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我們有請部長好 我們請林部長"},{"start":12.609,"end":41.334,"text":"萬委員早安部長早3月31號晚上LINE出現了大規模的登錄異常帳戶也被盜用那這些被盜用對象大概比較多是台灣大哥大的用戶那主要現在了解是有一些不肖人士利用台灣大哥大語音信箱的功能跟LINE的一個驗證機制的一些漏洞去盜取民眾的帳戶那顯然部長是知道這件事的那這個是發生到現在一個禮拜部長有沒有講過我們現在目前有多少民眾受害"},{"start":43.091,"end":65.059,"text":"目前台灣大哥大他接獲的那個客訴事實上只有16件但是我們所瞭解的其實受到影響的民眾應該是更多遠超過這個數字那只是說正式跟那個台灣大哥大提出客訴的只有16件因為其實我相信有很多的民眾有的自認倒楣有人嫌麻煩有人覺得算了這個應該很多"},{"start":65.959,"end":92.275,"text":"那但是這件事情呢我們除了人數要去掌握一下之外有沒有去考慮過說這到底是賴的問題呢還是台灣大哥大的問題這個責任歸屬是什麼是我想委員問到一個重點事實上在這種資安或者是這種詐騙的時候常常是很有趣的是什麼他個別來看很有趣喔我沒有覺得很有趣呢好啦抱歉啦我講錯話了OK就是說個別來看的話都是一個小問題就是說"},{"start":93.976,"end":120.549,"text":"因為台哥大他提供了他就是提供了一個語音信箱的遠端可以操控的功能這個本身是一個正面的事情只是說他有一個小問題是他從台灣之星那邊接收過來的這個背景上面我想我們都知道了那現在你認為應該是誰的責任還是雙方都有責任兩邊的話你來講都不是很大的問題但是結合起來就是一個漏洞很多的資安問題都是這個樣子"},{"start":121.79,"end":128.612,"text":"所以我們現在最重要的問題兩兆都有問題是趕快把這個漏洞給補助好 那當然我覺得您說得非常的好那現在看起來LINE它針對這件事情所以提供了一些補救的方式那它有提到說這個帳號如果已經有綁定了Apple或者Google的帳號它可能可以幫你找回帳號那如果沒有綁定的話它可能只能協助你重新建立一個帳號但我們都知道LINE對於民眾的依賴度其實就是民眾依賴它很高"},{"start":150.797,"end":173.432,"text":"那你現在一個新的帳號其實有很多的困擾那他現在就是說那你如果有這個購買這個付費的商品那可能回補這個經費不過帳號盜用之後還會衍生一些這個法律問題這才是最可怕的就拿這個帳號去詐騙那我們有沒有去了解一下說如果這個帳號被盜那被盜了之後又拿去做詐騙的工具甚至於得逞了那這個法律的責任應該是誰要來負"},{"start":176.004,"end":203.981,"text":"我覺得那個萬有緣你提的這個問題就是這個問題的核心其實這個LINE帳號被盜用其實很大的一個可能就是詐騙集團拿去做下一次的詐騙所以這個詐騙事實上是一個產業鏈它是一個階段一個階段來做的然後它利用各種小小的這個資安漏洞湊合起來就變成一個很大的資安漏洞那這個法律的這個事情我想這個可能得上法院才能釐清因為你說這個事情"},{"start":205.802,"end":213.764,"text":"我同意後端當然就是來到司法雖然說司法其實對於現在的詐騙我看起來蠻束手無策所以我們才會有個速發部才會想要從源頭來想辦法去遏止這個事情的發生所以剛剛我同意你說的一部分但是我覺得發生這樣的事情以後速發部其實應該要跟平台跟LINE或者跟台灣大哥大我覺得應該我不知道你們開過會了沒有針對這個案子"},{"start":233.395,"end":254.786,"text":"應該對不起我自己沒有開過會但是應該我們同仁都有跟他們都跟他聯絡因為現在我覺得不是單項聯會而已事實上是應該要把電信業者跟平台業者找來我們去看一看說到底這些所謂的這個可以杜絕的一些機制啊或者加強茶葉有沒有到高一尺磨高一丈那不能他們一直在進步我們留在原地嘛所以這個部分"},{"start":256.166,"end":284.151,"text":"會後讓我知道一下就這個案子我們有沒有跟兩方去談一談怎麼樣去加強這個機制怎麼樣去防堵看到這次的漏洞作為下一次不要再發生這樣OK嗎這個沒問題啊那這跟委員說一下因為這個治安的特性就是什麼這個漏洞在發生發現以後就叫Zero Day Vulnerability這個發現以後我們把它堵住以後它事實上就不會再發生了像這兩案子其實就堵住了但是它會尋找新的漏洞而不是舊的漏洞這個我當然知道這又是另外一個議題"},{"start":284.891,"end":294.775,"text":"那我的意思說不然連這個都堵不住就不好看了嘛不會啦 這個當然就是我們在最短的時間之內就是說這個事情還沒有擴散我們就已經通知這兩個業者把它堵住了一個禮拜內給我一下就關於這個案子發現的漏洞然後目前怎麼去加強那給我一個資料好不好沒有問題來接下來呢我想繼續我們看到就是剛剛講的是LINE嘛跟這個台灣大哥大部分但是電信業者目前看起來他們沒有提出任何的補償的一個"},{"start":314.602,"end":340.623,"text":"做為出來啦所以我想是不是部長應該我在這裡提醒您您也可能要提醒一下在我們台灣大哥大的部分我們依據現在的個資保護法第28條第29條可以去看一看被害人雖非財產上是損失但是還是得請求賠償相當之金額那同時如果被害人就算不能證明他實際損失的時候他一樣可以跟法院依照侵害的情節每一個人大概500到200兩萬塊錢的這個請求的"},{"start":344.206,"end":362.98,"text":"這個損害賠償所以呢我是這個提供給你們你們在跟平台跟這個電信業者在談的時候也要讓他們知道其實啊今天是因為有很多的民眾我們現在呼籲很多民眾受害了其實是應該要站出來講的那很多民眾可能不知道他有這個權益喔我認為速發部有這個責任把這樣的訊息這個弄出去好不好"},{"start":363.98,"end":386.127,"text":"接下來我想再談一件事情我們一直在談海底電纜韌性的加強可是本席看到蘇發部在昨天的時候有公佈114年台灣海底通訊電纜損害的原因其中提到台灣海纜斷線的次數大概去年前大概都是在7次左右這個數據是正確的嗎"},{"start":388.088,"end":403.965,"text":"是你們發布的應該是正確的嘛但是呢 本席又看到在速發布轄下的台灣網路資訊中心有一位黃聖雄董事長他在接受您剛剛所說很有公信力的台灣事實查核中心網路節目上面有說到他說全球現在約有500條的海底電纜"},{"start":406.007,"end":423.229,"text":"每一條平均每一年斷線是0.1次到0.2次換言之可能就是每10年有一次會斷的一個機率可是台灣國內的這個海欄尤其是馬祖這個台馬這一條它平均斷欄的比例是一年一條海欄大概5到6次是"},{"start":425.071,"end":442.436,"text":"本席就看啦 我們台馬海纜就談這個就好大概有三條 沒有錯嘛那如果按照這個算數來算的話那一年不是就是要差不多每一年的斷纜次數大概就在15次左右喔所以呢 你看速發部你自己再給我一個資訊說113年跟114年喔 國內的海纜斷線都是4次但事實上你光台馬這算起來就已經15次了到底這個差 落差是為什麼"},{"start":451.698,"end":472.999,"text":"我想這個落差主要是在於說24海裏之內還是24海裏之外這個是不是形容我們任性四次的海裏這個不管24海裏之內24海裏之外我覺得這個你速發布自己在公布的時候你就要說清楚嘛本身今天所有持續的東西都是從你上面去講來的嘛所以呢你看你自己發布的是這個四次但落差其實是非常的大的不是嗎"},{"start":473.479,"end":502.518,"text":"是跟委員報告基本上台馬海嵐自蘇發部成立以來到目前為止到今年3月總共斷了21次今年斷了兩次所以意味著就有19次在歷來就發生那全國的來講大概就三十幾次所以馬祖海嵐確實它的斷人頻率偏高那第二個就是跟委員報告基本上國際海嵐在做評估的時候目前的資訊有不同的資訊以ITU的資訊目前500根裡頭每年發生次數是200次以上"},{"start":503.439,"end":524.959,"text":"好 我理解 而且這個背景我也知道所以我是建議速發部啦 你在公布這個相關次數的時候啊背景條件它的基礎是在哪個地方 我覺得要講清楚是 沒有問題否則在我們看起來就是說 如果你連這個海嵐斷線的這個次數 落差都那麼大數據都弄不清楚 何來談韌性啦有啊 我們有講得很清楚啦"},{"start":525.663,"end":544.882,"text":"報告委員確實如此可能你自己很清楚啦但你公布的是不清楚的確實委員講這件事是一個我們為什麼要公布這個這樣子好不好你在會後今天就給我一份你認為最正確的資料再補一份上來那最後我想在一分鐘的時間您剛剛說到我們現在有一個數位憑證皮夾APP對不對我覺得很棒"},{"start":549.346,"end":576.409,"text":"這是一個很好的構想 也是一個很好的行動那我看到你的網站上介紹說不管是超商取貨 辦理政府業務拿出手機點一點就搞定了使用數位憑證憑假 辦理政府業務的時候只需要這個攜帶手機不需要一些繁瑣的證件手續 對嗎那我請教一下 那現在哪一些政府業務可以辦理目前 因為我們才剛剛在推出 那我們現在就是哪一些 現在可以辦理哪一些政府業務"},{"start":583.193,"end":597.423,"text":"今天報告我是哪一些政府業務目前的部分我們可以用的部分包含公務局的駕照 駕照相關的應用那後續在4月底會有工商名證也就是公司行號的生產推薦沒有 我就說目前嘛 我今天等一下要辦的話"},{"start":598.343,"end":624.52,"text":"跟你們報告一下 政府的角色主要是發證然後在應用的話 我們現在是民間應用譬如說我用政府發的那個駕照去用民間去租車所以就是說直接政府的應用這個上面我們目前部長啦 我建議你網路上去修正啦不要在這邊在這邊胡說八道了啦我今天拿出來看 本身剛剛就上去看看了以後就是兩個問問看是不是要去什麼便利超商是要到全家便利還是7-11去取貨沒有別的功能啦"},{"start":627.262,"end":631.083,"text":"沒有啦 我剛才要咨詢你之前我才看過啦我們接下來馬上會有台大 成大教大學生證跟畢業證我再重申一次你這個數位憑證皮夾我覺得很好但是我覺得身為速發部你最主要的功能我們現在都認為打詐嘛但不能左手打詐右邊詐騙啊你現在還沒有做到嘛"},{"start":650.828,"end":675.967,"text":"還沒有做到事情就不要好大喜功拿來寫這樣民眾上去看了以後會失望啊會對政府失望明明說可以辦很多政府業務結果他們一上去看什麼都不能辦只能去取貨我建議你啦如果是後面後面才要來可以執行的部分的話就不要在這上面去把它寫出來這是另外詐騙的一種啦好不好如果說有詐騙的話麻煩那個委員就明確講出來哪一句話不對我已經講出來了你是聽不懂喔"},{"start":676.747,"end":691.823,"text":"我講得這麼清楚嘛你說辦理政府業務那你現在又說政府業務要後面啊馬上要怎麼樣連結啊就還沒有嘛那本席好意提醒你說這個APP這個做法很好但是還沒有做到不要好大喜功對民眾來講這就是一種欺騙好不好所以這個部分請你嚴謹啦"},{"start":696.007,"end":721.659,"text":"那再來最後 我想現在我們在各部會有一些文化幣 運動幣 客家幣等等那我希望部長能夠跟其他部會的部長去研究一下說能不能把它整合起來這樣不要說一種數位幣就可以一個APP其實會 各機關是成本浪費也很麻煩這個部分研究一下好不好是 現在客家幣已經是使用我們的共同平台所以已經有開始了對好 那文化幣 運動幣也拜託好不好了解看看有沒有可能可以整合一下"},{"start":722.54,"end":744.016,"text":"是 因為他們已經launch了所以這個時候要拿回來再改的話比較麻煩但是如果說政府其他部會有新的這種幣要發行的話現在我們也都跟各個部會去溝通希望他們盡量利用速發部所開發的這個共同發放平台那不發現金事實上也是利用這個共同發放平台去發的好 OK 謝謝"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}