{"error":false,"id":["166357"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":166357,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/166357","日期":"2025-12-11","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"委員會-11-4-22-10","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第4會期教育及文化委員會第10次全體委員會議","屆":11,"會期":4,"會次":10,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"委員會","委員會代碼":[22],"委員會代碼:str":["教育及文化委員會"],"標題":"第11屆第4會期教育及文化委員會第10次全體委員會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2025-12-11T10:42:16+08:00","結束時間":"2025-12-11T10:53:38+08:00","影片長度":"00:11:22","支援功能":["ai-transcript"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/83ea75f4c686a7b15ff650b8daaf0dcfb5fe7457644078f046f29551fe3ea0e55195ddf4f073bf875ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"林宜瑾","委員發言時間":"10:42:16 - 10:53:38","會議時間":"2025-12-11T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第4會期教育及文化委員會第10次全體委員會議（事由：邀請核能安全委員會主任委員陳明真列席報告業務概況，並備質詢。\n【12月10日及11日兩天一次會】）","transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":4.30034375,"end":6.00471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":6.66284375,"end":7.793468750000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":13.36221875,"end":14.560343750000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":15.336593750000002,"end":15.960968750000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":16.652843750000002,"end":47.719718750000006},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":47.820968750000006,"end":55.009718750000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":55.14471875,"end":70.09596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":55.212218750000005,"end":55.68471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":70.31534375000001,"end":105.55034375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":106.51221875,"end":109.26284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":109.83659375,"end":115.79346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":115.97909375,"end":126.67784375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":127.60596875,"end":136.14471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":136.66784375,"end":147.65346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":148.00784375,"end":152.66534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":153.57659375,"end":169.91159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":170.38409375,"end":176.67846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":176.77971875,"end":188.82846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":189.92534375000002,"end":198.43034375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":196.55721875,"end":197.45159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":198.78471875000002,"end":204.97784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":204.82596875000002,"end":207.99846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":207.96471875,"end":208.30221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":208.30221875,"end":209.48346875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":210.64784375000002,"end":211.57596875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":212.35221875000002,"end":238.39034375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":238.66034375,"end":240.31409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":240.97221875000002,"end":245.66346875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":246.06846875000002,"end":262.11659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":262.43721875,"end":269.32221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":269.96346875,"end":275.43096875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":276.17346875000004,"end":295.19159375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":296.13659375000003,"end":303.79784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":304.28721875,"end":305.55284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":305.99159375,"end":309.60284375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":310.12596875,"end":311.20596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":311.64471875000004,"end":316.72409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":317.36534375,"end":321.46596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":321.97221875,"end":331.47284375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":332.01284375,"end":337.63221875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":338.88096875,"end":344.71971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":345.95159375000003,"end":354.91221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":355.30034375,"end":359.06346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":359.26596875,"end":361.62846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":361.40909375,"end":361.81409375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":362.40471875000003,"end":374.43659375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":368.96909375,"end":369.30659375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":372.83346875,"end":373.30596875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":374.75721875000005,"end":375.70221875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":375.70221875000004,"end":377.84534375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":378.01409375000003,"end":379.76909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":379.76909375,"end":379.97159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":379.80284375,"end":379.95471875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":379.97159375,"end":380.00534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":380.00534375,"end":386.41784375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":386.13096875,"end":386.16471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":386.41784375000003,"end":388.91534375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":388.56096875000003,"end":388.86471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":388.91534375000003,"end":388.96596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":388.96596875,"end":388.98284375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":390.16409375,"end":390.43409375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":390.65346875,"end":401.20034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":401.40284375000005,"end":404.67659375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":404.67659375000005,"end":442.12221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":413.87346875000003,"end":414.43034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":439.97909375,"end":440.40096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":442.20659375,"end":483.97221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":483.97221875,"end":504.77909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":503.44596875,"end":504.22221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":505.04909375000005,"end":514.4990937499999},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":514.7353437500001,"end":545.1440937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":545.46471875,"end":547.42221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":549.6328437500001,"end":550.57784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":550.99971875,"end":552.63659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":553.34534375,"end":570.2709687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":557.9015937500001,"end":558.2053437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":570.0347187500001,"end":572.88659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":572.88659375,"end":591.01034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":590.7234687499999,"end":593.84534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":594.2165937500001,"end":595.51596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":594.87471875,"end":599.2622187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":598.35096875,"end":598.9753437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":599.2622187500001,"end":637.02846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":638.9522187499999,"end":642.25971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":639.8803437500001,"end":639.9140937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":639.9140937500001,"end":640.43721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":642.51284375,"end":665.2434687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":645.61784375,"end":645.9553437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":660.4509687500001,"end":660.8559687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":665.26034375,"end":677.4778437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":671.75721875,"end":672.1284687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":676.83659375,"end":680.17784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":680.7009687500001,"end":682.16909375}],"whisperx":[{"start":4.535,"end":14.413,"text":"謝主席 有請陳主委有請陳主委主委好委員好"},{"start":16.97,"end":44.457,"text":"這個星期一深夜日本親身的外海發生了規模7.6的強震日本也隨即針對鄰近鎮央的核電廠進行戒備跟安全檢查當然所幸一切平安我想任何人都不會想要再陷入311福島核災發生史的恐懼所以不論是核電廠除以與否"},{"start":45.157,"end":69.733,"text":"或者它是否还要再运转天灾来临时针对核电厂的安全管制还是非常重要的议题警察院在今年11月7号有发布一个报告这个报告里面有指出说台湾三座核电厂的耐震能力堪忧台电跟核安会应检讨"},{"start":70.433,"end":96.289,"text":"那經常委員有表示說在地震風險無法預測的情況之下那各廠的運轉超過40年之際喔台電公司應該針對攸關緊急停機設備組件的先期耐震補強作業外還缺乏對於這個各核電廠結構體的耐震及系統老化影響等評估顯有安全的疑慮這個經常委員說的"},{"start":98.67,"end":125.959,"text":"雖然藍白聯手強行通過了核管法的修法把核電廠的運轉期限延長到60年我們從現實面來看無論如何我們都必須務實的去面對核電廠的安全管制的議題尤其監察院剛剛我說的公布了這個調查報告顯而易見不論它是在運轉的狀態或者是核電廠"},{"start":127.677,"end":152.351,"text":"的安全性他其實他特別對耐震度的方面我們都一定要嚴加的來加以這個檢視那特別檢察院這份報告也針對了耐震度來敦請台電跟核安會來檢討評估那可是本席認為除了地震這一件單單地震這件事情以外"},{"start":153.371,"end":166.179,"text":"它所造成的複合式的災害像是地震後會產生一些這個海嘯或者山崩甚至是軍事的威脅這個都應該要納入這個核子這個"},{"start":170.501,"end":184.95,"text":"反應設施運轉執照申請審核的辦法的評估的項目當中那其實民間團體也有提出很多寶貴的意見所以我現在要請教主委那你何安會參採這些民間的寶貴意見的情況如何"},{"start":189.963,"end":210.892,"text":"我們對這些意見非常重視所以內政方面或海嘯或複合型的災害都有相關的規定也都有相關的評估都有把它參採進去這些複合性的災害的安全評估是的"},{"start":212.401,"end":236.81,"text":"好 那同樣啦我們涉及這個核安法官的就是還有這個核子事故緊急應變的策略因為我們可以看到核安會都有辦這個核安演習嘛那本席是要提出一個關鍵的問題是核子事故緊急應變法中有關於這個核子事故緊急應變這個計劃區的這個劃定是不是要檢討的必要"},{"start":241.051,"end":265.727,"text":"因為我們看日本福島核災發生後日本政府就強制核電半徑的20公里的居民要疏散驅離也要求20至30公里的居民要採室內掩蔽或自行疏散如果根據我國核子事故緊急應變計畫區的範圍其實只有8公里"},{"start":270.034,"end":294.514,"text":"那如果萬一發生核子事故的話恐怕我看恐怕是難以充分的應變那再來就是說這個緊急應變法的第13條的第二項有提到他說核子反應器設施經營者應定期提出緊急應變的計劃區內民眾防護措施的分析跟規劃並設置完成必要之場所及設備"},{"start":296.209,"end":320.822,"text":"核一核二它半徑30公里的範圍內其實都框到整個台北市所以數百萬人都是所謂的潛在的影響對象那核三廠它半徑30公里的範圍內也框到了我們人潮熱絡的墾丁鬧區所以本席認為就算核電廠沒有在運轉"},{"start":322.423,"end":344.234,"text":"核廢料 核物料還是放在場子裡面同樣有風險所以主委你認為在現在的交通狀況之下假設我們即便就是依照日本的標準 匡合30公里的範圍內這數百萬人真的可以安全疏散嗎"},{"start":346.618,"end":366.514,"text":"我國的緊急應變區計畫是根據風險分析的科學評估結果這方法與美國等世界國家其他國家是一致的做法台電每三年都需要重新評估過緊急應變區的檢討評估我們經常有滾動式的檢討目前是8公里嘛"},{"start":375.021,"end":386.147,"text":"對 八公里對 可是要檢討的範圍需要擴大嗎因為我們看日本我們覺得目前是緊急應變區是適當的我們經過科學分析以及風險分析這確實是要滾動式檢討"},{"start":390.845,"end":413.562,"text":"那好 那即便你現在的所謂的8公里的這個計劃區裡面你覺得用現在的交通狀況 安全疏散是沒有問題的沒有問題 我請這位署長補充一下跟委員報告一下 針對疏散的部分我們現在都是採超前部署的方式然後也就是在輔助還沒有外事之前先做預防性的疏散"},{"start":413.962,"end":441.907,"text":"因此就是在疏散的時候都會考量以風險來做最優先例如說弱勢族群這個會需要當然最優先是那所以它的這個疏散它是會分階段分流的來進行的這是目前的一個應變的一個規劃那也每年的河岸演習也都有進行演練像今年也就有針對屏東縣就是三公里範圍內的居民都有做這個疏散演練是以及弱勢族群也都有"},{"start":442.527,"end":468.978,"text":"因為我們如果參照這個日本這個福島核災發生那其實它是這個20公里半徑20公里是強制那30公里是要求他們自行所以我的意思是說這個20 30這個是日本政府的規定可是這個因為他們發生這個核災是血淋淋的這個例子在那裡所以我們的8公里是不是也必須要滾動式的檢討"},{"start":470.358,"end":493.564,"text":"這8公里是不是範圍太小一些就是說是不是這個災害我覺得這個其實核安會也要定期檢討不是說它規定8公里那我們就是只用8公里來做安全疏散的這個範圍是不是報告委員這個部分我們也都有滾動的檢討因此我們最新的這個檢討評估台電公司提報的這個報告是今年6月的一個報告"},{"start":494.184,"end":514.055,"text":"那是依照剛剛主委有說的依照我們風險評估跟國際上其他國家一樣的科學的根據來做的評估好 瞭解好 那再來同樣的就是說民間其實也持續向核安會來倡議就是所謂的高放選址的條例的立法"},{"start":514.855,"end":534.329,"text":"那我們當然不能說我們只是討論是否在運轉而始終忽視了這個高階核廢料的處置跟它的法源所以我要再次強調就無論核電廠運轉多久或者它是否重啟運轉用過的高放射性的這些廢棄物它就是產生就是在那邊"},{"start":535.049,"end":547.202,"text":"所以我們必須務實的面對這個問題嘛那高階核廢料它的處置一定是我們的必要任務啦齁那所以請教主委這個高放選址條例 核安會內部還要討論多久"},{"start":551.391,"end":569.056,"text":"跟委員說明高放選條例其實是經濟部他的專案辦公室在研議去年今年4月的時候辦公室成立然後他的工作就是要來執行高放選條例的立法草案目前經濟部還在內部討論中"},{"start":570.777,"end":599.026,"text":"可是你们是共同参与的吗我们其实有给经济部我们的管制专业意见我们今年有邀请经济部来会里面跟他说明了三次我们对一些管制上的可能的技术要求让他们能够来那如果按照你的推估大约什么时候会有比较具体的确实我推估因为他们是专办公室在处理这件事情"},{"start":599.366,"end":624.255,"text":"好 最後再做一個小問題就是我國現行的原子能法它的主體是在1971年修正到現在已經超過50年那它的立法思維可以說是已經很難應對當代的這個核能挑戰尤其是它該這個法的這個終止它是究竟是要管制還是推廣什麼原子能的利用也有待商榷也就是說原子能法"},{"start":625.295,"end":636.682,"text":"應該要通盤檢視那並評估是不是要重修這個法所以我要請教主委說目前原子能法有推出修正草案的這個打算嗎"},{"start":640.006,"end":660.987,"text":"原子能法跟委員報告原子能法確實很長的時間沒有修改那我們也陸續的在進行草案的提出還有跟專家學者的討論因為現在相關的管制法規都有個別的法律在譬如核子擺機設置管制法輻射防護法"},{"start":662.088,"end":682.048,"text":"这些管制法规都有在使用目前原子能法在执行上并没有至暗难行但是因为它已经很久没有修了这部分我们会继续努力的把它修了让它与时俱进以上报告好 谢谢好 谢谢主委谢谢主席好 谢谢林怡景委"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}