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是"},{"start":301.158,"end":322.919,"text":"我其實不是要請你上來解釋這個啦因為這個我們已經我講過嘛我對抒發部從我站在這個位置這個會期開始我就只有一個問題問你就打雜其他我沒有任何問過抒發部任何問題那為什麼這樣我一直在講這個事情一萬塊就要發了可是我們這個宣導啊我不認為大家懂"},{"start":325.532,"end":352.184,"text":"我的做法我告訴家裡長輩的做法是就是政府另外領一萬塊的那兩個方法是譬如說你就直接零貴嘛是不然就ATM嘛是對不對是那這個實在是太困難啦是好主委你看我就講嘛我們大家都是政府我們都在宣導讓民眾知道哪一個是假的網站是但是我忽然告訴你就像你今天你此刻我發簡訊給你是"},{"start":354.312,"end":368.86,"text":"我們的各位這個行政院的各位同仁發簡訊給大家各部會的同仁你能立刻知道要不要點你也很懷疑所以更不要講一般民眾所以部長認重道遠謝謝要搞這個普發現金為什麼這個"},{"start":372.222,"end":394.974,"text":"四個假網站曝光不知道還有四十個還四百個沒有曝光嘛是沒錯可能此刻我在質詢的當下就有人正在受騙嘛是所以這個一萬塊啊要做這件事情就是說你要透過網站去做這個事情是速發部應該要有一個更審慎的規劃是你現在才在宣導是你宣導的狀況你看等於我們自己的"},{"start":395.774,"end":419.71,"text":"政府的同仁都不是太確定都不是太確定所以呢你們一定要想個辦法啦不然你要做這個你就不要做你要有拿出速發部的做法好不好這就已經開始了我現在講已經有點慢了啦但是你看我隨便考一下這個你要宣導到大家去都去知道這個難度實在很高"},{"start":419.83,"end":448.509,"text":"抱歉啦那個上場就像棒球員突然上場會緊張一下沒關係啦我沒有怪你你也沒有答錯啦你也不算答錯你只是說謹慎一下啦但是呢你看很明顯的這個謹慎只有你有辦法你是速發部長嘛一般民眾是沒有辦法有你謹沒有辦法這樣謹慎還有回去有速發部可以來問來去查沒有辦法OK那個祖密市區啊這個市場上都在大家都在煩惱因為市區的用戶現在還有一千多萬戶有啦"},{"start":450.851,"end":465.459,"text":"這一千多萬戶不斷在擔心因為現在可能這個電信公司不斷在促銷5G所以大家接到這種叫大家去轉5G的電話就會感到有壓力或緊張4G是不是會停了會停止服務"},{"start":466.52,"end":473.204,"text":"有沒有這個事情沒有沒有這個事情4G跟5G因為這個在技術上面上是標的雖然是5G的頻譜可是4G的服務其實還在持續這個應該是4G跟5G他講的是技術我應該問的是那個資費的方案沒有我只是問你說4G的服務不可以停止"},{"start":487.752,"end":510.474,"text":"這個一千多萬怎麼可能因為你的電信公司在促銷或者在推廣的時候他的那個語氣會讓民眾覺得好像一副4G快不行了要大家都去改5G這個就是市場為什麼會有這個題目會跑出來消費者為什麼會擔心可能你要跟電信公司稍微再溝通一下啦不要造成這個誤解我覺得"},{"start":510.854,"end":536.903,"text":"所以本席今天在這裡公開問你就是要從NCC的嘴巴告訴所有的消費者沒有這件事情喜歡5G的人就去辦5G因為資費那麼高嘛我們一般市井小民學生這些年輕朋友如果你的經濟能力有壓力的你辦4G絕對沒有問題可以繼續用那對於特殊需求的這些資費方案目前都還在持續當中對對對所以你這個要讓大家清楚喜歡5G的人可以說喜歡4G他還是有保障住啦然後呢這個"},{"start":540.322,"end":568.569,"text":"接下來這個纜線啊那個部長這個纜線現在目前有三條正在修復當中對不對就是這個EAC1 TDM2跟TSE1對不對三條纜線在修復中是委員您現在應該是本部網站網易上的資料對對對對那這三條纜線在修復中目前沒有修如果還沒修復完成之前對誰的衝擊最大"},{"start":571.743,"end":594.671,"text":"報委員目前為止台馬二號部分完全不用擔心因為台馬三號可以完全的替代掉所以完全不用擔心那至於EAC-1跟TS-1的話TS-1剛剛已經跟委員報告過那只是中間一根星段而已因為它大概十二星到六星也完全沒受影響那EAC-1的部分也有替代的路由所以大概目前為止影響不大以上報告"},{"start":595.011,"end":602.454,"text":"好 那既然這樣我實在有一點搞混就是看起來好像都沒什麼影響那這三條到底要做什麼"},{"start":603.738,"end":622.188,"text":"那不修會怎麼樣就是說我們把它修好了什麼就會變怎麼樣不修看起來我聽你們回答好像三條不修好像也不會怎樣這個基本上都是備援就像我們那個打棒球有一些板墊球員然後有人受傷了就換一個上去所以其實簡單講不修我們的備援就有問題"},{"start":625.79,"end":643.654,"text":"是不是這樣但現行對我們消費者使用上面現行這此刻的狀態沒有任何太大的影響但備援很重要備援很重要那最後一個問題那什麼時候你們預計什麼時候可以修復除了第一條這個東東亞交會這個是114年11月28嘛你們預計修復日期嘛對不對是那其他兩條你寫評估中是怎麼樣是"},{"start":650.635,"end":678.52,"text":"報告委員因為所有的海嵐在維修的時候都需要靠海嵐的國外的海嵐船團那這需要他們的評估因為國際上不是只有我們沒關係你只要大約告訴我譬如說一年內可不可以修復我只能跟委員報告說目前為止我看到的資料海嵐曾經在半年之內有維修的最長大概到半年之內會維修完成好這是最最最最長的最長對最長最長所以應該再怎麼樣也不可能拖到一兩年以上"},{"start":678.84,"end":685.744,"text":"當然有時候有時候海象的關係啊那就是禁訴啦備援對國安也很重要啦好謝謝謝謝委員"}]},"gazette":{"lineno":499,"blocks":[["蔡委員其昌：（10時11分）謝謝主席，請數發部林部長、國家通訊傳播委員會黃主秘。"],["主席：請林部長、請黃文哲主秘。"],["林部長宜敬：委員早安。"],["蔡委員其昌：部長早、主秘早。今天已經要開始進行普發現金1萬元的登記，我看了一下媒體報導，最近有4個假的財政部網站曝光，所以普發現金登記前要先認清楚網址，政府也做了宣導，我們提醒「.gov.tw」才是真的網站，對不對？"],["林部長宜敬：是，沒錯。"],["蔡委員其昌：這個是我們一直在宣導的。","請部長跟主秘看一下螢幕，你們覺得這三個網址哪一個是真的，哪一個是假的？"],["林部長宜敬：第三個絕對是假的。"],["蔡委員其昌：你一個一個來，我等一下會問主秘，不然主秘先回答好了。"],["黃主任秘書文哲：第一個應該是真的啦，第二個應該是假的，第三個的話，第三個可能很難判斷，因為「mvdisgov」……"],["蔡委員其昌：我們現場的列席官員，內政部有派人來嘛，請問視察，你覺得哪一個是真的、哪一個是假的？"],["張簡任視察則民：第一個是真的，第三個應該也是。"],["蔡委員其昌：一跟三啦，你認為一跟三是真的？一跟三還是一跟二？只有一是真的。","能源署呢？"],["陳副署長崇憲：應該第一個是真的，其他兩個可能都是假的。"],["蔡委員其昌：可能都是假的。好。請問現場有人覺得除了一是真的之外，認為第二個是真的人，請舉手。第二個，政府宣傳的嘛，「.gov.tw」是真的網站，有沒有人認為第二個是真的？那認為第二個是假的，請舉手。好，所以也有人遲疑啦，沒有舉手嘛；也有人真的沒有舉手，假的也沒有舉手，換言之，不大知道是真假。","部長，你覺得哪一個是真的？"],["陳部長世凱：第一個。"],["蔡委員其昌：只有第一個是真的，其他都是假的？好。","部長，你不能錯喔！其他人錯還……"],["林部長宜敬：這樣我壓力很大啦。"],["蔡委員其昌：對，你絕對不能錯，你錯了，這個臉就丟大了！"],["林部長宜敬：我現在用目視判斷，第一個是真的，第三個是假的，第二個我會回去確認，因為我要確認那個「gov」的字型會不會其實是個零或者怎麼樣，就有一些trap或是技巧啦。"],["蔡委員其昌：沒有、沒有，就是「gov」，我現在就可以告訴你，就是「gov」。"],["林部長宜敬：如果是「gov」，應該就是……"],["黃主任秘書文哲：那個「gov」已經是子目錄了，主目錄是「t.ly」"],["蔡委員其昌：你覺得呢？"],["林部長宜敬：這個domain是真的，前面加的那個看起來有點可疑。"],["蔡委員其昌：所以第二個你覺得是假的？"],["林部長宜敬：這個我……"],["蔡委員其昌：還是不能夠確定？"],["林部長宜敬：對，我們做事情的方法，科學家的方法就是再去確定。"],["蔡委員其昌：好，我跟大家公布答案，只有第一個是真的，另外兩個都是假的。"],["林部長宜敬：是。"],["蔡委員其昌：另外兩個是假的，這個是之前的，不是發現金，而是之前以監理站的名義專門在騙大家點進去繳費的釣魚網站，那第二個為什麼是假的，因為它的「gov.tw」不是在前面而是在斜線後面，這是假的，這是我拿過去的東西來問你們。"],["林部長宜敬：是、是、是。"],["蔡委員其昌：部長，你看，連你對第二個，你都要回去查證一下，現場我們很多政府部門的同仁們也都不是太確定。部長，你覺得一般的社會大眾怎麼知道？他難道還要跟你一樣回去數發部查一下，然後看哪一個，第二個是不是真或者是假？"],["林部長宜敬：是。委員說的完全沒錯，所以我們現在的宣傳是，普發現金的時候不是說只認「gov.tw」，我們講的是所有關於登記的訊息還有發放的作業等等，都只在「10000.gov.tw」，只有在這個上面才會是真的。這是我們的白名單策略，另外有個黑名單策略，就是我們在網站上事先預防，我們去把所有看起來很像，譬如說把10000寫成是1OOOO的這些網站我們就事先封阻，所以我們就是努力把各種詐騙的管道封阻住。"],["蔡委員其昌：好。我其實不是要請你上來解釋這個，因為這個我們已經……我講過嘛，我對數發部，從這個會期我站在這個位置開始，我就只有一個問題問你，就是打詐，其他我沒有問過數發部任何問題。"],["林部長宜敬：是。"],["蔡委員其昌：為什麼這樣？我一直在講這個事情，1萬塊就要發了，可是我們的宣導，我不認為大家懂啦。那我的作法，我告訴家裡長輩的作法，就是政府另外領1萬塊的那兩個方法，譬如說你就直接臨櫃嘛，不然就ATM嘛，對不對？"],["林部長宜敬：是、是、是。"],["蔡委員其昌：這個實在是太困難了，主委，你看，我就講我們大家都是政府官員，我們都在宣導讓民眾知道哪一個是假的網站，但是我忽然告訴你，就像今天此刻我發簡訊給你，發簡訊給我們行政院各部會的同仁，你能立刻知道，唉唷，我要點還是不要點？你也很懷疑啦，所以更不要講一般民眾，所以，部長，任重道遠啦……"],["林部長宜敬：是。謝謝，謝謝委員的提醒。"],["蔡委員其昌：要搞這個普發現金，為什麼？這4個假網站曝光，不知道還有40個還是400個沒有曝光嘛。"],["林部長宜敬：是，沒錯、沒錯。"],["蔡委員其昌：可能此刻我在質詢的當下就有人正在受騙嘛，所以你要透過網站去做發放1萬塊這件事情，數發部應該要有一個更審慎的規劃。"],["林部長宜敬：是。"],["蔡委員其昌：你現在才在宣導，你宣導的狀況，你看，連我們自己政府的同仁都不是太確定，所以，你們一定要想個辦法。不然你就不要做，不然你要做這個，你就要拿出數發部的作法，好不好？"],["林部長宜敬：是，沒錯，沒錯，對，好。"],["蔡委員其昌：發放作業已經開始，我現在說已經有點慢了，但是你看，我隨便考一下，你要宣導到大家都知道，這個難度實在很高。"],["林部長宜敬：抱歉，就像棒球員突然上場了也會緊張一下。"],["蔡委員其昌：沒關係，我沒有怪你，你也沒有答錯，你也不算答錯，你只是說謹慎一下。"],["林部長宜敬：是。"],["蔡委員其昌：但是你看很明顯的，這個謹慎只有你有辦法，你是數發部長嘛，一般民眾是沒有辦法這樣謹慎，回去還有數發部可以來問、來去查，沒有辦法。"],["林部長宜敬：是，OK。"],["蔡委員其昌：主秘，4G這部分，市場上大家都在煩惱，因為4G的用戶現在還有一千多萬戶，有啦喔？"],["黃主任秘書文哲：是。"],["蔡委員其昌：這一千多萬戶不斷地在擔心，因為現在可能電信公司不斷地在促銷5G，所以大家接到這種叫大家去轉5G的電話就會感到有壓力，或是緊張4G是不是會停止服務，有沒有這個事情？"],["黃主任秘書文哲：沒有，沒有這個訊息。"],["蔡委員其昌：好。"],["黃主任秘書文哲：4G跟5G因為在技術上面，上次標的雖然是5G的頻譜，可是4G的服務其實還在持續……"],["蔡委員其昌：對，那……"],["黃主任秘書文哲：這個應該講的是4G跟5G的技術……"],["蔡委員其昌：對、對、對、對，所以4……"],["黃主任秘書文哲：所以委員應該問的是那個資費的方案……"],["蔡委員其昌：沒有、沒有，我只是問你說，4G的服務不可以停止啦！這個用戶還有一千多萬怎麼可能，因為你的電信公司在促銷或者在推廣的時候，他的語氣會讓民眾覺得好像一副4G快不行了，要大家都去改5G，這就是市場為什麼會有這個題目跑出來，消費者為什麼會擔心。"],["黃主任秘書文哲：了解、了解。是、是。"],["蔡委員其昌：可能你要跟電信公司稍微再溝通一下……"],["黃主任秘書文哲：好，了解、了解。"],["蔡委員其昌：不要造成民眾的誤解。所以本席今天在這裡公開問你，就是要透過NCC的嘴巴告訴所有的消費者，沒有這件事情。"],["黃主任秘書文哲：是。"],["蔡委員其昌：喜歡5G的人就去辦5G，因為資費那麼高嘛，我們一般市井小民、學生這些年輕朋友，如果你的經濟能力有壓力的，你辦4G絕對沒有問題，可以繼續用。"],["黃主任秘書文哲：是。對於特殊需求的這些資費方案，目前都還在持續當中。"],["蔡委員其昌：對、對、對，所以你要讓大家清楚，喜歡4G的人，他的權益還是有保障住。"],["黃主任秘書文哲：是。"],["蔡委員其昌：然後接下來纜線的部分，部長，纜線現在目前有三條正在修復當中，對不對？"],["林部長宜敬：是。"],["蔡委員其昌：就是EAC1、TDM2跟TSE-1，對不對？三條纜線在修復中。"],["牛司長信仁：是，報告委員，您現在說的應該是本部網頁上的資料，是嗎？"],["蔡委員其昌：對、對、對，這三條纜線在修復中，如果還沒修復完成之前，對誰的衝擊最大？"],["牛司長信仁：報告委員，目前為止，臺馬二號的部分完全不用擔心，因為臺馬三號可以完全的替代掉，所以完全不用擔心。"],["蔡委員其昌：OK，好。"],["牛司長信仁：至於EAC1跟TSE-1的話，TSE-1剛才已經跟委員報告過，那只是中間一根芯斷了而已，因為它大概12芯到6芯也完全沒受影響，那EAC1的部分也有替代的路由，所以大概目前為止影響不大。以上報告。"],["蔡委員其昌：好，既然這樣，我實在有一點搞混，就是看起來好像都沒什麼影響，那這三條到底要做什麼？那不修會怎麼樣？就是說我們把它修好了，什麼就會變怎麼樣，不修看起來我聽你們的回答，這三條不修好像也不會怎樣？"],["林部長宜敬：是，這個基本上都是備援，就像我們打棒球有一些板凳球員嘛，對不對？然後有人受傷了，就換一個上去。"],["蔡委員其昌：好，對、對。部長，所以其實簡單講，不修我們的備援就會有問題，是不是這樣？"],["林部長宜敬：是，沒錯。"],["蔡委員其昌：但現行對我們消費者的使用上面，現行此刻的狀態沒有任何太大的影響，但備援很重要……"],["林部長宜敬：是，備援很重要。"],["蔡委員其昌：好，最後一個問題，那你們預計什麼時候可以修復？除了第一條這個東亞交匯1號海纜，你們預計修復日期是114年11月28日嘛，對不對？"],["林部長宜敬：是。"],["蔡委員其昌：那其他兩條你寫「評估中」是怎麼樣？"],["牛司長信仁：報告委員，因為所有的海纜在維修的時候都需要靠國外的海纜船團，這個需要他們的評估，因為國際上不是只有我們在斷纜……"],["蔡委員其昌：沒關係，你只要大約告訴我，譬如說一年內可不可以修復？有沒有機會？"],["牛司長信仁：我只能跟委員報告，目前為止我看到的資料，海纜曾經在半年之內有維修的，最長大概到半年之內會維修完成，我目前看到的資料。"],["蔡委員其昌：好，這是最短的時……"],["牛司長信仁：最長的。"],["蔡委員其昌：最長的？"],["牛司長信仁：對，最長、最長，大概180天以上。"],["蔡委員其昌：所以應該再怎麼樣也不可能拖到一、兩年以上啦？"],["牛司長信仁：當然有時候因為海象的關係或什麼原因……"],["蔡委員其昌：好、好、好，那就儘速，備援對國安也很重要啦！謝謝。"],["牛司長信仁：是。"],["林部長宜敬：是，謝謝委員。"],["主席：謝謝蔡其昌委員發言完畢。","先作以下宣告：徐富癸委員發言完畢之後，休息10分鐘，請各黨團助理告知其他還沒有發言的委員，徐富癸委員發言完畢之後休息10分鐘。","現在請陳素月委員發言。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":524,"meet_id":"委員會-11-4-23-5","speakers":["李昆澤","沈伯洋","蘇巧慧","林楚茵","黃國昌","洪孟楷","魯明哲","蔡其昌","陳素月","徐富癸","林俊憲","許智傑","陳雪生","廖先翔","邱若華","何欣純","王鴻薇","黃健豪","游顥","林國成"],"page_start":461,"meetingDate":["2025-11-05"],"gazette_id":"1149201","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1149201_00007"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第4會期交通委員會第5次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、審查(一)行政院函請審議、(二)委員王美惠等20人、(三)委員李坤城等18人、(四)委員伍麗華\nSaidhai Tahovecahe 等16人、(五)委員羅美玲等19人、(六)委員黃捷等21人、(七)委員邱鎮軍\n等21人、(八)委員吳沛憶等16人、(九)委員林楚茵等17人、(十)委員沈伯洋等18人、(十一)委員\n蔡易餘等17人、(十二)委員郭昱晴等16人分別擬具「電信管理法第七十二條條文修正草案」案及\n(十三)委員林宜瑾等22人擬具「電信管理法增訂第七十二條之二條文草案」案；二、審查(一)行\n政院函請審議、 ( 二 ) 委員王美惠等 19 人、 ( 三 ) 委員李坤城等 17 人、 ( 四 ) 委員伍麗華 Saidhai\nTahovecahe 等16人、(五)委員黃捷等22人、(六)委員吳沛憶等16人、(七)委員林楚茵等17人、\n(八)委員沈伯洋等18人、(九)委員蔡易餘等16人及(十)委員郭昱晴等16人分別擬具「氣象法第二\n十一條之一條文修正草案」案；三、審查(一)行政院函請審議、(二)委員王美惠等20人、(三)委\n員李坤城等18人、(四)委員伍麗華 Saidhai Tahovecahe 等16人、(五)委員羅美玲等19人、(六)\n委員黃捷等22 人、( 七) 委員邱鎮軍等23 人、( 八) 委員吳沛憶等16 人、( 九) 委員林楚茵等17 人、\n(十)委員沈伯洋等19人、(十一)委員蔡易餘等16人及(十二)委員郭昱晴等16人分別擬具「商港法\n第十五條及第六十五條之四條文修正草案」案；四、審查(一)行政院函請審議、(二)委員蔡其昌\n等 22 人 、 ( 三 ) 委 員 王 美 惠 等 21 人 、 ( 四 ) 委 員 李 坤 城 等 18 人 、 ( 五 ) 委 員 伍 麗 華 Saidhai\nTahovecahe 等16人、(六)委員黃捷等16人、(七)委員徐富癸等16人、(八)委員吳沛憶等16人、\n(九)委員林楚茵等17人、(十)委員沈伯洋等19人、(十一)委員蔡易餘等17人、(十二)委員郭昱晴\n等16人分別擬具「船舶法部分條文修正草案」案及(十三)委員蘇巧慧等18人擬具「船舶法第八條\n及第八十九條條文修正草案」案【本日會議僅進行詢答】","agenda_id":"1149201_00006"}}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}