{"error":false,"id":["164544"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":164544,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/164544","日期":"2025-10-22","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"委員會-11-4-15-7","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第4會期內政委員會第7次全體委員會議","屆":11,"會期":4,"會次":7,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"委員會","委員會代碼":[15],"委員會代碼:str":["內政委員會"],"標題":"第11屆第4會期內政委員會第7次全體委員會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2025-10-22T09:41:26+08:00","結束時間":"2025-10-22T09:48:16+08:00","影片長度":"00:06:50","支援功能":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/615807a88c5be4dafe7011915ed1d7e501812ea37d1526ba83c966d97180d5d2fe6342ee0b0898265ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"張宏陸","委員發言時間":"09:41:26 - 09:48:16","會議時間":"2025-10-22T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第4會期內政委員會第7次全體委員會議（事由：一、邀請內政部就「替代役訓練及備役召集運用」進行專題報告，並備質詢。\n二、審查「替代役實施條例」：(一)委員王美惠等18人擬具「替代役實施條例第五十九條條文修正草案」案。(二)委員羅美玲等18人擬具「替代役實施條例增訂第五十五條之五條文草案」案。(三)台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「替代役實施條例第五十五條之一條文修正草案」案。\n\n【10月22日及23日兩天一次會】）","transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":1.27971875,"end":2.9672187500000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":3.49034375,"end":5.2115937500000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":11.084093750000001,"end":11.82659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":11.89409375,"end":24.398468750000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":24.938468750000002,"end":26.79471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":27.33471875,"end":31.50284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":31.50284375,"end":34.759718750000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":31.688468750000002,"end":31.992218750000006},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":32.430968750000005,"end":32.73471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":34.94534375,"end":41.22284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":41.729093750000004,"end":46.48784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":46.84221875,"end":57.962843750000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":58.384718750000005,"end":66.09659375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":65.37096875,"end":67.93596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":68.22284375000001,"end":72.03659375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":72.40784375,"end":77.35221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":78.38159375000001,"end":83.56221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":83.56221875,"end":83.57909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":83.61284375000001,"end":91.62846875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":84.45659375000001,"end":84.91221875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":91.94909375,"end":94.96971875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":95.59409375,"end":102.44534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":100.36971875,"end":114.49409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":103.54221875,"end":104.36909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":114.61221875000001,"end":115.13534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":115.54034375,"end":117.36284375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":117.48096875,"end":118.22346875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":118.35846875000001,"end":135.62159375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":122.96534375,"end":123.65721875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":136.44846875000002,"end":137.05596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":136.58346875,"end":137.08971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":137.08971875,"end":141.71346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":139.38471875000002,"end":146.77596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":145.72971875000002,"end":146.47221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":146.91096875,"end":152.09159375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":152.61471875,"end":156.10784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":156.74909375000001,"end":157.17096875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":157.42409375,"end":172.03784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":172.03784375,"end":172.35846875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":172.35846875000001,"end":179.74971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":172.49346875,"end":172.96596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":174.46784375000001,"end":175.80096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":179.74971875,"end":179.78346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":179.78346875,"end":180.03659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":180.03659375,"end":181.28534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":181.63971875000001,"end":182.34846875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":182.73659375000003,"end":185.16659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":185.55471875,"end":188.08596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":188.33909375000002,"end":194.24534375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":194.90346875,"end":195.35909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":195.66284375,"end":196.37159375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":196.59096875,"end":197.62034375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":197.92409375000003,"end":205.16346875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":202.49721875,"end":209.66909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":207.45846875,"end":207.52596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":209.87159375000002,"end":210.02346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":210.02346875,"end":212.94284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":213.41534375,"end":224.24909375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":222.10596875000002,"end":222.54471875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":224.24909375000001,"end":233.20971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":233.69909375,"end":236.92221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":236.55096875,"end":236.90534375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":236.92221875,"end":238.74471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":239.11596875,"end":239.13284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":239.13284375,"end":241.52909375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":239.67284375000003,"end":239.92596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":240.48284375000003,"end":242.77784375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":241.52909375000002,"end"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義務役他們本來就是什麼兵種就過去就是什麼兵種 對不對那我們的替代役其實裡面就包括你們講的有很多的項目而且以前跟現在是不一樣 對不對"},{"start":136.519,"end":161.179,"text":"自從實施替代役以來我們就是都這樣子在辦理替代役的基礎信念就不是啦你聽不懂我了一別就有很多種我們現在又改了嘛對不對是對嘛所以以前跟現在又不一樣了那我想請問一下那如果我們的替代役未來他在備役的狀態之下我們拿請他來"},{"start":162.538,"end":187.819,"text":"叫招授訓或什麼的我們有沒有用他的特殊的專才然後去加強這一部分的一個訓練因為你要全民防衛嘛對不對裡面可能有醫生可能有什麼很多種喔我們目前就有分治安維護組跟防災救護組那治安維護組基本上這部分是由"},{"start":188.459,"end":211.929,"text":"警政署來做負責的這個招訊那治安維護署裡面又有所謂的這個環境清消以及這個物資配送這個是又牽涉到經濟部跟環境部這個部分我們有做這樣的一個區別不用講這個我只問你啦那如果是有醫生呢醫生的部分就在防災救護署裡面"},{"start":213.49,"end":218.355,"text":"有是由消防署這邊來做整體的規範但是裡面我們有請衛福部的醫事師來做這方面的專業訓練還有社工師剛剛你就講說這是你們醫政司的業務你現在又說都是他們我要問你的你就都說他們"},{"start":233.752,"end":260.052,"text":"那到底你對業務你到底有沒有了解這個部分是因為我們有做這個西用機關我請部長好了張委員我想我們司長比較仔細一點第一個就是有關專長訓練的部分由目的事業主管機關來訓練那內政部的議政司在基礎的國防訓練上面跟國防部一起配合對啊其實一句話可以講得很清楚對不對比較緊張"},{"start":264.389,"end":290.395,"text":"那我再請問像現在未來國防部什麼其實從俄烏戰爭等等的無人機其實扮演了一個不敢說最重要的角色但它在不管你全民防衛或等等裡面它都有這個角色存在那我們未來我們的替代役我們有沒有這一塊"},{"start":291.144,"end":317.399,"text":"有我們目前規劃明年要來對我們替代役的這個訓練要規劃8個小時的無人機的訓練那現階段我們是已經有在在職訓練也有做部分的已經訓練了今年也有做部分的訓練了那明年是規劃所有的替代役人在成功領基礎訓練我們有8個小時的無人機的訓練的課程的安排那是在成功領基礎那你他如果是備役之後呢"},{"start":318.271,"end":345.221,"text":"被預先這一段是那個治安維護組警察的這個區塊裡面他們也有對這個也有把他們當這樣一個課程這樣有啦目前警政署有這樣子規劃對於治安維護組這個區塊他們有做這樣的規劃他們用的無人機是跟國防部配合的還是我們自己一套系統國防警政署的這個部分我就不清楚那我們內政部的部分是我們明年開始我們是會專案採購"},{"start":347.403,"end":375.691,"text":"我們明年的部分明年的部分我們會採購無人機16架我也不問你細節什麼樣的無人機我只有一個這種無人機其實有攻擊型的有探勘型的有勘查的什麼的那我們著重在哪一塊我們著重在勘查 探勘比如說在有災害我們去探勘那個災害的狀況還有傾縮的這個部分我們沒有攻擊型的"},{"start":378.382,"end":381.59,"text":"所以我的意思是說要全民防衛在這個我認為"},{"start":386.431,"end":409.733,"text":"無人機我認為未來會扮演一個比較吃重在情搜在情報的蒐集等等的我覺得這一塊我認為應該要把它放成一個重點去處理是我們明明就有做這樣的規劃要來做訓練而且所有的藝人都要接受這樣的訓練好 謝謝委員的指教好 謝謝張宏錄"}]},"gazette":{"lineno":275,"blocks":[["張委員宏陸：（9時41分）我先請役政司司長。"],["主席：請役政司司長。"],["張委員宏陸：司長，我們現在所有的備役，不管義務役或替代役，他的受訓到底是國防部主責還是役政司？"],["沈司長哲芳：目前替代役的受訓一個是現役，一個是備役。"],["張委員宏陸：我剛剛問你的是包含義務役。"],["沈司長哲芳：義務役常備兵當然是國防部，替代役的部分，現役也是義務役，替代役是按照兵役法第二條的規定，也是義務的一種，第二條規定軍官役、士官役、士兵役跟替代役，所以替代役也是兵役的一種。有關於替代役現役的基礎訓練是由內政部會同國防部來辦理，因此，現階段所有全國替代役的基礎訓練就在成功嶺，這個營區也是跟國防部借的。"],["張委員宏陸：好啦，役政司其實最主要的是做徵兵和通知的程序，對不對？"],["沈司長哲芳：按照兵役法第三十條的規定，徵兵處理是內政部在負責，那麼替代役的主管機關是我們內政部，常備兵的訓練、後備管理是由國防部在負責，就是在兵役法裡面，我們是有做分工。"],["張委員宏陸：對啦，我剛剛就是問你這個問題，一句話可以回答的，你可以講這麼久，我也真的覺得佩服你，你知道嗎？就一句話而已。"],["沈司長哲芳：是。"],["張委員宏陸：那我想請問一下，義務役本來就是什麼兵種過去就是什麼兵種，對不對？"],["沈司長哲芳：是。"],["張委員宏陸：我們的替代役其實就如你們講的有很多項目，而且以前跟現在不一樣，對不對？"],["沈司長哲芳：自從實施替代役以來，我們就是都這樣在辦理，替代役的基礎訓練就由……"],["張委員宏陸：不是啦，你聽不懂我的意思，役別就有很多種，我們現在又改了嘛，對不對？"],["沈司長哲芳：是。"],["張委員宏陸：所以以前跟現在又不一樣了，那我想請問一下，如果我們的替代役未來在備役的狀態之下，我們請他來教召受訓或什麼的，我們有沒有按照他特殊的專才去加強這一部分的訓練？"],["沈司長哲芳：有，我們目前……"],["張委員宏陸：因為你要全民防衛嘛。"],["沈司長哲芳：是。"],["張委員宏陸：裡面可能有醫生，可能有什麼，很多種喔！"],["沈司長哲芳：是，我們目前就有分治安維護組跟防災救護組，治安維護組基本上是由警政署來負責召訓，治安維護組裡面又有所謂的環境清消及物資配送，這又牽涉到經濟部跟環境部，這個部分我們有做這樣的區別。"],["張委員宏陸：不用講這個，我只問你，如果是有醫生呢？"],["沈司長哲芳：醫生的部分就在防災救護組裡面，是由消防署這邊來做整體的規範，但是裡面我們有請衛福部醫事司做這方面的專業訓練，還有社工司。"],["張委員宏陸：剛剛你就講這是你們役政司的業務嘛！"],["沈司長哲芳：是。"],["張委員宏陸：你現在又說都是他們、他們！我要問你的，你就都說他們、他們哪！那到底你對業務有沒有了解？"],["沈司長哲芳：這個部分是因為我們有做需用機關的訓練……"],["張委員宏陸：我請部長好了。"],["劉部長世芳：張委員，我想我們司長比較仔細一點。第一個就是有關專長訓練的部分，由目的事業主管機關來訓練，內政部役政司在基礎的國防訓練上面，跟國防部一起配合。"],["張委員宏陸：對，其實一句話可以講得很清楚，對不對？我再請問，未來國防部，或者從俄烏戰爭等等的，其實無人機所扮演的，不敢說是最重要的一個角色，但不管是你的全民防衛等等裡面，都有它這個角色存在。那未來我們的替代役，有沒有這一塊？"],["沈司長哲芳：有，我們目前規劃明年對替代役的訓練要有8個小時的無人機訓練。現階段我們是有在職訓練，也有做部分的訓練了，今年也有做部分的訓練，明年是規劃所有的替代役男在成功嶺基礎訓練，我們有8個小時無人機訓練的課程安排。"],["張委員宏陸：不，那個是在成功嶺的基礎訓練。"],["沈司長哲芳：是。"],["張委員宏陸：如果是備役之後呢？"],["沈司長哲芳：備役現階段是治安維護組、警察的區塊裡面他們對這個也有上這樣的課程。"],["張委員宏陸：有嘛？"],["沈司長哲芳：對，有，目前警政署有這樣子規劃，對於治安維護組這個區塊他們有做這樣的規劃。"],["張委員宏陸：他們用的無人機是跟國防部配合的，還是自己的一套系統？"],["沈司長哲芳：警政署的這個部分我就不清楚，那我們內政部的部分是，明年開始我們會專案採購……"],["張委員宏陸：什麼？"],["沈司長哲芳：明年我們會採購無人機16架。"],["張委員宏陸：我也不問你細節、什麼樣的無人機，我只有一個問題就是，這種無人機其實有攻擊型的、有探勘型的，那你們著重在哪一塊？"],["沈司長哲芳：我們著重在勘查、探勘，比如有災害，我們去探勘災害的狀況，還有情蒐的部分，我們沒有攻擊型的。"],["張委員宏陸：所以我的意思是，要全民防衛，無人機我認為未來會扮演一個比較吃重的角色，在情報蒐集等等，這一塊我認為應該要把它放成一個重點去處理。"],["沈司長哲芳：是，所以我們明年就有做這樣的規劃要做訓練。"],["張委員宏陸：好，謝謝。"],["沈司長哲芳：而且所有的役男都要接受這樣的訓練。謝謝委員的指教。"],["主席（黃委員捷代）：謝謝張宏陸委員。","再來請牛煦庭委員。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":288,"meet_id":"委員會-11-4-15-7","speakers":["王美惠","羅美玲","麥玉珍","蘇巧慧","張智倫","張宏陸","牛煦庭","黃捷","許宇甄","李柏毅","徐欣瑩","羅廷瑋","林楚茵","謝龍介","吳琪銘","高金素梅"],"page_start":249,"meetingDate":["2025-10-22"],"gazette_id":"1148601","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1148601_00006"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第4會期內政委員會第7次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、邀請內政部就「替代役訓練及備役召集運用」進行專題報告，並備質詢；二、審查「替代役\n實施條例」： ( 一 ) 委員王美惠等 18 人擬具「替代役實施條例第五十九條條文修正草案」案、\n(二）委員羅美玲等18人擬具「替代役實施條例增訂第五十五條之五條文草案」案、 (三)台灣民\n眾黨黨團擬具「替代役實施條例第五十五條之一條文修正草案」案","agenda_id":"1148601_00005"}}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}