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次長請"},{"start":10.474,"end":34.802,"text":"市長好 大家都非常關心這個日本首相高市早苗的這個包含台灣有事說跟安保三文件的修正對區域安全可能產生的一個影響喔那我們現在觀察到的是呢中日衝突喔那想要問一下外交部的看法您覺得它會是一個短期化的一個衝突還是說它會演變成長期化的中日衝突"},{"start":38.786,"end":51.45,"text":"看怎麼定義衝突日本跟中國現在的國家利益不同這個是我們客觀看得出來但衝突不必然代表戰爭對 沒有 我沒有講戰爭我說的是衝突對 就是說有不同的對國家利益不同看法我想在國際關係是非常常見的尤其現在中國對區域產生一個非常具侵略性的各種動作比如說在我們的每年"},{"start":67.048,"end":70.253,"text":"去年派了接近4000架飛機對我們進行騷擾這也不是只有對我們對中國也是一樣再來是快速增加他們的國防能力你剛剛是講錯國家"},{"start":83.142,"end":108.744,"text":"對中國對整個區域的進行騷擾你剛剛講說對日本也是一樣對日本也是一樣沒錯啊對釣魚台中國也是進行很多的軍事騷擾到時候你回去可以重看一下剛剛因為我有聽到主席有講到說這個主持用法應該要精確一點那請您在回答的時候也特別注意一下好不好你懂我意思嗎"},{"start":109.484,"end":131.589,"text":"中國確實對日本進行軍事騷擾嗎對 您剛講的是中國對日本進行軍事騷擾但因為您剛回答的時候您講成了說對中國也進行了軍事騷擾是這樣子的好 請您繼續抱歉所以目前看到的是中國快速增加他的國防軍備也引起世界各國對這樣的一個情形有非常擔憂"},{"start":132.369,"end":150.311,"text":"是那個因為我剛剛問的是說這樣子目前中日的衝突我們評估他是會長期持續化還是說他是會短期之內那有多解決那想問您喔您剛剛的這個說法是比較偏向說會長期的產生這樣子的一個矛盾是嗎"},{"start":150.851,"end":157.375,"text":"以目前中國在習近平的主政之下確實我看不出這個衝突會有減低的一個趨勢那這個前首相石破茂他提到真正該討論的是避免台灣如何會沒有事就是說要避免台灣有事的情況發生"},{"start":170.123,"end":182.576,"text":"那我想問一下針對前首相時破帽的說法呢外交部除了認同高市早苗首相之外對前首相時破帽的說法外交部也是認同的嗎還是有不同的意見"},{"start":184.273,"end":211.705,"text":"我基本上我覺得石破茂現在已經不是首相了他可以表達他個人的意見他也是一個意見領袖嘛那我想要問一下因為在等於說在日本政壇裡面那有像高市早苗首相這樣子的說法那當然前首相他的說法是說認為應該要討論的是如何避免台灣有事針對這樣子的一個就是發言的取向跟他的整體的這個想法跟邏輯我想知道的是外交部是同時認同雙方"},{"start":213.266,"end":228.336,"text":"還是只認同高市早苗還是說有什麼樣的一個評論或是評估以目前我問更清楚一點就是說該不該要去討論的是如何避免台灣有事"},{"start":229.13,"end":257.609,"text":"如何避免台灣有事也不是要一切都順從中國的要求沒有人剛這樣講石破茂也沒有這樣講我問的是石破茂的言論所以你不能單就這句話我問的是石破茂的說法他說在日本來講除了這個高市早苗講的台灣有事日本有事之外要討論如何來避免台灣有事所以您的言下之意是認為說這是石破茂單方面的說法外交部並不認同 是嗎"},{"start":260.251,"end":273.377,"text":"我想石破茂講的是跟法律無關 我要講的是怎麼樣任何一個首相都有 我想高市早苗主要是要捍衛日本的安全那對一個國家領導人我想這是正常的"},{"start":274.763,"end":288.038,"text":"對 我知道你剛剛支持高市早苗的言論在前面很多的委員在質詢的時候都已經講了嘛對但他們沒有問到的是前首相石破茂的這個看法跟論點外交部是否認同我問的很簡單就是這個事情啊對於石破茂提到"},{"start":294.877,"end":320.41,"text":"就維護那個台海地區安全這點當然是這是對的那至於以什麼樣方法來做因為我們外交部不需要先去評論一個已經不是外交已經不是首相的一個說法我認為原則上精神上是對的那至於要用什麼樣方法來做如果今天前首相安倍晉三他有對台灣做出非常清楚的發言的話我不認為外交部這時候會告訴我說因為他是前首相所以就不予討論了"},{"start":323.852,"end":346.394,"text":"因為他仍然對在日本來說是有影響力的重要人物所以我只是想要詢問就是說呢當日本你不要講石破茂好了在日本裡面有一些人他認為除了高市早苗的說法之外也應該要討論如何避免台灣有事這樣子的說法外交部繞了這麼多圈圈所以是並不是這麼認同"},{"start":348.147,"end":358.459,"text":"報告委員對於台灣安全有說法的意見領袖會非常多我們外交部其實沒有必要對於每一個都做出回答的提問你這樣講我就清楚了就是不想要回應石破茂那再來我要講的是說我們也需要更多的盟友支持台灣"},{"start":368.229,"end":389.864,"text":"那前一次的質詢在林佳龍部長來的時候我才詢問過CPTPP的事情那當時就講到說在12月的時候其實11月現在就已經就已經開始了那當時這個我們林佳龍部長他也很有信心的提到我們有在跟這些國家他說有跟一個國家來做討論"},{"start":391.385,"end":418.466,"text":"那這個呢CPTPP的部長級的會議後的這個報告宣布了烏拉圭阿拉伯聯合大公國菲律賓跟印尼符合奧克蘭原則並且先啟動了烏拉圭的入會程序那其他的三國也就是阿拉伯聯合大公國菲律賓跟印尼會視情況於明年進行過程當中完全沒有提到台灣我想問一下外交部怎麼看這件事情"},{"start":421.439,"end":429.605,"text":"我們確實是已經符合奧克蘭三原則這是事實對啊 不要提到我們的這次是在澳洲主辦嘛根本不給人報告外交的場合不是說符合什麼就一定會獲得什麼"},{"start":438.032,"end":443.538,"text":"就像我們中華民國我們中華民國符合主權獨立國家但也不是每一個國家都承認我們我們符合奧克蘭三原則我們確實遇到阻礙這個阻礙就是來自於中國所以這一次CPTPP我們認為沒有公正審查我國的申請案是因為你們認為在這一次的"},{"start":462.496,"end":476.929,"text":"CPTPP的討論當中也一樣受到了中國大陸他們的打壓所以在澳洲這一次的CPTPP的部長會議才沒有讓台灣能夠成立入會小組是這個意思嗎"},{"start":479.918,"end":490.45,"text":"確實我想這是我們可以很清楚的去理解到我們之所以沒辦法受到公平對待絕對是中國的這一次也是是嗎在澳洲在澳洲舉辦的這一次也是嗎應該是我請那個我們那個司長又回答一下"},{"start":499.96,"end":502.422,"text":"請問在會議當中有哪一些國家有幫我們提案說要把成立台灣入會小組放進這個討論議程裡面"},{"start":523.241,"end":539.286,"text":"跟委員報告這個是會員國之間他們內部的審查如果沒有在內部我們是不會了解情節所以我們不清楚有哪一些國家願意支持我們哪一些國家你認為是中共介入所以說跟著中共一起來反對我們是這樣嗎"},{"start":540.117,"end":564.664,"text":"沒有 我可以很清楚知道日本會支持我們英國會支持我們那他們有提出 你們有所了解說他們有在CPTPP的這個會議裡面提出要把台灣列入入會小組放進議程裡嗎我們沒有參與討論所以我們對內部他們如果討論那你們有向日本了解以及建議或者是希望拜託他們做這樣的請求而對方表達了同意嗎"},{"start":565.612,"end":569.505,"text":"我們確實有跟日本提出這樣的請求對方有表達同意嗎"},{"start":570.744,"end":597.17,"text":"日本有明確表達是會對我們繼續表達支持但是日本也是一票英國也是一票啊當然啊我是說他們在會議當中有提出要把台灣入會小組放進討論議程這件事情是日本有告訴台灣說他們有做這樣子的舉措還是只是說我們跟他提出建議的時候他們會說好我們會來幫忙就是兩件不同的事情一個是說態度上面的友好一個是實際上面"},{"start":598.73,"end":603.631,"text":"告訴我們我們已經在CPTPP的議程裡面提出建議要把台灣入會小組放入議程不是表決一票喔是放入議程喔您要聽清楚我的問題我知道在許多場合日本確實會替我們捍衛但我剛才提到說這個並不引然代表整個大會就會通過我沒有問通過的問題因為沒有通過這已經是事實了我詢問的是說您剛講的國家"},{"start":627.978,"end":644.237,"text":"他們到底有沒有如實的就像我們的請求在CPTPP的這個會議裡面不是說投票通過是說把台灣成立入會小組這件事情放入議程討論因為我時間不夠有關係是不是可以簡短回答就好"},{"start":644.877,"end":665.44,"text":"報告委員我認為應該是有因為我前陣子有去日本有帶一個船去日本我們有討論過一些就這邊救貨交換知事方給我們回答說他們會在各項場合各項場合有包含這個CPTPP他們給我回答是有嘛當然不在現場我沒辦法跟你講有是沒有但是他們跟我講是有"},{"start":666.181,"end":692.216,"text":"那我希望就是說呢關於CPTPP這件事情我們持續來努力一定會 謝謝委員既然 既然今天日本提出了包含高市早苗等提出了對台灣要有所支持那我們希望是能夠有實際的表現而這些表現我們不能只因為說他們是在內部會議所以我們就不知情那我們也應該要透過我們跟日方的管道了解是否確實有在會議當中協助我們來提案"},{"start":694.677,"end":695.379,"text":"而不是說他簡單跟我們這樣談話表達口頭上的支持我們希望能夠看到更實質的表現謝謝"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}