{"error":false,"id":["163082"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":163082,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/163082","日期":"2025-07-11","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"院會-11-3-20","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第3會期第20次會議","屆":11,"會期":3,"會次":20,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"院會","標題":"第11屆第3會期第20次會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2025-07-11T15:00:55+08:00","結束時間":"2025-07-11T15:04:11+08:00","影片長度":"00:03:16","支援功能":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/8f9418b77881b51da81d46b1c56def2397a80d7271198c9e4c986071959c8b303cbf50dea0cea1405ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"沈伯洋","委員發言時間":"15:00:55 - 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蔡議員請準備謝謝主席"},{"start":18.058,"end":44.413,"text":"這一個關於今天的議案其實有三個值得討論的點第一個我們先來講財政面財政面就是如果今天我們全台灣人要發一萬就要兩千三百億那財政面的問題就是請問錢從哪裡來今天國民黨民眾黨不但說要還錢於民但請問今天國家之所以會有多出來的錢是為什麼"},{"start":45.353,"end":68.919,"text":"是因為今天稅收超乎預期,那稅收超乎預期來自於哪裡?大部分就是盈利事業所得稅、盈利稅、證交稅等等之類的,它其實最主要並不是個人所得稅。所以如果說你要還錢漁民的話,那你的錢,你從盈利事業所得稅的錢,然後你說要把它退到向個人所得,這其實兩邊是完全不合的。"},{"start":69.779,"end":89.747,"text":"這就好像你今天去買東西結果你給的店員太多錢了結果你跟店員說要求退費結果店員說他沒有要退給你但他所有經過的路人每個都退這不是莫名其妙嗎所以在財政面上面這完全就是一個錯誤的措施但更不要講說還有第二點就是法律面"},{"start":90.595,"end":119.915,"text":"在法律面今天4100億是由行政院提出立法院的責任是針對這一個4100億你可能給予刪減這就跟我們平常在煽動預算非常的類似這個權利是在行政院的身上而立法院的權利呢是跟大家講說對不起根據我們的所代表的民意我們不允許這個我們不允許那一個但是按照法制面按照憲政的分工立法院不能夠獨自去增加"},{"start":120.835,"end":146.205,"text":"如果增加的話呢 也要指名裁員那請問有指名裁員嗎也沒有指名這個真正的裁員來自於哪裡啊所以這個在法律面也是違憲 也是違法的但第三個更重要的就是執行面因為這一次在執行面呢剛剛這個黃國昌有提到他說那個以前金融海嘯的時候啊我們說要普發現金啊請問台灣現在是在金融海嘯嗎"},{"start":147.867,"end":171.644,"text":"今天台灣 今天如果你要每個人普發一萬 你為的是要刺激消費請問台灣現在要刺激消費嗎要把2300億的熱錢直接投在市場裡面突然有那麼多的熱錢 但是你的商品沒有變多啊你的服務沒有變多啊那你2300億直接砸進去 那你就是萬物起漲嘛所以到最後受害的是誰 受害的會是一般人民啊"},{"start":172.475,"end":195.92,"text":"所以最終國民黨提這個案子也只是為了救自己的罷免但我要告訴大家罷免跟一般選舉不一樣選舉你可以端出政策牛肉你可能還可以做這樣的事情但是罷免是因為大家對你們的信任崩解對於你們的迴憲亂政對於你們要大量開放中國移民要讓紅媒永久在這邊對這個信任崩解對於信任崩解政策買票是沒有用的謝謝"}]},"gazette":{"lineno":43,"blocks":[["沈委員伯洋：（15時1分）謝謝主席。今天這個議案其實有三個值得討論的點：第一個，我們先來講財政面，如果今天我們全臺灣人要發1萬，就要2,300億，財政面的問題就是請問錢從哪裡來？今天國民黨、民眾黨說要還錢於民，但請問今天國家之所以會有多出來的錢是為什麼？是因為今天稅收超乎預期，那稅收超乎預期來自於哪裡？大部分就是營利事業所得稅、營利稅、證交稅等等之類的，其實最主要並不是個人所得稅。所以如果你要還錢於民的話，把來自營利事業所得稅的錢退到像個人所得，其實兩邊是完全不合的。就好像你今天去買東西，你給了店員太多錢，你跟店員要求退費，結果店員說他沒有要退給你，但他對所有經過的路人每個都退，這不是莫名其妙嗎？所以在財政面上面，這完全就是一個錯誤的措施。","更不要講說還有第二點，就是法律面。今天4,100億是由行政院提出，立法院的責任是針對這個4,100億可能給予刪減，這就跟我們平常在刪凍預算非常地類似，這個權力是在行政院的身上，而立法院的權力是跟大家講說：對不起，根據我們所代表的民意，我們不允許這個、我們不允許那個。但是按照法制面、按照憲政的分工，立法院不能夠獨自去增加，如果增加的話，也要指名財源，請問有指名財源嗎？也沒有指名真正的財源來自於哪裡，所以這個在法律面也是違憲、也是違法的。","第三個更重要的就是執行面，關於這一次在執行面，剛剛黃國昌有提到，他說以前金融海嘯的時候，我們說要普發現金，請問臺灣現在是在金融海嘯嗎？今天如果你要每個人普發1萬，為的是要刺激消費，請問臺灣現在要刺激消費嗎？把2,300億的熱錢直接投在市場裡面，突然有那麼多的熱錢，但是商品沒有變多、服務沒有變多，2,300億直接砸進去，結果就是萬物齊漲，所以到時候受害的是誰？受害的會是一般人民。","所以最終國民黨提這個案子也只是為了救自己的罷免。但我要告訴大家，罷免跟一般選舉不一樣，選舉時你可以端出政策牛肉，可能還可以做這樣的事情，但是罷免是因為大家對你們的信任崩解，對於你們的毀憲亂政，對於你們要大量開放中國移民、要讓紅媒永久在這邊，對這個信任崩解。對於信任崩解，政策買票是沒有用的，謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝沈伯洋委員的發言。","接下來請蔡易餘委員發言，陳培瑜委員請準備。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":258,"meet_id":"院會-11-3-20","speakers":["韓國瑜","林俊憲","林國成","賴惠員","吳思瑤","劉書彬","陳昭姿","王義川","林楚茵","王鴻薇","張啓楷","麥玉珍","范雲","黃國昌","鄭天財Sra 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