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主委我們去年河安會第13次的委員會議有沒有討論游離輻射防護法"},{"start":26.633,"end":47.412,"text":"的修法有沒有這個討論或是有同仁可以來協助有齁那我為什麼這麼關注因為我在2024年齁當時的在也是教文會的預算提案的時候呢當時我就有提案要敦促河岸會可以盡速來完成修法那為什麼呢因為事實上你們去年這個討論是遲來的討論我們回顧一下這個修法歷程的討論"},{"start":52.757,"end":56.101,"text":"因為我們游離輻射防護法這個事實上是你們專業的科技法規嘛但是也是攸關人民健康安全的民生法規因為它的這個應用相當的廣泛包括了工業應用我們放射診斷放射治療等等其實跟民眾的健康都是息息相關的例如說我們就醫時候我們照X光我們的癌症治療我們海關檢查"},{"start":75.14,"end":92.562,"text":"這些都跟我們這一個游離服飾防護法是有所相關但是呢我們現在這個立法是在2002年的時候就立了到今天一次都沒有修過但是國際的標準有沒有改變已經改變了那何安惠能不能說明一下這個我們之前修法的討論是如何"},{"start":96.348,"end":106.655,"text":"報告委員確實我們在主改前也就是202年那時候我們有提出給行政院來進行那個服方法的一個草案的一個審議那也有審了不過因為後來我們那個園人會已經改組成和安會"},{"start":112.119,"end":116.821,"text":"所以我們後續又依照我們的一個和安會的一個組織架構以及在立院有委員的一些提案的一個一個建議的一個內容我們重新的來去做一個內容的一個審視那也通過了我們那個和安會的一個委員會議全體委員的一個一個同意我們就後續就經過那個行政院的一些性評還有一些人權的一個評估之後我們已經在"},{"start":140.229,"end":167.845,"text":"3月的又那個今年的3月我們送給行政院發函給行政院來再一次進行審議好因為我們現行法規是配合的是國際放射防護委員會1991年的規範2007年其實就已經有新的規範產生了所以我知道你們2002年這本來已經有修法草案了嘛好那麼現在你們現在這個修法版本已經抱怨了對不對好我們希望說今年啦"},{"start":168.505,"end":190.52,"text":"今年能夠來送到立法院來審議希望這個法規的這個修法其實已經是延遲了可以盡快來完成這部分我會持續的跟核安會來追蹤那接下來呢也是有關游離輻射相關的問題那我請這個核安會請劉柏慶國務院還有這個經濟部也一起上台是我們經濟部"},{"start":193.207,"end":213.122,"text":"標準檢驗局我們有一個國家有離輻射標準的建立那我們當時是委託了也就是我們現在的國園院我們成立一個國家有離輻射標準實驗室那麼我看了一下就是我們去年12月的時候我們也有開這個諮詢會議那就到我們這個"},{"start":214.943,"end":243.903,"text":"游离辐射的这个标准实验室的现场其实到现场来开会那我愿意针对我们的设备有一些讨论例如说其中之一就是我们的设备许多好像都相当的老旧就将近20年甚至20年以上甚至有一些都是已经在使用上面已经不是很符合我们现在的需求了那这个部分核安会能不能说明一下有没有掌握我们这个实验室的设备老旧"},{"start":244.443,"end":270.355,"text":"的問題是國營院做說明好國家游離標準實驗室事實上他第一次成立的時候是民國90年剛開始的時候就經濟部標檢局補助了大概2500萬那可是到今年今年的預算就下降大概只剩下三成920萬然後對於我們一些原來一些幾個重要的設施"},{"start":271.656,"end":291.633,"text":"比方說已經用了18年的校正這個X光機的電腦斷層校正的這個設備還有低能量X光機的校正設備還有孤60的這個校正設備都分別是18年到25年所需要的更換的設備都遠超過950萬甚至要到1500萬可是長期以來都沒辦法把這些老舊的設備汰換掉"},{"start":298.439,"end":324.997,"text":"那最後一項是河安會有建議這個比較迫切所以也撥補了額外撥補了我們一千五百萬就依據今年要完成這個社員的更新所以這個實驗室我想一直長期來都是國家重要的一個基礎設施之一兼顧國家良策體系的關鍵角色希望對民眾的生活這個施政的目標等等希望能夠委員繼續支持"},{"start":329.2,"end":347.115,"text":"我看一下你們那個中能量X光機甚至都使用時數都已經超過原廠建議值了然後你那個低能量X光機這個說超過25年然後呢一直在故障這個剛剛講這個低能量X光機像這個一台大概多少錢如果買新的話新機的話要1000萬"},{"start":351.508,"end":359.452,"text":"一千萬也不是一個很大的預算所以說我們國家沒有這麼窮這個是我們國家的實驗室也標準也就這三個而已所以說請這個河岸會國務院你們要去盤點你們這個設備不要讓那個委員來提醒我們確實我們有所需求要去更新的這個計畫因為是由經濟部來委辦"},{"start":375.598,"end":389.625,"text":"所以你的預算是由經濟部來編列是不是你們把這個需求提出來我們跟經濟部也來討論真的有需求的預算上面允許的我們是不是趕快來給他汰換更新呢這個部分的這個經費除了經濟部委辦的這個900萬之外那和安會也編列了差不多1500萬的"},{"start":402.288,"end":410.317,"text":"來去維持這個實驗室的運作那委員的指教的問題我們會跟何安慧對呀 因為一千五百萬你光是一台機器就不夠啦這個何況你還要營運這個請你們一起來共同討論好不好好 謝謝那接下來呢 這個市長請回國人院請回 這個"},{"start":419.147,"end":427.112,"text":"主委我要請教的是我們核電廠不管是不是要繼續運轉核廢料問題還是都要處理所以乾除設施的進度大家都很關心尤其是我們的核二廠因為核二廠的乾除設施開始試運轉了沒有什麼時候可以用"},{"start":439.989,"end":467.73,"text":"報告委員核二廠我們在今年的3月6號核准台電公司核二廠幹除的試運轉計畫那台電公司在3月16號開始進行試運轉開始試運轉那他如果要正式運轉的話還要通過什麼程序後續試運轉完成後台電公司依法要提出運轉執照申請那依據核一廠的經驗我們大概審查時間是4個月"},{"start":469.151,"end":482.045,"text":"對 到時候還是要經過審查嘛是對不對因為我們看了一下合一廠的像一號機你那個從開始移乾除好了之後從開始移燃料棒第一個是2024年10月到移完2025年8月有將近10個月的時間這是一號機而已還有二號機"},{"start":488.371,"end":505.504,"text":"那我們核二廠現在乾除為什麼那麼重要因為我看了經濟部跟台電的報告因為接下來他要來送你審這個有沒有要再營運再運轉的這個計畫當中要自主安全檢查嘛對不對但是核二廠的狀況是他要做自主安全檢查他必須要乾除先好"},{"start":506.445,"end":519.449,"text":"他的這個燃料棒要先從反應爐先移出來才能夠檢查是不是這個誰可以說明一下所以你這個乾除如果沒有好的話你連自主檢查都沒辦法檢查沒有檢查就不可能送給核安會這個誰能夠說明一下這個核二廠有關於乾除進度跟我們自主檢查"},{"start":526.78,"end":546.698,"text":"委員講的正確因為自主安全檢查最重要實際上就是我之前講的大概就是反應爐那一塊那一塊現在目前來講每一部機大概有624副燃料都在裡面所以必須要乾除完成以後才能夠去把反應爐內的用過燃料移出來以後才能去做所謂的自主安全檢查"},{"start":548.261,"end":557.687,"text":"檢測了這一塊所以呢這個核二廠的乾除的進度因為前面其實跟地方政府也有溝通上面的問題延長了許久所以接下來這個部分我想我們每一個環節我們都要非常的審慎非常的謹慎然後都不能的去疏忽安全還是我們最重要的考量是當然好謝謝台電好謝謝這個核安會謝謝"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"吳委員沛憶","start":"2026-03-18T11:06:13+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-18T11:06:14+08:00","text":"謝謝主席。","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳委員沛憶","start":"2026-03-18T11:06:14+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-18T11:06:15+08:00","text":"我請核安會。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-03-18T11:06:13.369000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:06:13.730000+08:00","text":"核安會主委請上臺。","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"吳委員沛憶","start":"2026-03-18T11:06:13.770000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:06:21.997000+08:00","text":"主委好。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳主任委員明真","start":"2026-03-18T11:06:21.997000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-18T11:06:22.997000+08:00","text":"委員好。","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳委員沛憶","start":"2026-03-18T11:06:22.177000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:06:40.934000+08:00","text":"主委，去年核安會第13次委員會議有沒有討論游離輻射防護法的修法？有。","quality":0.966},{"speaker":"吳委員沛憶","start":"2026-03-18T11:06:46.579000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:06:59.071000+08:00","text":"我為什麼這麼關注，因為我在2024年，也就是在教育委員會的預算提案中，我有提案敦促核安會儘速完成修法，為什麼呢？","quality":0.787},{"speaker":"吳委員沛憶","start":"2026-03-18T11:06:59.411000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:07:41.016000+08:00","text":"因為事實上你們去年的這個討論是個遲來的討論，我們回顧一下這個修法的討論、歷程，游離輻射防護法事實上是你們專業的科技法規，但也是攸關人民健康、安全的民生法規，因為他的應用相當廣泛，包括了工業應用、放射診斷、放射治療等等，其實跟民眾的健康都是息息相關的，例如說就醫時候會照X光、癌症治療、海關的檢查，這些都跟游離輻射防護法是有所相關的，而這個法是在2002年的時候立法，到今天一次都沒有修過，但是國際的標準有沒有改變？","quality":0.935},{"speaker":"吳委員沛憶","start":"2026-03-18T11:07:41.016000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:07:45.542000+08:00","text":"已經改變了，核安會能不能說明一下之前修法的討論是如何？","quality":0.92},{"speaker":"張組長淑君","start":"2026-03-18T11:07:49.348000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:07:58.435000+08:00","text":"報告委員，確實我們在組改前，也就是2022年，那時候我們有提給行政院來進行輻防法草案的審議，後來也有審了。","quality":0.886},{"speaker":"張組長淑君","start":"2026-03-18T11:07:58.475000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:08:40.693000+08:00","text":"不過因為後來原能會已經改組成核安會，所以我們後續又依照核安會的組織架構以及立院委員提案建議的內容，我們重新就內容來做一個審視，也經過我們核安會委員會議全體委員的同意，後續就經過行政院的性平還有人權的評估之後，我們已經在今年3月發函給行政院，再一次進行審議。","quality":0.917},{"speaker":"吳委員沛憶","start":"2026-03-18T11:08:40.693000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:08:50.579000+08:00","text":"好，因為我們現行法規配合的是國際放射防護委員會1991年的規範，2007年他們其實就已經有新的規範產生了。","quality":0.952},{"speaker":"吳委員沛憶","start":"2026-03-18T11:08:51.099000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:08:59.344000+08:00","text":"我知道你們2022年本來已經有修法草案了，現在你們的修法版本已經報院了，對不對？對。","quality":0.882},{"speaker":"吳委員沛憶","start":"2026-03-18T11:08:59.524000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:09:12.472000+08:00","text":"我們希望今年能夠送到立法院來審議，其實這個法規的修法已經是延遲的，希望可以儘快來完成，這部分我也會持續跟核安會追蹤。","quality":0.87},{"speaker":"吳委員沛憶","start":"2026-03-18T11:09:12.653000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:09:49.745000+08:00","text":"接下來也是與游離輻射有關的問題，我請核安會、國原院還有經濟部也一起上臺，經濟部標準檢驗局有一個國家游離輻射標準的建立，我們當時是委託了現在的國原院，成立一個國家游離輻射標準實驗室，我看了一下，去年12月的時候，我們也有開諮詢會議，是到我們游離輻射的標準實驗室現場，到現場來開會。","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"吳委員沛憶","start":"2026-03-18T11:09:49.765000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:10:18.604000+08:00","text":"委員針對相關的設備有一些討論，其中之一就是許多設備好像相當的老舊，用了將近20年或20年以上，甚至有一些在使用上面都已經不是很符合我們現在的需求了，就這個部分請核安會說明一下你們有沒有掌握實驗室設備老舊的這個問題？","quality":0.592},{"speaker":"高院長梓木","start":"2026-03-18T11:10:18.604000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:10:20.985000+08:00","text":"是，國原院做說明。好。","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"高院長梓木","start":"2026-03-18T11:10:22.065000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:11:04.613000+08:00","text":"事實上，國家游離標準實驗室第一次成立是在民國90年，剛開始經濟部標檢局補助了大概2,500萬，可是今年的預算下降到只剩3成，大概920萬，然後我們原來有幾個重要的設施，比方說電腦斷層掃描儀的校正設備、低能量X光機的校正設備還有鈷─60的校正設備，都分別已經用了18年到25年，需要更換設備的金額遠超過950 萬，甚至高達1,500萬，可是長期以來都沒辦法把這些老舊的設備汰換掉。","quality":0.83},{"speaker":"高院長梓木","start":"2026-03-18T11:11:12.180000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:11:23.627000+08:00","text":"最後一項是鈷─60的校正設備，核安會有鑑於這個部分比較迫切，所以也額外撥補了我們1,500萬，預計今年要完成這個射源的更新。","quality":0.673},{"speaker":"高院長梓木","start":"2026-03-18T11:11:25.408000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:11:37.977000+08:00","text":"我想這個實驗室長期以來一直都是國家重要的基礎設施之一，肩負國家量測體系的關鍵角色，關係到民眾的生活、施政的目標等等，希望委員能夠繼續支持，讓我們有合理的預算。","quality":0.671},{"speaker":"吳委員沛憶","start":"2026-03-18T11:11:42.200000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:11:59.354000+08:00","text":"我看了一下你們那個中能量X光機的使用時數甚至都已經超過原廠建議值，而且你們的低能量X光機超過25年，然後一直在故障，新的低能量X光機一臺大概多少錢？","quality":0.853},{"speaker":"高院長梓木","start":"2026-03-18T11:11:59.775000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:12:00.115000+08:00","text":"新機要1,000萬元。","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"吳委員沛憶","start":"2026-03-18T11:12:05.409000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:12:09.290000+08:00","text":"1,000萬也不是一筆很大的預算，我們國家沒有這麼窮，這個是我們國家的實驗室，標準也就這三個而已嘛！","quality":0.929},{"speaker":"吳委員沛憶","start":"2026-03-18T11:12:09.310000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:12:12.452000+08:00","text":"所以請核安會、國原院去盤點你們的設備，不要讓委員來提醒你們，你們確實有更新的需求，這個計畫是由經濟部來委辦，對不對？","quality":0.769},{"speaker":"吳委員沛憶","start":"2026-03-18T11:12:28.598000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:12:41.305000+08:00","text":"所以你們的預算是由經濟部來逐年編列，你們是不是把這個需求提出來跟經濟部討論，對於真的有需求、預算上面允許的，是不是趕快來汰換更新呢？","quality":0.885},{"speaker":"高院長梓木","start":"2026-03-18T11:12:41.305000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-18T11:12:42.305000+08:00","text":"謝謝委員的支持。","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳委員沛憶","start":"2026-03-18T11:12:42.305000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-18T11:12:43.305000+08:00","text":"請次長說明。","quality":0},{"speaker":"賴次長建信","start":"2026-03-18T11:12:41.425000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:12:59.853000+08:00","text":"這個部分的經費除了經濟部委辦的900萬之外，核安會也編列了差不多1,500萬的額度來維持這個實驗室的運作，對委員所指教的問題，我們會跟核安會來討論……對啊！","quality":0.815},{"speaker":"吳委員沛憶","start":"2026-03-18T11:12:59.993000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:13:02.336000+08:00","text":"因為只有1,500萬，光是一臺機器就不夠了，何況還要營運，所以請你們一起來共同討論，好不好？","quality":0.838},{"speaker":"吳委員沛憶","start":"2026-03-18T11:13:02.556000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:13:03.297000+08:00","text":"謝謝，次長請回，國原院院長請回。","quality":0.692},{"speaker":"吳委員沛憶","start":"2026-03-18T11:13:12.147000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:13:19.911000+08:00","text":"主委，我接下來要請教你，我們的核電廠不管是不是要繼續運轉，核廢料問題還是都要處理，所以對乾貯設施的進度大家都很關心，尤其是我們的核二廠，核二廠的乾貯設施開始試運轉了沒有？","quality":0.897},{"speaker":"吳委員沛憶","start":"2026-03-18T11:13:19.931000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:13:20.092000+08:00","text":"什麼時候可以用？","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳組長文泉","start":"2026-03-18T11:13:32.989000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:13:45.619000+08:00","text":"報告委員，我們在今年3月6號核准台電公司核二廠乾貯設施的試運轉計畫，台電公司在3月16號開始進行試運轉。","quality":0.864},{"speaker":"吳委員沛憶","start":"2026-03-18T11:13:45.619000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:13:48.321000+08:00","text":"開始試運轉了？對。","quality":0.714},{"speaker":"吳委員沛憶","start":"2026-03-18T11:13:48.741000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:13:51.063000+08:00","text":"如果要正式運轉的話，還要通過什麼程序？","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳組長文泉","start":"2026-03-18T11:13:53.425000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:14:00.710000+08:00","text":"在試運轉完成後，後續台電公司依法要提出運轉執照申請，依據核一廠的經驗，我們大概審查的時間是4個月。","quality":0.886},{"speaker":"吳委員沛憶","start":"2026-03-18T11:14:02.151000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:14:04.774000+08:00","text":"到時候還是要經過審查，對不對？是。","quality":0.929},{"speaker":"吳委員沛憶","start":"2026-03-18T11:14:04.894000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:14:15.045000+08:00","text":"我們看了一下核一廠一號機的乾貯，開始移燃料棒第一個是在2024年10月，到2025年8月移完，有將近10個月的時間，這是一號機而已，還有二號機。","quality":0.887},{"speaker":"吳委員沛憶","start":"2026-03-18T11:14:21.511000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:14:23.393000+08:00","text":"我們核二廠現在乾貯為什麼那麼重要？","quality":0.938},{"speaker":"吳委員沛憶","start":"2026-03-18T11:14:23.933000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:14:33.340000+08:00","text":"我看了經濟部跟台電的報告，因為接下來要送審有沒有要再運轉的計畫，在這個計畫當中說要自主安全檢查，對不對？是。","quality":0.878},{"speaker":"吳委員沛憶","start":"2026-03-18T11:14:33.340000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:14:44.087000+08:00","text":"但是核二廠的狀況是要做自主安全檢查就必須要乾貯先做好，要先把燃燒棒從反應爐移出來才能夠檢查，是不是？","quality":0.851},{"speaker":"吳委員沛憶","start":"2026-03-18T11:14:44.587000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:14:45.167000+08:00","text":"誰可以說明一下？","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員沛憶","start":"2026-03-18T11:14:46.407000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:14:52.429000+08:00","text":"這個乾貯如果還沒有好的話，連要自主檢查都沒辦法檢查，沒有檢查就不可能送給核安會，誰能夠說明核二廠乾貯進度跟自主檢查的關係？","quality":0.877},{"speaker":"許副總經理永輝","start":"2026-03-18T11:14:59.780000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:15:22.602000+08:00","text":"委員講的正確，因為自主安全檢查最重要的實際上就是像我之前講的，大概就是反應爐那一塊，那一塊以目前來講，每一部機大概有624束燃料都在裡面，所以必須要乾貯完成以後，才能夠把反應爐內用過的燃料移出來，然後才能去做所謂的自主安全檢查，就是檢測的這一塊。","quality":0.91},{"speaker":"吳委員沛憶","start":"2026-03-18T11:15:23.603000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:15:30.427000+08:00","text":"是，關於核二廠乾貯的進度，因為之前其實跟地方政府也有溝通上面的問題，所以延宕了許久，接下來對於這個部分，我想我們對每一個環節都要非常的審慎、謹慎，然後都不能疏忽，安全還是我們最重要的考量。","quality":0.871},{"speaker":"許副總經理永輝","start":"2026-03-18T11:15:30.447000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T11:15:30.507000+08:00","text":"是，當然。","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員沛憶","start":"2026-03-18T11:15:31.007000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-18T11:15:33.578429+08:00","text":"謝謝台電，謝謝核安會。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-03-18T11:15:33.878429+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-18T11:15:37.592714+08:00","text":"好，謝謝吳沛憶委員，請官員回座。","quality":0.231},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-03-18T11:15:37.892714+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-18T11:15:41.321286+08:00","text":"接下來有請萬美玲委員質詢。","quality":0}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}