{"error":false,"id":["166285"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":166285,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/166285","日期":"2025-12-10","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"委員會-11-4-26-15","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第4會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第15次全體委員會議","屆":11,"會期":4,"會次":15,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"委員會","委員會代碼":[26],"委員會代碼:str":["社會福利及衛生環境委員會"],"標題":"第11屆第4會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第15次全體委員會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2025-12-10T10:14:47+08:00","結束時間":"2025-12-10T10:25:40+08:00","影片長度":"00:10:53","支援功能":["ai-transcript"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/a128e1119a2c25c0b5d47ed45b1ef2c5ff56a78bd28eb12244a569ea12001d971bd147f165fa27cb5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"蘇清泉","委員發言時間":"10:14:47 - 10:25:40","會議時間":"2025-12-10T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第4會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第15次全體委員會議（事由：邀請衛生福利部部長、勞動部及教育部就「身心障礙者特教融合、就業服務及自立生活現況」進行專題報告，並備質詢。\n(討論事項)\n一、繼續審查\n(一) 委員范雲等17人、委員何欣純等17人、委員羅廷瑋等16人、委員廖偉翔等19人、委員陳菁徽等16人、委員羅美玲等16人及委員劉建國等17人分別擬具「身心障礙者權益保障法部分條文修正草案」案。\n(二) 委員郭昱晴等19人擬具「身心障礙者權益保障法第十六條條文修正草案」案。\n(三) 委員陳冠廷等16人擬具「身心障礙者權益保障法第三十八條條文修正草案」案。\n(四) 委員陳冠廷等20人擬具「身心障礙者權益保障法第二條、第五十三條及第九十九條條文修正草案」案。\n(五) 委員徐富癸等18人擬具「身心障礙者權益保障法第十條條文修正草案」案。\n(六) 委員黃捷等17人擬具「身心障礙者權益保障法第七十一條條文修正草案」案。\n(七) 委員王鴻薇等20人擬具「身心障礙者權益保障法增訂第四十條之一條文草案」案。\n(八) 委員柯志恩等18人擬具「身心障礙者權益保障法增訂第四十條之一條文草案」案。\n(九) 委員柯志恩等17人擬具「身心障礙者權益保障法第六十條之一條文修正草案」案。\n(十) 委員馬文君等19人擬具「身心障礙者權益保障法第三十條之一、第五十條及第五十二條條文修正草案」案。\n(十一) 委員廖偉翔等21人擬具「身心障礙者權益保障法增訂第五十條之一條文草案」案。\n(十二) 委員林楚茵等20人擬具「身心障礙者權益保障法第十條條文修正草案」案。\n(十三) 委員洪孟楷等18人擬具「身心障礙者權益保障法增訂第四十條之一條文草案」案。\n(十四) 委員陳俊宇等18人擬具「身心障礙者權益保障法第七十一條條文修正草案」案。\n(十五) 委員林楚茵等17人擬具「身心障礙者權益保障法第七十一條條文修正草案」案。\n(十六) 委員劉建國等17人擬具「身心障礙者權益保障法第七十一條條文修正草案」案。\n(十七) 委員邱若華等17人擬具「身心障礙者權益保障法第七十一條條文修正草案」案。\n二、審查\n(一) 委員林月琴等18人擬具「身心障礙者權益保障法部分條文修正草案」案。\n(二) 委員伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe等18人擬具「身心障礙者權益保障法部分條文修正草案」案。\n(三) 委員王育敏等17人擬具「身心障礙者權益保障法部分條文修正草案」案。\n(四) 台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「身心障礙者權益保障法部分條文修正草案」案。\n【第二(四)案，如經復議，則不予審查】\n【專題報告及討論事項，綜合詢答】）","transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":0.03096875,"end":0.73971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":5.6334687500000005,"end":7.72596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":8.907218750000002,"end":10.544093750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":10.864718750000002,"end":19.28534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":12.332843750000002,"end":13.379093750000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":15.52221875,"end":17.09159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":17.918468750000002,"end":18.79596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":21.17534375,"end":25.44471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":26.777843750000002,"end":35.43471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":35.99159375,"end":36.88596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":37.20659375,"end":41.45909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":42.74159375,"end":72.47534375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":73.36971875,"end":81.40221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":81.90846875000001,"end":85.53659375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":86.02596875,"end":89.13096875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":89.78909375,"end":90.32909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":90.76784375000001,"end":97.87221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":98.41221875000001,"end":99.42471875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":100.11659375,"end":106.51221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":107.37284375,"end":111.59159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":112.65471875,"end":123.87659375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":124.77096875000001,"end":125.09159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":125.95221875000001,"end":126.86346875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":129.27659375000002,"end":130.99784375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":131.50409375,"end":140.98784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":142.00034375,"end":165.20346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":165.65909375,"end":170.02971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":170.02971875,"end":170.38409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":170.65409375000002,"end":182.66909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":183.36096875,"end":184.87971875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":185.01471875000001,"end":214.02284375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":213.36471875,"end":219.11909375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":215.57534375,"end":216.58784375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":219.10221875000002,"end":223.37159375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":223.54034375,"end":224.51909375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":224.14784375000002,"end":225.53159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":226.45971875,"end":227.69159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":227.69159375,"end":235.16721875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":235.30221875,"end":238.59284375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":236.77034375000002,"end":237.32721875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":239.25096875000003,"end":242.77784375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":242.62596875000003,"end":244.19534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":244.46534375000002,"end":254.43846875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":256.04159375,"end":258.15096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":260.22659375,"end":261.67784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":263.16284375000004,"end":263.26409375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":264.31034375,"end":277.59096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":278.02971875000003,"end":279.46409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":279.64971875000003,"end":280.29096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":280.29096875,"end":282.06284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":282.90659375,"end":289.69034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":290.17971875,"end":291.88409375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":291.83346875,"end":300.16971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":300.92909375,"end":301.36784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":301.72221875,"end":307.22346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":308.21909375,"end":317.17971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":317.38221875,"end":320.36909375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":321.12846875,"end":322.41096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":323.01846875,"end":330.57846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":331.25346875,"end":333.09284375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":333.49784375,"end":336.16409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":336.75471875,"end":340.66971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":341.10846875000004,"end":341.51346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":342.72846875000005,"end":364.02471875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":359.28284375000004,"end":359.63721875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":364.02471875000003,"end":376.63034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":377.64284375,"end":381.38909375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":381.60846875000004,"end":385.87784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":385.97909375,"end":392.25659375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":392.62784375,"end":394.78784375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":395.93534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主席英明請時部長還有我們勞動力發展署副署長副署長 副署長 副署長副署長 副署長副署長 我今天問你三個問題我講話很清楚第一個"},{"start":26.892,"end":41.193,"text":"我們一百二十幾萬個身心障礙者而且人數好像有在增加他們的權益真的是非常重要他們也蠻辛苦的所以我等一下會講說我自己"},{"start":42.979,"end":72.282,"text":"做倫理在馬路上示給大家看那第一個就是我們勞動部7月1號公布一個身心障礙者職場合理調整行政指導不知道在寫什麼那7月1號到現在我們知道身心障礙者在職場上他的空間 他的尊嚴他的軟硬體要調整讓他比較鬆軟讓他不受歧視的感覺這個都非常重要"},{"start":73.423,"end":84.952,"text":"那我剛剛聽王毅民講我們國營事業台鐵啦台電都這樣啦看你不可以就連試用器都要衝掉我覺得我們國營事業自己本身都不說話"},{"start":86.112,"end":108.029,"text":"自己本身都不去配合那我要跟伯丁問的就是說你現在這裡的業者尤其是傳統業者這些中小企業的僱主他非常配合然後來禁用這些身心障礙者我覺得他們很偉大結果他們在街上街上吃的我們伯丁你們這裡有在"},{"start":113.071,"end":140.251,"text":"機器 還是幫人輔導 還是幫人贊助一些費用還是支援一些費用 不只是要求行政指導 行政指導要做什麼那不是你的事 還是勞動力發展時的事我想這個是在生權法下我們希望在身障者的權益的保障能夠更落實才有這個"},{"start":143.207,"end":169.199,"text":"適材適用啦所以這個合理調整的概念大概是這樣考慮到身上者他的這個條件那麼安排合適的工作所以這個合理調整大概有些這樣的精神在那只是說透過這個勞動部的這個行政指導可以讓所有的業者僱主更清楚那麼所謂的合理調整的概念是什麼那怎麼樣來落實"},{"start":170.74,"end":199.236,"text":"你衛福部或是勞動力發展署或是社家署你們自己有什麼配套來鼓勵這裡的業者你叫他改黨改賽你不給他贊助什麼你講你講 來報告委員就是在協助中小企業對這一些障礙者做合理調整我們有一個植物再設計的補助那每一個勞工一年可以補助十萬塊那這裡面就會有包含比如說他的"},{"start":199.756,"end":227.292,"text":"就業輔具等等或者雇主為勞工做的一些環境的改善那另外也有像是手語翻譯聽打聽力協助職場人力協助等等都有這樣子協助他做你說一個人一個人頭10萬塊那10萬塊是給雇主去配合的措施勞工也可以自行申請那我們也有一個申請的網站所以這個錢是兩個人都可以申請"},{"start":229.393,"end":254.054,"text":"僱主申請幫勞工申請算人頭的那勞工可以申請他自己需要的那這個錢從哪裡來 是救安基金是不是每個人都救安基金 不過救安基金有什麼他可以促進就業那這些身障者他的才30%達到基本工資這是真的嗎 其他都under基本工資有這回事嗎"},{"start":256.089,"end":276.364,"text":"他們的收入都變 都很少31.2%報告委員如果依照我們最新的勞動狀況生長的勞動狀況調查目前他的平均薪資是最新的113年5月的統計是3732萬多"},{"start":282.952,"end":307.148,"text":"那怎麼會有統計說都在基本工資下面有達到基本工資的才31%這是你們的data嗎我剛剛報告的是113年去年我們做的全國生長者的勞動狀況調查的平均薪資好 那我問第二個問題就是PA就是Personal Assistance"},{"start":308.257,"end":317.666,"text":"部長 這PA是 台灣有很多人第二 這PA是在家 幫他做assistant或是說他去職場 這個PA怎麼拿去"},{"start":321.535,"end":341.184,"text":"哇 這樣還得了這個120萬個生長業者如果有60萬人去上班那我們到底是多少批的剛才有人說一天賺到一千千這個是取高合寡還是利益良善但是做不到 不對"},{"start":342.942,"end":360.268,"text":"當然這個做個人助理的部分他不只是只有生活啦還有包含他的那些這個職場也有啦那所以目前投入的人力不多啦還沒有超過一千人"},{"start":361.769,"end":379.709,"text":"所以這個人數上確實是這是聯合國什麼CRPD要求的嘛這是衛福部在qualify這個PA還是勞動部在qualify個人助理是我們在認證的"},{"start":381.693,"end":399.042,"text":"所以是你們招聘 然後上課 然後認證對 認證啦 主要是上課 開課 然後訓練然後取得資格這樣所以這個人基本條件是要什麼他的財富要怎麼 要送點錢還是有薪水"},{"start":400.109,"end":421.51,"text":"跟委員報告 事實上在個人助理的部分目前其實在我們人員辦法裡頭有規定他的一個資格是高中以上畢業然後受訓25小時就可以那這25小時的內容包括了自立生活的精神還有如何協助支持等等所以這些是縣市政府在管理然後錢啊 錢怎麼算"},{"start":424.624,"end":435.168,"text":"個人助理的費用是我們中央補助一部分多數是在地方政府編列的預算所以這裡簽的 管理不是幾十萬這樣"},{"start":438.632,"end":445.897,"text":"分佈上我們再統計一下各縣市的資料所以我要跟主席報告我們這樣講到整大堆我看基本上人手沒夠 訓練也沒夠你說一個高中畢業最少25小時可以做"},{"start":457.965,"end":472.737,"text":"這個Personal System做PA 他的領域是有救護我們造服務員是這樣 訓練到要外遊去 課到要試醫 做造服務員這到底領域有救護 台服有救護 算點錢還是算這都要好好來研究一下"},{"start":477.921,"end":493.086,"text":"跟各位說這個也就是目前碰到的困境我們現在有長照的服務居家服務長照的居家服務又有個人助理這一塊因為這兩邊提供服務的人的條件"},{"start":493.926,"end":509.525,"text":"不相當所以就才會有這個身上者提出說為什麼他已經有個人助理那他個人助理不能幫他做這個事情還要再另外透過居家服務譬如說他有這個我們居家服務有沐浴服務那這個又"},{"start":511.106,"end":534.011,"text":"這個長照人員才能做那個人助理他本身如果不具有長照人員資格他就不能做這行所以他就會認為說服務的切割啦但是這個如果通通要包進來那確實是這個訓練的部分就要你一個身心障礙者他也要請長照的人還要請個人助理這樣可以嗎一個人可以兩選"},{"start":536.571,"end":557.303,"text":"我們目前是沒有排斥啦現在這個沒有互斥性啦只是說這個我上個禮拜跟這些身障團體溝通他們是認為說我還要再去找別人啦說我已經有一個個人助理了但是呢當我遇到某些服務的時候我還要再去找長照人員進來"},{"start":559.284,"end":568.409,"text":"我覺得這個真的知識體大 要整合啦要整合啦 齁 另外想問的要大家報告齁我們身心障礙者 你說我20秒就對了 主席我都讓你說20秒"},{"start":573.752,"end":596.959,"text":"來 我們的身心障礙者我們感同身受 都是我們的寶貝所以他們的所有權益我們一定要不管是立法會委員 不管是各縣市的首長像我們主席要選選管定的人 都要跟他們拼命所以我自己在東港 我自己借輪椅借輪椅到那個花橋池 漁市場那裡 我給他們三封索"},{"start":601.32,"end":623.095,"text":"我知道金本德連人情步道的倫理要拆掉就拆掉了所以各縣市的都很差勁的事實都不足六都可能還好所以大家不管你立委不管你做什麼我覺得這個案很重要再來大家要及時廣義所以剛剛講的點出來的問題都要融合"},{"start":637.951,"end":651.914,"text":"我們是主管機關但是還是會回到像交通的還是會回到地方政府或者是交通主管機關我們一起來努力這樣好 謝謝所以蘇朝偉英明提出來都是重點"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}