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打電話到處去陳情說市面上的收購價根本沒有這麼高甚至遠低於這個價格您有聽說嗎"},{"start":317.358,"end":321.603,"text":"我跟瑋瑜說明我們原來掌握的是大蒜的生產面積今年又比較多5547公斤比原來預計的計畫中多了200多公斤多了500公斤"},{"start":334.198,"end":354.551,"text":"我這裡數字是5300多了200 總是有比較多希望這個價格也能夠穩定下來目前大蒜除了產量的問題之外還有一些其他農作上面的狀況所以請問農業部正在就蒜農最大的利益來做思考是不是請部長來說說明"},{"start":355.872,"end":376.457,"text":"我跟委員說明我們在處理大村的時候我們是透過一些一般的盤商或是收購的時候收購的時候如果他用28塊收購的話我們再啟動一些補助用這種方式去穩定我們農民的價錢現在目前雖然說5500多公頃"},{"start":378.698,"end":401.564,"text":"但是因為今年的一些病害的關係導致它也適度的減產所以相對的它產量以五年平均來看還是差不多那有一個非常重要的就是因為從去年的十一二月到今年的三月有一些大蒜的進口那這個進口的量其實我們在監控的時候它是跟往常的量是一樣的"},{"start":402.284,"end":421.182,"text":"但是因為去年的價格是比較好今年農民多種所以我們用28塊去做這樣子一個確保農民收益是適當的我想部長也很專業然後也很關心農民這個我都肯定但是我必須要提醒"},{"start":421.883,"end":427.83,"text":"我想要院長知道一下我們地方的真相我幾樣提醒然後是不是請院長責成農業部盡快的去落實然後去關心為什麼收購價會沒有辦法在28塊以上呢"},{"start":437.6,"end":457.871,"text":"因為農業部發給收購單位的公文裡面開了一個大後門寫著正常品規且價格由雙方依品質議定所以今年因為氣候變遷導致的這個葉蠻病害大蒜普遍它結球就偏小這個部長應該非常的清楚"},{"start":460.072,"end":473.265,"text":"這個農業部這一紙公文等於讓盤商名正言順的以品質不佳來大肆砍價那院長農民甚至很激動的甚至很不開心的"},{"start":475.508,"end":488.527,"text":"來問說新聞都說新聞都說了政府要收28塊為什麼我們賣不到呢是不是政府在騙我們啊他說是政府在騙我們那當然農民會有很激動的這種想法"},{"start":489.688,"end":504.978,"text":"包括說這一次的第一階段總收購量是800萬台金總目標的收購量是1000萬台金這個是在公文裡面寫的那等於每0.1公頃的收購上限是"},{"start":507.76,"end":528.97,"text":"2800台金那這代表什麼呢代表說這一項政策就算發揮到極致最多也能覆蓋357公頃那根據農業部最新的調查今年光雲林縣佔大眾的大蒜面積就高達了5252公頃"},{"start":532.992,"end":558.121,"text":"那等於是說這個收購的總量連雲林的總面積十分之一都不到耶那它能夠產生什麼樣的效果這不就像抽抽樂一樣嘛 抽獎嘛就是有一些農民抽得到有一些農民抽不到那這樣子綜樂透視的一個補助辦法到底真的能夠幫到農民嗎而且資源這麼少之外"},{"start":559.741,"end":587.243,"text":"誰能夠加入評選是由特定的策略聯盟來評選誰能夠加入收購那現在基層的農民也許他沒有受過很高的教育但他也覺得這不合理啊他們強烈的質疑說是不是只有特定對象才賣得掉那這種抽垃圾式的是不是黑箱是不是有什麼特殊的考量院長你覺得這樣公平嗎"},{"start":588.624,"end":610.633,"text":"全國雲林是最大的一個大蒜的生產地雲林的大蒜產業策略聯盟也是一個健全的組織我希望農業部一定要跟這些農企以及農民團體在溝通的過程當中能夠依照我們設定的目標盡最大的能量去處理能夠收購的面積應該要衡量到農民實際上生產的"},{"start":615.835,"end":644.114,"text":"只有十分之一耶我稍微跟委員解釋一下我想委員也非常清楚第一個就是我們政府單位不可能全數去收農民所種的所有的大蒜這第一個所以從過去的經驗就是如果說我從市場抽離十分之一就是說它可以回到市場機制所以我們希望就是九年來我們再度的啟動這種所謂的協助的方式回歸九年嘛對所以我才會說我們用"},{"start":646.156,"end":662.377,"text":"適當的力道去引導那個價格的提升那它中間會有黑箱嗎會有圖利特定的廠商嗎我跟你保證絕對不會有另外那個品質的部分如果有任何案例我可以直接提供給部長可以 絕對可以我已經在他的要求也交代"},{"start":663.118,"end":678.04,"text":"在不同的鄉鎮包括赤鴻、園長、東勢、水林主要的雲林產區我都希望能夠普遍性的去收購我再提醒幾件事情然後再請院長跟部長一起回答好不好"},{"start":678.769,"end":696.394,"text":"我現在覺得比較不合理的是政府農業部明明有編列美台金3元的處理費的補助但這美台金3元的處理費是在這28元之外喔不是補助農民是補助盤商"},{"start":697.854,"end":719.166,"text":"現在農民質疑的就是說受傷害的是我們為什麼政府想要照顧的是盤商呢我就現在想要問啊過去其實曾經農委會也有過案例不管他們成交價多少依品項下去有一些成交比較高有一些成交比較低他就每台金補助兩塊五塊不一定"},{"start":721.887,"end":748.078,"text":"那這個案例就覺得比較合理嘛你是這個錢是直接給農民拿到喔但是我現在不理解的是除了把28塊給這些特定的盤商之外還把3塊錢再給盤商那這樣子的話我就想要問一下那個卓院長您是支持盤商還是支持農民呢"},{"start":749.406,"end":770.767,"text":"盤商應該要幫助農民跟政府一起來幫助農民這才是穩定他的農作的來源也還有一個好的管道這是一個理想所以我的意思是說難道這三塊你不能直接給農民嗎你如果直接給農民的話我大概跟委員講委員就會清楚"},{"start":771.528,"end":797.622,"text":"就是這些盤商去收了以後收了以後如果馬上倒進市場那相對的那個價格是越到越低所以我們希望說這些收購的這些大蒜能夠在延後再釋出那延後過程裡面的這些冷藏的費用我們來協助那它不只是盤商你只要大的專業農或者集團栽培的這些經營主體都可以來申請我們這樣的一個協助"},{"start":798.843,"end":803.961,"text":"甚至還有很多農民質疑他說其實盤商每年都氣說好喜施假"},{"start":805.151,"end":832.592,"text":"他就先把契作的收一收他根本幫助不到散戶也幫助不到小農真正我們需要幫助的農民受不到幫助反而是幫助了盤商先穩定了他這邊有契作的這個我們在規定的時候都特別講到如果說你盤商也是從事大家經營的時候你現在有八家就這個契作的他賣給另外一家這個契作的他賣給另外一家"},{"start":833.68,"end":857.424,"text":"他們就八家聯合互相把契作的收一收外面的一般農民受不到幫助所以我今天是很誠懇的心情也希望說院長一定能夠體恤民情體會這些農民真的很辛苦我去到那田邊阿桑是坐在地上哭你知道嗎所以我他們"},{"start":858.104,"end":881.135,"text":"真的很卑微他們就這三塊你補助盤商你不如直接補助他就有這三塊他就是覺得心裡有一點安慰結果這三塊他們不理解說為什麼還補助盤商呢而且他們一直覺得說那盤商就穩定了他自己的整個企作的部分而已根本幫助不到他們那我另外要講的是這個是有點調節的作用"},{"start":884.436,"end":910.863,"text":"調節的作用能不能發揮他的效果部長要去檢討我們期待他能夠發揮比較好的調節讓市場穩定但是其實除了調節之外你也要考慮到說他們現在的心理大家是反彈的不得了反彈的不得了你等於是只補助了十分之一抽樂透式的搞不好那十分之一都不足盤商本來囤的本來他氣做的"},{"start":911.423,"end":937.185,"text":"所以根本一般的農民是沒有辦法受益的院長我真的是希望你可以請農業部好好的思考一下這個落實一下真的幫助到一般農民其實你去雲林大家看到你那麼開心我們也希望說這一次蒜農的問題就院長可以關心農業部當然他有他的考量他有他的專業但是有時候社會上"},{"start":938.166,"end":960.927,"text":"不是像農業部想的這麼樣理想化的一個狀態我也希望農業部可以納進考量謝謝委員的一些建議那我想我們農糧署的各分署其實也不斷的在跟跟農民跟相關的產地去做這些座談那後續的部分特別是講你什麼時候下來我邀請你下來主持座談你願意來嗎"},{"start":962.088,"end":987.874,"text":"我想只要是對農民能夠做溝通的我都願意下去像針對花生的部分其實我在過年後其實第一時間就下去了花生我也要講一下我先把它講完我先講完就是說我舉例我其實有跟部長建議說這一次的病蟲害應該啟動天然災害現金救助那部長一直覺得說這個是蟲害不可以但是我們回顧2022年初"},{"start":990.875,"end":1011.206,"text":"當初在恆春半島的洋蔥也遭遇了非常嚴重的一個蟲害然後呢 那時候的農委會也非常的體恤農民考慮到這個病害的背後是受連日大雨跟氣候巨變引發的所以它產生了這個行政的彈性給予了農民實質的災損補助"},{"start":1013.587,"end":1032.845,"text":"那這個恆春的屏東的洋蔥的案例你不可能是因為之前的部長是屏東人他就可以然後我們現在的陳部長不是我們雲林人就不可以所以我必須要講這一次的蒜頭病害是因為天氣忽冷忽熱"},{"start":1033.866,"end":1055.345,"text":"我們人都因為忽冷忽熱很容易感冒了更何況是作物那明顯的就是因為極端氣候異常所造成的病蟲害是不是農業部可以考量說比照過往的彈性跟經驗重新評估這一次的氣候跟病蟲害的關聯給雲林農民最及時的實質幫助呢"},{"start":1057.947,"end":1077.183,"text":"我跟委員報告其實我們也做了一些評估那你舉的那些洋蔥的部分那其實天然災害救贖是因為天然災害所引起的一些農作物的損害那如果說這個農作物的損害跟病毒損害之間的關聯性這個我們會考慮那從大專來講他不是我現在你可以不用解釋你講的我都"},{"start":1079.045,"end":1103.678,"text":"我要跟您說明就是當你要用病蟲來啟動天然災害的時候有一個重點就是所有的普遍性都要符合但是相對這次病害是有特定的幾個鄉鎮才發生了這樣的一個問題你就針對這幾個鄉鎮你如果可以針對這幾個鄉鎮我覺得沒話說每一個鄉鎮都有好的農民的管理有的是不好的管理你不可能屏東有"},{"start":1104.719,"end":1113.668,"text":"黨後雲林沒有,我覺得這個是不合理的這兩個是不一樣的我再繼續講,去年我們進口了多少公噸?18000噸那你知道今年1月到3月進口了多少噸嗎?6000多噸6830噸"},{"start":1122.358,"end":1140.865,"text":"那照1公斤27塊的關稅少說也有1億的關稅我現在幫你找裁員這1億的關稅是不是院長可以讓讓他直接給農業部來支持我們這一筆開銷嗎我們算頭的這些關稅繳的很多農業相關的政策我想院長一直很支持"},{"start":1141.545,"end":1165.651,"text":"那相對的收入歸收入,收入就是要腳步那我們需要的話,我們就會跟院裡面去爭取相關的部位那你先不要回答,我沒有要你回答這一句我是希望院長說,既然進口了這麼多的蒜頭然後也繳了非常多的關稅這一筆錢有沒有可能給予農業部幫助讓他們可以幫助更多的農民"},{"start":1167.071,"end":1181.756,"text":"關稅的用途他有必須要繳庫以後我們做一個計畫性的使用我跟委員報告即使沒有這個關稅的進口這筆關稅農業部也應該也必須有其他的策略措施來應用這個天然災害"},{"start":1182.096,"end":1205.085,"text":"所以我還是希望我還是希望院長可以啟動天然災害現金救助幫助農民或者是補助盤商的這三塊錢直接讓農民受益農民直接拿到錢他就安心你補助盤商他就會擔心說哇 你要再給我二個介紹要再賺那三塊說實在喔"},{"start":1206.857,"end":1217.165,"text":"我真的是覺得說這個機制是可以調整的雖然依照這個天然災害救助辦法病蟲害並不屬於天然災害我知道但是過去就有曾經覺得說這個病蟲害是因為極端氣候導致的"},{"start":1224.051,"end":1251.376,"text":"他就有關聯嘛 這個剛才屏東的壓中例子就是了我請農業部迅速再去掌握最正確目前最新的狀況那麼能夠精確的提出一個方式讓農民 大蒜農能夠安心也讓他們的損害能夠得到更多更多的而且我也希望說部長喔就是能夠真的受我的邀請來到雲林縣走一趟來看一下這一點喔 也希望部長可以排出時間"},{"start":1252.456,"end":1267.708,"text":"我想時間許可我們一定會下去我希望你可以放在心上如果你覺得這是一件要事我相信你應該可以下來那另外呢這個台美正式簽署了這個ART但是美國最高法院判決對等關稅"},{"start":1269.409,"end":1284.453,"text":"是非法的所以ART的實際落實情況廣大的農民朋友都非常關心是不是請院長先簡單說一下最新的情況既然美方內部有爭議是不是我們也可以重新審視為台灣為農民爭取更好的空間呢"},{"start":1287.854,"end":1313.989,"text":"我再重申原來我們所簽署的ART這個內容對國內的產業不管是工業或農業都居於最有競爭力的一個地位但這個IPAD法被美國最高法院判決失效之後現在引用122的條款那這方面比方說我們原來有27項專屬豁免的現在已經沒有了那稻米的部分原來也是對我們"},{"start":1315.058,"end":1336.521,"text":"豁免 它現在是全球豁免但至少在這個基礎上我們並沒有比別的國家還要差只是它全球公平了我們回頭過來我們會請我們的談判團隊繼續爭取跟美方談到能不能依照過去所談到的ART的這個談判的協議的內容對我國最有利的方式我們進一步去做爭取"},{"start":1337.472,"end":1364.622,"text":"我覺得院長這個方向非常的好我也覺得絕對支持那就是如果能夠重啟談判的話我也希望提醒幾件要件包括這個條文上的一些協定像ART文本裡面協定第二點一條第二項原產於美國的農產品不應適用特別防衛措施就是所謂的SSG"},{"start":1365.762,"end":1373.502,"text":"那等於說以後萬一遇到傾銷我們沒有任何反制的措施院長是這樣嗎"},{"start":1375.151,"end":1388.074,"text":"我第一個跟委員說明 不管是特別額度配額內的關稅或是SSG特別防疫機制的部分是針對因為當關稅為零的時候 就沒有所謂SSG但是當關稅沒有零的時候 我們還是維持TRQ跟SSG"},{"start":1398.171,"end":1414.865,"text":"那我在問ART文本第二點二條第一項白紙黑字規定AIT透過其指定代表不應對原產於美國之貨品進口設置配額那這是代表我們未來不能夠針對美國農產品設置關稅配額嗎我的理解正確嗎"},{"start":1419.188,"end":1435.567,"text":"我想以水稻來講我們這次的水稻是完全沒有做任何的讓步那相對的我們的配額稻米的配額是在WTO加入的時候美國就有原來的配額了所以那個配額是還是會存在的部分不會不見配額內就零關稅啦"},{"start":1437.99,"end":1463.188,"text":"沒有一樣配額外的話他照樣有他的關稅因為他的關稅除非是零才會不會啟動SSG我還是希望呼籲一定要重視這個問題我指出了這兩點我希望院長也可以請我們的談判團隊再一次的審視他的內容然後不要說到時候我們回過頭來發現我們沒有辦法有任何抵制的這個措施剛剛聽張委員在談這個我們簽署ART的條文內容"},{"start":1467.071,"end":1484.248,"text":"我可以認定你非常了解這個內容以稻米而言我們原來的配額原來的保護政策都是有的因為他現在用122變成全球豁免如果我們再回到ART的內容的時候我們還是會擁有跟過去一樣的國際競爭力是 院長那再接下來就是花生了"},{"start":1485.409,"end":1507.121,"text":"我們2002年加入WTO的時候當時設計的花生關稅配額一年是5253公噸因為美國花生具大規模機械化的與補貼的優勢價格大概是我們國產花生的三分之一這個您很清楚而且我也知道您非常關心我們也通過電話針對花生的部分"},{"start":1509.642,"end":1535.669,"text":"那如果假设现在美国可以零关税无配额无限量的进口那这对花生产业是一个毁灭式的冲击院长这个制度手下了台湾花生产业这24年现在很担心说会不会这个MRT或者是会不会现在跟美国的谈判最后会让本土的花生业全面弃守"},{"start":1536.149,"end":1552.231,"text":"是我們的市場上本來每一年都有一定的量是需要從國外進口的那其中印度阿根廷量是比較大的巴西阿根廷對巴西阿根廷量是比較大的而且進口跟國產的花生賣相品質都不太一樣"},{"start":1553.212,"end":1582.305,"text":"進口是沒有殼的是去殼的花生我理解 你想要用進口取代進口然後這個 等於是讓他們進口跟進口之間去競爭但是美國的花生假設它的成本又比阿根廷的低其實就會誘發這個食品加工它會希望擴大進口的使用量然後就會壓縮到本土花生的使用量這個是有一個替代性的"},{"start":1582.785,"end":1606.811,"text":"那所以是不是有可能除了我們要去關心這個配額之外或者是關稅之外我們也要針對本土的花生一定要標示清楚因為假設你不標示清楚這一定要做而且現在就要開始輔導他們準備我跟委員說明謝謝委員對花生的一個關心那第一點就是"},{"start":1607.731,"end":1632.461,"text":"的確花生是值得我們要去關注的但是我們未來的花生就像委員長講的花生不應該在馬路再繼續曬所以這是一個機會我們不應該再用價格的戰爭因為用價格戰爭永遠打不過外國的我們應該提升到價值醬油你有標示說黑豆釀製或者是古法釀製或黃豆台灣花生唯一選擇"},{"start":1633.641,"end":1637.464,"text":"我跟委員說明農業部有一個農產品生產及管理及驗證辦法這裡面只要一規範下去的時候你的所有的產品都要標示"},{"start":1656.98,"end":1684.065,"text":"不管是花生農或是花生加工廠他們都會出事所以我也很希望說部長然後院長你們既然這麼關心這些人真的一定要把這個措施跟具體的配套趕快研擬出來因為不曉得什麼時候會開始那我們如果準備好的話呢就會降低他們的不確定性那我最後想要為這些花生農請命"},{"start":1685.819,"end":1702.596,"text":"假設我們的價格競爭力是等於是他們是我們三倍的競爭力那我們現在花生的轉作金額是一公頃兩萬五我們是不是能夠提高我們花生轉作的金額"},{"start":1703.797,"end":1726.316,"text":"把我們花生農的成本降低讓他們跟進口的有這個等於是有抗衡的力量有競爭的力量我們把花生的轉作金額拉高包括我記得像花生只有兩萬五毛豆就五萬啊甚至有一些更高是到六萬七萬如果假設"},{"start":1728.057,"end":1752.785,"text":"舉例啦假設我們只有他三分之一的競爭力我們要乘以三倍的話兩萬五乘以三就是七萬五一公頃假設是七萬五其實跟很多其他的作物相差也沒有太大也不是說他獨樹一格說他拉的比較高是因為過去花生的轉作金額比較低那是不是有可能請院長考量說為了要"},{"start":1753.345,"end":1770.936,"text":"迎接這個進口的衝擊我們把花生的轉作金額把它拉高起來我跟委員報告就是您說的這樣的一個轉作的一個金額的調整那已經在我們的相關的配套座位裡面那相關的轉作的金額一定是考慮到它的栽培的一個成本而不是"},{"start":1772.236,"end":1798.944,"text":"我現在就是在提醒你說有這個可能性希望你們可以納入考量最後因為時間不多我想要知道說農業部為了鼓勵農漁民子女安心就學有一個就學心機制有補助公私立高中或大專院校的學生農民就跟我反應這個有排富排富也合理就是你有120萬以上你就是不能"},{"start":1799.384,"end":1826.485,"text":"申請這個這個就學金但是農民就跟我說他說我是一個孩子我如果120萬我排付合理我有三個孩子同時在討債我也是120萬他的負擔是額外重的所以是不是農業部可以比照教育部把這個子女數分類然後來補助因為這多出來的錢不會很多但是他會真的照顧"},{"start":1845.15,"end":1845.17,"text":"好 謝謝"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:30:54.873000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:30:56.215000+08:00","text":"院長，我想請卓院長。","quality":0.625},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-03-24T14:30:56.215000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-24T14:31:03.163500+08:00","text":"麻煩請卓院長備詢。","quality":0.25},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-24T14:31:03.163500+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-24T14:31:10.112000+08:00","text":"張委員好。","quality":0.25},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:31:10.112000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:31:25.101000+08:00","text":"院長，近期美伊戰爭局勢惡化，引發全球高度關注，更直接引爆了能源供應與價格的雙重危機，能源穩定已經是國家生存的命脈。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:31:25.101000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:31:45.979000+08:00","text":"我們看到鄰國，像韓國政府已經開始要求所有公務機關車輛限行五部制，強制限縮公務用車還有能源消耗；以日本為例，日本政府已經啟動原油儲備，包括透過調節庫存來穩定國內市場的供需。","quality":0.962},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:31:46.019000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:31:46.980000+08:00","text":"院長，我們的鄰居都已經進入戰時或緊急應變狀態，那我們呢？","quality":0.92},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-24T14:31:58.707000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:32:07.910000+08:00","text":"從今天開始，我們也要求，就從我本身做起，我們所有對外的車輛出入的時候要儘量的精簡，我們已經開始在做了。","quality":0.957},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:32:08.090000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:32:14.172000+08:00","text":"所以我們也有跟上，就是要讓公務機關開始節約能源，然後限制公務用車的部分嘛！","quality":0.941},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-24T14:32:14.733000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:32:21.355000+08:00","text":"開源、節流都同時並行，我們才能夠面對這一次中東情勢還不可預知的一些發展。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:32:21.902000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:32:48.936000+08:00","text":"沒錯，我想要講的就是真的完全不可預知，因為我們不曉得戰爭還要打多久，所以我在這裡提醒院長還有部長，就是我們一定要有更具體的措施，如果以公務機關開始帶頭，就像院長講的開源、節流，我覺得就是非常具體的以身作則，那其他方面有沒有更實際的作為呢？","quality":0.936},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-24T14:32:48.936000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-24T14:32:51.337000+08:00","text":"請部長說明。","quality":0},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-03-24T14:32:51.337000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:33:12.052000+08:00","text":"報告委員，對節流的部分剛剛院長已經說明了，那開源的部分我們就儘量來做，我們現在對油的部分規定儲存量是90天，但是現在都超過這個數字，而且超過50%以上，非常多。","quality":0.928},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:33:12.673000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:33:21.042000+08:00","text":"所以你的意思是說我們從現在到5月可能都沒有問題？","quality":0.955},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-03-24T14:33:21.042000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:33:31.426000+08:00","text":"基本上都不會用到備用的，因為從當時228美伊戰爭發生到現在，我們的備用量不僅沒有減少，反而增加了。","quality":0.857},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:33:31.886000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:33:33.206000+08:00","text":"所以我們目前大概可以到多久？90天嗎？","quality":0.533},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-03-24T14:33:35.087000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:33:35.127000+08:00","text":"超過150天。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:33:35.127000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-24T14:33:36.127000+08:00","text":"超過100天？150天。150天？對。","quality":0},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:33:35.207000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:33:48.853000+08:00","text":"你們有想過如果這個戰爭持續超過150天，我們有什麼樣的因應措施嗎？","quality":0.929},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-03-24T14:33:48.853000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:33:55.938000+08:00","text":"因為那個150天會一直存在，我們會不斷的新增，讓這150天一直都存在。","quality":1},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-03-24T14:33:58.080000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:34:02.163000+08:00","text":"但是剛剛委員跟院長提到的節流部分，我們也來做一些鼓勵。","quality":0.92},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:34:02.163000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:34:13.071000+08:00","text":"所以院長跟部長有信心，要讓我們的民眾安心，對用油的部分應該是不需要擔心，包括天然氣的部分。","quality":0.902},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-03-24T14:34:14.383000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:34:24.449000+08:00","text":"對天然氣的部分，我們現在基本上對5月份大概都已經調度完成，對6月份現在開始在做一些調度，大概也差不多已經調度到一半了。","quality":0.849},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-24T14:34:25.510000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:34:42.040000+08:00","text":"對於我們天然氣跟油的安全存量，到目前我們都會把它滿載，在油的部分，安全存量是90天，現在我們保持150天，就是150天會一直存在，我們會有新購買的油可以使用；天然氣也是一樣，我們是11天，現在也會保持安全存量。","quality":0.918},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-24T14:34:42.500000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:34:50.288000+08:00","text":"但是無論怎麼樣，鼓勵人民跟由所有政府機關帶頭先行節流，這是平常都應該做的事情。","quality":0.944},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:34:51.928000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:35:13.892000+08:00","text":"是，我也希望我們要保持警戒心、保持緊張的心情來看待這件事情，因為看起來好像是不會這麼快結束，也不希望是一個長期抗爭的無限戰，我希望行政院和經濟部可以做好準備，讓一般民眾可以安心對待這件事情。","quality":0.943},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-24T14:35:14.332000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:35:20.247000+08:00","text":"非常謝謝委員的提醒，這個工作我們會列為首要，並且來對所有部會做更多的要求。","quality":0.912},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:35:20.861000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:35:30.084000+08:00","text":"感謝院長，真的非常感謝院長，也很感謝部長提供這樣的具體數字，讓我們全國人民知道，然後可以安心。","quality":0.881},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:35:30.764000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:36:03.016000+08:00","text":"院長，我接下來要問你有關於農業部的事情，院長可能非常清楚也非常關心農民，大蒜的穩價措施明定從本週一（23日）開始收購，宣稱收購價要在28塊以上，但是現在基層是罵聲一片，民眾都直接打電話到處去陳情，說市面上的收購價根本沒有這麼高，甚至遠低於這個價格，您有聽說嗎？","quality":0.991},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:36:05.478000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:36:06.059000+08:00","text":"跟委員說明……","quality":0.6},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:36:06.059000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-24T14:36:07.059000+08:00","text":"是不是先讓院長說？","quality":0},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:36:07.059000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-24T14:36:08.059000+08:00","text":"院長，你先說。","quality":0},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-24T14:36:06.199000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:36:09.043000+08:00","text":"我們原來掌握的是大蒜的生產面積今年有比較多，5,547公頃，比原來預計的、計畫中的多了兩百多公頃。","quality":0.829},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:36:09.203000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:36:09.383000+08:00","text":"多了500公頃，我今天最新的……","quality":0.3},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-24T14:36:22.198000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:36:36.708000+08:00","text":"我這裡數字是5,300公頃，多了200公頃，總之有比較多，我希望價格也能夠穩定下來，目前大蒜除了產量問題之外，還有一些其他農作上面的狀況。","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:36:36.708000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-24T14:36:37.708000+08:00","text":"對，蟲害。","quality":0},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-24T14:36:36.708000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:36:42.531000+08:00","text":"所以農業部正在就蒜農最大的利益思考，是不是請部長來說明？部長。","quality":0.929},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:36:43.992000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:37:02.857000+08:00","text":"跟委員說明，我們在處理大蒜的時候是透過一些一般盤商或者是收購，收購的時候如果是用28塊收購的話，我們再啟動一些補助，用這種方式去穩定我們農民的價錢。","quality":0.955},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:37:03.017000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:37:16.641000+08:00","text":"目前雖然是五千五百多公頃，但是因為今年有一些病害的關係，也導致適度地減產，所以相對的，產量以五年平均來看還是差不多。","quality":0.849},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:37:17.301000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:37:40.714000+08:00","text":"有一個非常重要的就是因為從去年11、12月到今年3月有一些大蒜的進口，這個進口量我們有監控，其實跟往常的量是一樣的，但是因為去年的價格比較好，今年農民多種，所以我們用28塊確保農民收益是適當的。","quality":0.94},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:37:41.655000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:37:55.810000+08:00","text":"我想部長也很專業，也很關心農民，這個我都肯定，但是我必須要提醒，我想讓院長知道一下地方的真相，我有幾樣提醒，是不是請院長責成農業部儘快去落實，然後去關心，為什麼收購價會沒有辦法在28塊以上呢？","quality":0.965},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:38:05.600000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:38:35.179000+08:00","text":"因為農業部發給收購單位的公文裡面開了一個大後門，寫著正常品規，且價格由雙方依品質議定，所以今年因為氣候變遷導致的葉蟎病害，大蒜普遍結球就偏小，這個部長應該非常清楚，農業部這一紙公文等於讓盤商名正言順的以品質不佳來大肆砍價。","quality":0.99},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:38:35.339000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:38:49.156000+08:00","text":"院長，農民甚至很激動的、很不開心的來問，新聞都說政府要收28塊，為什麼我們賣不到呢？","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:38:49.717000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:38:51.119000+08:00","text":"是不是政府在騙我們啊？","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:38:51.519000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:38:53.382000+08:00","text":"他說是政府在騙我們嗎？","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:38:53.803000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:39:17.361000+08:00","text":"當然農民會有很激動的這種想法，包括這一次第一階段總收購量是800萬臺斤，總目標收購量是1,000萬臺斤，這個是公文裡面寫的，等於每0.1公頃的收購上限是2,800臺斤，這代表什麼呢？","quality":0.931},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:39:18.001000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:39:27.526000+08:00","text":"代表這一項政策就算發揮到極致，最多也只能覆蓋357公頃。","quality":0.957},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:39:27.806000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:39:50.175000+08:00","text":"根據農業部最新的調查，今年光雲林縣種的大蒜面積就高達了5,252公頃，等於是收購總量連雲林總面積的十分之一都不到，它能夠產生什麼樣的效果？","quality":0.951},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:39:50.795000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:39:52.196000+08:00","text":"這不就像抽抽樂一樣嗎？","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:39:52.436000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:40:02.860000+08:00","text":"抽獎，就是有一些農民抽得到，有一些農民抽不到，這樣中樂透式的補助辦法，到底真的能夠幫到農民嗎？","quality":0.952},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:40:02.860000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:40:15.988000+08:00","text":"而且資源這麼少之外，誰能夠加入評選，是由特定的策略聯盟來評選誰能夠加入收購。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:40:16.368000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:40:27.717000+08:00","text":"也許現在基層的農民沒有受過很高的教育，但他也覺得這不合理，他們強烈地質疑是不是只有特定對象才賣得掉？","quality":0.936},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:40:28.858000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:40:31.200000+08:00","text":"這種抽樂透式的方式，是不是黑箱？","quality":0.714},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:40:31.760000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:40:33.482000+08:00","text":"是不是有什麼特殊的考量？","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:40:34.022000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:40:35.243000+08:00","text":"院長，你覺得這樣公平嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-24T14:40:37.204000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:40:39.405000+08:00","text":"雲林是全國最大的大蒜生產地。是！","quality":0.786},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-24T14:40:40.546000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:40:58.613000+08:00","text":"雲林的大蒜產業策略聯盟也是一個健全的組織，我希望農業部一定要跟這些農企以及農民團體，在溝通的過程當中，能夠依照我們設定的目標，盡最大的能量去處理，能夠收購的面積，應該要衡量到農民實際上生產的數量。","quality":0.978},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:41:03.835000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:41:04.996000+08:00","text":"真的只有十分之一耶！","quality":0.778},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:41:06.317000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:41:29.893000+08:00","text":"我稍微跟委員解釋一下，我想委員也非常清楚，第一個就是政府單位不可能全數去收農民所種的所有的大蒜，這是第一個，所以從過去的經驗，如果我從市場抽十分之一，就是它可以回到市場機制，這是9年來我們再度啟動這種的協助方式。","quality":0.979},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:41:29.893000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-24T14:41:31.634000+08:00","text":"我知道，睽違9年，對啊！對！","quality":0.222},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:41:31.634000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:41:37.060000+08:00","text":"所以我才會說，我們用適當的力道去引導價格的提升。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:41:37.641000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:41:38.702000+08:00","text":"這中間會有黑箱嗎？","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:41:38.702000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:41:40.004000+08:00","text":"會有圖利特定的廠商嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:41:40.004000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:41:41.265000+08:00","text":"我跟你保證絕對不會有。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:41:41.486000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:41:42.847000+08:00","text":"另外，在品質的部分……","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:41:43.008000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:41:46.833000+08:00","text":"如果有任何案例，我可以直接提供給部長？","quality":1},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-24T14:41:46.833000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-24T14:41:47.833000+08:00","text":"歡迎委員……","quality":0},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:41:46.833000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:41:47.634000+08:00","text":"可以，絕對可以。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:41:48.034000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:42:00.612000+08:00","text":"我已經再三的要求也交代，在不同的鄉鎮，包括莿桐、元長、東勢、水林等主要的雲林產區，我都希望能夠普遍性的去收購，這是第一個。","quality":0.792},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:42:00.612000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-24T14:42:01.612000+08:00","text":"第二個部分……","quality":0},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:42:00.612000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:42:06.020000+08:00","text":"我再提醒幾件事情，再請院長跟部長一起回答，好不好？","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:42:06.769000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:42:32.538000+08:00","text":"我現在覺得比較不合理的是政府、農業部明明有編列每臺斤3元處理費的補助，但這每臺斤3元的處理費是在這28元之外，不是補助農民，是補助盤商，現在農民質疑的就是說受傷害的是我們，為什麼政府想要照顧的是盤商呢？","quality":0.956},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:42:33.178000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:42:52.288000+08:00","text":"我現在就想要問，過去農委會曾經也有過案例，不管他們成交價多少，依品項下去，有一些成交價比較高、有一些成交價比較低，它就每臺斤補助2塊、5塊，不一定，依這個案例就覺得比較合理嘛！","quality":0.895},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:42:54.249000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:42:55.970000+08:00","text":"這個錢是直接給農民拿到喔！","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:42:56.510000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:43:16.058000+08:00","text":"但我現在不理解的是，除了把28塊給這些特定的盤商之外，還把3塊錢再給盤商，如果這樣子的話，我就想要問一下卓院長，您是支持盤商，還是支持農民呢？","quality":0.967},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-24T14:43:17.406000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:43:25.494000+08:00","text":"盤商應該要幫助農民，跟政府一起來幫助農民，這才是穩定他農作的來源，也才有一個好的管道。","quality":0.974},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:43:27.256000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:43:27.877000+08:00","text":"這是一個理想。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:43:28.417000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:43:34.383000+08:00","text":"所以我的意思是說，難道這3塊不能直接給農民嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:43:34.383000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:43:36.325000+08:00","text":"你如果直接給農民的話……","quality":1},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-24T14:43:36.325000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-24T14:43:37.325000+08:00","text":"這是有它的目的跟作用。","quality":0},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:43:36.325000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:44:05.602000+08:00","text":"我大概跟委員講，委員就會清楚，這些盤商去收了以後，如果馬上倒進市場，相對的那個價格是越倒越低，所以我們希望收購的這些大蒜能夠延後再釋出，我們來協助在延後過程裡面的這些冷藏費用，不只是對盤商，只要大的專業農或者集團栽培的這些經營主體，都可以來申請我們這樣的協助。","quality":0.933},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:44:06.843000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:44:27.062000+08:00","text":"甚至還有很多農民質疑說其實盤商每年都契作好幾十甲，他就先把契作的收一收，他根本幫助不到散戶，也幫助不到小農，真正需要幫助的農民收不到幫助，反而是幫助盤商先穩定了他這邊有契作的及有合作的……","quality":0.874},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:44:29.944000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:44:35.629000+08:00","text":"我們在規定的時候都特別講到，如果盤商也是從事大量經營的時候……","quality":0.964},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:44:36.109000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:45:04.042000+08:00","text":"現在有8家，就是這個契作的他賣給另外一家、那個契作的他賣給另外一家，他們就8家聯合互相把契作的收一收，外面的一般農民收不到幫助，所以我今天是以很誠懇的心情，也希望院長一定要能夠體恤民情，體會這些農民真的很辛苦，我到田邊，阿桑是坐在地上哭，你知道嗎？","quality":0.955},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:45:05.404000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:45:19.290000+08:00","text":"他們真的很卑微，就這3塊，你補助盤商不如直接補助他，有這3塊他就覺得心裡有一點安慰，結果這3塊他們不理解為什麼還補助盤商呢？","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:45:19.830000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:45:27.854000+08:00","text":"而且他們一直覺得盤商就穩定了他自己整個契作的部分而已，根本幫助不到他們。","quality":0.971},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:45:27.994000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:45:28.554000+08:00","text":"我另外要講的是……","quality":1},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-24T14:45:28.574000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:45:39.638000+08:00","text":"剛剛部長有講這是有點調節的作用，調節的作用能不能發揮它的效果，請部長要去檢討，我們期待它能夠發揮比較好的調節，讓市場穩定供應量。","quality":0.797},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:45:39.798000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:46:07.710000+08:00","text":"但是其實除了調節之外，你也要考慮到他們現在的心理，大家是反彈的不得了，你等於只補助了十分之一，抽樂透似的，搞不好那十分之一都不足盤商本來囤的、契作的，所以一般農民根本是沒有辦法受益的，院長，我真的希望你可以請農業部好好的思考……","quality":0.932},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-24T14:46:07.710000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-24T14:46:08.891000+08:00","text":"好的，好的，一定。","quality":0.167},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:46:08.891000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:46:32.932000+08:00","text":"落實一下，真的幫助到一般農民，其實你去雲林，大家看到你那麼開心，我們也希望院長可以關心這一次蒜農的問題，農業部當然他有他的考量、他有他的專業，但是有時候社會上不是像農業部想的這麼理想化的狀態，我也希望農業部可以納進考量。","quality":0.941},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:46:33.092000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:46:35.375000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝委員的一些建議。","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:46:35.875000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:46:44.903000+08:00","text":"我們農糧署各分署其實也不斷地在跟農民、跟相關的產地去座談，後續的部分，特別是公平……","quality":0.919},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:46:45.043000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:46:46.805000+08:00","text":"部長，你什麼時候下來？","quality":0.778},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:46:46.805000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:46:48.927000+08:00","text":"我邀請你下來主持座談，你願意來嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:46:50.908000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:46:59.050000+08:00","text":"只要是對農民能夠做溝通的，我都願意下去，像針對花生的部分，我在過年後其實第一時間就下去了。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:46:59.090000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:47:00.110000+08:00","text":"等一下，花生我也要講一下。","quality":0.727},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:47:00.551000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:47:14.654000+08:00","text":"我先把它講完，我舉例，我其實有跟部長建議，這一次的病蟲害應該啟動天然災害現金救助，部長一直覺得這個是蟲害，不可以。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:47:15.034000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:47:39.186000+08:00","text":"但是我們回顧2022年初，當初恆春半島的洋蔥也遭遇了非常嚴重的蟲害，那時候的農委會也非常體恤農民，考慮到這個病害的背後是受連日大雨跟氣候巨變引發的，所以他展現行政彈性，給予農民實質災損補助。","quality":0.965},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:47:42.548000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:47:52.838000+08:00","text":"這個屏東恆春洋蔥的案例不可能是因為之前的部長是屏東人就可以，然後現在的陳部長不是我們雲林人就不可以嘛！","quality":0.939},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:47:53.498000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:48:06.971000+08:00","text":"所以我必須要講，這一次蒜頭病害是因為天氣忽冷忽熱，我們人都因為忽冷忽熱很容易感冒了，更何況是作物？","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:48:07.791000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:48:11.955000+08:00","text":"明顯的就是因為極端氣候異常所造成的病蟲害。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:48:12.736000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:48:23.325000+08:00","text":"是不是農業部可以考量比照過往的彈性跟經驗，重新評估這一次的氣候跟病蟲害的關聯，給雲林農民最及時的實質幫助呢？","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:48:25.947000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:48:41.781000+08:00","text":"我跟委員報告，其實我們也做了一些評估，你舉的洋蔥的部分，其實天然災害救助是因為天然災害所引起的一些農作物損害，如果農作物的損害跟病蟲害之間的關聯性，這個我們會考慮。","quality":0.974},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:48:42.381000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:48:43.522000+08:00","text":"從大蒜來講，它不是……","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:48:44.463000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:48:45.163000+08:00","text":"你可以不用解釋，你講的我都懂。","quality":0.923},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:48:47.045000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:49:00.052000+08:00","text":"我要跟您說明，當要用病蟲害啟動天然災害的時候，有一個重點就是所有的普遍性都要符合，但是相對這次病害是有特定的幾個鄉鎮才發生這樣的問題……","quality":0.984},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:49:00.052000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:49:04.374000+08:00","text":"你就針對這幾個鄉鎮，你如果可以針對這幾個鄉鎮，我覺得沒話說，因為你不可能……","quality":0.818},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:49:04.374000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:49:10.217000+08:00","text":"沒有，每一個鄉鎮都有好的農民管理，有的是不好的管理……","quality":0.913},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:49:10.417000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:49:15.101000+08:00","text":"你不可能屏東有，然後雲林沒有，我覺得這個是不合理的。","quality":0.957},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:49:15.682000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:49:16.062000+08:00","text":"這兩個是不一樣的。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:49:16.302000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:49:19.166000+08:00","text":"我再繼續講，光去年我們進口了多少公噸？","quality":0.941},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:49:19.166000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:49:19.166000+08:00","text":"1萬8,000噸。","quality":0.333},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:49:19.166000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:49:21.648000+08:00","text":"那你知道今年1月到3月進口了多少噸嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:49:21.648000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:49:21.668000+08:00","text":"六千多噸。","quality":0.5},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:49:21.668000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:49:44.363000+08:00","text":"6,830噸，照1公斤27塊的關稅，少說也有1億的關稅，我現在幫你找財源，這1億的關稅是不是院長可以讓它直接給農業部來支持我們這筆開銷嘛？","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:49:44.363000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:49:45.924000+08:00","text":"我們蒜頭的這些關稅繳得可多了。","quality":0.714},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:49:46.444000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:49:56.847000+08:00","text":"農業相關的政策，院長一直很支持，相對的，收入歸收入，收入就是要繳庫，我們需要的話，我們就會跟院裡面去爭取相關的經費。","quality":0.922},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:49:57.207000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:49:59.367000+08:00","text":"你先不要回答，我沒有要你回答這一句。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:49:59.767000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:50:13.631000+08:00","text":"我是希望院長說，既然進口了這麼多的蒜頭，然後也繳了非常多的關稅，這一筆錢有沒有可能給予農業部幫助，讓他們可以幫助更多的農民？","quality":1},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-24T14:50:15.071000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:50:29.736000+08:00","text":"關稅的用途，必須要繳庫以後，我們做一個計畫性的使用，跟委員報告，即使沒有進口的這一筆關稅，農業部也應該必須有其他的策略、措施來因應這個不屬於天然災害的病蟲害。謝謝。","quality":0.838},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:50:31.877000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:50:42.641000+08:00","text":"我還是希望院長可以啟動天然災害現金救助，幫助農民，或者是補助盤商的這3塊錢，直接讓農民受益。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:50:43.401000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:50:52.845000+08:00","text":"農民直接拿到錢，他就安心，你補助盤商，他就會擔心說：他又要給我壓低價格，再賺那3塊錢。","quality":0.806},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:50:52.845000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:50:58.200000+08:00","text":"說實在，我真的是覺得這個機制是可以調整的，雖然……","quality":1},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-24T14:50:58.640000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:51:02.103000+08:00","text":"是，雖然依照天然災害救助辦法，病蟲害並不屬於天然災害，但是我請農業部確實了解……","quality":0.6},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:51:02.323000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:51:15.732000+08:00","text":"我知道，我知道，但是過去就有曾經覺得這個病蟲害是因為極端氣候導致的，這就有關聯，剛才說的屏東的洋蔥就是一個例子。","quality":0.765},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-24T14:51:16.412000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:51:28.034000+08:00","text":"好，委員，我請農業部迅速再去掌握目前最新的狀況，能夠精確地提出一個方式，讓大蒜農能夠安心，也讓他們的損害能夠得到更多、更多政策上的協助。謝謝。","quality":0.825},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:51:28.394000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:51:39.376000+08:00","text":"而且我也希望部長能夠真的受我的邀請，來到雲林縣走一趟，來看一下，這一點也希望部長可以排出時間。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:51:40.456000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:51:42.498000+08:00","text":"我想時間許可，我們一定會下去。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:51:42.798000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:51:48.702000+08:00","text":"我希望你可以放在心上，如果你覺得這是一件要事，我相信你應該可以下來。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:51:48.943000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:52:12.433000+08:00","text":"另外，臺美正式簽署了ART，但是美國最高法院判決對等關稅是非法的，所以ART的實際落實情況，廣大的農民朋友都非常關心，是不是請院長先簡單說一下最新的情況，既然美方內部有爭議，是不是我們也可以重新審視，為臺灣、為農民爭取更好的空間呢？","quality":1},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-24T14:52:15.854000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:52:50.787000+08:00","text":"我再重申，原來我們所簽署的ART，這個內容對國內的產業，不管是工業或農業，都居於最有競爭力的一個地位，但IEEPA這個法被美國最高法院判決失效之後，現在引用122的條款，比方說我們原來有27項專屬豁免的，現在沒有了；稻米的部分，原來也是對我們豁免，它現在是全球豁免，但至少在這個基礎上，我們並沒有比別的國家還要差，只是全球公平了。","quality":0.966},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-24T14:52:51.247000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:53:04.501000+08:00","text":"我們回頭會請我們的談判團隊繼續爭取，能不能跟美方談到依照過去所談好的ART這個談判協議的內容，對我國最有利的方式，我們進一步去做爭取。","quality":0.937},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:53:05.472000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:53:41.502000+08:00","text":"我覺得院長這個方向非常地好，我也絕對支持，如果能夠重啟談判的話，我也希望提醒幾個要件，包括這個條文上的一些協定，像ART文本裡面協定第2.1條第2項，原產於美國的農產品不應適用特別防衛措施，就是所謂的SSG，等於以後萬一遇到傾銷，我們沒有任何反制的措施，院長，是這樣嗎？","quality":0.975},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-24T14:53:41.502000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-24T14:53:43.151000+08:00","text":"請部長回答。","quality":0},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:53:43.151000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:53:53.133000+08:00","text":"我第一個跟委員說明，不管是特別額度配額內的關稅，或者SSG特別防衛機制的部分……","quality":0.944},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:53:53.133000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-24T14:53:54.133000+08:00","text":"這已經沒有了，有這一條，就沒有特別配額了啊！","quality":0},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:53:53.213000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:53:56.054000+08:00","text":"因為當關稅為零的時候就沒有所謂的SSG，但是當關稅不是零，我們還是維持TRQ跟SSG。","quality":0.925},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:54:06.171000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:54:20.683000+08:00","text":"那我再問，ART文本第2.2條第1項白紙黑字規定，AIT透過其指定代表，不應對原產於美國之貨品進口設置配額。","quality":0.957},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:54:20.983000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:54:22.765000+08:00","text":"這是不是代表我們未來不能夠針對美國農產品設置關稅配額？","quality":0.923},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:54:22.765000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:54:22.865000+08:00","text":"我的理解正確嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:54:27.569000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:54:41.945000+08:00","text":"以水稻來講，我們這次是完全沒有做任何讓步，相對地，我們稻米的配額是在加入WTO的時候，美國就有原來的配額了，所以那個配額還是會存在的……","quality":0.951},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-24T14:54:41.945000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-24T14:54:43.107000+08:00","text":"還是存在。","quality":0},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:54:43.107000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:54:43.367000+08:00","text":"不會不見。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:54:43.367000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:54:43.547000+08:00","text":"配額內就零關稅啦！","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:54:45.990000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:54:52.575000+08:00","text":"沒有，一樣，配額外的話，照樣有關稅，除非它的關稅是零，才不會啟動SSG。","quality":0.867},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:54:52.835000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:55:09.887000+08:00","text":"我還是呼籲一定要重視這個問題，針對我指出的這兩點，我希望院長也可以請我們的談判團隊再一次地審視它的內容，不要到時候我們回過頭來發現自身沒有辦法有任何抵制的措施……","quality":0.908},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-24T14:55:10.368000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:55:28.945000+08:00","text":"剛剛聽張委員在談我們簽署的ART條文內容，我可以認定你非常了解這個內容，以稻米而言，我們原來的保護政策都是有的，因為他現在用112變成全球豁免，如果我們再回到ART內容的時候，我們還是會擁有跟過去一樣的國際競爭力。","quality":0.99},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:55:29.486000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:55:30.166000+08:00","text":"是，院長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:55:30.447000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:55:55.101000+08:00","text":"再接下來就是花生了，我們2002年加入WTO的時候，當時設計的花生關稅配額一年是5,235公噸，因為美國花生具大規模、機械化與補貼的優勢，價格大概是我們國產花生的三分之一，這個您很清楚，而且我也知道您非常關心，我們也針對花生的部分通過電話。","quality":0.951},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:55:58.262000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:56:07.625000+08:00","text":"假設現在美國可以零關稅、無配額、無限量的進口，這對花生產業是一個毀滅式的衝擊！","quality":0.486},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:56:08.565000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:56:23.649000+08:00","text":"院長，這個制度守下了臺灣花生產業24年，現在很擔心會不會這個ART或者是現在跟美國的談判最後會讓本土的花生業全面棄守？","quality":0.593},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-24T14:56:24.329000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:56:44.734000+08:00","text":"本來我們的市場上每一年都有一定的量是需要從國外進口的，其中巴西、阿根廷的量比較大，而且進口跟國產花生的賣相、品質都不大一樣，進口是沒有殼的、去殼的花生。","quality":0.928},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:56:44.974000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:56:47.575000+08:00","text":"其實你跟我說明的我理解，你想要用進口取代進口……","quality":0.619},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-24T14:56:47.575000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-24T14:56:48.695000+08:00","text":"是，是進口競爭……","quality":0},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:56:48.695000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:57:10.285000+08:00","text":"等於是讓它們進口跟進口之間去競爭，但是假設美國花生的成本又比阿根廷的低，其實就會誘發食品加工希望擴大進口的使用量，然後就會壓縮到本土花生的使用量，這是有一個替代性的。","quality":0.962},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:57:10.965000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:57:25.789000+08:00","text":"所以除了要去關心這個配額以及關稅之外，我們針對本土的花生一定要標示清楚，假設你不標示清楚……","quality":0.952},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:57:25.789000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-24T14:57:26.789000+08:00","text":"這一定會做的！","quality":0},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:57:26.329000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:57:27.669000+08:00","text":"這一定要做！","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:57:27.809000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:57:30.770000+08:00","text":"而且現在就要開始輔導他們準備。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:57:30.770000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:57:51.477000+08:00","text":"我跟委員說明，謝謝委員對花生的關心，第一點，的確花生是值得我們去關注的，但是我們未來的花生就像委員經常講的，花生不應該再繼續在馬路曬，所以這是一個機會，我們不應該再用價格的戰爭，因為用價格戰爭永遠打不過外國的……","quality":0.948},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:57:51.477000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-24T14:57:52.477000+08:00","text":"是，就好像醬油……","quality":0},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:57:51.797000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:57:53.478000+08:00","text":"我們應該提升到價值……","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:57:54.098000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:57:59.120000+08:00","text":"醬油有標示黑豆釀製、古法釀製或黃豆……","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:57:59.420000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:58:00.461000+08:00","text":"臺灣花生唯一選擇！","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:58:00.461000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-24T14:58:01.461000+08:00","text":"對，臺灣花生……","quality":0},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:58:01.461000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-24T14:58:02.461000+08:00","text":"唯一選擇，所以我們會……","quality":0},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:58:02.461000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-24T14:58:03.461000+08:00","text":"你一定要有本土的標示，假設加工廠把本土的跟進口的混在一起來降低成本，這怎麼標示？","quality":0},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T14:58:01.641000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:58:05.444000+08:00","text":"我跟委員說明，農業部有一個農產品生產及驗證管理法，這裡面只要一規範下去，所有的產品都要標示……","quality":0.952},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:58:24.980000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:58:49.924000+08:00","text":"現在所有不管是花生農或是花生加工廠都「剉咧等」，所以我也很希望部長、院長，既然你們這麼關心這些人，真的一定要把相關措施跟具體配套趕快研擬出來，因為不曉得什麼時候會開始，我們如果準備好就會降低他們的不確定性。","quality":0.883},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:58:50.284000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:59:10.596000+08:00","text":"我最後想要為這些花生農請命，假設我們的價格競爭力……等於他們是我們3倍的競爭力，那我們現在花生的轉作金額是1公頃兩萬五，我們是不是能夠提高我們花生轉作的金額？","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:59:11.797000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T14:59:33.395000+08:00","text":"把我們花生農的成本降低，讓他們跟進口的有抗衡的力量、有競爭的力量，我們把花生的轉作金額拉高，我記得花生只有兩萬五，毛豆就5萬啊，甚至有一些更高是到6萬、7萬。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T14:59:36.057000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T15:00:06.308000+08:00","text":"舉例來說，假設我們只有他三分之一的競爭力，我們要乘以3倍的話，兩萬五乘以3就是七萬五，1公頃假設是七萬五，其實跟很多其他的作物相差也沒有太大，也不是說它獨樹一格、拉得比較高，是因為過去花生的轉作金額比較低，是不是有可能請院長考量，為了要迎接進口的衝擊，我們把花生的轉作金額拉高起來？","quality":0.968},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T15:00:06.308000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T15:00:18.916000+08:00","text":"我跟委員報告，您說這樣一個轉作金額的調整，已經在我們的相關配套作為裡面，相關的轉作金額一定是考慮到它栽培的成本，而不是直接……","quality":0.93},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T15:00:20.236000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T15:00:24.778000+08:00","text":"我現在就是在提醒你有這個可能性，希望你們可以納入考量。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T15:00:24.778000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-24T15:00:25.778000+08:00","text":"對，我們已經有這樣的配套……","quality":0},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T15:00:25.318000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T15:00:38.241000+08:00","text":"最後因為時間不多，我想要知道，農業部為了鼓勵農漁民子女安心就學，有一個就學新機制，有補助公私立高中或大專院校的學生。","quality":0.981},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T15:00:39.282000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T15:01:01.535000+08:00","text":"農民就跟我反映這個有排富，排富也合理，就是所得120萬以上就不能申請這個就學金，但是農民就跟我說如果他只有1個小孩，所得120萬的話，排富是合理的，但是他有3個小孩同時在讀書，也是120萬，他的負擔是額外的重。","quality":0.729},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T15:01:02.235000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T15:01:10.141000+08:00","text":"所以是不是農業部可以比照教育部把子女數分類來補助？","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T15:01:10.382000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-24T15:01:14.485000+08:00","text":"因為這多出來的錢不會很多，但是這真的會照顧到有壓力的農民。","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T15:01:14.985000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-24T15:01:30.127857+08:00","text":"我想農業部願意來做這樣的檢討，特別是多生小孩子的，是我們要特別鼓勵的，所以如果小孩子越多，其相關的經費，我們會來討論。","quality":0},{"speaker":"張委員嘉郡","start":"2026-03-24T15:01:30.427857+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-24T15:01:37.856429+08:00","text":"不能限定120萬就是排富，不管他有多少個孩子，所以如果這個可以……","quality":0},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-03-24T15:01:38.156429+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-24T15:01:40.442143+08:00","text":"我們會來檢討。謝謝。","quality":0.25},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-03-24T15:01:40.742143+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-24T15:01:47.313571+08:00","text":"謝謝張嘉郡委員質詢，謝謝卓院長、各相關部會首長備詢。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-03-24T15:01:47.613571+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-24T15:01:59.042143+08:00","text":"報告院會，在議場二樓旁聽的是來自歐洲價值安全政策中心，Welcome to Taiwan！","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-03-24T15:01:59.342143+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-24T15:02:02.770714+08:00","text":"Amigos、Amigas！","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-03-24T15:02:03.070714+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-24T15:02:05.070714+08:00","text":"Welcome！","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-03-24T15:02:05.370714+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-24T15:02:13.085000+08:00","text":"另外是一批來自於臺北商業大學的同學，我們掌聲歡迎各位同學。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-03-24T15:02:13.385000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-24T15:02:19.385000+08:00","text":"接下來，我們請陳秀寳委員質詢，黃建賓委員請準備。","quality":0}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}