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主委近一点来其实这个风灾水灾各种灾害灾损不断包含震灾都有所以我在关注这些灾害复建的这一个执行成效我觉得有一个系统性的问题那就是说地方政府他申报他的这个复建工程师绝大部分他是恢复原状"},{"start":43.14,"end":72.715,"text":"可是很多地點是重複災損就是說我們不斷的在看到同一個地區同一個地點的災損不斷的出現那一座橋可能五年斷三次那同一條路可能年年攤房那代表說我們是在治標當然現行的這個公共設施的復建工程他的執行作業要點裡面他有提到說地方政府在提報時是只要寫這個災損的情形嗎還是他可以要求必須進行災害根本的原因分析"},{"start":76.859,"end":77.505,"text":"手臂也会大"},{"start":85.74,"end":108.81,"text":"就是就災害的這個復建我們傳統的就如同委員講的說回復原狀但是我們現在的標準是回復原來的功能所以回復原來的功能會根據它現在的地質的狀況還有核穿的條件等等去配套那並不是說很呆板的這個就回復原狀謝謝你剛才提到這個問題但是這個問題也在這邊因為我們現在要寫的"},{"start":112.592,"end":140.508,"text":"這些災損的時候我們要要求在災後一個月內提報那災後這一個月內提報如果要達到你的功能恢復的話那我怎麼做水文怎麼做地質分析我只能提告最簡單的方案就是恢復原狀那目前我們得到的資訊如果我有這個資訊上面的落差的話隨時歡迎來糾正我那工程會的審議還是注重在進度管理跟這個施工的速度所以說如果我們現在要做的是根本改變的話或者是你說功能改變的話"},{"start":141.628,"end":150.814,"text":"功能恢復的話那變成說你又要協調上有整治可能會涉及跨部會可能會涉及環評那時間如果拉長可能就變成高風險的案件"},{"start":152.182,"end":176.293,"text":"跟委員報告剛剛提到的一個月是我們一個原則但是如果有一些特別的情況或者是這些範圍比較大的時候實際上我們是給他可能一個月他先提報說可能先規劃的費用或者什麼所以會等到規劃設計完了以後再去確認工程費我們還也是有這種機制的"},{"start":177.193,"end":197.595,"text":"那我現在講的是不是我們嘉義是桃園的這個連外的枕頭山的吊橋的那件事件那這個案子是有被監委這個糾正那說他歷時8年那可是花了326萬規劃經費可是到最後他還是沒有辦法解決根本的問題他就是恢復原狀會比較安全那"},{"start":198.516,"end":217.006,"text":"我們嘉義有一個叫嘉義肉桶農路它也是有類似的問題它不斷的修那它每年還是會塌但我們現在要根本性的解決這個問題的話那就會花很多的經費跟資金的時程我們是不希望說單純的恢復原裝或者是說你說恢復它的功能它就是連外等等"},{"start":217.566,"end":242.843,"text":"可是它只要風雨一來又要再來一次所以有沒有辦法我們來想像一下就是工程會統籌這樣的這種公共工程的重任有沒有辦法我們來解決不是只是單一的工程它的功能回復而是我們要想的是以任務為導向我們的任務是讓這一個部落可以連外而不是以說我的任務是讓這個橋能夠修復這個部分想請教工程會的看法"},{"start":245.623,"end":273.075,"text":"跟委員說明那既然是災害那就是有時候要搶災搶險先恢復一般的使用那至於整個功能的改變或者是原狀的改變那可能剛剛講的可能需要一些比較長的計畫或者是環評我想那個回歸到正常各部位的本預算那因為搶這個整個災害防救的預算是"},{"start":274.055,"end":296.961,"text":"全部是由特統這邊來支出這比較緊急的當然是沒有辦法一次解決問題所以希望回到正常的本預算來處理我今天講這個問題就是說我們當然是支持就是應急先我們救急救災的時候我們都是希望說盡快的有一個方案出來但是我今天講這個問題在於說很多時候是地方政府你說叫他協調各個部會"},{"start":297.901,"end":320.047,"text":"他們又要找水利署 農業部 國土署但有些時候地方政府沒有那個位階來去做整體的協調另外一個就是說有些地方我們剛才提到的種種的基礎建設它根本不適合一直投入資源去修復那一段甚至是我們要想的是說有沒有其他的方式來去整體評估它的長期的成本效益"},{"start":320.767,"end":346.205,"text":"你如果說它這個地點它本來就是抑制災案件它本來就是抑被損壞的地方那我們是不是要思考說其他的方式以任務為導向想說我的任務是要連外那這個地方為什麼每次都會塌陷那是不是表示這個地方不適合建造這個公共工程所以說我們有一個資料庫的話那我們就可以讓每一個案件就是說5年10年的資料彙整出來就是說有這個資料庫我們審議的時候會發覺到說這個地方為什麼重複災損"},{"start":349.267,"end":364.432,"text":"重複災損不斷的在投入這個金額然後你發現到有一天原來我已經投入了數以百億計在維護這座橋但事實上我乾脆就可以做整體規劃都可以所花費的這個價格還低於重複修復這座橋"},{"start":365.672,"end":388.308,"text":"所以說我們在講的這個卓院長講的AI內閣的意思不就是首先要有數據庫資料庫有資料庫之後你才知道警示點說這個地方我們是不是過多的投入資源在治標那我現在要治根本的話我可以發覺到說原來我只要投入這樣子的資本就可以投入整體的這個規劃改建那就是以任務為導向那這個地方是給一個建議那是因為"},{"start":389.088,"end":402.645,"text":"我自己不是土木工程的專家但是是有很多地方的這個人士來包含這一些相關的土木技師是有有跟我們建議這樣子你的意見非常好我們會遵照這個意見來"},{"start":404.747,"end":419.796,"text":"由跟組總或其他各部會在他執行這種天然災害救治的時候他相關的這個累積的數據累積的預算 累積的工法那能不能定期做一個檢討"},{"start":420.817,"end":446.574,"text":"有些易淹水低積或易崩塌地區是否一定要每一次的這樣去恢復原狀為主應該長期來看這個我們會再協調各部會來就是請工程就不只是恢復原狀從根本上面來把這個基礎建設把它完成就是任務為導向 我就是要讓它出去年外那或許不是這一個道路或許是有其他的方式或許是有其他的工法這樣子好 謝謝"},{"start":450.406,"end":451.895,"text":"好 謝謝陳冠廷委員發言完畢"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}