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委員好我們在12月初的時候看到一個新聞就是札幌的核電廠它的防護牆被"},{"start":49.599,"end":68.904,"text":"就破口了那整個烏克蘭的715億的核災設施有破口出現的時候那國際原子能總署就警告輻射外洩恐失控那這邊是一個叫防護牆那針對這個議題最重要的是核安衛視掌管核子核電廠的安全那我們大家就想問的是說那我們的"},{"start":70.845,"end":86.793,"text":"核電廠有沒有這樣子的一個防護牆然後還有就是說我關於核電廠的安全設計有沒有針對國際能源總署他所提到的核實 暫時核安指引或有沒有外部威脅的評估的一個要求這件請組長"},{"start":91.116,"end":109.423,"text":"報告委員就是委員所問的就是針對IAEA最新的這些暫時的指引跟外部威脅這些重大評估目前就是台電公司都已經訂了核電廠面臨軍事威脅下確保核安的準備跟應變計畫以及相關的程序書那也透過每年的演習做一個檢討精進"},{"start":110.663,"end":120.748,"text":"所以 我們的台電有這樣的一個計畫書嘛 對不對有在演習嘛 對不對那這部分是不是可以北本席或是你們已經放在台電已經放在他的官網上面了嗎"},{"start":122.754,"end":144.16,"text":"有知道這些事情嗎報告委員因為有些內容因為是涉及保安的部分所以它是屬於比較機敏的但是它在演練的時候我們的都會派員去做一個視察檢視好那我當然講詳細這是你們河岸會知道嘛對不對是好那這邊我特別想問到就是這後面的如果可以的話我希望說給本席一份這樣子有沒有機會"},{"start":146.616,"end":168.249,"text":"還是就是還有說核子安全的設施等等好那如果沒關係我們看到我是想問的是他是否這樣的一個指南裡面啦計畫書裡面是否有已經針對無人機的攻擊還有飛彈的落彈還有長時間斷電的這個設計基準外的這樣的事件有沒有這樣子的一個內容包括這些內容"},{"start":169.561,"end":188.493,"text":"報告委員有的 像委員所提的無人機攻擊也是近年非常重視的一個議題那每年也都有進行演練好 那這樣子就會涉及到更重要的問題老師我們已經針對了國際原子能總署最重要的最新的這樣的一個趨勢已經因應到像5.23陣下面的無人機的攻擊"},{"start":189.093,"end":213.527,"text":"那在下面的問句再下來就是在說那我們在8月20號的時候呢核三廠考察的時候台電的許永慧副總他有回應到現場的質疑說核三廠有完整的安全性不只是原始設計的抗震是0.4G還已經加上了所有極端風險機率性的考量因此呢台電的許副總他認為說核安會呢"},{"start":215.808,"end":232.669,"text":"所說的加固到1.384G呢是考量到所有安全性風險機率的抗爭能力並非只是抵抗單純的地震喔這是非常重要 因為是何安威是做這個把關的那請問主委或者是高斌組長請問一下除一中的機組 扯三的"},{"start":233.47,"end":246.457,"text":"核二的 乾式儲存的設施在是否已經納入暫時防護情境是否在國軍戰略跟民防單位有計畫的銜接保障核電在極端風險下仍然是安全的"},{"start":248.678,"end":262.914,"text":"報告委員,因為我們台灣的柑橱設施系統其實都引進於美國NRC核准的系統那開發商當時在設計的時候有些柑橱甚至是實際上採用飛機撞擊去做測試"},{"start":266.932,"end":284.563,"text":"所以這邊事實上包括機組那乾式儲存你今天也提到了嘛對不對乾式儲存包括你們現在的已經開始招標的這乾式儲存廠的標也是要求這樣的一個標準對不對這台電公司的招標案不過台電公司招標案裡面對於耐震設計有特別的要求"},{"start":285.123,"end":300.714,"text":"對 而且是全部嘛 對不對包括是極端風險都已經包括進去了好 那另外的是在國軍戰略跟民防單位是否跟這樣的一個演習有沒有做計畫 因為現在想要全民任性包括如果遇到這種極端的情況是不是也沒有問題"},{"start":302.808,"end":330.507,"text":"就是保障核電廠是安全的啦是 包括委員相關的這些重大威脅都有納入它的演習的情境然後有做討論跟實際的一個演練所以剛才所說的有些委員他們所提到的這樣的安全包括不只是地震甚至連極端的危險的狀況的風險都已經包括進去都可以抵擋住對不對是是的這就表示說你核安會的這樣子的一個尬詞我覺得非常好讓全民在核在"},{"start":331.688,"end":355.276,"text":"國家的民意最高殿堂裡面立法院展現出這樣子一個核安的態度好那我們現在再看看是核三廠的議題我們現在已經進入到一個除疫的階段核三廠的一號機二號機電線現在所謂的過度的管制期包括說爐心的燃料也拿出來了那現在已經進入到的是所謂的自主安全檢查的一個時期對不對"},{"start":356.216,"end":371.348,"text":"那這個時期當中呢現在我就會遇到一個很大的問題就是說我也看到目前呢可以看到的是一個情況是因為經濟部部長他也提到的是台電預計在明年的"},{"start":372.949,"end":396.921,"text":"2026的3月要提出要提出來的是申請重啟的這個辦法 提出的計畫嘛 對不對那現在就必須要說剛剛尤其是河山廠的2號機材才進入到一個除役的階段那除役的階段面臨到的是25年可是我們也知道如果他明年3月就進行的一個重啟的計畫書要提出來申請的話那會遇到"},{"start":399.062,"end":420.954,"text":"廚藝跟重啟的這個有這樣子的一個重疊時間那請問一下在這個情況之下哪一個轉是不是會遇到有一個轉折點的情況那這個轉折點是在哪裡可能會在哪裡就現在已經有了資料上級長官經濟就是說另外的在屬於核三廠的我說核電廠的重啟這部分請回答"},{"start":424.6,"end":447.319,"text":"跟委員說明除役許可的申請案是執照到期前三年台電公司依法來向會裡面申請這部分就是等台電公司提出除役的環評報告之後如果符合法規 何安會才會合法除役許可目前如果按照台電公司或者經濟部對外說明如果明年三月提出換照的申請案"},{"start":447.859,"end":463.729,"text":"那核安委也是依法來就是還審理之後再看情況然後因為剛才委員提到除役跟重啟這兩件事情可能會並行那我們也會參考國外核電廠重啟的經驗就是恢復申請的經驗"},{"start":464.75,"end":481.933,"text":"那我们会针对重启的现场工作进行现场查证或视察那也会针对重启跟厨艺的共同事项来进行查证那这部分还是会持续办理一些干除设施用过燃料的一些安全的管制作业"},{"start":482.453,"end":506.621,"text":"換言之如果台電提出重啟的一個申請那當然依照程序去申請的話也提出你在審核包括的情況下就變成重啟會是比較優先的項目但是重啟跟在裡面他要預報過的是在核燃料裡面的這個燃料棒也是要拿起來如果他是說已經有空間乾除設施可以進去包括乾除廠也是會繼續再建嘛對不對"},{"start":507.561,"end":534.201,"text":"是的那現在的問題是那二號機的部分燃料池這部分也都大概有了解所以包括現在的處理設備的拆除這件事情基本上就會停止了廚藝當中的這個設備的拆除這部分會停止嗎跟委員說明現在是就是按照廚藝計畫的規劃是現在是過渡階段那台電公司就準備一些乾除設施的一些準備新建作業"},{"start":534.981,"end":557.833,"text":"因為現在還沒有正式提出來我一次用過燃料的安全好那現在可是已經看得到一號機我們已經看到說它的已經開工把設備拆除氮氣槽跟室水加清系統的部分那二號機是否還會繼續進行二號機的這個氮氣槽跟室水加清設備各位委員那是合一廠氮氣槽跟室水加清這是合一廠的"},{"start":558.584,"end":577.739,"text":"喔好那這樣子了解所以事實上核彈是更新型的嘛對不對就沒有這個設施好那我們現在要更強調的是另外一部分可是如果遇到的是核燃重啟喔那重啟的情況之下有一個問題是說核燃料的補充是重要的啦因為核燃料的補充我們現在看到這裡喔就是說"},{"start":578.78,"end":600.775,"text":"核燃料如果在營運的運轉的計畫裡面的核燃料補充這部分那到時候是會有誰來負責是來編預算等等的這部分有沒有考慮到這些事情因為你們可能也遇到這樣的情形要思考跟委員說明這個燃料者採購是屬於台電公司的商務採購合約那這部分細節要由台電公司去規劃說明"},{"start":601.872,"end":625.87,"text":"OK好那就是可能兩邊都被重啟了之後他表示核燃料的部分可能台電部分就會更重要的去下去負責這邊的一個重啟等等更重要的一個構置對不對好那可是剛才有一個問題是在於說另外剛才對重啟有個政策有說環評剛才說只要環評可是目前環境部的部長他要提到是說"},{"start":627.051,"end":649.585,"text":"要做環評 可是現在在目前的核子設施反應器的管制法當中並沒有關於特別所謂的他後來講到說政策環評因為考慮到要政策環評就會把人民的意見放進來當地的或是全國的意見中進來那請問一下對於政策環評我是注意到是政策環評的意見核安會的態度是怎麼樣"},{"start":651.992,"end":661.917,"text":"覺得有必要嗎如果有提出政策環評的話 那當然要修法可能在核子設施反應器的管制法裡面你們的態度是怎麼樣"},{"start":663.2,"end":689.063,"text":"核安會是負責核能安全管制對於輻射對環境的影響評估這責任完全是在核安會核安會要負起全部的責任核安會是負責環境評估對不對但是我現在說是政策環評因為現在環評裡面沒有特別去講到是對跟人的這方面的事情我們會跟其他議題我們會跟環境部協商討論"},{"start":690.063,"end":716.562,"text":"好那如果這樣的話是不是要涉及到要把核子設施反應器的管理管制法要做修訂才能加入到這個有法源依據是不是要有這樣的考量跟委員先補充說明那核安會是核安嘛主管機關那針對輻射的相關議題在我們的執法已經納進來了那這部分也是環稟的一部分那但是針對非輻射"},{"start":717.723,"end":746.522,"text":"非輻射相關的環境評估這部分那可能就要剛才主委有說明就是要跟環境部再去討論不過因為所有的事情因為剛才說辦法有可是所有的事情都需要要有法源依據的那目前政策環境是看到沒有的像跟環境部在做溝通之後這部分可能會是重要的一個依據不然沒有辦法的法源依據其實做不來只是在辦法上面它的一個執行的效力也是會有問題的我就提供到這樣子的一個意見我們希望在跟環境部的時候要注意到這個議題"},{"start":747.763,"end":756.53,"text":"好 谢谢主委请回谢谢刘淑冰委员的质询下一个请郭玉琴委员"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}