{"error":false,"id":["165690"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":165690,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/165690","日期":"2025-11-20","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"委員會-11-4-35-16","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第4會期外交及國防委員會第16次全體委員會議","屆":11,"會期":4,"會次":16,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"委員會","委員會代碼":[35],"委員會代碼:str":["外交及國防委員會"],"標題":"第11屆第4會期外交及國防委員會第16次全體委員會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2025-11-20T10:55:43+08:00","結束時間":"2025-11-20T11:07:20+08:00","影片長度":"00:11:37","支援功能":["ai-transcript"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/972124280c86b913082a10e9ec55104e50d730950bdd7c8afa443352b7318b89739ca4563886b2115ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"沈伯洋","委員發言時間":"10:55:43 - 11:07:20","會議時間":"2025-11-20T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第4會期外交及國防委員會第16次全體委員會議（事由：邀請外交部部長林佳龍、農業部次長、衛生福利部次長報告「整合國家優勢輸出推動國際合作發展策略與進展」，並備質詢。）","transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":1.1953437500000001,"end":2.95034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":3.15284375,"end":3.84471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":10.645343750000002,"end":28.364093750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":16.028468750000002,"end":16.24784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":28.76909375,"end":28.785968750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":28.785968750000002,"end":29.106593750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":29.76471875,"end":31.047218750000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":31.50284375,"end":32.31284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":32.53221875,"end":45.96471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":45.96471875,"end":46.11659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":46.11659375,"end":56.95034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":48.580343750000004,"end":48.71534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":57.08534375,"end":69.87659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":59.51534375000001,"end":59.58284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":62.01284375,"end":62.400968750000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":66.23159375,"end":66.36659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":69.84284375,"end":70.12971875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":70.01159375,"end":79.29284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":79.29284375,"end":79.69784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":79.64721875000001,"end":87.42659375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":87.42659375000001,"end":87.96659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":87.89909375,"end":88.54034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":89.06346875,"end":89.77221875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":90.17721875000001,"end":92.18534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":92.84346875,"end":95.18909375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":95.39159375000001,"end":98.96909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":98.96909375,"end":99.27284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":99.22221875000001,"end":103.91346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":104.40284375,"end":106.20846875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":106.68096875,"end":111.94596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":112.50284375000001,"end":120.92346875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":121.24409375,"end":123.25221875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":123.45471875000001,"end":133.39409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":133.71471875,"end":135.18284375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":135.53721875000002,"end":152.49659375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":152.95221875000001,"end":153.44159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":153.44159375,"end":153.57659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":153.57659375,"end":293.09909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":191.95034375,"end":191.96721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":191.96721875,"end":192.11909375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":192.11909375000002,"end":192.18659375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":271.39784375,"end":271.56659375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":273.05159375,"end":273.27096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":293.45346875,"end":300.18659375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":300.18659375000004,"end":300.57471875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":300.45659375,"end":302.59971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":302.59971875,"end":302.93721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":302.68409375000005,"end":304.75971875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":305.02971875000003,"end":322.98471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":310.93596875000003,"end":311.37471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":311.37471875,"end":311.47596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":313.24784375,"end":313.70346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":316.55534375,"end":317.12909375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":322.90034375000005,"end":323.20409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":323.03534375000004,"end":342.05346875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":325.27971875000003,"end":325.60034375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":326.95034375,"end":327.45659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":328.09784375000004,"end":328.51971875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":342.05346875000004,"end":342.45846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":342.35721875,"end":358.45596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":358.40534375000004,"end":358.99596875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":358.65846875,"end":362.45534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":362.43846875,"end":362.80971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":362.65784375000004,"end":367.85534375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":366.52221875000004,"end":366.92721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":367.85534375000003,"end":368.41221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":368.05784375,"end":395.90159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":370.72409375,"end":371.16284375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":378.08159375,"end":378.40221875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":378.72284375000004,"end":379.07721875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":395.90159375,"end":402.56721875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":401.26784375000005,"end":408.99659375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":408.03471875,"end":409.80659375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":409.58721875000003,"end":411.19034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":411.29159375,"end":411.81471875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":411.35909375,"end":414.98721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":414.98721875,"end":415.07159375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":415.07159375000003,"end":418.27784375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":418.27784375000005,"end":418.59846875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":418.59846875000005,"end":421.07909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":421.07909375,"end":421.39971875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":421.31534375,"end":425.43284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":425.43284375,"end":426.00659375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":425.73659375000005,"end":429.85409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":430.15784375000004,"end":431.33909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":431.33909375,"end":431.92971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":431.92971875,"end":437.61659375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":435.18659375000004,"end":435.62534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":437.61659375000005,"end":438.03846875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":438.03846875000005,"end":446.96534375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":438.05534375,"end":438.08909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":446.96534375000005,"end":447.03284375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":447.03284375000004,"end":450.88034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":450.88034375,"end":451.33596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":451.13346875,"end":458.91284375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":458.03534375000004,"end":458.27159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":459.38534375,"end":466.01721875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":460.51596875,"end":460.54971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":460.54971875,"end":460.60034375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":460.60034375000004,"end":460.63409375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":460.63409375000003,"end":460.97159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":466.01721875000004,"end":518.46471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":470.69159375000004,"end":471.11346875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":518.5828437499999,"end":629.3840937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":526.9697187500001,"end":527.30721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":527.30721875,"end":527.34096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":533.78721875,"end":533.8547187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":539.1028437500001,"end":539.69346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":543.22034375,"end":543.3047187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":543.3047187500001,"end":543.3215937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":549.5147187499999,"end":549.9365937499999},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":554.5265937500001,"end":554.8640937499999},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":557.6484687500001,"end":558.12096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":560.78721875,"end":561.8672187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":571.65471875,"end":571.67159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":571.75596875,"end":571.8740937499999},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":576.0422187500001,"end":576.5990937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":579.1640937500001,"end":579.95721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":580.61534375,"end":580.66596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":589.81221875,"end":589.8290937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":589.8290937500001,"end":589.9640937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":589.9640937500001,"end":590.6728437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":592.19159375,"end":592.74846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":601.20284375,"end":601.6922187499999},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":604.94909375,"end":605.4384687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":611.98596875,"end":612.94784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":617.47034375,"end":618.02721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":618.02721875,"end":618.44909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":620.45721875,"end":620.5078437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":620.5078437500001,"end":621.1828437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":628.87784375,"end":630.29534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":630.0928437499999,"end":638.42909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":635.72909375,"end":636.8259687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":638.59784375,"end":643.2553437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":640.2009687500001,"end":640.23471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":643.50846875,"end":651.54096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":651.54096875,"end":668.53409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":668.6015937500001,"end":692.8172187499999},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":670.23846875,"end":670.4240937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":690.7078437499999,"end":691.16346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":692.9015937500001,"end":697.8797187499999},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":698.03159375,"end":698.1159687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":698.1159687500001,"end":698.23409375}],"whisperx":[{"start":1.186,"end":3.787,"text":"謝謝主席有請部長謝謝請部長部長好委員好因為最近剛好比較多時事剛好王委員其實也有問到就是說好像是今天你在受訪的時候就有提到就是現在中國去禁止日本的這一些水產品等等之類的你說我們在外交上面會有一些支持是不是可以再次說明一下是"},{"start":29.824,"end":56.016,"text":"因為日本現在對應該講說中國現在對日本的行為都過去發生在對台灣嘛包括文攻武嚇經濟脅迫各種霸凌的行為那現在也發生在我們的邻邦先是菲律賓現在又是日本所以中共就是麻煩製造者他想要藉由一些事情啊來去不管建軍備戰或轉移國內的焦點或是能夠跟未來美國這個討價還價"},{"start":59.537,"end":88.115,"text":"那這個時候啦 當然政府該做政府的那我也呼籲我們的國人啊可以以行動來支持日本特別是高斯草苗手下因為他的印太戰略或他的這個所謂的台灣有事就是日本有事就是日美安保有事這個是持續性的那他在那個內容講話其實也是很周延只是說當然有人會斷章取義那我覺得"},{"start":89.176,"end":111.612,"text":"所以他說的不對的話他說的誠實的話他也沒有要收回所以我想這個事情也不是中共單方面可以無限上綱的他想要藉由這個事情去找事情那我們要共同來管理因為稍微不慎他因為他現在是今年是所謂的三個八十年"},{"start":112.877,"end":132.711,"text":"抗日成功80年然後這個二戰結束成立聯合國80年然後所謂光復台灣的80年所以他今年就是民族主義年他就是要動員愛國主義所以這個時候呢我們要很小心的去因應但是也不用太過去被他做認知作戰比如說所謂一開始就是演習在黃海"},{"start":133.812,"end":145.199,"text":"如果地圖上你去看那個就是他暗編規模很小例行性的可是他就把它放大那我們的媒體或國人要了解要正確的進行試讀避免被他運用了這個也是我們在處理危機的時候也不要這個反應過度了要適當"},{"start":154.165,"end":178.857,"text":"確實要小心就是說呢這個現在在今年其實像高市的這個發言跟以前的發言其實並沒有什麼太大的差別但他就是故意說這個就是他的挑釁就是他去frame說高市的言論影響到他們的感情那我最近剛剛也有提到其實他們在做這個操作的時候最近不管是在Facebook還是在Threads上面其實有大量的帳號其實都是在詆毀日本"},{"start":179.597,"end":206.379,"text":"那這個詆毀日本呢當然在我們的國民我們大家自有公斷但是在外交上面我們特別要注意就是說如果我們也發現了有這樣的一個社群的操作其實外交是可以出來講話的這是第一個那第二個就是剛剛講的因為農業部在嘛對不對就是說我們今天呢跟農業部不管是怎麼協調怎麼跟國人呼籲就是說他們如果今天有這個被中國禁止出口的這個事情的時候台灣我們要怎麼去支持我覺得這個外交上面這個"},{"start":207.62,"end":231.853,"text":"之前我們在不管是在災害發生的時候我們所給予的這個能量跟支持其實這都是人民跟之間這個感情的互動那如果在這一次呢也有這樣的相類似的行動的話我相信呢對於台日之間的這個感情一定會更好那我接下來想問一下就是說我本來還想繼續往下但我突然想到一件事情就是說因為去年這個外交部的這個預算其實是被刪減跟凍結不少"},{"start":234.315,"end":250.473,"text":"我想知道就是說當然第一個今年我們還是要想辦法要守護好我們這個外交的預算因為我們說真的外交的預算本來就已經不太夠了中國的打壓就像剛剛部長提到的中國的打壓今年是特別的多在特別多的時候結果我們這邊的預算還沒有辦法執行那一定是問題"},{"start":251.834,"end":277.582,"text":"但是我想問人員的部分就是說我們現在在這個海外這些駐外的這個使館就是人員是不是有不足夠的問題有時候我們預缺會不會沒有辦法補上就是說我們現在在軍隊有這個問題嘛但外交人員因為外交人員一直以來都會有被挖角因為外交人員非常優秀外面的企業都想要挖角挖角之後呢因為畢竟在外面遇到中國的打壓他們有時候工時真的很長"},{"start":278.622,"end":292.518,"text":"工時長然後呢這個薪水又沒有一直辦法往上提升的時候呢其實有時候也會影響到士氣現在有沒有什麼規劃可以讓我們這個在這個海外就是我們現在預缺然後是希望能夠補上人力這件事情目前有沒有什麼規劃"},{"start":294.12,"end":317.482,"text":"報告委員我們當然公寓善其事必先利其器外交人員在第一線是打仗我們怎麼給他最好的環境這個我當外交部長我用很多精神在這方面所以除了預算增加然後他們的一些像譬如說地域加急 房屋補貼 健保 兒女的教育我覺得這個我們國家要全力來支持以外就是原額"},{"start":318.503,"end":345.14,"text":"那元額像歐洲專案我們就有一個整體的一個政策那也感謝這個行政院的支持先給我們的30個元額因為外交人員的這個入局他是要去訓練然後最後再外派他需要花至少一兩年的時間所以我們先有這樣子然後後面我們也都用政策性的比如要推動農幫計畫像現在以歐洲來講幾乎每個國家都想要跟我們發展"},{"start":346.281,"end":353.443,"text":"包括這個經濟外交當然文化外交還有非常多所以這方面確實會影響我們台灣我們外管的能量那我也在重新規劃打區域聯防避免各自為政強化落實館長制然後我們總和外交就是各部會我們也有派外人員加強整合"},{"start":368.327,"end":395.116,"text":"然後發揮綜合的這個外交的戰力這個是屬於組織調整跟改革但是真的你如果沒人沒錢那也沒有辦法去做這些事情所以說委員是說我們是希望委員會能夠支持就是預算的增加那我們也會把人人編制也增加我們一定會打造一個就是能夠來落實總和外交跟榮邦計畫的外交團隊"},{"start":396.156,"end":414.678,"text":"對 因為我覺得就是畢竟本鳳等等之類有時候是定死的像剛剛提到家籍啦我跟委員報告補充抱歉比如說那個物價一直上升像在美國或是歐洲甚至像新港那個租金很貴他那個住不起在那個都市中心他就往郊外住"},{"start":415.219,"end":441.506,"text":"然後為了通勤上下有些是女性像紐約他安全也會有顧慮搭地鐵我覺得說當然美國有一個叫做Foreign Service Act因為像我們國防部我們軍方是有相關的人事法令其實我也是覺得我們立法院也可以來研議是不是針對外交人員有一個專法讓他可以充分的來發揮吸收更多的人才願意來當台灣的外交官"},{"start":443.487,"end":458.657,"text":"因為如果說現在來考試的外交官的質量相對於我們可能幾十年前也許大陸那個時候都想要外交報廓可是現在社會的吸引力太多薪水啦單單會語言或有外交的這個能力的人才企業都"},{"start":459.477,"end":486.145,"text":"都真的要所以我們要留住這些人才不能靠他的熱情也要讓他有好的工作環境這個建議不錯啦所以這個法律的部分我們或許來可以一起來共同思考一下如果有願望我們這邊也來思考一下因為我覺得我們總是要想一個策略讓人才可以進來是那接下來我想問一下就是說這個我先跳過好了我想問一下因為今天剛好這一個衛福部也在嘛就是因為WHA就是說我們現在你看我們這個醫療團隊"},{"start":488.726,"end":503.924,"text":"我們已經獲頒這一次的這個頒獎典禮裡面在國際的我們獲頒四項大獎也就是說我們的這個人才你看這是11月的事情而已我們這個人才真的是非常的多那當然這個明年就是一樣這個打壓一定還會繼續存在"},{"start":505.265,"end":532.874,"text":"那我覺得我們提早做好準備一定是好事所以有沒有什麼現在目前來講有沒有什麼樣的方案就我們過往一定有一些事情要做吧對不對有沒有什麼額外的然後能夠讓我們明年看能不能再拼一次這個WHA好 謝謝委員崔迅那這個部分當然第一個我們也謝謝外交部長期以來不論是WHA或者是相關的這些國際的活動我們都跟外交部一起努力那謝謝在前線不論是駐館或者是專案的同仁幫我們去做一些溝通協調"},{"start":533.874,"end":557.094,"text":"那當然因為WHA的這些特定的情勢還有包含美國退出WHO所以說當然在跟過去的一些策略我們要重新來思考那這幾年以來我們在WHA的這一些倡議都有很多友邦還有理念相近國家來為我們做倡議我相信這個部分我們也持續在跟外交部一起來請我們的各外館來協助我們跟各國來做他們代表的遊說"},{"start":557.914,"end":578.976,"text":"那另外的話我們這幾年都做雙邊跟多邊的論壇雙邊多邊論壇其實都是建立我們跟各國之間實質的醫藥衛生合作的這個部分那所以明年我們當然希望說在WHA的期間我們這些多邊跟雙邊論壇的合作如果說有進一步的成果會在這邊再跟這些相關的國家或者是團體再做後續的"},{"start":579.717,"end":603.372,"text":"持續的討論那當然這邊台灣的這些醫療量能我們其實因為當然都聚於外面所以我們都會在沒有辦法進到正式的會場可是我們會在會場外面去做一些相關我們的side event包含多邊雙邊那另外的話我們都會主辦我們自己的一些討論像今年度我們是在以AI的部分去做一些分享那來的這些相關的國家還有團體都非常的多"},{"start":604.973,"end":620.266,"text":"那明年我們一樣會去討論我們要用什麼樣的議題來跟著那目前因為WHA明年可能主要是以癌症防治為主先跟委員報告台灣應該是明年我們會來提出我們根除吸肝的這個報告這個是比WHO的進度還要快"},{"start":621.107,"end":642.649,"text":"我們希望當然我們目標上是希望能夠送進WHO但是如果他們不接的話我們至少希望能夠在明年的會場外面至少也凸顯這件事情對 癌症防治還有我們在相關的吸肝等等還有現在國際社會關注的是Mental Health的部分這一塊我們在過去的合作經驗裡面發現世界各國都很喜歡我們的經驗我們會想辦法在Site Event這邊做更多的宣傳"},{"start":643.67,"end":667.598,"text":"世界上更多的國家跟友邦了解我們其實有做的更多他們應該其實可以在WHO裡面跟大家分享合作的案子謝謝市長因為這個友邦的遊說當然很重要他們的發聲很重要然後再接下來就是我們周邊這些NGO的幫忙但最後我們專業的突出是最重要的因為只有這個樣子他們才會有那個立即說好那我們必須要讓台灣進來那再拜託就是彼此合作我們也希望能夠明年能夠還有這個機會"},{"start":668.838,"end":693.992,"text":"謝謝委員我們當然再補充一下就是說其實我們有很多國際的專業團體不論是國際的護理師的學會或者是醫師公會牙醫師公會甚至我們的醫學生的相關的協會他們也都積極的參與這些國際的專業組織這是另外一個在專業立場上面讓各專業組織了解台灣其實應該是我們講的台灣可以幫助跟台灣可以幫助很重要的另外一個途徑謝謝部長 謝謝市長有一些問題我就下次再問謝謝主席 謝謝"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}