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先我們一律來介紹今天出席的委員有這個羅廷偉委員還有這個陳佩儀委員 陳佩儀委員張錫凱委員然後"},{"start":2044.132,"end":2065.522,"text":"這個機關代表有經濟部常務次長賴建信次長還有這個能源署代理組長夏組長台電總經理王耀廷總經理還有環境部這個料檢認視察謝謝"},{"start":2068.322,"end":2075.674,"text":"那我們現在是不是先請這個羅廷偉委員來要不要做提案說明還是不用"},{"start":2083.775,"end":2097.682,"text":"謝謝主席以及我們現場所有與會的同事還有我們主管機關提案說明其實鑑於環境部火速通過台中發電廠第二期的興建燃氣機組環評案"},{"start":2099.463,"end":2125.202,"text":"那新增了竟然六部機組而原本規劃要除以的藍媒機組轉為緊急使用那我們就覺得這個中火就是變相再繼續擴敞那變成六七六媒跟過去經濟部對我們台中市民的一個承諾爭一氣猜一媒的一個減媒規劃如今不減反針我們覺得中火目前所面臨到不只是追究"},{"start":2125.922,"end":2153.819,"text":"更是全球最大而且它是亞林界的燃煤電廠對於整個台中市以及中南部的整個健康發展都是非常非常的有劇烈的一個影響所以我們還是希望目前啊能夠像台電長期向國人的宣傳的早一天蒸汽早一天減煤能夠如今中火一起的燃氣機組呢也即將在今年還有明年呢完工運轉"},{"start":2154.98,"end":2174.654,"text":"那在這個總計2600的發電量總裝置容量可立即太出4.7座的藍莓機組但是基本上呢現階段又跟我們講不願意去太出所以對我們來說是非常非常的憤怒那藍莓基本上的整個空污影響我們覺得都是"},{"start":2175.515,"end":2196.723,"text":"影響空屋最劇烈的之一所以還是希望在2028年能夠趕緊完成當時所承諾的無煤台中那特別是中張頭雲嘉南都將是這一個中火發電的一個燃煤深受影響的最遠的一個縣市"},{"start":2198.204,"end":2222.122,"text":"行政院規劃2034年無煤中火的一個政策在此這個目標2024到2031中火僅將減煤160萬公噸與現行的2023年的用煤量相較自2031年仍有71%的煤電未太足減煤的進程我們是覺得嚴重的落後所以據統計2024的中火已經減煤了"},{"start":2227.406,"end":2239.934,"text":"630萬公噸的用煤量但是2025呢中火燃氣機組一上線可繼續汰除432萬公噸量但是2026還有加入民營的中佳燃氣電廠喔"},{"start":2241.375,"end":2248.141,"text":"所以以及中火的燃氣一期第二個機組可再以以氣鈦煤636萬噸公噸的一個這個燃煤但是最遲啊我們包在計算是2028即可每年節電83億度以此2028就可以達到無煤中火"},{"start":2263.694,"end":2288.635,"text":"這個是有一個騎乘並且是有具體的一個路徑以上來跟大家做一個報導也希望說這個部分能夠幫忙那支持2028無煤中火的主決議台灣要敬禮中火先無煤這個倡議的口號聲我們在基本上在每次記者會我們都堅定的一直在發聲這也是我們台中許多的公民團體不斷的一直在"},{"start":2289.455,"end":2302.64,"text":"包括這個台灣健康空氣行動聯盟的岳光彤醫師他們也都是一直在這個部分上一直在喊話所以今天先做初步的報告也希望說大家能夠一起來支持 以上這個提案委員 羅廷偉委員的說明其他委員要不要好 那個張錫凱委員"},{"start":2314.679,"end":2340.486,"text":"今天這個提案應該是不分朝野應該都是會共同支持的事實上減碳還有特別是減少燃煤這是國家既定的政策可是我們回去檢視我要引述的是中經驗的資料他說我們匯合政策一直在推的時候要減碳結果最近這8年我們的碳排放量"},{"start":2341.414,"end":2364.02,"text":"不減反增最近這8年我們的碳排增加了高達80萬噸就是我們人民用廢發電的這個同時碳排一直在增加那特別是517517台灣進入非核家園之後我們的火力發電全開大家有看到"},{"start":2368.231,"end":2397.525,"text":"前幾天台中市市長盧秀燕開了第一槍他非常的擔心擔憂的狀況下出來講了中火就是我們今天在討論這個中火是全台灣最大的污染源最大的污染源結果呢在五一七核能歸零的前一天跟後面一天中火啊"},{"start":2400.99,"end":2419.727,"text":"他的這個燒煤的這個燒煤的這個不只沒有減少竟然從16號一天喔就燒了3.23萬噸的煤炭到了19號大家看看3天19號那一天攀升到4.62萬噸就是在輝和家園前後的16號到19號"},{"start":2427.375,"end":2448.354,"text":"差了多少多燒了1.4萬噸的煤多恐怖啊大家可以想像嗎當政府一直在說我們要少燒煤結果在中火你非常具體的看到他燒的這個煤炭竟然在19號當天比16號一口氣增加了1.4萬噸"},{"start":2453.379,"end":2464.475,"text":"我們不只用廢在發電這對全民的健康有多大一個影響事實上中火整個影響從苗栗以南一直到高雄全部都影響到了"},{"start":2467.901,"end":2493.674,"text":"所以台灣民眾黨非常支持我們共同提案要求基於改善空氣品質守護我們國人的健康要求台中發電廠要逐年提出落實減煤這個計畫是每一年都要提那更重要的我們訂那個目標希望在2028年就完成無煤中火的國家減碳目標"},{"start":2496.387,"end":2513.855,"text":"這個為什麼非常的重要第一個是本來政府就要做的可是目前時間看起來一直在延宕包括台中市政府跟全民一直在要求的希望說你現在如果改成天然氣那你有沒有一個天然氣完成的時候你就是要把這個燒煤炭的"},{"start":2517.543,"end":2543.336,"text":"要廢掉可是那政府到現在沒有引諾而且甚至是跳票的之前引諾我們全民的跳票了所以我們今天非常具體的希望他每年提出一個減煤的這個計畫而且在2028年完成無煤的這個中火還給前台灣的這個民眾一個空氣新鮮的這個空氣另外我要特別提醒一點這不是只有中火碰到的問題"},{"start":2545.613,"end":2569.827,"text":"從非核加鹽517之後大家都有感受到包括連高雄市議院都跳出來說我們的燃煤的基礎是不是燒得比以前更兇了當然台電今天講這些都是平常可能就要用的可是有沒有發現這段時間全民都在擔心空污越來越嚴重而且很多本來已經停止或者是沒有再買的例如說"},{"start":2571.488,"end":2598.221,"text":"麥寮的電廠麥寮是全台灣第二大污染源剛講中火是第一第二就是麥寮了麥寮本來在河山廠的一號機去年停機完之後那個時間點本來麥寮我們台電跟他買電應該是要契約時間是到的可是台電又緊急去跟他續約讓這個台灣的第二大污染源也是燒煤炭的要一直延續到今年的年底所以那時候包括"},{"start":2600.189,"end":2629.284,"text":"雲林、外嘉義台南彰化、南投還有非常多的民間團體北上到行政院抗議到監察院去陳情他們說他們忍受那麼久的燒煤很多人用會發電甚至肺腺癌的比例一直在攀升好不容易判到他已經可以停了結果台電為了推動飛河的時候他去補了一個"},{"start":2631.293,"end":2647.726,"text":"燒煤的麥寮電廠的這個電傷害到我們人民的這個健康所以我要呼籲今天不只是要支持中火趕快在2028年完成無煤中火我們也希望在燒煤炭這一塊全台灣所有的燒煤的這個電廠都要大幅的減低 謝謝好 謝謝我們現在接下來請黃將豪委員"},{"start":2653.834,"end":2675.862,"text":"好谢谢主席后我想今天的这个主要的问题在我们提出是2028无煤中火那原因当然在于说好2025年和2026年预计很能够完成所有的燃气机组让我都知道说新的燃气机组理论上他的发电效率会比燃煤机组来的高所以我们觉得说第一个过去台电跟经济部也曾经承诺过"},{"start":2676.582,"end":2703.607,"text":"新建的燃气机组之后就能够取代燃煤机组那燃煤机组就应该除溢或者是拆除这是我们最主要的主张所以既然有新的燃气机组那在现行的能源政策之下发电量足够那就不应该再启用燃煤机组所以我们才提出所谓2028无煤中火的一个这个这个诉求那么回顾这几天依据这个台电官网公布的台中电厂的用煤量"},{"start":2704.227,"end":2722.42,"text":"我想跟去年相比5月13号到5月20号我们都是用同一天来比较跟去年同一天来比较5月16号去年的用的用煤量是2.75万吨那今年是3.22万吨5月17去年3.21万吨今年是4.02万吨5月18去年2.87万吨今年提高到3.8万吨"},{"start":2730.206,"end":2757.58,"text":"5月19去年的5月19号是2.76吨今年提高到4.64吨5月20号去年用3.56吨今年用4.28吨我刚所列举这些日子就在近这几天发生的事情而已我想每一天的这个的用煤量同一天都比去年来的高那很显见很显然发现一件事情就是我们一直强调说要减煤要降低燃煤发电但是很显然在这个"},{"start":2758.22,"end":2783.635,"text":"数据上面看不出来有减少的趋势每一天每一天都在增加那当然我们高度怀疑是不是因为这个非核家园之后我们整体用力量不够所以必须来让这个台中电厂用更多的发电量更多的煤炭来处理我的发电问题所以我们才需要提出的这样的决议我们希望说既然今年跟明年都会有燃气机组完成那完成之后"},{"start":2784.375,"end":2807.233,"text":"既然都是火力发电那火力发电有分天然气跟燃煤那燃煤是真的效率相对比较差而且对空气污染对人体健康伤害比较重的一种发电方式那是不是在今年跟明年竟然都有燃气机组能够新建完成的前提之下那2028年让中火能够真正的达成无煤中火让现在这些老旧"},{"start":2808.448,"end":2820.424,"text":"燃煤機組到2028年的時候都停止運轉不要再用這種燃煤的方式來發電來傷害中部這麼多縣市人民的健康以上謝謝好謝謝那個楊瓊英委員"},{"start":2827.683,"end":2846.364,"text":"非常的感謝我想今天針對這個議題對於我們中部地區來講我們長期的付出應該要還給我們中部地區的人不要再用廢發電這是我們非常非常卑微的一個要求"},{"start":2847.205,"end":2866.606,"text":"但是我們看到從要增氣一直到承諾我們一直得不到政府的承諾因為第一個從王美花部長說增氣我們就減煤就拆煤氣機組但是到現在我們仍舊在期待"},{"start":2867.587,"end":2891.845,"text":"我们看到最后在蒸汽的这个环境里头台电给了一个应许也就是2031年开始来减煤减煤300万吨但是我们知道我们现在每一年在中国所烧的煤量大概是1100万吨至1200万吨左右"},{"start":2894.887,"end":2919.243,"text":"那换句话说到2031年我们还有七至八年的时间到底我们的台电政府经济部你的督导你们的减煤计划是不是在这一段时间就不减煤了呢因为你所承诺的是2031年才开始要减煤一年300万吨"},{"start":2921.204,"end":2923.507,"text":"那換句話說現在我們就是1100萬噸至1200萬噸這七八年你不要減煤了嗎尤其我們看到在17號河山廠的二號機正式停役之後"},{"start":2939.025,"end":2964.888,"text":"正式停役之后我们看到我们的17号晚上18号19号连续三天火力全开在蒸汽的还品会里头我们只看到什么看到告诉我们也就是在非空污时期那么中火只有可以动九步机"},{"start":2966.249,"end":2986.129,"text":"九部機 那目前為止等於是九部火力全開那台電的臉書竟然還說 這沒有火力全開我說 這不是火力全開 這是什麼呢另外一個說法 又說是白天減煤"},{"start":2987.537,"end":2990.399,"text":"所以不是晚上增煤那這樣的一個情況讓我們更憂心因為數據告訴我們17號晚上18號19號這三天所增加的電量是大概1000到2000MW"},{"start":3008.191,"end":3037.25,"text":"用數字用真相來告訴民眾所增加的煤量是一天0.8萬噸至1萬噸的一個煤量這不是增加我們中部地區健康的風險危險嗎這是什麼所以早上我們在這個經濟委員會也特別問了經濟部長也特別台電的代表是副總經理我特別請問了副總經理我說"},{"start":3038.371,"end":3041.052,"text":"會不會增加燃煤是常態但是副總經理告訴我們不會是常態所以既然說不會是常態我們要用實際的數字實際的真相告訴台電如果你說的你不增加煤量那為什麼我們這三天的數字跟同期的三天是如此"},{"start":3067.242,"end":3083.74,"text":"因為我們看到最近這6年來不管是中央地方我們大家的努力終於一天大概平均是6部機而且平均的發電量是60%但是這一次火力全開的90%"},{"start":3085.402,"end":3087.524,"text":"我們的人民不憂心嗎?我們的人民不恐懼嗎?所以今天這個提案也就是從王美花部長開始要爭氣一直到現在我們看不到真正的減煤計畫"},{"start":3103.678,"end":3112.946,"text":"所以我們希望得到藍綠白的委員大家的同意我們希望能夠真正的來落實這個落實也就是在2028年無眉我們的環境樣態"},{"start":3120.333,"end":3137.45,"text":"那么同时在每一年都能够提出我们的减煤计划因为我们真的是希望让我们的人民能够安心这个减煤的计划务必要拿出而不是只有告诉我们2031年开始我们要减煤一年300万吨"},{"start":3141.454,"end":3166.113,"text":"我再一次的強調現在所燒的中火大概是1100萬噸到1200萬噸如果要等到2031年才允許每一年要減300萬噸那等於這七到八年的時間根本是不減煤的樣態所以我們希望得到大家的支持也希望行政部門能夠來說明跟落實 謝謝好 陳委員先好了"},{"start":3171.431,"end":3193.316,"text":"那個好謝謝主席根據今天我們要來協商的這個內容看起來國民黨還有所有聯署的委員是希望把這個期限提早到2028然後所以他們剛剛搬出了非常多的數字我想要提醒國民黨的委員或是今天所有聯署的委員目前為止"},{"start":3194.456,"end":3212.601,"text":"所有火力發電全開的時候事實上是在馬英九總統跟胡志強市長任內在蔡英文總統上任之後相關的數字跟空瓶都一直在改善但是你們不願意看相關的數字只有一個提出的非常荒謬的提議再來我要提醒剛剛講完就快閃不敢面對現實張綺凱委員你們在"},{"start":3215.242,"end":3230.652,"text":"禮拜二才通過荒謬的核三重啟的公投案可能在8月23就有相關公投要進行但你不回答核廢料的問題不回答核安的問題然後現在拿現在今天在這個協商會議當中你還再次造謠說"},{"start":3231.753,"end":3246.145,"text":"用廢發電這件事情我要強烈指控你的造謠因此我認為如果我們真的要回答相關的科學問題就請回到專業論述而不要再任意的造謠還有你還是沒有回答核廢料跟核胺的問題以上謝謝好還有誰要發言好麥義珍"},{"start":3254.02,"end":3265.784,"text":"謝謝主席我們台灣這個月為核三廠的停役後正式進行非核家園政府高舉著能源轉型的這個大旗子但實際上這個這面旗代表的是卻把全國發電的"},{"start":3274.167,"end":3294.816,"text":"重大压回中部的地区让中部地区成为牺牲品时时刻刻提醒着我们今天的电都是用人民的费来换的根据台电的公开资讯以核电停止前一日以后一日"},{"start":3296.209,"end":3311.977,"text":"相作比较暴增了50%的燃煤量18日中火10步燃煤机组开了9步而少了一步是因为已经停止"},{"start":3313.178,"end":3317.24,"text":"本來就是不能運作的所以才不會開如果不開全力開實際上就是名符其實的火力全開現在呢才5月到了6月7月8月夏季的電力需求高峰又怎麼辦呢答案只有一個繼續火力全開農務"},{"start":3341.667,"end":3370.818,"text":"弥漫继续牺牲着我们中张头云渣南地区的空气品质中火电力目前是依靠燃煤而来而燃煤众所积枝并非干净的能源政府一边含着能源转型却对于造成中部的空污严重的燃煤发电视而不见"},{"start":3371.738,"end":3379.416,"text":"原来政府的口中非核电家园非核家园就是换成全媒家园"},{"start":3380.902,"end":3404.067,"text":"尤其令人憤怒的中火早已是全国污染量和碳排放量的最高的电厂如今台中发电厂新建的燃气机组计划环平案通过后新增了六部燃气机组"},{"start":3405.154,"end":3420.593,"text":"原规划要除异燃煤机组不拆除反而转为紧急扩阻无以章让中火以勇成为全球最大的火力发电厂"},{"start":3421.693,"end":3443.699,"text":"这对我们中部居民来说是难以承受的负担与噩梦经济部曾经对台中人民承诺争一气拆一枚的减霉规划如今害怕想起来了还是为了达成非核家园的里程碑"},{"start":3444.759,"end":3452.17,"text":"即使明知綠電整位穩定還是一一孤行說好了以氣換煤難道只是政策"},{"start":3458.459,"end":3483.825,"text":"买票的谎言吗如今燃气机组将于今年明年完工的转运转燃气和稍微比燃煤更干净的能源但实际上氧气发电量完全可以取代老旧的燃煤机组既然政府对定定下就是减煤的目标"},{"start":3485.267,"end":3513.499,"text":"那就应该更踏实的执行能源转型不该拿中部人民的健康代价更不能是一场政治失言的骗局我们坚持2028无煤中火是政府能源转型的路上的责任是对中部地区人民的承诺绝不能只是空头支票谢谢"},{"start":3514.824,"end":3515.309,"text":"好 非常謝謝"},{"start":3517.38,"end":3544.114,"text":"剛才這個各黨團的代表都來發言看起來這個陳偉剛的發言就是還是有不同意見今天仍然無法達成共識是不是這個本案就保留我們就依後續依立法院之前刑事法第12章相關規定來處理"},{"start":3547.349,"end":3552.698,"text":"可以嗎好我們就協商會議結束非常謝謝非常謝謝上會"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}