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11:37:38","會議時間":"2026-03-23T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第5會期外交及國防、財政委員會第1次聯席會議（事由：併案審查：一、行政院函請審議「強化防衛韌性及不對稱戰力計畫採購特別條例草案」案。二、本院台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「保衛國家安全及強化不對稱戰力計畫採購特別條例草案」案。三、本院國民黨黨團擬具「強化國防及對美軍事採購特別條例草案」案。(3月23日、3月25\n日及26日三天一次會)）","transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":0.03096875,"end":2.22471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":2.71409375,"end":3.5578437500000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":9.24471875,"end":9.447218750000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":9.447218750000001,"end":9.98721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":9.98721875,"end":10.814093750000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":11.320343750000003,"end":16.77096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":17.53034375,"end":19.25159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":19.977218750000002,"end":20.73659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":21.46221875,"end":23.824718750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":23.824718750000002,"end":24.145343750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":24.90471875,"end":26.54159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":28.48221875,"end":28.836593750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":29.37659375,"end":34.08471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":33.15659375,"end":33.190343750000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":34.69221875,"end":37.52721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":38.21909375,"end":39.02909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":39.02909375,"end":43.68659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":44.42909375,"end":60.00471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":60.00471875,"end":62.85659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":64.78034375,"end":65.20221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":66.06284375,"end":74.56784375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":74.80409375,"end":86.56596875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":77.14971875,"end":77.79096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":87.30846875,"end":87.81471875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":88.37159375,"end":91.42596875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":91.74659375,"end":95.42534375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":95.88096875000001,"end":99.27284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":99.77909375,"end":100.72409375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":101.33159375000001,"end":104.35221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":105.66846875,"end":106.88346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":108.36846875,"end":120.13034375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":120.80534375,"end":133.98471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":123.38721875,"end":123.55596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":132.78659375,"end":135.40221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":135.58784375000002,"end":136.51596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":137.29221875000002,"end":138.42284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":139.18221875,"end":141.91596875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":142.06784375,"end":143.01284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":143.46846875,"end":146.89409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":147.31596875,"end":154.20096875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":154.84221875,"end":155.82096875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":156.79971875,"end":158.74034375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":158.55471875,"end":160.68096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":161.94659375,"end":162.50346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":162.84096875,"end":163.92096875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":164.54534375,"end":173.80971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":174.24846875,"end":179.46284375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":179.56409375,"end":181.84221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":182.34846875000002,"end":185.03159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":186.09471875,"end":189.19971875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":190.16159375,"end":202.49721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":203.02034375000002,"end":213.31409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":213.87096875,"end":218.00534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":218.68034375000002,"end":225.83534375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":225.95346875,"end":227.33721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":227.96159375000002,"end":253.22346875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":253.84784375,"end":255.07971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":255.31596875000002,"end":257.52659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":258.84284375000004,"end":261.23909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":261.86346875000004,"end":266.18346875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":266.84159375,"end":267.65159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":267.97221875,"end":269.17034375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":269.82846875,"end":273.13596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":273.52409375,"end":275.66721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":276.27471875000003,"end":282.50159375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":282.88971875000004,"end":287.80034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":287.00721875,"end":291.51284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":291.22596875,"end":294.75284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":295.34346875,"end":298.36409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":298.76909375,"end":312.38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民眾黨的第四條都在講這七大項 幾大項那這一些內容行政院版本就寫的是一個比較系統性的名稱國民黨版就部分它寫的是比較項目的名稱就出現了民眾黨版把裡面的金額都具體換算成台幣"},{"start":258.928,"end":272.962,"text":"部長在立法上這三種寫法國防部的寫法到底這樣寫對你們來說有什麼好處或者是彈性跟國人說明一下"},{"start":273.784,"end":293.696,"text":"我想先說明兩點,第一點是國民黨它在第五條裡面,它所列的這個項目我之前已經講過了有一些我們,它雖然智慧國會,可是並不是擺在我們的特別預算裡面沒錯,跟你們原來的第四條的部分是有些不一樣的嘛對對對,那麼它現在主要是講說它"},{"start":295.727,"end":322.643,"text":"將智慧國會的項目列進去但是還沒有智慧國會的部分就沒有列了解那我想這個部分會剛剛已經講了美方應該是沒辦法接受了解這是第一個第二個民眾黨團提的他將所有的那些這個項目跟那個金額都寫上去這個是跟條例還有將預算整個是"},{"start":323.897,"end":344.934,"text":"是混在一起了條例應該是能立預算案的部分呢我們還要等到後續我們預算案提出來那預算案還有可能跟美方在預約的過程當中最後會產生變動那麼變動的話我們就要修這個預算相關的這些書表如果把它列到條例裡面的話"},{"start":347.699,"end":373.79,"text":"隨便一個字一個項目一個金額的變動那我們要送到大院來再來審議然後再來修改然後才能夠去變更這個預算書表我想這個是沒辦法執行的啦最後一個請教一下這個執行的這個條例的期限期間行政院版現在訂的是八年那"},{"start":375.424,"end":396.016,"text":"拉到八年對這個案子來說部長可不可以再跟大家講一下為什麼要拉這樣的一個時間我們相關的這樣子的一個能力的建構不管是軍購案商購案或者是委制案我們都會有一定的一個期程那這些期程呢"},{"start":397.324,"end":422.337,"text":"我們也要考慮到這一個相關的財政紀律跟相關的公共債務法相關的給我們的一些限制那當然我們會跳脫說有關這個年度預算給我們的一些束縛但是我們還是會遵照財政紀律法跟這一個公共債務法有一些總量的一個管制那最重要就是說不管是軍購案、商購案或者是這個委戰它都有交易的趨勢所以軍購案會有一個"},{"start":423.376,"end":432.986,"text":"交運的期程那如果沒辦法在這個期間內完成這個交運將這個條例限縮在很短的時間內那幾乎這個預算這個案項就沒有辦法來執行交運這個"},{"start":439.692,"end":465.103,"text":"比如說海馬仕的82套那同樣無人機的部分我們也希望能夠符合迭代創新所以我們會有一個迭代創新的一個長年期的規劃然後來達到一個預算規模然後來增加國內的產線的能量讓這個整個國防制度能夠提升那這個都是有一個完整的一個配套所以這個8年這個數字也是跟美方討論過的數字"},{"start":467.055,"end":489.233,"text":"我們就美方討論的部分是軍購案的這個部分那麼其他的部分我們當然也會隨時跟美方保持溝通你總是要問他多久做得出來嘛多久怎麼當時做得出來你們去顧問這一個8年交易的期程都有從剛剛講的開始LR和平衡跟LR這個"},{"start":491.124,"end":497.12,"text":"LOA等等這個相關的這個階段就推估出來了我們都有跟他們做綿密的溝通OK 好 謝謝"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}