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請留書兵稍等一下 有PPT要放上去不然我們就先請國發會的葉主委請國發會葉主委 經濟部何市長"},{"start":38.851,"end":40.634,"text":"兩位好 產創條例的推動是為了要加速產業發展現行條例當中 民定行政院要設置國發基金來用這筆錢來投資民營事業來幫助發展"},{"start":54.835,"end":59.916,"text":"那國發基金用的是納稅人的錢那在投資企業 結果我們看到它現在的投資的狀況虧損的加速從民國108年到111年還包括我們現在看到的113年的資料呈現出來虧損的加速比獲利的加速還多虧損加速達到50%以上當中這些企業裡面不只虧損還不夠誠信曾經也出現過像聯合再生這樣的一個企業它得標之後卻"},{"start":83.702,"end":87.586,"text":"違約出售套利了2.63億就是一個違法的這件亂象就表示我們現行的依照行政院有國家發展基金收支保管及運用辦法成立的國發基金管理會它的運作是鬆散的然後傳出多次開會都沒有"},{"start":100.802,"end":125.924,"text":"人數不足 決策品質不佳 才會出現到這麼多情形這條的行政規則根本沒有辦法去守住所以我們民眾黨當然有提出來的29條跟30條的這樣的一個修訂我們主張的大家看到是國發會和國發基金的主管的管理機關要設置基金管理會也包括投資審議委員會包括做這樣的相關的審理等等的包括了這些項目等等的 請問"},{"start":127.545,"end":146.827,"text":"包括還這個學者專家要立法院同意那旋轉門條款像建制加嚴等等的那限制用途這邊我們也蠻要先說一個部分因為你們在你們剛才報告當中有提到這個限制的條款當中涉及到說屬於不得投資項目裡面我們其實看到是大家都一直在講到的是"},{"start":147.648,"end":165.744,"text":"對於所以不能作為企業的紓困然後也不能作為說是投資他的主要的營業項目是在中國大陸還有過去三年曾經違反到這些相關規定的這些看法等等的請李主委您回覆一下在這邊回應那個委員就是說我們國發基金從來不幫企業做紓困"},{"start":166.385,"end":177.309,"text":"我們只做投資所以這一點跟那個事實上有很大的一個差異第二個就是說假如說我們規定說只限定不能投資中國的話我覺得從業界那邊反應過來的話其實"},{"start":180.404,"end":185.867,"text":"主要項目 主要項目 同時也在限制限制企業的那一個投資的規定但這個部分來講的話其實並不是那麼適合那麼硬性的規定但我們會在整個審議的過程當中在整個審議過程當中去考量這個部分那就委員提到的那一個"},{"start":197.553,"end":215.528,"text":"選者們條款呢經濟措施這部分我們在大院通過在那個調查委員會之後的話我們其實有採行大概九大的那個進進措施啦所以比如包括說勝選投資標的還有強化審議品質以及優化投資協議書還有修正投資事業管理分類以及增加風險預顯指標那定期檢討轉投資事業營運的狀況那透過董事會與活動會強化投資管理"},{"start":227.097,"end":234.986,"text":"以及爭取設立投後管理專責部門以及精進退場機制這部分我們看到了我想要再問主委喔因為你在用這個報告當中對於人事的部分旋轉門條款您特別提到是用的是就"},{"start":242.154,"end":261.103,"text":"公務人員服務法當中的一些含釋啊你知道含釋的意義是怎麼樣因為要求一致性可是含釋是在整個行政命令規則當中是最低層次的我們如果這次能夠修法可以把他所謂的這旋轉門條讓他不要去跟照跟這樣的一個運作董建市的運作能夠是一個適用的人適合的人權的話那這個就會沒問題因為這部分其實要確定到法規上面的意義啊第一個就是說國發基金"},{"start":266.345,"end":285.521,"text":"也是一個非營業特種基金那我們國內有很多非營業特種基金那假如說只針對國發基金做這樣的一個限制的話其實就整個普遍性以及一致性來講的話其實不是相當於合理啦所以這表示你們全部都應該一起修訂以法為重 這才是重點"},{"start":285.981,"end":308.953,"text":"因為第一個就是說像比如說剛剛委員有提到那個投資審議委員會這邊的話修正的版本要求就是說三分之二初期三分之二的同意但可能委員要去思考一下就是說這麼硬性的要求參與的人數以及同意的比例的話是不是反過來在想說是不是讓一些初期的委員一兩個委員有否決權"},{"start":310.083,"end":325.395,"text":"那這個部分來講的話可能必須要去考慮考慮就是說假如說今天只有一兩位委員反對的話那是不是這個案子就整個就翻盤掉了不管說是不是有七八位委員同意所以這個部分來講的話就整個機制設計這個部分的話我會建議委員就是說不見得就是說把那個修得越來越嚴的話其實是有利於整個案件的一個審查啦"},{"start":336.244,"end":342.409,"text":"也就是說我們在房地跟經濟中間可能要取得一個橫頻的一個角色等一下 那我們就可以到深圳法律審查的時候再說那最後有一個問題要請教的是經濟部市長關於是在這個22條當中有些修法的部分因為跟67之3條嘛它並沒有就是因為沒有公佈因為是現在還沒有公佈吧那沒有實施生效對不對葉市長 何市長"},{"start":363.247,"end":386.362,"text":"還沒還沒是還沒對那你們為什麼跳票了那大家最重要是因為經濟部的這邊涉及到了22條的是涉及到我們國安的這個技術要涉及到所謂經濟不利的條件那這些兩個因素裡面的最重要的是他沒有生效就沒辦法規範尤其是經濟部所提到這個關於我們這樣關鍵的核心技術國家核心關鍵技術呢是在你們提出來的是N-1可是國"},{"start":389.063,"end":412.912,"text":"國科會是說出來的是N-2這樣的條件那請問一下你們再用經濟部的立場來說一下不然維持的是N-1還是N-2請說一下我們政府的立場跟委員報告好了我們這個在現有的那個產量條例裡面針對那個這個審查的機制本來就已經有了那剛委員講到N-1 N-2那個只是針對大陸"},{"start":415.293,"end":430.166,"text":"我們到大陸去投資的話所以我們沒有對美國設防我們還是有這樣的一個審查機制當然我們的審查機制是從整個國家的安全還有整個技術的是不是會造成產業的一個競爭力的影響"},{"start":432.908,"end":446.755,"text":"整體的一個部分我們會去做審查所以你才是沒有辦法肯定說對美國部分這個對中國對美國是沒有設限我們是最先進會留在台灣那現在最先進是多少技術呢是多少奈米呢"},{"start":448.109,"end":473.181,"text":"現在美國是4奈米跟3奈米那我們台灣已經是2奈米好 劉委員 歡迎時間到等一下 我就最後一句話因為已經確定是美國明年2027年就要施加2量米的好 謝謝好 這部分呢 之後的問題呢也許我們就用書面的方式呈現那就謝謝各位我們要知道要保護住台灣的一個經濟上面的一個國家的核心技術關鍵是非常重要的而且民國它的技術一定要調味一定要明確好 謝謝謝謝委員好 請先回座"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:27:06.238000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:27:06.498000+08:00","text":"先請國發會的葉主委……","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-03-19T09:27:06.678000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:27:06.698000+08:00","text":"請國發會葉主委。","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:27:06.698000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-19T09:27:07.698000+08:00","text":"還有經濟部次長。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-03-19T09:27:06.718000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:27:07.799000+08:00","text":"請經濟部何次長。","quality":0.714},{"speaker":"葉主任委員俊顯","start":"2026-03-19T09:27:07.799000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-19T09:27:15.825000+08:00","text":"委員好。","quality":0},{"speaker":"何次長晉滄","start":"2026-03-19T09:27:15.825000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-19T09:27:23.851000+08:00","text":"委員好。","quality":0},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:27:23.851000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:27:24.051000+08:00","text":"兩位好。","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:27:24.071000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:27:25.614000+08:00","text":"產創條例的推動是為了要加速產業發展，現行條例當中明定行政院要設置國發基金，用這筆錢來投資民營事業，幫助其發展。","quality":0.961},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:27:40.315000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:28:10.023000+08:00","text":"國發基金用的是納稅人的錢，它在投資企業，結果我們看到它現在的投資狀況，從民國108年到111年，還包括我們現在看到的113年的資料，呈現出來虧損的家數比獲利的家數還多，虧損的家數達到50%以上，這些企業裡面有的不只虧損，還不夠誠信，曾經出現過像聯合再生這樣一個企業，他得標之後卻違約出售，套利了2.63億，這是違法的。","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:28:10.043000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:28:28.885000+08:00","text":"這些亂象就表示我們依照現行行政院國家發展基金收支保管及運用辦法成立的國發基金管理會的運作是鬆散的，它傳出多次開會都人數不足，決策品質不佳，才會出現這麼多情形。","quality":0.947},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:28:29.986000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:28:37.212000+08:00","text":"這條行政規則根本沒有辦法去守住，所以民眾黨有提出來第二十九條及第三十條的修訂。","quality":0.784},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:28:37.212000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:29:01.135000+08:00","text":"大家看到，我們主張的是國發會為國發基金的管理機關，要設置基金管理會，也包括投資審議委員會，要做相關的審理等等的，包括這些項目等等的，包括學者專家要由立法院同意，還有旋轉門條款限制加嚴等等的，至於限制用途，我們要先說一個部分。","quality":0.882},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:29:01.696000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:29:22.257000+08:00","text":"因為你們在剛才的報告當中有提到，這個限制條款當中涉及到不得投資項目，我們看到大家都一直在講到的是不能做為企業的紓困，也不能投資主要營業項目在中國大陸的企業，還有過去三年內曾經違反到這些相關規定的。","quality":0.935},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:29:22.717000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:29:25.260000+08:00","text":"對於這些看法等等的，請葉主委回復一下。","quality":0.765},{"speaker":"葉主任委員俊顯","start":"2026-03-19T09:29:25.860000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:29:35.707000+08:00","text":"在這邊回應委員，我們國發基金從來不幫企業做紓困，我們只做投資，所以這一點跟事實上有很大的差異……","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:29:35.707000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:29:37.127000+08:00","text":"沒有，第二個是重點，中國……","quality":0.4},{"speaker":"葉主任委員俊顯","start":"2026-03-19T09:29:37.547000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:29:42.309000+08:00","text":"第二個，假如我們規定只限定不能投資中國的話，從業界那一邊反映過來的，其實……","quality":0.848},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:29:45.464000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:29:45.784000+08:00","text":"主要項目。","quality":1},{"speaker":"葉主任委員俊顯","start":"2026-03-19T09:29:45.804000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:29:50.607000+08:00","text":"同時也在限制企業的投資規定，這個部分並不適合那麼硬性的規定，但我們會在整個審議過程當中去考量這個部分。","quality":1},{"speaker":"葉主任委員俊顯","start":"2026-03-19T09:29:50.727000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:29:50.787000+08:00","text":"至於委員提到的……","quality":0.714},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:30:02.954000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:30:03.134000+08:00","text":"旋轉門條款呢？","quality":0.5},{"speaker":"葉主任委員俊顯","start":"2026-03-19T09:30:04.435000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:30:36.562000+08:00","text":"精進措施這一部分，在大院的調查委員會之後，我們其實有採行九大精進措施，包括慎選投資標的、強化審議品質，以及優化投資協議書，還有修正投資事業管理分類，以及增建風險預警指標、定期檢討轉投資事業營運狀況、透過董事會與股東會強化投後管理，以及爭取設立投後管理專責部門、精進退場機制適時停損……","quality":0.884},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:30:36.923000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:30:37.563000+08:00","text":"這個部分我們都看到了。","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:30:37.663000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:30:50.676000+08:00","text":"我想要再問主委，因為在您這個報告當中，對於人事部分的旋轉門條款，您特別提到就公務員服務法當中的函釋，你知道函釋的意義是怎麼樣？","quality":0.931},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:30:50.676000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:31:05.803000+08:00","text":"因為要求一致性，可是函釋在整個行政命令規則當中是最低層次的，如果我們這次能夠修法，把所謂的旋轉門條款限制加嚴，讓董監事的運作能夠有適合的人選的話，這個就會沒問題，這個部分請確定法規上面的意義啊！","quality":0.844},{"speaker":"葉主任委員俊顯","start":"2026-03-19T09:31:05.823000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:31:26.017000+08:00","text":"第一個就是國發基金也是一個非營業特種基金，國內有很多非營業特種基金，假如只針對國發基金做這樣的限制的話，就整個普遍性以及一致性來講，其實不是相當的合理。","quality":0.986},{"speaker":"葉主任委員俊顯","start":"2026-03-19T09:31:26.017000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-19T09:31:27.017000+08:00","text":"另外一個就是……","quality":0},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:31:26.718000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:31:30.521000+08:00","text":"沒有、沒有，所以這表示你們應該全部都一起修訂，以法為重，這才是重點。","quality":0.793},{"speaker":"葉主任委員俊顯","start":"2026-03-19T09:31:33.262000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:31:53.953000+08:00","text":"譬如剛剛委員有提到投資審議委員會，修正的版本要求三分之二出席，三分之二同意，但可能委員要去思考一下，這麼硬性要求參與的人數，以及同意的比例的話，反過來想，是不是讓出席委員當中的一、兩個委員有否決權？","quality":0.911},{"speaker":"葉主任委員俊顯","start":"2026-03-19T09:31:55.443000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:32:03.490000+08:00","text":"這個部分可能必須要去考慮，假如今天只有一、兩位委員反對的話，是不是這個案子就整個翻盤掉了？","quality":1},{"speaker":"葉主任委員俊顯","start":"2026-03-19T09:32:03.810000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:32:06.472000+08:00","text":"不管是不是有七、八位委員同意，所以這個部分……","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:32:06.472000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-19T09:32:07.472000+08:00","text":"好，我跟你講，葉主委，我想很重要的部分……","quality":0.125},{"speaker":"葉主任委員俊顯","start":"2026-03-19T09:32:07.433000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:32:08.974000+08:00","text":"就整個機制設計，我會建議委員……","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:32:08.974000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-19T09:32:09.974000+08:00","text":"這個我們到法案審查的時候再討論，我們只是提出民眾黨版本很重要的部分……","quality":0.031},{"speaker":"葉主任委員俊顯","start":"2026-03-19T09:32:09.154000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:32:10.255000+08:00","text":"不見得把那個修得越來越嚴就是有利於整個案件的審查……","quality":0.958},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:32:10.255000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-19T09:32:21.244000+08:00","text":"好，我們現在是交換意見，我的時間就快到了……","quality":0},{"speaker":"葉主任委員俊顯","start":"2026-03-19T09:32:21.244000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:32:21.725000+08:00","text":"也就是我們在防弊與興利中間可能要取得衡平……","quality":0.65},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:32:22.165000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:32:23.686000+08:00","text":"葉主委，等一下，我們可以到法案審查的時候再說。","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:32:23.846000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:32:27.349000+08:00","text":"最後有一個問題要請教的是經濟部何次長，關於第二十二條以及第六十七條之三當中修法的部分，並沒有公布，事實上，現在還沒有實施生效，對不對？","quality":0.689},{"speaker":"何次長晉滄","start":"2026-03-19T09:32:48.247000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:32:48.247000+08:00","text":"對，還沒生效。","quality":0.4},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:32:48.567000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:32:50.569000+08:00","text":"還沒，那你們為什麼跳票了？","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:32:54.851000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:33:17.064000+08:00","text":"第二十二條的修法是涉及到國安、涉及到所謂經濟不利的條件這兩個因素，最重要的是現在它沒有生效就沒辦法規範，尤其是經濟部所提到的，關於國家核心關鍵技術，你們提出來的是N-1，可是國科會說出來的是N-2這樣的條件。","quality":0.892},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:33:17.965000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:33:26.028000+08:00","text":"你們再用經濟部的立場來說一下，維持的是N-1，還是N-2，請說一下我們政府的立場。","quality":1},{"speaker":"何次長晉滄","start":"2026-03-19T09:33:26.028000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:33:41.734000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，在現有的產創條例裡面，這個審查機制本來就已經有了，至於剛剛委員講到的N-1、N-2，那個只是針對大陸，我們到大陸去投資的話……","quality":0.912},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:33:41.734000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:33:43.075000+08:00","text":"所以我們沒有對美國設防？","quality":1},{"speaker":"何次長晉滄","start":"2026-03-19T09:33:44.417000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:34:00.909000+08:00","text":"我們還是有這樣的審查機制，當然我們的審查機制是從整個國家安全還有整個技術是不是會造成產業競爭力影響整體部分，我們會去做審查，所以剛剛提到……","quality":0.938},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:34:00.949000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:34:06.612000+08:00","text":"所以你還是沒有辦法肯定說……這個N-1、N-2只對中國，對美國是沒有設限的。","quality":0.759},{"speaker":"何次長晉滄","start":"2026-03-19T09:34:07.012000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:34:08.693000+08:00","text":"我們是最先進的會留在臺灣，一定是這樣。","quality":0.647},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:34:08.933000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:34:11.735000+08:00","text":"現在最先進的技術是多少奈米呢？","quality":0.929},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-03-19T09:34:11.735000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-19T09:34:13.109000+08:00","text":"好，發言時間已到。","quality":0},{"speaker":"何次長晉滄","start":"2026-03-19T09:34:13.109000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:34:16.291000+08:00","text":"現在美國是4奈米和3奈米，我們臺灣已經是2奈米了。","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-03-19T09:34:16.371000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:34:17.611000+08:00","text":"好，劉委員，發言時間已到。","quality":0.7},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:34:17.791000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:34:18.592000+08:00","text":"等一下，我最後說完這個。","quality":0.6},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:34:19.172000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:34:23.234000+08:00","text":"因為已經確定的是美國明年（2027年）就要生產2奈米的……","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-03-19T09:34:23.694000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:34:24.274000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝。","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:34:24.274000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:34:27.656000+08:00","text":"好，這個部分之後的問題也許就用書面的方式呈現，謝謝……","quality":0.957},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-03-19T09:34:27.656000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-19T09:34:28.656000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝。","quality":0},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:34:28.416000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:34:37.121000+08:00","text":"我們要知道，保護住臺灣經濟上面的國家核心關鍵技術是非常重要的，而且條文一定要明確。","quality":0.895},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-03-19T09:34:37.121000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:34:37.261000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝。","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-19T09:34:37.261000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-19T09:34:38.261000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝。","quality":0},{"speaker":"何次長晉滄","start":"2026-03-19T09:34:37.261000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:34:37.481000+08:00","text":"謝謝委員。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-03-19T09:34:37.921000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-19T09:34:38.161000+08:00","text":"請先回座。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-03-19T09:34:38.661000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-19T09:35:03.518143+08:00","text":"為了會議進行的順利，並兼顧每位委員發言時間的公平性，避免影響下一位委員質詢的權利，請質詢委員於質詢時間結束之後，應該要停止發言，如果繼續發言，主席會一直站、一直站，一直看、一直看，請各位儘量配合。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-03-19T09:35:03.818143+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-19T09:35:06.961000+08:00","text":"下一位質詢請蔡易餘委員。","quality":0}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}