{"error":false,"id":["166475"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":166475,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/166475","日期":"2025-12-17","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"委員會-11-4-20-13","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第4會期財政委員會第13次全體委員會議","屆":11,"會期":4,"會次":13,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"委員會","委員會代碼":[20],"委員會代碼:str":["財政委員會"],"標題":"第11屆第4會期財政委員會第13次全體委員會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2025-12-17T10:55:02+08:00","結束時間":"2025-12-17T11:05:40+08:00","影片長度":"00:10:38","支援功能":["ai-transcript"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/a6d7659fd659acd0eeb22ede2508e1d2a3419a5287f8f915486d4848cd7fb6f344d40c79ee0f93675ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"林思銘","委員發言時間":"10:55:02 - 11:05:40","會議時間":"2025-12-17T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第4會期財政委員會第13次全體委員會議（事由：審查「海關進口稅則」5案：\n本院委員徐富癸等17人、委員黃健豪等22人、委員徐富癸等16人、委員陳菁徽等16人、委員林思銘等16人分別擬具「海關進口稅則部分稅則修正草案」等5案。【後1案須經各黨團簽署不復議同意書】）","transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":6.122843750000001,"end":8.215343750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":9.160343750000003,"end":12.484718750000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":12.484718750000003,"end":12.56909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":12.56909375,"end":13.294718750000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":14.796593750000003,"end":19.35284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":19.47096875,"end":19.48784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":19.48784375,"end":20.65221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":21.563468750000002,"end":23.132843750000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":23.65596875,"end":28.836593750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":29.106593750000002,"end":39.87284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":40.26096875,"end":43.095968750000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":43.399718750000005,"end":47.02784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":47.55096875,"end":52.64721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":53.204093750000006,"end":66.09659375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":66.58596875,"end":103.35659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":103.66034375000001,"end":104.25096875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":104.57159375,"end":123.84284375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":124.14659375000001,"end":131.40284375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":131.95971875,"end":132.83721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":133.51221875000002,"end":137.24159375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":138.42284375,"end":150.13409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":142.77659375000002,"end":143.50221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":150.18471875,"end":152.68221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":152.85096875000002,"end":159.17909375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":155.85471875000002,"end":156.32721875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":159.34784375,"end":236.23034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":166.16534375,"end":166.67159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":167.07659375,"end":167.38034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":173.03346875,"end":173.47221875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":178.31534375,"end":178.36596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":208.03221875000003,"end":208.38659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":227.96159375000002,"end":227.97846875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":227.97846875000002,"end":228.63659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":228.63659375,"end":228.68721875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":228.68721875000003,"end":228.80534375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":228.80534375000002,"end":228.85596875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":233.56409375,"end":234.39096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":235.03221875000003,"end":243.72284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":244.16159375,"end":245.29221875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":245.35971875,"end":279.22784375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":279.58221875000004,"end":299.34284375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":300.13596875,"end":302.43096875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":302.63346875,"end":372.10784375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":306.46409375,"end":306.53159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":306.53159375,"end":306.83534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":306.83534375,"end":306.86909375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":312.97784375000003,"end":313.43346875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":339.13409375000003,"end":339.89346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":348.41534375000003,"end":348.78659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":370.01534375,"end":370.74096875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":372.10784375000003,"end":372.51284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":372.83346875,"end":410.92034375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":411.27471875000003,"end":421.31534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":421.65284375000005,"end":423.10409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":423.45846875,"end":429.41534375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":427.35659375,"end":428.40284375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":428.87534375,"end":430.07346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":429.60096875000005,"end":441.19409375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":440.38409375000003,"end":444.87284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":444.34971875,"end":460.34721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":449.95221875000004,"end":450.40784375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":453.31034375,"end":453.74909375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":454.99784375,"end":455.50409375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":459.79034375000003,"end":471.65346875000006},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":461.27534375000005,"end":461.93346875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":465.54471875,"end":466.13534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":471.51846875,"end":472.80096875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":472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我們請林思明召委好 謝謝主席我們請莊部長我們請莊部長農業部的是農糧署副署長 陳副署長好 請陳副署長"},{"start":21.656,"end":46.25,"text":"委員好 是 部長我想我們今天討論海關進口稅責的這個案子我首先針對我國這個在2002年1月1號我們加入WTO成為第144個會員國距離現在已經23年了在啤酒的進口稅方面因為境外啤酒進口關稅後來就一直降 降到0"},{"start":47.671,"end":65.478,"text":"所以我们境外品牌进入本土市场的成本可以说是大幅降低但是我们本土啤酒的制造所需的主要原料麦芽还有啤酒花却仍需负担7.5%到15%的进口关税"},{"start":66.778,"end":93.511,"text":"當然按照WTO的架構各國都可以調降關稅但是卻不能任意提高各國承諾的一個稅率換句話說原料減稅是可行且合乎規定的政策工具之一讓我們的業者國內的業者更具有競爭力所以政府現在做的做法"},{"start":94.071,"end":113.828,"text":"你成品久就进口成品久关税是零但是我们进口原料这个税是7.5%到15%这个根本看起来就是对于我们这些这个在国外制造在国外完成制造的这些业者给予最大的优惠"},{"start":114.508,"end":136.943,"text":"对于本土业者而言造成严重的竞争上的不公平所以我们看起来现行的关税制度根本不是保护本土业者反而是在惩罚我们本土业者所以我们目前这样的税制结构部长你认为合理吗"},{"start":139.056,"end":163.664,"text":"謝謝委員因為委員也有我們召委也有提案所以在我們今天的報告裡面也做了一個詳細的分析包含我們的進口量進口值以及關稅的收入那當然如果這樣關稅的調降對我國產業可以產生怎麼樣的一個效益我們也做了分析那是因此在分析後我們認為說這些我們麥芽跟那個啤酒花都是進口量我們都是用"},{"start":164.324,"end":182.114,"text":"进口的量都97到86%都是用在我们的啤酒酿帐那如果我们降低它的关税的话也就是免征这个关税降为0的话确实可以降低我们国产啤酒的生产成本然后提高它的竞争力还有市产的占有率那么"},{"start":182.774,"end":207.112,"text":"有助于它和进口啤酒来做竞争这个是有关在产业面同时对于农业的部分因为它麦芽跟啤酒花跟农业会有关系我们也请了农业部的农粮署来表示意见他们认为大麦跟啤酒花在国内并没有经济规模的一个栽培所以调降这样的一个关税的税率他们是没有意见我们这样综合了"},{"start":207.572,"end":212.154,"text":"產業以及以關農業的部門的一個意見認為我們確實可以降低調降這樣的一個關稅讓我們的國產啤酒更具有競爭力那同時在稅收的部分我們也做了評估雖然關稅減少但是其他的稅收可以進增加那增加的結果事實上可以會有"},{"start":227.401,"end":241.798,"text":"9000多萬的進的稅收的收入我們因此這樣的評估以後也支持委員的提案財政部的方向是這樣部長我想你分析的已經很清楚但是接下來我想還是問一下農業部的意見"},{"start":244.221,"end":271.274,"text":"那個副長雖然剛才一直提到說我們對於這個大麥或者啤酒花的生產那農業部你的報告指出說在我們目前在國內並沒有大規模的一個栽植或者商業化的一個種植產業大部分就是大概這個大這些啤酒花或者麥芽進九成該不然講九成以上都是要去進口所以我們是完全高度依賴進口的一個狀況"},{"start":272.975,"end":299.073,"text":"所以在這種情況之下我們降低我們的這個原料的關稅除了降低用降低的方式我們今天修法說要降低以外那農業部農糧署你有沒有考慮剛才賴會員委員有問到對於我們相關的這些產業就在台灣來栽種這些原料這些產業的一個扶植那農業部有沒有做什麼規劃委員 召委好"},{"start":303.185,"end":314.471,"text":"剛剛講到關於大麥跟啤酒花這兩個作物它基本上是溫帶的作物那台灣是亞熱帶的氣候所以它國內沒有經濟規模的栽培"},{"start":317.973,"end":344.105,"text":"像以大麥為例他目前的農情調查資料在去年113年度全國的種植面積只有0.4公頃這個是因為他是溫帶的那也講到農業部的花蓮區農改廠在花蓮的那邊有四種啤酒花但是那個還在四種階段那我們也會來關心四種的結果再評估"},{"start":344.945,"end":348.447,"text":"他是不是可以進一步來做輔導跟推廣另外我們國內發展農村美酒不管是用台南的這些後壁剛剛講到的米或是像台中的霧峰的一泉香米或是其他的梅子或是包括草莓等我們都會發展台灣本土的農村美酒會做產業的輔導這個農業部都有在進行是"},{"start":372.722,"end":376.684,"text":"剛剛提到說我們也去試圖發展其他的美酒我們這次講的就是針對啤酒這部分當然你剛才提到大部分都要進口然後台灣是溫帶氣候不適合去發展這些大麥或者這些啤酒花的產業的種植"},{"start":397.294,"end":420.222,"text":"所以你既然這些原料都是要靠進口嘛那農業部有沒有思考如何幫助說我們相關的好像在花蓮花蓮有種植那個啤酒花是不是所以你既然認為說沒有生產的一個效益你有沒有去要想到說如何的去調整他的一個產業的一個發展"},{"start":422.158,"end":444.942,"text":"跟委員報告花蓮的部分它是在試種花蓮區農業改良廠在試種如果以國內譬如它試種的結果我們再評估在國內種少量的啤酒花它發展的是地方的特色不會是用價格所以花蓮是氣候適宜花蓮你評估跟委員報告"},{"start":445.322,"end":449.104,"text":"他在花蓮的農友曾國啟那邊試種我有去看過其實還要評估因為台灣是亞熱帶氣候溫度比較高一點試種的結果是不是適合我們農業部跟花蓮區農業改良廠會適宜的做調整說送不起來還一直去叫他送這個也滿奇怪的所以這一次降低整個關稅農業部的立場也是同意我們是支持"},{"start":472.893,"end":489.654,"text":"OK 好 謝謝我想再請財政部我想財政部剛才部長講了很多數據我們把啤酒主要原料麥芽跟啤酒花的進口關稅把它降成零之後每年稅收減少的金額"},{"start":490.915,"end":509.132,"text":"大概我刚才看了一下报告就是不到合计不到税损不到大概少了7435万这个数字在我们国务库的整体结构中并不会造成太大的一个冲击但是我们从反面来看"},{"start":510.593,"end":529.624,"text":"因為原料成本過高而導致本土釀酒業者的萎縮投資外移就業減少從而導致我們流失的恐怕不是只有關稅的收入而已而是我們的營所稅所得稅地方就業以及我們整個產業鏈的附加價值"},{"start":530.464,"end":550.247,"text":"所以付稅署你是否應該評估說我們的點不是在少收多少而是說如果什麼都不做長期會不會我們收得更少所以部長你剛才提到因為如果我們這一次把稅降為零之後我們的稅收反而會增加更多"},{"start":551.493,"end":557.815,"text":"謝謝委員也就是剛剛委員所提的如果我們把它降為零那關稅的稅收會減少4735萬但是如同剛剛委員所說的當我們把我們的啤酒市場的競爭力提高以後就就業人口來說也是有所幫助的另外我們也可以提高我們國產啤酒的銷售量所以在菸酒稅營業稅跟盈利事業所得稅其實是會增加的"},{"start":577.703,"end":605.876,"text":"而且會增加到一億六千九百七十四萬那如果這樣的增加跟減少相互來抵充了以後其實是淨增加九千五百萬的所以說是淨增加的所以部長你認為這次的修法方向完全是正確的所以基本上財政部支持這樣做完全支持是支持的農業部要經濟部經濟部呢經濟部也支持吧經濟部那翁市長我們也支持吧"},{"start":607.27,"end":613.815,"text":"都支持啦齁也是支持啦齁經濟部支持"},{"start":614.933,"end":638.898,"text":"這個也不會影響我們未來就是我國未來加入這個CPTPP或者我們其他自由貿易協定我們加入這些組織也不會受到任何影響會不會受到影響 經濟部這個部分我們都有綜合考量過都不會啦以上 謝謝謝謝委員 謝謝我們謝謝林思明 周偉"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}