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這次整套都換了喔這次整套因為你們為了要消化預算整套換了其實用上一套就好了你們不用上一套 一定要花錢重新搞一套重新搞一套 有沒有做過壓力測試"},{"start":194.059,"end":209.55,"text":"當然有做壓力測試而且把頻寬都加大那目前來說過去我們112年的時候大概一天平均是65萬人現在平均100萬人算起來到現在為止你知道多少人嗎部長我查了到現在at this moment 20萬"},{"start":216.515,"end":221.118,"text":"20萬 現在才多少9點開放都是要就一個小時不到一個小時不到20萬啦按照這樣算的話 一天超過100萬啦這一次我們在書發部在做規劃設計都有把它 全都放大對 對我沒有做過壓力測試一天最大頻寬可以到多少200萬 還是300萬還是500萬"},{"start":241.744,"end":245.968,"text":"財政部啊 你一直開口閉口說要提財化法什麼時候可以出爐"},{"start":259.537,"end":265.242,"text":"年底前一定會出爐年底前一定出爐年底前一定會出爐那出爐的過程當中是不是跟各地方政府都討論過了有關財政部其實已經開過了四次的會議他們都 各縣市都同意你這種版本嗎我們已經做了一個最大的共識最大的共識那另外有一個"},{"start":282.217,"end":289.969,"text":"345億 現在又有民進黨的委員提出來說要怎麼用啊 用在做月子啊 用在補助這個補助那個啦345億 但不要忘了喔這裡面離島可能就要拿掉220億喔"},{"start":297.569,"end":322.842,"text":"沒有這麼多 沒有剩這麼多剩一百多億而已喔345億是因為公事的問題沒有辦法分配出去這樣子 對要怎麼處理 你們認為該怎麼處理要修法才能做345億要怎麼分配啊其實這個財務法本身是給地方政府的再怎麼修都應該給地方政府這是一個中心思想"},{"start":324.127,"end":336.349,"text":"就是我再怎麼修都應該給地方政府因為財務法本來就是中央給地方的這是我跟你強調的事實上沒有這麼多因為我們只同意修一條啦十六十三啦十六十三以後如果還有剩的要立什麼法要來發什麼那個再說啦好我們再看啦APEC期間啦"},{"start":349.895,"end":354.197,"text":"有財長會議我知道你這次APEC期間你並沒有並沒有去嘛對不對你是前面去前面財長會議去後面沒有嗎我參加第一個就是財長會議一整天嘛那第二天有一個結構部長跟財政部長雙部長會議的早上半天接下來就是結構部長會議那結構部長會議整個是由我們國發會主委代表"},{"start":378.736,"end":399.511,"text":"那你見到的美國的官員是什麼等級的他們是副部長出席美國這個副助理部長來出席副助理部長不是副部長副助理部長跟你見面那我們在這裡已經討論了不知道幾次講了幾次了你從前年開始答應一直到去年又到現在"},{"start":400.331,"end":424.521,"text":"那你有沒有跟他再談有沒有再跟他談台美租稅協定在那個場合我們有跟他提就是說台美的租稅協定是雙方大家各界都希望能夠盡快簽署的那這部分呢希望能夠在他們國內能夠他有沒有給你一點也感謝他們的財政部跟我們的財政部其實我們都有做工作小組技術性的持續在做交流跟討論"},{"start":426.002,"end":430.964,"text":"他有沒有給你一個具體的承諾說hopefully大概什麼時候可以過我想這個部分涉及他們國會的以他們的財政部也很難去肯定告訴我們所以今年不可能啊國會是一定會通過今年現在11月了而且整個美國政府都停擺了"},{"start":445.791,"end":456.735,"text":"你應該很了解美國目前的狀況但是呢 我方其實一直都沒有我知道啦 所以今年底後沒有啦你這個題目啊 已經講了兩年了耶對啊 這個題目我們雙方都其實都很希望我們講了兩年了 我都講到我都不好意思了還要跟你一直講同一題目我都抱歉啊 一直懵"},{"start":467.798,"end":488.463,"text":"這都沒有答案但是委員的關切其實是可以表達我們代表國內的民意希望能夠盡快的簽署我們台美租金協定因為美國AIT的人說不定也在看你布局夾給他們聽所以我們這裡希望趕快簽委員的關切其實就是表達我們國內的民意這有一個小題目"},{"start":489.843,"end":510.864,"text":"也不剩小題目了 現在民間精精病 什麼 規模越來越大我們的犯公股啊 相對的排名就越來越後面了你有沒有 比如說 比如這樣講 第一金 兆豐金他都沒有受險啊 他老實講 不夠完全 變成一個金空啊是不是 那 你有沒有想要推動公併施"},{"start":514.181,"end":536.619,"text":"公私并私人的私有没有这样的计划公股跟民间的去合并我想这个部分要综合的一个评估要有综效而且能够可以复补我们比较弱的部分那当然由金控可以去做评估那财政部基本上是看他们评估出来的结果可以给予因为现在民间都一直"},{"start":537.419,"end":555.116,"text":"施施病嘛 越來越大嘛那我們競爭力相對的就會低嘛就會受到影響對 所以我希望你能不能夠提出一個你的評估報告可不可以就是說 要不要推動公施病你答案可以說不要 暫時不要也可以或者說你準備想要都可以"},{"start":556.778,"end":561.921,"text":"你答案給我一個 時間表什麼時候可以給我好 我們會給委員一個評估報告大概什麼時候給我們三個月時間好嗎一個月啦 三個月那我們還要去彙整各個航庫的好 那就兩個月好了可以吧 兩個月兩個月提出要不要我們財政部要不要推動公私併公私併公私併的計畫 好不好 評估一下好 我們評估 好 謝謝委員好 謝謝賴司保委員"},{"start":588.365,"end":589.874,"text":"接下來我們請郭國文委員質詢"}]},"gazette":{"lineno":183,"blocks":[["賴委員士葆：（9時49分）謝謝主席以及各位先進，有請財政部莊部長。"],["主席：請莊部長。"],["賴委員士葆：幕僚人員有需要可以來幫忙沒關係。今天開始普發現金登記對不對？"],["莊部長翠雲：預登記開始了。"],["賴委員士葆：大家很怕被詐騙，所以這裡面有教戰守則說不要點簡訊、不要跟LINE連結、不要ATM轉帳，可以去ATM領錢，但是不要轉帳，重點是只認「.gov.tw」。我看到你們原來就有推出一個東西是「.com.tw」，你們的網站是這個網站，政府是gov，結果你們沒有gov，你看一下普發現金登記網站，雖然你這裡是test，可是民眾向我檢舉，他說不是只認gov嗎？怎麼這個不是gov，怎麼會這樣子呢？你要不要解釋一下？或者是哪一位長官幫忙解釋一下到底是怎樣？這關係老百姓的權益，很怕被騙啊！"],["莊部長翠雲：我們一再說明網站只有「10000.gov.tw」，僅此一家別無分號，這個網站是來自於數發部還是……"],["賴委員士葆：這是你們的、這是財政部的，怎麼會是數發部呢？"],["莊部長翠雲：但財政部沒有這個網站啊！"],["賴委員士葆：有啦，你看機關名稱寫的是「財政部國庫署」，網站名稱叫做「普發現金登記網站」，還有網址，怎麼沒有呢？"],["陳署長柏誠：跟委員報告，我們普發現金的網站就只有「10000.gov.tw」，所有不是這樣網址的都會被我們封鎖，所以有些會……"],["賴委員士葆：所以畫面上這個是假的？"],["陳署長柏誠：對。"],["賴委員士葆：可是這個是標章資訊耶！從這樣看的話，這個是標章資訊，你們後來撤掉了，我現在替你講答案，你們發現問題之後才把它撤掉，然後才說網站是「10000.gov.tw」。"],["莊部長翠雲：沒有，就只有一個。"],["賴委員士葆：只有一個，所以這是假的？"],["莊部長翠雲：就只有一個。"],["賴委員士葆：所以這是假的？"],["莊部長翠雲：對，假的，不是「10000.gov.tw」都不是真的，都不是用來發1萬塊的，我們會到網路上搜尋，如果有類似的，我們都會處理。"],["賴委員士葆：你們現在每天開放身分證後面兩個數字，上一次上網大概935萬人，總共登記5天，所以平均每一天大概100萬人，你們有沒有做過壓力測試？因為這次整套都換了，你們為了要消化預算，所以整套都換了，其實用上一套就好了，你們不用上一套，硬要花錢重新搞一套，請問重新搞一套有沒有做過壓力測試？"],["莊部長翠雲：當然有做壓力測試，而且把頻寬都加大。過去在112年的時候，一天平均大概是65萬人，今天……"],["賴委員士葆：現在算起來平均100萬人，到現在為止，你知道多少人嗎？部長，我查了到this moment有20萬人，現在才幾點？9點開放到現在才一個小時不到啊！"],["莊部長翠雲：對。"],["賴委員士葆：一個小時不到就有20萬人，按照這樣算的話，一天會超過100萬人啊！"],["莊部長翠雲：這次數發部在做規劃設計時都有把頻寬放大。"],["賴委員士葆：確定嗎？"],["莊部長翠雲：對，我們有做過壓力測試。"],["賴委員士葆：你們一天最大頻寬可以到多少？200萬、300萬還是500萬？"],["莊部長翠雲：我們會後跟數發部確認再向委員報告。"],["賴委員士葆：第二個問題我很簡單的問，財政部一直開口閉口說要提財劃法，什麼時候可以出爐？"],["莊部長翠雲：年底前一定會出爐。"],["賴委員士葆：年底前一定出爐？"],["莊部長翠雲：對，年底前一定會出爐。"],["賴委員士葆：在出爐的過程當中，是不是跟各地方政府都討論過了？"],["莊部長翠雲：財政部其實已經開過四次會議，對於水平的分配……"],["賴委員士葆：各縣市都同意你這種版本嗎？"],["莊部長翠雲：我們已經做了最大的共識，當然……"],["賴委員士葆：另外有一個345億，現在又有民進黨的委員提出來說要怎麼用，用在坐月子補助、補助這個、補助那個，但是不要忘了，這裡面離島可能就要拿掉220億，所以沒有剩這麼多，應該只剩一百多億而已喔！"],["莊部長翠雲：345億是因為公式的問題沒有辦法分配出去。"],["賴委員士葆：那要怎麼處理？你們認為該怎麼處理？"],["莊部長翠雲：要修法，才能決定345億要怎麼分配啊！"],["賴委員士葆：其實財劃法本身是給地方政府的，再怎麼修都應該給地方政府，這是一個中心思想，因為財劃法本來就是中央給地方的，這是我跟你強調的。事實上也沒有這麼多，因為我們只同意修一條，除了第十六條之三，以後如果還有剩的要立什麼法、要來發什麼，那再說啦！","我們再看，APEC期間有財長會議，我知道這次APEC期間你並沒有去，對不對？你是前面財長會議去，後面沒有嘛？"],["莊部長翠雲：我參加第一個就是財長會議，是一整天；第二天有一個結構部長跟財政部長的雙部長會議，是早上、半天；接下來就是結構部長會議，結構部長會議是由我們國發會主委代表。"],["賴委員士葆：你見到的美國官員是什麼等級的？"],["莊部長翠雲：他們是副部長出席……美國副助理部長來出席……"],["賴委員士葆：是副助理部長，不是副部長。"],["莊部長翠雲：副助理部長，對。"],["賴委員士葆：副助理部長跟你見面。我們在這裡已經討論了不知道幾次、講了幾次了，你從前年開始答應，一直到去年，又到現在，你有沒有再跟他談臺美租稅協定？"],["莊部長翠雲：在那個場合我們有跟他提，就是臺美的租稅協定是雙方大家各界都希望能夠儘快簽署的，這個部分希望在他們國內能夠儘速推動……"],["賴委員士葆：他有沒有給你一點……"],["莊部長翠雲：也感謝他們的財政部跟我們的財政部，其實我們都有做工作小組，技術性地持續在做交流跟討論。"],["賴委員士葆：我現在要一個答案，請問你，他有沒有給你一個具體的承諾，說hopefully大概多少、什麼時候可以過？"],["莊部長翠雲：我想這個部分涉及他們國會的業務，以他們的財政部也很難肯定告訴我們國會一定會通過……"],["賴委員士葆：所以今年不可能囉？今年現在11月了，而且整個美國政府都停擺了，對不對？"],["莊部長翠雲：您也很了解美國目前的狀況……"],["賴委員士葆：對啊。"],["莊部長翠雲：但是我方其實一直都沒有放棄，一直透過各種管道……"],["賴委員士葆：我知道，所以今年底又沒有了，這個題目已經講了兩年了耶。"],["莊部長翠雲：對，這個題目我們雙方其實都很希望……"],["賴委員士葆：我們都講了兩年了，講到我都不好意思了，還跟你一直講同一個題目，我都不好意思了，一直問，對不對？但是你都沒有答案、都沒有進度。"],["莊部長翠雲：是，但是委員的關切其實是可以表達、代表我們國內的民意，希望能夠儘快地簽署臺美租稅協定。"],["賴委員士葆：我是做球給你，因為美國AIT的人說不定也在看也不一定。"],["莊部長翠雲：對，所以委員……"],["賴委員士葆：講給他們聽……"],["莊部長翠雲：是，委員的關心……"],["賴委員士葆：說我們這裡希望趕快簽，對不對？"],["莊部長翠雲：委員的關切其實就是表達我們國內的意思。"],["賴委員士葆：好，最後一個小題目……也不算小題目了，現在民間金金併的規模越來越大，泛公股相對的排名就越來越後面了。比如這樣講，第一金、兆豐金都沒有壽險，老實講不夠完全變成一個金控，對不對？你有沒有想要推動公併私、公私併，有沒有這樣的計畫？"],["莊部長翠雲：就是公股跟民間的去合併？"],["賴委員士葆：對，去併民間的。"],["莊部長翠雲：我想這個部分要綜合的評估、要有綜效，而且能夠可以互補我們比較弱的部分。當然，金控可以去做評估，財政部基本上是看他們評估出來的結果可以給予支持。"],["賴委員士葆：因為現在民間都一直私私併，越來越大。"],["莊部長翠雲：是。"],["賴委員士葆：我們的競爭力相對地就會低。"],["莊部長翠雲：就會受到影響。"],["賴委員士葆：對，所以我希望你能不能夠提出一個評估報告，可不可以？就是要不要推動公私併，你的答案可以說不要、暫時不要，或者你準備想要，都可以，給我一個答案。"],["莊部長翠雲：是，好。"],["賴委員士葆：時間表什麼時候可以給我？"],["莊部長翠雲：好，我們會給委員一個評估報告。"],["賴委員士葆：大概什麼時候？"],["莊部長翠雲：給我們三個月時間，好嗎？"],["賴委員士葆：一個月啦，三個月……"],["莊部長翠雲：我們還要去彙整各個行庫的意向和評估。"],["賴委員士葆：好，那就兩個月好了，可以吧？兩個月。"],["莊部長翠雲：好。"],["賴委員士葆：兩個月提出財政部要不要推動公私併的計畫，好不好？評估一下。"],["莊部長翠雲：好，我們評估，謝謝委員。"],["主席：謝謝賴士葆委員。","接下來請郭國文委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":92,"meet_id":"委員會-11-4-20-6","speakers":["林思銘","王鴻薇","李彥秀","徐欣瑩","羅廷瑋","陳超明","許宇甄","林德福","吳秉叡","賴士葆","郭國文","賴惠員","顏寬恒","鍾佳濱","李坤城","王世堅","陳玉珍","黃國昌","羅明才","黃珊珊","楊瓊瓔"],"page_start":1,"meetingDate":["2025-11-05"],"gazette_id":"1149201","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1149201_00002"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第4會期財政委員會第6次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"審查「使用牌照稅法」29案：（僅詢答）一、行政院函請審議、本院委員邱鎮軍等19人、委員陳\n超明等18人、委員羅明才等20人、委員廖偉翔等19人、委員楊瓊瓔等27人、委員許宇甄等22人、\n委員邱若華等17人、委員林俊憲等26人、委員王鴻薇等19人、委員李彥秀等16人、委員蘇清泉等\n18人、委員徐欣瑩等24人、委員郭昱晴等19人、委員王美惠等19人、委員李坤城等18人、委員羅\n廷瑋等17人、委員郭國文等18人、委員吳沛憶等17人、委員葛如鈞等16人、委員沈發惠等17人、\n委員林思銘等22人、委員賴士葆等25人、委員黃健豪等20人分別擬具「使用牌照稅法第五條條文\n修正草案」等24 案；二、本院台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「使用牌照稅法第五條及第七條條文修正草\n案」案；三、本院委員廖先翔等17 人擬具「使用牌照稅法第五條及第三十八條條文修正草案」\n案；四、本院委員牛煦庭等17人、委員鍾佳濱等16人分別擬具「使用牌照稅法第七條條文修正草\n案」等 2 案；五、本院委員廖偉翔等 17 人擬具「使用牌照稅法第七條及第三十八條條文修正草\n案」案","agenda_id":"1149201_00001"}}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}