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12:48:19","會議時間":"2026-01-28T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"5.蘇被提名人嘉宏-立法院第11屆第4會期內政、司法及法制委員會第2次聯席會議（事由：審查行政院函送中央選舉委員會委員提名名單，游盈隆為委員並為主任委員，胡博硯為委員並為副主任委員，黃文玲、李禮仲、蘇嘉宏、蘇子喬及陳宗義均為委員，請同意案。【1月28日及29日二天一次會】）","transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":7.472843750000001,"end":10.864718750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":11.185343750000001,"end":13.598468750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":16.19721875,"end":16.73721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":17.63159375,"end":18.47534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":18.79596875,"end":21.00659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":21.85034375,"end":23.74034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":26.05221875,"end":70.29846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":70.48409375,"end":105.90471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":106.17471875000001,"end":107.74409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":108.33471875000001,"end":108.57096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":109.12784375000001,"end":112.45221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":113.39721875000001,"end":117.51471875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":113.56596875000001,"end":114.52784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":117.43034375,"end":117.81846875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":117.56534375000001,"end":118.76346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":119.01659375000001,"end":120.51846875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":119.70846875000001,"end":120.88971875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":121.02471875,"end":139.63784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":139.87409375000001,"end":154.53846875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":155.21346875,"end":158.28471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":159.36471875,"end":166.77284375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":167.43096875,"end":177.69096875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":177.85971875,"end":180.44159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":180.72846875000002,"end":181.60596875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":182.33159375000002,"end":192.15284375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":192.43971875000003,"end":201.23159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":201.94034375,"end":202.95284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":203.17221875,"end":206.63159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":206.69909375,"end":209.56784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":210.05721875,"end":230.64471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":222.93284375000002,"end":223.05096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":230.88096875000002,"end":242.60909375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":242.74409375000002,"end":248.02596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":248.14409375000002,"end":249.94971875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":251.11409375000002,"end":251.56971875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":251.94096875000002,"end":253.39221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":253.32471875000002,"end":253.76346875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":253.76346875000002,"end":257.30721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":255.70409375000003,"end":256.10909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":257.35784375000003,"end":264.05721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":260.31096875000003,"end":260.46284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":260.53034375000004,"end":260.73284375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":264.51284375,"end":264.93471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":265.18784375,"end":271.02659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":266.06534375,"end":266.53784375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":267.14534375,"end":268.24221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":271.31346875,"end":274.92471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":275.34659375,"end":278.90721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":279.10971875,"end":292.60971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":279.14346875,"end":279.53159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":293.09909375,"end":294.01034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":294.55034375,"end":300.38909375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":301.31721875,"end":304.08471875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":304.16909375,"end":311.50971875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":311.76284375,"end":328.06409375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":328.38471875000005,"end":332.04659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":332.26596875,"end":332.97471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":333.54846875000004,"end":337.88534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":338.30721875,"end":347.31846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":347.74034375,"end":358.05096875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":358.74284375,"end":391.19346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":391.93596875000003,"end":424.57221875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":425.41596875000005,"end":436.01346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":436.73909375000005,"end":445.02471875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":442.89846875,"end":443.33721875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":445.51409375000003,"end":451.04909375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":451.43721875000006,"end":462.65909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":458.60909375000006,"end":459.18284375},{"speaker":"SP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有請蘇老師蘇老師謝謝老師好 真的辛苦了"},{"start":21.892,"end":50.208,"text":"所以我們想要請問一下 因為現在的選舉制度 你有說了就是憲政由內政部主管 選務由中選會負責的分立設計原意在於落實責任政治就是維護選舉的中立但你也指出 實務上因為全職的交"},{"start":51.188,"end":55.092,"text":"交換所以呢往往就是導致改革就是遲締甚至使中選會受制於行政關係難以回應高度流動社會於新型的風險所以呢我想要請教兩點第一在維持分立的架構下你認為"},{"start":75.709,"end":99.062,"text":"中選會應清楚定位以依法執行選務的獨立機關而非非推上政治的正義第一線第二若短期能維持分立體制是否通過交錯的任期專任化外部專家參與度透明等的"},{"start":99.842,"end":111.771,"text":"制度設計就是逐步強化中選會獨立性與公信力我們要的就是可以獨立作業嗎 這樣子的一個目標"},{"start":113.473,"end":129.11,"text":"是的 我原您的提問通通都是我的答案我就是肯定的很好 所以在我們的問卷裡面還有回覆指出說選舉權不是行"},{"start":132.433,"end":157.302,"text":"形式的權利 而是國家必要積極保障的基本權 當人民因為求學啊 就業啊 或者服役或執勤無法返回戶籍投票的時候 我國家就是要提供替代制度 實質上就是限制其他投票 並"},{"start":159.657,"end":181.265,"text":"對年輕人還有流動人口造成不平等所以我們你認為在就是本人到場還有身份查驗也秘密投票的前提下國內移轉投票在實質上不是便利措施而是"},{"start":182.686,"end":193.309,"text":"國家例行憲法保障參政的必要制度你也強調說國內轉移投票不同於資訊或者電子投票風險可控不宜被過度上網為國安問題那麼有立法完成不在籍投票的法治化的那個就是投票的法治化"},{"start":210.915,"end":222.13,"text":"你是否認為中選會在制度設計就是執行上應如何就是權力就是最大為原則從如何讓更合格"},{"start":224.134,"end":249.62,"text":"選民安全投票出發因為現在很多地方就是各國等於是說印尼 菲律賓他們都是可以就是在台灣在投票但是我在這邊強調的是說我們的民眾黨說的就是在台灣 在台灣 在台灣是移轉投票而已所以你覺得是說這樣子我們能做得到嗎"},{"start":252.039,"end":262.015,"text":"以目前國內的移轉投票我認為中選會可能步步為營也是步步為營"},{"start":266.455,"end":292.383,"text":"贏得勝利的贏這件事情我覺得中選會可能還可以勉強的跟上社會的需求但是如果我們繼續做民主深化的話我們還要再做其他更大的發展的話以目前我再強調一次我所了解到的中選會的行政量能"},{"start":293.203,"end":300.179,"text":"是做不到的所以必須要有所調整才能夠因應時代的變遷回應社會的需求以上"},{"start":301.377,"end":327.684,"text":"中選會應該做得到現在我們是台灣是科技國家所以這個是說應該要做得到不是說還在不一定做得到我覺得這個是已經我們台灣已經應該要做得到的所以接下來我想要請教一下因為現在就是兩岸人民的關係明定大陸地區人民在"},{"start":328.904,"end":357.643,"text":"涉及滿10年還有我是外配也是滿10年就是依法登記為公職候選人但是立法則憲法徵定條文裡面第11條所做出了特別規範但近期引發就是行政機關用國籍法張就是大陸地區的人民"},{"start":358.824,"end":376.5,"text":"人民比例外國人額外要求放棄所謂的外國國籍形同就是以行政解釋炸空的特別法所以你在這邊也是就是你說理解所以你也是說依法依法就是涉及滿十年原則是大陸地區的人民"},{"start":385.308,"end":388.496,"text":"參政權是否以憲法保障的基本權應用優先"},{"start":391.96,"end":397.482,"text":"因為在我們的兩岸條款這邊就是說優先應用所以排除國籍法的類型就是來去適用所以在目前我們的部會法律見解出現就十分之甚至有行政官員公開宣稱說陸配參政權已使的情況下你是否認為說中選會應依特別法"},{"start":421.372,"end":433.409,"text":"明文辦理選務而非就是被動承受這樣子可能違憲的行政解釋以免就是實質剝奪人民的參政權報告委員"},{"start":439.532,"end":466.499,"text":"台灣地區與大陸地區人民關係條例相對於國籍法民法諸多的相關涉及的法律目前就是一種特別法優先適用於普通法的這樣的一種法律適用關係這是沒有疑問的如果啦在這個特別法的跟普通法的這種優先適用關係不成立的話"},{"start":467.591,"end":490.647,"text":"那大陸地區人民來臺 繼承這個遺產的上限兩百兩百萬可能就會怎麼樣呢那就不用遵守了 回到民法它的印記份或者是什麼樣的那都很可能超過兩百萬所以這個特別法的問題 這是第一個第二個 這個叫做期待可能性"},{"start":491.748,"end":518.495,"text":"如果中國大陸是沒有放棄國籍的這樣的一種法治的話強要我們的大陸配偶回去大陸去放棄國籍在客觀上沒有其他可能性強人民之所難以此來剝奪人民的參政權這個我不能認同 以上報告"},{"start":519.056,"end":545.559,"text":"好 謝謝 再給我一分鐘 謝謝主席謝謝我們的老師給我們的說明所以我常講的就是說我們不要因出勝地來去決定我們在台灣的我們拿身份證是跟我們國民一模模一樣樣參選也是一模模一樣樣的當選也是一模模一樣樣不要再拿出勝地來去卡就是在台灣努力的人"},{"start":546.36,"end":565.133,"text":"所以在最後就是請教我們的教授你在問卷中也多次強調選舉制度的核心不在政治操作的便利而在憲法持續的穩定以及人民參政權是否能被實質保障在這樣子的一個關鍵問題你是否未來擔任中選會的委員在面對高度的政治爭議"},{"start":576.88,"end":596.669,"text":"或跨部會法律的見解的分支時你將如何具體拿捏中選會作為獨立機關的分機確保制度解釋回到法律明定性與憲政的原則真正守住民主制度與人民參政權的長期保障是 報告委員那個超越黨派"},{"start":604.617,"end":617.186,"text":"依法行政公正公開 以上報告好 太好了 謝謝希望未來就是要看你要讓我們的國家正常運轉讓保障我們的人民 謝謝謝謝委員 謝謝主席"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}