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你如果說是要打消它的累虧800多億再加上現在可能增加了兩三百億 那就1000億啊那為什麼中油要增資3500億 理由是什麼跟委員報告齁 其實剛委員估算的只是氣的部分其實油的部分還沒有加進來所以油是多少 油大概預計會多付出多少成本"},{"start":186.772,"end":201.683,"text":"預計大概65億美金65億美金是因為中東戰事的關係所以加起來你覺得是3500億所以3500億就不含別的就純粹是因為中東戰事所衍生出來的成本增加就3500億"},{"start":205.285,"end":227.692,"text":"這麼多?三千五百億是中友提出的是四年三千五百億那我們會評估到底這三千五百億有沒有需要所以我們現在目前報到行政人員沒有這麼多因為你們現在那時候部長就講說已經提了三千五百億報到行政人員是一千多億 一千七百億一千七百億而已是不是再我問一下再一分鐘就好"},{"start":227.932,"end":249.891,"text":"沒有沒有 剛剛大家都可以喔 因為我一個小問題就好一個小問題就是因為大家現在在質疑說中油他油價公式啊以前是七成杜拜三成布蘭特油嘛但是現在其實我們購買的比例美國油是比較多大概六成中東降到四成以下那之前大家在問啊中油是說這公司有沒有訂的 去問經濟部啊經濟部現在立場怎麼樣"},{"start":251.273,"end":269.687,"text":"中友目前也委託一些經濟部的立場給他回答一下經濟部的立場你們希望他能夠調整嗎我們會來做一個檢討什麼時候檢討因為隨時每一週都在動你不能夠拖到流年馬月去什麼時候會有一個公式公式的調整方案什麼時候"},{"start":270.908,"end":296.514,"text":"可能至少半年啦 半年左右要半年 那這半年這半年呢 大家中油多調的部分咧為什麼要半年呢 因為你每週都在調油價嘛那公司竟然發現有問題 為什麼不立刻調油因為這個可能要做一個更深入的一些沒有 我覺得這樣可能大家不太能夠接受啦大家可能不太能接受中油有很多的一些成本沒有加進來那這可能兩回事嘛 你現在他已經提政治計畫了嘛這一碼歸一碼嘛 不要全部的事情都混在一起了謝謝 謝謝"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:13:00.069000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:13:00.149000+08:00","text":"麻煩請次長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-01T11:13:00.149000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-01T11:13:07.714500+08:00","text":"經濟部何次長。","quality":0},{"speaker":"何次長晉滄","start":"2026-04-01T11:13:07.714500+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-01T11:13:15.280000+08:00","text":"葉委員好。","quality":0.25},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:13:15.280000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:13:22.025000+08:00","text":"次長，我上次有問部長，因為我們現在的天然氣是在現貨市場去搶，大概比原來貴多少？","quality":0.886},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:13:22.226000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:13:24.948000+08:00","text":"他說大概一船是貴11億。對。","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:13:24.948000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:13:33.474000+08:00","text":"如果二十幾艘的話，中油大概多付出兩百多億了，現在有最新的數據嗎？","quality":0.724},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:13:34.495000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:13:35.676000+08:00","text":"有沒有？","quality":1},{"speaker":"何次長晉滄","start":"2026-04-01T11:13:36.076000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:13:36.076000+08:00","text":"可能……請張總。","quality":0.4},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:13:37.678000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:13:39.759000+08:00","text":"因為不斷在搶嘛，預計大概要搶幾艘？","quality":0.867},{"speaker":"張總經理敏","start":"2026-04-01T11:13:41.705000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:13:51.376000+08:00","text":"每個月的船期都排好的嘛，因應要經過荷姆茲海峽的船，我們目前去找替代了，所以數量都是一定的。","quality":0.951},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:13:51.757000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:13:51.977000+08:00","text":"多少嘛？","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:13:52.438000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:13:55.701000+08:00","text":"因為主席控制我們的時間控制得很緊，你可不可以針對問題回答？","quality":0.926},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:13:57.403000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:14:00.047000+08:00","text":"之前是說二十幾艘，還要再增加嗎？","quality":0.857},{"speaker":"張經經理敏","start":"2026-04-01T11:14:00.047000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-01T11:14:01.866000+08:00","text":"到6月底就差不多這個數字。","quality":0.273},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:14:01.866000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:14:12.953000+08:00","text":"到6月底就是這個數字，但是如果戰事拖長的話，比如7月、8月的話，很可能就繼續延續下去，就不只多增加兩百多億，可能三百多億、四百多億都有可能嘛！","quality":0.85},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:14:13.933000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:14:16.235000+08:00","text":"上次我問部長，中油怎麼辦？","quality":1},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:14:16.855000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:14:26.401000+08:00","text":"他的解決方案是中油要提出增資計畫，我特別去看一下，中油的增資計畫有一個背景是因為中油的負債比很高，大概92%，累虧大概八百多億。是。","quality":0.914},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:14:29.903000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:14:52.211000+08:00","text":"每一年的利息就付了非常多，但很奇怪的是，因為之前中油類似的狀況也有跟經濟部提出增資計畫，但是都被打回票，打回票的理由是中油都還有盈餘849億，那我就不懂，為什麼之前增資被打回票的理由是有盈餘，現在又忽然間說增資很重要，原因是什麼？","quality":0.951},{"speaker":"何次長晉滄","start":"2026-04-01T11:14:52.211000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:14:56.853000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，那個是淨值，不是盈餘。","quality":1},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:14:57.814000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:14:58.154000+08:00","text":"對不起，是淨值。","quality":0.5},{"speaker":"何次長晉滄","start":"2026-04-01T11:15:01.055000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:15:05.397000+08:00","text":"是，畢竟它的負債比拉高……沒有！","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:15:06.097000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:15:12.400000+08:00","text":"因為經濟部最近才打回票，現在忽然間又要大家去支持增資計畫，中間的轉折是什麼？","quality":1},{"speaker":"何次長晉滄","start":"2026-04-01T11:15:14.968000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:15:18.050000+08:00","text":"最主要是這一次的中東戰事。","quality":1},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:15:18.150000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:15:19.210000+08:00","text":"是因為中東戰事？","quality":1},{"speaker":"何次長晉滄","start":"2026-04-01T11:15:19.610000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:15:24.172000+08:00","text":"中東戰事讓它每天吸收的成本會增加。","quality":0.812},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:15:24.593000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:15:31.476000+08:00","text":"好，主要是中東戰事，所以經濟部才忽然間改變立場去支持它的增資計畫。","quality":0.767},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:15:32.116000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:15:42.241000+08:00","text":"剛剛講到因為中東戰事的關係，所以多付出的成本大概是兩百多億，我想問為什麼它的增資計畫是3,500億？","quality":0.86},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:15:44.421000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:15:55.049000+08:00","text":"如果是要打消它的累虧八百多億，再加上現在可能增加了兩、三百億，那就1,000億啊，為什麼中油要增資3,500億，理由是什麼？","quality":0.917},{"speaker":"何次長晉滄","start":"2026-04-01T11:15:55.049000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:16:02.075000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，其實剛剛委員估算只是氣的部分，油的部分還沒有加進來。","quality":0.966},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:16:02.075000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:16:02.775000+08:00","text":"所以油是多少？","quality":1},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:16:03.376000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:16:05.598000+08:00","text":"油預計會多付出多少成本？","quality":1},{"speaker":"何次長晉滄","start":"2026-04-01T11:16:06.772000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:16:10.415000+08:00","text":"大概65億美金。","quality":1},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:16:11.736000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:16:14.338000+08:00","text":"65億美金，是因為中東戰事的關係？對。","quality":0.929},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:16:14.338000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:16:21.683000+08:00","text":"所以你覺得加起來是3,500億，這3,500億不含別的，純粹是因為中東戰事所衍生出來的成本增加，就3,500億？是。","quality":0.805},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:16:25.285000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:16:25.285000+08:00","text":"這麼多喔！不是。","quality":0.5},{"speaker":"胡司長文中","start":"2026-04-01T11:16:26.845000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:16:36.408000+08:00","text":"不是，3.500億是中油提出的4年3,500億，我們會評估到底這3,500億有沒有需要，所以我們目前報到行政院的沒有這麼多。","quality":0.822},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:16:36.408000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-01T11:16:37.408000+08:00","text":"沒有這麼多，那是多少？","quality":0},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:16:37.229000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:16:40.790000+08:00","text":"因為那時候部長就講已經提了3,500億？","quality":0.933},{"speaker":"胡司長文中","start":"2026-04-01T11:16:40.790000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:16:43.451000+08:00","text":"現在報到行政院是1,700億。","quality":0.6},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:16:44.971000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:16:45.811000+08:00","text":"1,700億而已，是不是？好。","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:16:45.871000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:16:48.613000+08:00","text":"我再問一下，1分鐘就好。沒有……","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:16:48.753000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:16:51.075000+08:00","text":"剛剛大家都可以，我有一個小問題就好。20秒……","quality":0.882},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:16:52.576000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:17:04.326000+08:00","text":"因為大家現在在質疑中油的油價公式，以前說七成杜拜、三成布蘭特油，但是現在我們購買比例是美國油比較多，大概六成，中東降到四成以下。","quality":0.948},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:17:05.307000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:17:08.690000+08:00","text":"之前大家在問，中油說這公式又不是我訂的，去問經濟部。","quality":0.783},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:17:09.591000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:17:09.891000+08:00","text":"經濟部現在立場怎麼樣？","quality":1},{"speaker":"何次長晉滄","start":"2026-04-01T11:17:11.273000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:17:12.674000+08:00","text":"中油目前也委託一些……","quality":0.889},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-01T11:17:12.674000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-01T11:17:16.116000+08:00","text":"好，1分鐘到了。","quality":0},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:17:16.116000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:17:17.938000+08:00","text":"經濟部的立場，你給他回答一下。","quality":0.538},{"speaker":"何次長晉滄","start":"2026-04-01T11:17:17.938000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-01T11:17:18.938000+08:00","text":"我們會再……","quality":0},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:17:18.138000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:17:19.239000+08:00","text":"你們希望它能夠調整嗎？","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"何次長晉滄","start":"2026-04-01T11:17:19.239000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:17:21.721000+08:00","text":"我們會來做一個檢討。","quality":1},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:17:21.721000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:17:22.201000+08:00","text":"什麼時候檢討？","quality":1},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:17:22.201000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:17:29.527000+08:00","text":"因為它每一週都在動，你不能夠拖到牛年馬月去啊，什麼時候會有一個公式的調整方案？","quality":0.917},{"speaker":"何次長晉滄","start":"2026-04-01T11:17:30.908000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:17:31.928000+08:00","text":"我們會等中油……可能至少半年。","quality":0.5},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:17:32.668000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:17:36.549000+08:00","text":"怎麼又要半年，這半年中油多調的部分呢？","quality":0.765},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-01T11:17:36.549000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-01T11:17:38.170000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝……","quality":0},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:17:38.170000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:17:38.590000+08:00","text":"為什麼要半年？","quality":1},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:17:38.890000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:17:42.191000+08:00","text":"因為每週都在調油價，公式既然發現有問題，為什麼不立刻調？","quality":0.92},{"speaker":"何次長晉滄","start":"2026-04-01T11:17:42.331000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:17:44.631000+08:00","text":"因為可能要做更深入的一些……","quality":1},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:17:44.771000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:17:47.092000+08:00","text":"沒有，我覺得這樣子可能大家不太能夠接受啦！謝謝……","quality":0.857},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:17:47.732000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:17:48.732000+08:00","text":"大家可能不太能接受。","quality":1},{"speaker":"何次長晉滄","start":"2026-04-01T11:17:48.852000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:17:50.793000+08:00","text":"中油有很多的成本沒有加進來。","quality":1},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:17:50.893000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:17:54.454000+08:00","text":"這是兩回事嘛，現在它已經提增資計畫了，這一碼歸一碼嘛！","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"葉委員元之","start":"2026-04-01T11:17:54.914000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-01T11:17:56.514000+08:00","text":"不要全部的事情都混在一起了。謝謝。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-01T11:17:57.014000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-01T11:18:15.299714+08:00","text":"因為我當主席，本委員會我都很準時5加1分鐘，但是跳過的委員比本席講得還久，此例不可開，以後類似狀況要來質詢的委員請注意時間，跳過就沒有再回頭了。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-01T11:18:15.599714+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-01T11:18:19.028286+08:00","text":"最後一位請陳冠廷委員，2分鐘。","quality":0}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}