{"error":false,"id":["166246"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":166246,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/166246","日期":"2025-12-08","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"委員會-11-4-23-10","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第4會期交通委員會第10次全體委員會議","屆":11,"會期":4,"會次":10,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"委員會","委員會代碼":[23],"委員會代碼:str":["交通委員會"],"標題":"第11屆第4會期交通委員會第10次全體委員會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2025-12-08T13:10:14+08:00","結束時間":"2025-12-08T13:20:16+08:00","影片長度":"00:10:02","支援功能":["ai-transcript"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/e238918248e277b3dbe3fed079b56d96b5dd3a7969bdec96e205c0f991a2210e440e68855abdbf165ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"葉元之","委員發言時間":"13:10:14 - 13:20:16","會議時間":"2025-12-08T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第4會期交通委員會第10次全體委員會議（事由：審查一、委員羅智強等55人、二、台灣民眾黨黨團及三、委員翁曉玲等24人分別擬具「衛星廣播電視法部分條文修正草案」案、四、委員陳雪生等23人及五、委員傅崐萁等24人分別擬具「衛星廣播電視法第五條條文修正草案」案、六、委員葉元之等22人擬具「衛星廣播電視法第十一條條文修正草案」案、七、委員翁曉玲等16人擬具「衛星廣播電視法刪除第五十條條文草案」案、八、委員許智傑等27人及九、委員洪孟楷等22人分別擬具「衛星廣播電視法第六十四條條文修正草案」案。\n【本次會議僅進行詢答】\n【12月8日及10日二天一次會】）","transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":3.8109687500000002,"end":6.51096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":11.10096875,"end":11.77596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":12.214718750000003,"end":18.20534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":18.610343750000002,"end":22.96409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":19.47096875,"end":20.297843750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":21.44534375,"end":23.01471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":23.01471875,"end":23.031593750000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":23.14971875,"end":25.17471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":26.17034375,"end":28.262843750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":28.54971875,"end":29.629718750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":30.11909375,"end":30.50721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":30.945968750000002,"end":31.671593750000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":31.85721875,"end":36.143468750000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":36.143468750000004,"end":37.20659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":36.85221875,"end":40.42971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":40.61534375,"end":40.63221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":40.63221875,"end":40.665968750000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":40.665968750000005,"end":40.986593750000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":40.85159375,"end":43.737218750000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":43.737218750000004,"end":46.72409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":44.024093750000006,"end":44.040968750000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":44.09159375,"end":44.81721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":46.251593750000005,"end":50.453468750000006},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":50.470343750000005,"end":50.52096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":50.52096875,"end":51.55034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":51.010343750000004,"end":62.41784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":62.721593750000004,"end":71.53034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":67.69971875,"end":67.78409375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":71.19284375000001,"end":79.12409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":72.98159375,"end":73.26846875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":77.28471875000001,"end":81.43596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":81.79034375,"end":104.26784375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":104.65596875,"end":119.87721875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":120.21471875,"end":123.40409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":123.79221875,"end":139.26659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":139.95846875,"end":144.81846875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":145.40909375,"end":146.97846875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":147.24846875,"end":148.83471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":149.18909375,"end":165.55784375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":165.55784375000002,"end":165.67596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":165.67596875,"end":166.23284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":165.70971875,"end":175.04159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":167.29596875000001,"end":168.78096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":172.67909375000002,"end":181.57221875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":176.56034375000002,"end":177.40409375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":180.49221875,"end":184.18784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":184.39034375,"end":195.03846875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":195.25784375,"end":195.27471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":195.27471875,"end":195.51096875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":195.51096875000002,"end":204.37034375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":195.54471875000002,"end":195.78096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":203.18909375,"end":206.00721875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":205.75409375,"end":214.10721875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":209.01096875000002,"end":209.48346875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":211.37346875,"end":211.55909375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":214.10721875000002,"end":228.88971875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":214.90034375000002,"end":215.18721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":225.48096875000002,"end":226.94909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":228.16409375,"end":231.92721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":231.50534375,"end":238.06971875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":233.14221875,"end":233.54721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":238.30596875,"end":239.40284375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":239.87534375,"end":249.34221875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":248.54909375000003,"end":267.63471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":268.10721875,"end":312.06659375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":312.06659375000004,"end":313.16346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":312.47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麻煩請代理主委 謝謝陳代理主委請葉委員午安代理主委 先跟你確定一下像您的第一任的NCC主委的委員任期是到什麼時候第一任的就是這一任95年的第一任是到97年你自己啦我的任期到明年7月底"},{"start":26.195,"end":49.367,"text":"到明年七月底所以大概剩七個多月那這個我不知道有沒有開始在徵詢你留任的意願有沒有目前沒有 還沒有現在NCC還缺四個委員那除了你之外另外兩個委員任期到什麼時候都一樣 這一批都是到七月底那你有感覺到行政院很重視NCC這個單位嗎"},{"start":51.468,"end":71.001,"text":"現在有四個委員到現在雖然之前有提但是都之前提來也不溝通然後審完之後也沒有後續好像也不認為這個NCC有運作沒運作有什麼差別你們現在你們的任期到明年7月又要結束了到時候會不會NCC都沒有委員直接組密代理組委"},{"start":71.641,"end":98.28,"text":"沒有 照我們組織法規定委員會前幾個月要提名在組織法是規定我跟你講組織法有規定但是現在行政院沒有在理組織法的像那個公共電視按照公事法的規定應該是在去年11月就要提董事名單過來結果董事都已經延任了好幾個月了都沒看到名單所以現在行政院沒有在按照法律在辦事的所以不用扯那個組織法出來"},{"start":99.982,"end":119.204,"text":"那我想跟請教一下最近大家在關心小紅書被禁這件事情那因為行政院他用的是打詐當理由但NCC照道理來講打詐跟NCC很有關係而且小紅書我怎麼看都應該算是NCC的業務因為NCC的你們的組織法裡面就是規定"},{"start":120.345,"end":146.753,"text":"你是網際網路傳播政策制定法令訂定的相關單位嗎所以有關於網際網路的傳播的政策跟網際網路有關的應該都是NCC要扮演很關鍵角色而且是可以影響的那我想問一下小紅書這樣子被封一年站在網際網路主管機關的NCC的看法是什麼"},{"start":147.318,"end":165.009,"text":"好是謝謝委員跟委員報告我們的組織法規定NCC是網際網路傳播政策的訂定等等那個就是源頭端某種程度那以我某種程度就是說屬於源頭端的政策的訂定但是還要搭配一個"},{"start":165.809,"end":194.59,"text":"還要搭配好 那沒關係因為時間關係我想請教一下他們現在在訂這個政策之前有選過你們嗎有去開會嗎有去開會那你們的意見是什麼小公司這一塊你們的意見是什麼它是APP因為這不是NCC主政所以沒有 這網際它是屬於網際網路的一個很重要的平台對現在有300萬的台灣300萬的用戶但是所以它是很廣大的但是因為我覺得這很奇怪是NCC常常都沒有數位匯流的概念"},{"start":195.59,"end":206.338,"text":"以前網路歸網路電視歸電視然後大家金稅不犯河水但是在數位匯流之後其實很多東西都變同一件事情所以你們針對這個網際網路尤其是小紅書這麼大的平台你認為該進就可以直接進嗎"},{"start":214.744,"end":238.86,"text":"網際網路平台太陽很多種屬於OTTV視訊部分是NCC管其他屬於那個商業經濟或廣告的是數位部在主管那請教一下小紅書是屬於那一塊不屬於這個所以你們那時候意見說跟你們無關所以你們沒有不是 我們有一起共同開會有參與可能後續的一些中介投入的處理我們會有協力的部分怎麼樣協力"},{"start":240.229,"end":267.011,"text":"協力就像當初我們處理愛奇藝那種情況一樣就他在台灣廣告那他在電信業者有設CDN這一部分的處理就是那主委跟請教一下因為內政部他把小紅書關掉是引用了詐欺犯罪防害防治條例第十二條嘛他是說為了要處理詐欺犯罪緊急案件為了要及時防治民眾去接觸到那些詐欺的網站所以可以把它可以用這一條"},{"start":268.408,"end":297.231,"text":"來把它可能關閉吧那它有一個前提學者說有前提是第一個它必須要緊急狀態第二個它是要詐欺網站但是小紅書我怎麼看它都不是詐欺網站它是一個平台有的人或許可能會在小紅書上面被騙但是也有很多人是在小紅書上面看到了原來有人是這樣詐騙他得到很多防制詐騙的資訊甚至於他發現自己在被詐騙當中所以它平台是中立的只是有人利用這個平台在做壞事"},{"start":297.851,"end":316.262,"text":"這就好比說有人在馬路上面可能騙人在馬路上騙人結果我們現在政府的做法是我把馬路整個封了一年不讓人家走這已經完全高度的侵害到人民的自由了使用資訊的自由所以這個在事法性上我覺得有很大的一個問號"},{"start":317.603,"end":338.848,"text":"各位報告同樣的新聞它投射在不同部會主管的法規命令裡頭那像這個涉炸部分我們當然是尊重內政部他們的一些看法沒有 我知道你今天不會講什麼啦我只是覺得作為一個網際網路的主管機關你要保障那個網路的多元啦有的時候如果說其他機關它"},{"start":340.208,"end":357.018,"text":"他用什麼理由當然我是不太相信是詐騙啦因為有的平台詐騙裡面更多啦我是不太相信啦但是站在網路多元這個角度其實要幫忙講話啦但其他的平台他是有法律代表要聯絡什麼處理X就沒有啊X有嗎"},{"start":358.619,"end":372.4,"text":"那但是他相對他目前情況跟X炸雞的一大堆好不好你們是看人的啦然後剛剛講到中天因為我看到前一個委員在講說中天是因為投訴太多變成是一個關台理由"},{"start":373.061,"end":395.248,"text":"那所以現在我們只要討厭一家電視台發動所有的人去投訴他就可以讓他被關台喔哇賽原來NCC關台是這麼的粗糙喔不是 這個只是這是太誇張了剛剛講到說內控不行上一次在那個教育文化委員會祖密來嘛我舉了一大堆有一個綠媒在罷免期間一大堆假消息祖密你還記得吧"},{"start":395.968,"end":420.695,"text":"那這種沒有 完全沒有內控的綠媒怎麼沒看到你們要去關台沒有 這程序都會經過我們所以你們都看人的嘛然後再者喔再來剛剛那個委員 民進黨委員提到的說那個農民口誤啦兩千萬口誤成噸啦其實兩千萬斤啦主持人馬上就糾正了你可以問謝榮介委員啦現場就糾正哇賽 人家口誤就要被罰耶"},{"start":421.815,"end":438.602,"text":"口誤旁邊的委員主持人馬上糾正結果你們也要去開罰他不舉這個例子我還沒想到舉了這個例子就讓你感覺先射箭再劃靶嘛因為要關中天所以一堆人跑去檢舉他檢舉他成為關台理由"},{"start":439.102,"end":467.916,"text":"因為要關中天所以只是農民口誤主持人跟謝榮介馬上糾正然後也要被裁罰然後內控司令我看到一堆罷免期間你去看啊一堆的那種綠媒啊造謠造到那個超級誇張的啊我去教育文化委員會去考察還可以造謠說什麼這個一大堆我們明明有通知地方官員他還說地方官員沒來這種我都不想再講了啦然後你們可以都沒看到都沒看到"},{"start":468.476,"end":490.211,"text":"只是嚴厲只有中天因為他批評政府最用力這一種東西我跟你講啦這就是為什麼大家衛廣法今天會修正案嘛正常來講如果我們國家尊重新聞自由大家衛廣法這個文化民主文化願意尊重的話法律都是在在後面啦大家只要尊重就好現在是沒有想到政府會這樣搞啦"},{"start":491.131,"end":499.395,"text":"那我現在我提的案子我也沒有看到你們在你們的那個裡面有回應啊我的案子就是說現在電視像我家電視"},{"start":501.825,"end":528.021,"text":"往右邊切就是網路電視往左邊切是有線電視對我來講網路電視跟衛星電視是一樣的東西啊都是透過電視看啊那網路上我看網路電視我看賴清德假設我看賴清德總統的youtube好了他都在圈圈他自己在罵國民黨舉例啦就譬如說講他政績什麼之類的也可以啊那我看到轉過來看到那個電視也可以啊"},{"start":529.5,"end":548.607,"text":"YouTube什麼不用換照只有電視也要換照這已經很過時了以前為什麼要換照是因為以前頻道稀有所以必須要有一個退場機制你做不好換人來做現在是大家都有機會可以做那就是市場來決定嘛你東西真的很爛就沒人看了嘛你如果違法有相關的法律來規範嘛"},{"start":550.327,"end":570.921,"text":"所以你指你現在在數位匯流時代保留一個關台的手段其實第一個沒有必要第二個你就是侵害到新聞自由啦因為我今天這個不同平台它目前的價值其實是不是達到可以一視同仁來看待其實這個都是在持續改變的過程你覺得賴總統的頻道沒有電視台有價值是不是"},{"start":573.923,"end":598.999,"text":"不是 我講平台市場不是啦 這個有沒有價值是有沒有價值是閱聽人來決定不是NCC來決定數位匯流時代有沒有價值有越點大家做眼球爭奪戰不是你來定義誰有價值誰沒有價值是由閱聽人來決定基本上你越鬆現在的趨勢就是越鬆綁越好更何況我們的NCC還曾經做過新聞自由的快指手所以我覺得衛王法通過是很有必要的謝謝謝謝偉"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}