{"error":false,"id":["168005"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":168005,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/168005","日期":"2026-03-30","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"委員會-11-5-35-5","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第5會期外交及國防委員會第5次全體委員會議","屆":11,"會期":5,"會次":5,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"委員會","委員會代碼":[35],"委員會代碼:str":["外交及國防委員會"],"標題":"第11屆第5會期外交及國防委員會第5次全體委員會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2026-03-30T09:42:00+08:00","結束時間":"2026-03-30T09:52:19+08:00","影片長度":"00:10:19","支援功能":["ai-transcript"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/d0265d86f2f18c67532c5951d105e0347f5bc5cff238b3be44e2a508d43692327b10ae65e3cca9285ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"王安祥","委員發言時間":"09:42:00 - 09:52:19","會議時間":"2026-03-30T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第5會期外交及國防委員會第5次全體委員會議（事由：邀請國防部部長顧立雄報告「國軍年度軍事投資計畫與財政負擔能力之動態平衡評估」，並備質詢。）","transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":0.84096875,"end":2.56221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":2.88284375,"end":3.60846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":4.53659375,"end":6.7809687499999995},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":7.185968750000001,"end":9.109718750000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":10.98284375,"end":58.604093750000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":11.77596875,"end":12.78846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":62.265968750000006,"end":63.51471875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":63.51471875000001,"end":65.33721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":64.89846875,"end":68.89784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":69.65721875,"end":102.29346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":103.84596875000001,"end":104.80784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":106.71471875,"end":107.65971875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":108.70596875000001,"end":111.15284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":110.10659375,"end":123.45471875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":115.23659375000001,"end":115.48971875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":125.27721875,"end":142.74284375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":143.33346875,"end":172.07159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":178.24784375000002,"end":179.02409375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":180.84659375,"end":223.37159375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":187.47846875000002,"end":187.93409375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":198.90284375000002,"end":199.30784375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":219.76034375,"end":220.04721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":223.10159375,"end":227.79284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":226.59471875000003,"end":230.05409375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":229.32846875,"end":236.56784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":236.95596875,"end":283.85159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":284.72909375,"end":286.01159375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":286.43346875000003,"end":303.71346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":288.05346875000004,"end":288.32346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":303.71346875,"end":304.05096875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":304.40534375000004,"end":309.68721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":310.10909375,"end":329.92034375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":312.08346875,"end":312.10034375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":330.17346875000004,"end":349.27596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":348.97221875,"end":351.79034375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":351.41909375,"end":351.70596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":352.09409375,"end":380.07284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":360.81846875,"end":361.10534375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":380.29221875,"end":380.52846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":381.28784375000004,"end":424.77471875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":426.59721875,"end":436.72221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":437.31284375,"end":443.69159375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":440.36721875,"end":440.55284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":443.84346875000006,"end":445.44659375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":445.44659375000003,"end":447.28596875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":447.30284375,"end":447.31971875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":447.31971875000005,"end":447.67409375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":448.14659375,"end":460.43159375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":460.75221875000005,"end":461.69721875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":460.76909375,"end":461.44409375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":461.69721875000005,"end":462.22034375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":462.38909375000003,"end":465.49409375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":465.96659375,"end":466.27034375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":466.82721875000004,"end":467.55284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":467.87346875000003,"end":472.12596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":469.39221875000004,"end":469.64534375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":470.48909375000005,"end":470.69159375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":472.73346875000004,"end":474.13409375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":474.64034375000006,"end":500.71221875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":496.17284375,"end":496.56096875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":500.44221875000005,"end":505.01534375000006},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":504.59346875000006,"end":520.01721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":510.93846875,"end":511.22534375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":519.15659375,"end":551.5903437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":554.74596875,"end":556.7878437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":556.7878437500001,"end":557.0578437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":557.15909375,"end":557.54721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":558.01971875,"end":559.9265937499999},{"speaker":"SPEA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有請顧部長請顧部長也請詹貴司司長 侯司長請詹貴司 黃司長"},{"start":11.124,"end":40.384,"text":"部長好 市長早上禮拜我們連續三天在討論這個預算不是預算 是我們這個條例的部分因為我剛好坐在市長對面我也在觀察市長的狀況前幾天媒體大幅報導市長表情的狀況還好啦 昨天晚上看起來是好消息我想我們也透過很多方法跟美方大家透過一些民間的方法告訴他們說我們其實"},{"start":41.184,"end":68.337,"text":"不是 再來一檔其實基本上也是贊成軍購的部分我們也事先授權給國防部先去預約基本上我想這個是好消息市長應該是吧 有暫時心情稍微舒緩了一點幫我們全力以赴好 他跟我說他下次在立法院的時候他的姿態管理要關掉"},{"start":70.268,"end":75.536,"text":"不過我想大家都一樣都是非常努力的在促成這件事情"},{"start":76.434,"end":104.231,"text":"那我想我今天主要基本上因為那天應該是禮拜三的時候我有提到一些我們在做討論那個不管是名稱啦或是裡面具體的內容的部分其實有講到這個飛鴻的部分啦當然有些人是說這個什麼供應鏈啦更進一步不過基本上那天有特別提到大家比較肯設的就是無人機的部分啦那看起來好像我們過去已經買了這個大概市面都要大概八家嘛不曉得市長這個數字是不是正確大概現在的狀況"},{"start":107.055,"end":123.106,"text":"這軍用的啦現在講的是無人機您是講前面的4000多架對對對 之前的啦 之前的是那我們也很關心現在那個飛紅的狀況所以部長或市長可以告訴我們一下有關於過去這個無人機的採購我們現在飛紅的程度大概是怎麼樣"},{"start":125.997,"end":140.552,"text":"我們飛鴻的原則是一貫的那前面的4700多架從微型一直到幕後型無人機的這個部分那也是要求國內廠商必須以國內自己的技術或是國外可以取得的飛鴻技術來產製這些無人機"},{"start":143.419,"end":171.83,"text":"是 因為我們過去都在機關裡面我們過去國安法跟國防長的條例還有我們最近有一個新的自動安全審查辦法去年12月基本上要求都會越來越嚴格我們也受到很多的管制我們接下來可能還會有一些所謂的商購的部分不曉得無人街這個部分我們要怎麼確保這個非紅的狀況尤其大家很多聽過什麼洗產地或者一些基本上的零件的部分是不是可以再跟大家說明一下"},{"start":178.542,"end":178.785,"text":"對 加速了"},{"start":180.865,"end":208.107,"text":"跟委員說明第一個我們原本是特別預算通過我們要公告的我們就設定了我們的20萬家然後分成疊代的問題我們就分成兩個年度大概115跟116大概要買了四萬八千多家我們已經召開了兩次的說明會尤其在去年11月國內兩三百家都來我們也跟他們說明了我們這個四萬八千多家一定要在台生產在台組裝"},{"start":209.068,"end":235.32,"text":"杜絕紅色供應鏈而且我們的無人機是要整機拆驗並且要經過資測會相關的資通的檢驗我們要杜絕這個紅色供應鏈那這個部分我們一定會落實在地化的生產你這樣說明是不是可以提供我更多一些資料就你們現在預備要我們可以把一些說明會的資料提供給委員辦公室我想大家都非常關心因為那天在講名稱的時候或一些說明的時候我想在座大家都非常非常關心這個問題"},{"start":237.062,"end":262.639,"text":"那另外就是我上次其實有特別提到這件事情就是在那個特別預算裡面有提到一些作為費的部分作為費的部分那我們也這個光輝也來跟我做一些說明不過我想這次我們又增購了一些武器我想這個作為費的部分一定會慢慢就會一直來增加那尤其是現在這次我們新買的一些武器包含這個是I3海馬4"},{"start":263.88,"end":283.645,"text":"那我們當然知道這個有新的武器基本上它的一些cost model可能都會有一些不一樣的狀況不曉得國安部對這個部分尤其新式採購跟舊的部分有沒有做過這樣的評估啊那我們那個作為飛行會不會在哪一個年度會達到高峰那會影響到我們的一些我們今天主要的議題就是有關於我們的預算的部分財政的部分"},{"start":284.91,"end":302.625,"text":"發委員,作為費是沒有高峰的這個問題,作為費只有依照需求我們去籌編,那當然像過去這幾年來,敵情威脅陡峰的狀況導致我們的油料零件等大幅增加之後,我們會適度的去調整我們作為費的預判額度"},{"start":304.446,"end":329.451,"text":"那我們在這次特別預算裡面,您剛剛問到會不會成為常態,基本上我們不希望它成為常態。目前我們在這次特別預算裡面,編列的兩大重點是我們要快速的提高我們的基本的戰備量,尤其是關鍵彈藥的那個部分,以及各式系統有必要的部分,我們才會在這個地方放進來。"},{"start":330.911,"end":350.538,"text":"我有看到那個115年的預算裡面這個後勤通知系統大概就編了1500多億嘛580幾億我的意思說未來我們general budget裡面這些部分會不會可能因為我們有新式的這些武器進來會影響到可能會變成會變得更高或是跟過去會有很明顯的一個差異報告員這個要看他的武器裝備的性質我們"},{"start":352.199,"end":379.093,"text":"目前所有的武器裝備裡面作為耗費最高的是航才就是各式飛機包含直升機之內它佔的比例是最高的那您可以看得到在這一次我們特別預算裡面編列的項目絕大部分是屬於彈藥類或是屬於地面的武器系統的這個部分它的那個佔比以及它的消耗額度就相對的會低很多尤其是彈藥類的部分"},{"start":381.328,"end":405.61,"text":"那我上次的質詢裡面其實有提到了大概一個概念就是我們發現很多的這個文號的字號其實它那個年跟月其實好像有點順序不是非常一致的狀況那很感謝國安部也跟我們做了一些說明不過我對於這個大家看到這個投影片上面就有關於這個像是擴增這個產線的部分這個好像做了一些調整國安部的意思也說好像做了那個產線的一些調整"},{"start":406.491,"end":423.938,"text":"那不過大家可以看到這個的年份他的月份是在114年12月跟115年的1月大家都知道特別預算送進來的時間是114年11月送進來的那我不知道這個狀況到底是怎麼樣是因為有做一些調整其實budget應該會改變吧"},{"start":427.411,"end":447.026,"text":"對,包委員我們這個部分在確定這個上限額度之前我們就依照2500億的這個部分數量的部分在平行的部分我們是有做了一些修調所以我們是控管在它的這個範圍之內是在預算內做了一些調整對"},{"start":448.226,"end":465.145,"text":"所以結論就是說他的數量或者他的金額可能都不會受到影響就後面調整我們現在已經框了1.25兆了嘛對不對那可是後端這個部分有一些調整可是不會影響到1.25兆的總預算不會所以增加也不會增加或減少都不會影響"},{"start":466.892,"end":482.525,"text":"包委員這個不是增加或減少不會有影響我剛剛已經講了這是我們在確保財政紀律法的前提之下不讓我們的這整個軍購案造成國家財力太大的負擔所以"},{"start":483.386,"end":502.107,"text":"針對那個個案裡面它的數量如果說我們要維持在一定的預算額度的部分我們就會做一個平行的調整比如說A案它目前的迫切性沒有那麼高我們會稍微降低一下它的數量B案如果目前我們認為它可以獲得而且迫切性比較高所以您的調整的是在這一項裡面"},{"start":503.268,"end":529.025,"text":"像室內做調整所以包委您看到那個文號必須要看到整個序列因為我們整歸書的部分做任何一點維修條包括裡面的標題甚至某一些文字的修訂我們就會賦予他一個新的文號所以事實上我的意思是說我已經接納你們上次跟我說的一些解釋啦我只是說最後這個部分我還是不是非常了解因為最後作為調整我們如果是1.25兆的總"},{"start":530.726,"end":551.287,"text":"框了這麼大一塊嘛有些調整我覺得應該會有一些調整沒關係我們再來再來做一些溝通啦那另外就是我們其實還是比較擔心這個所謂軍用衛星啦我們整個通訊的部分啦我不知道因為那天有特別提到這個Link16的部分啦就是有一些戰艦的部分不曉得現在是不是所有我們的戰艦上那個Link16都是OK的"},{"start":554.81,"end":581.545,"text":"包委員另一個16是美製系統對所以只適用於美製的裝備是那所以我們這次看到那個伊朗的部分其實他這個通訊的部分有受到一些這個軟性的攻擊不曉得我們現在整個對通訊系統的部分我們這個整個這個韌性的部分是怎麼樣做調整包委員這個部分可能屬於高度敏感疾病是是是不方便在這邊說好沒關係我們私下在"},{"start":582.832,"end":599.823,"text":"對 LINK-16相關這個部門應該是屬於機密案件我們私下再跟委員做說明好 沒有問題那天有特別提到這個 LINK-22有特別提到這個事情因為美方應該也有做一些Promise"},{"start":601.485,"end":618.156,"text":"這個部分我想也私下再跟委員長說那這一次我其實這一次有特別提到上次有一些主責廠商的部分這一次的那個公告好像沒有特別看到那這部分再請跟國防部做一些溝通那感謝好 謝謝委員"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}