不起來但是我知道這是你自算裡面寫的呢是是是那一整張是我修的是我增訂進去的只是那個數字我記不起來我大概是從93條左右開始所以你不曉得在第幾邊數字會記不起來很抱歉來我給你看一下來這個是掛在總統府的網站上面這也是你送到立法院來審查的自算"},{"start":131.251,"end":151.987,"text":"你說你負責推動跟增訂《刑訴訴訟法》的第二篇第八章之一限制出境跟出海是這是對的嗎因為我現在可能要翻一下法條會比較清楚就是那一整章這是你重要的政績謝謝謝謝委員對不對"},{"start":156.803,"end":181.922,"text":"你居然不曉得他在第幾邊喔?呃...是不是...我想要確認一下是不是有打錯字或是什麼我這個有點壓抑喔因為這算你重大的政績嘛對不對你是刑事廳的廳長而且這是你長久推動的這是你自傳送過來又送到總統府的最嚴重的是什麼?不只你現在不曉得欸你的自傳還寫錯欸"},{"start":185.559,"end":202.576,"text":"這個規定是在第一邊耶你送到總統府送到立法院立法院審查的竟然是錯的很抱歉可能是誤善這是你寫的是不是是誤善這麼嚴重真的很抱歉你竟然也還不記得"},{"start":207.564,"end":218.25,"text":"你算是這七位裡面資歷我看是排在前面很完整的可是連這個字算都寫錯你都還不記得在哪個位置這很大的扣分耶我記得93條我記得條文"},{"start":225.659,"end":240.912,"text":"謝謝委員這回去馬上改這是一個認真的態度大法官應該是要認真的嘛第二個你要非常尊重立法院的審查你說裡面送來的資料都是不對的我要回去查還找不到這是你的專長"},{"start":243.875,"end":272.512,"text":"這扣分扣太多了這是對我們立法院審查的不尊重這樣也是對你被提名為大法官的被提名人一個不尊重我陳斥的道歉應該是誤善打字的時候就是誤善來 被提名我們再看一下上次你們來拜會的時候我特別提醒你我說我們辛辛苦苦非常詳細的做了問卷對不對是請你要盡快想死而且要盡快的"},{"start":274.363,"end":296.775,"text":"要填寫你在什麼時候我們26號給你們嘛對不對你什麼時候回來給我回來我記得是禮拜一個就是禮拜五我禮拜一才接到啊我在兩天前才接到你的回覆耶這對我們審查制度的尊重嗎"},{"start":299.517,"end":321.514,"text":"我們為什麼辛辛苦苦要做問卷這是我們的職責也是你的職責你被提名了我們要很清楚知道你對很多事情的看法你要立場要有主張對不對結果你在前天才給我們這時間不會拖太晚嗎我們一起應該是星期五的下午可能有一點剛好是週末假日的時間差"},{"start":323.459,"end":352.356,"text":"拉得太長 26要給你 到前天才回來另外更嚴重的就是你的這個回答很多都是十問虛答顧左右而言他我們看不到你的立場跟你的內容欸甚至在第二問的時候 大家看到沒有我們的十個問題第二問的時候問題啊 跟你的答案文字大概差不多在下一張"},{"start":354.244,"end":374.934,"text":"第七問的時候在問你不適合檢察官的這個問題這個有沒有侵犯到人權有沒有不正新聞這是非常非常重要你剛剛在報告的時候還有打醒的時候你在強調你非常關心人權嘛這麼重要的問題我題目473個字你回答了430個字耶為什麼會這麼一個是在敷衍嗎沒有跟委員報告我可以口頭來補充說明嗎"},{"start":384.229,"end":407.175,"text":"因為檢察官的部分畢竟就是因為我長久是在審判體系所以檢察官的部分其實我們是確實是比較不了解的但是我知道法院組織法的部分檢察官的這個職務監督人他根據規定他可以做哪一些職務監督然後呢他也准用到法官法的一些相關的規定就是檢察官評鑑等等所以我是引用了這一些條文"},{"start":407.655,"end":432.531,"text":"然後來說明說現在有相關的規定來處理檢察官的違法失職然後這個規定在那裡但是委員覺得說好像執行起來好像不太有效這個應該是權責單位他們要去檢討說執行的問題這個是因為是檢察官的部分我們審判體系確實是比較不了解"},{"start":433.351,"end":440.737,"text":"被提名人你在強調你是長久以來非常尊重人權對不對注意人權的結果這段時間的"},{"start":443.117,"end":468.659,"text":"不是任檢察官裡面的不正訊問或者是羈押的問題這是憲法第八條明文規定要保障人權也是你長久在追求的結果你是回答這樣短短幾個字看不到你很明確的立場跟堅定的立場我們在投票的時候這一題要幫你加分還是扣分當然扣分啊最重要的是十個題目我剛才講你是所有七個被提名人裡面資歷算是幾乎是最完整的"},{"start":469.807,"end":490.191,"text":"這是加分結果你的問卷裡面扣分滿滿幾乎是死當的一個狀態跟委員報告關於不當詢問的部分我有特別引用了刑事訴訟法第156條它事實上就是在處理不正詢問的問題它提到的是被告自白一定要有任意性他不能夠被強暴脅迫"},{"start":493.132,"end":519.809,"text":"不正詢問的方法之下來做陳述所以您提到了這個不正詢問我特別提到了這個刑事訴訟法第156條的規定如果檢察官引用了這個這樣的不正詢問的公訴來當作證據的話在開庭的時候這個資料是會公開的在開庭的時候法官經過調查他經過調查之後他會他可以認為說這個"},{"start":522.43,"end":549.286,"text":"不具任意性把這個證據排除那不正詢問的部分後來如果經過調查確實確有歧視的話這個警方或者是檢察官可能都還要面對可能的跟根據事證或情節他有可能有責任有民事刑事或者是行政責任我們題目裡面提了很多針對這段時間受到不正詢問的侵犯的這個事情你都沒有明確去回答我們甚至還特別問你徵詢的內容是不是應該公開你也不回答"},{"start":550.146,"end":577.494,"text":"有太多的該回答的東西沒有回答我其實有回答就是說申請的內容它是卷證的一部分它起訴之後它自然就會公開了在法庭上會公開的貝提琵人然後上面這個第二題這個我們特別提到說限訴法這個修正我們詳細的說明了我們這次修正的這個重點連全世界相關的都寫了我們特別請教你要你明確的表達意見"},{"start":581.652,"end":601.973,"text":"說有沒有如賴清德總統在公告法律時候加注的容後有妨礙憲法法庭正常運作侵略了司法權力的核心範圍破壞了政府體制分立制衡的憲政正義要你回答明確的你是短短一句話"},{"start":605.654,"end":622.894,"text":"我先明確跟你講現在我提的只是其中的一部分就是實題下來你跟其他的七位被提名的人你幾乎是相當少的一部分第二個你都是實問虛答這基本上在我們審查的過程裡面我們沒辦法很清楚看到你的主張"},{"start":624.428,"end":651.935,"text":"我們為什麼要做問卷就是希望你把你的我們有十問每一個立場都非常清楚我們了解你的立場跟主張之後才能夠投同一票嘛 是不是這樣子是 謝謝委員委員這個部分我也可以口頭來補充這方面真的要補考啦來 再看看你現在要被提名為副院長嘛你是要這段時間台灣民眾對於司法的滿意度"},{"start":653.168,"end":679.504,"text":"跟信任度是非常低的我們看一下美麗島電子報啊四月底那個給你們可以看一下政府有沒有選擇性辦案將近六成政府政治力有沒有介入檢調機關辦案將近六成政治力介入了司法案件你要現在當這個副院長對不對"},{"start":682.583,"end":689.069,"text":"將近六成為什麼台灣民眾對於司法的不滿意不清這麼高"},{"start":692.648,"end":719.002,"text":"台灣民眾對司法的信賴度不高我們確實有要深自檢討的地方當然有部分原因是因為我們覺得還要更加加強的跟民眾來做溝通然後我們自己就是要做到的就如同我剛剛提到的我們必須把公平正義當作我們說要投票給你你怎麼讓我們的司法信任度跟滿意度可以升高"},{"start":719.741,"end":725.121,"text":"你要做什麼事情今天早上被院長被提名人說他痛加檢討如果他投票給你 你要怎麼做"},{"start":726.379,"end":750.833,"text":"我剛剛已經提到說我們了解人民對司法的這個的鞭策跟期待是很深的而且不會停止的所以司法改革的腳步也從來沒有停止過然後所以我們一定會再加強相關的譬如說我剛才提到說這個要每一個法官把這個公平正義的這個精神當作他最重要的一個核心價值"},{"start":753.395,"end":780.289,"text":"我來給你看一下你以前的經驗你當過刑事廳的廳長對不對民國105年11月21號到109年的2月2號你上任前啊大家對於法院的法官的不信任度是高的48.5可是在你上任之後更高啊隔一年還更高啊當然不能只有怪你一個人可是沒有看到你的承擔看到你的改革"},{"start":781.667,"end":809.262,"text":"所以妳要加油啦謝謝妳就擔任了副院長之後真的是百惠待舉我們再看一下現在更嚴重的是連大法官都不被信任了從這次的國會改革一直到實質廢止這個事情太多的民眾對我們的大法官本來是高道德高標準的對不對現在很多人在馬路上都跟你講說搞不好這變成已經是政治的一個打手"},{"start":811.337,"end":838.469,"text":"這是很嚴重的一個問題我來具體的事實上我們要不要投票給你我相信全國民眾要看你就看你的擔當你的獨立性跟公正性你有沒有擔當有一個發生在你跟你家人的為據實申報的這個案子我們看一下這個案子這個一共是24筆沒有據實去申報"},{"start":841.92,"end":862.756,"text":"我看後來這個罰款處分監察院處分確定這個金額高達22萬高達22萬一共有24筆那現在這個監察院處分書裡面他直接寫說受處分人應該依照規定據實申報財產可是在申報102年12月31號財產的時候就應申報這財產項目沒有據實申報配我是你的先生是存款有9筆"},{"start":871.856,"end":873.882,"text":"股票5筆基金受益憑證10筆"},{"start":876.489,"end":905.343,"text":"怎麼會發生這麼嚴重的跟委員說明謝謝委員給我這個機會說明這件事情困擾我也很久了這個事情是發生在102年102年的時候當時的財產申報是用人工查詢、手工登錄的所以我配偶他給我的資料確實有遺漏剛剛委員提到說存款的部分存款的部分我們被查出來就是"},{"start":905.703,"end":933.624,"text":"他本來常用的就是那三個帳戶但是後來查出來有14個帳戶我們自己都嚇到就是有一些可能已經放很久沒有用了那所以你剛剛提到說好像有11個帳戶沒有報沒有錯因為我們常用後來監察院說你經過你們受處分人所陳述的申報不實是理由他說不足採信對不對他認為是故意的申報不實我先給你看一個你應該認得林子儀林教授我們看一下"},{"start":934.645,"end":962.684,"text":"林子儀林教授是在2007年他跟你一樣 他也被提名為副院長這個提名人一樣狀況 他也是配偶財產申報的他的狀況是什麼他是主動發現 他坦承疏失了然後呢他的金額比你多一點 他三次股票交易虧損然後他是已經信託給證件公司錢錢去處理的他後來做了一個決定婉拒了司法院副院長的提名"},{"start":964.67,"end":983.838,"text":"你這邊看起來金額比他少一點點可是你是動態的而且是存款這看起來然後監察院認為說不採信你的嘛看起來有點嚴重跟委員報告監察院後面寫的是說他認為我是不確定故意他認為我的錯是在我沒有竭盡所能去發現被配偶的財產這樣子"},{"start":985.078,"end":1010.393,"text":"那我的配偶就這個部分他已經誠摯的跟我道歉他確實是他提供的資料是不夠完整的那我們在被發現了這件事情之後我們就立刻就是去做了補正然後也繳了罰款我們沒有再做任何的這個訴願林教授是因為這樣子他婉拒了副院長提名那你說你的先生是已經有道歉了你要不要利用今天這個公開的這個在地法院這個審訊"},{"start":1012.556,"end":1039.687,"text":"這個審查你要不要公開跟民眾是不是要道歉?大法官是高標準、高道的我誠摯的道歉而且我在監察院後來採用電腦借機申報之後從事辦開始我們就全權授權從事辦開始我們就全權授權一直到現在就是我的態度是很明確的我知道我不夠完美但是我覺得我的專業表現值得給自己這樣一個機會好"},{"start":1043.817,"end":1054.097,"text":"你是國民法官法很重要的推手很多人是肯定你的國民走進法院法官走下法台"},{"start":1055.45,"end":1083.485,"text":"這個是國民法官法當初注定一個非常重要的一個特色他們說這是蔡英文總統任內最重要的一個司法改革那時候的院長是許仲麗他們說推動這個國民法官法起草這個草案就是由司法院著名的梅尼法官刑事廳長舒適兒一手主導推寫社會大眾對你推這個國民法官法是肯定的謝謝在開宗明義第一章開宗明義的第一章"},{"start":1086.303,"end":1114.034,"text":"國民法官法講的是要提升司法的透明度第二個要反映國民正當的法律感情增進國民對司法之了解跟信賴彰顯國民的主權理念那如果是要推動司法改革司法的這個透明度法庭直播你應該是要贊成的可是我看你回來的回來的我們問卷回來的你設了一堆條件"},{"start":1116.189,"end":1131.697,"text":"你贊成法庭直播嗎我再跟委員說明一下法庭直播的部分在6月27號三讀通過那三讀通過之後它是一個就是已經是一個法規範了理論上我們是抱歉我打斷你講話了"},{"start":1134.878,"end":1163.815,"text":"你的精神你的初心應該是要推動整個公開透明嘛是對不對這兩個A是一致嘛從你推動國民法官法到法庭直播我現在懷疑的是說你的初心是不見了嗎為什麼你現在回來了問卷的答案跟民進黨的反對意見好像看起來不止70%相像欸你很多都是複製K上欸沒有欸很多是複製K上欸你剛才講你剛一開始自傳弄錯了你這個也是然後更嚴重的來你看一下"},{"start":1165.37,"end":1178.384,"text":"你提到這個理由啊你說此外相關的媒體的自律網路平台規範還有待建立現在的媒體不夠自律嗎"},{"start":1179.127,"end":1205.017,"text":"我跟委員說明這個是我們立法院在召開公聽會的時候就是有代表就是有公聽會有各界的代表來表達很多人的意見所以你把人家反對意見貼上來當你的意見我是提醒就是說在那個公聽會裡面曾經就事實省的直播有意見就是說有比較多的意見時間有限我問你一下所以在媒體自律這一塊如果有問題誰要負責NCC嘛對不對"},{"start":1208.612,"end":1235.228,"text":"NCC委員到現在還被癱瘓啊沒有提是誰要負責任是誰要負責任我們是覺得說就是媒體或許可以再討論一個就是比較可行的方案行政院院長依法要提啊他到現在沒有提啊違法亂紀啊無法無天啊他大家癱瘓NCC啊你講的這個問題行政院要負責啊第二個你講說網路平台規範有待建立網路平台什麼有管誰管的"},{"start":1239.531,"end":1260.273,"text":"網路平台 行政體系誰在管是不是數位部嗎數法部啊這裡面出現兩個大問題啊你知道問題 那應該去解決問題啊第二更重要的 你的初心是什麼公開透明嘛 對不對不要再只有推別人的反對意見我希望你可以很明確的支持法庭直播"},{"start":1263.162,"end":1276.254,"text":"他就那個道德勇氣我相信所有的地方在同一陣營當的時候專練你專練是有的可是你的公共正義性、獨立性你的道德勇氣會是當他同一陣營當非常重要"}]},"gazette":{"lineno":101,"blocks":[["張委員啓楷：（15時1分）謝謝韓院長，請副院長被提名人。"],["主席：麻煩被提名人再次說明。"],["蘇素娥被提名人：委員好。"],["張委員啓楷：副院長被提名人好。你擔任過行政廳的廳長？"],["蘇素娥被提名人：刑事廳。"],["張委員啓楷：對，刑事廳的廳長。刑事訴訟方面你是專家，對不對？我先請教一下，關於限制出境、出海的相關規定，是在刑事訴訟法裡面的第幾編、第幾章？"],["蘇素娥被提名人：委員，很抱歉，我記不起這個數字，不過它一整章當時是我在的時候修的法。"],["張委員啓楷：在刑事訴訟法裡面，關於限制出境、出海的相關規定是在第幾編、第幾章？"],["蘇素娥被提名人：就是數字我記不起來，但是我知道大概……"],["張委員啓楷：這是你自傳裡面寫的耶！"],["蘇素娥被提名人：是、是、是，那一整章是我修的、增訂進去的，只是那個數字我記不起來，大概是從第九十三條左右開始。"],["張委員啓楷：所以你不曉得是在第幾編？"],["蘇素娥被提名人：數字記不起來，很抱歉。"],["張委員啓楷：來，我給你看一下。這是掛在總統府的網站上面，也是你送到立法院來審查的自傳，你說你負責推動跟增訂「刑事訴訟法第二編第八章之一限制出境、出海」。"],["蘇素娥被提名人：是。"],["張委員啓楷：這是對的嗎？"],["蘇素娥被提名人：我現在可能要翻一下法條會比較清楚，就是那一整章。"],["張委員啓楷：這是你重要的政績……"],["蘇素娥被提名人：是，謝謝、謝謝委員。"],["張委員啓楷：你竟然不曉得它在第幾編哦？"],["蘇素娥被提名人：是不是……我想要確認一下是不是有打錯字或什麼。委員的意思是……"],["張委員啓楷：這有點令人訝異喔！因為這算是你重大的政績嘛！對不對？"],["蘇素娥被提名人：是、是，可是數字部分可能真的比較沒有……"],["張委員啓楷：你是刑事廳的廳長，這是你長久推動的，而且這是你送過來的自傳，也送到總統府的！最嚴重的是什麼？不只你現在不曉得，你的自傳還寫錯耶！這個規定是在第一編！你送到總統府、送到立法院，立法委員審查的竟然是錯的！"],["蘇素娥被提名人：很抱歉，可能是誤繕。"],["張委員啓楷：這是你寫的對不對？"],["蘇素娥被提名人：是。"],["張委員啓楷：誤繕這麼嚴重！"],["蘇素娥被提名人：真的很抱歉。"],["張委員啓楷：而你竟然還不記得！"],["蘇素娥被提名人：我記得條文……"],["張委員啓楷：副院長被提名人，在這7位被提名人裡面，我看你的資歷算是排在前面、很完整的，可是連這個自傳都寫錯，而且還不記得是在哪個位置！這是很大的扣分耶！這幾乎要死當了喔！"],["蘇素娥被提名人：我記得第九十三條。"],["張委員啓楷：什麼？"],["蘇素娥被提名人：我記得條文，謝謝委員。"],["張委員啓楷：這回去馬上改，好不好？"],["蘇素娥被提名人：是，謝謝。"],["張委員啓楷：這是一個認真的態度，大法官應該是要認真的嘛！"],["蘇素娥被提名人：好。"],["張委員啓楷：第二個，你要非常尊重立法院的審查，不要連送來的資料都是不對的，我還要回去查，還找不到！這是你的專長！這扣分扣太多了，這是對我們立法院審查的不尊重，事實上也是對你被提名為大法官被提名人的不尊重。"],["蘇素娥被提名人：我誠摯的道歉，應該是誤繕，打字的時候就是誤繕了。"],["張委員啓楷：被提名人，我們再看一下，上次你們來拜會的時候，我特別提醒你，我說我們辛辛苦苦非常詳細的做了問卷，對不對？"],["蘇素娥被提名人：是。"],["張委員啓楷：請你要詳實而且要儘快的填寫，我們是26日給你們，對不對？你什麼時候送回來給我？"],["蘇素娥被提名人：我記得是……就是禮拜五。"],["張委員啓楷：我禮拜一才接到，我在兩天前才接到你的回復，這是對我們審查制度的尊重嗎？我們為什麼辛辛苦苦要做問卷，這是我們的職責，也是你的職責。"],["蘇素娥被提名人：是。"],["張委員啓楷：你被提名了，我們要很清楚知道你對很多事情的看法，你要有立場、要有主張，對不對？結果你在前天才給我們，這時間不會拖太晚嗎？"],["蘇素娥被提名人：我們一起應該是星期五的下午，可能剛好是周末假日的時間差。"],["張委員啓楷：拉得太長，26日給你，到前天才回來。另外更嚴重的就是你的回答很多都是實問虛答、顧左右而言他，我們看不到你的立場跟你的內容，甚至在第二問的時候，大家看一看，我們的十個問題，第二問的時候，問題跟你的答案，文字大概差不多；第七問在問你不適任檢察官的問題，這有沒有侵犯到人權、有沒有不正訊問？這是非常非常重要的，你剛剛在報告還有答詢的時候，一再強調你非常關心人權嘛！"],["蘇素娥被提名人：是。"],["張委員啓楷：這麼重要的問題，題目473個字，你回答了430個字，為什麼會這麼的……"],["蘇素娥被提名人：委員，我現在可以……"],["張委員啓楷：是在敷衍嗎？"],["蘇素娥被提名人：沒有，跟委員報告，我可以口頭補充說明嗎？因為檢察官的部分，畢竟我長久是在審判體系，所以檢察官的部分其實我們確實是比較不了解的，但是我知道法院組織法的部分，檢察官的職務監督人根據規定可以做哪一些職務監督，然後他也準用到法官法的一些相關規定，就是檢察官評鑑等等，所以我是引用了這一些條文，說明現在有相關的規定處理檢察官的違法失職，然後這個規定在那裡，但是委員覺得執行起來好像不太有效，這個應該是權責單位要去檢討執行的問題，因為是檢察官的部分，我們審判體系確實是比較不了解。"],["張委員啓楷：對。被提名人，你一再強調你是長久以來非常尊重人權、注意人權的。"],["蘇素娥被提名人：是。"],["張委員啓楷：結果這段時間的不適任檢察官裡面的不正訊問，或者是羈押的問題，這是憲法第八條明文規定要保障人權，也是你長久在追求的。"],["蘇素娥被提名人：是。"],["張委員啓楷：結果你回答這樣短短幾個字，我看不到你很明確的立場跟堅定的立場，我們在投票的時候，這一題要幫你加分還是扣分？當然扣分啊！最重要的是十個題目，我剛才講你是所有七個被提名人裡面，資歷算是幾乎最完整的，這是加分，結果你的問卷裡面扣分滿滿，幾乎是死當的一個狀態。"],["蘇素娥被提名人：跟委員報告，關於不當詢問的部分，我有特別引用了刑事訴訟法第一百五十六條，它事實上就是在處理不正訊問的問題，它提到的是被告自白一定要有任意性，不能夠在強暴、脅迫等不正訊問的方法之下陳述。所以您提到的不正訊問，我特別提到了刑事訴訟法第一百五十六條的規定，如果檢察官引用這樣不正訊問的供述當作證據的話，在開庭的時候，這個資料是會公開的，在開庭的時候，法官經過調查之後，他可以認為這個不具任意性，把這個證據排除；不正訊問的部分，後來經過調查，如果確有其事，警方或者是檢察官可能都還要面對相關的責任，根據事證或情節，他可能有責任，有民事、刑事或者是行政責任。"],["張委員啓楷：我們題目裡面提了很多針對這段時間受到不正訊問的、侵犯的這些事情，你都沒有明確回答，我們甚至還特別問你偵訊的內容是不是應該公開？你也不回答，有太多該回答的東西沒有回答。"],["蘇素娥被提名人：我其實有回答，就是偵訊內容是卷證的一部分，起訴之後，它自然就會在法庭上公開。"],["張委員啓楷：被提名人，上面的第二問，我們特別提到憲訴法的修正，詳細說明了我們這次修正的重點，連全世界相關的資料都寫了，我們特別請教你，要你明確表達意見，有沒有如賴清德總統在公布法律時加註的批示「容或有妨礙憲法法庭正常運作，侵越司法權力核心範圍，及破壞政府體制分立制衡之憲政爭議」？但你的回答卻是短短一句話。我先明確跟你講，現在我舉的例子只是其中一部分，這十題下來，你跟其他七位被提名人的回答相較，幾乎都是相當少的一部分。第二點，你都是實問虛答，基本上在我們審查的過程中，我們沒辦法很清楚的看到你的主張，對不對？我們為什麼要做問卷？就是希望你把你的主張說明清楚，我們有十問，每一問的立場要非常清楚，我們了解了你的立場和主張之後，才能夠投下同意票，是不是？"],["蘇素娥被提名人：是，謝謝委員，委員，這個部分我也可以口頭補充。"],["張委員啓楷：這方面真的要補考啦！好，再來看看，你現在要被提名為副院長，然而這段時間臺灣民眾對於司法的滿意度跟信任度非常低，我們看一下美麗島電子報4月底的調查：政府有沒有選擇性辦案？將近六成；政治力有沒有介入檢調機關辦案？將近六成；政治力介入了司法案件，也將近六成，你現在要當副院長，對不對？為什麼臺灣民眾對於司法的不滿意度會這麼高？"],["蘇素娥被提名人：臺灣民眾對司法的信賴度不高，我們確實有要深自檢討的地方，當然有部分原因是因為我覺得我們還要更加加強與民眾的溝通，然後我們自己就是要做到如同我剛剛提到的，必須把公平、正義當作……"],["張委員啓楷：我們要投票給你，那你怎麼讓我們的司法信任度跟滿意度可以升高？你要做什麼事情？今天早上院長被提名人說他要痛加檢討，如果要投票給你，你要怎麼做？"],["蘇素娥被提名人：我剛剛已經提到，我們了解人民對司法的鞭策跟期待是很深的，而且不會停止，所以司法改革的腳步也從來沒有停止過，我們一定會再加強相關的……譬如我剛剛提到的，每一個法官要把公平、正義的精神當作他最重要的核心價值。"],["張委員啓楷：被提名人，我們來看一下你以前的經驗，你當過刑事廳廳長，對不對？"],["蘇素娥被提名人：是。"],["張委員啓楷：任期是民國105年11月21號到109年2月2號，你上任前，大家對於法院法官的不信任度是高的，有48.5%，可是在你上任之後更高，隔一年還更高，當然這不能只怪你一個人，可是我們也沒有看到你的承擔、你的改革，所以你要加油啦！"],["蘇素娥被提名人：謝謝。"],["張委員啓楷：要加油！擔任副院長之後，真的是百廢待舉，現在更嚴重的是，連大法官都不被信任了，從這次的國會改革，一直到實質廢死這個事情，大法官本來是高道德、高標準的，對不對？但現在很多人在馬路上都會跟你說大法官搞不好都已經變成政治打手，這是很嚴重的問題。事實上，我們投票給你，相信全國民眾要看的就是你的擔當、你的獨立性跟公正性。有一個發生在你跟你家人的案子，就是未據實申報的問題，我們看一下這個案子，一共有24筆沒有據實申報，我看後來監察院處分確定的金額高達22萬，一共有24筆。監察院的處分書裡面直接寫受處分人應該依照規定據實申報財產，可是在申報102年12月31號財產的時候，就應申報之財產項目沒有據實申報，配偶是你的先生？"],["蘇素娥被提名人：是。"],["張委員啓楷：存款有9筆，對不對？"],["蘇素娥被提名人：是。"],["張委員啓楷：股票5筆、基金受益憑證10筆，怎麼會發生這麼嚴重的……"],["蘇素娥被提名人：跟委員說明，謝謝委員給我這個機會說明，這件事情困擾我也很久了，這個事情是發生在102年，102年的時候，當時的財產申報是用人工查詢、手工登錄的，我配偶給我的資料確實有遺漏，他確實有遺漏！剛剛委員提到存款的部分，我們被查出來，他本來常用的就是那3個帳戶，但是後來查出來的有14個帳戶，我們自己都嚇到，有一些可能已經放很久沒有用，所以你剛剛提到好像有11個帳戶沒有報，沒有錯，因為我們常用……"],["張委員啓楷：被提名人，後來監察院說，經過受處分人陳述申報不實之理由，他說不足採信，對不對？"],["蘇素娥被提名人：對。"],["張委員啓楷：他認為是故意申報不實。我先給你看一個，你應該認得林子儀林教授，對不對？"],["蘇素娥被提名人：是。"],["張委員啓楷：我們看一下，林子儀林教授是在2007年，他跟你一樣被提名為副院長的提名人，一樣的狀況，他也是配偶的財產申報。他的狀況是什麼？他是主動發現，他坦承疏失了，然後他的金額比你多一點，有3次股票交易虧損，他是已經信託給證券公司全權去處理了，他後來做了一個決定，婉拒了司法院副院長的提名。"],["蘇素娥被提名人：是。"],["張委員啓楷：你這邊看起來金額比他少一點點，可是你是動態的，而且是存款，這看起來……然後監察院也認為不採信你，看起來有點嚴重。"],["蘇素娥被提名人：跟委員報告，監察院後面寫的是說，他認為我是不確定故意，他認為我的錯是在我沒有竭盡所能去發現配偶的財產，我的配偶就這個部分已經誠摯的跟我道歉，確實他提供的資料是不夠完整的，我們在被發現這件事情之後就立刻做了補正，然後也繳了罰款，我們沒有再做任何的訴願。"],["張委員啓楷：林教授因為這樣子婉拒了副院長提名，你是說你的先生已經有道歉了，你要不要利用今天在立法院公開的審查，公開跟民眾道歉？因為大法官是高標準、高道德。"],["蘇素娥被提名人：是，我誠摯的道歉，而且我在監察院後來採用電腦介接申報之後，從試辦開始，我們就全權授權，從試辦開始，我們就全權授權一直到現在，我的態度是很明確的，我知道我不夠完美，但是我覺得我的專業表現值得給自己這樣的一個機會。"],["張委員啓楷：好。被提名人，你是國民法官法很重要的推手，很多人是肯定你的，「國民走進法院、法官走下法台」，這個是國民法官法當初制定的一個非常重要的特色，他們說這是蔡英文總統任內最重要的一個司法改革，那時候的院長是許宗力，他們說推動國民法官法、起草這個草案，就是由司法院著名的美女法官、刑事廳長蘇素娥一手主導、推行，社會大眾對你推國民法官法是肯定的。"],["蘇素娥被提名人：謝謝。"],["張委員啓楷：在開宗明義第一章，國民法官法講的是要提升司法的透明度，對不對？"],["蘇素娥被提名人：是。"],["張委員啓楷：第二個，要反映國民正當的法律感情，增進國民對司法之了解及信賴，彰顯國民主權理念。"],["蘇素娥被提名人：是。"],["張委員啓楷：如果是要推動司法改革，有關司法透明度的法庭直播，你應該是要贊成的啊！可是我看你回來的問卷，你設了一堆條件耶！你贊成法庭直播嗎？"],["蘇素娥被提名人：我再跟委員說明一下，法庭直播的部分在6月27號三讀通過，三讀通過之後，它已經是一個法規範了，理論上我們是尊重……"],["張委員啓楷：抱歉，我打岔，打斷你講話了。"],["蘇素娥被提名人：是。"],["張委員啓楷：你的精神、你的初心應該是要推動公開透明，對不對？"],["蘇素娥被提名人：是。"],["張委員啓楷：這兩個是一致嘛！所以你推動國民法官法到法庭直播，我現在懷疑的是說，你的初心是不見了嗎？為什麼你現在回來的問卷答案，跟民進黨的反對意見好像看起來不只有70%的相像，有很多都是複製、貼上的。"],["蘇素娥被提名人：沒有……"],["張委員啓楷：很多都是複製、貼上！你剛才講了，一開始是自傳弄錯了，你這個也是，然後更嚴重的是，你看一下，你提到的這個理由，你說「此外，相關的媒體自律、網路平台規範亦有待建立」，現在的新聞媒體不夠自律嗎？"],["蘇素娥被提名人：我跟委員說明，這個是我們立法院在召開公聽會的時候，公聽會有各界的代表來表達很多的意見，就有代表……"],["張委員啓楷：所以你把人家的反對意見貼上來，當成你的意見嗎？"],["蘇素娥被提名人：不是，我是提醒，在公聽會裡面曾經就事實審的直播有比較多的意見。"],["張委員啓楷：時間有限，我再問你一下，所以在媒體自律這一塊如果有問題誰要負責？是NCC對不對？"],["蘇素娥被提名人：是。"],["張委員啓楷：NCC的委員到現在還被癱瘓，還沒有提名是誰要負責任？是誰要負責任？"],["蘇素娥被提名人：我們是覺得，媒體或許可以再討論一個……"],["張委員啓楷：什麼？"],["蘇素娥被提名人：就是比較可行的方案。"],["張委員啓楷：行政院院長依法要提，但他到現在沒有提啊！違法亂紀、無法無天啊！他到現在還在癱瘓NCC，你講的這個問題是行政院要負責。第二個，你講網路平台規範有待建立，但網路平台是誰在管的？誰管的？行政體系是誰在管網路平台的？"],["蘇素娥被提名人：是數位部嗎？我不是很瞭解。"],["張委員啓楷：數發部啊！"],["蘇素娥被提名人：對，是數發部。"],["張委員啓楷：這裡面出現了兩個大問題，你知道問題就應該去解決問題啊！第二個，更重要的，你的初心是什麼？公開透明對不對？"],["蘇素娥被提名人：是。"],["張委員啓楷：不要只貼別人的反對意見，我希望你可以很明確地支持法庭直播，把初心找回來，要不然就沒有道德勇氣了。我相信所有立法委員在投這一票的時候，專業你是有的，可是你的公正性、獨立性，你的道德勇氣會是大家投這張票非常重要的，加油！"],["蘇素娥被提名人：謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝張啓楷委員的詢問，也謝謝被提名人的說明。被提名人請喝口水，等你喝完水，之後下面一位委員就要開始詢問了。","接下來請登記第4位的吳思瑤委員詢問，翁曉玲委員請準備。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":364,"meet_id":"全院委員會-11-3-4","speakers":["韓國瑜","黃國昌","王義川","許宇甄","林岱樺","王育敏","林淑芬","賴士葆","陳亭妃","王鴻薇","張啓楷","吳思瑤","翁曉玲","林月琴","吳宗憲"],"page_start":291,"meetingDate":["2025-07-09"],"gazette_id":"1146501","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1146501_00004","1146501_00005"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期第4次全院委員會會議紀錄","content":"總統咨，為司法院大法官含院長、副院長，現有缺額7名，茲依據中華民國憲法增修條文第5條規\n定，提名蔡秋明、蘇素娥、蕭文生、鄭純惠、林麗瑩、陳慈陽、詹鎮榮7位為司法院大法官，並\n以蔡秋明為院長、蘇素娥為副院長，咨請同意案","agenda_id":"1146501_00003"}}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}