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照業務計畫 基金來源 用途及輿促 結繳工庫等逐項審查營業基金部分 照業務計畫 營業收入 生產成本 轉投資計畫重大之建設事業 資金運用及補辦預算等逐項審查"},{"start":1933.77,"end":1951.314,"text":"現在請宣讀今日審查項目與委員提案宣讀後再進行協商請一併宣讀114年度中央政府總預算案經濟部主管附屬單位預算非營業部分經濟作業基金依業務計畫請參閱預算書二業務收支業務總收入87億零66萬3千元業務總支出76億4533萬1千元"},{"start":1961.417,"end":1982.996,"text":"本期剩余十亿五千五百三十三万两千元三 结缴公库金额两千七百一十八万六千元四 转投资计划无劣数五 固定资产建设改良扩充十八亿零七百五十七万六千元六 国库增波基金额无劣数七 补办预算资产变卖一亿三千八百八十一万三千元"},{"start":1983.837,"end":1988.702,"text":"水資源作業基金一 業務計畫請參閱預算書二 業務收支業務總收入95億9354萬1千元業務總支出114億3195萬9千元本期短處18億3841萬8千元三 結繳供庫金額無劣數"},{"start":2003.979,"end":2004.7,"text":"4.軟投資計畫無劣數5."},{"start":2004.7,"end":2006.363,"text":"固定資產建設改良擴充32億8949萬5千元6."},{"start":2006.363,"end":2007.104,"text":"國庫增撥基金額21億3467萬8千元經濟特別收入基金"},{"start":2019.656,"end":2025.119,"text":"一 業務計劃請參閱預算書二 基金來源用途及餘處基金來源315億2,506萬2千元基金用途293億4,793萬7千元本期剩餘21億7,712萬5千元三 節繳公庫餘列數"},{"start":2039.105,"end":2046.589,"text":"核能發電後端營運基金一 業務計畫請參閱預算書二 基金來源用途及餘處基金來源423億8185萬7千元基金用途79億9064萬9千元本期剩餘343億9120萬8千元三 截角工庫無劣數"},{"start":2059.597,"end":2081.46,"text":"提案部分經濟作業基金第一案總收入增列五千萬元委員先奉等提案第二案業務收入租金及權利金收入向下土地租金收入瓜福產業園區開發管理基金增列一千萬元委員陳超明等提案第三案增列五百萬元委員邱瑩穎等提案第四案服務費用向下專業服務費"},{"start":2085.483,"end":2104.796,"text":"第五案 业务成本与费用 劳务成本 服务成本 服务费用向下专业服务费 冻结百分之二 委员呈停费等提案第六案 会费捐助补助分摊救助剂与交流活动费 冻结百分之十 委员先奉等提案依科技产业园区作业基金第七案"},{"start":2106.537,"end":2118.864,"text":"業務營業成本與費用勞務成本管理成本服務費用向下專業服務費凍結1000萬元委員女育齡等提案第八案固定資產建設改良擴充凍結10%委員楊瓊英等提案第九案凍結50萬元委員賴瑞榮等提案"},{"start":2122.526,"end":2141.724,"text":"第十案一般建築及设备计划分联性项目向下房屋及建筑冻结1%委员邱盈莹等提案二产业园区管理开发基金第十一案业务成本与费用向下劳务成本减列1%委员陈廷飞等提案第十二案冻结1亿元委员陈超明等提案"},{"start":2142.404,"end":2160.07,"text":"第十三案投融資業務成本凍結1億元委員呂玉玲等提案第十四案管理及總務費用凍結100萬元委員賴瑞榮等提案第十五案管理費用及總務費用向下服務費用減劣10%委員楊瓊英等提案十六案至31案為主決議請參閱"},{"start":2163.672,"end":2178.699,"text":"水資源作業基金提案第32案業務收入銷貨收入向下土石銷貨收入增列500萬元委員賴瑞榮等提案33案服務費用減列100萬元凍結200萬元委員賴瑞榮等提案34案業務成本與費用關乎溫泉事業發展基金凍結100萬元委員邱志偉等提案"},{"start":2186.922,"end":2196.11,"text":"35案 業務成本與費用向下銷貨成本 凍結1%委員陳廷飛等提案36案 凍結500萬元委員邱志偉等提案37案 給水銷貨成本 凍結20%委員張家俊等提案38案 凍結200萬元委員邱志偉等提案39案 給水銷貨成本服務費用向下水電費減列500萬元委員張祺凱等提案"},{"start":2212.164,"end":2231.638,"text":"40案修理保养及保护费 冻结5000万元委员陈超明等提案41案一般服务费 冻结2000万元委员陈超明等提案42案专业服务费 减列5000万元委员张其凯等提案43案媒体政策及业务宣导费 全数减列委员张其凯等提案"},{"start":2232.939,"end":2246.37,"text":"44案土石銷貨成本向下專業服務費減列200萬元文章齊凱等提案45案業務費用服務費用向下專業服務費減列200萬元文章齊凱等提案46案耗水費費用凍結20%文章家俊等提案47案凍結5%文邱瑩等提案"},{"start":2254.497,"end":2278.451,"text":"48案凍結500萬元委員邱志偉等提案49案耗水費費用服務費用向下專業服務費減列470萬元委員張其凱等提案50案媒體政策及業務宣導費全數減列委員張其凱等提案51案一般建築及設備計畫向下分年性項目凍結100萬元委員邱志偉等提案52案至61案為主決議請參閱"},{"start":2282.062,"end":2299.143,"text":"经济特别收入基金提案部分1.推广贸易基金62案贸易推广工作计划简列2000万元委员陈廷飞等提案63案冻结2亿元委员吕玉玲等提案64案冻结1318万2000元委员邱毅英等提案"},{"start":2299.884,"end":2309.472,"text":"65案凍結1000萬元委員賴瑞榮等提案66案凍結500萬元委員邱志偉等提案67案服務費用向下履運費減列10%委員楊瓊英等提案68案凍結400萬元委員邱志偉等提案69案服務費用向下專業服務費凍結1億元委員陳超明等提案"},{"start":2322.101,"end":2337.834,"text":"70案其他商业服务费向下委托办理智慧机械海外推广计划冻结20%委员张家俊等提案71委托办理战略性高科技货品管控作业计划冻结20%委员张家俊等提案"},{"start":2339.28,"end":2367.56,"text":"72 服务费用向下媒体政策及业务宣导费减列1800万元为先一奉等提案73 案冻结10%为杨琼英等提案74 案服务费用向下推展费冻结10%为先一奉等提案75 会费捐助补助分摊照顾救济与交流活动费向下捐助金融机构办理海外公共工程贷款逆袭补助计划全数冻结委员张家俊等提案"},{"start":2368.34,"end":2382.452,"text":"七十六案 凍結一千萬元委員邱志偉等提案七十七案 凍結一千萬元委員賴瑞榮等提案二 能源研究發展基金提案第七十八案 能源研究發展工作計畫凍結十億元委員張祺凱等提案"},{"start":2385.534,"end":2396.957,"text":"79案凍結2億元委員張祺凱等提案80案能源研究發展工作計畫向下服務費用凍結減劣10%委員楊瓊英等提案81案服務費用向下專業服務費凍結20%委員張家俊等提案82案凍結300萬元委員邱志偉等提案83案凍結150萬元委員賴瑞榮等提案"},{"start":2411.294,"end":2439.502,"text":"84案委托调查研究费科技计划能源效率管理与节能技术推广辅导向下服务业能源查核与能源管理辅导推广简列150万元委员陈廷飞等提案85案冻结500万元委员吕玉玲等提案86案冻结5%委员邱瑛颖等提案87案服务费用向下媒体政策及业务宣导费简列168万6千元委员谢一凤等提案"},{"start":2440.702,"end":2467.723,"text":"88案凍結50萬元委員賴瑞榮等提案89案材料及用品費凍結10%委員楊瓊英等提案90案匯費捐助補助分攤照護救濟與交流活動費捐助國內團體向下科技計畫凍結10%委員謝一鳳等提案91案科技計畫能源效率管理與節能技術推廣輔導向下廢熱與廢冷回收技術示範應用專案補助"},{"start":2470.245,"end":2478.112,"text":"凍結200萬元委員邱志偉等提案92案凍結100萬元委員邱盈盈等提案3石油基金提案第93案"},{"start":2479.318,"end":2488.707,"text":"政府除油石油開發及技術研究計劃凍結5%委員蔡宜宇等提案94案服務費用減劣10%委員楊瓊英等提案95案服務費用專業服務費向下委託調查研究費向下科技計劃凍結10%委員謝一鳳等提案"},{"start":2500.369,"end":2520.773,"text":"96案其他專業服務費非科技計劃向下住宅家電效率升級檢列1500萬元委員陳亭飛等提案97案政府儲油石油開發及技術研究計劃服務費用其他專業服務費非科技計劃向下加護屋頂設置太陽光電加速計劃檢列100萬元委員陳亭飛等提案"},{"start":2523.814,"end":2543.689,"text":"98案服务费用向下媒体政策及业务宣导费减列159万4千元委员谢一凤等提案99案冻结50万元委员赖瑞龙等提案100案会费捐助补助分摊照护救济与交流活动费向下捐助补助与讲助冻结2亿元委员陈超明等提案"},{"start":2544.909,"end":2564.942,"text":"101案凍結500萬元委員邱志偉等提案102案捐助國內團體科技計畫向下業界能源科技研究發展凍結10%委員先一鳳等提案103案定制型燃料電池發電系統示範推廣凍結5%委員邱盈盈等提案104案凍結200萬元委員邱志偉等提案105案"},{"start":2570.745,"end":2595.743,"text":"补协助政府机关购非科技计划向下电动机车产业环境加值补助冻结5%委员邱英等提案106案冻结1000万元委员邱志伟等提案107案一般行政管理计划冻结10%委员杨琼英等提案4再生能源发展基金提案108案再生能源推广计划简列一亿元委员张奇凯等提案"},{"start":2596.203,"end":2599.405,"text":"109案凍結1億元委員張家俊等提案110案凍結5%委員蔡奕宇等提案111案凍結5%委員蔡奕宇等提案"},{"start":2609.53,"end":2625.73,"text":"112案 再生能源推廣計畫 向下服務費用 凍結100萬元委員賴瑞龍等提案113案 匯費捐助補助分攤照護救濟與交流活動費 向下捐助補助與獎助 凍結3000萬元委員陳超明等提案"},{"start":2627.472,"end":2633.437,"text":"114 原住民地區參與再生能源設置示範獎勵 凍結5%委員邱瑩等提案115 太陽光電結合漁業環境友善維護計畫凍結700萬元委員邱志偉等提案116 凍結2%委員陳亭飛等提案"},{"start":2645.938,"end":2648.663,"text":"5.中小企業發展基金117案中小企業發展計畫凍結2億元委員張祺凱等題案118案凍結5%委員蔡奕宇等題案"},{"start":2658.152,"end":2667.976,"text":"119案服務費用向下專業服務費凍結20%委員張家俊等提案120案凍結1000萬元委員邱志偉等提案121案其他專業服務費凍結10%委員謝一鳳等提案122案背列新創躍升投融資平台計劃凍結1500萬元委員呂玉玲等提案123案城鄉在地供好能量提升計劃檢列300萬元委員陳亭飛等提案"},{"start":2685.424,"end":2699.998,"text":"一百二十四案租金償債利息及相關手續費凍結兩百萬元委員陳超明等提案一百二十五案一般行政管理計畫簡列百分之十委員楊瓊英等提案一百二十六案至一百四十九案為主決議請參閱"},{"start":2702.961,"end":2716.096,"text":"核能發電後端營運基金提案150案財產收入向下利息收入減列30億元委員張家俊等提案151案服務費用向下一般服務費減列10%凍結10%委員賴瑞榮等提案152案低放射性廢棄物處理及組成計劃"},{"start":2724.205,"end":2735.175,"text":"檢列500萬元凍結1000萬元委員賴瑞榮等提案153案服務費用檢列4500萬元委員張祺凱等提案154案凍結20%委員張家俊等提案155案服務費用向下推展費全數檢列委員張家俊等提案156案構建固定資產無形資產非理財目的之長期投資及營舍與設施工程支出"},{"start":2750.929,"end":2777.201,"text":"动结20%委员张家俊等提案150起案低放射性废弃物最终处置计划减列300万元服务费用向下专业服务费向下委托调查研究费向下玻璃熔融固化技术可行性评估研究计划全数动结委员赖瑞荣等提案150办案低放射性废弃物最终处置计划减列150万元委员陈廷飞等提案"},{"start":2778.585,"end":2793.062,"text":"159案冻结20%委员张家俊等提案160案冻结5%委员邱盈盈等提案161案冻结500万元委员邱志伟等提案162案服务费用减列10%委员杨琼英等提案"},{"start":2795.287,"end":2803.172,"text":"163案服務費用向下專業服務費減列2000萬元委員張其凱等提案164案用過核子燃料儲存計劃減列3000萬元凍結3000萬元委員賴瑞榮等提案165案減列100萬元委員陳廷飛等提案166案凍結20%委員張家俊等提案167案用過核子燃料儲存計劃"},{"start":2817.942,"end":2833.535,"text":"最终处置计划简列600万元冻结600万元委员赖瑞龙等提案168案冻结20%委员张家俊等提案169案冻结5%委员邱英英等提案170案冻结500万元委员邱志伟等提案"},{"start":2835.015,"end":2862.969,"text":"171案服务费用向下专业服务费冻结5000万元委员张其凯等提案172案盒子设施厨艺拆厂及其废弃物处理及最终处置计划向下服务费用冻结2亿元委员张其凯等提案173案服务费用向下专业服务费冻结20%委员张家俊等提案174案一般行政管理计划减裂5%冻结10%委员内瑞龙等提案"},{"start":2864.43,"end":2874.482,"text":"175案凍結100萬元委員邱志偉等提案176案一般行政管理計劃向下服務費用減列200萬元委員張啟改等提案177案為主決議請參閱"},{"start":2878.612,"end":2905.807,"text":"营业部分台湾唐业股份有限公司1.业务计划请参阅预算书2.营业收支业务总收入364亿4283万4千元营业总支出305亿9315万5千元税前净利58亿4967万9千元3.生产成本请参阅预算书4.转投资计划无列数5.重大支建设事业26亿3156万1千元"},{"start":2908.788,"end":2930.889,"text":"6.資金運用請參閱預算書7.補辦預算固定資產是建設改良擴充2429萬1千元提案部分第一案產銷營運計畫向下環境保護瓜湖污染防治支出凍結500萬元委員賴瑞榮等提案第二案勞工安全衛生檢列100萬元委員陳亭飛等提案第三案凍結1623萬"},{"start":2934.012,"end":2951.429,"text":"委员薛英凤等提案第四案冻结1623万元委员郑天才等提案第五案冻结1000万元委员陈超明等提案第六案冻结5%委员邱颖等提案第七案冻结300万元委员邱志伟等提案第八案失业永续发展计划"},{"start":2952.21,"end":2981.093,"text":"永續揭露項目投入資本支出凍結10%委員謝一鳳等提案第九案營業收入跨乎金融事業部增列500萬元委員邱瑩等提案第十案營業收入向下銷貨收入增列1億元委員張家俊等提案第十一案其他營業收入向下投資性不動產收入向下加油站租金收入增列100萬元委員陳超明等提案第十二案營業外收入"},{"start":2982.094,"end":3001.025,"text":"其他營業外收入向下處分投資性不動產利益增列2億元委員賴瑞龍等提案十三案 服務費用刮鬍管理費用凍結10%為楊瓊英等提案十四案 服務費用向下水電費減列1.5%為蕭鳳等提案十五案 服務費用向下專業服務費減列500萬元凍結500萬元委員賴瑞龍等提案"},{"start":3008.149,"end":3030.18,"text":"十六案營業成本凍結五百萬元委員邱志偉等提案十七案凍結五百萬元委員邱志偉等提案十八案凍結兩百萬元委員邱志偉等提案十九案營業成本及費用關乎蓄值加工廠凍結百分之四委員陳廷飛等提案二十案營業成本向下銷售成本凍結一千萬元委員賴瑞榮等提案"},{"start":3031.479,"end":3057.819,"text":"二十一案再生能源發電費用服務費用向下水電費凍結百分之二十委員張家俊等提案二十二案再生能源發電費用向下材料及用品費減列三千萬元委員張齊凱等提案二十三案其他營業成本投資性不動產費用向下服務費用減列百分之十委員楊瓊英等提案二十四案凍結三千萬元委員張齊凱等提案"},{"start":3058.899,"end":3080.485,"text":"25案租赁成本向下服务费用减列700万元委员张家俊等提案26案营业费用向下行销费用冻结1949万8千元委员谢玉凤等提案27案行销费用向下推展费冻结1000万元委员陈超明等提案28案管理费用冻结5000万元委员吕玉玲等提案"},{"start":3081.555,"end":3095.03,"text":"29案其他营业费用向下员工训练费用冻结1000万元委员吕玉玲等提案30案营业外费用向下其他营业外费用减列100万元冻结500万元委员赖瑞龙等提案"},{"start":3096.148,"end":3105.593,"text":"31案其他營業外費用向下停工損失 凍結20%委員張家俊等提案 32案凍結5%委員邱盈盈等提案33案凍結1000萬元委員陳超明等提案 34案凍結300萬元委員邱志偉等提案 35案製造費用"},{"start":3116.628,"end":3145.361,"text":"猪肉及其制品向下服务费用冻结三千万元委员张其凯等提案三十六案各产品制造费用服务费用向下占除包装代理及加工费减劣三千万元委员张家俊等提案三十七案固定资产建设改良扩充专案计划继续计划农业循环租场改建投资计划冻结百分之十委员谢一凤等提案三十八案冻结百分之十委员蔡义渝等提案"},{"start":3146.141,"end":3166.322,"text":"三十九案 凍結5%委員邱映穎等提案四十案 凍結1000萬元委員陳超明等提案四十一案 凍結500萬元委員邱志偉等提案四十二案 凍結500萬元委員賴瑞龍等提案四十三案 一般建築及設備計畫凍結10%委員蔡奕宇等提案四十四案至六十九案為主決議 請參閱"},{"start":3169.683,"end":3173.728,"text":"臺灣中油股份有限公司一 業務計畫請參閱預算書二 業務收支業務總收入1兆2,121億1,485萬4千元營業總支出1兆2,042億7,291萬9千元稅前淨利78億4,193萬5千元"},{"start":3190.007,"end":3193.389,"text":"3.生產成本請參閱預算書4.轉投資計畫增加投資16億7,552萬1千元5.重大之建設事業595億6,277萬8千元6.資金運用請參閱預算書7.補辦預算固定資產之建設改良擴充27億元"},{"start":3211.417,"end":3237.108,"text":"提案部分第一案產銷營運計畫公安環保及衛生向下環境保護檢列300萬元委員陳亭飛等提案第二案凍結20%委員張家俊等提案第三案凍結8億4千萬元委員鄭天才等提案第四案凍結5%委員邱瑩等提案第五案凍結5%委員陳超明等提案第六案凍結1億4千萬元委員謝一鳳等提案"},{"start":3240.1,"end":3263.839,"text":"第七案 凍結一千萬元委員邱志偉等提案第八案 凍結五百萬元委員賴瑞榮等提案第九案 工業安全檢列五百萬元委員陳廷飛等提案第十案 凍結百分之二十委員張家俊等提案第十一案 凍結百分之十委員蔡易宇等提案第十二案 凍結三億元委員鄭天才等提案第十三案 凍結百分之五委員陳超明等提案"},{"start":3264.58,"end":3279.944,"text":"第十四案 凍結3%委員賴瑞榮等提案第十五案 凍結6000萬元委員謝一鳳等提案第十六案 凍結1%委員邱映穎等提案第十七案 凍結500萬元委員邱志偉等提案第十八案 研究發展 凍結10%委員謝一鳳等提案"},{"start":3283.308,"end":3304.677,"text":"第19案 凍結5億2千萬元委員鄭天才等提案第20案 凍結3%委員賴瑞榮等提案第21案 凍結1千萬元委員邱志偉等提案第22案 失業永續發展計畫 淨零轉型關鍵戰略行動計畫向下探捕捉利用及封存 凍結1千萬元委員陳超敏等提案"},{"start":3305.277,"end":3322.161,"text":"第23案營業收入增列1000萬元委員邱瑩等提案第24案撤案第25案服務費用向下水電費減列1.5%委員蕭一鳳等提案第26案專業服務費減列1000萬元凍結1000萬元委員賴瑞榮等提案第27案媒體政策及業務宣導費減列1000萬元委員張家俊等提案第28案凍結100萬元委員賴瑞榮等提案"},{"start":3333.584,"end":3346.939,"text":"19案租金与利息向下利息冻结10%委员谢一凤等提案30案营业成本劳务成本油气输出费用向下服务费用向下专业服务费冻结3亿元委员张奇凯等提案"},{"start":3348.366,"end":3372.24,"text":"三十一案 油汽輸出費用稅捐與歸費向下歸費凍結一千萬元五元呂玉玲等提案三十二案 探勘費用減列兩億元凍結一千萬元五元賴瑞龍等提案三十三案 減列兩千萬元五元陳亭輝等提案三十四案 凍結七億七千萬元五元鄭天才等提案三十五案 凍結百分之五五元邱瑩等提案"},{"start":3373.36,"end":3383.825,"text":"36案 凍結1億3千萬元委員謝一鳳等提案37案 凍結1千萬元委員邱志偉等提案38案 探勘費用向下服務費用減劣10%委員楊瓊英等提案39案 服務費用向下專業服務費減劣5億元 凍結3億元委員張祺凱等提案40案 凍結5億元委員呂玉玲等提案41案 專業服務費向下委託檢驗試驗費"},{"start":3402.468,"end":3405.112,"text":"凍結1億元委員陳超明等提案 42案委託檢驗試驗費向下國安探勘部分"},{"start":3410.296,"end":3432.708,"text":"凍結20%委員張家俊等提案43案委託檢驗試驗費向下海域探勘部分凍結30%委員張家俊等提案44案其他營業成本向下雜項營業成本向下服務費用凍結1000萬元委員張祺凱等提案45案營業費用向下行銷費用服務費用向下公關慰勞費"},{"start":3433.888,"end":3452.694,"text":"动结300万元委员吕玉玲等提案46案管理费用向下服务费用动结10%委员杨琼英等提案47案服务费用向下专业服务费动结3000万元委员张奇凯等提案48案其他营业费用向下研究发展费用动结3亿元委员吕玉玲等提案"},{"start":3454.536,"end":3469.565,"text":"49案研究发展费用向下服务费用减列10%委员杨求英等提案50案服务费用向下专业服务费减列4亿元委员张其凯等提案51案专业服务费向下技术合作费及权利金"},{"start":3470.305,"end":3487.836,"text":"冻结20%委员张家俊等提案52案专业服务费向下委托调查研究费冻结20%委员张家俊等提案53案员工训练费用向下服务费用向下专业服务费冻结2000万元委员张其凯等提案54案营业外费用"},{"start":3488.837,"end":3516.905,"text":"财务成本向下利息费用冻结10%委员张家俊等提案55案其他营业外费用杂项费用服务费用向下修理保养与保护费冻结1亿元委员吕玉玲等提案56案签建管线经费减列1000万元委员赖瑞龙等提案57案桃园观音藻礁生态富裕及生态补偿冻结3000万元委员吕玉玲等提案58案生态保育基金"},{"start":3517.506,"end":3532.263,"text":"冻结1亿元委员吕玉玲等提案59案冻结1亿元委员吕玉玲等提案60案直接材料人工向下原料向下耗用进口原油成本冻结10亿元委员陈超明等提案"},{"start":3533.401,"end":3561.62,"text":"61案中东地区天然气投资计划向下卡达能源异化气异化天然气公司冻结1亿元委员陈超明等提案62案冻结3000万元委员吕玉玲等提案63案冻结1000万元委员邱志伟等提案64案冻结500万元委员赖瑞龙等提案65案固定资产建设改良扩充减列50亿元委员赖瑞龙等提案66案冻结30%委员张家俊等提案"},{"start":3562.813,"end":3570.132,"text":"67案专案计划冻结42亿4千万元委员郑天才等提案68案冻结5%委员陈超明等提案"},{"start":3570.7,"end":3590.687,"text":"六十九案凍結五百萬元委員邱志偉等提案七十案繼續計畫向下高雄港洲際貨櫃二期大林石化油品儲運中心投資計畫凍結一千萬元委員賴瑞榮等提案七十一案天然氣事業部洲際液化天然氣接受站投資計畫凍結四億元委員張祺凱等提案"},{"start":3594.454,"end":3612.135,"text":"七十二案 凍結一千萬元委員賴瑞榮等提案七十三案 天然氣事業部通宵制大潭第二條海底輸氣管線投資計畫全數凍結委員呂玉玲等提案七十四案 凍結一千萬元委員呂玉玲等提案七十五案 凍結一千萬元委員陳超明等提案"},{"start":3613.136,"end":3621.222,"text":"76案凍結5%委員邱穎等提案77案一般建築及設備計畫凍結3億元委員賴瑞榮等提案78案業務用機械設備、油品行銷事業部向下電動汽車充電裝建制凍結20%委員張家俊等提案79至115案為主決議請參閱宣讀完畢"},{"start":3644.38,"end":3672.739,"text":"好 我們先介紹在場的行政首長我們經濟部的郭志輝部長還有我們國貿署的姜文若署長能源署的游政委署長中小及新創企業署的李冠志署長水利署的賴建信署長產業園區管理局楊伯根局長"},{"start":3674.893,"end":3703.831,"text":"台灣電力股份有限公司徐永輝副總經理台灣糖業股份有限公司吳明昌董事長董事長跟總經理區域委員辦公室報告馬上回來請通知一下我們先介紹在場的委員邱義營委員台灣中油股份有限公司方振仁董事長"},{"start":3707.629,"end":3718.799,"text":"張明總經理行政院主計總處 基金預算處 王沛山科長好 我們再等一位委員"},{"start":3776.067,"end":3805.638,"text":"好 再介紹一下在場委員 賴瑞隆委員 陳庭菲委員我們現在來進行協商 我們先協商非營業基金的部分在業務總收入第一案請先說明"},{"start":3809.874,"end":3832.274,"text":"業務總收入請郭部長主席委員長我們現在開始來報告我們第一項業務總收入要增加"},{"start":3837.782,"end":3856.503,"text":"五千萬 是 這個是我們謝義鳳協委員所提到的那這部分我們有跟委員報告 委員簽名同意 我們是修改成五百萬好 已經簽名了 委員簽名的部分要送過來 馬上送過去好 沒意見 那增列五百萬 沒意見"},{"start":3858.379,"end":3867.58,"text":"照列增加五百萬就增加五百萬然後五千萬現在需要改成五百萬就是第一案總收入"},{"start":3868.669,"end":3896.412,"text":"照原預算增加500萬好接下來第二案到第三案請說明第二案是陳濤明委員他說要增加增加經費那我們也跟委員辦公室報告過委員也同意簽名改成主決議修改文字為提升設置產業用地效益促進土地活化那一塊文字的部分已經我們 潮同意"},{"start":3898.653,"end":3908.157,"text":"第二案你說改組決議嘛組決議簽名的送過來第三案第三案是邱委員這邊所提到的那希望能夠"},{"start":3910.024,"end":3927.561,"text":"增加那個500萬那這一部分我們有跟委員辦公室送到資料那我們是想建議委員能不能修改成文字就是說把那個增加的部分刪掉然後我們來提那個希望我們經濟部來積極來辦理好 請秋瑩委員"},{"start":3933.582,"end":3956.142,"text":"謝謝局長 這個當然你們有來辦公室說明但是我還是想要聽一下 如果說我不爭略我是可以我是可以贊與同意但是就說你們在積極的作為上面現在有沒有一些想法跟規劃可不可以再詳細說明一下像委員報告 就是因為產狀條例有修正條文閒置的土地我們陸陸續續都在公告"},{"start":3958.424,"end":3974.759,"text":"閒置的土地的部分公告完以後我們給他兩年來改善趕快來興建那兩年如果沒有完成的話我們會按照條例的規定予以罰還那罰還在一年之後我們會如果他還沒有改善完畢的話我們會強制辦理拍賣"},{"start":3977.481,"end":3995.026,"text":"那這一塊目前我們已經之前我們有盤過總共有接近300公頃的閒置土地目前我們只剩下大概多少公頃很少了只剩下這個大概十幾二十公頃的土地目前正在積極處理當中"},{"start":3998.669,"end":4026.971,"text":"好 請邱志委員邱志委員我想請教一下那個局長是那個高雄有多少是經濟部開發的這個工業區產業園區除北高雄之外北高雄你收取的租金現在是多少詳細數字是不是我再查一下資料再跟委員報告不用查我告訴你啦"},{"start":4029.286,"end":4043.205,"text":"一坪多少錢一坪多少錢你比照核發核發是高雄市開的核發是高雄市開發的對啦我知道你們收費是比較核發的那你要租金收入多少錢"},{"start":4044.446,"end":4065.922,"text":"你不知道你的同仁跟委員報告我們的原管局所開發的園區目前租金的收取是按照那個公告地價然後乘上百分比啦所以每個地區的公告地價不一樣的話那你為什麼要說比照合法呢我沒有說比照合法我意思說你們租金收入是比照合法啦那你們收入多少錢"},{"start":4068.792,"end":4092.629,"text":"查一下我們現在馬上查一下你接下來還有這個陸族產業園區對不對陸族產業園區我們目前正在努力在跟地主啦或者跟市政府在協調我也希望說除了北高雄之外已經目前我下禮拜會排考察去看北高雄產業園區的這個開發情形跟產商進度的狀況那另外除了"},{"start":4097.352,"end":4111.222,"text":"北高雄之後還有白埔嘛白埔現在市政府希望說做橋科第二期 這個經濟部部長大概了解那我也樂觀其成那原先的白埔沒有那必須要補一塊給傳統產業作為這個產業園區所以我們就選擇我們經過多次的討論選擇陸竹比那個高科"},{"start":4121.294,"end":4139.566,"text":"高科技科、本州電管,差不多有40多公頃這個區位剛剛好,在省道旁邊,然後又離高科教導近,又離未來要開的岡山第二教導又近"},{"start":4140.246,"end":4161.638,"text":"所以大家都引頸期盼希望能夠快速用你們的效率用北高雄財源區的模式趕快讓它來設立完成所以我希望這個部分也希望楊局長能夠盡力全力來推動那我之所以問這個租金"},{"start":4162.879,"end":4191.776,"text":"租金啊 這個有些廠商說認為他們太貴 因為有時候他們租要租三千坪 一千 兩千坪你一坪租多少錢 是不是有可能說能夠著降 好像我記得是知道一坪是一千五啊好像是那個數字啦千塊啦齁 你們同仁應該也了解這個這牧師討論這個你們租金收入啊那你到底租多少錢 你應該很清楚才對啊"},{"start":4192.833,"end":4204.689,"text":"那每一個你們開發產業員去收費的標準都是按照土地公告限值然後再去算嗎是同仁"},{"start":4206.513,"end":4231.818,"text":"沒有啦 那個跟委員報告您提到陸竹那一塊目前是因為還沒有變更所以變更還好啦那個大概有兩三年之後啦對 變更完以後它有加開發成本所以公告地價會上漲開始慢慢進駐了那這個廠商也都很滿意那唯一有一點點的這個問題就是說那個租金能不能不要那麼高特別他們進駐的都是這個傳統產業你說金屬扣件"},{"start":4235.823,"end":4240.209,"text":"而且他們屬於非汙染的金屬擴建所以他們這個在這兩三年這個傳統產業擴建面臨到這個有史以來最嚴重的這個經濟環境所以如果"},{"start":4250.629,"end":4270.794,"text":"你一次又把租金還是一樣那麼高是不是有一個彈性的機制我想問他們有沒有一個彈性的機制租金如果低價高的時候你就高一點然後低價低的時候就低一點我的意思是這樣子不要說在他們經營困難的時候你租金還說那麼高因為那是設定立場權的對不對"},{"start":4273.512,"end":4296.002,"text":"向委員報告就是說陸竹那一塊那剛剛部長也特別指示我們可以比照就之前我們開園區的提006688所以初期的部分對廠商的租金壓力會比較少一點因為前兩年他正在興建當中那後面在營運期那北高雄能不能再試用有有有北高雄已經都在試用了這樣很好對對對好謝謝好請邱議員委員你不是還在"},{"start":4308.019,"end":4309.86,"text":"第二案改成主決議 第三案就增列500萬"},{"start":4330.165,"end":4356.346,"text":"那接下來是第四案請說明第四案也是那個謝一鳳委員所提到的那希望就是我們要來凍結我們百分之十那我們有跟委員幫忙委員溝通過那這一部分的委員已經簽名了請謝一鳳委員到我的五百萬"},{"start":4362.234,"end":4388.423,"text":"謝委員希望是第四案我知道剛才我要講一下總收入的部分因為我也是體恤就是說工業區裡面所有人的就是所有的廠商要配合政府做這些節能減碳還有相關的目標他們都要做一些改善的設施所以當然我們也不要求說你們的收入"},{"start":4388.863,"end":4405.953,"text":"要一直漲他們的租金因為畢竟他們也要配合國家的這個政策那所以要做非常多的就是花費非常多更多的成本在做這些事情那所以我們也不予以這樣子那對於就是說第四案這個部分"},{"start":4406.633,"end":4424.262,"text":"那我們也覺得說只要就是說產業園區對於這個廠商那對於他們未來要再節能或者是用水上面有一些的那個什麼就是說他們要節約用水然後你們會給他家宇服務"},{"start":4425.323,"end":4438.796,"text":"那你們如果能夠對於廠商來做這樣子相關的規劃我們也不會非常支持因為畢竟這些廠商的那個這些廠商的那個我們可以酌量是不是動少一點"},{"start":4440.778,"end":4464.381,"text":"向委員報告目前我們局裡面已經在去年跟今年我們都成立計劃然後組織團隊然後到廠商進場去做輔導那輔導的部分我們會從一般性的輔導跟深入輔導的部分來著手那目前我們譬如說我們以那個節能減碳的部分節煙用電的部分"},{"start":4464.921,"end":4481.114,"text":"那今年度我們編列輔導的家數可以高達大概790家以上那以往啊去年我們只辦了大概200家左右所以今年為了要讓廠商能夠節用電的部分跟節水的部分我們有增加經費來做輔導"},{"start":4482.574,"end":4505.702,"text":"那第二個就是有關於委員所提到的就是說廠商的負擔的部分那如果說在我們輔導能量不足的部分那部裡面還有產發署產業發展署中小企業創新署他們對於業界都有一些補助的申請那我們也會來嫁接這些資源的引進那所以對廠商的輔導的部分我們會全力來辦理"},{"start":4507.793,"end":4533.386,"text":"那我們希望說你們可以協助尤其是我們彰化地區的這些人區那其實那廠家在裡面因為你也知道說最近電價已經漲了兩波那還有一些就是當然我們很擔心未來用水費用等等那所以希望說大家就是你們可以協助廠商對於節水節電還有這些設施能夠盡力去輔導好不好"},{"start":4534.026,"end":4557.416,"text":"好是謝謝委員那是不是能夠建議免凍結然後我們提書面報告凍小一點啦免凍結對不對好是來請謝委員建議五百五百好是好謝委員好第四案凍結五百萬書面報告接下來第五案請說明"},{"start":4558.854,"end":4588.068,"text":"第五案是陳委員所提到就是有關於我們污水廠營運的部分有關於污水廠的部分因為最近我們在推薦那個節水的部分所以廠商的排水的部分確實是有減少那第二個就是我們也對於廠商剛剛有提到就是說我們會派輔導團隊進廠去幫廠商做節水的輔導那節水的部分分製程的節水跟後面排放出來的節水回水"},{"start":4588.628,"end":4614.426,"text":"回收再利用的部分我們都有在做輔導那所以對污水廠來講的話是一個比較嚴重的一個考驗為什麼呢前端廠商的排水減少我們要提升我們污水廠的營運量的部分這一部分我們會來想辦法來增加它的經營那所以我們也想說是不是能夠有一些區外的廢水能夠引進因為污水廠的capacity處理量夠"},{"start":4615.106,"end":4636.522,"text":"那是不是能夠引進外水這邊來增加收入我們會從幾方面來幫忙來處理好 請陳丁飛委員謝謝主席其實污水處理很重要尤其在我們產區 產業園區可是為什麼我們整個績效並沒有我們預期就像你講的 我們量是夠的"},{"start":4637.502,"end":4659.862,"text":"量是夠是超於現在處理的所以才會有這樣的所謂沒有到達目標可是你沒有到達目標你委外由他們去處理你錢也要給他嗎跟委員報告委外的部分我們是不給錢的就廠商是支付盈虧可是你的那你這個左邊列的這個費用呢"},{"start":4660.778,"end":4689.577,"text":"這一部分你代操作費啊我們自己的這是你們我們自己的我知道我是說你這個代操作費那你又有場你又有他們來是我們自己跟委員報告就是說污水廠現在有分兩類一類是我們自己自營操作的那一部分是委外那委外的部分你這個是委託代操作費用對啊我沒有看錯啊"},{"start":4690.579,"end":4694.959,"text":"你這是三座污水處理廠委託帶操作費用"},{"start":4696.342,"end":4722.054,"text":"這一部分跟委員報告這個是我們科技產業園區以前加工出口區科技產業園區我們這一部分是委外操作那目前它的收費的部分我們都達到它的預定值那為什麼會達到預定值因為當初我們在跟廠商簽約的時候是以它申請量來收費不是排放量所以我們收的都比它的排放量的水量的還要多"},{"start":4722.864,"end":4745.083,"text":"可是那為什麼在整個三座污水處理廠你的營運時機還是有偏低沒有達到我們預期的效果是那第二個要跟委員報告就是屏東污水廠就我們有幾個包括中港潭子這一些都它的操作量都夠目前唯一比較操作營運績效不好的話是屏東"},{"start":4746.224,"end":4768.244,"text":"科技產業園區那屏東科技產業園區目前的架動力大概只有4成就是區內廠商排放出來的水它本來就不夠所以它一般來講我們的處理費的部分跟成本跟收益的話要架動力要達到6成以上這個才能夠收支平衡那目前它廠商排出來的水大概只有3成多到4成"},{"start":4769.096,"end":4796.078,"text":"所以只有那個操作率有一點比較低一點那第二個跟委員報告這個是我們試作污水廠裡面所有的委外操作費用那另外我們還有一塊收入的部分因為沒有把它併在一起可能委員稍微有一點誤會那是不是會後我們再提供比如說攬子我收多少支付多少這個數字再給委員那那個主席我這個部分齁我先我凍結這個"},{"start":4798.42,"end":4813.009,"text":"兩百萬然後等他們書面報告完把這個資料整個都給了我們委員會之後我們就可動之好第五案凍結兩百萬書面報告第二案請說明"},{"start":4814.39,"end":4840.586,"text":"第六案是謝委員這邊所提到的就是有關於我們捐補助的部分那捐補助的部分目前比較大宗的是屬於我們電價回饋金的部分那電價回饋金的部分在補助彰化跟雲林離島我們目前有比較大的回饋金的部分是這兩項那是不是就這一部分能夠我們提出書面報告跟委員報告這邊是能夠"},{"start":4842.887,"end":4862.964,"text":"能夠來不要凍結請信一芬委員我是說除了就是說這個捐補助的部分那我們還是提到未來彰化的因為畢竟還有可能就是我們還有新的園區那對於這些再生水的使用"},{"start":4863.624,"end":4881.929,"text":"那其實在其他的地區都已經就是非常的普遍那怎麼樣子協助彰化這一邊能夠在再生水廠來供就是說工業區的使用等等的那我也希望說這個那個懺悔所這邊可以做一個像"},{"start":4885.527,"end":4905.248,"text":"請你們做一個相關的這個園區管理署說一個相關的規劃因為畢竟就是說未來這個用水的問題還有產業缺水的問題都是一個非常嚴峻的一個事情那是不是要盡快的提出來相關再生水場的使用的規劃這樣子"},{"start":4907.312,"end":4922.254,"text":"跟委員報告第一個就是有關於目前這個科目目前我們有回饋金的是只有彰化跟雲林地區因為那個是我們設置大面積的平面型的太陽能板那這部分回饋的部分我們在捐補助的部分我們會給"},{"start":4924.576,"end":4944.264,"text":"縣政府然後再轉播給那個當地的這一塊那第二個就是說委員這邊所提到的再生水的部分目前有關用水的部分我們會積極來規劃使用再生水那目前在水利署也部裡面也特別指示園區開發的部分再生水的比例都有定下來"},{"start":4944.904,"end":4963.816,"text":"那時候我們也在進入在廠商輔導就是能夠盡量使用再生水那是不是有關全面性的再生水的部分的使用的部分是我們會後提報告給委員好那就免於凍結好第六案送書面報告免凍結好第七案請說明"},{"start":4964.898,"end":4975.098,"text":"那第七範圍是委員這邊所提到的就是有關於一樣是污水廠營運的部分那剛剛就是有報告過那是不是能夠比照上一案來辦理"},{"start":4977.439,"end":4995.63,"text":"本席的提案是第七案是針對我們潭子這個科學園區還有台中港的科學園區跟屏東科學園區他們的污水處理廠使用力不到六成那尤其是潭子科學園區還不到三成所以我們希望你對這三座污水處理整個營運的方針作為檢討跟調整來"},{"start":4998.536,"end":5020.686,"text":"來改善這個整個營運的績效 是好不好那這個部分我先凍結一千萬 順便報告好 謝謝委員接下來是第八案到第九案 請說明第八案是有關於楊卓英委員所提到的就是我們園區的土地使用效率的部分那目前就是說因為老園區的部分"},{"start":5021.246,"end":5049.279,"text":"原先的建築的使用容積率都比較低一點那目前局裡面也跟部裡面有呈報一個就是有關於園區改更新改善計畫那目前我們會來把低容積的尤其沒使用的這些廠房能夠盡量協助廠商來拆除重建那予以高容積的部分那這一部分也要需要有一些經費那目前我們科技產業園區的部分這一塊已經先報行政院了"},{"start":5049.699,"end":5076.107,"text":"那產業園區的部分我們最近也跟部長報告過那我們會再循程序來報行政院來辦理是不是這一塊能夠建議我們也跟委員辦公室也報告過那委員辦公室的主任也說他支持啦要問委員不是委員辦公室主任那因為委員還沒碰到面現在請任務委員"},{"start":5077.366,"end":5104.427,"text":"好我的是第9案因為高覽二期的第一棟大樓這個相當重要然後他對於不管是矽谷的對接5G或者是AIC這塊都很重要那我是要求可能這個經濟部要加速在招商跟對於有意願的廠商的積極的投入讓他能夠盡快的新建完成後加快來做一些營運那我是要求凍結50萬要求提出順便報告再行解凍"},{"start":5106.254,"end":5113.298,"text":"好 第8案改組決議等會請委員簽名後送上來然後第9案凍結50萬書面報告接下來第10案請說明"},{"start":5118.103,"end":5144.75,"text":"第十案是邱委員這邊所提到的就是有關於我們工程的進展的部分那這邊的委員是提到就要凍結一趴那這一部分就是有關於我們也是一樣對於廠房的新建的部分就剛有提到就是說我們正在推更新的部分那尤其在南子已經推第一塊那接著會從前鎮這邊再來執行接下來第三波的話就會到壇子"},{"start":5145.59,"end":5162.692,"text":"那我們會陸續的從園區這邊來推動更新計畫那是不是能夠委員能夠建議呢免凍結然後我們提書面報告請求議員委員好那我們就免凍結然後改成主決議好不好好謝謝謝謝委員好第十案改成主決議"},{"start":5165.748,"end":5192.08,"text":"接下來我們處理業務總支出第11案跟12案請說明那11案是陳廷輝委員這邊所提到的就是有關於我們營運中心的績效還有收支結構的部分那也跟委員報告就是因為我們服務中心設在產業園區裡面一般來處理的部分都是有關於公共設施包括道路 公園 路燈等等的修復"},{"start":5193.62,"end":5211.935,"text":"這一塊原先在之前很早以前我們有訂個費率那費率訂定完以後經過多年來我們要去調整那廠商就覺得負擔可能會增加所以我們一直沒有把這個費率結構去做調整那是不是能夠我們為了解決"},{"start":5212.816,"end":5235.397,"text":"服務中心營運上的困難的部分那我們希望就是說我們能開拓其他的財源來預租那目前我們最大的財源就是我們在處理我們的006688土地由租轉購的部分然後來增加基金的收入那這一塊的部分可以來減輕我們服務中心的長期的負擔"},{"start":5236.118,"end":5245.109,"text":"那是不是就是說其他的部分我們對新延區的部分也跟委員報告原來我們是每平方公尺是10塊錢那現在我們新延區已調到18塊就是我把那個"},{"start":5251.897,"end":5272.539,"text":"公共設施維護費的部分有把它調高我們有調整這個結構那會從新園區這邊陸陸續續來調整那如果新園區調整完以後慢慢回頭會來再檢討我們老園區那老園區的部分目前我們有60個產業園區可能要調整的話我們會慢慢的再跟廠商這邊來溝通"},{"start":5274.056,"end":5302.048,"text":"好 請陳地非委員謝謝主席其實我們不是要讓你去調整這個價格啦我們為什麼會提這個就是說在我們整個服務中心的一個經營是應該要更所謂的多樣化然後呢對於廠商的一個互動要更直接其實今天如果我們在地方上的一個量能更大的話那彼此的回饋其實廠商不會計較這些錢"},{"start":5303.909,"end":5317.486,"text":"但是你如果讓他覺得說服務中心就只是一個服務中心並沒有給他很重要的一個這個彼此的一個互動那我相信這個即使我們再加了多少錢大家還是會覺得說"},{"start":5319.281,"end":5342.326,"text":"我根本使用率不高或是反而是覺得我們政府在壓榨所以我會提這個是說我們到底在服務中心而且過去我們還沒有整個組織在做調整的時候我們都是工業局那工業局跟大家的一個直接感沒有那麼重而且現在是北中南"},{"start":5343.186,"end":5356.603,"text":"北中南多了台南台南然後高雄所以我們要怎麼樣我們分屬跟地方有更好的一個直接接觸去擴展你在服務中心的量能"},{"start":5358.12,"end":5376.496,"text":"重點是在這個不是要叫你去調說30元變成17元、38元 不是是說我們服務中心在整個我們所謂產業園區服務中心我們到底要怎麼有價值感呢我們設一個服務中心 它在做什麼"},{"start":5379.15,"end":5396.262,"text":"是不是有發揮到它實質服務我們所有廠商的一個重點如果有時我們雞開一隻都沒有意見但是如果沒有 你就剩下雞 雞太多 雞太多 他都會覺得沒有那一個對應關係"},{"start":5398.563,"end":5413.995,"text":"我意思是這樣所以我覺得說你把我們未來服務中心我們到底要怎麼去經營怎麼去做一些跟廠商之間的彼此互動我要的是這個東捷兩百萬"},{"start":5418.098,"end":5432.472,"text":"提這個所謂的我們服務中心的一個轉型或是服務中心的一個對接怎麼去處理然後各辦公室我們再解凍給委員會再解凍謝謝請新一份委員"},{"start":5435.256,"end":5450.966,"text":"我在這裡也是要拜託本委員會的委員也是未來新的園區管理署的署長就是說這個園區很多像我們彰化非常多的道路什麼什麼的"},{"start":5451.406,"end":5470.116,"text":"都沒有沒有修或者是整個都是需要你們來協助那這個部分是不是大家就是用凍結的方式不要用剪裂的方式因為畢竟我們那些我們長化的園區都非常比較舊那需要修復的然後希望就是說園區這邊"},{"start":5472.077,"end":5500.413,"text":"也是有盡力的去協助啦好不好好 請邱志偉委員請教一下袁局長那個北高雄產業園區現在設立有沒有成立服務中心委員是說北高雄產業園區啊現在準備要已經招商完成了嘛都已經準備要進駐在蓋廠房了未來公共設施這些管理對進駐園區的廠商的服務有沒有要設立服務中心"},{"start":5501.295,"end":5517.712,"text":"像委員報告就是說北高雄園區的部分目前我們已經在籌設我們的服務中心第二個就是服務大樓的部分也準備在蓋了要新建了那第三個就是說剛剛委員都有提到就是說服務中心的功能的部分"},{"start":5518.473,"end":5545.18,"text":"那其實部長也幾次來指示我們雲管局就是說服務中心以後不要只有做那些修馬路修路燈所以我們服務大樓日後的服務大樓的功能的部分會擴充它的多樣性使用包括就是有生活機能或是公托的這一塊的引路那再來就是我們也希望服務大樓蓋起來能夠有人陪的訓練場所的進駐"},{"start":5548.241,"end":5574.338,"text":"市長跟部長 這個都是微中小型企業什麼叫微中小型企業 它的定義資本的一億 員工的數200人所以進駐的這些廠商 基本上是微中小型企業所以這部分 他們有任何 比方說你現在傳統製造業傳統製造業又分很多種 扣件 螺絲 鋼鐵 塑化等等"},{"start":5575.731,"end":5592.239,"text":"那他們面對這個經營環境的改變衝擊他們的這個需求跟很多都不一樣說話有說話的問題 擴建有擴建的問題所以當然提出很多解方 我昨天也跟這個政府院長也討論過"},{"start":5595.683,"end":5601.431,"text":"這個不是一個綜合感冒藥你要針對不同的產業項目去更深入了解他們這個產業需要是什麼"},{"start":5609.523,"end":5634.863,"text":"扣件啦 塑化啦 或者你這個服務業也是一樣如此傳統服務業就是除了金融之外 傳統服務業這個每一個傳統服務業面臨的問題各有不同所以你們應該 這個服務中心啊還要應該跟這個住在園區的所有廠商去充分了解他們需要政府哪些的協助"},{"start":5635.943,"end":5657.902,"text":"而不是說你丟一個整個綜合感冒藥包山包海什麼需要人就人需要錢就錢需要貸款就貸款或者需要技術轉型或者需要進行談判這個每一個產業都面臨著不同的問題我希望你們能夠精準的醫療精準的對每一個產業所以你們要跟這個產業工會比如說塑膠產業工會石化產業工會"},{"start":5662.185,"end":5681.663,"text":"去進體做多座談了解所以服務中心這主要很重要他應該作為你的耳目不是耳目就是說你的深入基層的深入基層去了解產業需求的重要的耳目講耳目也沒有錯"},{"start":5683.318,"end":5698.587,"text":"去探查民意所以不是說你這個一個服務中心只是單純做行政協調而已它要有政策的功能那把產商的問題可以透過服務中心來反映給局長反映給部長以上"},{"start":5699.962,"end":5714.961,"text":"請陳地非委員謝謝主席剛剛就是我們服務中心現在大概就是說比較重視這所謂的一個公共服務然後就是說修道路啊然後這些比較公共直接可是這也很重要"},{"start":5716.092,"end":5737.42,"text":"那重點是你在做這些之前我想以我們台南產業園區來看像上次我剛剛座談現在地方上還有很多公共的需求我們並沒有到位所以這個就是說我們服務中心要怎麼跟他們做一個比較好對接做一些他們真正能夠感受到我們"},{"start":5738.16,"end":5764.425,"text":"服務中心對他們的服務我說真的他們那個園區根本不是政府能夠去碰觸到地方政府所以都這樣一天一天然後這個無論是地啊或是在整個監視系統等等像上次他們就有提到這個問題所以我覺得說我們服務中心應該給他們更多的量能這才是重要的謝謝好請陳昌明委員"},{"start":5770.547,"end":5777.077,"text":"首先我感謝我們產業延期的楊局長在111年、112年你到苗栗會刊了三次到兩次期間"},{"start":5785.83,"end":5808.355,"text":"現在我們苗栗縣那個桃竹苗大溪谷計畫已經行政院核定了剛好你請的地方中了兩個地方我特別感謝你聽說你要退休了退休的話常常到苗栗來我們會好好招待你尤其是以那個當祭祀好不好"},{"start":5809.415,"end":5822.607,"text":"我現在要跟你請教一個問題關於你這個勞務成本的收入是18億5271萬你的成本38億7965萬這麼多你以後20月底以你這樣的專財這個地方怎麼會虧損那麼多啊你給我們報告好了解一下好不好你的勞務收入這一邊"},{"start":5837.067,"end":5855.105,"text":"業務收入裡面的勞務收入的差價錢,勞務成本怎麼提高那麼多,讓我了解一下,因為未來我們的產業延期如果有這樣的缺點,我們就要把它改進了。你這差不多20頁,了解一下。"},{"start":5859.228,"end":5873.053,"text":"向委員報告第一個就是說服務中心以往都只對公共設施做一些管理維護從主改之後在部長的指示下我們對服務中心的能量都有擴充了"},{"start":5873.593,"end":5901.63,"text":"那第二個就是說我所謂的擴充的部分就是剛剛委員所提到的就是說我們要深入廠商對廠商的需求的部分那廠商的需求的部分服務中心的同仁不一定是很了解所以現在局裡面都推動我們有幾個計畫包括就是節能減碳的輔導計畫包括碳盤查的計畫還有一個最重要一個就是一校一園區的我們引進大學的資源來幫我們園區的廠商來做初步的診斷"},{"start":5903.011,"end":5923.596,"text":"所以剛剛也跟陳委員報告就是為什麼我們那個成本會增加就是我們的輔導計畫增加了輔導計畫增加才能夠了解廠商的需求予以廠商更適切的需求的服務那包括就是剛剛邱委員所提到的扣件的金屬的我們就找星空中心或是這些專業團體進來做輔導"},{"start":5926.414,"end":5952.19,"text":"那第二個就是說剛陳委員有提到就是說那個成本支出增加那我們以往以往園區的收入的部分我們有一塊是園區開發出售土地有一些超成本的部分然後來預助基金那我們從那一塊來減輕我們剛講的就是說有一些成本支付比較跟收入有差距的部分"},{"start":5952.89,"end":5976.847,"text":"那現在如果我們改成那個出租為主的時候那所以我們就要另闢財源就是陳委員也提示了就是說我回去會跟我們的團隊再來想一下有沒有什麼可以再來做多元化的經營能夠增加收入那這一塊的部分是不是能夠讓其實裡面的同仁再study一下然後再提整體的報告來跟委員做說明"},{"start":5979.428,"end":5983.575,"text":"好 那我們直接處理11案跟12案凍結200萬書面報告接下來13案請說明"},{"start":5988.318,"end":6014.457,"text":"13案的部分就是有關於我們的出租的土地還有一些土地都一直沒有辦法處理就是我們租給廠商了或是賣給廠商了這一塊廠商都一直沒有蓋那所以剛剛也報告過就是我們對於這些土地我們就依照產創條例46條之一的規定我們來做閒置土地的盤查那從最早的4年前盤的300多公頃"},{"start":6016.238,"end":6021.367,"text":"目前已經廠商陸陸續續在興建當中的只剩下十幾公頃"},{"start":6023.726,"end":6048.501,"text":"十幾公頃的土地目前被列管要刻那個伐環的然後如果今年如果在伐環他還是沒有興建的話明年度我們就會移送那個強制執行所來強制拍賣那對於這個嚇阻作用的部分有很大的促進我們土地的使用的部分有很大的功效那所以委員這邊所建議的部分我們已經陸陸續續在執行"},{"start":6050.422,"end":6074.066,"text":"但是要跟委員報告的就是因為我們要給廠商改善時間所以我們公告閒置土地要給他兩年改善如果說你不給他時間的話他可能也臨時找不到資金或是建築師這邊來興建所以我們期間的部分就是公告兩年兩年之後如果再不興建的話就處以罰還處以罰還再不興建的話我們就移送強制執行署"},{"start":6074.426,"end":6091.036,"text":"那這個程序走下來的話因為最快要到今年底或明年我們就有第一批要移送強制執行了是因為這一項這個經費預算是在這政策性開發不動產的這個服務費那整個園區的管理土地部分"},{"start":6091.596,"end":6118.177,"text":"到了今年的113年的8月還有73.92公頃的土地還沒有租售出去那有租出去的還沒有建的廠商的範圍還有153.37公頃所以我們整個管理局應該要協助企業來使用我們的土地充分使用他的效益出來讓潛在的廠商能夠提升他產業的用地這個標準好不好好那這一案的話我們就凍結1000萬書面報告好"},{"start":6121.06,"end":6121.602,"text":"接下來14案到15案請說明"},{"start":6123.966,"end":6153.432,"text":"事實上是賴委員這邊所提到的就是有關於我們也是一樣就是說土地陳出土地完了以後啊他的使用率的部分那這一塊就剛剛也提到就是說我們對於產創條例對於出租土地或出售土地啊我們都要求他來興建那也跟委員報告就是以往啊我們對於就是說陳購土地的部分啊他的時間啊不是就沒有掌控目前我們是有規定陳出完土地以後要"},{"start":6154.172,"end":6182.092,"text":"譬如說兩年要興建完成 已經給他規定了這一塊的部分我們已經確實帶來執行了好請 區長說明很清楚 其他委員我們再建議照列照列好14案跟15案第15案改成主決議預算照列接下來我們來處理主決議第16案第16案的部分遵照辦理"},{"start":6182.875,"end":6207.703,"text":"好 通過第17案 遵照辦理 通過第18案遵照辦理 通過19案 19案的部分內委員這邊所提到就是說美季要來公告進度那因為我們對於大林埔的部分我們都每半年或一年我們都會在林里的部分我們有公告這些資訊是不是能夠建議把文字美季刪掉就好把美季"},{"start":6208.97,"end":6225.199,"text":"兩個字拿掉好文字修正通過好謝謝第二十案第二十案也是一樣內委員也是要我們掌控這些工程進度美計我們也是建議美計兩個字拿掉好修正通過第二十一案遵照辦理"},{"start":6225.819,"end":6235.762,"text":"通過22案 中照辦理通過23案 中照辦理通過24案 中照辦理通過25案 中照辦理通過26案 中照辦理通過27案 中照辦理通過29案 中照辦理通過30案 中照辦理通過31案"},{"start":6244.345,"end":6265.091,"text":"31案 賴委員是要希望我們能夠對大林埔的部分來啟動這個預登記的部分那因為這一塊我們在千春計畫的部分我們的作業都委託高雄市政府那所以我們建議是不是能夠在文字上請原管局原意在114年上半年度來啟動加兩個字啟動"},{"start":6271.642,"end":6292.513,"text":"好31案文字修正通過接下來我們來處理的是水資源作業基金預算業務的總收入32案請說明我們遵照委員的意見來增加我們的工作來增加收入好32案增列500萬第33案請說明"},{"start":6298.534,"end":6319.993,"text":"主委委員說明我們這幾年的水資源正在大力的轉股所以我們必須要多很多的這個服務費用包括水資源的設施還有包括去年幾次的颱風我們要趕快跟他復旧過來那這個部分有跟賴委員有做溝通了那是不是請求大會給予支持"},{"start":6322.342,"end":6342.512,"text":"33不在就照列了33就他不在就照列委員溝通好的話請你把案子簽名送上來我們就照列好不好你們的作業要這樣子改成主決議的委員通過的你就要簽名送上來那委員有照列預算的你要簽名把他送上來是好我們就會節省時間好嗎好"},{"start":6343.919,"end":6353.424,"text":"第三十三案照列第三十四案請說明第三十四案跟委員溝通之後委員同意改成主決議請出示委員你有跟我溝通"},{"start":6357.776,"end":6359.678,"text":"34案邱志偉委員同意改成主決議接下來處理35案到44案請說明"},{"start":6376.248,"end":6394.225,"text":"基本上我們的服務我們朝著成本降低收入增加的方式那剛剛跟國會委員講我們當然支出的部分有增加是不是一個加薪那多數的委員我們都已經跟他溝通他都同意改成主決議那建請大會予以支持"},{"start":6395.404,"end":6397.925,"text":"多數的委員你要把哪一案說明出來38案 36 38 39 40 39 4040 41還有嗎還有4444案"},{"start":6420.131,"end":6436.783,"text":"好 那署長這些改成組決議你都已經事先溝通了你就必須要給委員同意簽個名要事先送上來那請邱志偉委員這36案我想我應該有簽名我昨天晚上思考半天"},{"start":6439.103,"end":6463.511,"text":"這個部分考慮到你們這個輸菌 水庫輸菌我希望這個能夠有更好的效果包括阿公店水庫包括這個其他的縣市的水庫輸菌的成果我想大家都希望能夠做得更好所以針對這個清淤輸菌的部分 水庫清淤的部分我還是覺得要凍結"},{"start":6465.751,"end":6483.684,"text":"請你們提出更精進的做法數六 凍結 我可以改成凍結一百萬凍結一百萬 你提出一個怎麼樣能夠有效對水庫輸菌讓水庫的蓄水量能夠保持一個好的狀況所以我還是要凍結一百萬好 36號還不改組決定凍結一百萬請陳寧菲委員"},{"start":6490.459,"end":6516.738,"text":"其實因為我比較關心在曾文水庫的一個預計狀況所以其實我們一直很努力我們也看到我們相關單位都很努力在清預可是它的一個清預的狀況現在就是要期待我們這個聯通館完成之後然後是不是能夠有一個比較重要的一個突破"},{"start":6517.839,"end":6531.949,"text":"但是我們還是在原始的這個部分到底我們要怎麼去把它做永續的經營我們還是要有一個方向因為年功還是只是部分"},{"start":6533.911,"end":6554.884,"text":"所以我覺得我是希望說能夠看到我們到底在整個政論水庫我要怎麼把它做一個比較好的強化否則這個我告訴你雖然我們在延緩它延緩它的淤積但是無法處理它目前的淤積量你應該 署長應該懂我的意思"},{"start":6556.105,"end":6576.447,"text":"我們這點的話是在延緩它 不能去改變它現在其實已經是淺盤 淺盤再淺盤的狀況所以每次 我想只要是大雨 這個颱風好大雨我都打電話跟署長說 署長 現在會比較容易讓你們還是要放水"},{"start":6579.929,"end":6592.975,"text":"因為水庫要放水啊可是你知道放水對於地方下游是雪上加霜可是你沒有板子又不行那到底這怎麼辦"},{"start":6594.622,"end":6604.225,"text":"沒水又沒水有水的時候沒飯又不行就因為我們的水庫都變成是淺盤水庫這該怎麼辦啊所以我認為說我希望是凍結"},{"start":6611.207,"end":6619.15,"text":"我希望的是一個完整性的佛祖我每次只要是這個颱風天一下大雨下面的人大來一下就開始好像聽說上面又要放水了"},{"start":6638.475,"end":6640.538,"text":"我覺得這個問題真的是還蠻嚴重的 謝謝好 請清穎委員"},{"start":6646.052,"end":6671.66,"text":"好 謝謝主席我想今天如果談到清淤跟土石銷貨的這些成本水利署這個應該是你們的重要工作之一如何在非汛期的時候加強清淤然後等到汛期來的時候能夠維持不淹水這件事情我覺得都還是要提前作業那剛剛幾位委員談到都是水庫的部分我要談的是"},{"start":6672.6,"end":6695.942,"text":"就是溪流就水利署主管的这些溪流的不管是疏菌或者是沙石的侵蕴比如说像我们这个宝来地区山上的这些沙石其实淤积的非常严重这个对水利署来讲一直是束手无策到底有没有一些更好的方式可以去做可以去进行那刚刚提到那个水库"},{"start":6697.143,"end":6715.703,"text":"清淤的部分我想这个署长我还是要再请教一下就是说你们在台风期间比如说像阿公店水库你们都会预先先放水等到台风来的时候要能够储水可是你们的放水每一次都会把它放到干"},{"start":6717.224,"end":6736.25,"text":"放到那個底盤的土石都露出來然後一直曬太陽那個土石全部硬掉你們要清淤的時候也不好清那對於民眾或者對於附近的居民或者是對於那個景觀來講又很難看那每一次都跟你們說可是我覺得"},{"start":6737.301,"end":6748.339,"text":"可能你們的維護人員水資局就會覺得說我水就把老人家撐起來這樣比較不開心水如果來我就不開心所以我是覺得你的那個"},{"start":6749.659,"end":6774.261,"text":"你還是要比如說你要放水的時候你還是要維持一個低水面嘛保持那個土壤的濕潤度你要清淤的時候也會比較好清嘛你至少你的湖面你的水庫的湖面是有一點水的不是全部乾枯的那個狀態嘛像這個我每一次都講可是你們每一次都是公了就沒了公了就沒了這個可不可以請署長說明一下好不好好先請陳少明委員"},{"start":6780.539,"end":6806.187,"text":"我們水利市那個我們那個市長他們都在講清衣我們不要管不太嚴重但是有幾個地方有樓山水庫大埔水庫雖然不適宜其實那個地方你要替我們清一清雖然不怎麼大但算切水的時候就變成很重要了好不好大埔我現在有一項事情包括柏中寧在這"},{"start":6808.048,"end":6812.82,"text":"大家都不敢建水庫我們苗栗縣中東景縣長說他要建水庫"},{"start":6813.991,"end":6837.691,"text":"但是我們中東景縣長也有去拜訪過我們水利市長,啊拜訪了沒有什麼地方那你要有決心啊,縣長想要做這麼大膽,而且這麼創新的敢做水庫啊你現在要怎麼配合,好像去拜訪完了就沒有什麼具體的效果你不就要跟我們說,要安裝來做,你們預算要怎樣,便利好我們才贏一個"},{"start":6839.008,"end":6847.474,"text":"不然我們真的有時候一坨災進去很熱心,但是我看起來好像你們對於建水庫都很怕你給我回答一下,不然我就亂問了好,請署長回答鄭惠勳回答"},{"start":6860.203,"end":6871.504,"text":"首先 諸位委員的指教對於水庫的庫董的維持跟甚至是回春的這個部分我們都有一個計畫我們會感謝委員的這個督促我們會來加促"},{"start":6872.689,"end":6897.569,"text":"除此之外的話不但是水庫庫容維持剛剛陳委員提到系統性的部分如何調度來促進我們台南包括整個大南部的這個穩定的這個工作隨著真穩南化連通管路在去年完工的通水我們增加了這個水量很大所以一直到農曆過年我跟委員報告真穩水庫都是滿庫的"},{"start":6899.824,"end":6913.824,"text":"這開始這個即便說一起倒做公關這也是一個區域系統性的效果發生那至於委員督促我們的水庫放水的這個策略大概颱風的時候大家都希望我們水庫多放一點水"},{"start":6914.861,"end":6943.127,"text":"可是颱風過後的時候又希望說水庫要滿庫那基本上這是一個需要專業性的一個調控這個感謝委員的這個提醒那除此之外的話邱委員所提到的無論是水庫的清淤或是河流的清淤這裡面我們特別著重在南部特別是在楷米颱風所在的區域剛剛這個蔡議員也帶我們到現場去現勘巴掌溪"},{"start":6943.707,"end":6959.432,"text":"甚至是瀑紫溪這一些的溪流那邱永元所關心的寶萊地區我們在老農溪我們已經有提報行政院有專案計畫在做清淤的工作這個是所移關河川的數據那至於"},{"start":6960.833,"end":6974.954,"text":"陳委員所關心的新建水庫的部分 基本上這個計畫已經通過環評但是因為很久都還沒有實施 還必須要去做一個環境調查我們會在地方支持而對環境衝擊"},{"start":6977.844,"end":6998.284,"text":"可獲得大家的這個接受的一個情況之下我們來全面性的推動我們的所謂的水資源工作在這邊也跟主委報告在大會的這個監督之下我們部長的帶領我們去年的這個清淤量創歷史新高而且還獲得了考試院"},{"start":6999.084,"end":7012.191,"text":"清淤的這個團體獎項 那我們未來還是會持續的朝著這個目標來邁進 而各個區域的發展計畫 水資源的部分都供應無虞 請諸位委員不用擔心"},{"start":7017.446,"end":7039.741,"text":"請陳昌明委員賴市長你剛剛講到天花湖水庫要環境調查是苗栗縣政府做還是你們水利市做我們已經在做了大概多久的時間能完成我們事實上在過去幾年我們在公務預算的部分我們都有編列相關的這個計畫今年也有"},{"start":7040.621,"end":7068.826,"text":"今年有這樣多久的時間你每年都有編列這應該很快就可以完成了嘛今年會有報告做一個規定完成環境調查報告會完成嘛今年完成好 了解好 請蔡議員好 謝謝主席那事實上剛剛這個署長有去講到清淤啦水庫清淤還有包括河川的輸菌它就會產生大量的土方"},{"start":7070.069,"end":7098.112,"text":"所以這個土方去化的問題我這幾年跟藍帶署長我們事實上都討論了幾個月但是後來都會卡在不管是水利署本身或者是在做制洪池的時候涉及到台塘的土地台塘公司本身那因為台塘今天也有在現場常常就是有大量的土方沒有辦法被去化那造成的疏菌侵淤的效率是不夠的"},{"start":7099.096,"end":7119.51,"text":"所以我是覺得說今天經濟部可不可以站在一個比較上位的概念應該要協助這兩個單位包括水利署包括台塘公司我們應該要有一個土方的一個去化的一個方式那尤其是當我們在梅河有一些農民他們的農地可能會農地相對比較低窪那他們需要用土方來墊高他們的農地這個時候我們應該不要再去計較說我這個土方就還要再"},{"start":7130.358,"end":7144.197,"text":"土方還是有價格的這個價格還是要透過拍賣的一個形式當然土方有價格可是我們知道這幾年因為持續在輸進所以土方價格幾乎都是接近0元"},{"start":7147.641,"end":7170.681,"text":"那如果在這樣的情況之下農民或者是其他工部門他在做工程的時候他有需要土方的時候我們就想辦法大家的土給他們用這樣的話造成整個資源是可以大家可以更加不要被浪費而且不會造成這些農民他要土方他又要去別的地方載然後整個土方的市場又很混亂"},{"start":7172.102,"end":7193.357,"text":"所以我是覺得說既然有要做輸菌我們不管是水利署或者是台糖應該要協助最快的時間把土方去化好那這個可能需要一個專案來做一個辦理所以我是覺得經濟部可以用一個比較上位的專案來處理這件事情好 謝謝好 請張家俊委員第37案"},{"start":7217.534,"end":7235.491,"text":"剛剛我執行問過了好幾次關於失禁的土方它的市量非常大現在地方都很困擾困擾在哪裡 失禁的土方到底要擺在哪裡擺在他們的那個垃圾場裡面一下子進去就把垃圾場填滿"},{"start":7237.236,"end":7259.929,"text":"那到底我們能不能設一個看你們水利地還是哪裡別人的土地都不給你用 倒在林間政府又不允許所以失禁的那個土方你除了水庫的失禁我說包括我們野溪或是你們子女的失禁的時候這個土方的堆置一定要有區域不然沒有人敢去標這個問題很嚴重"},{"start":7262.21,"end":7286.138,"text":"那有人跟我提議說真的沒有辦法的話就推到你們那個譬如說在大安溪啦中港溪啦等倒水的來給它沖爪不然沒有地方堆這個問題真的要克服啦如果你不克服雖然你水庫的濕淨增加沉水量但是在子溪的濕淨還有野溪的濕淨上啊"},{"start":7287.438,"end":7311.652,"text":"大家不曉得要如何解決土方我為了這樣花了一個月去解決所以我們中東體縣長把這個責任擔下來所有責任他負責才把那個縣裡的那個縣裡溪的失禁土方整個堆積起來沒沒所在你們失禁現在很夭壽你們把失禁的土方都擺在那個溪的旁邊裡面"},{"start":7313.032,"end":7328.826,"text":"啊現在大姿勢來陰調就叫我們要去看你要看都是這些土方害的你們失禁的時候沒有再走因為沒有地方失禁的工程不貴但是你要維持土方的話那成本很高不曉得要找在哪裡"},{"start":7329.929,"end":7330.329,"text":"好 請張家俊委員"},{"start":7363.302,"end":7386.577,"text":"謝謝主席我必須要講也呼應一下陳昌明委員跟蔡英瑜委員的確是地方上有他們所述的這些問題存在也希望就是我們署長你畢竟是水利專家而且水利經驗這麼豐富可不可以幫我們找一個解決的辦法那這個水資源作業基金我本席提出要凍結20%是因為這個"},{"start":7391.44,"end":7398.341,"text":"這個銷貨成本的編列就是集水銷貨成本編列52.1558萬52億1558萬7千元那這個成本其實叫113年增加了相當大的幅度所以它這個給水的業務收支短缺高達29點"},{"start":7418.266,"end":7442.966,"text":"29億然後9571萬2千元喔然後這是五年來近五年來最高所以也希望說這兩項成本包括說這個修理保養還有保固費用啊包括折舊這個折耗攤提費用這麼高的支出到底是為什麼所以希望說是不是署長能夠做一個說明跟解釋這樣子 謝謝好 請署長再補充"},{"start":7447.873,"end":7463.693,"text":"剛剛主委委員指導首先針對於土方的去化大的策略上面我舉一個例子我們現在跟台廠公司合作在巴掌溪的南岸利用蘇安農場蘇安農場非常的低窪就是要台廠自力花他的成本來做"},{"start":7464.694,"end":7482.686,"text":"農地的改善對他來講也是一個負擔而我這些土方要再出去我自己要發錢所以我們產生了一個很好的模式是我們後來精算的結果我把土方拿去不管是填海造陸或怎麼樣我的成本很高可是我究竟"},{"start":7483.507,"end":7498.603,"text":"在蘇安農場我把它墊高然後甚至排水系統做好規劃這些我們都來做不用台廠來負擔那這樣一來對我也有幫助對台廠有幫助這個就是雙方都有很好的這個"},{"start":7499.985,"end":7527.704,"text":"注意的這個方式那這個也是過去委員會所指導的方向我們現在已經在做落實所以在這邊跟委員說明那除此之外的話水是每個人要用的啦但是我們又不希望說這個水造成大家比較大的負擔我們當然希望我們降低成本增加收入所以我們雖然在114年是短處但是我比113年的短處數還更少一點"},{"start":7528.544,"end":7557.227,"text":"那我增加的一些的這些管理的效能的這個提高那至於剛剛張委員所提到的為什麼說這幾年我們會投資的那麼多第一個是去年連續接連的颱風來造成我們的水庫的設施啊必須要趕快去復旧所以這些我們希望在今年的4月底之前都能完成這個工作第二個部分是過去委員會一直支持我們興建海灘廠"},{"start":7558.368,"end":7573.911,"text":"所以我們要新建海灘廠所以我們編列到114年所以因為這樣子所以我們114年的經費才增加那基於時間還有實際的需求再度的懇請大會來支持我們這個部分的預算"},{"start":7575.367,"end":7586.849,"text":"好委員都支持這部分的預算了現在把事情做好尤其是儲育的工作那也陸續在做了很多年所以在我們先直接來處理35案到44案38案39案40案41案44案改為主決議從35到44我們凍結1000萬書面報告1000萬"},{"start":7607.363,"end":7634.934,"text":"好 接下來45案請說明主委委員剛剛所提示的是我們水資源經營很大的困難的問題這個就需要專業的服務來做相關的這個評估那我們希望我們的水庫是健康的所以我們這個服務的費用畢竟相對於工程的成本不是很大但是期待委員會給我們支持這個部分"},{"start":7636.677,"end":7652.872,"text":"張其凱委員也同意改成主決議 已經簽名我們送到已經溝通好的案子請先送上來第45案不檢列 預算照列我們現在處理46到50案 請說明46到50案的"},{"start":7660.448,"end":7666.888,"text":"這個案裡面 其中48案 49案我們已經溝通了 然後你趕快拿去"},{"start":7669.467,"end":7697.132,"text":"我們現在送到這個大會這邊來那這裡面主要是談到耗水費的部分那耗水費也是大會的支持所以我們在修改水利法我們從112年針對大用水戶來去徵收這個費用那徵收的結果其實對比它對於推動ESG甚至是說委員所提到的它需要用到再生水的這個部分提高水資源的回收率是有很大的這個幫助"},{"start":7698.292,"end":7722.49,"text":"所以我們希望說大會予以支持這個部分的預算我必須要說一下就是說在開米颱風這個期間所有的護岸的工程那水地署要緊迫的完成"},{"start":7723.564,"end":7743.329,"text":"一些其餘的事件你們就要趕快緊述的完成那還有未來的就是說東國西沿岸到那個王宮就是那個海岸線的部分相關的工程你們也應該緊述完成我就是借這個順便說一下好不好"},{"start":7744.229,"end":7758.684,"text":"上禮拜委員所垂詢的包括那個道路的部分事實上我們現在已經報告了那個變道也要趕快緊述完成請清理委員"},{"start":7760.801,"end":7777.978,"text":"謝謝主席我想請教一下這個我上次也跟水利署談過就是說你們在有一些無自來水地區比較偏遠的山區又找不到水源的部分他們其實有一些水權是要跟水利署申請的這些是不是水利署能夠有主動"},{"start":7779.461,"end":7805.345,"text":"積極的比如說去跟自來水公司啊或者是跟農水署去做溝通協調然後讓地方可以有水權去使用那個山林那一卷嘛對不對應該不只山林山林啊甲仙啊很多地方其實靠近藍水堰可是附近的居民是沒有自來水客用又找不到水權喔那這個部分是不是能夠請水利署能夠來協助一下好不好好遵照辦理"},{"start":7808.817,"end":7814.884,"text":"本席就不動之了我可以改成主決議好我們來處理46案到50案47 48 49改成主決議46到50預算照列第51案請說明"},{"start":7826.892,"end":7837.656,"text":"本案經過跟邱委員溝通他已經同意改組決議然後組決議的簽名我們稍後提案委員不在我們就照列好51項改為組決議預算照列"},{"start":7842.897,"end":7850.242,"text":"現在來處理主決議第52案通過53案通過54案通過55案通過56案通過57案通過58案通過59案通過60案通過61案建議說文字最後一行局部的修改"},{"start":7873.017,"end":7901.095,"text":"有關於建請經濟部於一個月內我們建議說再增加三個字建請經濟部水利署建請經濟部水利署對好 陳委員61他這邊有修正文字OK好 61案文字修正通過接下來我們要來處理的是"},{"start":7902.557,"end":7910.868,"text":"推廣貿易基金在基金的用途部分第62案到74案請說明"},{"start":7917.337,"end":7934.43,"text":"主席各位委員62案到74案我簡單的歸類為幾類委員關心的議題第一個是陳委員關心的我們對於傳產產業的相關的輔導最主要其實我們也有跟這些傳產產業"},{"start":7935.791,"end":7963.628,"text":"也有做一些互动已经有约好在下个礼拜会直接的来跟他们面对去了解他们的需求那我们也观察到这些传言产业它其实的网站编列的不错只是缺乏了英文的说明所以在英文的行录部分还有一些影片我们也会做协助另外呢如果有需要的话我们可以协助开设像这个商用英文或者展览英文的"},{"start":7964.321,"end":7984.305,"text":"這些課程那第二大類呢是很多委員有關心我們加入CPTPP包括63案64案66案等尤其是像召委很關心這一次呢我們沒有能夠成立台灣的入會工作小組但是呢我們有觀察到這個在去年11月"},{"start":7984.765,"end":8003.895,"text":"部長及執委會他有發布一個聲明是他會強調不會停止對於其他申請案的考量以及討論所以呢因為這整個案子是由OTN在統籌所以我們也會配合OTN的規劃在持續的跟其他成員國來溝通"},{"start":8006.096,"end":8034.227,"text":"那第三第三大類的話是有關於這個貿易推廣工作是第65案我們這個在出口的部分呢可以很篤定的算今天會公佈全年的出口的數據我們很篤定的話應該是可以連14個月長紅但是呢我們還是會積極的努力帶領我們的廠商到各國去"},{"start":8035.227,"end":8046.476,"text":"參展同時也會洽邀更多的國際的買主到台灣來跟我們的業者做相關的這個媒合的工作那還有委員很關心的是我們的旅運費"},{"start":8049.537,"end":8075.443,"text":"在從111年到113年我們的資訊力未達五成最主要的原因是因為111年還有112年的上半年受疫情的影響很多的活動呢很多的這個會議都是用視訊的方式召開因此把我們整個的這個旅運費給拉下來但是現在已經都回復正常所以114年的部分"},{"start":8075.923,"end":8103.575,"text":"我們可以跟更多的國際的這個來進行交流也有需要到國外去所以邀請委員來支持我們旅運費那最後一點呢很多的委員有關心我們的海外工程的ODA的進展其實現在已經有具體的這個目標過我們在跟對方洽談但是對方基於政治的因素希望我們不要對外的公開所以呢我們基於尊重這個對方國家"},{"start":8104.995,"end":8114.481,"text":"的這個考量所以我們還是會進行相關ODA的這個案子的推動那以上呢是簡單的報告請各位委員給予支持"},{"start":8121.199,"end":8135.187,"text":"我們62案到74案很多都談的都是整個我們的對推展貿易的工作服務那尤其剛好提到就是CPTPP我們在2021年的時候9月份我們就申請加入我們萊豬也吃了"},{"start":8136.848,"end":8162.131,"text":"這個福島食品也吃了那可是我們一直還沒辦法進入CPTPP那我們要向世界來證明我們要解決這個貿易壁壘的這個決心在這一次2024年加拿大所舉辦的這個部長級的這個執行委員會也把台灣來擱置沒有進入所以在這部分的話我們是不是要再努力一些會員國或非會員國或是雙邊貿易等等"},{"start":8163.091,"end":8191.432,"text":"這個部分我們希望我們整個在貿易的推廣上可以再加強這邊給我們做一個明確的一個報告哪些會員國不支持或者說我們要加入這個CPTPP有沒有既定的一個期程因為他們要小組做那個我們加入的一些會議組織都還沒有所以這部分我要請你們做一個詳細的報告給我們書面報告好不好現在請陳迪菲委員"},{"start":8193.973,"end":8196.395,"text":"我們現在先是以協業為主已經約了1月14號那在哪裡"},{"start":8216.026,"end":8235.692,"text":"在台南那你要去跟他們盤整到底說他們所需要的其實他們都很用心很努力其實我都說鞋業如果我們能夠變成一個樣板它可以是一個給很多船產作為一個模範甚至他們一個推動的方向"},{"start":8236.232,"end":8264.895,"text":"所以我們一個產業一個產業做盤整那麼他們才會有信心所以這部分再麻煩我們的署長謝謝好 請謝一芬委員署長那我在想說因為我知道說最近業務推動也不利然後又很多壓力還是簡略要不要"},{"start":8266.338,"end":8293.877,"text":"剪裂一千八你们少做一点啊是不是报告委员因为这些费用呢都是其实是用于厂商譬如说我们在国外要参展的时候要跟国外的买主讲说我们在什么地方有个台湾馆时间日期地点然后呢这些国外的买主才会知道在哪里所以这些其实都是一些帮助我们厂商的相关的费用所以恳请委员支持你看你们那个贸易"},{"start":8294.958,"end":8302.265,"text":"那個講到那個貿易署的他就那個你們部長就不在啊你看他都不維護你們預算刪掉刪掉"},{"start":8304.161,"end":8324.27,"text":"中情委員支持部長都不在 可是他不重視貿易啊對不對他就馬上跑去廟中沒有沒有 部長有跟我請我想說他不重視貿易部長非常重視國際貿易的業務他有重視嗎給他回答一下給他回答一下來 請郭部長"},{"start":8337.935,"end":8360.094,"text":"是部長你有重視貿易嗎非常重視你如果不重視我們就簡略了我們現在是大好的時機啦這個中美貿易的這個改變以後啊那我們增加了對美國跟對歐盟然後對這個亞洲地區的這整個的生產態勢會改變所以我們一定要重視貿易"},{"start":8362.006,"end":8391.284,"text":"那若是有重视毕竟我们台湾的经济都是仰赖出口为主那必须要对于外贸的推广上面要尽力的支持所以希望说我们在推广外贸的相关的业务上面经济不能够真的非常重视谢谢委员支持好那我们就我改冻结谢谢好你改冻结建议"},{"start":8394.12,"end":8410.778,"text":"好 接下来赖瑞龙委员的提案65案好 我们先请邱颖委员"},{"start":8414.329,"end":8435.74,"text":"好 謝謝主席我這個提案是跟我們加入CPTPP是有相關的那我還是想要請教一下我們現在的推動的進度跟您現在可以掌握或者是可以對外說明的進度到哪裡可不可以解要說明一下請說是不是回答"},{"start":8437.381,"end":8453.143,"text":"是謝謝邱委員的指導這是就是在去年的這個11月很遺憾的沒有成立我們的入會工作小組但是在11月的部長級的會議諸委會當中有說明並不會停止對於其他入會申請國"},{"start":8455.065,"end":8473.583,"text":"這個案子的討論那我們其實也了解到其實這個有受到政治因素的考量但是呢我們並不因此會拖延我們申請入會的這個相關的腳步我們要做的方向大概有分為幾點第一個部分呢還是要加強這個"},{"start":8475.104,"end":8493.199,"text":"跟这些成员国官方的接触双边的会议要持续的进行利用双边的会议来争取这个对方国家对我们加入CPPD的支持同时呢像很多的多边的场域例如APEC就是一个很好的场域也可以"},{"start":8493.661,"end":8518.774,"text":"用APEC的場域跟其他的成員國做意見的交換另外一個部分很重要就是要加強產業的合作在CPED成員國很多的國家都是位於這個這個新南向的國家這些國家呢例如說都很有智慧都有智慧城市的需求我們也可以利用產業合作的方式來爭取這些國家對我們支持此外的我們也鼓勵相關的工協會"},{"start":8519.914,"end":8536.14,"text":"跟CPT成員的工協會來進行交流這是我們推動的相關重點的工作我再問一個簡單問題您剛講那個工作小組沒有成立但遊說小組呢比如說你們在跟各國進行"},{"start":8537.875,"end":8558.204,"text":"遊說的部分有成立嗎OTN的話會要求我們其實這個工作是由OTN外交部跟經濟部共同在推動的所以我們也會在這個OTN統籌之下分別就不同的國家還有不同的這個產業別來進行相關的遊說工作以上報告"},{"start":8559.565,"end":8577.844,"text":"好請任委員好謝謝喔這一個部分因為我看到貿易推廣工作有增加了1億多的一個經費那當然我是認同整個持續的推展不管是各項的一些對外的貿易的部分但是裡面還是要請這個"},{"start":8580.627,"end":8600.318,"text":"部長跟署長這邊還是持續的加強 特別是我還是會關注到南部的一些產業的一些活動的部分 不管是在對外的行銷推廣或者是南部的一些策展等等 我還希望署長能夠加強 我知道署長有重視但是要持續加強 那我就凍結一千萬 書面報告再行解凍好 謝謝好"},{"start":8604.438,"end":8631.44,"text":"62案到74案67案跟73案改成主決議我們全案凍結一議書面報告接下來75到77案請說明是75到77案是有關於幾位委員有關心我們這個海外工程"},{"start":8632.233,"end":8659.599,"text":"贷款的这个补助利息补助的计划推动的进展刚才有说明现在其实已经有具体的个案在进行当中但是对方的国家基于政治的考量希望我们不要对外公开那实际上我们跟对方的国家已经就像融资还有公共工程推动的方式现在都在进行这个协商我们也希望利用这个ODA的"},{"start":8660.379,"end":8676.185,"text":"案件呢能夠讓我們的工程業者能夠進入這個國際市場來增加他們的時機那以後呢他們就可以這個承辦更多的國際的工程案件以上說明請賴樂隆委員77案"},{"start":8689.908,"end":8716.942,"text":"這個部分因為過去以來都無意的一個編列但是都沒有任何的執行那我覺得還是要請國防署這邊還是要持續加油就是說新南向現在很重要那很多的海外的一些公共城其實我們也希望既然每年在編列應該要努力去做執行所以這個部分我一樣先做凍結一千萬那希望能夠鼓勵也請署長加油好不好是"},{"start":8717.782,"end":8720.865,"text":"好75案到77案凍結1000萬書面報告接下來78案到89案請說明"},{"start":8730.769,"end":8753.715,"text":"跟委員會報告有關於78案到89案這有關於能源基金的部分那我們可以把它歸納成幾個部分來跟大家做說明那第一個是有關於張其凱委員關心的有關部分的縣市有跳電的情況那這個部分台電公司已經有電網強韌計畫會做相關的一些電網的改善來減少這個跳電的情形"},{"start":8754.255,"end":8776.705,"text":"那另外委員從80到88這邊很多都是有關於節能政策的一些對我們的一些建議包括說對服務業的節能成果所以要持續的加強那這邊也做一個報告我們整體的能源成效在過去5年大概已經提高了5.4%那以非製造業以這個服務業來看的話但他的用電的一個"},{"start":8777.265,"end":8792.297,"text":"節約大概也降低了1.34%所以這邊已經有一個持續的成果那另外委員關心的做要持續的推動X口來做深度節能部分我們在計畫裡面也有編列的相關的預算我們會持續的來推動深度節能"},{"start":8792.813,"end":8822.253,"text":"那另外針對這些節能政策應該持續的推廣讓我們廣大的民眾能夠了解的部分我們也會透過我們的廣宣計畫來讓我們的廣大的社會跟企業來了解那另外針對於人民使用效率的部分那謝委員特別也關心到說相關的執行成效應該做一個適當的揭露那這邊我們在這個基金的相關的執行成果也都會依照規定送到國家圖書館以及我們的經濟委員會這邊那另外委員大概也關切到一些廢熱的回收計畫"},{"start":8823.133,"end":8845.53,"text":"那過去的執行率在疫情期間確實是有比較降低因為大家有減少資本支出的關係那我們看到去年113年這個執行的情況已經有所回升了所以這個廢熱的部分已經開始有慢慢的回升這邊請委員來支持所以中整起來大概有關於那邊基建的部分做整體的綜合說明請委員支持好 請邱營委員"},{"start":8847.486,"end":8862.431,"text":"好 謝謝主席這個關於我的提案92案講到那個廢熱的部分謝謝局長剛剛談到這兩年已經有回升你現在回升的幅度是到82對不對 112年度那未來預期呢我們預期到"},{"start":8864.712,"end":8893.792,"text":"應該可以達到九成以上沒有問題因為我們最近在跟這個廠商做宣導的時候大家也有感受到這個節能減碳的必要性那費熱費冷的回收的話就可以針對他的結緣人員以及達到減碳的效果所以會持續的提升所以你預期到九成以上是一百一十今年度會到一定會到九成以上甚至可能會可以達到更好的結果OK好那我就我就把它改成署決議我就不凍結了是謝謝委員"},{"start":8895.356,"end":8902.039,"text":"我們經濟部在推廣綠能的時候其實我們的陸域風機它的效率其實是比較少的在彰化縣我們已經有非常大的離岸風電的暗場了"},{"start":8916.587,"end":8944.336,"text":"但在陸翼風機的推廣上面是不是對於太接近民宅因為會有眩影以及太接近就是說養殖區會有可能產生的低頻噪音的相關的影響那我覺得經濟部應該要一併的考量在推我們在推再生能源的時候那必須要有效率的去推動這些事情當然還有一些就是漁電工生不要發生就是像嘉義縣這個情況"},{"start":8946.196,"end":8965.76,"text":"我們在推廣再生能源以及未來的能源政策的時候必須要有一個非常縝密的相關規劃不然第一個我們的發電成本過高對於企業他們所需要的綠電也沒有太大的幫助"},{"start":8969.381,"end":8996.161,"text":"就這個部分我可以不要給予你們刪除但是你必須要提出一個完整的專案報告給委員會那委員會才能夠針對就是說我們未來能源政策的規劃那相關的那個就是要應該要就是我覺得這是對國家非常重要對經濟也非常重要的事情我覺得經濟部能源署應該要提出一個相關的規劃出來好請陳廷飛委員"},{"start":9007.449,"end":9022.361,"text":"我們現在都要求各廠商一定要去做一些相關的節能減碳的一些動作可是我覺得我們的方式跟我們的處理讓廠商會有一點覺得我們只是為了罰而罰"},{"start":9024.122,"end":9050.723,"text":"因為我們現在好像是會比較他如果說在前年度在整個節能的狀態沒有那麼優的話可能我們會給他一個提醒然後甚至會做一些處罰的動作這會有問題啦我覺得我們應該是要怎麼輔導他們怎麼做到真正節能減碳他們要做是不要做不知道要怎麼做"},{"start":9051.343,"end":9079.206,"text":"那你今天就說這個要求他們要達到什麼樣的一個標準那如果沒有達到的話可能我就要去做什麼樣的一個這個所謂罰款的動作那有意義嗎罰了之後又怎麼樣罰了之後還是一樣沒有減能減碳呢好 我們的目的是希望他能夠減能減碳不是罰可是現在讓廠商的感受是你是為了要換我"},{"start":9082.026,"end":9098.802,"text":"我事實上也沒有辦法去達到我想要達到的所以我們到底有沒有這樣的一個協助平台那誰要去做是台電嗎還是你們到底誰來做這樣的一個窗口對於廠商的節能減碳這個部分"},{"start":9100.987,"end":9127.379,"text":"前面的農委員好 我的83案一樣我認為現在的這個預算其實看起來是有增加包括結算跟決算比也都增加了包括7000 將近8000萬跟將近1億多那為所關切的也是我們能源的開發其實一直都很努力在做但是節電我認為也很重要節能這一塊還是要持續的來做一些努力"},{"start":9128.599,"end":9144.648,"text":"我覺得特別是一些深入節能推動工作這個我當然是支持啦也希望能源署這邊加速來推動所以我是凍結150萬也希望提疏運報告更完整的一些方案出來也希望達到更大的成效讓節能工作做得更好"},{"start":9145.523,"end":9170.713,"text":"好 節能減碳的部分的話我們也希望透過這個輔導的方式來協助廠商可以導入一些節能的技術讓我們的不管是產業也好或是民生用電也好都能夠做節約用電所以我們希望能源署能夠針對節電的這個效率能夠重新檢討來提升整個產業的節電成效好不好那我們就來處理78案到89案"},{"start":9173.914,"end":9199.594,"text":"在80案86案89案改成主決議我們全案凍結500萬書面報告這個主席我再補一下我88案部分就一併了我也是要再提醒一下一些政策的宣導工作還是要持續推動不要讓能源政策或一些受到了這個一些錯誤的訊息的影響我還是希望署長社區要加強你的88案是改主決議是嗎"},{"start":9200.84,"end":9211.831,"text":"沒有我這個是動啊所以我是78案到89案對我只是提醒說一併併進去一併都有一定提醒一下能源署是好那就78案到89案凍結500萬書面報告接下來90案到92案請說明"},{"start":9218.716,"end":9247.596,"text":"跟委員報告90案到92案在委員關心的其實我剛剛在整體說明裡面大概也談就有關廢熱廢冷的這一些回收的計畫過去是有執行不如預期那跟委員報告就過去疫情期間確實廠商投資相對比較少那現在已經這個他們慢慢的這個隨著景氣以及對這個減能減碳的重視所以這個廢熱廢冷的這些相關的回收的部分廠商參與已經有提高了以上報告好 請謝一鋒委員你有提案"},{"start":9250.199,"end":9268.78,"text":"但是我覺得其實還是要增加效率啦就是說因為畢竟我們現在沒有就是說沒有往節能的方向然後或者是沒有增加發電量的話那對於當然國內的用電以及成本的增加都不是那所以我覺得我們還是我還是凍結1%好不好"},{"start":9286.089,"end":9296.074,"text":"主席,這我剛講過了,我就不凍結了,改組決議就好了"},{"start":9306.448,"end":9332.496,"text":"再說明一下 新一份委員的提案好我剛剛針對委員的剛剛有在推詢我綜合做一下答覆那有關再生能源的部分 那陸域風機其實我們現在跟環保署大概那個環評標準有加嚴了所以現在是到500公尺大概就要做環評透過環評的制度來看到底對環境有沒有影響那要總體規劃的部分我們大概也主要因為土地來源在主要根據農業部所以我們現在跟農業部有在"},{"start":9333.656,"end":9342.809,"text":"研擬這個相關的一個快篩的機制第一個避開生態敏感區避開這些環境敏感區然後針對可以做的部分我們把它盤點出來採用這整體規劃的方式來做處理那剛剛那個"},{"start":9348.772,"end":9375.522,"text":"陳委員所提到的確實對那節能的部分跟委員報告我們現在才不會馬上針對他沒有達標就開罰我們會先用一個限期改善的方式那我們輔導團會進去先讓他改善其實目的確實是要讓他改善不是要罰所以我們如果說發現沒有達標我們限期改善然後去輔導輔導的結果如果他還沒有達標才會有後續的處罰那也會持續的輔導這個部分是我們現在採取的一些做法市長事實上並不是這樣啊"},{"start":9378.984,"end":9393.735,"text":"我會這樣子講就是大家收到你們的這些法案你沒有辦法配合你們節能的這個標準標的大大小小案例非常多你沒有辦法每一件"},{"start":9395.339,"end":9419.275,"text":"你大的可以那種小的你沒有辦法說你們輔導團第一時間就可以去協助然後呢你們就可以給他很多的方向不可能你們沒有那麼多人力啦我針對800以上的大用戶啦800以上的大用戶現在是有一些我們的這些中小企業也都收到你們相關的資料"},{"start":9420.675,"end":9443.45,"text":"這個做法我們再來做檢討我們目的還是先輔導到地方就是來做說明或者是來輔導我們來安排跟地方政府因為地方政府也跟我們一起做檢討那就是到地方來說明那我們就凍結少一點好90案到92案凍結1000萬書面報告"},{"start":9448.237,"end":9476.2,"text":"接下來是93案到99案 請說明好 93案到99案這一邊其實後面的題目帶也有些會有重複那委員主要關切的會包括幾個大的項目那第一個是有關於電動車 電動機車的一個推動那電動機車的推動也需要一些環境的配套跟這些相關的一些充電設施 充換電站設施的一些配置"},{"start":9476.54,"end":9496.935,"text":"那這部分我們產發署大概在今年有一些比較好的一些輔導計畫會來做推動所以在電動機車的部分會來做一些加強跟改善那另外是委員另外關心的一個有關於我們定制型燃料電池的一個示範獎勵計畫那在過去的疫情期間確實也是比較少"},{"start":9497.475,"end":9511.611,"text":"我們現在看到定制型燃料這樣的一個技術也開始成熟所以針對定制型燃料的這個推動計畫目前看起來廠商申請的情況也開始都熱絡起來我們覺得這個在未來可以來做大力的一些推動"},{"start":9512.472,"end":9531.163,"text":"那另外在謝議員這邊談到說這個新興計劃跟延續計劃註明這部分那我們現在是針對新的計劃大概都有註明的那延續計劃當然我們就沒有特別去想但是新計劃我們都會把它註明出來那以上針對這個到99案的部分做簡要的說明"},{"start":9534.241,"end":9551.529,"text":"好 謝謝主席 我兩個部分請教一個就是在本席的提案第105案就是你們那個在整個電動車的現在是93到99好好好 那我等一下再說好 請謝一芬委員我想"},{"start":9552.506,"end":9570.831,"text":"我想請問一下 美國現在宣布要跟Toyota等等的車廠進行下一階段 下一世代的電動車那下一世代的電動車到底"},{"start":9573.152,"end":9597.55,"text":"目前的產業規劃是什麼那我們要怎麼做那這個部分你們是不是要進一步的說明一下給委員會知道那這樣子我們才對於就是說我們能源石油基金的相關的這個產業我們可以就是說給予你們凍結少一點那不然的話你們沒有提出下一世代對於我們所有電動車產業相關零組件的"},{"start":9601.013,"end":9606.568,"text":"這樣子相關的規劃的話那我覺得對於我們的預算好像也不能夠那麼輕易的放過請內論委員"},{"start":9612.537,"end":9637.882,"text":"好我先提一下就是有關於這個石油經濟媒體跟業務宣導費一方面是我還希望持續的加強宣導特別是一些安全的一些設置的部分那另外一方面我還是希望還是提醒這個整個政策上面還是要多多的加強在更多能源政策上就是除了這個以外的能源政策上還是要持續做宣導好不好我一樣凍結50萬說明報告再請解"},{"start":9644.073,"end":9652.589,"text":"我們這邊提案的委員很多都是簡列陳廷飛委員的部分也有簡列的部分"},{"start":9657.011,"end":9677.072,"text":"那有沒有針對我們陳廷飛委員檢列部分針對那個陳委員關心的是有關於家戶設置太陽光墊那確實太陽光墊在設在屋頂是目前台灣比較能接受的方式那我們現在目前的累積累積的設置量也達到8GW以上確實這個是值得在做大力的推動所以我們在"},{"start":9677.872,"end":9696.097,"text":"最近也在去年底的時候也到行政院提出了一個鼓勵小屋頂的這樣的計畫那同時在法規上也針對未來的新建屋頂也都強制的要來設置相關的屋頂太陽光墊所以針對家戶的這個屋頂太陽光墊我們會持續的加強力道來做推動以上的說明"},{"start":9699.768,"end":9712.559,"text":"其實這個加護的太陽能光電板是一個未來趨勢可是就是說到底我們在整個政策性要怎麼這個好像我們速度太慢了"},{"start":9713.583,"end":9742.444,"text":"各位報告就是剛剛我剛剛說明了說第一個小屋頂的現在的潛量比較大所以在去年底我們在行政院有做一個報告我們會來做這個獎勵的動作來鼓勵這些還沒有設置的小屋頂小屋頂的部分加速推另外透過法規法規我們修法之後就是對因為你這些其實都是你未來在整個能源政策當中其實這個才是最真實的自己自主的方式"},{"start":9743.416,"end":9758.614,"text":"是在那個屋頂新建建物的這個部分內政部已經完成草案那也有好多次的利害關係人的會議那應該在近期應該他們會提出預告的草案的一個預告這部分的相關執法由內政部負責在擬定"},{"start":9759.255,"end":9787.177,"text":"我覺得我們應該是站在一方面是鼓勵限制但不是強硬的我覺得我們是民主時代不是你我一定要強硬你怎麼做然後不怎麼做又怎麼樣我覺得應該是要朝向說我鼓勵鼓勵獎勵然後呢如果能夠大家共同加入到我們這個所謂的自給自足的所謂太陽能的一個這個綠電的行列我們可以用怎麼樣的一個幫忙的一個"},{"start":9788.197,"end":9805.303,"text":"處理我覺得這比較重要然後還有就是說你們那個潰線潰線的部分雖然這個太陽能光念這個自給自足的不需要潰線可是如果比較亮大的他還是需要潰線那潰線夠不夠有沒有跟台電去盤整"},{"start":9807.885,"end":9834.139,"text":"匯線的部分台電的台電的他們的輸配電部門其實是有做針對熱區有做相關的盤點所以在過去配合離岸風電跟太陽光電他們都有相關的加強電力網的這樣的一個計畫來提供這樣的一個匯線那至於這些小屋頂的部分都是用配電系統配電系統它如果可以的話就用並鏈線的方式處理所以我說小屋頂是OK小屋頂是OK像是說如果那個面"},{"start":9835.78,"end":9863.018,"text":"因為它的容量比較大的你就勢必一定是要有虧線那這個虧線到底夠不夠它基本上都已經被佔滿了那你在鼓勵這個部分它沒有虧線根本就沒有用我是提醒你啦在地方上可能會遇到這個所有漢格的問題沒有虧線你在做怎樣的一些光電的推動都不好沒有虧線都不好謝謝"},{"start":9866.121,"end":9866.462,"text":"請陳昌明委員"},{"start":9875.583,"end":9898.419,"text":"那個我們的游市長特別注意一下我每次坐車子都在觀察我發覺台北市新北市六都的都市裡面你們這個家戶屋頂設置的非常好大樓很多我仔細看過好像沒有看過大樓上面去設你們這個家戶型的屋頂"},{"start":9899.92,"end":9921.771,"text":"這個太陽能發電,尤其在臺北市跟新北市最多,你們都往城上去,透天室去蒸,大人也要去蒸,那都好怕人家住,你們都沒有部長,你坐車的時候,如果經過高架橋,你仔細看一下,所有屋頂幾乎都沒有裝,說到大廈,到時我們就去鄉鄉市,叫我們城市的人一直發電給你們用"},{"start":9925.829,"end":9941.911,"text":"至於像這樣的情形你去看台北市的大樓哪裡有一棟在裝太陽能的啊講得滿天都是先由都市來做示範給我們鄉下人看啊好不好"},{"start":9944.259,"end":9961.381,"text":"我剛才問的問題那個杜蘇拉沒有回答那廠發組說明一下目前在電動車的產業發展因為我們在電動車在除了電動化之後後面一個重要的是智慧化部分像我們博鳥還蠻多ICT廠商目前其實在這一塊著墨非常的深像比如說面板的廠開始往"},{"start":9961.821,"end":9984.867,"text":"像車用面板或是像智慧座艙這些機台都已經打到這些全世界車廠裡面不管是油車跟電動車他都需要這些東西所以我們也一直在支持這一項這樣的一個項目那包含像一些系統跟運行部分我們希望透過台灣這些補助啦練兵練完之後就可以到國外去不是不是你們都著重在那個ICT的部分其實我們有非常多的中小企業傳產的"},{"start":9986.868,"end":10000.441,"text":"就是汽車零件的相關業者那在這一波裡面你們也應該把它變成一個就是相關的供應鏈不然他們因為電動車有可能造成他們就是出口就減少"},{"start":10001.502,"end":10019.822,"text":"那怎麼樣子你們能夠就是說把他們也帶上去有沒有這樣子才不會讓傳產的這個汽車零組件的這些廠商你們都你們著重的都只有ICT也不對啊是不是是 報告委員我們這邊是有那個捷爾就像剛剛講智慧座艙就要捷爾以前我們做傳統座椅這樣的廠商"},{"start":10021.523,"end":10048.553,"text":"信艙全新這一些它就結合面板把它變成智慧座艙這個有出去那包含有一些傳統的一些比如說保險桿它要裝一些sensor這個地方包含aftermarket或是那個東洋我們都有協助他們跟電子廠去做結合賣到國外而且訂單都有拿到還要包含LED燈也是一樣我希望說就是經濟不可以重視這個部分就是能源處也要特別重視不要只重視半導體對於傳產的這些中小企業你們也應該要一併的重視"},{"start":10053.404,"end":10059.906,"text":"好我們現在就來處理93案到99案94案改為主決議93到99我們凍結1500萬書面報告經同意使得凍資接下來是100案到106案請說明"},{"start":10075.288,"end":10092.149,"text":"好 100案到106案這中間代委員帶有關切到有關於我們電動機車普及率偏低然後我們過去編列的石油基金補助電動機車的補助加速偏低那這部分產發署這邊有一些因應的作為待會進一步的再做說明那"},{"start":10093.05,"end":10105.978,"text":"另外在剛剛有談到的那個定制型燃料電池因為剛剛也已經有做報告定制型燃料電池目前已經技術比較成熟所以這部分我們預期未來會達到我們預期的目標那另外"},{"start":10107.113,"end":10126.257,"text":"另外在有關於這個相關的業界能專的部分我們大概也過去在執行率比較偏低的情況也是跟廠商的申請有關那我們現在也看到很多新的技術陸續的在出來所以業界能專申請的情況目前也看到都廠商都比較踴躍的申請這部分我們會來繼續的來加強推動那有關那個電動機車的部分我已經採訪署來說說明"},{"start":10131.998,"end":10154.238,"text":"那電動機車部分因為考量因為在機車部分還是以價格為因素所以我們在購車補助還有設站還有在機車場的訓練上面大概會做幾個政策上面的一個加碼像比如去年來看充電站不太夠的部分我們在我們的補助辦法裡面有提一個方案上去希望把這個補助的金額往上提升有一點像30萬提升到60萬"},{"start":10155.419,"end":10178.892,"text":"那機車補助的部分因為過往也希望因為燃油機車過往在做市場競爭他也有下個優勢所以我們在電動機車部分也用相關的太舊換金的方式還有結合像我們產源局在做開發園區的時候他有太舊換金要去那時候要抵換這些空污跟稀有度他有加碼像雲嘉南地區他就有加碼4000塊每台車的一個部分那站的那個站跟"},{"start":10179.432,"end":10201.79,"text":"那個車子講完之後那還有機車場輔導因為機車場這邊重點還是在於他的基本的維修技能那當然我們會再教他一些他們比較需要一些勞動法規或是消費者糾紛這些所謂的期款的一個部分來做一個加強讓後續如果像消費者買電動機車多包含修理或是在做尾運或在做生意是可以很大的幫忙以上說明請請議員"},{"start":10207.912,"end":10216.782,"text":"好 謝謝主席我現在要請教的是在104案現在講到104案了嗎106那個104105 對不起本人的提案跟那個10就是你們在那個"},{"start":10228.527,"end":10249.107,"text":"定製型燃料電池的這個推廣計畫裡面可不可以再更進一步說明你這個大概是都是在大型的中大型的工廠還是所謂的定製型燃料就是所謂的儲能設備它其實它是一個發電設備"},{"start":10251.69,"end":10275.658,"text":"它是一個發電設備就是說我們用這種定制型燃料電池它一般可以運用在工廠或像醫院或飯店那這種情況它可以用一個定制型燃料那我們現在比較成熟的技術比如說它可以用天然氣當作燃料之後它可以自己做發電然後同時可以產生熱水所以像飯店或是像醫院其實就很適合這一種那現在的技術比較成熟所以廠商開始"},{"start":10276.518,"end":10302.372,"text":"陸續的都有投入到所以你這個是補助給廠商還是補助給申請使用的這一些比如說醫院或者是就是他們的就由醫院或是由這個工廠他們來申請補助那我們每K瓦是經過審查他好的計劃我們每K瓦大概補助五萬到七萬那這部分會包括他的設置費以及後面的一些染料的一些染料的一些補貼的部分好OK 了解請新一份委員"},{"start":10304.259,"end":10331.845,"text":"對於國內的相關的電池的廠商那是不是大家已經有足夠的就是量能以及或者是需要到就是說現在外國呢外國有沒有缺掉的情況那不然的相關的補助對於這個我們相關的業者如果要申請的話那也是沒有辦法去協助就是會變成就是供過於求對於這些電池的部分那是不是你們對於這個相關的有做一個進一步的"},{"start":10335.698,"end":10343.228,"text":"統計您提的那個電池是講車用電池嗎還是講你們現在是機車嗎現在大家在講機車或者車用電池這個部分"},{"start":10344.073,"end":10369.822,"text":"好 那產化署說明一下 目前電池現在目前像鴻海跟台塑都有在那個高雄跟彰化都已經生產 投產大概1GW以上的電池芯了 目前我們都在沒有他跟整車廠去做 我們有像比如說中華汽車或是鴻華智捷電動巴士 通常我們拉發去車上去做測試 最快今年年底就可以看到這些有公產電池芯的車子在路上跑所以我們會去 每有整車廠跟電池廠去合作 把它的數量"},{"start":10371.323,"end":10387.678,"text":"那充電站的部分是你們做還是中友做目前是業者去做新建讓我們給他做補助剛我提到說我們本來補助30萬一座最高我們要拉到60萬我們是希望業者去做然後服務消費者好謝謝請求議員委員"},{"start":10392.22,"end":10405.35,"text":"謝謝主席我再請教一個問題就是說我們在講到那個電動車的普及率的這個部分到113年7月底為止我們的電動機車普及率大概不到4%我想請教到底電動機車"},{"start":10407.071,"end":10419.223,"text":"的推動這件事情還會還是不是政府的一個重要的推廣政策這是第一個第二個是如果是的話那對於電動機車的業者我們應該給予什麼樣的"},{"start":10424.226,"end":10452.156,"text":"輔導跟協助因為最近有一些比如說像Gogoro的經銷商啊什麼的因為車輛的銷售數急速下降導致他們在銀行的貸款的部分被抽銀根那當然銀行就會覺得說這個已經好像不是政府要主動推動的一個政策方向所以我想請教一下能源局在這一方面的布局跟整個政策面到底是怎麼樣"},{"start":10453.615,"end":10472.997,"text":"好 謝謝委員 那懲罰組這邊做一下說明 那電動機車當然是我們要持續推動的一個政策 畢竟它又是庶民經濟又可以減碳那再來是剛才提到的說 相關的機車廠他們有些困境 我們大概都有去做過盤點最重要的原因還是在於說 現在目前的換電站的數量不太夠 因為業者要投入這些換電站都需要花蠻多錢 所以"},{"start":10473.798,"end":10498.622,"text":"我們先從源頭開始補助他比較把他的那個補助的增加那第二個是說我們在相關的像購車補助的那個金額我們也試圖做一些提升那當然在機車行本身的部分除了讓他有車子可以賣之外剛才提到有些銷售跟金額銷售的一些技能跟那些技能我們都跟他做支持我們都有在跟這些車行的全聯會做一些溝通但去年跟前年狀況比較特殊是因為"},{"start":10499.162,"end":10519.046,"text":"燃油車它有一些比較促銷競爭的一個情況讓整個市場有一點電動車賣得比較不好所以這邊我們都有在做滾動式的修正把這些支持力道增加上來以上好請陳昌明委員你這邊的凍結沒意見好那我們現在開始處理100案到106案我們凍結1000萬書面報告"},{"start":10531.294,"end":10552.502,"text":"接下來是107案 請說明好 各位委員報告其實107案 楊委員關切的也是電動機車補助的加速低那我們剛剛已經做了說明是不是可以併到好 107案改成主決議 預算照列接下來是108到112案 請說明"},{"start":10556.391,"end":10573.66,"text":"好 108到112這個是有關於再生基金那再生基金這邊在這部分主要委員關切的是有關於再生能源的推廣就是我們目前的一個再生能源的一個推動佔比那我們預估到今年大概是百分之到2025年大概會達到15.2%"},{"start":10577.122,"end":10606.393,"text":"那另外委員關切的是說我們的再生能源發展不要只集中在風跟光這部分應該要做多元的發展那另外委員關切說光電案場未來如果有改建的時候應該要採用更高效率的這些光電板那這邊做一個簡要說明就有關有關於再生能源的部分但我們還是會朝向這個多元綠能的方式去推動除了既有的成熟的風跟光之外針對一些新的再生能源比如說像"},{"start":10606.813,"end":10630.532,"text":"地熱水力生殖能等等這些大概我們也都會持續的來做推動那另外像光電暗場確實他在20年到期之後他如果原地的來做一個改建的時候當然會採用當時20年後的一個最新效率的這樣的一個光電板他可以用同樣的面積可以發出更多的電力這個也是我們未來在做這個更新汰換的時候會來注意要求的那以上的說明"},{"start":10633.213,"end":10653.861,"text":"在這方面絕對是一個重要的能源政策也就是一個對的方向但是其實在執行面上面當然會出現一些問題特別是地方的執行但是我認為整個整體上面的政策能源署這邊還是要加強做說明跟溝通跟宣傳所以我要求凍結100萬提出報告我希望"},{"start":10654.481,"end":10674.614,"text":"署長這邊能夠加強宣傳不要讓一個對的政策國家對的整個政策受到汙名化或受到一些攻擊反而導致受到影響這塊希望署長還是要持續的加油端銀跟圖卡要立即能夠對社會做說明跟澄清來捍衛整個再生能源的政策的一個方向好我們來處理108案到112案凍結1000萬書面報告好接下來113到116請說明"},{"start":10688.526,"end":10702.542,"text":"113到116後面委員關切的大概有兩個三個大的部分第一個是有關於我們漁業工基金的部分目前的一個繳納的一個情況那這部分的我們跟台電公司大概已經有簽訂了相關的一個契約書我們會委託"},{"start":10704.123,"end":10720.463,"text":"台電來針對這個漁業環境公積金的部分來做一個收繳那我們在今年也會再來研究一個我們的標準作業程序看怎麼樣做會更有效率讓這個錢可以收進來之後針對這些漁電共生的場域能夠做更好的一個環境共榮"},{"start":10721.204,"end":10736.895,"text":"那第二個委員關切的大概有關於我們公民電廠的一個相關的推動以及原住民地區的一個再生能源的推動那這部分呢在我們的相關的一個浦島計畫裡面我們這樣也修改了相關的一些我們的申請辦法"},{"start":10737.856,"end":10766.151,"text":"那過去大概是採用一年一次審查的方式定期來審那我們為了要讓這一些能夠比較有彈性所以我們現在會改成用隨到隨審的方式來做處理那第二個我們大概會做一些制度上的一些調整那這個兩階段的審查的部分本來是第一階段規劃第二階段設置那設置的話一定要根據規劃的內容我們現在也同意經過規劃階段調整之後如果有一個比較符合當地的發展我們也同意他在設置階段的時候可以"},{"start":10766.491,"end":10782.607,"text":"不一定要完全按照規劃階段的這一些計畫構想來做執行那我們大概透過這樣的一個制度調整的方式我們希望能夠加快有關於公民電廠跟原住民地區來參與這個再生能源這樣的一個推動那以上做簡要的一個說明請區議員委員"},{"start":10784.912,"end":10812.883,"text":"好 謝謝主席那個 所長我可不可以請您再請您再說明一下你剛剛講到那個大概跟北市提案有關在原住民地區的再生能源設置到底他可以做什麼他要設置什麼東西那因為我看到你們這幾年來的這個執行率其實都偏低很顯然的是原住民地區的很多不管是區公所或者是原住民朋友們都不知道"},{"start":10813.883,"end":10823.059,"text":"要怎麼申請 或者是要申請什麼你在原住民地區的再生能源是要做哪一個區塊可不可以再詳細說明一下"},{"start":10826.462,"end":10855.882,"text":"好 跟委員報告原住民地區在做再生能源大概第一個光電然後第二個水利這兩個大概是在原住民地區比較可以做的那我們過去在原住民地區55個原住民地區大概有40個曾經跟我們來洽詢過或提出過申請那這部分大概我們會持續的來跟他們做相關的討論跟輔導那觸及率其實是算高的55個原住民地區大概有40個有來跟我們洽詢過那實際上的執行當然就第一階段"},{"start":10856.722,"end":10882.742,"text":"參加的比較多第一階段我們是補助一個規劃調查費用大概是兩百萬那這是作為一個規劃調查費用那要進入到實質設置的時候它就要有具體的場域比如說它要有活動中心的屋頂或是說一般的民宅的屋頂或是水域的話小水利的話它要有相關的這一些水域的水利的這些空間你那個好我現在就請教你兩個問題嘛什麼活動中心啊什麼屋頂"},{"start":10883.923,"end":10900.215,"text":"如果依照我的了解在很多原住民地區那個都是沒有始造建造的所以他跟你查詢完之後他當然什麼都不能做啊所以你說查詢的很多但是實際做的很少啊你不能用查詢數就可以當作這個執行率嘛"},{"start":10900.675,"end":10923.007,"text":"第二個水利的部分他要用水利那個山坡的這個高低差去做小水利發電那個河川也不是他管的那個河川有可能是水利署管的啊或者是有的是那個水土保持局什麼野溪啊什麼的那個也不是原住民朋友可以自己決定啊所以你這樣子算起來"},{"start":10924.128,"end":10950.346,"text":"看起來還是他的查詢完之後發現沒有一項可以做事啦所以你的執行率是很低的啊所以你們有沒有想過用其他的方式比如說你乾脆就鼓勵他家戶去做這個光電板你用那樣子的方式自己是他自己的最少是他自己的家你不要去想到什麼什麼活動中心啦什麼有的沒的"},{"start":10951.653,"end":10963.534,"text":"古時候蓋的那些活動中心根本都沒有使用執照沒有使用執照 沒有建造那根本不能去申請這些光電設施根本不能去申請再生能源的這些所有的設施"},{"start":10965.538,"end":10993.44,"text":"謝謝委員指導那確實在太陽光電的部分主要是以他們自己的加護那我們應該要達到一定規模會比較有設置誘因所以我們是說透過第一階段的整合之後如果可以有比較多的加護出來的話那這個比較會有這個相關的一個經濟規模可以來做處理也可以降低成本那確實在小水利的部分是需要跟這個河川的管理機關做協商那所以我們在署裡面這邊大概也會先做"},{"start":10993.981,"end":11002.234,"text":"做出一個小水利的一個相關的設置指引那在這個協商的過程當中我們署裡面會協助來跟其他跨機關的一些協調"},{"start":11003.649,"end":11024.887,"text":"那個我再提一下小水利的部分我覺得是不是應該要請水利署或者是水土保持署他們去做盤點有哪些地方是可以做這樣的小水利因為都是水土保持署是在農業部啦水利署是你們自己經濟部的業管單位嘛你們自己去做協調如果可以的話"},{"start":11025.828,"end":11053.454,"text":"看看是水利署來跟你們申請或者是怎麼樣去做調配你交由原住民地區的公所或者是原住民的朋友自己去申請這不可能嘛因為他還是要取得水利署的同意嘛所以這個區塊我覺得是不是他即使是在原住民區來做再生能源我認為是不是應該讓水利的主管機關去做盤點可以做的由跟你們能源局去做共同的合作來做開發"},{"start":11055.147,"end":11065.212,"text":"是 謝謝委員提醒所以這個經費我不會去給你刪減啦但是我想可能你們還需要還是是不是我把它改成主決議我還是凍結5%但是我覺得你們可能還是要經過一些"},{"start":11068.757,"end":11086.046,"text":"重新整理整個計畫內容啦好不好是 做法上我們會再來精進那過去我們當然有跟水利署跟農水署針對這個水利的部分有一些討論不過委員提醒的部分我們會加強我們雙方的聯繫讓他做得更好 謝謝是 請委員主決議就不凍結囉好"},{"start":11096.192,"end":11098.255,"text":"那我們113案到116案第114案改為主決議預算照列現在處理117到123請說明"},{"start":11115.493,"end":11143.542,"text":"主席各位好117到123是有關於中小企業發展基金的題目主要我歸納成三類那第一類是117號委員關心我們這個青年創業貸款因為我們編列的費用是提供青年創業貸款相關的利息的補貼那這個在過去以比較低的利率還有高的保證乘數還有一個簡易生態的方式來協助青年做創業所以在"},{"start":11144.942,"end":11164.31,"text":"109到111年之間政府開放這個申請的時候有承諾相關利息補貼的5年所以目前費用的編列是持續就還有4萬多家企業必須要持續來清理相關利息補貼那這個也向委員做了一個報告委員同意改凍結100萬題書面報告這是117案"},{"start":11168.112,"end":11188.643,"text":"那第二類是118 119 120 122 123以及125那委員關心的事項是中小企業相對於大企業能夠取得的這個租稅優惠比較有限那另外中小企業需要更多的研發支出的一些投入還有相關的這個整個升級轉型"},{"start":11189.703,"end":11208.091,"text":"包含他們的財務結構能力怎麼樣去提升等等所以在這方面的話我做幾點報告就是第一個也謝謝委員會的支持在去年中小企業法案條例修法通過了以後特別針對中小企業在研發支出的抵減我們持續這個延長的適用的期限還有"},{"start":11211.792,"end":11231.04,"text":"一直延長到112年年底為止並且把這個有關於過去可以作為人才培訓支出相關的這個教育訓練費用也納入投資抵減的一個範圍我們預估這樣子的一個做法在未來的10年每年還可以平均來帶動"},{"start":11233,"end":11257.326,"text":"85億元的這個研發的這個支出取得相關的乘以10就850億元的相關的一個效益那第二個是整個的這個研發投入除了這個租稅優惠抵減以外我們還有編列相關的這個小型企業創新研發的計畫這個也會結合地方政府共同來針對中小企業所需要的研發資源我們盡快的發的準確發的快"},{"start":11259.887,"end":11277.176,"text":"那第三個是在中小企業相關的數位轉型跟淨零轉型我們也持續提升那我也有關心中小企業相關的這個財務結構怎麼樣去給他優化我們也持續有相關的這些專案的計劃以及委員最關心的是不是持續的到各地像"},{"start":11279.042,"end":11295.368,"text":"中小企業來說明相關的這些輔導的計畫跟做法所以我們也是就產業別特別是在製造業我們歸納國內中小企業最主要的製造類型有金屬加工像塑膠 飾品 紡織 機械等等的"},{"start":11295.868,"end":11310.282,"text":"跟他們做相關所需要的這個說明特別是在這個流程的管理設備的維護還有這些自動化的生產等等那在財務的部分的話我們也持續結合信保基金向中小企業來說明怎麼樣去優化財務的結構"},{"start":11311.983,"end":11327.156,"text":"還有取得相關的這些優惠以及低利貸款提供中小企業所需要的資源所以在125萬呢我也同意的話呢就是改成主決議的一個方式那第三類是121跟"},{"start":11330.473,"end":11356.533,"text":"是 好 對不起那第三類是121案121有提到是有關於相關的這個育成中心的這個經營的績效所以我們也持續的強化整個培育新創事業的機制但是因為這個育成中心經營成本在電費上其他的費用可能有一些支出的增加所以我們在這方面會持續的努力強化這整個新創事業培育的績效以上報告請謝醫鳳委員"},{"start":11359.4,"end":11377.811,"text":"上次好像我們對於那個微中小型的企業你們說要到彰化來辦那個就是相關的輔導說明那好像都沒有進一步的進展是不是也應該要加速這個相關的推動那我是可以給你寓意凍結少一點你再說明一下"},{"start":11378.99,"end":11401.757,"text":"是謝謝委員有跟這個縣府還有跟彰化地區的業者來聯繫因為目前我們在下禮拜行政院有一個正式的中小微計畫的一個啟動的儀式業者也比較忙所以我們已經有規劃好在可能是要到農曆年過後我們會再去針對地區的這些產業再跟他加強這說明"},{"start":11402.777,"end":11426.746,"text":"那也除了這個中部地區以外對於南部地區還有其他的縣市我們也都有持續的排列相關的說明的計劃那另外我們對於中小企業所需要的這些問題呢經濟部包含部長我們都有持續的去做第一線的一個關心跟了解以上報告好請問陳天佩委員你的部分有簡列好改動節喔"},{"start":11434.312,"end":11437.155,"text":"好117案到123案 我們凍結1000萬好 書面報告好 接下來124案請說明"},{"start":11450.521,"end":11477.33,"text":"124案是邱委員等人所關心的也是有關於這個中小企業所能夠取得的這些租稅獎勵相較於大企業可能比較有限剛才已經報告了我們在針對中小企業能夠取得的這些研發支出的一個投資抵減我們持續來加強然後另外在中小企業所需要的這個小企業創新研發計畫的一些補助我們也盡可能盡快的審核"},{"start":11478.03,"end":11504.471,"text":"尽快的来提供另外在中小企业相关的整个的一个接班传承我们除了持续的这些培育的计划以外最重要是说由标杆企业由这些相关具有经验的这些企业主来带领让他们在传承的效果上会更好另外在财务结构上我们也持续的来协助以上是124案"},{"start":11505.612,"end":11532.91,"text":"好 124案預算照列第125案請說明那125案是編列在中小企業發展基金相關的一個行政費用這個費用的話編列主要是我們每次開會的時候相關委員的一些這個出席的費用還有整個的基金相關的這個聘僱人員相關的這些薪資還有一些辦公費用等等那這部分的話也向委員辦公室做一個報告"},{"start":11536.332,"end":11553.943,"text":"將這個中小企業發展基金的這個會議呢能夠討論的更加的深入也符合中小企業所需的這個內容我們來提供相關所需的服務所以這邊有向委員辦公室做一個報告委員辦公室能夠也有一個了解好 請楊秋英委員"},{"start":11556.11,"end":11557.312,"text":"中小企業真的錢不夠我們95%"},{"start":11573.812,"end":11597.44,"text":"的這個勞動力都在我們的中小企業所以我也跟部長討論過未來你們在編列預算我沒辦法幫你增加預算但是我非常的希望在編列預算的時候是符合時事所需千變萬化尤其現在跟以往完全不一樣的形態每一分每一秒的形態都不一樣"},{"start":11598.26,"end":11612.385,"text":"所以我語重心長的說我們現在包括我們的中小企業3K產造在基層上面是很辛苦我也很敬佩他們他們如此的辛苦還願意努力的苦撐"},{"start":11614.005,"end":11634.956,"text":"甚至有很多的中小企業到現在他們是爸爸媽媽一個阿公還是阿嬤還是一個孩子還是一個媳婦就這樣子自家人組成還維繫住這個是我超級感動早期我們到日本去我們看到他的拉麵是爸爸在煮媽媽在端"},{"start":11636.016,"end":11654.828,"text":"一個女兒在當會計我們當時覺得很奇怪怎麼可能產業會如此可是台灣很快就走向這樣子的形態現在已經有很多所以我很敬佩我們台灣人非常非常地用心他即使多困難他仍舊願意如此努力做"},{"start":11655.448,"end":11679.88,"text":"所以我提這個案也就是希望我願意改為主決議當然我要請中小企業處你如果人不夠你應該報給我們的部長因為我覺得部長來自產業他在判斷方面跟我們整個這一個產業行為是非常的可以結合這一點我是覺得因為部長在這邊我是覺得中小企業既然占95%你的人力"},{"start":11681.761,"end":11700.587,"text":"你的預算要怎麼樣去調整我覺得這個才是真正釜底抽薪的問題所以這個我改組決議但主席我有一個議題想要跟這個部長討論一下請郭部長對 部長我想跟你討論一下因為我覺得這個是非常重要的源頭也是我們在基層裡頭在講"},{"start":11702.569,"end":11715.769,"text":"現在我們所有的木工機機械類 鋼鐵 水泥也好 都列為第一類別我們現在推動ESG 我們也推動零碳的概念"},{"start":11718.252,"end":11739.552,"text":"都非常好 但是要有人去帶 有人去做所以現在我給部長說明有一個事情一定要請我們經濟部來協助就說 比如說 我不攻擊我到歐美去 我到北歐去 我的ESG他們那一國的認證 在我國所訓練我拿去是不通的"},{"start":11740.493,"end":11764.365,"text":"所以我強烈要求我們台灣人這家產業我是感動的不得了他們都跑比政府還快一家的認可大概要花兩百萬左右那這個老闆都願意花我非常的希望由政府來代政府你將我們全球五大洲他們必須認定的比如說荷蘭"},{"start":11765.821,"end":11778.076,"text":"還是這個印度印度他們認定可以認定的他這個區塊可以認定的這個認證的廠家應該是由我們政府來協助請他們來我們台灣針對這個工會給他們上課"},{"start":11784.978,"end":11811.622,"text":"讓他們知道你ESG到時候你到那個國家去你是可以通的現在我們碰到一個很大的問題公會也就是我在台灣或者是我拿東南亞的可是我拿到中東 不通可是我拿到北歐 不通所以他們還要重新重新除了花錢之外他們還要浪費時間時間對於我們廠商來講就是金錢我非常的希望"},{"start":11812.182,"end":11836.065,"text":"政府以大帶小這個概念我是很敬佩而且現在也在落實包括我們亞談神我們也是第二年我們也一直在帶有能力的廠商你自己趕快做跟政府合作做好了之後你來帶你相關的這樣子我們一年我們自己這個協會一年大概帶了36到42家左右我很高興"},{"start":11836.886,"end":11858.512,"text":"我很高興我們總是有進步但是我們現在碰到這個問題廠商比如說木工機木工機我們好不容易現在如果扣掉大陸我們是我們可以佔第一名因為他們結盟起來所以我們是第三名那我真的很希望我們很高興就是說廠商他自己去賺五大洲以前我們都在東南亞以日本為主"},{"start":11860.892,"end":11884.931,"text":"現在他整個在其他州的地方他們也努力在做可是他們碰到這個問題所以我真的很希望就是說政府應該要有這個責任跟這個義務你們來找你叫他去找印度的一個他不知道在哪裡啦你們應該去盤點五大州這些認證要怎麼樣可以跟我們台灣的廠商來結盟這樣子公會趕快"},{"start":11886.412,"end":11911.03,"text":"結合起來工會完成之後就由工會的會員去以大帶小去帶他們願意的你來市場競爭嘛我覺得這個是政府可以做的事情啊要不然他們現在喔我現在去到印度不通我還要重新在印度我到荷蘭不通我要重新在荷蘭一次下去將近十個月哇 這個廠商太辛苦了以上建言"},{"start":11913.134,"end":11923.039,"text":"謝謝委員吹詢那這一部分事實上這個經濟部有在進行我現在都每個禮拜都跟兩個工協會在討論那我們來聽他們的這個工協會裡面的"},{"start":11928.303,"end":11950.263,"text":"問題如果碰到這個國際的這個這個所謂的標準的確認我們會用這個國家的這個立場來跟對方來討論那只要我們這邊通過那麼讓對方可以認證的話希望他能夠通過我們的認證承認我們的認證這個是最快的方法這個我們現在正在進行部長我們有一點雞同鴨講"},{"start":11951.784,"end":11969.703,"text":"第一個第一個第一個也就是說我們很努力在做但是我做出來的東西當然他國願意我們好可是他國是跟世界接軌他們有他們的規格所以我本席現在所說的意思就是說我們政府應該去盤點"},{"start":11971.044,"end":11993.397,"text":"譬如說我歐盟的你要怎麼樣才可以認證如果我方的我們目前所認證不能通我們應該請歐盟的這個國家他們的認證公司來協助我們來告訴我們怎麼去申請我覺得這個很重要報告委員你想你說的跟我們在做的是一樣的事情"},{"start":11993.922,"end":12014.493,"text":"那你是說要我們的要讓他認可可是他不認可啊我們現在馬上工會就碰到很多這樣的問題他會先認可我們的認證單位我們的認證單位代理他的認證對你後面這一句要講出來你後面這一句要講出來由我們認證可以雙方協議那我們國家的立場來"},{"start":12017.955,"end":12032.961,"text":"我們會協助國內的這些中小委的企業這一點委員我非常了解你現在所垂詢的問題我們也在進行現在進行是請給我們一點時間我們趕快來做這個事情"},{"start":12035.982,"end":12051.161,"text":"你預估這個時間因為我們現在廠商有碰到我們現在在進行中那你預估大概會怎麼樣有一個時間成效比如說我們木工機馬上會碰到這個問題所以我現在所有的工隊我都跑一趟"},{"start":12051.701,"end":12076.93,"text":"那我實際了解這個問題然後它這個按照它的輕重緩急我們快速多方面結合我們國貿署然後我們再跟國外來推動聯繫再請部長到我們洋委員辦公室去說明好不好我們一個結論主席那也謝謝部長你已經看到這個要跟世界接軌政府要站的立場要怎麼協助那我覺得像我們"},{"start":12077.89,"end":12098.264,"text":"至少我們經濟委員會的委員跟產業界都很接觸我可以講出這一些也就是我們一直挺聽這個工會以及廠商的意見那我們是不是就是說我們如果有哪一個工會比較緊急的我們趕快報給部長這邊你們優先來我們都要做嘛好不好 一起加油好 謝謝"},{"start":12105.952,"end":12115.306,"text":"125案改為主決議預算照列現在處理主決議126案遵照辦理通過127案遵照辦理通過128案遵照辦理通過129案遵照辦理"},{"start":12120.253,"end":12129.639,"text":"通過130案 遵照辦理通過131案 遵照辦理通過132案 遵照辦理通過133案 遵照辦理通過134案 遵照辦理通過135案 遵照辦理通過136案 遵照辦理通過137案 遵照辦理通過"},{"start":12139.165,"end":12151.153,"text":"138 遵照辦理通過139 遵照辦理通過140 遵照辦理通過141 遵照辦理通過142 遵照辦理通過143 遵照辦理通過144 遵照辦理通過145 遵照辦理通過146 遵照辦理通過147 遵照辦理通過148 遵照辦理通過149 遵照辦理"},{"start":12168.531,"end":12187.086,"text":"現在要來處理的是核能發電後端營運基金先來處理基金來源第150案請說明150案大概是有關於後端基金因為大於台電大概2200億左右那這塊委員認為說台電目前的財務狀況風險過於集中那因為針對這一題主要是因為"},{"start":12195.493,"end":12222.259,"text":"後端基金帶給台電的這些實際上都定有一個所謂的貸款的合約而且每年都依照合約的條件我們會編列一個台電都有編列預算來償還相關的一個一個一個還本付息所以都依照合約的約定來執行所以我們是建議是不是委員讓我們能夠提書面報告以上好沒見"},{"start":12226.281,"end":12226.507,"text":"明天"},{"start":12230.235,"end":12255.345,"text":"150案預算照列第151案請說明151案主要是委員針對服務費用的話一般服務費的部分的簡列跟凍結主要是賴委員針對就是111年石門區的茂林社區它有一個自來水沿管的一個幹線跟支線的一個工程那這部分是由後端基金來帶電"},{"start":12256.545,"end":12283.001,"text":"那委員呢他是要求就是新北市負責的支線的35%的部分必須要全數返還後端基金那這一部分跟委員報告就是新北的原來負責的35%的部分大概148.6萬目前已經在去年的10月份已經全數返還給後端基金所以我們也建議看委員是不是讓我們提書面報告把相關的一個經過做一個報告請賴樂隆委員"},{"start":12285.543,"end":12301.628,"text":"好 我再勸一下所以這一筆電付的錢全部都歸還了對 新北市水利署跟新北市都歸還了水利署的還沒有但是水利署我們大概固定每半年後端基金委員會新聞給所以一直新聞 然後一直吹套"},{"start":12302.208,"end":12317.936,"text":"我再問一下核後端的基金為什麼可以做這樣的一個使用主要是因為當時石門區的茂林社區它原來沒有自來水所以它的用水實際上都是核一廠在營運期間的儲礦水就是經過儲礦的乾淨的水打"},{"start":12322.915,"end":12338.063,"text":"打水打到茂林社區使用那可是因為合一場進入除以後他原來的那個設備打水的那個設備的區域我必須要來蓋所謂的室內乾除所以後來就把那個設備都拆除掉了"},{"start":12338.783,"end":12358.423,"text":"所以基本上當時是在經濟部大概協調之下後來我們就先由後端基金來帶電我再提一次我認為這個還是非常的不恰當核厚基金就應該做在核厚的事項上費用不應該當作一個小金庫來可以挪來挪去做使用那當時為什麼會有這樣的一個決策而同意來動用這筆錢"},{"start":12359.944,"end":12385.652,"text":"即使現在帶電有的時間是不還的啦好朋友現在追討有在追討回來但是一樣是不妥的我認為一樣不妥經濟部跟核貨基金都不應該把這個當小金庫來濫用所以我認為該追究責任還是要追究那另外一次我還是要求要凍結提出一個完整的說明報告給經濟委員會這樣的事情不應該再發生核貨端的基金就應該用在核貨端"},{"start":12386.152,"end":12403.702,"text":"沒有 如果這樣的理由可用的話那成小金庫每個都可以當理由來用這絕不能夠把它當作是一個回饋或當作是一個地方的一個敦青木林做使用這絕對不妥甚至於去帶電作為政府該做的事務不管是地方政府或中央政府該做的事務"},{"start":12404.503,"end":12420.703,"text":"這個都是濫用都是逾越了核候基金該用的範圍我還是要予以強力的譴責這樣的用法同時我要求必須要追究真相同時另外對於這個部分我要求凍結來做後續的完整的報告所以檢列部分不用了改凍結"},{"start":12423.26,"end":12432.148,"text":"檢列的部分我還是要照檢列啦等你把水利所有的錢追討回來再說你沒有追討回來表示你的錢太多嘛錢太多才會濫用這樣一個狀況我一樣要求檢列10%凍結10%"},{"start":12435.487,"end":12452.788,"text":"各位委員報告一下主要是現在的那個一般的服務費用目前來講像今年大概變了21.9億可是他其實有21.2億是用在合一合二合三除以後的一個人事的費用還有蘭嶼跟台東金門"},{"start":12453.168,"end":12482.737,"text":"好啦 我就比較簡略 我凍結10%但是我要求你要把這個身相查清楚另外未來絕對不能夠再同意這樣的使用跟核後無關的絕對不能再動用是是 遵照辦理請陽瓊議委員是不是讓我們凍結然後再那個他已經跟你說了 你沒聽清楚來 這個 那你要的回來嗎我們是有信心啦 因為我們有給台水有給台水 那其實它今年原來是有編譽的你編譽法本來就要 那為什麼不編呢"},{"start":12484.516,"end":12498.316,"text":"我們今天立法院第一層在經濟委員會審查預算我們都要負責任的我們給你們預算然後你嫌太多然後就給人家如果沒有人看那也不想去要"},{"start":12499.755,"end":12515.916,"text":"不要只有告訴我們說我們真的是中央政府啊反正中央政府都是中央政府的啊不能這樣子吧我們是依法嘛你們所謂的有信心你怎麼讓我們有信心你已經本來他今年要編可是預算上面我沒看到啊"},{"start":12517.677,"end":12546.242,"text":"那什麼叫做有信心 你今天如果預算上沒有看到我說有信心就跟剛剛播出郭部長一樣我們剛開始雞同鴨講 最後答案是一致的方向是一致 我很高興我們一起來協助我們的產業可是你不要隨便打打今年預算看不到然後你告訴我們有信心這個信心是要怎麼論定怎麼辦 你告訴我們方法啊就是已經"},{"start":12548.174,"end":12558.253,"text":"立法院通過的預算那你只要告訴我們有信心 那也沒有預算啊那這個信心是什麼"},{"start":12560.083,"end":12580.559,"text":"沒有 要怎麼樣回來 我只要了解因為我經常 本席經常在立法院我們先不論說金額而是制度面的問題大家都很了解本席的個性我覺得我們就是要依法好好去做你們公務人員太辛苦了不可以這樣子"},{"start":12581.68,"end":12601.781,"text":"隨便一個指令下來你們就蓋個章就過去那我們立法院根本就不要審啊你們就中央總預算三兆多就自己自行運資啊不可能這樣吧不可能這樣子所以我再聽聽因為為什麼我一定要趕回來審查這個預算因為我昨天還跟部長討論"},{"start":12603.464,"end":12629.103,"text":"核會不會用三大原則大家都同意啊這個核後可以處理啊就可以用核欸昨天三大原則是如此欸那現在怎麼辦現在怎麼辦告訴我們怎麼要回來好嗎是 這個是不是讓我們再提一個書面報告我們再研擬一個方式去把它那個你在心中有沒有方案腦中有沒有方案他不理你嘛他不編啊"},{"start":12632.679,"end":12640.224,"text":"你如果依照用這樣子啊 就等我說的啊 反正我中央預算啊不管基金公務預算啊 通通都可以挪啊部長 不可以這樣子啦怎麼辦你以前的方法 給他一張文 他不理你不編 那現在你怎麼辦"},{"start":12655.458,"end":12671.465,"text":"我來補充一下啦我比較擔心西北市政府已經不同了那經濟部想一下我相信部長可以妥善處理好不好就是內部該緩的就緩啦這個水利署台水該緩的就緩好不好好謝謝好我來處理啦我先來處理151案我們凍結2億書面報告等到錢要回來才得以解凍好"},{"start":12687.042,"end":12713.718,"text":"我是這樣講啦 因為他的預算喔 我們都很詳細看啦他的預算21.9億當中啦 他有21.1億多是人事費用我是覺得這個我們不要動他啦反正也是書面 但是我覺得我們還是要有所本所以我是建議我們提案人啦就是說我們的應該是凍結八千萬然後提書面 那重點你錢要給我 要回來啦"},{"start":12714.498,"end":12716.719,"text":"151案凍結2億書面報告好 接下來152到156案是當然"},{"start":12738.158,"end":12763.913,"text":"是 遵照辦理好 152到156主要是針對蘭嶼的這一塊就是地方私信廢棄物的這個儲存那委員主要有 主要規則大概有三個意見大概是針對蘭嶼這個廢料這個遷出的這一塊還有一個土地層出的問題還有一些監察院在去年3月提出的一個糾正案沒有落極三級平保的這些議題"},{"start":12765.185,"end":12782.632,"text":"那有關於蘭嶼遷出的這個議題目前來講我們今年其實上有編列的預算大概1.9億所謂的土地的這個補償金的部分大概是依據原住民保留地損失補償要點那這個在今年的預算大概都會有編另外有關於"},{"start":12786.033,"end":12802.393,"text":"等我後面的所謂的藍宇的這個簽書主要牽扯到所謂的低放射性廢棄物的這個最終處置的部分那經濟部也已經成立了所謂的一個廢料的處理處置的一個專案辦公室"},{"start":12804.215,"end":12819.437,"text":"所以今年來講我們當然會積極努力的去把它能夠把相關的一些立法還有一些社會的溝通去把它做好那這一塊來講我們希望也是讓委員能夠讓我們提出書面報告好 請待任委員"},{"start":12827.369,"end":12840.058,"text":"好這個部分我還是希望因為蘭嶼的部分持續的其實一直都沒有辦法達成共識那其實也看不到到底具體成效結果怎樣所以我是建議結立500萬 共結1000萬等這個書面報告再行解凍好我們"},{"start":12850.731,"end":12851.912,"text":"152案到156案我們就簡列500萬 凍結1000萬 書面報告接下來157案到163案 請說明好"},{"start":12863.958,"end":12890.378,"text":"157到163案主要是針對於低放射性廢棄物的這個最終處置的部分那委員關切的議題主要是對於就是低放的最終處置的這個選址作業在2012以後選定台東達人跟金門烏丘以後在10年沒有進展那另外有關於中期儲存的這個應變方案邱穎也提到說邱穎委員有提到說沒有一個定案"},{"start":12891.238,"end":12911.945,"text":"那這一塊來講的部分我剛才前面已經有提到就是說經濟部我們已經成立了所謂的一個專案辦公室積極來推動相關這個選址條例的這個修法跟立法包括公投的一個應變的一個補救的一個辦法但目前來講在今年來講我們積極來推動大概以上請內陸董委員"},{"start":12919.558,"end":12947.794,"text":"這個一樣齁 這個最終處置的部分其實處理很久一樣都沒有成效啦齁 所以我具體簡列了這個300萬 那另外1847萬部分我凍結順便報告再請解凍請請委員來 我請教一下齁這個你們河後端的最終處置計畫經過了這麼多年到底要放在哪裡"},{"start":12948.888,"end":12975.618,"text":"可以放在哪裡會放在哪裡能不能清楚說明你不要說這個什麼修法啦然後還在研議啦什麼因為現在一堆人在要求核四要重啟那前面的我們的這些核廢料可以放在哪裡最終能放在哪裡會放在哪裡都不知道那現在要求核四要重啟的人他要不要也先去考量到說"},{"start":12976.818,"end":13000.936,"text":"那之後的核廢料要放在哪裡 會放在哪裡 可以放在哪裡要放在他家隔壁嗎所以我們每一年都在討論這個問題啊每一年都編列預算啊 每一年都在研究啊那你們可不可以告訴我們 這個要到底 你們要怎麼處理其實在 等一下 楊瓊英委員發言"},{"start":13003.924,"end":13026.22,"text":"謝謝主席 楊瓊玉發言楊瓊玉是162案其實我們提案委員包括我個人我覺得一個有為的政府你應該編列預算出來就是表示你有所本你要做這個事情而不是完全有所本而不做這個事情"},{"start":13027.789,"end":13041.145,"text":"現在我剛剛一開頭說了訊息萬變以往大家認為核四很危險現在全世界各國多數認為核四安全核四又是最低的未來有很多"},{"start":13042.512,"end":13055.748,"text":"能源的來源大家也提出了很多的質疑這個就是民主的真諦各方提出意見大家共同來討論而且所有的不管是在產學訓裡頭尤其是產"},{"start":13058.03,"end":13079.944,"text":"學方面很多的發明家他們不斷的去推陳出新未來會怎麼樣我們不知道但是我覺得政府必須要跟世界來接軌但是我們現在編列的這個預算跟何時要不要重啟似乎也不是那麼相關目的是在什麼你現在的要怎麼處理"},{"start":13081.445,"end":13108.263,"text":"你已經十年選定的那個地方沒通沒有一個政府說選定的一個地方十年溝通不來你還認定在那裡不可能的事情啦我舉一個例子就像我們台中的屠宰場每一屆三屆的市長都到哪裡都罵最後我們盧市長想了一個方法怎麼樣去團結和諧去結盟我們就解決了這個問題啊"},{"start":13110.157,"end":13128.707,"text":"所以我認為不是每一年的預算固定這樣子我今天即使不簡略給你改動一下提書面報告你們如果一樣態度還是一樣以十年前的態度那十年前不是你啦那趕快叫抄又拿來那白浪費我們在這裡開會啦"},{"start":13130.803,"end":13155.851,"text":"對不對 所以我仍舊真的我非常的希望我仍舊非常的希望你們必須要提出方法 該當會贏的要怎麼做 該當不贏的也要改變方法我想部長你可以認同這樣的論點吧十來年都一樣我們笑的 不可以這樣子嘛我們也對不起民眾啊 對不對所以這個"},{"start":13159.027,"end":13182.616,"text":"這個162案本席的提案我可以改為主決議但是我真的非常的希望你們該當去研判你現在鎖定的地方到底會通還不通啦不通你自己想想看要怎麼做不可以不通常常定在那明年再來還是一樣那個位置這我們沒辦法接受嘛好不好是好我們現在處理157案到163案"},{"start":13186.889,"end":13187.61,"text":"162案改為主決議 前列300萬 凍結1000萬書面報告"},{"start":13195.834,"end":13219.605,"text":"接下來164案到166案 請說明好 164到166案主要是針對於用過核子燃料的儲存就是所謂目前乾式的儲存 室內室外的乾式的儲存那委員針對這部分大概就是過去這幾年來因為一些發包不順利 所以執行率偏低的問題但是我要跟委員報告的是"},{"start":13220.505,"end":13240.753,"text":"核一廠的室外的乾除我們現在已經完成了所有的試運轉測試目前來講大概這個月的20號我們會跟核安會申請實用製造所以大概陸陸續續大概在今年如果實用製造拿到以後核一廠反應爐的燃料大概就可以全數移出"},{"start":13241.673,"end":13265.774,"text":"那核二的室外乾除我們也在去年的12月30日已經動工了我們估計大概兩年後核二廠的反應爐用過核子燃料也可以把它全數再移出所以過去執行率偏低的問題我想今年來講我們應該會整個大幅的改善所以這部分還希望委員的部分讓我們能夠提書面報告然後來動之這樣子"},{"start":13271.291,"end":13275.658,"text":"好164案到166案用書面報告預算照列167案到171案請說明好"},{"start":13285.803,"end":13301.21,"text":"167到171主要是針對用過核子燃料最終處置的部分這其實剛才很多委員都有指教有關於整個高方立法還有選址多年推動不順利的這一塊那我講的就是說因為最終處置這部分其實上是專業的議題"},{"start":13303.142,"end":13319.414,"text":"因為在選址條例未來在規劃裡面包括人口密度的問題包括地址條件的問題實際上這是非常很專業的議題那現在未來我們如果在專案辦公室底下呢我們會成立了所謂的專家的平台然後透過公聽會跟意見所謂的"},{"start":13321.795,"end":13346.785,"text":"意見交流的方式然後去把這個案子的去把它積極的推動不管未來何能何能不論你是發電或是未來不發電那最終處置的這一塊一定要積極來推動這也是我們所有正在世代爭議裡面必須要積極來執行的部分所以我們也希望說這一塊是不是委員讓我們提書面報告後動之請 請委員"},{"start":13348.826,"end":13361.07,"text":"好 謝謝主席 我沒有意見我就改組決議好 那請邱志偉委員既然邱委員都這麼說 我也改組決議所以169 170是改組決議好 那現在167案到171案169案 170案改成組決議 預算照列"},{"start":13373.719,"end":13375.76,"text":"接下來是172到173請說明172到173主要是現在合一合二及未來今年開始合三的有關於廚藝計畫的一個費用的部分那這部分來講"},{"start":13390.67,"end":13409.466,"text":"主要預算大概總共包括他的服務費用委員關切的大概就是服務費用的這一塊那服務費用的這一塊主要剛才有提到服務費用裡面有一般服務的費用大概就是21.2億用在人事的成本人事的成本這一塊也希望委員能夠來支持以上"},{"start":13409.906,"end":13411.768,"text":"172案到173案預算照列接下來是174到176案請說明174到175案裡面的委員"},{"start":13424.952,"end":13451.053,"text":"174 174到176對不起174到176主要委員的關切的議題主要是認為說一樣就是前面的一些高放的一些推動低放的處置的一些推動不順所以針對於所謂的這個這個這個管理的行政管理的這一部分呢必須要檢列跟凍結的部分那個好請 請這位委員請這位委員只有我在啊我這個改組決議預算照例吧好是"},{"start":13451.886,"end":13453.809,"text":"好174案到176案第175案改為主決議預算照列接下來來處理主決議177案遵照辦理通過"},{"start":13471.735,"end":13492.512,"text":"這個部長在這裡我當然尊重大家討論的結果但是我有一點想要跟部長分享因為部長你來自產業我真的對你期望很高因為你看到這一筆預算你如果本來就是在行政部門你看不出來但是你來自產業第一個"},{"start":13493.57,"end":13521.825,"text":"我們編列的預算十年沒有辦法做還是維持在那個地方第二個方法我們十幾年來二十幾年來還是這個方法但是我們現在已經有一個資訊全世界對於核的概念是不一樣概念之所以會不一樣表示它的生產出它最後的處理之一定有它整套的不一樣才會在世界來風行"},{"start":13523.206,"end":13548.722,"text":"那我們要怎麼樣跟他們去對接這個是我覺得部長你絕對有這個能力可以去做這個事情這個才能夠幫助我們所有的行政部門今天這個預算今天這個預算是基金的今天這個預算假設是公務預算每一年比如說水利追口一次三四十億它不行它公務預算變成那邊"},{"start":13550.263,"end":13572.103,"text":"這樣坦白他希望我們刪因為會影響到他的績效我不希望如此但是我覺得已經有我等等等等到最近這一兩年大家對於這個核的概念已經轉彎的時候我們要怎麼樣世界各國比如德國日本什麼美國哪一國都好只要人家有可以處理我們有沒有主動"},{"start":13572.984,"end":13591.532,"text":"去連結這個方向我們才能夠真正去解決這個問題啊以上建言謝謝委員這部分我們經濟部自己有在處理我們有在學習我們的國貿署都有在跟國外的這一些這個"},{"start":13593.633,"end":13593.873,"text":"現在請宣讀協商結論"},{"start":13616.069,"end":13641.754,"text":"第一案 增列五百萬元第二案改為主決議 第三案照案通過增列五百萬元 第四案凍結五百萬元提出書面報告後 使得凍資 第五案凍結兩百萬元提出書面報告後 使得凍資第六案預算照列第七案照案通過第八案改為主決議 第九案照案通過第十案"},{"start":13643.11,"end":13671.116,"text":"預算照列本案改為主決議第十一案十二案凍結兩百萬元提出書面報告後使得凍資第十三案凍結一千萬元提出書面報告後使得凍資第十四案十五案預算照列第十五案改為主決議主決議部分第十六案到十八案照案通過十九案二十案修正通過二十一案到三十案照案通過三十一案修正通過"},{"start":13672.196,"end":13685.865,"text":"水資源部分第32案 照案通過增列500萬元第33案預算照列 第34案預算照列本案改為主決議第35至44案 銷貨成本凍結1000萬元提出書面報告後使得凍資"},{"start":13690.268,"end":13710.514,"text":"其中38案到41案及44案均改為主決議第45案預算照列本案改為主決議第46至50案預算照列其中第47至49案均改為主決議第51案預算照列本案改為主決議 主決議部分"},{"start":13712.044,"end":13725.409,"text":"52案到60案均照案通過 61案修正通過經濟特授部分第62案到74案貿易推廣工作計畫凍結1億元提出書面報告後使得凍資其中第67案73案均改為主決議第75至77案凍結1000萬元提出書面報告後使得凍資"},{"start":13736.312,"end":13750.983,"text":"第78至89案 能源研究發展工作計畫凍結500萬元提出書面報告後 使得動之其中第80案 86案 89案均改為主決議第90案至92案 參考90案凍結1000萬元提出書面報告後 使得動之第93案至99案參考第93案 凍結1500萬元提出書面報告"},{"start":13763.272,"end":13774.879,"text":"經同意後始的動之其中第94案改為主決議第100至106案參考100案凍結1000萬元提出書面報告後始的動之第107案預算照列本案改為主決議第108案至112案再生能源推廣計畫凍結1000萬元提出書面報告後始的動之第113案到116案"},{"start":13790.729,"end":13795.691,"text":"預算照列其中114案改為主決議第117案到123案中橋企業發展計畫凍結1000萬元提出書面報告後使得凍資第124案預算照列第125案預算照列本案改為主決議"},{"start":13809.157,"end":13818.284,"text":"主決議部分自126案到149案均照案通過和後端第150案預算照列第151案凍結2億元提出書面報告後時的凍資第152案至156案"},{"start":13826.469,"end":13830.775,"text":"簡列低放射性廢棄物處理及儲存計畫500萬元令凍結1000萬元提出書面報告後10日動之第157案到163案簡列低放射性廢棄物最終儲存"},{"start":13842.148,"end":13848.372,"text":"第164至166案預算照列第167至171案預算照列其中169案、170案均改為主決議第172案、173案預算照列第173到176案預算照列其中175案改為主決議主決議部分177案照案通過宣讀完畢"},{"start":13877.873,"end":13897.652,"text":"請問各位同仁有委員提案的部分照剛才宣讀的協商結論通過在沒有提案的部分均照列或者是隨同調整請問有無異議好沒有異議通過本次通過之決議文字授權主席及議事人員整理"},{"start":13901.489,"end":13928.944,"text":"今天我們審理了可以請非營業基金相關人員先離開那我們下午休息到下午一點繼續來做審查是修正的吧新的還是修正的修正的修正您簽名簽名就可以"},{"start":13933.309,"end":13936.232,"text":"中文字幕志愿者 李宗盛"},{"start":13951.03,"end":13954.533,"text":"這間餐廳的餐廳有很多不同的餐廳。這間餐廳有很多不同的餐廳。"},{"start":13975.489,"end":13976.869,"text":"那你要不要拿兩片?"},{"start":14010.823,"end":14010.963,"text":"好,謝謝記者"},{"start":14035.307,"end":14036.828,"text":"這裏面就是蒙太奇,居上鋪的山"},{"start":14058.277,"end":14060.539,"text":"全部都是動物動物動物動物動物動物動物動物動物"},{"start":14089.115,"end":14105.687,"text":"這個就是主要的主題應該是這樣寫的這個是不是前面沒有是上一集然後是在這個數字上面沒有還是這邊沒有我覺得原本這樣子寫然後再改主題這邊改主題按改主題沒有再來再來就是"},{"start":14117.655,"end":14118.356,"text":"這裏是一間餐廳這裏是餐廳"},{"start":14147.095,"end":14151.058,"text":"這個應該是樹的,應該是這棵樹的。不要,不要給我帶去。"},{"start":14168.875,"end":14174.578,"text":"蜂蜜"},{"start":14193.217,"end":14220.657,"text":"對謝謝"},{"start":14223.2,"end":14229.265,"text":"這間餐廳的餐廳有很多不同的食物"},{"start":14238.038,"end":14259.354,"text":"這間餐廳的餐廳是一間餐廳的餐廳。這間餐廳的餐廳是一間餐廳的餐廳。"},{"start":14276.267,"end":14288.6,"text":"這裏有個大廈,有個廟宇"},{"start":14300.043,"end":14306.266,"text":"這裏面是一間餐廳"},{"start":14320.433,"end":14323.374,"text":"中文字幕志愿者 李宗盛"},{"start":14357.978,"end":14384.785,"text":"這邊是火營,那是?對,在這邊擺"},{"start":14387.443,"end":14392.544,"text":"其實他們這個氣氛絕對不太好。你給什麼?你給什麼?"},{"start":14418.469,"end":14443.237,"text":"這裏有很多不同的雕塑物,有很多不同的雕塑物"},{"start":14454.066,"end":14477.187,"text":"哦哦哦哦"},{"start":14491.977,"end":14497.319,"text":"蜂蜜"},{"start":14510.577,"end":14524.561,"text":"中文字幕志愿者 李宗盛"},{"start":14548.523,"end":14549.263,"text":"蜂蜜"},{"start":14574.497,"end":14592.447,"text":"這裏有個小小的小小的"},{"start":14601.621,"end":14606.022,"text":"嗯嗯"},{"start":14626.459,"end":14628.92,"text":"蜂蜜"},{"start":14664.149,"end":14664.169,"text":"蝦仁"},{"start":14678.33,"end":14679.431,"text":"要換重點"},{"start":14705.958,"end":14718.664,"text":"好漂亮喔"},{"start":14722.023,"end":14738.297,"text":"這裏是大廈的大廈"},{"start":14743.507,"end":14765.754,"text":"他不遇見"},{"start":14844.695,"end":14850.156,"text":"嗯嗯"},{"start":14864.687,"end":14879.955,"text":"謝謝大家"},{"start":14973.183,"end":14973.203,"text":"謝謝觀看"},{"start":15011.054,"end":15011.074,"text":"謝謝觀看"},{"start":15045.179,"end":15047.887,"text":"感谢您的观看"},{"start":15094.944,"end":15102.511,"text":"嗯嗯嗯"},{"start":15117.352,"end":15118.694,"text":"鸡蛋糕"},{"start":15131.226,"end":15145.89,"text":"那孩子就叫他帶我去買,後來他就說,那個兒子,他說太可愛了,說你比我孩子還要可愛。可是我覺得還好。他小嘛,他才來找我喝茶,他小來問我小一點,我就簡單講話。"},{"start":15163.437,"end":15173.139,"text":"中間我們會有的車我都不怕我交換錢給他他會想上街線現在你能把那個拿出來因為我覺得我沒有太多錢所以中間你不怕你拿不太多我會等你到飛機站前面就行我有帶的啦 已經有帶了幾個了"},{"start":15189.787,"end":15214.514,"text":"這個...這個..."},{"start":15214.514,"end":15237.159,"text":"對,對,對"},{"start":15241.734,"end":15244.675,"text":"中文字幕志愿者 杨茜茜"},{"start":15267.021,"end":15270.622,"text":"中文字幕志愿者 李宗盛"},{"start":15298.937,"end":15300.018,"text":"這裏是一間餐廳"},{"start":15312.914,"end":15336.114,"text":"這個位置原來是一個內陸家族的地方所以說這個地方就有很多不同的地方所以說這個地方就有很多不同的地方所以說這個地方就有很多不同的地方所以說這個地方就有很多不同的地方所以說這個地方就有很多不同的地方"},{"start":15341.538,"end":15351.565,"text":"中文字幕 李宗盛"},{"start":15358.91,"end":15361.231,"text":"哈哈哈哈"},{"start":15378.36,"end":15385.108,"text":"現有的,就不要亂講,就不關你的事。我們就是這一點,生活才是最重要的。對,對。"},{"start":15396.886,"end":15419.507,"text":"請在身邊的朋友和朋友一起分享一下疫情暢通健康的話題的情緒和感染症狀的問題這個不會是最難的因為您會有小朋友跟著你一起去訪問人家有什麼感染症的方式可以幫助您解決這個問題在身邊的朋友和朋友跟著你一起去訪問人家有什麼感染症的方式"},{"start":15438.77,"end":15448.855,"text":"這張照片的主要目的就是為了保護自己的身體和身體的健康。這張照片的主要目的是為了保護自己的身體和身體的健康。"},{"start":15450.782,"end":15451.463,"text":"這裏是大廈的廟宇"},{"start":15465.908,"end":15468.591,"text":"這裏是大廈的一間餐廳"},{"start":15491.732,"end":15508.481,"text":"新的豆瓣三館,一斤三餅三百三十塊"},{"start":15516.101,"end":15517.021,"text":"這個叫什麼?這個叫什麼?這個叫什麼?"},{"start":15547.073,"end":15567.058,"text":"嗯嗯嗯"},{"start":15584.832,"end":15587.675,"text":"中文字幕提供"},{"start":15601.135,"end":15613.566,"text":"這張照片是在2012年10月1日拍攝的"},{"start":15632.504,"end":15633.126,"text":"嗯嗯"},{"start":15636.92,"end":15637.62,"text":"這裏面就是開發的地方,就是用的地方。這裏面就是開發的地方,就是用的地方。"},{"start":15690.224,"end":15690.244,"text":"謝謝觀看"},{"start":15708.874,"end":15711.255,"text":"在這裏面,我們可以看見有幾個大廈的建築物。"},{"start":15736.977,"end":15737.137,"text":"对吧"},{"start":15751.889,"end":15767.595,"text":"所以這時候加一層布 放出來"},{"start":15787.803,"end":15789.104,"text":"後面那個620,625,625,625,625,625,625,625,625,625"},{"start":15811.683,"end":15836.574,"text":"這個要動腰 改動腰肌 要動腰肌 要動腰肌 要動腰肌要動腰肌 要動腰肌"},{"start":15840.183,"end":15840.523,"text":"這裏面有一個大廈,是一個大廈"},{"start":15859.2,"end":15866.228,"text":"中文字幕志愿者 杨茜茜"},{"start":15890.092,"end":15892.913,"text":"三個字就三個字三個字就三個字"},{"start":15922.179,"end":15922.199,"text":"嗨!"},{"start":15946.084,"end":15949.187,"text":"倒數第二盤 最後三盤"},{"start":15987.127,"end":15990.627,"text":"這裏是大廈的廟宇"},{"start":16017.383,"end":16033.751,"text":"好,我們來看一張照片"},{"start":16044.822,"end":16046.924,"text":"這個都已經有了"},{"start":16072.956,"end":16094.283,"text":"這裏有一個大廈的廚房"},{"start":16100.995,"end":16114.144,"text":"中文字幕志愿者 杨栋梁"},{"start":16129.988,"end":16139.534,"text":"這裏有個大廈,有個大廈"},{"start":16163.706,"end":16164.607,"text":"謝謝收看,下次見"},{"start":16270.145,"end":16271.832,"text":"谢谢大家"},{"start":16388.749,"end":16390.483,"text":"我們現在要去哪裡呢"},{"start":16489.521,"end":16489.541,"text":"好"},{"start":16505.589,"end":16508.615,"text":"可以給大家介紹一下的經驗和方法"},{"start":16552.617,"end":16552.938,"text":"謝謝大家"},{"start":16596.564,"end":16597.368,"text":"我先喝一杯水"},{"start":16637.253,"end":16654.939,"text":"這裏是大廈的大廈"},{"start":16676.293,"end":16676.613,"text":"嗯嗯"},{"start":16712.449,"end":16718.195,"text":"謝謝大家的收看"},{"start":16764.757,"end":16766.238,"text":"這裏面的職政黨的都不在場"},{"start":16773.328,"end":16773.608,"text":"最貼心的"},{"start":16800.682,"end":16804.212,"text":"感谢观看"},{"start":16845.941,"end":16867.23,"text":"謝謝大家"},{"start":16885.035,"end":16907.562,"text":"今天投資不動彈的,你的投資,我們台中的投資都不動彈。我們都這樣,是吧?你都去投資。今天投資不動彈的,你看看投資,投資到哪裡都沒有了。我們台中的投資都沒有了。"},{"start":16909.418,"end":16909.979,"text":"嗯嗯嗯嗯"},{"start":16941.876,"end":16945.16,"text":"嗯嗯"},{"start":16967.832,"end":16975.118,"text":"谢谢观看"},{"start":16977.814,"end":17000.38,"text":"可以融合在一起嗎?可以融合在一起嗎?可以融合在一起嗎?可以融合在一起嗎?可以融合在一起嗎?可以融合在一起嗎?可以融合在一起嗎?可以融合在一起嗎?可以融合在一起嗎?可以融合在一起嗎?"},{"start":17006.996,"end":17016.262,"text":"唯一比较成果色的那一种是,把眼睛换掉,顶起来的话,就有这样的,然后你能够让它温定,就没有这样的肚臍了。"},{"start":17019.053,"end":17046.305,"text":"謝謝,謝謝。"},{"start":17048.672,"end":17067.747,"text":"好,可以看嗎?可以看嗎?可以看嗎?可以看嗎?可以看嗎?"},{"start":17075.948,"end":17081.151,"text":"葉梅養豬場的開放參觀葉梅養豬場的開放參觀葉梅養豬場的開放參觀葉梅養豬場的開放參觀葉梅養豬場的開放參觀葉梅養豬場的開放參觀葉梅養豬場的開放參觀葉梅養豬場的開放參觀"},{"start":17119.552,"end":17121.013,"text":"中文字幕志愿者 杨茜茜"},{"start":17138.235,"end":17159.516,"text":"我們繼續開會 現在進行台灣糖業股份有限公司的協商我們先處理業務計畫 第一案請說明檢要 因為你們都已經溝通過 檢要說明就好了"},{"start":17160.27,"end":17168.019,"text":"董事長你可以說台語沒關係你可以說葡萄圍沒關係說葡萄圍齁我都聽得到啦謝謝 謝謝我可以我來講的好 也可以我聽 跟湯姚你這個講給阿發沒關係沒關係 沒關係 沒關係好 羅氏如麻 沒關係 沒關係好 沒關係 沒關係齁"},{"start":17181.832,"end":17209.74,"text":"第一個就是因為汐止4月部循環豬場改建案一定在今年完成所以下面很多養殖場的那個豬尿袋處理會用沼渣等處理所以拜託委員能夠美麗動輒好主席好那第一案我們就預算照列好那處理第二案到第七案請說明因為我們香港重視公安安全防護器具以及消防設備的改善"},{"start":17210.62,"end":17237.673,"text":"等信任會用所以這個就列在這幾個都是在這個部分謝謝好請出座委員來多年三百萬啊對啊提出書面報告好安全很重要好多年三百萬提出書面報告那第二案到第七案凍結三百萬書面報告好第八案請說明因為充電樁進度落後本年度會趕上那這個希望能夠"},{"start":17238.789,"end":17259.95,"text":"委員能夠同意改正書面報告 謝謝好 那第八案預算照列 第九案請說明我們的費用已經比七年度多了4800萬請委員能夠免禮增累 謝謝好 第九案沒有"},{"start":17264.79,"end":17293.485,"text":"我們送書面資料那如果說不用增列是更好啦 謝謝不是 你有跟邱議員委員溝通過了嗎沒有他如果同意的話請他簽個名這樣子好好 照列 照列 謝謝好 第九案我們就不增列了預算照列第十案請說明那我們這個部分喔那個我們以委員溝通過啦那委員希望增列五百萬"},{"start":17294.872,"end":17322.739,"text":"好 你那個改成為增列500萬的話請你把簽名送上來喔我們已經簽名了 謝謝請行政人員你這個有跟委員溝通的不管是改組決議或者是有修改的動結數的話都要事先送過來好 第10案第10案增列500萬好 謝謝第11案請說明也是一樣那個充電段的事情那我們跟委員已經簽名就改成組決議 謝謝"},{"start":17324.346,"end":17326.294,"text":"好 第十一案預算照列改組決議"},{"start":17328.171,"end":17357.081,"text":"第12案請說明因為我們土地主株不授所以要針對糧液災害很有困難希望委員能夠免以針對改成書面報告12案因為土地不能用主株不授所以這針對就不針對了預算照列第13案請說明是充電樁的那個進度那我們今年會改善希望"},{"start":17363.329,"end":17378.605,"text":"請問楊全英委員你這個充電樁我也覺得很奇怪很大半的讓你們去處理但是你們的進度都拿不起來這個原因是什麼是你們自方的原因還是他方的原因不是"},{"start":17379.437,"end":17400.137,"text":"那個喔 相關的因為我們要申請啊要核准我們是保護人家做啦 啊他在做的時候他就要經過通過 啊去請 要給他代電 申請當然要依法啊 啊別人也一樣這樣在做啊 你這樣子的理由不成理由啊當然是要 不可能你的人自己代電 自己去找啊"},{"start":17401.678,"end":17427.396,"text":"對不對 你要外包給人家 然後他要依照法程序去申請嘛 台電申請嘛對阿你今天是台藤公司 這樣還會延宕 阿你如果一般的背信不再要求對不對 怎麼會政府應該是帶頭作用阿本席的意見是這樣子阿 為什麼你看前面幾個案子也都是一樣你說你告訴我說要追上 你怎麼追"},{"start":17428.484,"end":17433.336,"text":"大概我們有跟廠商達到說今年應該會全部把他追上我們的進度"},{"start":17434.81,"end":17462.742,"text":"那今年會應當他有什麼特別的方案嗎對不對廠商不變啊請說明我跟委員說明我們有兩個方案第一個就是說我們成立那個國營事業的一個充電樁的一個群組那所以我們跟台電公司就是說我們廠商如果已經準備好了我們就會在那群組上跟台電公司取得聯繫掛件之後的預審等等就是會"},{"start":17464.763,"end":17475.733,"text":"跟台電公司會有直接的一個聯繫那第二個部分就是說之前會比較嚴當的原因就是說廠商他要提出這個志願性產品檢驗的一個證明"},{"start":17478.695,"end":17483.439,"text":"很多的廠商都在這邊卡關所以我們後續就是說我們對於得標廠商他剛開始在規劃的時候我們就主動提出整個他要興建過程的這個流程圖給這個提供給他廠商然後還有就是說哪邊哪邊會之前的經驗會卡關的部分我們都已經有把這個經驗你們有再檢討請問現在執行多少"},{"start":17503.524,"end":17511.79,"text":"我們到今年底是要有96隻那我們現在那實際是68隻那我們在明年的話我們會全部就是我們到明年是會到106隻我們到明年底我們在今年底我們到106都會把它完成那我剛剛報告的是113年底是68我們完成了68隻那計畫目標是96隻這樣子"},{"start":17531.354,"end":17547.444,"text":"我聽到行政部門 當然大家都辛苦啦但是我覺得人家民間在做事情必定要很積極你剛才說成立一個群組我們現在隨便一條水溝要做我們就是得標的廠商跟里長"},{"start":17550.225,"end":17576.473,"text":"那個發包單位就是一個群組對不對 我們到現在才改變這個方法 難怪你會延宕那麼久啊這樣不對啊所以一定要積極啦 為了要積極你們也延宕這麼久 那個13案我建議主席我們凍結3000萬報告後你們的方案使得動之好 謝謝 好 我們的營業總支出的第13案凍結3000萬書面報告"},{"start":17582.008,"end":17608.442,"text":"接下來第14案請說明謝委員已經簽名就說那個改成專案不是 改成書面報告凍結 那用凍結那個整列改成凍結1.5%那改成書面報告1.5%就是等一下 等一下你為什麼蛤你是同意嗎蛤"},{"start":17609.517,"end":17631.189,"text":"不是 他是凍結我知道他的意思啦齁他有跟謝一鳳委員溝通過了就不以簡列改成書面報告預算照列是嗎對預算照列啦 沒有凍結了啦要凍結啊 但是我們跟他你的水電費 每個月都要納4億元你凍結 凍結一定發生什麼事"},{"start":17638.427,"end":17657.874,"text":"沒有已經溝通好了啦我來處理第14案給書面報告不以凍結預算照列然後第15案請說明第15案請說明這個因為那些費用保錢等等的費用檢驗"},{"start":17666.361,"end":17690.561,"text":"服務會法律執行 法律事務會委託檢驗會等之類 請兩邊以檢列動輒改成書面報告 謝謝好啦 照例了這個預算是全部支持 但是書面報告要詳細 精進一點好15案預算照列書面報告我們現在處理16案到25案 請說明那因為那個"},{"start":17696.67,"end":17715.567,"text":"第十四案是我們豬會增加那個豬肉肉片火鍋肉片都會增加請能免禮凍結改成書片報告那第十七案的話那個美國公司我們要持續改善也請能免禮凍結改成書片報告那十八案的理由跟十六案的理由是一樣請能"},{"start":17719.91,"end":17743.29,"text":"還有19案的話那個總經理主席我可不可以先講一下委員給你提案你不是直接講答案答案是主席才要講是請你說明說明為什麼人家凍結你希望不凍結或者是不立美國怎麼樣到底內容是什麼你要講這個好董事長那個你可以講明"},{"start":17743.71,"end":17771.645,"text":"閩南語比較可以精進的說明清楚那本席是才是說現在處理是16案到25案你要整體這個預算項目的說明那最後才是要動要剪要書面要專案是由主席來才是你只要對委員提案的內容給予說明清楚做一個溝通這樣好不好你不用一案一案來你可以一起講有些案子是相關聯的好不好"},{"start":17772.671,"end":17795.551,"text":"好謝謝因為第17案委員提的是美國公司的情況那我們今年會持續的改善那18案的話是改善就本來是虧損那現在我們虧損要少一點這一個部分那你要說要怎麼做"},{"start":17797.304,"end":17812.587,"text":"跟各位報告我們美國分公司的部分我們在開源的部分我們現在已經我們那個分公司是是在加州的北部然後我們現在已經在我們在去年的時候113年我們已經開拓市場到加州的南部甚至到這個美東的這個部分所以我們在113年我們美國分公司的這個虧損已經減少了1500萬元這是第一點"},{"start":17824.369,"end":17850.28,"text":"那節流的這個部分我們在溫室的這個部分我們投入這個設備的一個改善所以電費也大幅的減少那第三個部分就是說我們在美國基地有一個加州的在加州基地的部分那我們經過檢討之後也把加州的這個德州基地的部分我們已經把這個德州基地的業務把它"},{"start":17851.937,"end":17862.106,"text":"所以那邊的虧損也可以降低這個是具體降低我們美國分公司的一個做法陳總你這樣講我就聽清楚聽明白了我的疑惑也瞬間毛色鈍開"},{"start":17871.213,"end":17892.317,"text":"講重點 我的質疑 為什麼我要凍結你500萬有原因 你針對我的原因說明我可以接受 我當然就可以免於凍結主席我就把16 17 18 三案全部改成主決議好 楊群英委員"},{"start":17894.652,"end":17908.627,"text":"謝謝主席剛剛台談公司所做的說明因為大家對於我們在海外的投資大家都非常的希望可以跟國際接軌那我認為說我們台談公司也有責任"},{"start":17909.608,"end":17926.194,"text":"就像我們邱昭偉所說的他毛色鈍開原來你們在做什麼但是很多人還是不知道所以我希望要有一個書面資料告訴我們你們目前現在的狀態如何那麼在新年度裡頭你預計可以有哪些前瞻性"},{"start":17927.154,"end":17952.429,"text":"的方案以及預計的KPI到底是什麼請你順便資料給我們經濟委員會也給本席那第二個呢23萬是本席所提我一再再強調在我們的營業成本裡頭投資性的不動產費用因為我們現在有很多你們自己用你們的土地然後去蓋這個包租工"},{"start":17953.569,"end":17967.736,"text":"這個因應各個都市的樣態 你們也隨時再調整那以我們台中 你在豬公台中 你是一定是大賺錢而且你包豬公的方面 這個也非常好"},{"start":17968.496,"end":17994.553,"text":"那現在社會擺態也就是你要賺錢你必須要將你的成本要怎麼樣節流這個很重要以往光光是這個比如說電費派去什麼的這一些事務性的水管壞掉啊什麼的這些事務性的那現在也有很多是怎麼樣做是我們自己管理還是我們委託這個代租公的這個公司來管理你們有沒有去"},{"start":17995.894,"end":18011.541,"text":"就是去檢討我們在節流的方面成本節流我可以怎麼樣又好又這個成本又低我覺得這個是我們公家機關裡頭我很重視的要怎麼樣去去節流"},{"start":18012.861,"end":18035.417,"text":"這個是非常重要 因為光是這個節流又可以賺到很多錢也就是在你的成本可以降低的時候 你當然你的EPS就會高起來嘛那所以我這個23案呢 我原本是給你減列就是減列620萬那我現在可以 就是以凍結的方式那這個凍結600萬"},{"start":18039.039,"end":18048.813,"text":"那你們將你們截留的方案營業成本的這個不動產部分的你怎麼樣截留方案書面報告時的動資好嗎好請陳婷菲委員"},{"start":18055.11,"end":18072.995,"text":"謝謝主席我想我的提案的部分是希望說我們的整個在續產事業的部分是不是能夠有所謂增加更多的一些量能然後怎麼能夠有比較高的"},{"start":18073.775,"end":18102.309,"text":"一些盈餘盈利甚至推廣這個部分所以我們希望說我們在整個閒置的能量好像會有一些事件因為台堂常常都是首當其衝如果有狀況我們就是要先閒置不能與民爭利大概會有這樣的狀況那到底我們如果遇到這些我們怎麼去調整"},{"start":18104.53,"end":18126.279,"text":"調節然後而不是好像放在那裡就是沒有辦法有更多的一些我們的營業收入然後每一次然後相抵之後我們的盈餘又沒有那麼高營業利益沒有那麼高所以因為我們畢竟我們公司也是"},{"start":18128.041,"end":18141.702,"text":"營業為主要目的當然我們在重要的這個政策當中還是要配合可是我們在配合當中然後在我們的一個調節度做一個最適配的"},{"start":18142.643,"end":18164.965,"text":"我覺得這是我們要去思考的啦所以我希望說我凍結這個一千萬然後我們一個月提出書面報告使得凍結就是在調節的時候那閒置的部分呢我們該怎麼去做處理然後給我們一個報告書面報告好 謝謝委員好 請張旗開委員"},{"start":18166.995,"end":18184.722,"text":"我提了二十二跟二十五我今天 當時你跟我說我台語比較廉重 但是我台語說那個二十二案就是現在的經濟部在推動這個再生能源可是不能變成說一直在砍樹砍樹我提了兩個 你看這兩個例子第一個是最近"},{"start":18188.715,"end":18206.76,"text":"屏東月滿園你這個你撤企劃這個事情本來就是光電專區嘛你看二十幾年你看二十幾年這個現在已經停下來了也過了我自己當一個人你們台湯地我自己當一個人你現在在那裡撤企劃你砍樹去種光電你摧毀了那個有77公頃的那整個自然生態都破壞了當地我很多當一個人在那裡看他的"},{"start":18216.069,"end":18223.718,"text":"我就提的案子我要砍掉你三千萬的這個預算我現在先把它改成凍結可是你要趕快去幫我了解一下這個案子"},{"start":18225.348,"end":18243.253,"text":"當然了解 我就簡略先把它改成凍結 因為年頭是有來做溝通啦我這個態度也很好 那更重要的就是要改革問題我把它變成凍結 包括你現在 你知道一星期來你要稍微去了解整個狀況77公頃 這是很嚴重的 民眾 當局有很多民眾在抗議的嘛你一星期你給他了解看到底要如何後續改革 好不好"},{"start":18250.095,"end":18267.808,"text":"我跟委員報告啦,平時我很清楚的,因為那是,剛才就是說配合那個兩原素,把林鄉不佳的改成農用,先改成農用,連隔天報告就出來了,所以我們就順便動起來,平時那件我很清楚的。"},{"start":18268.789,"end":18268.909,"text":"另外這個24案"},{"start":18285.345,"end":18295.172,"text":"就是你以前當署長的這件事他去準備土地賣給這個村農公司這個弊案這其實範圍都有範圍啦你們台湯損失2億5千萬這算是很嚴重的嘛其實台湯就是要去錢要去賺回來嘛有範圍有範圍嘛所以你現在有兩個要做的嘛你去對他的 你可以去看不看這個什麼"},{"start":18310.902,"end":18321.889,"text":"執行署嘛,你叫他先去請他的財產嘛,現在就是包括黃國昌,他們現在都去堆就住了,說他現在開BMW的高級車,去高檔的產品吃飯,檢測官就叫他去吃飯,你現在去堆,就是說好像堆了很多次回來,這是第一例嘛,第二次的,你現在如果堆,他到現在都沒辦法理他"},{"start":18335.196,"end":18335.737,"text":"我們已經向法院議席"},{"start":18358.513,"end":18387.042,"text":"那個113年12月9號向法院遞狀申請再以強制執行依強制執行法第19條規定申請調查債務人 無難人等4人之財產狀況那向中華民國連受保險商業同業工會中華郵政公司台灣集中保管結算所公司及勞動部勞工保險及查刑"},{"start":18387.822,"end":18410.952,"text":"以及請求法案依強制執行法第20條規定定期間令無難人等4人即時報告財產狀態與立強制執行我們的繳錢了現在我們是很積極的在做到法案那邊 謝謝法官你有申請他要不會回你就對了對你要12月當時申請12月19日12月19日現在今天當時今天一位"},{"start":18417.139,"end":18423.196,"text":"請教一個位啊要一個位啊就一個位這件事對後面都比較清楚 如果還要有消息回來我們的法務"},{"start":18424.412,"end":18451.004,"text":"我們這個法務委員這個要看執行處他的那個案子怎麼樣子啦他不可能為台南車線優先來處理不是要查 上面這個案子是國案啊你以前一直在那裡嘛對不對在那裡是國案啊在那裡四個人的財產應該很好查的啊那他在12月19號有給我們一張文我們也去繳費用了那他會去查像那個人壽保險的那個工會啊等等他會去查 查到之後他會把它扣掉"},{"start":18451.684,"end":18473.546,"text":"好,這樣,我看要再一、兩個禮拜當然,馬上有回來你就趕快給我啦好啊,如果沒有回來一、兩個禮拜,我還要做這個進度,好不好?好,謝謝所以吃一隻,不要第一隻這麼多,第二隻他就在外面開名車然後這個,吃這個高檔的餐廳因為整個社會觀感會不好啦對整個經濟部跟台黨形象也會不好啊,要繼續推,好不好?謝謝"},{"start":18474.827,"end":18477.889,"text":"好我們現在處理16案到25案第16 17 18改為主決議那16到25我們凍結3000萬書面報告接下來是26案到29案請說明最主要這個"},{"start":18493.646,"end":18521.756,"text":"我們營業費用是受那個年初的那個 七年初的西部特樓的影響還有疫情商品 本來我們疫情商品那個酒精方面都賣得很好啊 但是受到影響所以七年的營業有下降 希望我們能夠能夠改成那個 給我們改成市民報告 然後"},{"start":18523.837,"end":18546.794,"text":"那個在29的地方第幾到第幾26到26到哪裡到29那29案因為那個主席有提到就有一些問題但是"},{"start":18549.174,"end":18560.048,"text":"經法案的清查就我們調查出來我們連也沒有割捷地方但我們一定會加強員工的信念那來"},{"start":18562.029,"end":18579.448,"text":"有這種事情的話我們在廢棄物處理法裡面就我們員工沒有去勾結而是他下雨的關係造成那個委員所關心的這件事情那到現在查出來都沒有我們員工勾結的情況以上跟委員報告 謝謝好"},{"start":18583.421,"end":18596.655,"text":"這個是我們台糖整個運作的這個相關的支出啦那因為台糖公司剛剛就我們董事長所講的就是冷凍豬肉遭到檢舉說有瘦肉肌有西部特羅那後來呢我們大量的來採樣檢查的時候"},{"start":18599.378,"end":18622.613,"text":"也做了一個檢測並沒有驗出這個西部特羅那但是現在我們要查出來是污染源在哪裡污染的源頭你沒有把明確查出來這樣子的話你整個流程有必要做檢討這樣子才能夠挽回到民眾對台糖商品的這個信心所以這個也必須要詳細的檢討之後給我們書面報告好不好這個是不是先跟委員報告因為我們從那個飼料"},{"start":18625.697,"end":18654.637,"text":"毛豬血液都在場裡面都查了總共檢測了920幾個樣品都沒有查出你是檢測出來的就給我們報告嘛給我們書面報告所以26案到29案我們凍結1000萬書面報告好請去委員來對不起謝謝那個董事長我請教一下你們這個因為西部特羅的這個烏龍事件所造成的營業損失是多少"},{"start":18656.338,"end":18684.418,"text":"那你們現在所有的檢測都是零那那個營業損失跟商譽有沒有要請求賠償?如何重建你們台堂的商譽?你不要笑啊,這很嚴肅的問題啊是是是你評判這麼嚴格,阿馮跟你說有時沒有透露整個整個你們台堂的地板都綁板啊你們現在驗出來確實是沒有啊那如果是一般的公司這個是要去求償的捏"},{"start":18686.206,"end":18705.746,"text":"阿你這樣放過了嗎?或是每次拼了沒辦法自己顧好自己我講這是嚴肅的議題喔這個不是政治議題喔這未來不管是誰如果還是講台糖又驗出來又一個搞一個烏龍然後你們的豬肉銷售量又下跌這國營事業你總是"},{"start":18706.923,"end":18719.333,"text":"不是說國營世界就可以隨便污蔑嘛你如果是搞這樣子的話你們還是要有一個求償機制啊你的整個商域受損你把自己當成是一個企業來經營如果你的企業是這樣商域受損的話你們要怎麼處理是"},{"start":18724.326,"end":18735.898,"text":"好 那董事長剛剛的書面報告不管是你檢測的整個過程還有未來的求償部分法律途徑這個你都要書面報告講清楚好那26到29就凍結1000萬書面報告接下來是30案到34案請說明這個最主要就是說"},{"start":18743.462,"end":18771.863,"text":"我們的那個廠房有24處的那個停閉的場期但其實我們已經活化了76.2%那我們最主要是交那個土地稅交了2.1億那這個是因為我們要活化的話沒有辦法一下就全部活化因為要年要錢要時間所以希望委員能夠給我們那個便宜"},{"start":18772.799,"end":18778.426,"text":"剪裁後沒有動輒而我們提那個書面報告謝謝好請邱志偉回言"},{"start":18781.387,"end":18808.403,"text":"這個我也去昨天去質詢嘛因為34年都沒有去處理所以可能總經理比較了解這個你們要提出一個改善方案不是每年都是花那麼多的這個稅金在上面是跟委員報告我們具體的做法可以分成兩類第一類就是它是樹地的部分比如說我們的這個屏東場區那還有我們的新興場區的這個部分那"},{"start":18808.843,"end":18830.482,"text":"不涉及到文資身份的部分我們就是透過這個都市計畫的一個一個變更那這兩個案子其實我們在顯示土地的部分在屏東廠區它就已經佔了60公頃那新興廠區也將近21公頃所以最主要是這兩個廠區的土地那目前都是在"},{"start":18832.943,"end":18846.481,"text":"高雄沒有因為高雄我們的這個像岐山我們都已經變成是岐塘文創園區了那我們整個這個橋頭的部分也都活化是是是對那這個部分我們就是透過都市計畫"},{"start":18847.462,"end":18871.595,"text":"專案變更的方式那另外有一部分就是會涉及到它是這個古蹟那歷史建築文資身份的這個部分我們必須要依照文資法的三個程序修復再利用計畫還有這個這個細部設計因應計畫那接下來是修復工程的一個發包我可以理解你們有做最大的努力但是還是有進步空間所以我才會凍結"},{"start":18874.216,"end":18880.438,"text":"凍結300萬可以再降到凍結100萬提出書面報告好謝謝好前面的第29案是改組決議好那33案到34案凍結100萬書面報告第35案請說明因為我們今年那個"},{"start":18895.66,"end":18924.966,"text":"毛住量會增加 那毛住量我們就外包人力會增加那個大概增加86% 那水電大概會佔啦 佔86% 水電佔9%所以希望能夠那個免以凍結謝謝好 第35案預算照列改成主決議第36案請說明那個張委員他已經簽名同意撤案你那個送過來沒要不要送過來"},{"start":18927.674,"end":18953.937,"text":"好 第三十六案預算照列現在處理重大資建設事業第三十七案到四十二案請說明最主要跟委員跟主席報告就是說我們榮慧新環租產改建今年完工那當然物價那個調整工程委託建造技術服務的展援配合鄰里意見"},{"start":18955.411,"end":18977.896,"text":"調整部分租場的改建範圍以及公共藝術法令適用等不可抗議因素所以我們追加了17億多的那個經費那這今年要執行而且可以可以完成的那是希望那個委員能夠給那個改成書面報告謝謝請清雲委員"},{"start":18982.83,"end":18988.846,"text":"謝謝主席這個董事長您剛講說這個17億是追加的你們確定今年可以完成嗎"},{"start":18990.598,"end":19014.643,"text":"三年前也是這樣說你們的期程一直在往後延然後剛剛第35案的時候您又講說你們的租資今年是可以增加的那你的這個租場改建還沒有完成租資可以增加你這裡有信心跟委員報告我們租場改建當然是第一個早就完成有分成第一期跟第二期那是第一期我知道你現在是說你後面在內的"},{"start":19017.472,"end":19031.105,"text":"你比較長的可以完成 如果不完成呢?叫我的結尾是可以完成 因為齁計畫都趕不上變化啊叫你的結尾是可以完成 你現在缺工缺料 頂頂的來總經理 你要說明一下嗎 還是你們什麼人 資產OK 我們那個 矽資部的處長"},{"start":19035.885,"end":19061.093,"text":"報告委員現在目前我們其實有兩期的改建第一期的部分六個場現在應該都算已經完成現在就是在養豬了所以剛剛講說那個養豬量在今年來講會持續的增加這是第一個原因第二個第二期的部分有七個場那當然七個場目前的進度平均起來應該已經八大概八十趴了裡頭有四個肉豬場現在進度應該是九十趴左右"},{"start":19061.613,"end":19086.312,"text":"那這個部分就是說其實應該是在最近的幾個月我們就會開始陸陸續續進租來做功能的測試那最慢的有三個場現在是排在大概六月左右應該會完成也可以慢慢的持續的進租所以才會講說後面的那個租的量會逐漸的提升上來這樣子 以上報告那我就不堅持我就不凍結可是可不可以請你們把這些"},{"start":19087.519,"end":19110.095,"text":"詳細的計畫書面送過來好請邱志偉委員你們要說明我也了解那我還是不要啦你都不動我也不用動我還是改組決議好了好我們來處理第37案到42案書面報告預算照列第43案請說明"},{"start":19116.609,"end":19133.221,"text":"雖然是那個113年12月20號嘉義縣政府富阪台南公司我們同意以包租代管的模式來辦理那我們董事會通過以後就可以跟嘉義縣政府來簽約那而且委員那個我們跟蔡委員"},{"start":19134.505,"end":19142.751,"text":"那個郭通過他改成主決議謝謝好把他送過來委員簽名的送過來好43案改為主決議現在來處理主決議44案"},{"start":19147.796,"end":19167.227,"text":"遵照辦理通過45案遵照辦理通過46案遵照辦理通過47案遵照辦理通過48案遵照辦理通過49案遵照辦理通過50案遵照辦理通過51案遵照辦理通過52案遵照辦理通過53案遵照辦理通過54案遵照辦理"},{"start":19170.009,"end":19193.983,"text":"通過55案 遵照辦理通過56案 遵照辦理通過57案 遵照辦理通過58案 遵照辦理通過59案 遵照辦理通過60案 遵照辦理通過61案 遵照辦理通過62案文字修正修正哪裡修正那個倒數第二行都把它刪除說一下"},{"start":19195.595,"end":19217.607,"text":"那個就說倒數第二行的應積極活化利用停工廠房並應將位於原住民地區之閒置廠房五廠四次作為原住民文創基地與發揮資產多元應用之效益全部把它刪除掉是 謝謝好 鄭天才委員鄭委員已經同意好"},{"start":19219.407,"end":19235.113,"text":"62案文字修正通過第63案遵照辦理通過第64案遵照辦理通過第65案文字修正好請說明就在那個島數第二行從併那個地方開始那個山處從併的地方"},{"start":19241.673,"end":19269.396,"text":"並積極地將屬於戰用隊 謝謝好 鄭天才委員好 同意第65案文字修正通過第66案 遵照辦理通過第67案 遵照辦理通過第68案 遵照辦理通過第69案文字修正請說明以美計刪掉就倒數第二行的最後三個字"},{"start":19277.226,"end":19293.86,"text":"倒數第二行最後三個字書面報告刪除你現在是要刪除與美計這三個字刪掉是不是台廠公司應將開發進度及成果向立法院經紀委員會提書面報告"},{"start":19297.645,"end":19316.149,"text":"所以不是最後三個字順便報告導述第二行導述第二行所以你要講導述第二行美季把它改掉以美季美季改掉那個賴委員有沒有簽字來我們請邱映穎委員還沒送來"},{"start":19326.256,"end":19351.859,"text":"好 69案文字修正通過 新增69之1案69之1陳天飛委員的提案 昨天有諮詢你了主決議第69之1照案通過 遵照辦理 對不起 sorry sorry"},{"start":19353.673,"end":19378.422,"text":"好 謝謝 69案通 69之1案通過來 我們接續進行台灣中油股份有限公司的協商那個審查完畢的單位可以先行回去辦公"},{"start":19390.302,"end":19419.021,"text":"我們現在就來處理114年度中油公司的預算業務計畫在第一案到第八案請先說明主席各位委員大家好那麼我們114年的在環保支出預算的編列是84億那麼工作的主要重點是在污染防治設備以及的改善那麼力求減少罰單來強化我們的節能減碳公司永續經營"},{"start":19420.888,"end":19424.212,"text":"那麼114年相較於去年我們所編列的預算來講已經減少了編列的6.5億那麼我們後續會"},{"start":19432.199,"end":19452.326,"text":"把握這個預算那在公司的這個環保的制度面操作面跟設備面來持續的深切檢討來降低罰單的一個件數那這個案子我們經過幾位委員跟拜訪以後那麼其中第二案張家俊委員還有第六案謝一鳳委員的提案"},{"start":19453.146,"end":19478.719,"text":"或者委員同意改為書面報告另外第5案陳超明委員改為凍結500萬也提書面報告那麼以上說明提醒委員支持好這第1案到第8案請邱志偉委員好1到8嗎這個剛剛這個說明是"},{"start":19483.134,"end":19510.582,"text":"好像沒講到重點 你幫的事業我是第七案嘛 我可以不要動那麼多 但是這個公安的部分有時候會讓人家覺得好像有時候會出現一些公安或者環保的問題那個終於連支事業部都是在高雄嘛所以我那邊還有一二天安氣"},{"start":19511.676,"end":19525.311,"text":"所以公安一定要做到確實的所以我覺得是不是鳳姐千萬提出對公安環保衛生的盡盡作為提出書篇報告之後我們再來動之那是動500好了好 請楊瓊議員"},{"start":19531.153,"end":19551.022,"text":"謝謝楊卓銘發言 諸董事我想要請教你剛才的報告當中說你這個114年度呢你是比前年度減了這個減6.5億表示你有方法但是我要請教的是說因為越來越多"},{"start":19552.162,"end":19562.762,"text":"的這個環保標準是比以往是越來越嚴那這樣的情況之下 你目前你的罰單最多的類別是什麼"},{"start":19563.976,"end":19586.683,"text":"最多的類別就是像VOC 就是有機非化性氣體的那個罰單比較多那個很恐怖耶 一下子一台自動車進去你們就要暫停啦現在各地方政府對於非化性氣體的管制非常嚴而且一旦查到的話罰的都很重"},{"start":19588.151,"end":19615.741,"text":"這不是法案重視,你不能有這樣子的因為像我說要進去,一架摩托車去發生這個問題就整個要停掉是,那怎麼辦我們就只有在那個,我們是門禁管制會去把它加嚴另外在智慧公安的部分我們也要去把它加強也就是說透過AI的方式來去做遠程的監控能夠適時的把它制止"},{"start":19617.386,"end":19640.438,"text":"你現在講的這個就是一個重點遠程的監控現在很方便啊我們自己手機在裡面你連你家裡現在你要叫他怎麼樣他就怎麼樣啊就很方便啊這個我們應該都是要佈建吧對不對因為我們中友是一個模範生啊而且他也是一個指標的而且給你們的家門的像我們家門的都這麼多"},{"start":19642.312,"end":19669.687,"text":"那你這個你自己本身的模範神沒有做好家門的怎麼跟跟不上來啊這個我們加強我們加強對不對是這個部分我個人是認為對於算沒意見但是我是充分建議就像我們剛才在審幾個單位一樣訊息萬變技術方面它是越來越先進而且會越來越簡單那我們務必一定要去接軌"},{"start":19671.351,"end":19694.905,"text":"因為如果從業中我們的罰單都是一樣單一項目這一種項目都是排在第一名表示我們沒有進步那為什麼會發生這樣子呢對不對所以這個部分要怎麼樣去加強我相信有很大努力的空間嘛對對對要借用現代的科技來去做改善"},{"start":19695.581,"end":19711.276,"text":"那這個是您嘴巴說啊要不要實際行動啊會 我們正在建制當中因為本席跟你的一個我只有看到一個項目就是說你的罰單同樣是每一年都是那一個類別最多所以表示你根本沒精進啊"},{"start":19712.077,"end":19738.162,"text":"因為已經出現罰單就是表示問題在那裡可是每一年都一樣是那個問題罰單最多表示沒精進啊這個是我們在看預算裡頭最希望看到有精進的方案你把精進方案給我們好不好看你的KPI指數你預計要怎麼做我們在這裡不是說要聽到說我比去年少了6.5億我就通通預算給你不是這樣子的該當需要的"},{"start":19739.142,"end":19753.476,"text":"當然要全力支持啊但是該當都一樣沒有監禁怎麼給啊好不好你把方案出來KPI拿出來嘛讓每一年的罰單都同樣類別那這個不好啊好不好中油是金字招牌啊是對不對好請陳靜菲委員"},{"start":19759.779,"end":19783.938,"text":"其實我知道中油的預算其實都很拮据因為說真的我們油價的問題等等可是我們在監督的時候還是需要去做一些控管就是說我們所謂的空污品質的部分那我們也確實也有被相關單位去開罰的問題"},{"start":19785.899,"end":19807.74,"text":"那到底這一個開閥的問題跟我們現在每年也要求編列預算要去配合政府的環保政策那這當中到底有什麼漢格為什麼還是一樣有編預算也編了不少可是為什麼還是沒有辦法執行到位這是什麼原因"},{"start":19809.954,"end":19838.429,"text":"跟委員報告就是延續剛剛委員所提的問題我們最大的被開罰的範圍就是那個VOC超標的問題那因為我們公司的這個煉油廠它那個設備元件非常的多所以我們現在打算就是把每一天每一個月要求要自主去檢查這些設備元件有沒有洩漏我們要求把這個比例要提高"},{"start":19839.505,"end":19860.736,"text":"提高那在主管機關來查核之前我們再做最後一次確認那麼這樣的話就希望就是說主管機關來查核的時候對於設備元件的VOC的一個洩漏能夠在標準值以內那麼以前沒這麼做嗎以前我們要求的比例需要把它提高沒有那麼高對我們的比例沒那麼高對"},{"start":19862.017,"end":19889.749,"text":"那現在都很多科技我們其實可以透過很多的一個科技的大數據控管去控管這個部分因為我們每年省預算我們給予配合環保政策去處理一些相關的改善計畫我們每年的預算都蠻多的而且我們也都不敢去動因為這是空屋沒有人敢動"},{"start":19890.729,"end":19914.314,"text":"可是每年一樣這個被開單的狀態還沒減少對這讓我們就很納悶啊所以到底我們預期我們要達到什麼樣的一個標準好今年我們總是要自己訂一個標準吧我們期待說今年好這個預算下去我們期待下一次可以給我們什麼樣的一個目標值好"},{"start":19916.201,"end":19935.307,"text":"這個是不是容我們在書面報告的時候把我這個KPI一起把它放進去好那我我就凍結啦我本來要減劣啦但是我現在不要減劣但凍多一點我要凍結兩千萬啦凍兩千萬然後書面報告之後使得凍之好不好然後把我剛剛講的"},{"start":19936.627,"end":19965.492,"text":"就是說這一筆錢給你了那你要做什麼樣的一些KPI的一些控管達到什麼樣目標值那如果沒有達到怎麼辦我覺得這個東西都應該要有一些數據出來跟標準出來謝謝好 請清理委員好 謝謝主席這個董事長剛剛您講到這個部分你說你們現在那個BOC的部分你們現在要開始"},{"start":19966.451,"end":19983.149,"text":"做查核你們是一個月一次嗎?還是多久一次?目前我們是要求一個月一個月一次到主管機關來查不是一個月一次而是說一個月裡面所有的設備元件他要去查核的百分比定一個KPI"},{"start":19984.96,"end":19994.844,"text":"譬如說這個100個元件裡面要一個月裡面要完成自主的檢測到達5%舉個例子那我們現在把這個5%的比例把它提高譬如說10%"},{"start":20003.468,"end":20021.834,"text":"但是你這個不應該是要定期的有去做檢測除了你現在要做的這一塊以外難道不應該是定期的要去做檢測而不是在主管機關要來查核之前才把這個東西完成我覺得像這一塊就是說"},{"start":20022.694,"end":20044.186,"text":"中油在維護環保跟公安上面的SOP可能還要再更精進再更提高那你們能不能運用高科技的這些技術去減少你們在公安的事件跟環保比如說這些氣體外洩的事件的發生率"},{"start":20046.067,"end":20073.595,"text":"這個你們應該會有一些所謂的精進作為嘛預算都給了那怎麼樣去降低這些事故而不是說一直不斷的被環保機關來罰錢環保署對於很多新的設廠比如說我們現在在講一些新的這一些什麼SRF廠啦或者是這些什麼廢棄物的處理工廠等等的環保署對他們要求很嚴格啊"},{"start":20074.54,"end":20078.883,"text":"那中油在這一塊本來就應該要以身作則而且你們本來就應該帶頭要精進這些設備減少事故嘛"},{"start":20083.741,"end":20110.506,"text":"這一塊就像剛剛廷飛委員講的啦我覺得可能你們還是要再擬定一個一個更更精準的這些書面報告我可以不動我可以不凍結你們的預算啦但是我想要了解一下你們更精進的這些是作為好不好好是是好那第一案到第八案我們凍結兩千萬書面報告接下來是第九案到第十七案請說明"},{"start":20113.38,"end":20128.153,"text":"這個主要是公安預算那麼委員所關心的事情就是公司發生的公安事件以及總和傷害指數以及員工傷害頻率那麼有升高的一個趨勢我想說明的是這個費用"},{"start":20130.615,"end":20148.082,"text":"在今年來講編了30億那麼是比去年113年編的要多啦那主要的考慮就是我們公司在陸續的一些場域將會進入營運階段譬如說第三接收站"},{"start":20148.922,"end":20176.758,"text":"以及在永安的第三期的建設已經完成所以相關的這些設施設備也會比較多那剛剛提到在公安措施的方面我們要加強AI的一個防護AI的防護來去管理這個門禁以及我們要去管理在現場的員工或者是承攬商人員他所穿戴的"},{"start":20178.479,"end":20203.22,"text":"裝備跟他的工作的行為能夠也能夠預先的預測出來能夠適時的在遠端監控能夠制止他那麼希望藉由這樣的方式來降低這些公安的事故那麼所編列的預算也懇請就是委員們能夠支持以上說明好 請邱英委員"},{"start":20204.466,"end":20227.549,"text":"謝謝主席董事長您剛講到一個重點我上次去參加新創展的時候我發現有一個研發我覺得這個中游應該要去深度了解那個新創展裡頭有一個人他研發了一套東西是他可以偵測到你在這個建築工地或者是一個什麼樣的工廠裡面的氣體有沒有外洩還有工人"},{"start":20229.181,"end":20246.509,"text":"你在工作的工人佩戴的安全帽他隨時上面都有sensor可以定位你所在的區域安不安全或者是你有沒有確實的佩戴這些安全的設施如果是有這樣我去新創展看到這個研發的時候我非常的驚訝我覺得這個所有的"},{"start":20247.549,"end":20271.169,"text":"公共安全公共建設上面都應該要去了解這個配備應該都要去考慮採用所以您剛講到這個我剛提的就是說運用新的科技比如說你們的廠區裡頭也有類似這樣的一個感應器裝置或者是說跟什麼樣的新創公司研究這個新創很多都是我們經濟部在輔導的"},{"start":20273.69,"end":20295.424,"text":"我覺得運用這些東西來降低你們的公安事故或者是提高這個公共工作環境的公共安全這個是很重要的所以你剛剛講的其實你是在複述我的話但是我不確定你到底知不知道有這樣的東西存在那這個是不是能夠把它列為未來你們在降低公安上面的一個很重要的"},{"start":20296.55,"end":20299.233,"text":"我們現在打算在我們公司的場域選擇一個工廠"},{"start":20319.032,"end":20333.35,"text":"當成是一個示範場域我們把這些AI的科技呢所想到的部分在這個場域裡面把它建置起來再看它實行的結果是怎麼樣那麼哪些適合哪些不適合或是要做什麼調整"},{"start":20334.051,"end":20359.067,"text":"那麼這個模式建立起來以後就推動到其他的工廠來一體的試用目前我們準備朝這個方向去做那麼有關公安的部分剛剛有再補充說明那麼第11案蔡議員跟第13案陳昌明委員那麼就這兩個提案他們也同意改成主決議以上補充好 請邱志偉委員"},{"start":20360.494,"end":20372.301,"text":"這個我們在高雄不管是林議員的石化事業部或者是在這個林市事業部相對的他的工作場域的危險性比較高"},{"start":20373.564,"end":20398.424,"text":"有阿伊歐亞天然氣還好 但是還是有它危險性所以中游的不管是操作或者你們這個工作的空間還是有一定的自災整體的總和性的自災指數也一直沒有降到降到1以下然後員工的傷害頻率也一直沒有到0傷亡我們希望你做到0傷亡"},{"start":20400.327,"end":20425.746,"text":"所以這目標 這個是內部管理問題如果每天都能夠戰戰兢兢 能夠確實貫徹我們說要零傷害 零傷亡是最主要的目標總和自災 你要降到1以下所以我覺得這部分其他部分我們都那麼堅持 但是功能部分我還是要堅持這個要凍結五百萬提出書面報告 加強內部管理機制是是好 凍結五百萬"},{"start":20427.472,"end":20434.637,"text":"第9案到第17案11案跟13案改為主決議全案我們凍結500萬書面報告接下來18案到21案請說明"},{"start":20443.021,"end":20462.049,"text":"這個案子我想委員關心的兩個事情第一個就是專利申請數的逐年下降還有專利為商業運用的占比偏低這兩個問題做以上說明我們公司在08年到110年專利申請數是雖然有下降不過在111年開始這個專利申請數已經開始逐年上升了"},{"start":20472.464,"end":20501.967,"text":"至於說這個專利數的為商業運用的占比低的原因是因為我們最近的研發的項目都是主要集中在前瞻科技方面的一個推動那麼前瞻科技的方面的一個推動這方面的一個運用恐怕需要一點時間讓我們累積更有效的一個專利那麼才能夠實施的商業化那麼做以上的說明請邱志偉言"},{"start":20505.433,"end":20520.19,"text":"謝謝主席 那個引發固然重要 這筆金額也非常大想請教一下比去年是多了一億七千多萬嘛相信八千萬嘛是所以八千萬我希望你們這個真的要有實際的結果那你們這個"},{"start":20521.796,"end":20545.43,"text":"預算增加的同時 你們專利的效益好像也沒有看到很明顯的增加 專利所以你的績效管理很重要這個經費我當然支持 研發也很重要特別是中油 你們這是研發的產品對未來一定有很大的幫助所以我覺得怎麼樣讓你們的研發的效能能夠朝向更多的專利累積"},{"start":20546.491,"end":20562.834,"text":"然後能夠有更好的外溢效果不管是智慧綠能、高質材料、循環經濟、智慧安環因為地熱、碳供應也很重要所以另外氫的技術 我昨天也諮詢過"},{"start":20570.936,"end":20596.006,"text":"清隆的开发这一部分所以我是觉得这个部分我是不是在52亿里面我们冻结500万提出这个你们如何去提升专利效益以及各方面的研发成果提出这篇报告冻结500万好我们"},{"start":20596.796,"end":20620.052,"text":"鄭天才委員你的提案 沒意見好 18案到21案凍結500萬書面報告第22案請說明22案主要是陳昌明委員關心的有關在鐵戰山碳封存的示範計畫那麼因為沒有碳源所以為了避免無效益的投資呢所提的凍結1000萬那麼這個案子呢"},{"start":20625.249,"end":20643.18,"text":"我們拜訪過委員,委員是同意改凍結200萬因為這個案子跟後面相關的其他案子都有關聯性我們是不是建議跟3243案一起再來並案辦理"},{"start":20648.933,"end":20666.825,"text":"好 第22案我們預算先照列在32、43在一併處理第23案請說明23案我們專照辦理好那我們第23案的營業收入增列1000萬"},{"start":20670.373,"end":20691.235,"text":"第24案已經測案了然後我們現在來處理營業總支出第25案到28案請說明是這個案子主要是針對是水電絕電費那麼委員他是關心希望我們國營事業要帶同節電那這部分我想做個說明那麼"},{"start":20693.375,"end":20696.941,"text":"當然國營事業來講中國公司一定也是要帶頭來節電這個我們會努力去做那麼對於這個今年所編的預算是78.9億"},{"start":20706.004,"end":20734.98,"text":"那麼主要叫113年增編的原因是我們今年會陸續有幾個工廠會開始營運譬如說第三接收站要開始營運那麼以及我們在煉製事業部的煉油的煉量來講的話也會配合現場會增加因此在這個水電方面的費用會增加那也希望委員支持能夠維持原列數"},{"start":20737.605,"end":20762.59,"text":"好 25到28案大概是水電費了我們就遵絕使用預算照列好 第29案請說明29案是有關於利息費用編列143億那委員的提案是因為公司虧損那麼財務狀況不好希望在利息費用的部分能夠準決"},{"start":20765.23,"end":20791.636,"text":"那我想說明就是在我們140年左邊的143億呢跟去年來比的話呢跟去年的決算數是102億來比的話是有增加了那主要原因就是我們中央銀行在去年的3月有升息那麼同時呢在7月跟10月也調升了銀行存款準備率那麼加上我們今年呢"},{"start":20792.476,"end":20814.835,"text":"預估的平均的這個付息負債的金額也會增加因此我們預估在今年所需要的支付的利息是需要去增加的所以因此懇請委員能夠支持好 第29案我們預算就照列第30案到31案請說明"},{"start":20817.22,"end":20844.37,"text":"第三十案 三十跟三一主要是對這個服務費用的部分那麼這個委員關心的主要還是關心的三接保冷柴的這個議題那麼三接保冷柴的議題那我們會在三月底以前去努力的把這個三接保冷柴把它汰換完畢"},{"start":20845.871,"end":20870.431,"text":"那對於這個這個費用本身呢他是他是所作為是海管跟儲槽管線跟儲槽的一個檢查檢測之用所以為了這個油氣輸出油氣輸出跟供應的安全我們希望能夠委員支持還是照列好 請張季泰委員"},{"start":20874.967,"end":20891.019,"text":"三月底你會處理好嗎?我們努力把它完成四月就...本來你說四月你要去剪裁,不是嗎?你四月就整個三屆就完工了嗎?是,所以三月底以前把它...不是啦,四月要剪裁才不是,就是四月就開始三屆...開始運作測試測試,什麼時候開始運轉?"},{"start":20897.938,"end":20903.521,"text":"測試運轉,測試運轉,什麼時候減財?目前沒有安排,還沒有安排時間所以現在就是清澈表達說你3月底,就是本價的保冷財,確定它會是安全的,是不是?"},{"start":20919.813,"end":20947.621,"text":"我們不是說你財料有一點沒支配嘛對不對所以要換賣戶嘛那你現在三月要完成的標期你東西都支配都很好啊是這個意思嗎我們努力會在三月底前把它完成三月那我本來凍結的三例雖然我凍結不會影響你的工程監督嘛對不對這個費用不是用在三接啦沒有啦對啊所以好那我繼續凍這三例然後你三月底如果真的完成就解凍這樣可以好不好"},{"start":20948.783,"end":20952.588,"text":"報告委員我意見就是說這個費用跟三接沒有關係"},{"start":20959.685,"end":20974.334,"text":"財料不是財料有錢買,第一財料有錢買,第二財料有錢買,第一財料有錢買,第一財料有錢買,第一財料有錢買,第一財料有錢買,第一財料有錢買,第一財料有錢買,第一財料有錢買,第一財料有錢買,第一財料有錢買,第一財料有錢買,第一財料有錢買,第一財料有錢買,第一財料有錢買,第一財料有錢買,第一財料有錢買,第一財料有錢買,第一財料有錢買,第一財料有錢買,第一財料有錢買,第一財料有錢買,第一財料有錢買,第一財料有錢買,第一財料有錢買,第一財料有錢買,第一財料有"},{"start":20982.532,"end":21005.94,"text":"好請陳立立委員我想這個藉著預算然後希望我們中俄做得更好大家都是共同的方向但是如果說這個預算因為你動的額度其實已經有讓整個執行面有問題的話那就又違反到我們當初的意識所以其實我想我們希望"},{"start":21006.94,"end":21017.655,"text":"整個程序三接的部分有什麼樣的一些具體性的一些進度或有一些具體性的一個發展我相信大家都一樣可是我覺得"},{"start":21019.535,"end":21046.962,"text":"不要去動了這麼多啦我覺得動應該給你們趕快催促你們做更好的一些處理可是我還是建議立委說不要動那麼多啦如果真的是書面報告後然後可以去做動之那部分讓他們可以有叮嚀有催促又可以有我們的監督職責我覺得這比較重要"},{"start":21048.627,"end":21060.926,"text":"好 請邱志偉委員這個8億 動3億大概就將近4成你仔細看預算書啊這個是油氣輸出啊油氣輸出是天然氣對不對 總長"},{"start":21062.915,"end":21078.425,"text":"天然氣是不是包括油跟天然氣有沒有會影響永安天然氣會會嘛如果是你那個張信凱是關心三接跟這筆預算沒有關係啊你不要讓我這個永安天然氣這沒有辦法運作"},{"start":21082.531,"end":21092.947,"text":"你要解凍之後才能再凍之耶那什麼時候解凍還要再看看什麼時間點這不能讓他斷氣啊這個事關能源安全"},{"start":21094.161,"end":21112.773,"text":"我們不要針對這條啦不過你動了一千萬我覺得讓他們能夠對整個這個專業服務能夠提升這個我沒有意見你動到傷筋這個傷骨那個到時候你氣出不來這個會產生很大的能源危機喔"},{"start":21115.011,"end":21136.817,"text":"好 這是針對三十案的部分本期的提案是三十一案三十一案是對於我們的整個行政規費的支出那針對於我像我們終於針對空污水污染跟土污染這部分這個整個防治應該終於公司要再努力因為你們很多的被處罰的招罰金違反環保這個規則被罰金都已經高達了兩千多萬"},{"start":21142.779,"end":21170.227,"text":"那在這一部分的話我們希望中油這部分能夠再加強那因為這兩項的預算科目是不一樣啦那本席這邊也請我們中油再來做檢討讓整個污染能夠降低好不好那三十案的話我們請張七開委員我其實當初想要是當一個三億因為你之前就跟我說四月就要減財嘛那我想說你一定是可以完成啊你本來背一個以上你到了四月之前"},{"start":21171.383,"end":21177.136,"text":"你也有另外的5億啊 怎麼會影響啊其實就不會啊我是算過了才做的這樣的一個要求啦"},{"start":21178.414,"end":21206.594,"text":"對你有沒有困難 就是如果動3億 然後你趕快把這個3階完成 趕快剪裁有沒有影響到謝謝喔 張委員 我們一般預算喔大概我們都盡量是 我們當然是下個會期3、4月就可以把預算解凍但是這個預算的話 我們凍結的部分大概都不會超過最多不會超過五分之一啦 大概都以10%為標準那這一部分大概8億啦 我們就凍結五千萬好不好"},{"start":21208.934,"end":21233.043,"text":"英明瑞士的主席已經這樣接你那就洞前問前就請我們中油公司董事長針對三接外推455公尺造成了海流漁民的那個生計部分請你們趕快處理因為他們已經跟你們說明也抗議了很久我們希望在你三接在這個三四月要運轉的時候要測試的時候不要再有抗爭"},{"start":21233.743,"end":21237.264,"text":"30案動5000萬30跟31案共動5000萬好我們現在來處理30案到31案我們就凍結5000萬書面報告好"},{"start":21253.976,"end":21281.568,"text":"接下來是三十二案到四十三案請說明三十二到四十三案是有關於探勘費用那編列的是七十七億那委員所關心的就是探勘費用在去年的執行率偏低同時在自主遊園的部分也能夠提高那我想說明那麼今年所編的七十七億的預算是沒錯是比去年來講是增加了十七億"},{"start":21282.848,"end":21297.988,"text":"主要增加的原因我們是希望在今年在地熱的攤勘部分量能要去加大另外在現有的礦區像在印尼還有在澳洲的礦區能夠"},{"start":21301.272,"end":21322.996,"text":"也能夠加速了它這個專井碳油另外最重要就是說新增的礦源包括在澳洲以及在美國我們也希望能夠爭取到新的油源那麼我們所編的預算是照目前的規劃來去編的這個預算那麼來去執行也希望委員們能夠支持"},{"start":21326.158,"end":21338.663,"text":"那麼經過拜訪委員幾位委員有表達意見第38案楊委員同意改為主決議另外第41案陳昌明委員也同意改為主決議另外第36 42跟43委員同意改成書面報告以上說明請就議委員"},{"start":21355.831,"end":21375.046,"text":"好 謝謝主席董事長我想請您再說明一下就是說你們今年新編的這個77億你確定今年可以執行完嗎你剛剛講的這幾項大計畫的主要預算分配大概是怎麼樣的配置有嗎我請湯執行長說明一下"},{"start":21378.369,"end":21405.188,"text":"委員好 謝謝委員指教簡單報告一下其實除了過去經常性的持續性的業務部分基本上編列的是差不多以外主要是增加在兩個區塊一個是在取得新的那個自有能源的部分這部分增加大概是加了幾億另外一個是主要是要加大地熱碳侃的這部分這部分增加了十幾億所以這邊合起來大概到了20多億"},{"start":21406.423,"end":21433.925,"text":"所以整體比較去年來講會增加了大概是23億左右簡單做一個說明這個部分我們再另外用書面的書面再提供給委員好那個原則上我可以改成主決議啦就不動你們的預算那我覺得碳勘這件事情因為你們現在做了幾個新的包括地熱啦包括其他的新的油泉這件事情我覺得"},{"start":21436.166,"end":21463.382,"text":"我應該給你們鼓勵啦所以我想這個還是給你們給予你們適當的支持啦那至於就是說你們這些碳產事業部有一些在海外的這些同仁其實在那邊工作環境相對辛苦我認為該給他們的這一些福利加給這個還是請中友你們要去顧慮到這一塊是 是 遵照辦理好 那我們先請張季凱委員我提案這39案"},{"start":21466.075,"end":21481.466,"text":"提了要減累五億跟凍結三億元的原因是因為是人命關天地熱當然現在我們鼓勵你們要盡量盡量去開發因為到目前我看那個能源佔比很低嘛現在是0.06億連1%連0.1%都要不夠這個是要加強可是有一個事情非常重要很重要的我現在講"},{"start":21489.352,"end":21510.988,"text":"我們現在在處在那個環太平洋火山地震帶嘛對不對 對我們這階段是很平凡的啦你現在這個大屯山這邊你現在開採的方式都是用那個增強型的增強型的那個開花嘛現在看起來就是這個有助於地熱這個熱能的這個獲取可是呢 也可能引發"},{"start":21512.827,"end":21538.416,"text":"地震的發生嘛這在日本在美國、韓國都有這種歷史嘛所以在美國、在韓國他們都很注意很注意這個事情在探勘的時候他們加強他的防災跟自災嘛對不對你們在點頭所以我現在我可以把這個這是我辦公室在討論的時候他們說這個非常重要所以才會提到說要減淚5億到凍結3億我可以把減淚這部分先拿掉可是這個事情一定要注意好不好那你們在這個大概"},{"start":21540.037,"end":21547.513,"text":"一個月內提出怎麼樣向美國向韓國就是你們在特別是在大屯山你們在探勘的時候"},{"start":21548.693,"end":21575.004,"text":"這個地熱的事情你們到底要怎麼去防災跟治災給我一份報告一個月的話如果這個能夠說服大家我覺得這個是非常重要的人命關天做好報告我們再解凍這筆錢好不好那檢內部分先拿掉好 針對我們海外這整個探勘我們的油田這部分我們自己設定的目標大概在10%到現在還沒有到達這個目標我們希望我們在這個投資上面重新做個檢討讓我們的效益都能夠發揮因為我們在鄰近海域"},{"start":21578.425,"end":21599.84,"text":"以這個探勘都沒有成果 已經虧損了31億了在這個部分我們請你們再精進一點 好不好好 陳婷妃委員也有提案請陳婷妃委員謝謝主席 其實我們要強調是說"},{"start":21601.775,"end":21627.731,"text":"你增加這 因為我們有看嘛 這個比113年度這個是增加了13億嘛6736那當然有說明說可能我們是在這個國內外陸海域的油氣第二探勘跟探風船的工作嘛那這些已經都有方向了嘛否則你預算怎麼變有方向"},{"start":21630.987,"end":21643.933,"text":"你要不要說明一下是什麼方向就是說這幾樣13億所增加的13億6736萬都已經找到點了而且知道要怎麼探勘了是今年也一定會執行"},{"start":21645.811,"end":21665.762,"text":"首先我報告地熱這個區塊目前我們在土廠正在建置地熱電廠總量大概5.4MW另外在宜蘭園山目前正在鑽一口園山一號井 井深4000米我們預定會在明年的6、7月"},{"start":21668.665,"end":21683.521,"text":"今年的六七月會轉到預定的深度之後呢會就這個專警的一個量來知道這個地底下的一個熱能的量能來去決定這個發電廠那麼要蓋多大的一個發電的量能以及適當的一個地點"},{"start":21684.562,"end":21702.174,"text":"那另外的在花蓮地區啊從瑞穗到玉里我們也已經就地熱的部分已完成了調查現在就這個調查的部分來去解讀那麼在什麼花蓮地區呢哪個區塊呢是比較恰當的那另外呢在這個"},{"start":21703.716,"end":21721.278,"text":"因為這些地熱的部分那麼都需要很大的一個鑽井的量能那我們公司鑽井數並沒有那麼多所以現在在研議從國外來進口這些鑽機希望能夠同步的去推動"},{"start":21722.492,"end":21749.531,"text":"各地區的一個專警這是地熱的部分那麼碳封存的部分剛剛提到就是說在苗栗鐵站山現在有一個碳封存的示範計畫同步我們也在西部濱海地區我們稱它為鹽水層那麼來去看這些鹽水層在碳封存的可行性那麼這個都在同步的進行"},{"start":21752.246,"end":21771.578,"text":"謝謝 因為我相信我們是有計劃但我為什麼會問說那這些預算到底我們是已經確定了一定會執行還是只是一個概括如果依照你們講的是有計劃可是這些預算是概括因為從其實這個灘竿的執行結果其實除了"},{"start":21776.862,"end":21802.161,"text":"112年以外其實我們的執行率都並沒有達到我們預期包括113年其實截至到8月底為止那我不知道現在有沒有增加了多少齊馬到8月底你們的執行說是39.0%那現在呢現在有比較多嗎113年對啊去年啦已經今年已經是114啊對對113年就原預算大概執行70%"},{"start":21804.303,"end":21814.155,"text":"所以70%你原來的就沒有執行完你現在就增加13億是這些計畫所以我才會認為說其實希望我們在編類這個部分不是服編的"},{"start":21821.804,"end":21850.209,"text":"而不是過於 我反而覺得你們應該把這個區塊縮減因為你們有時候就這樣嘛 你在這裡比較遠 你在其他必要的地方你就要減少因為不是你可以隨便沒有一個比例啊所以我會認為說這筆預算我要把它刪減是說 刪減下來你明年應該去考慮應該在你說的 你多出來的這一億兩億你如果移到別的地方可以做更多的事情"},{"start":21851.822,"end":21874.178,"text":"所以我認為我要篩檢這些筆預算兩千萬這不影響他啦 不影響可是我覺得給你們一個警惕說明年這裡不要再編這麼多你要移到別的地方反正這個數就這樣 謝謝好 董事長點頭是可以啦好 我們現在來處理32案到43案第35案 38"},{"start":21880.885,"end":21887.289,"text":"案跟41案改為主決議 那32到43案我們全案減列2000萬 凍結3億書面報告這邊有三筆預算 77億 59億跟56億所以我們全案凍結3億 好 以上那接下來減列2000萬"},{"start":21909.246,"end":21913.849,"text":"我再重新宣告一次32到43案我們減列2000萬凍結3億35跟38跟41案改為主決議現在是44案請說明44案是有關雜項營業成本服務費用那麼這項編列的數是10.45億那麼"},{"start":21934.864,"end":21957.556,"text":"委員所關心的就是我們海外探勘的進度效益我想說明的是這項的預算也跟探勘沒有太多的直接關係它主要是用在我們暫儲、包裝、代理及加工費、旅運費等等還有很重要就是修理、保養、保護費"},{"start":21959.537,"end":21985.575,"text":"所以呢基於就是說實際編列的預算跟去年來比是相比也比較低啦所以希望就是說委員能夠支持這項費用不要刪也不要凍結那至於說委員所提到的海外探勘的這個效益成效的部分我們能夠提供書面資料給委員參考那麼是不是建議改成主決議這樣子"},{"start":21987.15,"end":21996.025,"text":"請張警戴委員給我完整的資料就好 那改為主決議好 44案改為主決議 預算照列第45案請說明"},{"start":21999.372,"end":22017.553,"text":"第45項就是有關於服務費用的公關未到費那麼這項費用其實編列的並不高778萬那麼跟往年所編的預算來比的話事實上是相差不多而且執行率都蠻高的"},{"start":22018.214,"end":22038.444,"text":"那這項費用主要是用在業務推展還有對於員工、婚喪、賀儀、傷病慰問這些費用那麼但是這個委員所關心的這個議題主要是關心藻礁生態那麼藻礁生態這個議題呢當然我們也很關心那我們建議呢是不是這項這個項目"},{"start":22043.891,"end":22062.868,"text":"好那是是那剛剛聽到說委員已經同意說改成組決議沒有等一下我會處理請突宣級委員好謝謝主席那這剛剛是有溝通過啦那因為之前我們有針對我們當初我們蔡總統去三接的時候就有講說要對於生態"},{"start":22064.83,"end":22075.744,"text":"還有我們藻礁的保育要成立一筆基金10億的基金那之前我們是說因為這講了很久都沒有做那後來我們就是要求說這筆基金"},{"start":22076.618,"end":22097.453,"text":"不但要編列 那時候已經有提過逐年編列 分五年來編列那現在也看到可是我們重點說希望針對這筆 因為其實大家也知道整個全台灣桃園藻礁的覆蓋率桃園大概七成到八成那當然新北 屏東也有那我們認為說這筆基金上面"},{"start":22100.595,"end":22116.177,"text":"沒有很明確的規範它用在全台灣那你用在全台灣跟這個藻礁生態保育基金其實是有一點出入你這應該專款專用它居然是為了保護藻礁那你去用在沒有藻礁的地方就有點奇怪"},{"start":22116.707,"end":22137.873,"text":"那後來我們說希望藉由這部分我們一定要還是要針對比較明確一點針對這筆基金它的主要用途要能夠明確你不要去做你編一個實例去做全台灣的生態保育基金你又不是環境部對不對這環境部做的工作我們應該沒有必要去做這個應該是專管專用"},{"start":22139.373,"end":22168.573,"text":"所以这部分后来我们是沟通过同意转组决议但是我希望还是要针对我们后面这基金的部分这个范围及用途一定要能够明确针对这笔钱它是生态藻礁保育基金就一定要用在这专款的用途上不要编了实意就去做了一些跟藻礁没有关系的事情那这部分先转组决议可是后面基金的部分我们还是要去谈一下好 谢谢"},{"start":22169.053,"end":22169.155,"text":"谢谢大家"},{"start":22170.481,"end":22199.1,"text":"所以陀螺岩這個改組決議 同意了那請你簽名那要跟董事長講 這個藻礁是千年的藻礁他沒有辦法移地去復育 一定要在原來的地方那因為他就在海邊 那個整個海流的流向也會影響藻礁的生存所以這邊請我們的工程團隊多注意一下好 那第45案改成組決議預算照列然後第46案到47案請說明"},{"start":22203.428,"end":22205.673,"text":"這兩項是有關於管理費用的服務費用"},{"start":22209.127,"end":22231.034,"text":"委員提案的所關心的就是希望公司在物料的管理要去加強那另外就是台資電投資的一個可行性那麼對於這項服務費用來講主要是用在總公司水電的修理費還有會計師等固定的費用"},{"start":22234.657,"end":22254.014,"text":"這個所編的預算應該是已經核實了那麼希望能夠不要刪也不要動那至於說委員所關心的有關加強物料的管理這個我們會去做加強性的一個措施另外對於台積電的投資可行性"},{"start":22254.875,"end":22277.152,"text":"那因為這個案子目前是在公司董事會是已經通過然後現在在行政院的審查當中那麼公司是認為公司有未來有綠電的一個需要同時這個投資計畫也有它一定的效益因此我們是建議去實施目前在行政院審查當中好 請張季楷委員"},{"start":22280.214,"end":22307.657,"text":"我提了這個47跟50我一起講台市那個我前幾天剛剛請教的那個部長嘛就是國營事業包括那天談的中鋼今天的中油事實上連高鐵都要進去的中華電信那我提的事實上我不是反對你們去買綠電不是反對買綠電我覺得可是有兩點一定要做到第一個就是不能買太貴第二個更重要的"},{"start":22308.357,"end":22335.084,"text":"一定要有合約你們才能去買不然弄到後來是別人沒有買弄到全部到貨到給這個中鋼或者是中油那這樣就會賠錢我要的是這兩個這兩個重要的保證所以我才會提到就是說當然部長現在站上來了啦那個你那天有提到就是說中鋼他有一個權利嘛你說你責成中鋼的董事長總經理跟他們的工會去討論嘛他們如果不同意的話就中鋼就不投資嘛那中油想有這個權利嗎"},{"start":22336.104,"end":22359.639,"text":"完全都是有同樣道理因為我們不是一個國營的公司不是要成立一個國營的公司而是成立一個平台讓有需要綠電的一些公司都可以上來然後他可以扮演股東的角色那他也可以得到這個公司這個公司不是現在先建立平台未來"},{"start":22360.76,"end":22386.011,"text":"他可能還是有一些可能要去購電的這樣的一個需求購電的目的是要服務我們國內的這些比較小的公司或者是綠電需求不斷在增加的公司那因為台電他扮演這個綠電但是他要照顧全民所以我們對這種所謂的綠電需求那這些公司我們國營的我們先讓他進來"},{"start":22387.352,"end":22414.993,"text":"他隨時可以退出如果說我因為我是先辦辦官股但是未來他完全是民營的公司也就是說我現在在建立一個未來的台積電那你認為要不要讓他參加這個就是我們的目的我們希望他這個公司剛開始先只是做綠電的買賣未來是做能源的"},{"start":22416.55,"end":22426.116,"text":"能源的公司他是一個能源的公司來照顧國內的中小微對未來能源的需求的一個公司那他先建立這個平台"},{"start":22426.98,"end":22452.67,"text":"是這個樣子 跟委員報告部長 我看了資料齁 他真正開始要買店的這個買賣啊是三年後的事情嗎這三年要先 最初要先休息三年嗎沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有沒有"},{"start":22453.018,"end":22460.691,"text":"我們現在可以買到電隨時都可以這個我們只要沒有沒有沒有應該是三年後是不是馬上可以買得到嗎"},{"start":22463.615,"end":22484.874,"text":"跟委員報告就是因為大量的就是你剛剛說的大量的離岸的風電要等到離岸風電上來才買不過在那個之前如果有些小的這個是可以這個只要隨時而且可以跟委員報告因為它的人數其實現在大概就是很大概人數的很少所以大概委員擔心的那個前面燒錢的事情也不會也不會存在這樣"},{"start":22485.214,"end":22491.098,"text":"為什麼會3.1就是你們現在買的最主要限定在風電那風電3-1跟3-2級它真正開始運轉可以賣電給你要3.1我們不一定會買風電我們不一定會買風電你連光電都買嗎我們連光電也會買地熱"},{"start":22501.306,"end":22514.302,"text":"因為我們是做能源服務的公司不是為了風電而去處理這件事情所以可能是在他在這個設計的時候並沒有考慮到那麼詳細"},{"start":22517.586,"end":22546.419,"text":"不過我在這邊可以跟委員報告這個是我們完全負責任為的是國內的中小微企業綠電的需求所以RE100雖然2027年才開始但是對不起我們現在已經有民間的在反映那個需求RE30它就需要了嘛所以我們還是要服務它再來就是我們要讓這個綠電的價格不會高漲如果說我現在沒有這樣的一個機制在那個地方"},{"start":22547.54,"end":22575.687,"text":"它的如果供給是不足的需求是成長的這個它價格會一直漲但是我現在有一個平台在這裡它是不敢漲的部長今天講的是一個新的齁因為之前我們聽到都是只有買風電嘛你今天就很明確講就是包括光電或者是地熱全部只要是再生能源全部都會所以它就不會等到說風電的第三之一跟三之二等到三年後這段時間有些就可以先買先賣了就"},{"start":22576.087,"end":22599.557,"text":"那一部分可能就是以而傳而啦這就很明確的把它定下來那可是還是有兩個問題嘛一個就是我們的很多放工營的進來包括剛剛在講的這個中油這個我們都有退場機制啦我們都會讓他有退場機制怎麼樣有退場機制我就是將來這家公司一定會IPO一定會IPO所以他們可以退場"},{"start":22601.26,"end":22630.272,"text":"所以不會出現外界很擔心的就是到時候你的中小企業店沒賣出去然後到貨到給中油或者是我們認為這個就是有點杞人憂天啦也許我們沒有說明的很清楚我們認為我們可能沒有說明的很清楚所以造成大家看的時候或者了解的時候沒有完全了解我們的初衷啦但是我們的初衷政府的立場就是一定要幫助所有的企業一定要幫助所有的企業解決它"},{"start":22631.845,"end":22648.336,"text":"綠電的問題是的所以部長能夠這樣很明確的表達一下我就是先動了三千萬的預算你看這幾十億我只動了三千然後等整個跟外界講得非常清楚的時候我們再解凍這筆預算可是我還是要提醒第一個不要買太貴我昨天就已經提了部長"},{"start":22649.156,"end":22674.978,"text":"如果台積電五塊都不買你就不能去買超過五塊的去年的等過的價格是4.5你就不要去買到一個比外面平均價格更高的4.5進來這是一個第二個你剛剛一直在講說外界的那個中小企業要我一直在提你要先確認他們跟你簽了契約不是簽MOU到時候你像東和你一直在講說東和鋼鐵要買對不對東和鋼鐵到昨天為止媒體去問他他說都還沒有定案啊"},{"start":22675.518,"end":22703.49,"text":"你們現在對他說有六家嘛大家就要問啊連電看起來是比較正面在回應欸東河鋼鐵都到現在都沒有很明確的所以有人在開玩笑啦他說如果是真的大家都用到那應該是從業進去你是從業創辦人欸應該從業創辦人去叫從業進去幫忙經營可以嗎我可以叫他進去嗎如果今天是個好的好事情大家認為說這個不是不是圖利從業的話我可以叫他進去嗎這個有風險喔你如果覺得真的好的話你如果"},{"start":22705.965,"end":22714.123,"text":"創辦人可以啦你現在已經退出公司的經營嘛對不對如果真的這麼好如果真的這樣是好的如果您同意我說從業可以進去沒有問題喔"},{"start":22716.431,"end":22735.435,"text":"部長你不要跳出這個陷阱裡面明天就換黃國昌來罵你了不會不會不會如果真的是可以造福全民像你說的可以造福到中小企業都可以買到而且不會買貴的話從業力系投資大家不會怪你報告委員就是不行了部長你不用再回應這個議題了好我們回來審議算來處理46到47案"},{"start":22741.256,"end":22753.843,"text":"那張委員因為你要跟50案併在一起來動3000但是我們先分開來了所以你這一部分動1000萬就好了50案是另外好第46案改為主決議46跟47案我們凍結1000萬書面報告接下來是48案到53案請說明"},{"start":22764.529,"end":22784.622,"text":"48、49案也是有關於研究發展費用主要就是說也是關於我們公司研究發展部分我的關心就是說有關專利申請數以及專利未商轉佔比比較低的"},{"start":22787.364,"end":22805.356,"text":"我們公司在研發費用是投入了前瞻研發費用,包含儲能材料、前瞻電池研究、鋰電池、自成的潛能改善、二氧化碳碳封存研究"},{"start":22806.457,"end":22822.25,"text":"那麼這些研發事實上已經有出具成效了譬如說我們在雙環、霧二溪還有泰酸里都已經在建置適量產的一個工廠我們未來可以逐步再增加營收提高這個附加的價值"},{"start":22823.598,"end":22843.929,"text":"那麼對於這個所編列的預算30億那麼是跟113年度來比是增加了3.28億那主要是我們在研究的項目裡面今年會增加碳纖附材的高壓氫氣瓶這方面的一個性能跟安全測試還有在中油軟碳電池模組的測試以及在電動二輪載具的實測驗證"},{"start":22851.052,"end":22870.649,"text":"這方面來去做努力那這個案子我們有有拜訪的委員其中第48案跟48案這個呂昭偉已經同意改為主決議另外第49案楊委員也同意改成主決議那麼以上說明請張委員還要補充"},{"start":22873.07,"end":22879.797,"text":"不用那我直接處理了好第48案到53案48案跟49案改為主決議那48案到53案我們凍結2000萬書面報告接下來54案請說明"},{"start":22891.747,"end":22900.978,"text":"第54案是有關於我們53案53就是那個霸凌那個事情53案已經過了"},{"start":22903.919,"end":22905.481,"text":"第五四案是有關於租金跟利息所編的143億"},{"start":22926.24,"end":22941.026,"text":"這個編143億交113年為增加主要原因是我們考慮中央銀行升息的關係以及我們今年的付息負債的金額也提高那麼何時去預估是需要編列143億那麼也誠請委員能夠同意以上"},{"start":22949.568,"end":22970.268,"text":"好第54案我們預算照列接下來是55案到59案請說明有關這個費用那麼我想幾個委員所關心的就是在公安希望能夠落實能夠降低職災那麼"},{"start":22973.77,"end":22999.846,"text":"所編列的預算呢6億3千8那主要是要維持我們公司的各項設備的性能跟安全性那麼如果說這個希望維持他的安全性跟他性能來避免一些潛在的公安危險所以呢為了支持這公安相關的一個檢查呢那麼也建請各位委員能夠支持改成組決議"},{"start":23002.093,"end":23028.644,"text":"好 請圖圈級委員好 謝謝主席那針對這部分 我們中油自己的數據都有顯示這個藻礁保育覆蓋率是越來越差 而且是數據上顯示都是一直在下降所以針對我們這個觀音藻礁生態復育的部分 那我覺得"},{"start":23030.427,"end":23052.703,"text":"還是要需要在地方我們再召集民間的學者我們再去開個說明會第一讓他們了解一下我們將來到底後面要怎麼去做因為現在數據上我們針對這個保育的工作其實數據上是真的成效是很差而且是一直在減少所以真的就像他們當初說"},{"start":23053.864,"end":23075.479,"text":"這做這三接一定會影響而且我們自己做出來的數據也是越來越差那現在我們針對這部分應該要去解除他們的疑慮然後跟他們大家來溝通大家及時廣義一下是怎麼樣子把這個藻礁的覆蓋率能夠再來提升不然現在看到這個藻礁是一直在減少所以針對這部分那"},{"start":23076.66,"end":23093.506,"text":"我們溝通過也同意下去開協調會那我們就轉組決議是沒問題那我希望說這部分我們還是要落實去做這個保育的工作真的很重要那我不但要持續的監測那如何讓這個藻礁的覆蓋率能夠提升"},{"start":23094.161,"end":23121.19,"text":"我們大家來溝通一下然後地方也有很多好的意見所以請下去大家開一個協調會來溝通一下好 謝謝圖文請張旗開委員71案是關西道中游的高雄這個洲際天然氣的接收站就是七階現在環評過了那可是沒有辦理這個二階段的這個環評所以高雄大林埔大林埔市長 張委員我的是55到59案"},{"start":23122.568,"end":23151.213,"text":"他不是已經在講72號抱歉抱歉抱歉抱歉好那先打斷了先停止等一下再來謝謝那土匪你的建議是那有溝通就是我們請我們中油要下去地方那我到時候會召集"},{"start":23151.96,"end":23170.055,"text":"民間的學者跟地方的人士那就請我們中原這邊來配合到地方開個協調會大家集思廣益他們有很多好的意見我們來採納一下目前我們看到這個覆蓋率真的是越來越差那是57 58 59都改組決議嗎那58 59的部分我們各凍結五千萬因為這是逐年編列嘛那因為"},{"start":23178.742,"end":23203.08,"text":"當初我們就有針對我們基金的諮詢委員我們地方上然後大家溝通我們對諮詢委員其實我們是很有意見啦因為我不知道為什麼找對藻礁不是很有善的來做藻礁保育我覺得這部分一直沒有辦法解決大家的疑慮你像當初我們的監察人詹順貴他對這個藻礁他說"},{"start":23206.987,"end":23233.058,"text":"讓中南部居民受更大的空乎保護藻礁那也說蓋三接一定會破壞藻礁 這說法上大有問題那我覺得這做基金的諮詢委員對藻礁不是很有善 結果找這些委員來做保護藻礁 我不知道當初為什麼會有這樣子的方法 那我們要保護藻礁"},{"start":23234.315,"end":23237.729,"text":"對這些環保議題然後對藻礁是很友善的所以"},{"start":23238.24,"end":23267.832,"text":"我們也希望我們先凍結五千萬因為剛才有溝通嘛 目前這筆錢因為可能要到下半年度才用得到所以這兩億基本上兩億來講基本上先凍結五千萬基本上對我們運作上是不會有大的問題那我們希望針對這個委員的部分到時候我們大家再來溝通因為地方上市府環保局等等他們也希望說能夠盡量多推一些在地"},{"start":23268.359,"end":23281.565,"text":"保護藻礁的人士來共同參與我們藻礁保育基金的這些工作我覺得這應該是會對對我們藻礁保育應該是比較良善的好那所以針對這部分我們就先凍結然後"},{"start":23288.98,"end":23313.514,"text":"報委是不是57案就不要凍結改為主決議我們大家有溝通過啦 那我們也希望我們照著去做那我們也各退一步啦 那本來各凍結1億那我們就各凍結5000萬然後希望針對我們生態保育這部分"},{"start":23314.675,"end":23328.437,"text":"還有我們委員的部分我們再來溝通協調一下希望綜合大家的意見不然你這個委員裡面我們去查他們的歷史記錄這些委員對藻礁保育都不是很友善"},{"start":23329.042,"end":23351.085,"text":"那難免大家對這個委員的成員確實有相當大的疑慮我們還是要來溝通一下好 謝謝委員 謝謝好 我們都是為了要降低這個整個公安意外的發生讓我們職場上能夠在防護業務上都能夠做得更好來降低職災的發生率我們也希望忠義公司能夠對公安管制能夠加強改善"},{"start":23351.485,"end":23359.816,"text":"好不好 那我們55案到59案再57案改成主決議那我們全案凍結5000萬書面報告好 接下來是60案58 59是一起嗎好"},{"start":23368.516,"end":23384.283,"text":"對 全部一起5859是各凍結五千萬我們一併處理啦一併處理五千萬對 各凍結五千萬然後我還要說明一下一併處理五千萬好 那我們要再說明一下還有這個名稱的部分我們要希望我剛剛有講一下專款專用我們這個是"},{"start":23387.904,"end":23415.823,"text":"利益在藻礁保育基金不要把这重点放在全国的生态上面我又讲说你全国生态是环境部做的不是我们这基金要做的我们这藻礁保育基金我希望这名称还有我们基金的咨询委员这部分我们好好的讨论一下那希望针对这部分我们再演绎一下专款专用针对藻礁保育来去做不要去做到全国的生态这跟这笔基金是没有关系的"},{"start":23416.647,"end":23443.87,"text":"好 謝謝我們55到59案就凍結5000萬57案改為主決議書面報告接下來請六十案請說明六十案是有關於進口原油成本的部分那委員提案是關心我們進口的原油呢在現貨跟常約的比例那麼經過這個我們跟陳昌明委員溝通以後呢那委員已經同意了改為主決議"},{"start":23448.48,"end":23455.306,"text":"60案改為主決議 預算照列 接下來是轉投資的計畫 61案到64案請說明這61到64呢 主要委員關心"},{"start":23460.089,"end":23476.839,"text":"是中東地區的一個地緣政治的風險那麼以及這些風險要有做適當的管控那我做以下說明那我們中東地區的這個左邊的預算12.25億那主要是中東地區天然氣投資計畫從112年起它是114年是一個延續計畫"},{"start":23482.867,"end":23509.38,"text":"那麼114年所編列的股款這個12.25億是全數都是股款那麼由於根據合約公司有支付股款的責任如果是支付不足的話會違約所以我們建議這個預算免於凍結改成主決議那麼其中第61案陳超明委員同意改為主決議"},{"start":23510.393,"end":23519.278,"text":"那麼委員所關心的有關地緣政治的風險等等的公司會加以做風險管控以上說明好那就是"},{"start":23520.61,"end":23539.819,"text":"好 請邱志偉也發言我跟這個李理委都有提案其他兩位都不在我想這樣聽董事長說明我可以理解那這個如果有凍結的話對你們相關的這個作業會有一些影響所以可以啦我把它改成六三案改組決議好"},{"start":23542.827,"end":23571.718,"text":"好 我們最重要是關心說我們投資在卡達這個部分那因為我們中東的局勢有點混亂為了我們投資的這個整個風險我們要找一個對策的計畫才能夠讓我們原先的預估效益能夠發揮請我們董事長這邊要再加強我們61案到64案61 62 63改成主決議預算照列接下來是重大之建設事業部分"},{"start":23573.839,"end":23593.611,"text":"從65案到76案請說明謝謝65到76案各位委員所提案主要都是關心公司的財務狀況不好這部分我首先要謝謝各位委員對本公司的財務狀況的關心"},{"start":23597.662,"end":23623.163,"text":"那么本公司为了改善经营情况减少支出因此在各位提案以后我们就全面检视盘点这些重大的投资计划来拟定优先顺序以及重新评估每一个案子的供期那么经检讨以后我们认为可以延缓部分的投资计划的施作那么估算"},{"start":23625.144,"end":23651.706,"text":"應該50億元的一個投資清潔呢可以延到以後年度再執行所以呢對於這個賴委員所提議的減劣50億這部分呢我們希望就是我們同意這個按50億的金額去刪減那你要跟賴委員溝通了嗎是是有嗎有跟好這是賴委員提案是好好我們先請陳廷飛委員"},{"start":23654.942,"end":23680.977,"text":"謝謝主席這個就像我剛剛在討論你們所謂的探勘預算一樣我覺得我們的預算其實已經都非常拮据了那你今天那麼大筆預算在這個所謂你們的固定資產建設改良擴充可是畢竟我們從過去你們的資料"},{"start":23681.977,"end":23703.886,"text":"其實執行數都不如百分之百也就是說當中都有一個gap有一個缺口沒有辦法執行的那就是我們在一整年雖然我們想進行可是它畢竟還有很多的因素你還要發包計畫完要發包不是那麼簡單而且發包是不是能夠順利"},{"start":23705.407,"end":23729.205,"text":"因為你這個是整個固定資產的一個建設擴充所以我認為說這個其實我有連署要簡列簡列這個51就是說這個部分希望以後變成我們中油的一個警惕就在明年我們要編預算的時候是把這個部分我們自己"},{"start":23730.205,"end":23753.332,"text":"能夠長期的稍微拿捏一下不應該編進去的我們政府實際如果編在其他的地方不是更好嗎是不是更好我們可以做很多事結果我們現在剪裂掉了比如說我們認為應該要剪裂因為你做不到都要剪裂可是如果我們"},{"start":23754.625,"end":23755.025,"text":"董事長這做得到嗎"},{"start":23778.215,"end":23796.353,"text":"剛剛我們陳委員講的減劣50億的部分對還是逐年檢討就減劣50億減劣50億可以可以喔好請邱議員委員來董事長這個你們同意減劣50億喔表示你們原來的這個預算編列是有很多是做不到或者是"},{"start":23797.648,"end":23819.497,"text":"至少今年度沒辦法執行那是不是有一些你們應該要趕快加速可以去做的到現在沒做比如說台積電都已經快蓋好了可是你們旁邊的企業大樓到現在還沒有看到營資那工會也都同意工會也來找我陳情希望中油是不是能夠加速"},{"start":23820.546,"end":23838.976,"text":"去建置那這個也沒有看到在你的預算編列裡頭我不知道它是不是編列在這一個向下但我現在舉例的就是說有一些你們做不到的但是你預算把它編進去然後現在希望我們可以同意你們簡列但是有一些你們應該要趕快加緊腳步去做的"},{"start":23839.997,"end":23864.338,"text":"到現在還沒看到雖然您剛接任董事長沒多久但是你過去是總經理所以有一些相關持續性的計畫您應該是很清楚那這些能不能更積極一點去做我剛剛講到了比如說你們那個雅灣區那邊的招商那邊的大樓的招商也是慢吞吞過去的董事長不積極我希望現在的董事長跟總經理能夠更積極一點"},{"start":23866.344,"end":23885.246,"text":"這個可以做得到嗎?是公務員報告南部企業大樓來講已經加速要進行了那目前呢現在是什麼程度?目前在做基本設計細部設計等等那要拖到什麼時候才會動工?我們希望是在六年內把這個天啊!"},{"start":23886.972,"end":23905.447,"text":"天啊你再講一次因為設計嘛他設計需要花時間啦中鋼已經走了是吧那個國營會中鋼大樓蓋多久要蓋到六年否定有這個可以接受喔你蓋一個企業大樓要蓋六年陳其邁任期都快結束了"},{"start":23908.789,"end":23934.415,"text":"你搞不好下一任市長任期都結束了你們那一棟大樓還沒蓋好太扯了吧我們加速進行主要因為還有一些前置作業啦董事長前置作業我不是叫你現在才做台積電幾年前開始蓋當時你們一併在規劃企業大樓都已經在同步進行你們做不到看看要不要委託"},{"start":23935.799,"end":23950.371,"text":"高雄市政府還是委託哪裡來做嘛委託一個動作比較快的嘛好不好我現在跟你講企業大樓你竟然跟我講說六年以後才能蓋好這我聽不下去啊分期好我們再加速再加速好請邱志偉委員"},{"start":23959.692,"end":23975.521,"text":"這個效率實在要提高 國營事業我們大家都過病的時候 它的效率有待提升所以你應該又告訴委員會一個明確的提升你說6年我們不滿意 那你可以縮短到幾年"},{"start":23977.062,"end":24006.404,"text":"那經費也給你們充裕然後這個加快進行應該這四年應該可以完成吧該待會有需要那麼久嗎這樣好不好這個我們再研議一些更加速的方法那麼再來跟兩位委員做說明這個那我們應該要怎麼樣監督你們呢你們的研議的加速方法研議多久你不要告訴我研議一年然後來告訴我們以後要做五年那還是六年啊"},{"start":24006.98,"end":24032.657,"text":"我們兩個禮拜以內把它研議兩個禮拜以內跟委員報告接下來請張旭凱委員不只那個喔不只那個煉油廠旁邊就是那個切大樓連你們那個雅灣區的招商的部分可不可以都一併來做報告好 OK兩個禮拜請張旭凱委員董事長我先追問一下你這個固定資產建設改良擴充你本來595億"},{"start":24034.958,"end":24051.551,"text":"你減列了50億到底是哪些工程進度落後還是哪些工程你現在要延緩一口氣50億到底是哪些地方出了問題是要減少還是進度落後我請我們黃副總說明一下"},{"start":24056.698,"end":24082.448,"text":"報告委員 那我們有幾個計畫 第一個就是台中三期的一個擴建計畫 兩個海管就是永安到同宵以及通宵到海管那另外還有我們那個新市區的部分那因為還在跟高雄市政府討論減碳的議題所以進度協會往後 還有一般建築及設備加起來大概就是50億"},{"start":24083.568,"end":24086.072,"text":"預算應該是我們在兩年前就兩年前編的啦兩年前就編的喔"},{"start":24100.95,"end":24116.208,"text":"因為最 不是啊 行政院最後開始審你們的應該也是五、六月啊你是最近這半年來出現了五十億的落差市長是因為需要溝通啦 所以就會往後市長 落後的事 不然你這些變數 這五十億的變數都出現在這半年啦"},{"start":24116.448,"end":24132.261,"text":"所以跟委員報告應該就是基本上就是那個新四期的計畫那行政院核定了以後因為他有個前提要求說要跟高雄市政府要去要去再談關於空污減量的部分那因為這個談就會使得原來已經核定的計畫就會往後延"},{"start":24132.961,"end":24156.676,"text":"所以這個是一個很大的一個部分所以才說所以如果看起來就有可能今年就沒有辦法就今年只能做一些前置的一些作業他沒辦法去真正進行發包啦或是說這些東西所以他大概有很大比的預算現在是兩部分啦就是半年內你本來提出要爭取的50億突然自己要拿掉這是一個很大的問題啊第一個以後你們如果真的已經發現不行要趕快跟我們講我們審預算的時候還看了老半天"},{"start":24157.476,"end":24176.173,"text":"因為預算好就是今年的預算是在去年的八月的時候八月後就送到立法院來那事實上大概我們經濟部審完後差不多六月的時候就縱行這個那這個新世界計畫是在後頭才核定然後有這麼一個但書要求要去做最近四五個月裡面發生的事情就對了啦"},{"start":24177.934,"end":24196.539,"text":"我來問那個七十一案是不是七十一 現在可以講了對不對英明對市的主席 七十一案可以講嗎現在到七十六案 到七十六我講七十一案 七十一案是這個高雄的做進去天然氣接收的 七階啦你環評剛過 可是沒有做那個二階環評"},{"start":24197.981,"end":24225.583,"text":"現在高雄的大林埔的基民有在抗議嘛所以我先凍結我不要凍四億啦我凍五千萬好了凍五千萬你做兩件事情第二趕快跟民眾要溝通好不好你這個七街跟民眾民眾現在是有抗議嘛你跟他溝通要化解他們的餘力第二個你在一個月內把這個報告給我還是要解決問題的這筆錢因為不是只有我我看民進黨這個高雄的高雄的這個立委也有也有提案嘛對不對不是齊凱"},{"start":24227.245,"end":24240.257,"text":"瑞隆有提案嗎你這個錢好像是在595億的大象裡面對不對剛剛那個曾慶愷委員提到的這個部分所以我們是全部檢定有7億我們在講第71案的部分那個是28億7700萬另外一個案子跟瑞隆提的那個2千就是那個"},{"start":24246.002,"end":24256.128,"text":"固定投資計劃的那個專案計劃繼續計劃LEE201啦LEE201不是我的意思是說你的這個91億的這個形式在595億的大框架裡面啦剩下595億的大框架我們是減列50億"},{"start":24263.152,"end":24265.434,"text":"那針對我們73岸因為他這有有要做第二條海底輸氣管線那其實針對我們"},{"start":24291.906,"end":24318.784,"text":"很多漁民說三接外推之後已經嚴重影響漁獲目前也一直在跟我們中游這邊溝通協調他們也一直醞釀要抗爭但是我們希望還是跟我們這邊大家好好溝通協調那現在又針對三接外推的部分影響漁獲都還沒有處理好現在他們又聽說要再興建第二條海體梳氣管線"},{"start":24319.56,"end":24345.496,"text":"是通宵到永安嘛對所以這部分我們也希望跟我們地方加開兩場地方說明會然後到時候再提出書面報告那你看剛剛也打電話來有很多民眾對於這些問題三接還有剛剛我們提藻礁還有現在這第二條書氣管線我們希望地方我們把這個管道"},{"start":24345.956,"end":24371.986,"text":"能夠做完善的溝通所以藉由我們這邊來開協調會開說明會希望我們用比較正確大家用和平的方式來處理但是我也希望說我們主管單位真的要好好的來溝通針對他們提出的影響漁獲的問題還有山階對地方的影響現在馬上要再做第二條海底輸氣管線我覺得這部分我們先凍結5%"},{"start":24373.544,"end":24391.056,"text":"然後針對我們這幾個問題剛剛前面的協調會我們要開那針對這個新建的工程我們一樣再加開兩場地方說明會報告你是不是我是建議是不是也是併在一起至於說委員講說要開說明溝通我們照辦主席會處理"},{"start":24392.725,"end":24418.527,"text":"好大家都很關心那個我們從通宵到大潭電廠這個第二海管線最重要海管線的話你要拉過去的話會影響整個生態環保團體都在抗議他們都有這個疑慮尤其是漁民他們的漁獲量也減少這一方面的整個生態跟環保我們請我們董事長你在這邊的話要加強看怎麼樣去改善好不好好那現在我們就來處理"},{"start":24421.297,"end":24441.922,"text":"65案到76案我們全案減列50億另外再凍結1000萬書面報告好 接下來77案到78案請說明報告主席抱歉一下因為剛剛有一點疑慮就是我們58 59因為說凍5000萬我是58凍5000萬 59凍5000萬"},{"start":24448.294,"end":24474.72,"text":"是各動五千萬不是因為他有跟我協調我有簽喔好對啊這個副總應該知道我們簽是各動五千萬我這簽是各動五千喔有寫喔沒錯那個圖委員剛剛協調的話他主張是兩個案子要同一個科目各動五千那這個我們是可以行的"},{"start":24476.021,"end":24493.677,"text":"你現在5859的話他的經費是兩億你各動五千就一億了欸我動了二分之一欸欸你是同一個案子捏你是同一個科目捏你是同一個科目兩億各動五千那不就動一億了嗎那你怎麼會答應呢你怎麼會答應啊連主席都問你這個問題對啊"},{"start":24496.099,"end":24519.401,"text":"我想因為剛剛那個圖表其實它有說明因為這個預算的動資的話目前還在海保署審查當中所以一定通過這個基金的話最快也是上半年才會通過所以今年來講事實上只剩下半年的時間可以支持因為有協調過基本上是好那如果你們是這個態度我們不用在這裡捍衛你們的預算了"},{"start":24522.111,"end":24532.617,"text":"那就兩億全部凍結啊等海保署通過以後再來凍支啊我們在這裡幫你捍衛預算然後你這樣子同意人家然後你跟我說上半年根本不會用到搞什麼嘛哪有人這樣子凍預算的然後你們自己還去同意人家我們還在這裡幫你講話當我們三個是瘋子跟傻子嗎"},{"start":24552.377,"end":24577.371,"text":"來 區委員請坐下 主席來馬上處理連主席都覺得你們這樣子同意很奇怪 然後你現在竟然這樣子回答我那以後你們的預算 你們哪一條6月以後才能開始做的6月以後再來解凍就好了 現在全部都凍結可以這樣嗎你可以同意我這個提議嗎你如果可以同意的話 我現在全部每一個案都是這樣你們6月以後才要做 6月以後再來凍結再來解凍"},{"start":24581.874,"end":24585.475,"text":"剛剛已經公佈了65到76案的處理"},{"start":24608.052,"end":24636.108,"text":"就是減列50億凍結1000萬書面報告接下來77案到78案請說明77案是我們一般建築及設備這個計畫編列171億那麼主要委員所關心的就是在我們南部高廠那邊的宿舍紅藝宿舍的有關電所供應方面的問題"},{"start":24639.5,"end":24666.632,"text":"那目前就是這個宿舍區它是用工業用戶的高壓電供應那麼因為現在工業用戶的高壓用電比一般住戶的用電要貴所以他們所分攀的電費就比較高所以這些居民他們就訴求說你要用一般的住戶的用電來去收費所以這個目前在市政府"},{"start":24667.472,"end":24684.249,"text":"居民鄰里還有我們公司跟台電正在協調這件事情如何去解決它那這個議題主要是包括三個區塊就是在屋內的電線跟屋外道路上的電線以及在公用區的用電那麼"},{"start":24687.092,"end":24695.999,"text":"中油公司跟住戶之間如何去分攤這些電費目前還在協調當中那麼至於委員這邊提出來就說要凍結3億的部分"},{"start":24698.735,"end":24724.052,"text":"我是建議就是說事實上這個議題還是在繼續的在持續的溝通跟協調當然我們也希望趕快有一個決定那麼跟這個預算的編列其實沒有什麼太多的直接關係所以建議還是能夠免於凍結改成主決議好我們就來直接處理77案到78案預算照列接下來處理主決議79案"},{"start":24726.889,"end":24734.194,"text":"通過80案通過81案通過82案通過83案通過84案通過85案通過86案通過87案通過88案通過89案通過90案通過91案"},{"start":24757.525,"end":24761.51,"text":"這個陳委員好像已經同意撤案了好91案撤案"},{"start":24777.593,"end":24795.341,"text":"92案同意辦理通過93案遵照辦理通過94案遵照辦理通過95案遵照辦理通過96案遵照辦理通過97案遵照辦理通過98案遵照辦理通過99案遵照辦理通過100案遵照辦理通過101案遵照辦理通過102案遵照辦理通過"},{"start":24804.036,"end":24812.283,"text":"103案 遵照辦理通過104案 遵照辦理通過105案 遵照辦理通過106案 遵照辦理通過107案 遵照辦理通過108案 遵照辦理通過109案 遵照辦理通過110案 遵照辦理通過111案 遵照辦理通過112案 遵照辦理通過"},{"start":24828.686,"end":24830.809,"text":"113 遵照辦理通過 114 遵照辦理115 遵照辦理114 通過115 遵照辦理好 通過請宣讀協商結論"},{"start":24845.973,"end":24858.943,"text":"宣讀台糖公司協商結論第一案預算照列第二至七案產銷營運計畫凍結300萬元提出書面報告後始的動之第八案預算照列第九案預算照列第十案"},{"start":24860.103,"end":24884.684,"text":"增列500萬元 第11案預算照列本案改為主決議 第12案預算照列 第13案凍結3000萬元提出書面報告後始的動之 第14案預算照列第15案預算照列 第16至25案營業成本凍結3000萬元 提出書面報告後始的動之其中16至18案均改為主決議 第26至29案"},{"start":24888.046,"end":24913.956,"text":"營業費用凍結1000萬元提出書面報告後時的凍資其中29案改為主決議第30至34案其他營業外費用凍結100萬元提出書面報告後時的凍資第35案預算照列本案改為主決議第36案撤案第37至42案預算照列第43案預算照列本案改為主決議主決議部分44案到"},{"start":24915.157,"end":24930.331,"text":"61案均照案通過 62案修正通過 63案 64案照案通過 65案修正通過 66案至68案照案通過 69案修正通過 新增69之1案照案通過"},{"start":24932.622,"end":24947.767,"text":"宣讀中油公司協商結論第一案至第八案凍結兩千萬元提出書面報告後使得凍資第九至十七案凍結五百萬元提出書面報告後使得凍資其中第十一案十三案均改為主決議"},{"start":24948.687,"end":24953.691,"text":"第18至21案凍結500萬元提出書面報告後死的動之第22案預算照列第23案照案通過第24案測案第25至28案預算照列第29案預算照列第30、31案油氣輸出費用凍結5000萬元提出書面報告後死的動之第32至43案"},{"start":24971.967,"end":24996.088,"text":"簡列探勘費用2000萬元另凍結3億元提出書面報告後 使得動之其中第35案、38案、41案均改為主決議第44案預算照列本案改為主決議第45案預算照列本案改為主決議第46、47案管理費用向下服務費用凍結1000萬元提出書面報告後 使得動之其中46案改為主決議第48至53案"},{"start":24999.631,"end":25025.311,"text":"其他營業費用凍結2000萬元提出書面報告後使得凍資其中48 49案均改為主決議第54案預算照列第55至59案其他營業外費用向下雜項費用凍結5000萬元提出書面報告後使得凍資第57案改為主決議第60案預算照列本案改為主決議第61至64案預算照列"},{"start":25026.673,"end":25045.421,"text":"其中61至63案均改為主決議第65至76案固定資產建設改良擴充減列50億元科目自行調整令凍結1000萬元提出書面報告後使得凍資第77 78案預算照列主決議部分79案至90案均照案通過第91案測案92案至115案均照案通過宣讀完畢"},{"start":25060.345,"end":25077.002,"text":"請問各位同仁有委員提案的部分照剛才宣讀的結論通過沒有提案的部分均照列或是隨同調整請問有無異議好無異議通過通過之決議文字授權主席及議事人員調整"},{"start":25081.023,"end":25104.542,"text":"114年度本會負責審查之附屬單位預算營業部及非營業部均審查完略凝聚審查報告送財政委員會會診本會審查結果需交由黨團協商院會討論時由本席來做說明本日所列議程處理完略謝謝大家現在上"},{"start":25108.17,"end":25108.371,"text":"新郎"},{"start":25137.414,"end":25146.897,"text":"謝謝大家"},{"start":25161.442,"end":25174.335,"text":"謝謝大家"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}