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王榮章 蘇利窮同樣都有這方面的爭議當時李鴻鈞副院長說要把這些監委送紀律委員會請問目前進度如何針對李俊逸還有這些監委有進行進一步的調查嗎"},{"start":51.858,"end":73.076,"text":"跟委員報告6月6號的時候這個相關的案件就進了紀律委員會那紀律委員會呢其實在7月份就開過兩次會議然後那因為有任期所以到7月31號任期到那不過呢前面一次的紀律委員會四個月了"},{"start":73.857,"end":93.888,"text":"前面的紀律委員會呢已經有派兩位紀律委員去收集資料那到8月1號以後呢8月1號是一個新的七個紀律委員副秘書長你講的一大堆什麼任期到啊什麼新的紀律委員啊都無法解釋一件事情"},{"start":95.697,"end":120.635,"text":"這麼簡單的事情四個月放在那邊擺爛來我想請教一下你們監察院的這個年度的施政目標就包括針對行政機關違司立案調查提出糾正案對不對然後追究相關責任處期徹底注意改善結果你們監察院自己的違法濫權"},{"start":123.15,"end":150.094,"text":"沒關係啊 一晃眼拖個四個月過去然後跟我講什麼 因為這個任期屆嘛 因為新的上來你覺得我們台灣人民聽得懂嗎 聽得進去嗎遇到你們自己就拖拖拖 慢慢慢 是這樣子嗎跟委員說明 這個任期是 事實是這樣子事實是什麼事實就是你們對自己的部分 就是搞拖延"},{"start":151.963,"end":178.209,"text":"監察百官的机关变成最该被监察的对象然后叫人民怎么去信任监察院那我就直接问你啊 傅明晓我知道你答也答不出来了那请问到底什么时候给我们结果嘛你现在有新的机遇委员会出来了那告诉我啊是不是等到下一个机遇委员会任期多久一年一年后再跟我讲说抱歉啦一年这个新的机遇委员会"},{"start":179.505,"end":183.32,"text":"又任期借買又要新的紀律輪會無限紀律下去嗎"},{"start":185.26,"end":210.482,"text":"就是新的紀律委員會他們已經開過有兩次的約詢 兩次的調卷而且兩次提出拜託啦 速度快一點10月份報告其實出稿已經出來了出稿出來了那告訴我結論是什麼通通沒事做官員的典範不用有任何的結果不用負擔任何代價是這個結果嗎 告訴我"},{"start":212.772,"end":234.803,"text":"那個紀律委員會是獨立行使職權我是行政幕僚我知道你不會講啦我知道你不曉得不曉得拭目以待好不好可不可以來 想請問喔如果地方政府放任土地環境被違法開發破壞清道廢棄物該不該開罰該不該處理監察院該不該調查"},{"start":239.174,"end":266.933,"text":"其實監察院是事後權那跟行政權裡面還是有權力分立的適用所以呢如果有事件發生應該是行政權優先處理不是廢話嗎我就問你啦盧甲學渣案算不算是事後權啊學甲盧渣案對啊我要問你就是這些已經發生的事情啊"},{"start":267.864,"end":288.434,"text":"要不要調查有調查案來來來有調查我當然知道啊好來我們監察院社會福利及衛生環境等委員會在今年8月20號有召開聯席會議嘛對不對是針對台南雪茄的爐渣案還有一些重要的一些議題來進行討論嘛對不對來你知道根據會議記錄什麼時候開會什麼時候散會"},{"start":298.539,"end":313.022,"text":"來啦 我告訴你啦對啊喔 非常長 我就忍這句話來來來來 我告訴你 我跟你講我這邊很簡單 你們會議紀錄在這邊8月20號下午3點42分開會嘛 對不對你知道什麼時候結束嗎你們會議紀錄寫的喔 散會是什麼時候"},{"start":326.425,"end":339.112,"text":"散會3點42分好厲害啊真的好厲害啊3點42分開會3點42分散會文化部補助0日攻擊你們是什麼0秒開會啊"},{"start":344.066,"end":363.912,"text":"因為常設委員會在開會的時候是會開他的本會跟各聯席會議那那個會議記錄的話就會一段你覺得你講這些大家聽得懂來來來我講下一個問題你知道那天不只開這個會吧8月20號當天下午3點37分到42分5分鐘開了幾場聯席會開了幾場告訴我"},{"start":371.15,"end":393.209,"text":"開了七場聯席會好有效率啊 監察院真的太厲害了有兩個聯席會3點38分開會3點38分散會又是一個所謂的零分開會你知道在立法院開聯席會要開多久啊常常開一整天耶還要挑釁業戰耶"},{"start":397.276,"end":425.054,"text":"我讓你答不出來啦你剛剛已經認了五秒鐘答不出來啦不是因為我手中沒有相關的資料欸欸欸你們連這個都不知道來五分鐘開七場一分鐘開兩場你跟我講開什麼會啊過場而已啊來這七場我直接告訴你包含哪些議題看我有沒有說錯包括性騷擾台南雪甲爐災案外籍漁工人權家暴長照健康食品安全環境保護"},{"start":427.321,"end":452.841,"text":"五分鐘講得完啊因為呢 剛剛委員講的那個議題不是在審調查報告 而是在審後面的你剛才跟我講 你們聯席會開很久欸你現在要改口了嗎後面的審查意見那審查意見前面已經經過調查委員我跟你講 副秘書長你到現在為止 你在兜圈圈你在兜圈圈 我不為難你啦你是行政幕僚 不為難你啦"},{"start":454.793,"end":464.202,"text":"最諷刺的是 你知道監察院你剛送進來115年預算議事行政上引印機租金印刷費用編多少錢354萬還有一筆是有線電視收視費開會餘時誤參費多少錢134.9萬"},{"start":481.745,"end":509.628,"text":"監委你認真工作有些費用是可以編列但是我要跟你講光光你那聯席會五分鐘開七場印大量的會議資料我直接跟你講對不起那會議資料根本沒有用心討論就是敷衍連買A4紙跟碳水匣給你們都是浪費五分鐘開七場會議的單位你有臉去編百萬元的務參費"},{"start":511.756,"end":531.203,"text":"還要編列預算給監察委員看有線電視照你們這種開會的速度我真覺得你們到底有沒有時間誤餐這些不合理的項目我直接跟你預告進到審查的時候我們就嚴格審查要刪就刪再來我要請教115年編了900萬元的沒宣費對不對沒錯吧"},{"start":541.087,"end":560.032,"text":"在平和指標上你們自己設定人權獎項要達10萬次人權研討會也是10萬次人權教育推廣徵建活動要達30萬人次然後人權專題宣導達35萬人次人權影像紀錄要達45萬以上觀看也就是說總共要達130萬次觀看嘛對不對我跟你講"},{"start":565.779,"end":588.504,"text":"我自己的那個社群平台有時候一支影片30秒鐘成本零也可以破百萬但沒有關係你要編900萬去達130萬次觀看可以啦可以啦那麼來看看你到底做得你做不做得到來請問你知道監察院自己有那個youtube頻道吧你知道你們訂閱數多少我告訴你啦"},{"start":595.854,"end":624.404,"text":"非常棒的數字啊402人你有沒有訂閱數402然後你跟我講說你要130萬觀看你的訂閱數402也監察搞這麼久連1000都沒破他給你錢是幹嘛丟海裡嗎來我想請教目前監察院上架了多少影片目前監察院上架了多少影片"},{"start":628.154,"end":644.043,"text":"150支你知道最高大概點閱率多少嗎我知道你也不知道啦最高的不到1萬大概7400150支平均觀看352次加起來5.3萬我跟複密書上講你們要那900萬沒懸廢我直接講一點立場都沒有"},{"start":656.018,"end":667.872,"text":"以你們這種所謂的宣傳績效一點立場都沒有所以我這邊直接跟你講這900萬在我看來叫浪費公帑這些錢也會延伸以上 謝謝好 謝謝羅志強委員"}]},"gazette":{"lineno":580,"blocks":[["羅委員智強：（11時43分）主席，有請王副秘書長。"],["主席：請副秘書長。"],["王代理秘書長增華：委員好。"],["羅委員智強：請教副秘書長，幾個月前李俊俋前秘書長因為濫用公務車送狗去美容，他因此辭職了，對不對？但是監察院當時爆出濫用公務車的，其實也不只李俊俋一個人，包括林郁容、王榮璋、蘇麗瓊，同樣都有這方面的爭議，當時李鴻鈞副院長說要把這些監委送紀律委員會，我想請問目前進度如何？針對李俊俋還有這些監委，有進行進一步的調查嗎？"],["王代理秘書長增華：跟委員報告，在6月6日的時候，相關的案件就進了紀律委員會，其實紀律委員會在7月份就開過兩次會議，因為有任期，所以到7月31日任期到，不過前面一次的紀律……"],["羅委員智強：4個月了，沒錯吧？"],["王代理秘書長增華：前面的紀律委員會已經有派兩位紀律委員去蒐集資料，然後到8月1日以後，8月1日是7個新的紀律委員，然後他們……"],["羅委員智強：副秘書長，你講了一大堆，什麼任期到啊！什麼新的紀律委員啊！都無法解釋一件事情，這麼簡單的事情，4個月放在那邊擺爛。","來，我想請教一下，你們監察院的年度施政目標就包括針對行政機關違失立案調查，提出糾正案，對不對？"],["王代理秘書長增華：是的。"],["羅委員智強：然後追究相關責任，促其澈底注意改善，結果你們監察院自己的違法濫權，「無要無緊」啊！一晃眼拖個4個月過去，跟我講什麼因為任期屆滿，因為新的上來，你覺得我們臺灣人民聽得懂嗎？聽得進去嗎？遇到你們自己都拖拖拖、慢慢慢，是這樣子嗎？"],["王代理秘書長增華：跟委員說明，這個任期事實是這樣子。另外，有關……"],["羅委員智強：事實是什麼？事實就是你們對自己的部分就是搞拖延啦！"],["王代理秘書長增華：那委員有……"],["羅委員智強：監察百官的機關變成最該被監察的對象，叫人民怎麼去信任監察院？那我就直接問你啊！副秘書長，我知道你大概也答不出來啦！請問到底什麼時候給我們結果？"],["王代理秘書長增華：我就是……"],["羅委員智強：你現在有一個新的紀律委員會出來啦！"],["王代理秘書長增華：是。"],["羅委員智強：那你告訴我啊！這個紀律委員會的任期多久？"],["王代理秘書長增華：一年。"],["羅委員智強：一年，一年後再跟我講說抱歉啦！這個紀律委員會又任期屆滿，又要新的紀律委員會，無限紀律下去嗎？"],["王代理秘書長增華：委員，新的紀律委員會他們已經開過，有兩次的約詢，兩次的調卷，而且兩次提出相關說明。"],["羅委員智強：拜託啦！速度快一點。"],["王代理秘書長增華：10月份，其實報告的初稿已經出來了。"],["羅委員智強：初稿出來了？"],["王代理秘書長增華：對。"],["羅委員智強：那告訴我結論是什麼。統統沒事，作為官員的典範，不用有任何的結果，不用負擔任何代價，是這個結果嗎？告訴我。"],["王代理秘書長增華：委員，紀律委員會是獨立行使職權，我是行政幕僚，我不曉得。"],["羅委員智強：我知道，你不會講啦！我知道你不會講。"],["王代理秘書長增華：我不曉得。"],["羅委員智強：你不曉得。"],["王代理秘書長增華：我真的不曉得。"],["羅委員智強：拭目以待，好不好？可不可以？"],["王代理秘書長增華：可以。"],["羅委員智強：然後想請問，如果地方政府放任土地、環境被違法開發破壞，傾倒廢棄物，該不該開罰？該不該處理？監察院該不該調查？"],["王代理秘書長增華：其實監察院是事後權，跟行政權還是有權力分立的適用，所以如果有事件發生，應該是行政權優先處理。"],["羅委員智強：你不是廢話嗎？"],["王代理秘書長增華：是，然後……"],["羅委員智強：我就問你啦！學甲爐碴案，算不算是事後權？"],["王代理秘書長增華：學甲爐碴案嗎？"],["羅委員智強：學甲爐碴案。"],["王代理秘書長增華：我們有調查。"],["羅委員智強：對啊！我要問你的就是這些已經發生的事情，要不要調查？"],["王代理秘書長增華：有調查案，而且有糾正。"],["羅委員智強：來來來，有調查我當然知道啊！來，我們監察院社會福利及衛生環境等委員會，在今年8月20日有召開聯席會議，對不對？是針對臺南學甲的爐碴案，還有一些重要的議題來進行討論，對不對？"],["王代理秘書長增華：是。"],["羅委員智強：你知道根據會議紀錄，什麼時候開會？什麼時候散會？來啦！我告訴你啦！"],["王代理秘書長增華：委員，那個是聯席會嗎？"],["羅委員智強：對啊！"],["王代理秘書長增華：其實他們開會的時間是非常長的。"],["羅委員智強：喔！非常長，我就要你這句話。"],["王代理秘書長增華：因為先開聯席會……"],["羅委員智強：來，我告訴你，我這邊很簡單，你們會議紀錄在這邊，8月20日下午3點42分開會，對不對？你知道什麼時候結束嗎？你們會議紀錄寫的喔！散會是什麼時候？"],["王代理秘書長增華：委員，因為有……"],["羅委員智強：散會3點42分，好厲害啊！真的好厲害啊！3點42分開會，3點42分散會，文化部補助「零日攻擊」，你們是什麼？零秒開會啊？"],["王代理秘書長增華：因為常設委員會在開會的時候是會開它的本會跟各聯席會議，所以那個會議紀錄就會一段、一段。"],["羅委員智強：你覺得你講這些大家聽得懂？來！我講下一個問題，你知道那一天不只開這個會吧？"],["王代理秘書長增華：對。"],["羅委員智強：8月20日當天下午3點37分到42分，5分鐘開了幾場聯席會？開了幾場你告訴我。"],["王代理秘書長增華：我手中沒有資料。"],["羅委員智強：開了7場聯席會，好有效率啊！監察院真的太厲害了！有兩個聯席會，3點38分開會，3點38分散會，又是一個所謂的零分開會。你知道在立法院開聯席會要開多久？常常開一整天耶！還要挑燈夜戰耶！"],["王代理秘書長增華：委員，因為我手中沒有資料。"],["羅委員智強：我知道你答不出來啦！你剛剛在那邊已經愣了5秒鐘，答不出來啦！"],["王代理秘書長增華：不是，因為我手中沒有相關的資料，不過就是……"],["羅委員智強：你們連這個都不知道，來！5分鐘開7場，1分鐘開2場，你跟我講開什麼會啊？過場而已啦！這7場我直接告訴你包含哪些議題，看我有沒有說錯，包括性騷擾、臺南學甲爐碴案、外籍漁工人權、家暴、長照健康、食品安全、環境保護，5分鐘講得完啊！"],["王代理秘書長增華：剛剛委員講的那個議題不是在審調查報告，而是在審後面的……"],["羅委員智強：你剛才還跟我講你們聯席會開很久耶！你現在要改口了嗎？"],["王代理秘書長增華：那是後面的審查意見，那審查意見前面已經經過調查委員，還有經過召集人的……"],["羅委員智強：我跟你講，副秘書長，你到現在為止，你在兜圈圈！"],["王代理秘書長增華：我是在說明……"],["羅委員智強：你在兜圈圈。"],["王代理秘書長增華：沒有、沒有，委員，我是說明實情。"],["羅委員智強：我不為難你啦！你是行政幕僚，我不為難你啦！"],["王代理秘書長增華：是。"],["羅委員智強：最諷刺的是，你知道監察院剛送進來115年預算，議事行政上，影印機租金、印刷費用編多少錢？354萬。還有一筆是有線電視收視費及開會逾時誤餐費，多少錢？134.9萬。監委你認真工作，有些費用是可以編列，但是我要跟你講，光你那個聯席會5分鐘開7場，印大量的會議資料，我直接跟你講，你對不起那些會議資料！根本沒有用心討論，就是敷衍！連買A4紙跟碳粉匣給你們都是浪費，5分鐘開7場會議的單位，你有臉去編百萬元的誤餐費，還要編列預算給監察委員看有線電視，照你們這種開會的速度，我都覺得你們到底有沒有時間誤餐啊？這些不合理的項目，我直接跟你預告啦！進入到審查的時候，我們會嚴格審查，要刪就刪。","再來，我要請教，115年編了900萬元的媒宣費，對不對？沒錯吧？"],["王代理秘書長增華：是。"],["羅委員智強：在評核指標上，你們自己設定人權獎項要達10萬次，人權研討會也是10萬次，人權教育推廣徵件活動要達30萬人次，然後人權專題宣導達35萬人次，人權影像紀錄要達45萬以上觀看，也就是說總共要達130萬次觀看，對不對？我跟你講，我自己的社群平臺有時候一支影片30秒鐘，成本零也可以破百萬，但沒有關係，你要編900萬去達130萬次觀看，可以啦！那我們來看看你到底做不做得到。來，請問你知道監察院自己有YouTube頻道吧？"],["王代理秘書長增華：是。"],["羅委員智強：你知道你們訂閱數多少？我告訴你啦！非常棒的數字啊！402人，你們訂閱數402，然後你跟我講說你要130萬觀看，你訂閱數402，你今天還搞這麼久，連1,000都沒破，給你錢是幹嘛？丟海裡嗎？來，我想請教，目前監察院上架了多少影片？"],["王代理秘書長增華：那個訂閱數是有關於人權委員會的，不是監察院。"],["羅委員智強：目前監察院上架了多少影片？150支。你知道最高大概點閱率多少嗎？我知道你也不知道啦！最高的不到1萬，大概7,400，150支平均觀看352次，加起來5.3萬，我跟副秘書長講，你們要那900萬媒宣費，我直接講，一點立場都沒有啦！以你們這種所謂的宣傳績效，一點立場都沒有，所以我這邊也直接跟你講，這900萬在我看來叫浪費公帑，這些錢也會嚴審、嚴刪，以上，謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝羅智強委員。","所有的委員發言都已發言完畢，詢答結束。委員質詢時要求提供相關資料或以書面答復者，請相關機關儘速送交個別委員及本會。","議程所列的事項都已經處理完畢，本次會議進行到此結束，現在散會，謝謝大家。","散會（11時54分）"]],"agenda":{"page_end":294,"meet_id":"委員會-11-4-36-3","speakers":["莊瑞雄","黃國昌","吳宗憲","林倩綺","王鴻薇","沈發惠","王義川","翁曉玲","吳思瑤","陳培瑜","傅崐萁","羅智強"],"page_start":253,"meetingDate":["2025-10-15"],"gazette_id":"1148302","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1148302_00007"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第4會期司法及法制委員會第3次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請監察院秘書長列席說明立法計畫，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1148302_00006"}}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}