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對那請問他上任的人是不是因為談判辦公室的作業疏失導致他被延誤兩個星期才上任有嗎"},{"start":53.7,"end":65.093,"text":"你不曉得沒關係你曉得就說曉得不曉得就說不曉得這個訊息我們不曉得那請問一下李副委這個編制上副總談判代表有沒有專任的秘書"},{"start":68.74,"end":91.806,"text":"但是以下的問題都是你知道就說知道,不知道就說不知道沒關係因為他是台美會的主任委員,那他是兼任副總談判的代表所以基本上我們是應該是沒有配秘書的沒有專任秘書那他第一天上班就被拋銷這件事情行政院有沒有掌握這個我們不清楚,我們是看到媒體報導才知道"},{"start":93.646,"end":100.031,"text":"好,那再來呢,我想要請教一下李副秘書長,特仁館的顏慧欣副總談判代表是何時開始請病假的?不知道?去年9月的時候呢,就不細細。好,那請問一下他在這個今年2月19號,是大年初三的時候,在病榻前寫的這個辭職信,請問一下行政院是何時收到這封辭職信的?"},{"start":119.782,"end":139.627,"text":"那請問卓院長有沒有交辦這件事情?跟委員報告,那卓院長昨天回答王育敏委員的質詢的時候呢那他是有這樣子說啦,說他2月19號的時候呢那嚴副總有把這個訊息傳給行政院那個院長室的幕僚,那幕僚有把這個訊息給院長看"},{"start":141.187,"end":161.913,"text":"那院長對他表達關心,但是也希望他好好休息休息好以後,病好以後,能夠繼續為國來效力所以換言之是沒有處理這個實質性?我們不知道你不知道就回答不知道沒關係,我就是在釐清一些問題而已"},{"start":164.557,"end":177.303,"text":"所以這個我想要請教一下那今年的2月23是年後上班的第一天那到了3月12號這個顏副總代表他辭世請問你們有什麼中間有什麼任何的作為嗎"},{"start":181.533,"end":198.376,"text":"沒有不曉得因為我們根本不知道這個訊息所以其實我想要表達的就是今天的報告說行政院是3月26號才開始啟動調查嘛對不對那也就是說在3月24號的這種霸凌案被揭露之後"},{"start":199.096,"end":217.855,"text":"被媒體揭露之後被媒體逼出來之後才在兩天的時間說要開始有動作所以這就是突顯出從這個個案突顯出整個這個行政的失靈然後也突顯出行政院的一個冷漠無作為"},{"start":219.281,"end":243.756,"text":"跟委員報告因為這過了很這個看起來這時間過了非常的久啊然後也是被媒體揭露之後才開始兩天的時間才開始說好那我們要來啟動調查我們事實上也是3月26號看到那個Tree的報導的時候他那個詳細的揭露那些事情的時候我們知悉這件事情我們馬上就組成那個專案小組要來釐清事實對所以你不覺得這裡面哪裡疏漏了嗎"},{"start":250.529,"end":259.063,"text":"因為我們是真的3月26號才知道的所以你這樣的講法就會讓這個我們覺得說那行政院長明明就知道了2月19號就知道了怎麼過了這麼多這麼久的時間沒有交辦沒有去請"},{"start":264.029,"end":286.462,"text":"這個下面的去相關了解這個案情的事情好等到媒體報了之後才匆匆的說我們趕快來調查這就是我今天想要從這個個案推出來讓大家覺得說哇這個很很嘩然喔讓社會嘩然怎麼會行政院長自己本身已經知道這件事情居然沒有請責成下下面的人去了解去關心"},{"start":287.768,"end":300.124,"text":"這就是現在大家在討論一個這個時間點的問題所以這部分我想要再進一步從這個個案推到這個系統性的問題我想要再請這個保訓會的處長保訓會處長"},{"start":315.08,"end":327.941,"text":"好 我想要請問兩位就是你們可以看是誰的執掌來負責回答所以首先我想要請教根據你們的114年度的職場霸凌防治執行的情形調查表"},{"start":328.905,"end":346.025,"text":"就是更深入探討了霸凌行為的層級關係跟行為樣態那表上呢也有顯示這個此項調查是自114年的7月1日到12月31日指對不對然後要求各機關詳時記錄所有受理的情形"},{"start":346.886,"end":364.704,"text":"那這個統計的框架不僅包含了案件數啦也更深入的這個探討了霸凌行為的層級關係行為樣態那你們最後要求的截止通報日是3月31號那今天是4月1號是不是想必你們資料是已經有收集完成了對嗎"},{"start":368.055,"end":388.261,"text":"跟委員報告這個部分因為還有少數的主管機關他還在彙整中像是一些縣市政府因為他下面所有機關其實很多那所以我們有已經在31號的時候我們另外有在行文去催請大家所以等於是說你本來說3月31號要要求這些資料回來是還很多人沒有繳回來是這個意思嗎"},{"start":388.621,"end":408.643,"text":"一部分 並沒有很多 就一部分是不是因為其實我們就是 我本席也有在上週就有跟相關的單位包含人事總書有去索資喔 那目前我是沒有得到回應所以我這邊想要請教喔 第一個就是根據你們目前為止的資料喔你們統計的案件數前三名的部會是哪幾個"},{"start":410.543,"end":427.671,"text":"目前你們報告目前我們收到了其實還不齊全啊我們後續在整個整體收完之後我們還要再做進一步通所以目前還不知道是好所以你也沒辦法評估說哪三哪三個是案件比較多的是好那再來第二個問題"},{"start":428.837,"end":444.773,"text":"就是職場霸凌的申訴數量總共是多少結案數是多少你現在等於也沒辦法回答是那再來第三個我想要了解的事情是職場霸凌申訴後霸凌者行這個處分的份件數有幾件你們也沒有現在也都沒有有沒有初步的數據也都沒有"},{"start":448.991,"end":459.417,"text":"這部分可能都得要等三月份的這一份那我剛剛問的這三個問題就是我本席想要希望你們等這個資料回來之後提供給本席辦公室讓我們瞭解好不好是"},{"start":460.137,"end":488.704,"text":"因為這份表格其實我覺得是相對相關是蠻完整的我希望你們可以盡快到時候去識別化之後也定期的公佈那我也想要提醒這個表格其實明確的也有規定說114年的7月1日前所有的案件數均不記錄所以事實上你們到現在還沒有辦法完全的拿到這些資料我也很好奇喔因為這個明明就已經這段時間已經很久了並不是說這個中間持續增加的還要他們"},{"start":490.835,"end":502.612,"text":"還要他們再補上去所以你也給了很多的時間了這個部分要請你落實去追蹤要求相關的部會誰還沒有交回來的哪一些地方政府還沒交回來的你要趕快去跟他們要求好不好是"},{"start":504.209,"end":528.886,"text":"好那再來就是我想要最後我也想要詢問監察院有指出這個許多的機關的人事處在接受到霸凌陳情的時候常常為了顧及長官的顏面將其歸類為一般申訴導致案情沒有辦法進入法定的防護小組甚至也有報導指出這個經濟部的技術司案中即便有監察院的報告背書"},{"start":529.887,"end":546.842,"text":"內部仍然會傳出說抓吹哨者的這個吹哨者的這個風聲那這反映出來我們公務機關其實在這個文化裡面對於異議的聲音極度的不受不耐受導致內部修正機制完全失靈請問這件事要怎麼改善"},{"start":548.953,"end":570.884,"text":"各位委員報告依照這個公務人員保障法跟安慰辦法的規定其實各機關對於提出職場霸凌申訴的人都不能給予不利對待或不合理的處分那相對於這件事情其實在保障法跟安慰辦法上路之後保訓會也陸續的到各個機關去做宣導跟教育我跟你說有一個很根本的問題"},{"start":571.704,"end":592.17,"text":"就是你可以看到這個通報制度其實是有問題的有很多基層的公務員向本辦公室反映他說現場現在的這個職場霸凌案件通報平台你要給不是要給他自然人憑證就是要建保卡但事實上也根本沒有人敢實名的使用啊對不對那這部分你要怎麼處理"},{"start":593.45,"end":619.231,"text":"跟委員報告依照我們安慰辦法的規定提出職場霸凌申訴其實本來就應該要具名申訴的也是避免說機關可能被少數的這個不當的爆料或者是不實的指控而導致整個行政作業上面的事但是也是發生了這個問題嘛所以這個第一線也發生了所謂的實名通報會讓人家不敢通報那你這部分你有什麼改善的想法"},{"start":620.512,"end":647.844,"text":"是 那以目前來說我們都是要求各機關在收到職場霸凌申訴的時候都要在10天內去決定是否要受理同時他應該要通報上級機關那如果機關違反這樣的規定依照保障法沒有啊 你這個規定都是一樣我懂你要表達的就是說你的規定依照這樣走可是現在就是發生了這個事嘛就是說他不敢通報嘛因為他怕通報上去他會知道說他通報了誰然後去指控他的"},{"start":648.624,"end":674.992,"text":"上級以後有不利對待他以後可能會被會被這個針對所以剛剛也有委員提到之前洪宣安部長就說不然你就直接直接寄到我的信箱我來直接來處理那請問你們現在這個部分你有什麼精進的想法或是作為因為大家就不信任這個還是你可以跟他們說請大家放心你這個你這個你這個東西到我這裡來絕對不會外洩外洩了會發生什麼事你這部分有辦法"},{"start":676.107,"end":705.06,"text":"承諾或者是怎麼改善嗎跟委員報告其實我們現在目前也在建置資產霸凌的申訴平台那這個平台建置之後其實所有的人他都可以以他的自然人憑證或者是健保卡直接在我們的平台上面做申訴那申訴之後他的案件就會記錄在那個平台上那你申訴完了之後上級機關也會收到你申訴完之後你要怎麼確保這件事情這樣或者是你要再去宣導說跟這些這個相關的公務部門的同仁說"},{"start":705.74,"end":728.499,"text":"你去用這個自然人憑證或是你用健保卡你來了我怎麼用保密機制讓你確保你的這個身份不會外洩不會被你的相關的直屬長官知道這個部分你們會怎麼做是這當然就關系到我們後續這個系統怎麼建制那以及我們也會對於那些可以使用這套系統的人的權限也會做劃分"},{"start":728.999,"end":745.825,"text":"那你要怎麼做 你現在有具體一點系統上 原則上啦 機關在看到這筆申訴案的時候其實他只會接收到有一筆申訴案 可是他不會去讀到就是讀到他實際上的申訴內容你說誰會拿到這個他有一筆申訴案 你說長官會說他被申訴了"},{"start":750.767,"end":770.422,"text":"機關通常都會有一個職場霸凌的申訴窗口那那個窗口的負責人我們就會給他一個權限讓他可以定期的去看一下那個系統上是不是有職場霸凌的申訴案那他看到那個申訴案之後他就可以知道是申訴人跟被申訴人但是他沒有辦法見到實際上的具體內容"},{"start":771.443,"end":792.07,"text":"申訴人跟被申訴人就是最大的問題啦不是嗎如果他在同一個機關裡你的譬如說我舉個例子就是我們紅部長假設你有一個司長他去申訴了然後到了這個部會裡面然後這個窗口知道說這個紅部長你被某司長申訴囉那這樣子不就會造成了他們不敢申報的原因嗎"},{"start":793.515,"end":808.596,"text":"這不就是現在我提出來的問題嗎就算是現在用書面上做申訴那個申訴的窗口他一定要知道是誰被誰申訴嘛那他才能再往後續把整個案件提交到防護委員會去做討論"},{"start":809.838,"end":823.778,"text":"所以你這個勿填這個機制會不會發生我剛剛說的這個問題就是申訴的從一個單位裡面的這個窗口他收到有申訴案了那知道某長官被某下屬這個申訴了那這個事情就可能會在那個機關單位傳出去"},{"start":824.94,"end":828.804,"text":"那傳出去之後大家就更不敢去申訴這件事所以我剛剛說從個案我們來檢討整個系統的問題這個系統現在是有問題的我是不是可以請你們回去把我的意見帶回去你們到底要怎麼做到不管是匿名匿名申報也好或者是你要用一個機制去告訴這些人說我這個絕對不會洩漏或者是洩漏了之後這個人要負什麼責任"},{"start":848.3,"end":866.603,"text":"這個部分你們是不是可以回去檢討然後給本席一個具體的方案可以跟委員報告依照我們安慰辦法的規定本來調查小組跟所有參與這項調查整個程序過程的人都具有保密義務所以你說這個所以你這個窗口本身就是也不能夠有透露"},{"start":866.963,"end":896.447,"text":"那他如果透露了之後他會有什麼責任當然會違反安慰辦法的規定那同時他可能也有公務人員考積法公務員服務法的相關追究好那你就要去好好的宣傳你給本席一個修改的建議修正的建議之後你也必須去各個單位機關跟這些公務人員跟他們掛保證說你要跟他說這件事情你去申訴了你用證人憑證申訴了你去實名申訴了你絕對不會有得到不利對待是"},{"start":897.15,"end":901.239,"text":"是不是 你要去做這件事那接下來我要請洪部長有請洪部長"},{"start":911.88,"end":939.418,"text":"來 部長好我想要請教一下有關公安和老安的部分那依照勞動檢查法的第五條這個由中央主管機關設勞動檢查機構或授權直轄市主管機關或有關機關專設勞動檢查機構辦理之對不對那授權之勞動檢查依法依本法啦 因依本法有關的規定辦理並受中央主管機關之指揮和"},{"start":940.907,"end":941.77,"text":"監督 你們確實是有監督的權責 對嗎"},{"start":945.427,"end":968.543,"text":"是是好那根據這個你們在2025年的7月8號也有個新聞稿你們明確的定義說多次發生災害勞動檢查的機構也就是你們的職安署或與地方政府應該要擴大停工範圍並加嚴復工審查那是不是這樣子是那也顯見勞動部具有監督的責任對嗎"},{"start":971.107,"end":988.101,"text":"本來就有對本來就有好那我就想要請教一下因為衛科在高雄有某特定的建案那他已經屬於定類的危險性工作場所那麼他在2024年的3月2024年3月的時候有發生板模坍塌"},{"start":989.102,"end":999.686,"text":"而且在2025年的11月4日又發生這個工人高樓墜落死亡意外那其實已經符合你們所謂的多次發生災害的範疇那依照你們的規定應該要擴大停工範圍加強稽查那麼為何又在2026年呢他1月11號又發生了第三起"},{"start":1011.192,"end":1032.99,"text":"工地這個高處天降鐵板的意外然後你們在兩天內就有予以復工不管是你或地方政府有予以復工所以導致最後在兩個月後在2026年的3月24號第四度發生天降鋼板的意外砸死人這個時候就砸死人所以"},{"start":1034.05,"end":1060.672,"text":"這兩年內發生這個公安意外兩人死亡那你們治安署去年的督導考評中有沒有針對這個高雄勞檢處的復工審查流程提出過糾正或者是警告或者對於這兩年這四起反覆造災的這個高風險的工地中央有沒有啟動過任何專案督導或是書面要求或是復工的這個流程的檢視或考評的扣分"},{"start":1062.288,"end":1091.083,"text":"跟委員報告我們確實在停復工要點去年有修正那我們的認定還是職業災害就職業職安法裡面所定義的職業災害那剛剛委員提到的這些案件就我們所知有部分的案件經過這個法官法醫或是檢察官他認定不是因工作引起的那就不會回到我們剛剛提到的這個這個停復工要點因為我們認定是職業災害對如果最近這一切是職業災害沒有錯"},{"start":1091.943,"end":1121.234,"text":"好這個等一下我們會回來講我覺得這個是有一個流程上會有會發生問題喔所以其實你們也有說這個設施不良造災其他相同的處要全面檢討改善可是明明在這個部分1月11號你就有發生這個天降鋼板嘛對不對那後來讓它復工了復工了之後所以導致有人然後後來再次天降這個鋼筋砸壞兩台車一個小時之後再這個砸死人所以這個東西你剛剛這樣子歸類是不是反而是沒有好好的去檢查它如果譬如說它已經"},{"start":1122.235,"end":1130.807,"text":"掉下來你沒有砸到人這工地他掉下來一個危險物品沒砸到人然後你就沒有去要求他或者是說示警他那"},{"start":1131.798,"end":1158.366,"text":"這只是剛好那裡沒有人而已嘛對吧第一個我們其實在去年下半年提出的減災計劃裡面其實也有一個是會針對高質災跟高危違規的這個監管的計劃那我想在這些相關的案件裡面我們都會來跟高雄市勞檢處來瞭解一下包括也跟他們在瞭解有沒有大家可以互相協助然後能夠把這樣子的一個"},{"start":1159.546,"end":1178.894,"text":"這樣子的一個公檢的案其實你們兩方不管是高雄市政府或者是你所以這次到底是要誰負這個督導的責任監督的責任當然這是高雄市勞檢處他要來進行這些這個相關的檢查的業務但是這個高雄市勞檢處當然也跟中央的部分也會有一些互相可以互相協助的關係"},{"start":1179.554,"end":1207.141,"text":"所以你要互相協助他但是這樣看起來是高雄市勞檢處沒有好好的去去檢討我沒有這樣子我沒有這樣因為政策當然是中央我們訂定的政策所以不管是減災計畫或者是剛才說強化停復工的計畫這都是中央提出來的可是我們當然也有義務來協助地方政府的檢查機構來照著這個政策的方向盡量的來落實所以我們也有這個部分的"},{"start":1207.321,"end":1221.909,"text":"所以你有沒有去檢討說他現在這個流程裡面到底他的檢查哪裡出了問題所以我說在這幾個案例裡面當然也有剛剛林組長說的裡面有部分的計畫他在檢查官的認定裡面他並不是指災也有這樣的部分可是我想"},{"start":1222.869,"end":1236.96,"text":"呃有職災的尤其是重大職災的案例的發生就是大家不樂見的我們都願意來跟相關的地方政府的檢查機構來多做一點關心跟了解來協助請問一下那你們有沒有依照你們頒布的這個職場檢災計畫你剛剛一直提到對這個案件同類樣態進行抽查啦或是複合你們有做這件事嗎"},{"start":1243.485,"end":1260.335,"text":"跟委員報告我們確實在去年下半年我們也有頒布一個高違規高職災的監管計畫那我們會就這個個案我們會要求高公司勞檢處是不是有符合我們的規範應該要列入這個所謂的列管的一個工地"},{"start":1261.175,"end":1277.523,"text":"對 所以簡單來講我聽到現在你好像沒有去監督或是督導他們有沒有依照你們訂新的這個停工跟復工的要點去確實 落實說他有沒有依照這個新規則去執行不是 我們的定期性或年度的考評"},{"start":1278.724,"end":1302.066,"text":"都有 都有 但是這個在實情上不可能每一個個案這個 但是我們會假設這樣的案件我們會每個月去從我們的系統上去看對嘛 它是屬於高違規所以你們有系統可以去看嘛 對不對我們所有的檢查都要進到我們中央的系統 對所以你們有個通報平台有 你們有個通報平台 對不對好 那我想要請教一下你說你每個月去看 那這件事情"},{"start":1304.187,"end":1323.823,"text":"不是每個月去看那個現場不是 我知道 就是這個通報平台嘛你們就是要透過通報平台才知道有沒有發生這件事 對嗎你們現在是要這樣嗎是 他如果有剛剛委員提到的被檢查 被罰還 被停工在我們的紀錄都會看到那如果是屬於我們列管的那我們就要提高檢查頻率 還有提高罰還金額那這個案件有被通報嗎"},{"start":1324.964,"end":1347.469,"text":"這個案件一定通報一定有通報是不是一定有通報一定有通報嗎所以那這個部分勞檢單位可能他有介入嗎勞檢單位依照我們剛剛委員提到勞檢法跟相關的法規程序規範都會去做勞檢對都要去做勞檢所以你這個案子應該會有所以在通報平台上應該也要會有當然確定"},{"start":1351.417,"end":1379.353,"text":"我想要 所以我就想要問喔 但是我有去查齁我去查 這個是零筆 零筆資料欸我查不到這一件事情欸我上網去查 我根本查不到這件事啊甚至我也去看他的地圖 根本沒有這個案件啊那個 第一個公開網的部分 當然會跟我們他還通報的這個資訊系統不一定一樣 但我們可以來看一下就是說所以你說 那你如果不一樣的話 那你又何必公開又需要這個網站呢"},{"start":1383.679,"end":1407.791,"text":"我跟你講我去你們重大職災公開網這個案件是一筆資料都沒有啊一筆資料都沒有那個他的關鍵字不一定是用凹子底啦好那再往下我沒有關鍵字沒有凹子底那我去看的地圖也沒有這個案件再往下再往下有個圖片好我有去看你們的公開的地圖地圖上也沒有這個案件"},{"start":1412.637,"end":1440.395,"text":"跟委員報告那整個只要經過我們檢查報告書經過我們中央核定以後他資料就要上傳那這個個案是不是我們會後把提供完整資料給委員所以你們就是有督導的疏失嘛所以因為你這個資料我根本完全查不到這件事情如果剛剛委員這個案子他剛發生剛發生 實在報告書要一到兩個月我們整個責任都釐清以後我們才允許他上去對 是這個部分那你這一到兩個月這個工地你們要怎麼處理"},{"start":1441.576,"end":1460.079,"text":"委員你現在把好幾件事情全部混在一起了第一個事情是資訊流的通報跟揭露這件事情他有他在這個職災上面責任認定的程序必須把這些相關責任認定的程序給走完他才能夠確認這筆資料相關的資料是如何"},{"start":1460.339,"end":1481.413,"text":"他才會放到相關的資訊公開的部分這是一個部分但是那個工地現場該怎麼處理這也會有一套系統所以這是不同的事情你把他好幾件事情沒有所以我剛剛是幫你開開來講所以我的問題也是問另外一件事就是說那這段時間因為我們最終我們要講的事情叫做你有沒有落實督導有沒有有沒有發生說你看他明明就掉了東西下來"},{"start":1482.173,"end":1496.67,"text":"然後呢因為沒有及時的去用嚴格的監督的管理規則讓他復工結果隔了兩個月之後又掉下來我就要表達的事情是你第一次發生的時候是剛好下面沒有人那你第二次發生的時候就砸到人了嗎"},{"start":1497.09,"end":1512.394,"text":"所以我現在要說的事情是說針對這個案例我想我們會請治安署來跟高雄市勞檢處針對這個案子目前處理到什麼樣子的程序來做一個更深入的瞭解因為這的確是地方政府的勞檢檢察機構在處理我們會來瞭解那我們會來跟他確認"},{"start":1516.175,"end":1541.678,"text":"他有沒有按照去年我們頒布的相關的這個政策跟機制來去處理我們會來跟他確認這件事情但他的確在這個案例上面也會有他要走的流程他的走的流程到目前按照該個三月的話他到現在不一定這個流程你剛剛有說中央地方都有各自的責任然後他表達說你們的督導責任包含不管這個資訊的問題或者是他有沒有依照你們新規則去逐一的去執行落實"},{"start":1542.819,"end":1563.416,"text":"這件事情是你們的督導責任然後再來就是你們地方政府上面他有沒有落實做這件事情所以我要表達的是你這個公安和勞安其實你在這個個案你就可以發現說一個很奇妙的地方他第一次砸下來之後只是剛好沒有人那後面呢你很快的復工之後好大概兩個月後你如果沒有落實檢查這些要點"},{"start":1565.117,"end":1589.73,"text":"他再砸下來的時候剛好下面有人 哇那就一個工人就這樣子過世了這個狀況的發生都是我們不樂見的情況我們都不樂見所以我們願意跟地方政府我們願意跟地方政府來加強這部分的督導我想這部分我們願意跟地方政府來做所以我想要跟你說的事情是第一個你們好像不願意承認你們在資訊流上面請你們回去檢討一下然後給本席辦公室檢討的報告為什麼我去查 查不到"},{"start":1590.27,"end":1606.487,"text":"然後有四起我會說過去這個工地就有四起可是我在網站上是一筆都查不到但是你剛剛在質詢前面又跟我說你們都有落實登記所以這件事情本席希望會後給本席辦公室一個報告我還是要再強調這個案件他一定會有通報但通報以後他"},{"start":1607.128,"end":1635.642,"text":"他去處理的程序會要走到一定處理的程序以後他才會放上一個公開揭露的系統因為如果他沒有走完一個一定處理的程序的時候他放上公開揭露的系統他的資訊不一定是完整跟正確的所以公開揭露的部分跟內部的通報這是兩件事情那我想要請問一下前面有一個53歲工人他在之前就有意外墜樓也很久了也很久以前那為什麼他還是沒有上你們這個公開系統呢"},{"start":1640.143,"end":1653.611,"text":"那個公開網是職業災害因為工作而引起的如果這個個案就目前我們了解他不是跟工作有相關性所以他不是職業災害就是不能不是職業就不是在我的平台去公布"},{"start":1653.971,"end":1672.517,"text":"所以你的意思就是這就是我們剛剛講的就這兩件事情你可能要去看一下這件事情他要怎麼在資訊上面串起來因為不管是公安或是這個職災我覺得這個東西你們要去想一下這個流程上第一階段發生了這個事你們要嚴格的去要求不要再發生坍塌"},{"start":1673.177,"end":1702.025,"text":"掉下來 這個是不是要特別示警至少這個案例我們會重點來關注那過去 剛才講的你剛才應該是講你現在投影片上面的第二起事件是後來檢察官認定他不是職業災害他是他新陰性的原因對好 你看著這個 好 OK但是我還是要講在天降鐵板這兩個關係所以我說我們願意重點來關注請你們這個會後之後再提供給本席辦公室為什麼我的質疑的點好 謝謝"},{"start":1703.291,"end":1704.687,"text":"好,謝謝廖瑋雄委員的諮詢"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}