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早安跟主席報告為什麼會遲到因為那個媒體一直叫我說是不是可以問一下賈永傑那個董事長那個一些議題啦那我是跟他們講說那個賈永傑董事長的議題我沒有準備不過我相信啦我相信他應該是對台北市的市長的參選"},{"start":39.721,"end":63.611,"text":"你看從笑聲裡頭我們就可以知道了知道答案好謝謝那個董事長董事長我想在去年12月31號那個你的記者會裡頭你有特別特別宣布了就是說你跟八家公那個銀行那就是完成了就是我們"},{"start":65.572,"end":80.928,"text":"這個貴金屬的RWA的代幣化的一個研究那這一個其實我想要跟你致敬因為這一個議題你們做了投入的非常多的一個研究那也對於就是這個"},{"start":82.911,"end":111.234,"text":"RWA的一個貴金屬的一個發展其實你把那個關鍵的問題點出來了從實證到落地這個是非常重要的一步可是從這個問題裡頭我們也發現金管會也在做這樣的一個研究這個是不是有一點跟他PK還是說你做的會比金管會還來得好是不是說明一下謝謝委員的鼓勵那確實是我們因為台灣銀行是"},{"start":112.575,"end":116.397,"text":"國內唯一有銷售實體黃金的銀行所以我們認為整個業務雖然是實體的交易但是所有的銀行如果賣黃金存摺客戶如果需要換取實體黃金的時候都必須要經過非常繁瑣的程序所以我們跟這八家銀行聯合起來看看是不是可以"},{"start":133.747,"end":143.555,"text":"做一個實體資產的待遇化就是RWA那讓大家未來客戶呢他要換取這個實體黃金的時候呢他可以透過這樣的一個機制所以我們就跟八家銀行一起做了一個觀念的驗證那這個觀念的驗證呢在去年已經完成了所以今年呢就我們有跟很多的一些系統的建制廠商啊還有這個"},{"start":155.003,"end":156.743,"text":"那你覺得你跟金管會的RWA你們的差異性在哪裡?等一下你一併的回答我"},{"start":174.228,"end":191.267,"text":"還有就是說這一個RWA你的就是議題上我們看到了就是你是在這個交割跟清算末端的一個開花倒是全團實體資產的一個變成代幣化這個我沒有看到你有提到這個"},{"start":192.868,"end":207.77,"text":"這一段這一段就是說我們也知道說你自行想要那個自行開發相關的一個系統那還有是委外還是從國外找還是找那個本土的業者那一併回答"},{"start":208.411,"end":226.686,"text":"好 謝謝委員目前我們都是本土的業者一起來做一些研議像我剛剛提到的譬如說一些區塊鏈的一些開發的廠商等等都是我們本體的業者那至於呢我們是不是跟金管會有什麼PK當然不是金管會是我們的監理機關它所有定下的法規我們都要遵循所以呢我們這個整個"},{"start":228.047,"end":247.281,"text":"整個RWA的一個開發呢因為是屬於這個虛擬資產的部分所以呢也是要遵循經管會所定的相關的規則那麼目前這個虛擬資產的一些相關的一些法規呢我不知道目前在哪一個階段應該已經是不是已經在立法院了如果這個法規一旦通過的話呢我們就依據相關法規的一些相關的規範在它的規範的架構下來進行"},{"start":251.644,"end":262.495,"text":"好 那還是我再回到一個相同的議題 前端呢 前端你目前就是在這個實體資產的一個代幣化這一段你進行到什麼樣的一個階段"},{"start":263.806,"end":291.872,"text":"目前我們就是跟八家跟我們一起聯合因為這八家不是飯工股的而已還包括一些民營的包括玉山還有中信銀行等等都在內那我們有成立一個小組那麼另外也就是跟其他的相關的關聯的業者做一個就是有定期的一些做一些討論跟研發好 董事長你就是這一個聯盟的盟主那你有承諾大家就是說現在我們大家都聽到了你一定就是用本土的業者對"},{"start":293.592,"end":318.046,"text":"對,這個本土的業者本來就是有相當相當的必須要萬一有重要的狀況發生的時候本土業者才可以非常實際的來支援我們是好,謝謝謝謝董事長,謝謝謝謝好,部長我想在針對的就是一個少子化的一個議題衍生出來就是我們整個董事長你請回"},{"start":321.564,"end":344.197,"text":"部長從2020以來我們整體的稅收其實我們逐步的在成長但是在這個當中有一個非常令人必須要去注意到的一個情況就是我們的中手稅還有正是那個成長的那個速度是緩慢的其實這個很清楚我們就知道就是少子化帶來稅收的一個影響如果我們從2025年全國那個護稅時增的那個金額初步的一個統計"},{"start":350,"end":359.692,"text":"我國的稅收是兩兆七千三百六十二億元相較2024年我們增加了465億但是卻短徵了483億那部長我要請教你就是說你怎麼樣去推估稅收的預算數你是依據什麼"},{"start":370.297,"end":375.303,"text":"跟委員報告對於稅收的預算的預算書怎麼樣去推估我們有一個專案小組然後邀請了專家學者以及機關像央行還有主機總處還有國發會等等一起來我們來討論而不按照各個稅務會影響每個稅收的一些因子都"},{"start":390.641,"end":412.964,"text":"納入去討論跟委員報告那像委員報告的有關2025年的一個稅收其實大概都達到99.6%不管是全國是達到預算數的99.6%而中央是達成99.1%那比預算數短收的是251億在中央的部分那跟委員報告這其中有一個原因就是因為"},{"start":414.105,"end":442.263,"text":"就2025年就是因為美國的一個對等關稅的措施實施所以我們對於盈利事業因為在這段時間受到衝擊的話它可以申請延期跟分期繳納銀索稅所以這個部分大概我們會延後取得大概有500多億所以整體來說跟預算數幾乎是可以達成如果沒有這個因素影響的話事實上是可以達成我們的預算數而且是百分之百大概都在百分之一以內的一個變動"},{"start":444.726,"end":458.647,"text":"那我再請教你一個關鍵的議題你有沒有預期今年我們的民眾會大幅的調升還是因為大家在股市裡頭賺了更多然後你會收到更多的一個股市投資人的首得稅是不是這樣子"},{"start":459.608,"end":471.121,"text":"一個看法其實本席看到的是說這個少子化少子化的一個遞減然後中手稅的稅基其實這個結構面正在縮小那我們從國發會發布的一個2024年發布的一個資料在2070年"},{"start":476.587,"end":495.47,"text":"它預計就是這個人口比例會到2028年會低於三分之二那勞動力的人口的一個減少最直接也影響到了就是你的中手稅的一個萎縮那面對最直接中手稅的稅基的一個減少的問題你是不是有開始"},{"start":496.491,"end":515.14,"text":"就是開始研究因為你中手稅的一個減少你勢必你就是拿到今天的一個議題你的遺損稅你的贈與稅是不是也會跟著調整啊開始研究了沒有是謝謝委員的指教那對於因為人口結構的一個改變對稅收的影響"},{"start":516.281,"end":544.583,"text":"本部已經委外做一個研究這個部分已經在做研究當中跟委員報告那另外呢就是部長倒是我要請教你這一個研究進行了多久這個研究應該是今年多吧到今年所以目前還在研究當中還沒有出來研究報表還沒有出來你這一個少子化影響到這個中手稅還有證語稅還有就是整個遺產稅的這一個稅基的一個結構面你已經開始研究了多久這一個計畫進行了多久"},{"start":545.503,"end":553.446,"text":"我們是從去年九月開始委外到今年結束這樣它是不是一個計畫是一個計畫這個計畫的規模有多大規模是說經費嗎還是經費一共大概九十萬元這樣這麼少"},{"start":572.87,"end":587.29,"text":"我們的預算編列就是這麼多少子化是目前就是會影響你整個稅基任何的一個稅很大的一個很嚴重的一個最主要的原因那你一個規模這麼小的一個計劃案"},{"start":589.6,"end":607.15,"text":"這個我們會期待他會研究出什麼我們委託的專家學者他基本上很強所以說出來的結果都是一定是最好的最精準的我們是委託那個政大財政學系的主任陳國良陳教授去"},{"start":608.25,"end":616.976,"text":"你不能跟我講說政大做最強啊那為什麼不要委託台大呢我的意思是在凸顯說你這一個計劃案如果就是說你們的態度是這個樣子的話在未來面臨的我們的正遺稅跟這個遺產稅我們勢必會不夠周全所以我要看你這個計劃好不好部長"},{"start":632.325,"end":646.51,"text":"請把這個計畫我知道委員認為應該要更重視這樣的一個議題所以部分這個因為受到預算的一個限制我們副業屬錢還不夠還要用部裡面的錢去挪用一些來做做這個研究計畫那我們想等研究報告出來我們在過程當中會讓研究團隊們能夠更周全的去做思考各種因素然後看研究報告出來以後未來我們在估算預算的時候把這個報告"},{"start":658.834,"end":666.89,"text":"把這個報告的研究進度 給本席好不好一個禮拜給本席然後報告也會到時候送給委員一起參與好 謝謝謝謝委員 委員下一位 請林黛嬅委員質詢"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:00:33.171000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:00:33.171000+08:00","text":"（10時）謝謝。","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:00:33.171000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:00:38.040000+08:00","text":"有請臺灣銀行董事長以及部長。","quality":0.846},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-03-25T10:00:38.040000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:00:39.984000+08:00","text":"請莊部長和凌董事長。","quality":0.778},{"speaker":"莊部長翠雲","start":"2026-03-25T10:00:46.811000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:00:46.991000+08:00","text":"委員好。早安。","quality":0.4},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:00:47.612000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:01:02.299000+08:00","text":"跟主席報告我為什麼會遲到，因為媒體一直叫我，是不是可以問一下賈永媫董事長一些議題，我是跟他們說，賈永媫董事長的議題我沒有準備。","quality":0.948},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:01:02.299000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:01:13.862000+08:00","text":"不過我相信他應該對臺北市市長的參選……你看，從笑聲裡頭我們就可以知道答案了。","quality":0.971},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:01:14.503000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:01:18.564000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝，請董事長。","quality":0.857},{"speaker":"凌董事長忠嫄","start":"2026-03-25T10:01:18.564000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-25T10:01:19.605000+08:00","text":"委員好。","quality":0},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:01:19.605000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:02:03.779000+08:00","text":"在去年12月31日你的記者會裡頭，你有特別宣布跟8家銀行完成了貴金屬業務RWA代幣化的研究，我想要跟你致敬，因為這個議題你們投入了非常多的研究，對於RWA貴金屬的發展，其實你把關鍵的問題點出來了，從實證到落地，這個是非常重要的一步。","quality":0.961},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:02:04.520000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:02:16.429000+08:00","text":"可是從這個問題裡頭我們發現金管會也在做這樣的研究，這是不是有一點跟它PK的意味，還是說你做的會比金管會來得好？","quality":0.923},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:02:17.010000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:02:18.011000+08:00","text":"是不是說明一下？","quality":1},{"speaker":"凌董事長忠嫄","start":"2026-03-25T10:02:19.452000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:02:26.417000+08:00","text":"謝謝委員的鼓勵，因為臺灣銀行是國內唯一有銷售實體黃金的銀行，所以我們認為整個業務雖然是實體的交易，但是所有的銀行如果有賣黃金存摺，客戶如果需要換成實體黃金的時候都必須要經過非常繁瑣的程序。","quality":0.978},{"speaker":"凌董事長忠嫄","start":"2026-03-25T10:02:26.437000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:02:52.713000+08:00","text":"所以我們跟這八家銀行聯合起來，看是不是可以做實體資產代幣化，就是RWA，讓客戶未來要換取實體黃金的時候可以透過這樣的一個機制，所以我們就跟八家銀行一起做了一個觀念的驗證。","quality":0.95},{"speaker":"凌董事長忠嫄","start":"2026-03-25T10:02:52.773000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:02:54.555000+08:00","text":"這個觀念的驗證在去年已經完成了，所以今年我們也跟一些系統的建置廠商還有區塊鏈（blockchain）的這些廠商在進行一些研議，我們希望今年或者是明年初可以向金管會來申請進行試辦。","quality":0.393},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:03:06.023000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:03:07.103000+08:00","text":"你覺得你跟金管會的RWA差異性在哪裡？","quality":1},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:03:07.103000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:03:57.348000+08:00","text":"等一下你一併回答我，還有從這個RWA的議題上我們看到了，你是在交割跟清算末端的開發，倒是前端實體資產變成代幣化的部分我沒有看到你有提到，這一段我們也知道你想要自行開發相關的系統，因此你是委外，還是從國外找、還是找本土的業者？","quality":0.904},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:03:58.290000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:03:58.750000+08:00","text":"一併回答。","quality":1},{"speaker":"凌董事長忠嫄","start":"2026-03-25T10:03:59.691000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:04:08.639000+08:00","text":"謝謝委員，目前我們都是找本土的業者一起來做一些研議，像我剛剛提到的，譬如一些區塊鏈的開發廠商等等，都是我們本土的業者。","quality":0.963},{"speaker":"凌董事長忠嫄","start":"2026-03-25T10:04:09.239000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:04:11.501000+08:00","text":"至於我們是不是跟金管會有什麼PK？","quality":1},{"speaker":"凌董事長忠嫄","start":"2026-03-25T10:04:11.521000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:04:26.873000+08:00","text":"當然不是，金管會是我們的監理機關，它訂下的所有法規我們都要遵循，我們這整個RWA的開發因為是屬於虛擬資產的部分，所以也是要遵循金管會所訂的相關規則。","quality":0.928},{"speaker":"凌董事長忠嫄","start":"2026-03-25T10:04:28.494000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:04:35.279000+08:00","text":"虛擬資產的相關法規我不知道目前在哪一個階段，是不是已經在立法院了？","quality":1},{"speaker":"凌董事長忠嫄","start":"2026-03-25T10:04:35.819000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:04:38.261000+08:00","text":"法規一旦通過的話，我們就會依據相關法規，在它規範的架構下來進行。","quality":0.966},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:04:42.644000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:04:53.475000+08:00","text":"好，我再回到一個相同的議題，前端實體資產代幣化的這一段，目前你進行到什麼樣的階段？","quality":0.919},{"speaker":"凌董事長忠嫄","start":"2026-03-25T10:04:54.806000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:05:13.630000+08:00","text":"目前我們就是跟八家聯合，因為這八家不只是泛公股的而已，還包括一些民營的、包括玉山還有中信銀行等等，我們有成立一個小組，另外跟其他相關聯的業者有定期做一些討論跟研發。","quality":0.961},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:05:13.630000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:05:20.991000+08:00","text":"好，董事長，你就是這個聯盟的盟主，你有承諾大家一定是用本土的業者，現在我們大家都聽到了。對。","quality":0.775},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:05:22.212000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:05:34.998000+08:00","text":"用本土的業者本來就是有相當、相當地必要性，萬一有重要的狀況發生，本土業者才可以非常實際地來支援我們。是。","quality":0.936},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:05:36.499000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:05:36.659000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝董事長。","quality":0.5},{"speaker":"凌董事長忠嫄","start":"2026-03-25T10:05:36.659000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-25T10:05:37.659000+08:00","text":"謝謝委員指教。","quality":0},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:05:36.659000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:05:38.880000+08:00","text":"謝謝，董事長請回。","quality":0.714},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:05:39.300000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:05:46.424000+08:00","text":"部長，我想再討論的是針對少子化衍生出來的議題。","quality":0.619},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:05:53.765000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:06:14.116000+08:00","text":"從2020以來，其實我們整體的稅收逐步地成長，但是當中有一個必須要去注意到的情況，就是我們綜所稅成長的速度是緩慢的，其實這個很清楚，我們知道這是少子化所帶來對於稅收的影響。","quality":0.882},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:06:14.116000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:06:28.289000+08:00","text":"如果我們從2025年全國賦稅實徵淨額初步統計來看，我國的稅收是2兆7,362億元，相較2024年增加了465億，但是卻短徵了483億。","quality":0.841},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:06:28.469000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:06:30.492000+08:00","text":"部長，我要請教你，你怎麼樣去推估稅收的預算數？","quality":1},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:06:30.492000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:06:30.692000+08:00","text":"你是依據什麼？","quality":1},{"speaker":"莊部長翠雲","start":"2026-03-25T10:06:41.297000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:07:02.983000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，對於稅收的預算數怎麼樣去推估我們有一個專案小組，然後邀請了專家學者以及機關，像央行、主計總處還有國發會等等一起來討論，按照各個稅目，將會影響每個稅收的一些因子都納入討論。","quality":0.952},{"speaker":"莊部長翠雲","start":"2026-03-25T10:07:03.103000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:07:20.320000+08:00","text":"向委員報告，有關2025年的稅收，全國是達到預算數的99.6%，而中央是達成99.1%，較預算數短收251億。","quality":0.946},{"speaker":"莊部長翠雲","start":"2026-03-25T10:07:21.642000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:07:43.337000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，這其中有一個原因就是2025年美國對等關稅的措施實施，所以營利事業在這段時間受到衝擊的話，它可以申請延期跟分期繳納營所稅，所以這個部分我們會延後取得大概五百多億。","quality":0.936},{"speaker":"莊部長翠雲","start":"2026-03-25T10:07:43.337000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:07:53.263000+08:00","text":"所以整體來說，如果沒有這個因素影響的話，事實上是可以達成我們的預算數，而且是百分之百達成，大概都在百分之一以內變動，主要是這個原因。","quality":0.85},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:07:55.986000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:08:01.514000+08:00","text":"好，部長，我再請教你一個關鍵的議題，你有沒有預期今年民眾會大幅的調薪？","quality":0.871},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:08:02.175000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:08:09.446000+08:00","text":"還是因為大家在股市裡頭賺得更多，你會收到更多股市投資人的所得稅？","quality":0.933},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:08:09.446000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:08:11.409000+08:00","text":"是不是有這樣子的一個看法？","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:08:11.970000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:08:20.840000+08:00","text":"本席看到的是少子化的遞減，然後綜所稅的稅基結構面其實正在縮小。","quality":0.862},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:08:21.520000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:08:34.335000+08:00","text":"我們從國發會2024年發布的資料（2024至2070年人口推估），它預計15-64歲工作年齡人口占總人口的比例在2028年會低於三分之二。","quality":0.636},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:08:35.637000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:08:48.492000+08:00","text":"勞動力人口的減少，最直接影響到的就是綜所稅的萎縮，面對綜所稅稅基減少最直接的問題，你是不是有開始研究？","quality":0.787},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:08:48.992000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:08:58.836000+08:00","text":"因為不只是綜所稅減少，人口減少勢必會影響另一個議題，你的遺產稅、贈與稅是不是也會跟著調整？","quality":0.659},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:09:00.097000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:09:01.077000+08:00","text":"開始研究了沒有？","quality":1},{"speaker":"莊部長翠雲","start":"2026-03-25T10:09:01.438000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:09:13.786000+08:00","text":"謝謝委員的指教，對於因為人口結構的改變對稅收的影響，本部已經委外做一個研究，這個部分已經在研究當中。另外……","quality":1},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:09:14.506000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:09:17.448000+08:00","text":"部長，倒是我要請教你，這個研究進行了多久？","quality":1},{"speaker":"莊部長翠雲","start":"2026-03-25T10:09:18.349000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:09:22.713000+08:00","text":"這個研究應該是到今年，所以目前還在研究當中，研究報告還沒有出來。","quality":0.862},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:09:23.073000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:09:32.901000+08:00","text":"沒有，少子化影響到綜所稅、贈與稅，還有遺產稅稅基的結構面，你已經研究了多久？","quality":0.848},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:09:33.701000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:09:35.563000+08:00","text":"這個計畫進行了多久？","quality":1},{"speaker":"莊部長翠雲","start":"2026-03-25T10:09:35.563000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-25T10:09:36.563000+08:00","text":"我想這部分是不是請賦稅署來說明？","quality":0.067},{"speaker":"莊部長翠雲","start":"2026-03-25T10:09:36.563000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-25T10:09:37.563000+08:00","text":"這整個是它委外的。","quality":0},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:09:37.563000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-25T10:09:38.563000+08:00","text":"好，賦稅署。","quality":0},{"speaker":"宋署長秀玲","start":"2026-03-25T10:09:36.623000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:09:38.604000+08:00","text":"報告委員，我們是從去年9月開始委外到今年結束。","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:09:38.724000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:09:39.384000+08:00","text":"它是不是一個計畫？","quality":1},{"speaker":"宋署長秀玲","start":"2026-03-25T10:09:39.384000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:09:39.765000+08:00","text":"是一個計畫，委外研究計畫。","quality":0.455},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:09:39.765000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:09:40.465000+08:00","text":"這個計畫的規模有多大？","quality":1},{"speaker":"宋署長秀玲","start":"2026-03-25T10:09:40.565000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:09:43.266000+08:00","text":"規模是說經費嗎？還是？對。","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"宋署長秀玲","start":"2026-03-25T10:09:43.386000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:09:44.346000+08:00","text":"經費大概九十餘萬元。","quality":0.889},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:09:44.426000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:09:44.426000+08:00","text":"這麼少啊！","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"宋署長秀玲","start":"2026-03-25T10:10:03.870000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:10:06.033000+08:00","text":"我們的預算編列就是這麼多。","quality":1},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:10:06.374000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:10:22.541000+08:00","text":"少子化是目前會影響你整個稅基、任何一個稅，一個很大的、很嚴重的最主要原因，你一個規模這麼小的計畫案，我們能期待它研究出什麼內容？","quality":0.879},{"speaker":"宋署長秀玲","start":"2026-03-25T10:10:22.541000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:10:25.083000+08:00","text":"我們委託的專家學者基本上……","quality":1},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:10:25.683000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:10:26.564000+08:00","text":"都很強？","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"宋署長秀玲","start":"2026-03-25T10:10:26.564000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-25T10:10:27.564000+08:00","text":"對，很強，然後他是……","quality":0},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:10:26.564000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:10:30.366000+08:00","text":"所以做出來的結果一定都是最好的、最精準的？","quality":0.895},{"speaker":"宋署長秀玲","start":"2026-03-25T10:10:30.506000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:10:37.829000+08:00","text":"對，我們是委託政大財政學系的主任陳國樑教授，他有一個研究團隊。","quality":0.643},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:10:39.250000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:10:41.432000+08:00","text":"你不能跟我講說政大就最強啊！","quality":0.923},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:10:41.952000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:10:42.592000+08:00","text":"為什麼不要委託臺大呢？","quality":1},{"speaker":"宋署長秀玲","start":"2026-03-25T10:10:42.592000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-25T10:10:43.592000+08:00","text":"不是，他對這個議題很有研究。","quality":0},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:10:42.612000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:10:47.896000+08:00","text":"我的意思是在凸顯你這個計畫案，如果你們的態度是這個樣子的話，未來將面臨的，我們贈與稅跟遺產稅的研究勢必會不夠周全，所以我要看你這個計畫，好不好？","quality":0.879},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:10:47.956000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:11:03.905000+08:00","text":"部長，請把這個計畫……","quality":1},{"speaker":"莊部長翠雲","start":"2026-03-25T10:11:03.905000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:11:15.709000+08:00","text":"我知道，委員認為應該要更重視這樣的議題，這個部分因為受到預算的限制，我們賦稅署錢還不夠，還要用部裡面的錢去挪用一些來做這個研究計畫案。","quality":0.903},{"speaker":"莊部長翠雲","start":"2026-03-25T10:11:16.229000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:11:17.450000+08:00","text":"我們在過程當中會讓研究團隊們能夠更周全地去思考各種因素，然後研究報告出來以後，未來我們在估租稅、預算的時候再納入考量。","quality":0.855},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:11:17.450000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-25T10:11:18.450000+08:00","text":"好，部長，正視啊！","quality":0},{"speaker":"賴委員惠員","start":"2026-03-25T10:11:17.490000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:11:33.121000+08:00","text":"這個禮拜把這個報告的研究進度給本席，好不好？","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"莊部長翠雲","start":"2026-03-25T10:11:34.503000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:11:36.447000+08:00","text":"好的，報告到時候也會提供給委員參考。謝謝。","quality":0.611},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-03-25T10:11:36.447000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:11:36.948000+08:00","text":"謝謝賴惠員委員。","quality":0.714},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-03-25T10:11:36.948000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-25T10:11:37.890000+08:00","text":"下一位請林岱樺委員質詢。","quality":0.818}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}